General: Where Do MMOs Go Wrong?

SBFord

Most forums related to MMOs these days contain thread after thread about the disappointments many gamers experience when it comes to new and upcoming MMOs. Taking a break from his usual Friday TERA column, MMORPG.com Industry Relations Manager Garrett Fuller asks our readers, "Where do MMOs go wrong?" Read Garrett's thoughts and then answer the question in the comments below as it pertains to you.

I am taking a break from my TERA column this week to ask readers and users a simple question: Where do MMOs go wrong for you? There is a method to this article that I think will help all of us as players get the word out to developers as to why certain things in games work and fail. The market has been flooded with MMOs lately and there are many more on the way, the industry thinks players are becoming more picky. Well maybe it is because we have a lot to pick from. In an age with tons of free to play games, more AAA titles coming this year, and the general shift to games in the online space, it’s about time we reopened the case file on why games can fail.

Read more of Garrett Fuller's column, Where Do MMOs Go Wrong?

Qazz

Over promising and under delivering is my biggest turn-off for a game.  Developers need to be honest and stay true to what their games are.  Some developers simply lose touch with their audience and it all starts to fall apart.  

To the devs: Be honest with your game's faults, and be open in your communication with your player base.  Don't be afraid to say, "yeah, we know that sucked".  Honesty and 'human-ness' of developers go a long way.

Loktofeit

For me, the failure is in making 'Killer of Things' the main path of progression, with any secondary paths completely shackled and restricted by the Killer of Things path. Couple that with junk loot (rusted pauldron chips, rat tails, ogre toenails, etc)  with no actual in-game purpose and from Day One I have that "I've already done this in every otehr MMO" feeling. For me, that's where MMOs go wrong.

neosapience

The main reason MMOs fail is fairly straight forward; they're designed for the masses. In order to make a profit, MMO devs have to make sure that a lot of people will play thier games. This automatically means that the game has to appeal to your average MMO player. This isn't a problem if you're an average Joe, but for people like me, it means every MMO is an instant FAIL.

AndyPreston

You'd swear that the people designing the MMO's have never played one in their lives. If thousands of people can all say "omg dont implement that..." and they do it, what the hell are they thinking? I'd love to hear some of the round the table discussions they must have.

I think most of this community could sit down and concoct a pretty decent list of things a good MMO should and shouldnt have. Yet if we supplied it to a company to produce, they'd make it instanced, they'd add a bloody cash shop, they'd make the world small and unintersting with pointless copy quests, their customer support would be crap, there would be lag and bugs but they'd say it was our computers and our connections that are at fault, they'd lock threads where people complained, there'd be bots but they'd claim that there wasn't and they'd banned them all.

The list could and would go on and on...

MMO's are 90% of the time a huge disappointment, simply because the companies don't deliver and they don't listen to the people who know best, us!

ryuga81

Dear devs & publishers,

First: learn to give an appropriate price to your games. There are several well estabilished AAA titles you are going against, so if your title isn't comparable, just accept it and act accordingly.

Second: Don't overhype. Making promises you cannot deliver is bad for business. Start up with a small set of "open" features and grow over time. A player can be simply disappointed with a missing feature he would like to see, but disappointment will become rage if that feature was previously announced and expected.

Third: Try something new. Players are happy to start in a familiar environment, but if 99% of everything is already seen, already done, that's bad.

Fourth: Invest on support and work on bug solving. Even if a game is not perfect and has a buggy release, players are far more forgiving if they see continued and fast support. Leave them without news (even a simple "we're actually working on X and Y") for a couple days and you're ruined.

werewood

They go wrong in simplistic un challenging PvE.

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Werewood @ werewood.wordpress.com

bleyzwun

MMOs go wrong by almost rehashing the same ideas.  It get's pretty boring.  Some of the conepts might be different, but the basics of the gameplay are almost identical.  I also think these devs are rushing their games instead of trying to bring their true vision to life. 

