Well, if you are trying to solo, you should be doing your best to find one on one fights. I think it is realistic that way. If you want to solo, stay out in the wilderness, pick your fights, find some wandering animals, scouts, etc to pray on. I don't think one guy should be considering invading a dungeon, cave, castle, stronghold, etc, it just isn't realistic. Unless of course, you were to implement a good stealth, hide in shadows, sneak, sort of experience for the would be thief/assassin. Then someone good at the trade could get past the hordes of guards at the gate, and sneak in searching for pray alone in their bedroom... but that person should also expect to get gang banged if they get caught sneaking around somewhere they don't belong.
Well i do agree with that, for realisms sake. But just for the purely fun aspect of the game its a nice feeling to cut down swathes of enemies rather than just beat one of them, and i dont want to have to run away every time i see 4 or 5 goblins/rats. Bosses are fun, but should be rare rather then the norm.
Originally posted by Anofalye This is why you need intelligent level cap on each zone, so anyone above a precise level is of that level instead. You can give him TRIVIAL edge for each level he have above the limit, but not more, in this zone, nobody can be abobe level X, so be it.
Not only such level cap make it nice for new player, but the uber experienced player, when he is limited in level, might need to work stuff out with new players...add some level range AAs and you have a perfect setting.
I think you are talking about creating area zones in game that would work like the D&D scenarios. This will just cause mini-games within a game. I don't think this is a god solution. I think the best solution is what I call YOH (You're Only Human; of course in a race based system, you might call it something else). The premise is that there's no reason for a new player to start out with 10 HP and an experienced player has 100 HP. An experienced player should have higher skill levels, but why 10 times as much health? In real life, someone could be an experienced martial artist. I'm not, so, he is going to kick my butt. Does it mean he has more health than me? If he got shot in the leg, wouldn't he lose just as much blood as me if I got shot in the leg? So, my premise is that set everybody's base health level the same. The skill levels will still allow experienced players to be able to do things more effictively and faster than a new player, but the experienced players will no longer be a god.
As much as YOH make sense, I saddly have to disagree.
Yes, logic is on your side, I will not argue about that. But peoples love to see CHANGES that matter. On this aspect, if someone have 100 HPS and another have 10 HPS, it dont really mean he can take 10 times the same wounds, it actually reflect his skill to avoid damage in a very simplified, easy to check, way.
This is about making fun, and folks like to see changes. Even if YOH would be meaning the same change, it is not visible, and players does care for visible changes.
Level caps that dont prevent you to do it, but put you of the level limit are a need in such a system for obvious reasons of fun, challenge and not breaking a zone others are hunting.
YOH > Levels where folks get 2000 times more HPS, but even me, will stick to pure raw amount of HPS that change a lot rather then a YOH.
See, when I play EQ, I find nothing more boring then earning stuff that I dont see easily how it help me(most tanking AAs where you mitigated damage and avoid some blows where really ZZZzzz to earn), I need to see, to taste, to know, to feel that it help me and change my life, HPS does that where YOH dont.
Call me superficial, I will nod. But I need to see HUGE changes and understand easily what is a nice upgrade and what is not, and pure raw HPS provide me that! This subject is not new. D&D take the HPS road, Warhammer and Whitewolf took the YOH road. I love all those 3 games, but Whitewolf and Warhammer never come close to how much motivated I was to gain my level in D&D, not even a few miles close. Yet, in a purely soloing game, I think I would support a YOH and skill game more then a level with tons of HPS, but in a group, forget it, I will just fall alseep over those skills.
- "Coercing? No no, I assure you, they are willing to bring my bags and pay public transportation just to help me, it is true!''
I knew there was some reason i liked big increases in hp's.
The problem with the "large amount of HP" system is the downtime. You have to HEAL those hitpints, they reflect that you can dodge more attacks, etc, but they also mean that you have more to heal...
If an Ultimate Fighting Champ, and a nerd both get hurt or sick, it takes the same amount of healing ability to heal them both. But in RPG's, it requires a more powerful healer to heal the champ for no reason whatsoever.
There is no reason that a 10th level character knocked to half his health and a 1st level character knocked to half his health should have to rest different amounts of time.
You cut your finger, I cut my finger. Yours heals in 4 hours, mine heals in 2 days... Whats up with that?!?!
Originally posted by TaskyZZ The problem with the "large amount of HP" system is the downtime. You have to HEAL those hitpints, they reflect that you can dodge more attacks, etc, but they also mean that you have more to heal... If an Ultimate Fighting Champ, and a nerd both get hurt or sick, it takes the same amount of healing ability to heal them both. But in RPG's, it requires a more powerful healer to heal the champ for no reason whatsoever. There is no reason that a 10th level character knocked to half his health and a 1st level character knocked to half his health should have to rest different amounts of time. You cut your finger, I cut my finger. Yours heals in 4 hours, mine heals in 2 days... Whats up with that?!?!
I agree with that, but to sort that out you simply have to heal (while resting) in percentages rather than HP's. That means i may rest 5 mins and gain 1000 HP', while you rest for 5 mins and only gain 100HP's, but this may represent 50% of both of our totals.
