Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
South Park, WoW and why non-sandbox MMOs are no fun....
Tonkatsu
Member Posts: 53
Having caught the WoW episode of South Park on its second showing last night, it occured to me just why I'd quit WoW in the first place...you kill some mobs in order to get gear to kill some mobs in order to get gear to kil...well, you get the picture. While no sandbox MMO is perfect, once you get past the WoW story and the rather well designed interface and world, you realize just what a damned repetitive grind it is. On the other hand, in games such as pre-NGE SWG and UO, you had a wealth of options. Sadly enough, the people at SOE (and every other major MMO developer house) seem to think that the best way to go is to make their upcoming offerings (or existing games) more "Warcrafty", that is, shallow and full of grinding. Somehow I get the impression that regardless of the genre's remarkable potential, it'll never be realized, as it's just not "cost-efficient". It's really a pity the first time I really noticed this game was about a week after they added the NGE, I do hope it somehow comes back in it's classic form.
Comments
Go away.
I have my own thought provoking thread...
But yeah, cost-efficient is the real problem here.
Devs and people dont understand warcraft is warcraft, everything blizzard did to warcraft was perfect for well Warcraft. SWG made the game to warcrafty and it failed. Only blizzard knows how to make a good warcraft, SOE and many others do not. Why cant game companys just be original instead of copying the most popular thing on the market.
Meaning it's lowest common denominator. It's quality is quantity. It has no sophistication or artistry to it at all.
And as the prominent star, it's vulnerable to being gunned down in a drive-by and suddenly die.
WoW and Rap are popular and sadly nothing will kill them in a long time, only washed up, dried up crap will only say it competes with it
Uh oh...
You know what you just did?!
you woke the RAP Fans!
You can stay here if you wish, but I'm heading for the hills!
Van Halen w/David Lee Roth FTMFW!
Van Halen w/DLR= Pre CU (the classic everyone loves best)
Van Halen w/Sammy= CU (well, not as good but still good)
Van Halen w/Gary Cherone= NGE (like seeing Rosie O'Donnell naked)
--When you resubscribe to SWG, an 18 yearold Stripper finds Jesus, gives up stripping, and moves with a rolex reverend to Hawaii.
--In MMORPG's l007 is the opiate of the masses.
--The absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence!
--CCP could cut off an Eve player's fun bits, and that player would say that it was good CCP did that.
I would say:
Pre-CU = Mozart played by 1'st year music school students. Beutifull music, but horrible musicians.
CU = Dvorak played by black metal band Mayhem. Beutifull music, but in no way made to be played as black metal.
NGE = David Hasselhoff. PERIOD! (sorry, I just couldnt find a classic composer in my collection that had bad enough music to fit the NGE...The NGE is just...David Hasselhoff.)
I bought Van Halen 1 after a friend played me Eruption, think i was about 12 or 13.
Never had a single album since affect me like that did
I bought Van Halen 1 after a friend played me Eruption, think i was about 12 or 13.
Never had a single album since affect me like that did
Yep, that one was genre changing. No one had ever played guitar like that. No band before had the combo of master gunslinger Eddie Van Halen and over the top master frontman David Lee Roth.
It set the standard for 80's rock. Almost all 80's rock bands were VH wannabes.
... but just over the roar could be heard DLR's voice announcing:
"Please return your Hostess to the upright position"
You just dont get entertainment like that anymore
I wrote this song a long time ago/a real long time ago, way before Slim Shady was in demand, way before we dropped bologna on Afganastan/I wrote this song in '94...
Now this is funny.
(Although) all jokes aside, Cherone has one Hell of a voice, alone or in Extreme he did some decent tunes.
I admit that Nuno and Him played well together and some of their albums were cutting edge actually, very opera like in some ways.
But that Rosie comment just made me spit coffee LOL
You win the ISK Quote of the day award thats for sure....
______________________________
I usually picture the Career builder commercial with the room full of monkeys and upside down sales chart when thinking about the SOE/SWG decision making process.....
SOE's John Blakely and Todd Fiala issued a warning: "Don't make our mistakes." Ref NGE
Winner of the worst MMOS goes to.... the NGE and SWG..!!! http://www.mmorpg.com/showFeature.cfm?loadFeature=1034&bhcp=1
TUPAC STILL LIVES!
Fixed
Yes Tupac does in fact still live; however, he's not allowed to perform as his usual self and can only produce videos under the new gangsta experience or better known on the streets as "da NGE" .
Wow, such small thinking... Rap & Hip Hop, like all music, has it's good and it's bad...
That said, come out of your boxes people!!! Personally, I listen to a HUGE variety of music (160 gigs of MP3's, including 2k of converted V). In fact, the only style I would say I definatly don NOT listen to is modern country.
