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Star Trek vs The Old Republic (cmon you knew this thread was coming)
admriker4
Member Posts: 1,070
It seems like another wow vs eq2 battle is coming for our hearts and minds. Both games are pretty deep into development and will probably launch in 2010. I know its early but already some info has surfaced that warrants comparisons...
Developers - Cryptic for Trek and Bioware for TOR. Cryptic has the edge in MMO experience but Bioware always makes a great game.
Its unknown how involved Paramount will be with the development and direction of Star Trek. We do know LA will be heavily involved with TOR based on the past.
Format - very early so this is pure speculation based on limited info....Star Trek will be more sandboxish with no levels and an emphasis on exploration. TOR will be more of the Linear Theme park type of game with a ton of quests and emphasis on storyline (you being the hero)
graphics - ironically both games have similiar cartoonish graphics that have already stirred many complaints. Many seem to prefer more photo-realistic graphics. I think both dev teams have taken a lesson from WoW and Age of Conan (cartoon low pixel vs high pixel graphics)
Gameplay - cryptic says we'll captain our own ship and have npc crewmen to assist us. Bioware says we'll have npc companions to assist us on our quests.
Community - where will the community likely come from for either game ?
Star Trek - I think we may get a very small percentage from CoH as they'll hear it through the grapevine (even though cryptic doesnt own CoH anymore).
I doubt we'll get even a hundred players new to the MMO industry for Star Trek.
The KOTOR fans who dont normally play MMO's might take up the game. Keep in mind though that KOTOR gamers were predominantly console players so its a mystery how many will likely cross over to PC subscription play.
What about the WoW gamers, will they be tempted to leave blizzcraft for Trek or KOTOR ? If WoW gamers were to leave, my guess would be KOTOR is more appealing as its similiar style (linear theme park).
What about EVE gamers ? I think a small minority there might be tempted by Star Trek. I doubt any will leave for KOTOR though unless Bioware adds in space flight content.
Most obvious will be the SWG vets who quit over the NGE fiasco and current SWG players. There are many thousands more SWG vets compared to NGE players so clearly the community will be dominated by them. Go check out the TOR forums, 90% of the posts are from ex swg players. I believe Star Trek and TOR will attract most of its community from these players.
I suspect that Trek will actually appeal to the swg vets while the NGE players will prefer TOR (those happy with nge anyway).
Overall - there seems to be quite a few similarities between these two games. Launch dates are likely within a yr at most of each other. graphics are similiar. we get npc companions in both games. community will come mostly from the same core gamers (swg). The difference is gameplay and it will be interesting to see if the swg vet crowd that despises NGE for its linear theme park style of content will be lining up to play TOR.
Time will only tell
Comments
In the end I think most of the SWG fans will stay right where they are.
They are incredibly defensive of a game they have been with for years, TOR will not be sandbox, and STO isn't Star Wars. TOR will get some of the fans that are just in SWG because its Star Wars and STO may get a few because of its "A day in the life of Star Trek." But in the end I think most will just stay until SOE shuts down the servers.
again, show me the gameplay aspects of both then someone can decide. Until then you got conjecture.
SWG is more of a WoW linear theme park clone nowadays. So I can see many of them leaving for TOR. Better graphics, better storyline, cleaner gameplay, etc.
I could see the crafting community (as well as the entertainers) going to Star Trek. Im one of those former hardcore crafters and yeah Im guessing crafting wont be a major part of Trek Online but its the other potential non-combat stuff (exploration) that appeals to me as well.
The idea that I can just log in and hang out, fly around and explore some without having to raid or fight over a spawn for loot is exciting. MMO's dont need to be 100% focused on combat so any game that offers me an alternative to killing 24/7 is appealing.
SWG Pre-NGE vets who left because of the NGE will likely go to STO eventually. STO is going to be VERY "SANDBOXY" supposedly. That is what Pre-NGE vets like myself are looking for and that is why I am extremely interested in STO. Hell in early SWG is was "Poke-mon War" anyways, I think we will dig the bridge crew for noslagia of that alone.
When the TOR devs said the 3 pillars of MMORPGs were Exploration, Combat, and Progression, I knew this is nowhere near going to be a sandbox-type game. Many SWG vets who are also Starwars fanbois are going to be very disappointed when they have only another Starwars themepark and not the Starwars universe. I am thinking more KOTOR people will be more into TOR than SWG people. This all being said, I think TOR might actually be the "WoW killer." KOTOR like Warcraft is a huge franchise, it is going to draw a lot of gammers.
I would not say that yet.....
From the Official FAQ:
Q: Will there be an economy?
A: Many of the details are still in the works, but yes, there will be an economy that makes sense in the Star Trek universe. Since the Federation has explicitly done away with money, expect bartering and trading of goods to be an important part of the economy. Less tangible forms of economics such as Reputation are also not out of the question.