Originally posted by TaskyZZ The problem with the "large amount of HP" system is the downtime. You have to HEAL those hitpints, they reflect that you can dodge more attacks, etc, but they also mean that you have more to heal... If an Ultimate Fighting Champ, and a nerd both get hurt or sick, it takes the same amount of healing ability to heal them both. But in RPG's, it requires a more powerful healer to heal the champ for no reason whatsoever. There is no reason that a 10th level character knocked to half his health and a 1st level character knocked to half his health should have to rest different amounts of time. You cut your finger, I cut my finger. Yours heals in 4 hours, mine heals in 2 days... Whats up with that?!?!
Agree.
This is why the healing process need to work in pure amount of HPS during the fight(like now), but in % of you health outside the fights. So while you fight a mob, you dont regen to much if the devs dont want this to break the balance, but outside of the fight, should be in pure % of health instead to cut downtime.
See this as the time you need to restore your fighting edge for the during the fight regen, since you used them. But after, they should come back fast.
During the fight, the need of a more powerfull healer can be reflected in actually be able to figure where the champion is to actually land the heal on him rather then where he was.
Logic is not on my side here, yet, this is what peoples love and those explanations are the best solutions I figure out. If peoples love magics in a MMORPG, we need to put magic even if illogical, same with HPS. Then we elaborate a logic system for it.
But during the downtime, the healing progress of all toon should be in %, not in pure amount. pure amount is for during the fight only.
Anyway, I am against downtime in a game, so between the fights, 1 minute wait should be more then enought. Slow regen for during the fight(and non-stop pulling), very insane regen outside of it. They dont make me roleplay when my toon sleep or go to the bathroom, no need to make me wait either.
The only acceptable downtime are those where I am doing something I care for, waiting on a boat more then once, medding, waiting for a port, waiting for a mob to spawn, those are all unacceptables. But this mean they have content to keep me busy, luckily for them, I have a very incredible XP quirst!
- "Coercing? No no, I assure you, they are willing to bring my bags and pay public transportation just to help me, it is true!''
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
Heres my only problem with MMORPGS: The price. I'm sorry, but you already payed the original price to get the game, but why the hell would you make people pay to play it?! Thats bull crap damnit! BULL CRAP! I mean, I love the social aspects and the fighting and all that fun stuff...But I just hate the fact I have to pay to do that stuff. Not fun >:@
Here we go, the world is spining, when it stops, its just beging, sun comes up, we laugh and cry, so goes down, and we all die...-Samara Morgan "The Ring"
--------------------------------------- People say I'm weird for being a proud Nerd. I say people are weird for being proudly normal. FREAKS!
Originally posted by DeadThorn Heres my only problem with MMORPGS: The price. I'm sorry, but you already payed the original price to get the game, but why the hell would you make people pay to play it?! Thats bull crap damnit! BULL CRAP! I mean, I love the social aspects and the fighting and all that fun stuff...But I just hate the fact I have to pay to do that stuff. Not fun >:@
Here we go, the world is spining, when it stops, its just beging, sun comes up, we laugh and cry, so goes down, and we all die...-Samara Morgan "The Ring"
Your paying the salaries of the hardworking GM's and game designers who constantly update these games.
If you can't shell out at a max 15 bucks a month for the game you shouldn't be buying games at all much less paying for an internet connection. 15 dollars isn't that much, hell even if you live in your parents basement, smoke pot, and are a complete loser you could earn $20 by mowing lawns.
Originally posted by Hnlecter If you can't shell out at a max 15 bucks a month for the game you shouldn't be buying games at all much less paying for an internet connection. 15 dollars isn't that much, hell even if you live in your parents basement, smoke pot, and are a complete loser you could earn $20 by mowing lawns.
Is that a cry for help?...come here lil' buddy, give me a hug. *hugs* ...its gunna be okay, we wont let them hurt you..
If trees could scream, would we be so cavalier about cutting them down? We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason. --Jack Handy
If trees could scream, would we be so cavalier about cutting them down? We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason. --Jack Handy
I can't tell if that is an insult because I think people who bitch about a 10 dollar fee probably aren't allowed to get P4P games because their parents say no. Or they are just really really cheap.
Or is this just some irrelevant comment to earn +1 to your post count?
Comments
Well i do agree with that, for realisms sake. But just for the purely fun aspect of the game its a nice feeling to cut down swathes of enemies rather than just beat one of them, and i dont want to have to run away every time i see 4 or 5 goblins/rats. Bosses are fun, but should be rare rather then the norm.