 

I also feel that MMOs rely on levels too much.  Everything has to be a grind.  Some might enjoy it, but unless the level grind is hidden (leveling is so fun you don't think about it) I don't want to deal with it anymore.  From character levels, to crafting, to gear... it all relies on levels or grinding and is usually a boring process.  I feel as if they do this to keep you playing and paying longer.  If the game is fun enough I won't need levels to keep playing.

maplestone

This is not D&D.

I miss the idea of the old pencil and paper RPGs that the players are the primary storytellers rather than passive consumers of content.

trojan99

paying for beta is my biggest turn off and a gigantic fail. almost every title out there goes thru a closed beta -> open beta phase. yes, you are getting a bunch of freeloaders in that group, but you are also getting bug hunters, fans of a franchise, if it exists, experienced players looking to see if its worth sticking around, and paying for.

 

when a game is released with glaring technical problems, missing content, poor translations, these are the basics that really need to be at 100% before i pay you monthly or visit your item shop. what it tells me is that the devs and more likely the money behind the game, wants to start getting roi before the game is ready for primetime. short sightedness motivated by money leads to a fail game. and to ignore the feedback of the people who think highly enough of you to spend thier time submitting reports, and yet still release broken content.....words escape me here.

 

the mindset of  "good enough" to launch has got to stop.

 

Prophet0621

There are many ways I think games fail. As the article and others have said, trying to appeal to everyone for the sole reason of getting more money. I know it's a business and making money is the goal but it's sad when it is placed before the game. It often seems that the direction of the game is focused with generating more money and a distant second is making the game better.

 

 Shortcuts in the game to make it 'easy'. In a dungeon, fought your way to the bottom... what's the easiest way out...die. Spend the 5 minutes with a small penalty hit and move on. On the other side of the world and want to get back... die. Need to kill that one beast in the middle of the other 5... run in and hope you kill it before they kill you... die and no big deal. 

 Personally what will kill a game for me is when it becomes raid gear focused and anything short of that gear is pointless to play. I like PvP, I like the excitement, the challenge, the running for my little toons life to break up the boring as all hell grind. If you have a life and can't or absolutely no desire to spend 7 hours in a raid with an anal retentive group to get the newest uber gear you are gimped by game design.  Crafted gear should be better than drop.

 

 I think SWG had the most potential but became the biggest fail.

Luv_bug

MMOs suck because the people that make them are more skilled at technical logistics, corporatism, bootlicking, trying to act like they think they are the masters of the universe and office politics than innovation and creativity. They also REFUSE TO PAY for good game ideas. If you send them something, and they like it, they still expect you to be happy with a thanks in the  credits instead of even a design credit cuz THEN THEY'D HAVE TO PAY YOU. Fortunately IF you e-mail them the idea they can't steal it because e-mail has an automatic copyright based on the berne convention, but only in countries they respect that. They hope to  make millions, and you get the shaft. I mean you think between all these players we haven't given them enough data to figure out the problem? It's not that mmos suck, the problem is  that mmos suck because of WHO is making them. Just cuz someone has the money, wherewithall and technical expertise to make an mmo, doesn't mean they know how to make a good game.

elocke

Make worlds with a game not just games pretending to be parts of a world.  Ways to do this are, never use instanced zones, use free roam persistent zones.  Use housing and other methods of gameplay OTHER than combat.  Make questing fun and worthwhile and have a purpose other than to fill some npc's to do list for the day.

Throw in boats and boat building, mount collecting that is useful as well as fun and addictive, collections, mini games, other than combat competitions like Fishing tournaments.  Dynamic content will hopefully address a lot of these issues but just remember to give us options and tons of crap to do.

GrumpyMel2

Here are my list of reasons for where so many MMO's miss the mark:

1) Many of the people who run the companies that make them (not talking the designers down in the trenches, talking the studio/publisher head honcho's) aren't gamers at heart, don't enjoy playing the type of games they make or worse yet look down upon gamers. Many haven't even tried playing the products thier companies are producing. Really hard to make good decisions about how a product is made, if you have no practical experience or interest in actualy using that product yourself.