From the Allakhazam Interview:
Craig : We’re not going to have Federation captains looting corpses for gear. Much of your currency will come either through rewards or trading. You will be able to get new technology from races you meet as you explore, or you can create new items with resources you gather or trade for and information you learn as you complete missions.
That being said, there is a chance that you will discover technology or a resource in a salvaged ship or on a planet. If you’re a Starfleet captain who finds a new Klingon weapon, for example, it would make sense that you might try to adapt the technology for yourself or return it to the Federation for analysis.
http://www.allakhazam.com/story.html?story=15597
That makes me think there will be some sort of crafting personally..
I would not say that yet.....
From the Official FAQ:
Q: Will there be an economy?
A: Many of the details are still in the works, but yes, there will be an economy that makes sense in the Star Trek universe. Since the Federation has explicitly done away with money, expect bartering and trading of goods to be an important part of the economy. Less tangible forms of economics such as Reputation are also not out of the question.
From the Allakhazam Interview:
Craig : We’re not going to have Federation captains looting corpses for gear. Much of your currency will come either through rewards or trading. You will be able to get new technology from races you meet as you explore, or you can create new items with resources you gather or trade for and information you learn as you complete missions.
That being said, there is a chance that you will discover technology or a resource in a salvaged ship or on a planet. If you’re a Starfleet captain who finds a new Klingon weapon, for example, it would make sense that you might try to adapt the technology for yourself or return it to the Federation for analysis.
http://www.allakhazam.com/story.html?story=15597
That makes me think there will be some sort of crafting personally..
I gotta say that sounds pretty dam good.
Personally I don't give a hoot about all that.
My Major concerns are.
Star Trek / The Old Republic
Do I like the history Yes / No
Is the game gonna be fun Don't know got to see the game.
So far star trek has a chance. Star Wars does not.
I have to agree that current SWG players will be there until the lights are turned off. Lucas Arts has an ability to really mess up good games so I will wait to pass judgement on TOR since it is about 2 years away from release. I think that STO is going to have those Cryptic Studio characteristics that will be a good game for gamers but not for ST fans. In the end I think fans of sci fi will try both. For me I liek some of the things I have heard about STO such as the creation tools for alien races. For TOR I feel Bioware will make agreat game and Lucas Arts will frak it up just like they did with SOE and the NGE.
Which ever has a more appealing and MEANINGFUL PvP system will win.
There are enough carebear shitass games out there with carebear shitass Pvp. We need a game that has meaningful RvR, PvP that has CONSIQUENCES. If you lose an objective or piece of land/space it should hurt your side somehow.
Well thought out poll I might add my thinking often though is towards the ends of the weight we put behind this "swg vet" status,this group can be around 500k strong which I'm sure it isn't that large of a group but for the sake of argument we'll give them that. Now other than vocal complaining what do we say makes up this group? Do they not play any mmos simply because of the nge or do they actually play other titles (as I in fact do)? In that case I would not consider SWG or it's memory my competition let's face it LA and Bioware are probably hoping to be able to hold around 750k subs if not wow type numbers so basically I'm saying that even worrying about swg vets is a waste of time, shoot for star wars and bioware fans alike and they can do much etter than WG ever did.
but yeah, to call this game Fantastic is like calling Twilight the Godfather of vampire movies....
I won't be playing this game over Knights, period.
And to actually comment as one of the old pre CU/NGE players, I stopped playing the game because it had more in common with WOW than it did the Star Wars Galaxies I had played for 26 months (heck I'm playing the emulator for Christ sake, now).
The SWG population of old was somewhere between 200-280k if I remember correctly (could have been 300k).
Star Trek online is going in the direction of Romper room with Cryptic and I hate to say this, PE had more innovative ideas in the beginning than what these jokers are coming up with "are they serious with making up your own race?".
Why not just put in races from the extened universe if they were gonna do that?
If Star Trek has more sandboxish feature and doesnt cave in the current WOW formula this game could have a lot of potential... TOR on the other hand is a NGE 2 done right this time without $OE involved this time, all TOR will be is WOW with glowsticks, knowing this almost every member over in their TOR forums has a Jedi Avatar, and all the focus Ive seen over there on threads is Jedi this, Sith that... it's really making me to not even bother with the game when it is released, I have not even seen any info on any of the other classes/professions.
Not only is TOR will be mostly soloable as stated, but its has the WOW smell to it levels, probably end game raiding as well, remember LA wanted to chase WOW sub numbers with SWG so they made the NGE and it failed, so they went to Bioware the most successful game maker that makes a quality game and join forces for the NGE2 that is not a buggy mess or horribly implemented perse.
