Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice...

Dracheir

Remember, there have been a lot of titles that promised a lot of things to us in the not too distant past. ArcheAge comes to mind when I think about Black Desert. Don't be starstruck by a game based solely on your lack of a current one. Keep your mind clear and judge the game for what it is. 

Far too often, we convince ourselves that next game is going to be the "one" but more often than not it ends up being a disaster. Don't get me wrong, I am not judging Black Desert I am just saying - as a consumer, make them earn your money.

d_20

Sounds like dating and relationships in general.

Unless you're just a playah. Ew. Wait...

scorpex-x

I've played BD and it's nothing impressive.

Having said that you simply cannot disuade people that this game isn't the next big thing, being pretty is more important than being good.  Just look at Star Wars battlefront, that game is a joke but because it looks and sounds pretty it will sell in the millions.

 I could list so many games that are honestly awful but nice graphics seems to make people overlook how bad the game is.

Dracheir

scorpex-x said:

I've played BD and it's nothing impressive.

Having said that you simply cannot disuade people that this game isn't the next big thing, being pretty is more important than being good.  Just look at Star Wars battlefront, that game is a joke but because it looks and sounds pretty it will sell in the millions.

 I could list so many games that are honestly awful but nice graphics seems to make people overlook how bad the game is.

This is why we continue to have bad games. People are in awe over visuals and settle for mediocre gameplay resulting in a mass exodus after a couple of months and a recycle of the process. 

holdenhamlet

It's also possible the game has amazing graphics AND good gameplay.  Not everyone will agree but try it yourself before deciding.

Also I can't think of an MMO that was hyped for great graphics but had bad gameplay causing an exodus.  Is this an actual trend or just one you're imagining?

Last MMO I can think of that was hyped for graphics is FFXIV (which does in fact have mediocre gameplay imo).  However that game is going really strong.

Finally, there's just no way in hell the game is just about graphics.  If you play it you'll see all the thought and detail that went into everything.  

You may not agree with certain design decisions but you can't say the devs didn't work really hard on this game.

Vrika

If you were fooled by Archeage founders packs, then it's already shame on you.

Speaking as someone who never paid anything for Archeage, let me be hyped about Black Desert because it looks like a lot better game.

Vrika

DMKano said:

Vrika said:

If you were fooled by Archeage founders packs, then it's already shame on you.

Speaking as someone who never paid anything for Archeage, let me be hyped about Black Desert because it looks like a lot better game.

It looks better for sure in terms of graphics.

However gameplay - well if you are a soloer at heart BD will be fun for you for a few weeks.

Longevity wise Archeage all the way for me.

Unfortunately I must agree with you about longevity.

whilan

Dracheir said:

Remember, there have been a lot of titles that promised a lot of things to us in the not too distant past. ArcheAge comes to mind when I think about Black Desert. Don't be starstruck by a game based solely on your lack of a current one. Keep your mind clear and judge the game for what it is. 

Far too often, we convince ourselves that next game is going to be the "one" but more often than not it ends up being a disaster. Don't get me wrong, I am not judging Black Desert I am just saying - as a consumer, make them earn your money.

You know, if you actually research the game before hand and don't buy stuff before you have all the required info to make an actual informed decision, you run the risk of getting a product you are unhappy with. Everyone who bought AA and are now upset with it, failed in researching.  I researched saw what the game was, enjoyed it for what it is, dropped it a bit later when there wasn't anything I wanted to do, and was happy.  I all the time see people say i'm unhappy because hype made me believe I was so sure that it was going to be great, I bought it before seeing what it was or looking stuff up.  Stop doing that.  That makes it very easy to impulse buy something which usually makes you regretful later once the thrill is over.

Here is some quick easy steps that can be applied to nearly EVERY game, single player, MMO, doesn't matter:

1. Look at what the developers are saying, if what they are saying sounds interesting, move on to step 2. if not move on to step B.

2. If video is available and is not CGI but actual game play, watch those.  Preferably player ones as company ones will show you footage but it's to make a sale, so keep that in mind. if you like the game play footage move to step 3, if not move on to step B.

3. Take your past likes into account, what other games have features like those, good chance a game hasn't completely reworked how this plays out, sure they can call it a pretty name like dynamic event but in the end game play footage will tell you, it's a public quest with a different name. If you like the features so far move on to step 4, if not move on to step B.

4. Look at some of the other things the company does, Bioware does stories (but usually fails miserably at getting the ending down), Bethesda usually does open worlds but all conversation (save for FO4 and i reserve judgement on that) takes place where the NPC is in front of you the whole time. Take their past works into account especially when they are making a game that is in the same genre, that should give you a heads up for what kind of game you are in for.  In the case of AA as it was brought up, don't look at Trion but the people who made it.  If you like all this move on to Step 5, if not move on to step B.