Muahahahahahahaha
MUAHAHAHAHAHA
I think you are talking about creating area zones in game that would work like the D&D scenarios. This will just cause mini-games within a game. I don't think this is a god solution. I think the best solution is what I call YOH (You're Only Human; of course in a race based system, you might call it something else). The premise is that there's no reason for a new player to start out with 10 HP and an experienced player has 100 HP. An experienced player should have higher skill levels, but why 10 times as much health? In real life, someone could be an experienced martial artist. I'm not, so, he is going to kick my butt. Does it mean he has more health than me? If he got shot in the leg, wouldn't he lose just as much blood as me if I got shot in the leg? So, my premise is that set everybody's base health level the same. The skill levels will still allow experienced players to be able to do things more effictively and faster than a new player, but the experienced players will no longer be a god.
As much as YOH make sense, I saddly have to disagree.
Yes, logic is on your side, I will not argue about that. But peoples love to see CHANGES that matter. On this aspect, if someone have 100 HPS and another have 10 HPS, it dont really mean he can take 10 times the same wounds, it actually reflect his skill to avoid damage in a very simplified, easy to check, way.
This is about making fun, and folks like to see changes. Even if YOH would be meaning the same change, it is not visible, and players does care for visible changes.
Level caps that dont prevent you to do it, but put you of the level limit are a need in such a system for obvious reasons of fun, challenge and not breaking a zone others are hunting.
YOH > Levels where folks get 2000 times more HPS, but even me, will stick to pure raw amount of HPS that change a lot rather then a YOH.
See, when I play EQ, I find nothing more boring then earning stuff that I dont see easily how it help me(most tanking AAs where you mitigated damage and avoid some blows where really ZZZzzz to earn), I need to see, to taste, to know, to feel that it help me and change my life, HPS does that where YOH dont.
Call me superficial, I will nod. But I need to see HUGE changes and understand easily what is a nice upgrade and what is not, and pure raw HPS provide me that! This subject is not new. D&D take the HPS road, Warhammer and Whitewolf took the YOH road. I love all those 3 games, but Whitewolf and Warhammer never come close to how much motivated I was to gain my level in D&D, not even a few miles close. Yet, in a purely soloing game, I think I would support a YOH and skill game more then a level with tons of HPS, but in a group, forget it, I will just fall alseep over those skills.
- "Coercing? No no, I assure you, they are willing to bring my bags and pay public transportation just to help me, it is true!''
I knew there was some reason i liked big increases in hp's.
BRAVO you
Muahahahahahahaha
MUAHAHAHAHAHA
The problem with the "large amount of HP" system is the downtime. You have to HEAL those hitpints, they reflect that you can dodge more attacks, etc, but they also mean that you have more to heal...
If an Ultimate Fighting Champ, and a nerd both get hurt or sick, it takes the same amount of healing ability to heal them both. But in RPG's, it requires a more powerful healer to heal the champ for no reason whatsoever.
There is no reason that a 10th level character knocked to half his health and a 1st level character knocked to half his health should have to rest different amounts of time.
You cut your finger, I cut my finger. Yours heals in 4 hours, mine heals in 2 days... Whats up with that?!?!
Muahahahahahahaha
MUAHAHAHAHAHA
Agree.
This is why the healing process need to work in pure amount of HPS during the fight(like now), but in % of you health outside the fights. So while you fight a mob, you dont regen to much if the devs dont want this to break the balance, but outside of the fight, should be in pure % of health instead to cut downtime.
See this as the time you need to restore your fighting edge for the during the fight regen, since you used them. But after, they should come back fast.
During the fight, the need of a more powerfull healer can be reflected in actually be able to figure where the champion is to actually land the heal on him rather then where he was.
Logic is not on my side here, yet, this is what peoples love and those explanations are the best solutions I figure out.
If peoples love magics in a MMORPG, we need to put magic even if illogical, same with HPS. 
Then we elaborate a logic system for it. 
But during the downtime, the healing progress of all toon should be in %, not in pure amount. pure amount is for during the fight only.
Anyway, I am against downtime in a game, so between the fights, 1 minute wait should be more then enought. Slow regen for during the fight(and non-stop pulling), very insane regen outside of it.
They dont make me roleplay when my toon sleep or go to the bathroom, no need to make me wait either.
The only acceptable downtime are those where I am doing something I care for, waiting on a boat more then once, medding, waiting for a port, waiting for a mob to spawn, those are all unacceptables. But this mean they have content to keep me busy, luckily for them, I have a very incredible XP quirst!
- "Coercing? No no, I assure you, they are willing to bring my bags and pay public transportation just to help me, it is true!''
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
Here we go, the world is spining, when it stops, its just beging, sun comes up, we laugh and cry, so goes down, and we all die...-Samara Morgan "The Ring"
---------------------------------------
People say I'm weird for being a proud Nerd. I say people are weird for being proudly normal. FREAKS!
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Give me your lunch money.
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
If trees could scream, would we be so cavalier about cutting them down? We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason.
--Jack Handy
If trees could scream, would we be so cavalier about cutting them down? We might, if they screamed all the time, for no good reason.
--Jack Handy
I can't tell if that is an insult because I think people who bitch about a 10 dollar fee probably aren't allowed to get P4P games because their parents say no. Or they are just really really cheap.
Or is this just some irrelevant comment to earn +1 to your post count?
Please explain if you do I will offer man sex.