 

2) Loosing sight of good game design in the chase for your own marketing buzzwords. Pretty much any game who's developers use the words "Iconic", "Epic", "Heroic" or something similar is a sure bet ti run into problems. The only buzzword that should really be the focus of a Dev should be "Fun".....and fun really stems from solid game design.

 

3) Trying to be all things to all people. Yes, everyone wants to appeal to a good sized market...but the bottom line is that many things that different audience segments want are completely incompatible with each other. Dev needs to define thier target audience up front and the design a product that appeals to THAT audience....and NOT LOOSE FOCUS on that by chasing after other audience segments.

 

4) Understand the difference between an MMO and a SPRPG.  SPRPG's you play by yourself and you play for a fixed period of time. With a SPRPG you can craft the game for the Player to be the main focus of the World...and you can tailor the tempo of the action to bring it to a dramatic climax. An MMO doesn't work like that.... being "The ONE" really doesn't work very well when there are 500,000 other players running around in the environment who are also "The ONE". Nor does killing the World-Eating Dragon of Ultimate Doom and gaining the Item of Ultimate Power in Chapter 10. That works perfectly fine in an SPRPG because after that happens the Player rides off into the sunset and the credits role. The MMORPG doesn't...so then the question becomes what happens AFTER you do all that?  Pretty soon the game becomes a farce of itself.

 

5) Sandbox != FFA full loot PvP.  FFA full loot PvP = gank/greif fest

 

GrumpyMel2

Originally posted by maplestone

This is not D&D.

I miss the idea of the old pencil and paper RPGs that the players are the primary storytellers rather than passive consumers of content.

+1

ThomasN7

1. The people who makes these games are not gamers at heart. They are people who are only passionate about making money.

2. Been getting go kill 20 and go fetch quests since the days of DAOC. Nothing has changed.

3. Scared to innovate because if they fail they don't make as much money.

4. Catering to the masses. Once a game goes mainstream the quality is lost. It is dumbed down so that a 10 year old can comprehend mmo gameplay.

Without giving it much thought these are just 4 that come ot mind.

battleaxe

Today's MMOs fail for one single reason - WoW.  Designers, bean counters, and everyone involved in the project see WoW, think they can mimic its success by simply recreating it with minor differences, and they will be an overnight success.  Let me break it to anyone thinking this makes any sense at all - no one is leaving WoW for a WoW clone.  It simply won't happen.  Guilds, groups of friends, and the millions of current and former subscribers will not jump to your game unless you supply a drastically superior experience to Blizzard's offering, which you can't do.  It's not possible to out-WoW WoW.

If you really want to succeed - be different.  Include more realistic physics (friendly fire, explosions that knock people around and set flammable armor on fire, etc.).  Include a combat model other than tank/dps/healer.  For example, create a game with no healers, where healing isn't available during combat, or where fight outcomes are determined in such a short window of time that healing isn't practical during a fight.  Use different races with powerful racial abilities - I'm tired of humans, elves, orcs, and dwarves - try something different (I'd love to play a draconian). 

Quests need to be unique.  Every MMO has an overwhelming majority of the same 4 quests - pick up X things, kill X things, kill things and loot X items, give this to that NPC.  Come up with something different that's fun and you'll have a lot of subscribers.

Marcus-

They fail for me because it seems for almost every MMO that gets released, I have one on my hard drive/collecting dust in a drawer just like it...

 

Yep, the graphics are updated, and the combat may be a lil better, there could even be a slight spin on the quests, but overall, I already bought this game....And i don't feel the need to spend another $50 on something pretty similiar.

Foomerang

Thats easy. MMOs are being made first and foremost as combat/action games. The virtual world and everything else in it is an afterthought. Thats where MMOs go wrong these days.

CactusJack

I would agree with many of the opinions expressed here. I would like to add mine...it all begins and ends with us, as gamers.