5. Finally get an idea of viewer opinions, look at critics you tend to generally agree with, big site critics, forums, if the game is currently going in other parts, see how it's doing, if well, why is it doing well. if not, why is it doing poorly, do these reasons affect you?  If you really plan to play a game for the long haul (as most forumites on this forum tend to think that's what a MMO is supposed to be) you may want to take some time to look this up yourself.  If all of this still sounds good to you, move onto step A, if not move on to Step B.

Step A. Once you are dang sure that you still want this game after all 5 steps, make a preorder depending on how much you'd normally pay for a game of this type unless you really think this is something that absolutely must be made, but gauge your own interest (not excitement) as to where you should pre-order at.

Step B. Move on, leave the game forums, make a post every so often informing people why it wasn't a good fit for you (so you contribute to step 5 for other people)

5 easy steps that will help you avoid the majority of games you will dislike.  Too many people just jump to step 5 and go from there.  step 5 is the last thing you should look at IMO.

Sovrath

scorpex-x said:

I've played BD and it's nothing impressive.

Having said that you simply cannot disuade people that this game isn't the next big thing, being pretty is more important than being good.  Just look at Star Wars battlefront, that game is a joke but because it looks and sounds pretty it will sell in the millions.

 I could list so many games that are honestly awful but nice graphics seems to make people overlook how bad the game is.

While there are concerning issues such as lack of challenge I believe that many, at least on forums where pros and cons are discussed, know of these things and to them they are either non-issues or something to be tolerated.

This game, at least to me, doesn't have to be "the next big thing". Truth be told, I don't really fall into that type of frenzy because something is touted to be "the next big thing".

Other than lack of challenge and lack of dungeons (which to me means something along Lineage 2 lines and not WoW lines) I think this game will work just fine with me. 

I've read the pros and cons and I'm in. A shame some people have alpha keys and probably had no idea what they were getting into. bleah I say "BLEAH".

Kyleran

DMKano said:

Dracheir said:

scorpex-x said:

I've played BD and it's nothing impressive.

Having said that you simply cannot disuade people that this game isn't the next big thing, being pretty is more important than being good.  Just look at Star Wars battlefront, that game is a joke but because it looks and sounds pretty it will sell in the millions.

 I could list so many games that are honestly awful but nice graphics seems to make people overlook how bad the game is.

This is why we continue to have bad games. People are in awe over visuals and settle for mediocre gameplay resulting in a mass exodus after a couple of months and a recycle of the process. 

Theres is a lot more to it that that. 

People just hop from game to game a lot more frequently than before. Less than 20% of players stay after the first month.

Look at steam - there arw pretty decent games released every week - and yes I am counting all types of games. 

I don't exclusively play MMOs, I play a bunch of single player games too.

Tourist

I'll be passing on this one, mostly because I'm pretty sure this style of game isn't for me these days, and will be sticking with EVE for the long haul.

I don't play games, I inhabit virtual worlds™

Wizardry

Dracheir said:

scorpex-x said:

I've played BD and it's nothing impressive.

Having said that you simply cannot disuade people that this game isn't the next big thing, being pretty is more important than being good.  Just look at Star Wars battlefront, that game is a joke but because it looks and sounds pretty it will sell in the millions.

 I could list so many games that are honestly awful but nice graphics seems to make people overlook how bad the game is.

This is why we continue to have bad games. People are in awe over visuals and settle for mediocre gameplay resulting in a mass exodus after a couple of months and a recycle of the process. 

It is working both ways,super lame cheap graphics and people seem to make excuses for a game based on basically nothing,example "i like the art style",unless a game is COMPLETE i am not  playing it past my initial testing phase.

Mikeha

Black Desert is here to save us. 

makasouleater69

scorpex-x said:

I've played BD and it's nothing impressive.

Having said that you simply cannot disuade people that this game isn't the next big thing, being pretty is more important than being good.  Just look at Star Wars battlefront, that game is a joke but because it looks and sounds pretty it will sell in the millions.

 I could list so many games that are honestly awful but nice graphics seems to make people overlook how bad the game is.

Well, sorry but some of us didn't buy a 1500+ computer, to play baudlers gate 2. There are already plenty of games with bad graphics and really good game play. For me if it is new, and coming out, with graphics like play station 2 and 3, I am not even gonna see if the game play is any good. Why, because if I want good game play as I said there are thousands of games already out that fit that. Which have been out for so long, they have had many mods/fixes, that make them better than a new world. The only advantage a new game has is its graphics, than if the game play is good, we got a good game. 

I never played battlefront, but as your saying its a joke I doubt it. It looks like star wars battlefield, that would obviously be a hit. 