Star Trek could be one of the few that is being made by a well known company that doesnt follow the , "formula" and do their own thing taking parts from other games that work and make a game that fans and newcomers could enjoy. The people at Cryptic have a lot to live up to to gain the real fans of ST and make it truly massive and fun , and addicting for all for years , cause really if you want to keep a playerbase it has to be fun and engaging with penalities and challenges.
I am looking forward to both games really. I am just loving the idea of a Star Trek Universe that is adaptable to my gaming experience. I have total control over my character and experience from appearance to the kind of crew for my ship. Just awesome. TOR is excited for whole different reasons. I LOVED KotOR and thing the timeframe is just very interesting for the SW universe. One of the things I look forward most to with this game is the story line pillar. If it works out it will be great that choices made by player characters will effect them within the story not just an XP grind but real experience and adaptation through play. The choices you make will effect your character and no characters or experience would be the same in game play. It wont even be just like KotOR where you could save the game, make a choice and if you didnt like the effect re-load. Nope when you make a choice in this game it will stick and I think thats just novel and will be very attractive for those like me who love story lines in gaming. So it wont be so limited as like WoW or other story line games because you will have options in the story that will directly effect your experience and character.
I'm interested in both games for different reasons. Being a SWG Vet, I'm hoping things would be close to the pre-cu/nge SWG, but done correctly. STO is because it's Star Trek, lol.
And UltimateNoob, don't be assuming you have even the slightest idea as to what kind of game SWG Vets want to play.
Im interested in both as well hence this topic. However i suspect TOR wont have long-term appeal based on the info we have on its design. STO might fit that role Im hoping
I see myself going more for STO than TOR because it seems like it will be different than what I'm playing now. I'm playing Warhammer and having fun, but I wish I had more control over my character. And yes, I miss some of the freedom that pre-NGE SWG gave me. I think a skill based system is the way to go because it allows you to tailor your character more to your liking than a simple level based system does. And for goodness sakes lets's stop straightjacketing players with themeparks. Themparks should be an OPTION, not the core part of the game.
One more thing, if companies want to expand subscriptions, how about putting them on consoles? That's where most hardcore gamers are. I get tired of constantly having to upgrade my PC every time a new game comes out.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
Why doesn't your poll have a "both" option? Are you assuming a gamer will only take one game over another? I think it's quite possible for players from other games to try and stay with both games without giving up their original game.
SWG will close once TOR is released. And that's not a statement about the condition of the game, per se, but I highly doubt LA will allow the very weak SWG to in any way hinder TOR. SOE must somehow vastly improve the game and their profit line before TOR's release in order to convince LA to let it live.
From what little I've seen and heard, I don't think STO will hold many hardcore Trek fans or even casual Trek fans after a short curiosity period. It seems as if Cryptic is not doing anything particularily innovative in the game design and is relying mostly on the IP. Essentially an EvE with a Star Trek skin. This is just my impression now and may turn out to be completely wrong. But as a rabid Trekkie, I can tell you I'm very "eh" about this game.
agreed...i think TOR has a much better chance than ST:O in long term success
The average (and majority) of MMO gamers only play one MMO. The genre is quite time-consuming and makes investing into more than one MMO difficult. Sure there are exceptions (ive played 3 at a time) but most dont play more than 1.
I certainly will be there at launch for both games. And Id love it if both are amazing and addicting. My gut from following MMO's for over a decade though says STO will be more appealing to me long-term
I will be playing both, but I'd have to say that right now I am liking TOR a little better. Both have their pluses and minuses, but I think TOR will have a more character oriented story, and more room for individuality. Pimp my starship can only go so far in that regard.
I hope they both do great so we have a choice. I would like not to have to float back to a fantasy game when i get bored.
i'm an obvious fan of star trek over kotor online.
one thing trek is sure to have over tor is world pvp. imagine warping into a system to find an enemy ship with her shields down getting ready for an away mission. as a klingon move in for the kill while cloaked, or as federation try to hail them or whatever.
sandbox pvp is more important than character customization for me i guess, although i'm sure your avatar and npc crew members will gain exp from fighting ships in the 'world' and away missions.
KERPLAH!
Two things I've heard in STO that I like:Skill Based and Player based economy. That tells me right there that they're putting some kind of effort into making this game more imersive. It also tells me that they're NOT trying to copy WOW,which means they're trying to be more original. The looting for weapons and junk in games has gotten old. An item crafted by a player should ALWAYS be better than one gotten by a NPC. If it's not, then what's the point of the crafting profession in the first place?
While I enjoyed the original KOTOR, I don't see myself getting into an online version of it, which is exactly what it looks like to be shaping up as.
Currently Playing: World of Warcraft
thats what attracted me to STO as well. Skill based system is just better than classes and levels
I'll have to try both. Whichever one has better PvP is what I'll most likely end up playing.
I like the sound of that skill-based system, though.