If you purchase a game, play it, dislike it...you end your sub and move on. Expressing your displeasure on forums is normal, if unremarkable.  Where we as gamers get into trouble is....it's generally the same 6-7 companies that continue over and over to produce/publish the same terrible crap.

It's very similiar to RMT sales. If no one bought in game currency/weapons/ships/mounts with real money, they wouldn't exist. I would say class action lawsuits might help, but that would stifle an already struggling genre as is. I am of the thought that if you are unhappy with a game, don't play it. You single largest currency as a gamer is your SPENDING power.

If you don't like EvE, Rift, Vanguard whatever....don't pay for it. Attendance is the very first lesson we all learned as children. It still applies today. All the rage in the world is fixed...if you leave. Companies have customer service departments that are there for who? Their customers. No customers=no company, really it's that simple.

I think the layers of MMO players is so varied now, you will have a large group of them...therefore SIGNIFICANT group that will continue to support companies that put out crap b/c they want to believe it will get better or whatever.

I find most of my age range of MMO players have figured this out. We vote with our presence. If a game fails to deliver..I leave.

just1opinion

For me, quests are the big mess.  I agree with everyone who has complained about the delivery quests, kill x, kill and loot x, etc. type of questing.  Sure it's fine to have MINIMAL amounts of that, but when quests are reduced to PURELY that type of quest.....hell no.  I'm immediately turned off.

 

Oblivion comes to mind. There's one quest where you have to go inside a painting to achieve your objective and the world inside the painting LOOKS like an oil painting. Another quest where you have to infiltrate a faction and become "friends" with the members only to have to betray them and kill them all later. These types of quests took some IMAGINATION.  We NEED quests that are imaginative rather than generic.  I enjoy questing and BAD questing ruins a game for me rather quickly.

 

Of course there are a lot of other things wrong with today's MMOs too, in my opinion, but this quest thing has got to be one of the most annoying things for me personally.

erictlewis

A lot of them fail simply because they promise to deliver product A then you get product B instead.  Then over the years the Nerf it down to easy mode and make what was once fun a grind fest.

I agree trying to appease the mindset of the east vs the west is always going to be a problem .  Over here we like subscriptions, in other countries they rent they computers by time so only play limited times, subscriptions don't work for them,  and then you run into the huge problem of society,  east vs west are very dynamic and very different cultures to their own and trying to play to both societies nobody is going to be happy.

Daitengu

I find it interesting that Fuller brings up "This is not D&D. The DM cannot create an intricate story line around saving a village from a tribe of goblins."

I think it's true only because the companies use the mechanics, but not give the players the tools to do their own story telling. CoH/V has corrected this problem in my eyes with the architect patch.

 

I would add a 4th to Fuller's list. Companies are afraid to innovate. They are trying to be White Castle's McDonald's. Attempting to do what the first one did, but better. Well too bad. EQ was White Castle. and WoW is McDonald's.  No one does better than McDonald's. That ship already sailed.  Now people are trying to be Wendy's and burger King. Copy of a copy. So sad. Companies need to innovate if they want to draw their own crowd. They need to stand out, Be the KFCs and Domino's. Games that are competition, but don't use the same stuff as WoW.  It's why I think Rift will have decent sales of boxes, but linger near death's door like Warhammer. Rift's too busy being a copy of a copy, to try and stand out with it's own flavor. After the initial shine of a new world to explore, players will find it'll taste too much like WoW.

travamars

They 'go wrong' by letting sites like this one build up their games to the point where people are disappointed when they play. DCUO has been pumped to the point where it wil explode, and when it finally came out only then did we get to here of the problems with the game, or how it actually played.

Loktofeit

Originally posted by travamars

They 'go wrong' by letting sites like this one build up their games to the point where people are disappointed when they play.

Had you not posted this on the same day that the MMORPG.com staff posted the reviews that they did, you might have had a point.

TookyG

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Originally posted by SaintViktor
1. The people who makes these games are not gamers at heart. They are people who are only passionate about making money.

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This is completely false. You're thinking more along the lines of investors...and there's nothing wrong with wanting a good ROI.