Herase

whilan said:

Dracheir said:

Remember, there have been a lot of titles that promised a lot of things to us in the not too distant past. ArcheAge comes to mind when I think about Black Desert. Don't be starstruck by a game based solely on your lack of a current one. Keep your mind clear and judge the game for what it is. 

Far too often, we convince ourselves that next game is going to be the "one" but more often than not it ends up being a disaster. Don't get me wrong, I am not judging Black Desert I am just saying - as a consumer, make them earn your money.

You know, if you actually research the game before hand and don't buy stuff before you have all the required info to make an actual informed decision, you run the risk of getting a product you are unhappy with. Everyone who bought AA and are now upset with it, failed in researching.  I researched saw what the game was, enjoyed it for what it is, dropped it a bit later when there wasn't anything I wanted to do, and was happy.  I all the time see people say i'm unhappy because hype made me believe I was so sure that it was going to be great, I bought it before seeing what it was or looking stuff up.  Stop doing that.  That makes it very easy to impulse buy something which usually makes you regretful later once the thrill is over.

Here is some quick easy steps that can be applied to nearly EVERY game, single player, MMO, doesn't matter:

1. Look at what the developers are saying, if what they are saying sounds interesting, move on to step 2. if not move on to step B.

2. If video is available and is not CGI but actual game play, watch those.  Preferably player ones as company ones will show you footage but it's to make a sale, so keep that in mind. if you like the game play footage move to step 3, if not move on to step B.

3. Take your past likes into account, what other games have features like those, good chance a game hasn't completely reworked how this plays out, sure they can call it a pretty name like dynamic event but in the end game play footage will tell you, it's a public quest with a different name. If you like the features so far move on to step 4, if not move on to step B.

4. Look at some of the other things the company does, Bioware does stories (but usually fails miserably at getting the ending down), Bethesda usually does open worlds but all conversation (save for FO4 and i reserve judgement on that) takes place where the NPC is in front of you the whole time. Take their past works into account especially when they are making a game that is in the same genre, that should give you a heads up for what kind of game you are in for.  In the case of AA as it was brought up, don't look at Trion but the people who made it.  If you like all this move on to Step 5, if not move on to step B.

5. Finally get an idea of viewer opinions, look at critics you tend to generally agree with, big site critics, forums, if the game is currently going in other parts, see how it's doing, if well, why is it doing well. if not, why is it doing poorly, do these reasons affect you?  If you really plan to play a game for the long haul (as most forumites on this forum tend to think that's what a MMO is supposed to be) you may want to take some time to look this up yourself.  If all of this still sounds good to you, move onto step A, if not move on to Step B.

Step A. Once you are dang sure that you still want this game after all 5 steps, make a preorder depending on how much you'd normally pay for a game of this type unless you really think this is something that absolutely must be made, but gauge your own interest (not excitement) as to where you should pre-order at.

Step B. Move on, leave the game forums, make a post every so often informing people why it wasn't a good fit for you (so you contribute to step 5 for other people)

5 easy steps that will help you avoid the majority of games you will dislike.  Too many people just jump to step 5 and go from there.  step 5 is the last thing you should look at IMO.

No matter how many times you say it, people won't listen. Every game I see come out people buy into hype then they complain, "the game wasn't what I expected. I've been duped, scammed, lied to" or whatever other excuse and then they wounder why so many bad games get put out half complete. 

psiic

Wow good to see people starting to realize that BDO is nothing but a polished turd. You can shine up shit to make it pretty but its still shit.

Distopia

Dracheir said:

scorpex-x said:

I've played BD and it's nothing impressive.

Having said that you simply cannot disuade people that this game isn't the next big thing, being pretty is more important than being good.  Just look at Star Wars battlefront, that game is a joke but because it looks and sounds pretty it will sell in the millions.

 I could list so many games that are honestly awful but nice graphics seems to make people overlook how bad the game is.

This is why we continue to have bad games. People are in awe over visuals and settle for mediocre gameplay resulting in a mass exodus after a couple of months and a recycle of the process. 

What constitutes good game-play isn't a universal concept... What constitutes a bad game isn't a universal concept. Posts like this are simply nonsense.

time007

“There's an old saying in Tennessee — I know it's in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can't get fooled again.” -George W. Bush

waynejr2

whilan said:

Dracheir said:

Remember, there have been a lot of titles that promised a lot of things to us in the not too distant past. ArcheAge comes to mind when I think about Black Desert. Don't be starstruck by a game based solely on your lack of a current one. Keep your mind clear and judge the game for what it is. 

Far too often, we convince ourselves that next game is going to be the "one" but more often than not it ends up being a disaster. Don't get me wrong, I am not judging Black Desert I am just saying - as a consumer, make them earn your money.