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
Man Alive! You can't honestly be telling me that the pre-CU environment didn't rely on repetitive tasks. Every profession relied on the same type of grinding you find in other mmos. Whether it was grinding heals in a hospital, killing the same bounty ad nausea, or killing a bazillion quenkers outside the Mining Outpost, the majority of players relied upon a repetitive grind to gain xp.
As for items, players were still 'grinding'. I rarely found myself alone, or at least among a few players, when I went to the Geonosian Cave, Dantooine to hunt Krayts, or Dathomir to hunt witches.
The problem with games like WoW is that the Quest System puts blinders on most players and they don't realize what else is possible.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
Man Alive! You can't honestly be telling me that the pre-CU environment didn't rely on repetitive tasks. Every profession relied on the same type of grinding you find in other mmos. Whether it was grinding heals in a hospital, killing the same bounty ad nausea, or killing a bazillion quenkers outside the Mining Outpost, the majority of players relied upon a repetitive grind to gain xp.
As for items, players were still 'grinding'. I rarely found myself alone, or at least among a few players, when I went to the Geonosian Cave, Dantooine to hunt Krayts, or Dathomir to hunt witches.
The problem with games like WoW is that the Quest System puts blinders on most players and they don't realize what else is possible.
Perhaps I should've phrased my original post better. I should have said "pointless grind". In SWG, you ended up grinding for skill leveling, but also to contribute to such things as housing, creation of new types of armor etc. It's this lack of breadth in its gameplay that makes WoW so monotonous.
Also, Queen kicks VH's ass, go take a look at their Live Aid performance on Youtube or Google Video for an example.
I'm not sure if you played the pre-CU or not, but I'd argue that nearly everyone wore composite armor. Even with variables in crafting, most gear pieces (armor and weapons) were identical. For example, I found little variation in 'quality' stun batons. Sure you had options to use different equipment, as you do in WoW, but the effective use of items prevented their prevalence among players.
Fundamentally speaking, grinding is grinding. I don't see much of a difference between SWG and WoW in that respect.
As breadth, there's nothing to prevent players from 'going off the beaten' path in WoW. If you don't want to do quests, fine, you can go out and kill x beast just like you did in SWG. Don't like Battlegrounds, try raid the various towns and cities (a personal favorite of mine). Other than housing and the entertainment professions, I don't see much more that SWG offered over WoW in terms of player 'freedom'.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
I'm not sure if you played the pre-CU or not, but I'd argue that nearly everyone wore composite armor. Even with variables in crafting, most gear pieces (armor and weapons) were identical. For example, I found little variation in 'quality' stun batons. Sure you had options to use different equipment, as you do in WoW, but the effective use of items prevented their prevalence among players.
Fundamentally speaking, grinding is grinding. I don't see much of a difference between SWG and WoW in that respect.
As breadth, there's nothing to prevent players from 'going off the beaten' path in WoW. If you don't want to do quests, fine, you can go out and kill x beast just like you did in SWG. Don't like Battlegrounds, try raid the various towns and cities (a personal favorite of mine). Other than housing and the entertainment professions, I don't see much more that SWG offered over WoW in terms of player 'freedom'.
There certainly is something that prevents people from going off the beaten path in WoW, there's nothing there! Housing? Nope. Making Droids? Nope. Dancing/Entertaining? Nope. Being a Medic? Uh-uh. And so on...you can kill, and that's about it (with the exception of the seriously lacking crafting professions).
Perhaps you didn't read my post, I admitted there's no housing and entertainment professions in WoW. : )
Sure there's plenty to do in WoW outside of killing x beast. For example, my guild and others use city taverns just like we used cantinas in SWG. We go there to meet, talk, rp, whatever. As I said previously, most players put on the blinders and don't realize what's beyond the Quest System.
Being a medic? Maybe you forgot about Priest, Paladins, and Druids as classes, and Alchemy and First-Aid.
Ico
Oh, cruel fate, to be thusly boned. Ask not for whom the bone bones. It bones for thee.
Perhaps you didn't read my post, I admitted there's no housing and entertainment professions in WoW. : )
Sure there's plenty to do in WoW outside of killing x beast. For example, my guild and others use city taverns just like we used cantinas in SWG. We go there to meet, talk, rp, whatever. As I said previously, most players put on the blinders and don't realize what's beyond the Quest System.
Enough to know that you are required to raid after level 59....up to that point it wasn't too bad - albeit an almighty grindfest like lots of other games.
Proud Master CH -
Sorry,
Proud FORMER Master CH...
my toon was untimely converted into something more Star Warsy
For reference, I played SWG from early beta until NGE (on and off), but NGE was the nail in the coffin.
Sandbox doesn't mean there is or isn't a grind.
Sandbox doesn't mean there is or isn't a class system.
Sandbox doesn't mean there won't be quests.
Sandbox does mean the game is designed for players to influence the world.
If you want to play a true sandbox game, try Eve Online. The big drawback to Eve for me is that I want a ground based game included and it's not going to be there for Eve, ever.
so...