You know, if you actually research the game before hand and don't buy stuff before you have all the required info to make an actual informed decision, you run the risk of getting a product you are unhappy with. Everyone who bought AA and are now upset with it, failed in researching.  I researched saw what the game was, enjoyed it for what it is, dropped it a bit later when there wasn't anything I wanted to do, and was happy.  I all the time see people say i'm unhappy because hype made me believe I was so sure that it was going to be great, I bought it before seeing what it was or looking stuff up.  Stop doing that.  That makes it very easy to impulse buy something which usually makes you regretful later once the thrill is over.

Here is some quick easy steps that can be applied to nearly EVERY game, single player, MMO, doesn't matter:

1. Look at what the developers are saying, if what they are saying sounds interesting, move on to step 2. if not move on to step B.

2. If video is available and is not CGI but actual game play, watch those.  Preferably player ones as company ones will show you footage but it's to make a sale, so keep that in mind. if you like the game play footage move to step 3, if not move on to step B.

3. Take your past likes into account, what other games have features like those, good chance a game hasn't completely reworked how this plays out, sure they can call it a pretty name like dynamic event but in the end game play footage will tell you, it's a public quest with a different name. If you like the features so far move on to step 4, if not move on to step B.

4. Look at some of the other things the company does, Bioware does stories (but usually fails miserably at getting the ending down), Bethesda usually does open worlds but all conversation (save for FO4 and i reserve judgement on that) takes place where the NPC is in front of you the whole time. Take their past works into account especially when they are making a game that is in the same genre, that should give you a heads up for what kind of game you are in for.  In the case of AA as it was brought up, don't look at Trion but the people who made it.  If you like all this move on to Step 5, if not move on to step B.

5. Finally get an idea of viewer opinions, look at critics you tend to generally agree with, big site critics, forums, if the game is currently going in other parts, see how it's doing, if well, why is it doing well. if not, why is it doing poorly, do these reasons affect you?  If you really plan to play a game for the long haul (as most forumites on this forum tend to think that's what a MMO is supposed to be) you may want to take some time to look this up yourself.  If all of this still sounds good to you, move onto step A, if not move on to Step B.

Step A. Once you are dang sure that you still want this game after all 5 steps, make a preorder depending on how much you'd normally pay for a game of this type unless you really think this is something that absolutely must be made, but gauge your own interest (not excitement) as to where you should pre-order at.

Step B. Move on, leave the game forums, make a post every so often informing people why it wasn't a good fit for you (so you contribute to step 5 for other people)

5 easy steps that will help you avoid the majority of games you will dislike.  Too many people just jump to step 5 and go from there.  step 5 is the last thing you should look at IMO.

Players don't want to be good consumers it seems.   They do seem to like to complain and not researching adds into it.  If they took the time they complained about a bad purchased into researching it before hand, they MIGHT have a better result.  Then again, they might always find fault in every game they purchase.

I don't like OP's use of the word promise.  That is a pretty loaded word.  Perhaps it is accurate but someone would be foolish to simply believe marketing statements and then label them promises.  I guess it is a trust but verify situation.  However that would require research. 

holdenhamlet

Another thing to consider is great graphics isn't easy to pull off in MMOs, especially in a seamless world.  If anything, it's an indicator of quality, not an indicator of shallowness like it might be with single player games.

FlyByKnight

I agree with OP 100%, but the fact is many people are searching for a reason to ditch (rightfully) Archeage and will end up running into this solo PVE Archeage 2.0. I used to scoff at people who way this genre of game is dying but now I'm starting to agree a bit.

AzAsheron

Its a decent game, but yes it will attract alot of people because of how great it looks and all in all, its a pvp game with close to no content for pve players whatsoever, have fun having sex with this 10 a couple of times. I'll be having a long good relationship with an 8 I found, Tree of savior

YashaX

ikcin said:

 BDO is definitely bad. But it is the typical new AAA MMORPG, like AA, ESO, GW2, Wildstar, and etc. In comparison with them BDO is a good game actually, mostly because of the PvP. In conclusion people buy bad MMOs. 

Ikcin's definition of a bad mmo is one that is better than AA, ESO, and GW2, haha. I would be happy with it even if it is half as good as ESO or GW2.

ste2000

I will definetly try it.
But only if it's either P2P or B2P.
None of that F2P bullshit for me.

With AA I had the unconfutable proof that Cash Shops is what ruins MMOs for me.

Dracheir

ste2000 said:

I will definetly try it.
But only if it's either P2P or B2P.
None of that F2P bullshit for me.

With AA I had the unconfutable proof that Cash Shops is what ruins MMOs for me.

It's buy to play.

Gdemami

Sometimes people aren't being fooled, sometimes people are just fools...

Dracheir

Gdemami said:

Sometimes people aren't being fooled, sometimes people are just fools...

True.