Originally posted by WARCRYtm PS. Lineage 1 didnt died with L2
Isn't it strange the number 2's in games never do as well? You would think game companies would learn by now..
AC and AC2 (AC2 closed)
EQ and EQII (EQ still has more subs then EQII)
And even when you look at L1 and L2, L2 never hit the same numbers as L1 although L2 did do very well comparitively. It did far far better then any other sequel. But yes the life cycle of the MMO clearly shows that the games have a very clear lifecycle. They are 99% predicable the only variable is the length of time which is only effected by the overall quality. The absolute consistant factor in all games lifecycles is the launch. A poorly launched game NEVER recovers.
Still the industry marches on......
Holy Grails and marching morons.....
where do we fit in? We the players seek the grail and we all (industry and community) march on
Yes, people have to realize that L2 is NOT dying, and neither did L1. These games are ageing very well. They are old MMOs, and old games will slowly loose population when new generation games come out.
WoW revoloutionized the MMO industry. It made MMO games less grindy basically. Plus not to mention the Warcraft fans (numbering over 6 million) would want to play WoW, so Blizzard was already building upon it's devoted player base.
Yes, L2 will loose subs...but before the game is declaired "dead" I guarentee Lineage III will be out. And if NCsoft starts kicking ass with L2 and marketing it, like they are slowly doing, then I doubt the game will die anytime soon, if anything it will grow. The graphics of L2 are stunning. It's Lore (which isn't implemented in the game, yet anyway) is awesome. I think you get my point.
But people gotta stop thinking that a 3 year old game is dying because it lost less than 1/3 of it's subs in the world when a revolutionary game was released.
Originally posted by WARCRYtm Gameloading, i remember to see you here saing the same thing about Arshlord(it will destroy Lineage...) look at it now. WoW came out and every game in US became copy paste of WoW, but none can take his place, they all try to be similar to WoW, to have a similar sucess. The same hapends to L2 on korea. Lineage(s) are losing subs becase Lineage saga is geting old(Lineage1 have 7-8 years), there are few people there that didnt tried one of thous games, and got bored after a long time playng them. Is normal. No game lasts forever, we get tired to do the samme things all over the years. Lineage 3 is the game koreans are w8ing for. PS. Lineage 1 didnt died with L2
and ArchLord WAS well on its way to defeat the success of Lineage 1 and Lineage 2. the game raised to 800k subscribers in the first few months in korea. but then something happened that shouldn't have happened. NHN's showed that they had zero customer support. bugs didn't get fixed, Customers weren't treated right. ArchLords subscriber base collapsed soon. Unlike the west, there are hundreds of MMO's in korea. gamers aren't going to wait untill the company gets it act together. they leave. ArchLord failed because of the customer support, and was forced to close down a lot of servers and move to a cash shop payment system.
Lineage 3 isn't that awaited in Korea. The game is a good 3 years off. there are many other games comming out in those 3 years.
Originally posted by Leasa Originally posted by BumLife It is SO war-like that people will do ANYTHING to get their hands on adena, lvled characters which equals === BOTS+++ (people do whatever it takes in war). IF the game sucked and there wasn't as much demand, why would there be so many BOTS????? why would farmers even bot in the world of L2? DEMAND+++
So the end justifys the means ??
Sorry but the game "SUCKS" because of all the bots and cheaters.
You brag about a commuity that is full of people who cheat ???
just like the real world...
I've been playing since closed-beta... getting close to 3 years now... and have never boughten adena, nor botted. It's definitely a rough game to play, but has been made easier from chronicle to chronicle. I'm now on my sub, and have a lvl 77 main. It's a game that if you are willing to dedicate to, it'll keep you hooked. There are so many things I still want to accomplish in this game.. and now with the prospects of Territory Wars in the next release update (Interlude: The Chaotic Throne)... it's only going to even get better.... already looking forward to 2007 for that update....
I have played since open beta as /gasps a bishop... I have tried to quit but there are just so many thing in L2 that appeal. The community is awesome farmers, botters, and all. I used to think that NcSoft never cared about the community... then i tried playing other games. I suffered through long waits for patches that did nothing to improve the game or changed the game so drastically that everyone quit /sigh swg... Lineage has been like clockwork... routinely updating giving certain classes a time to be the elite. While I have manage to stay out of some of the combat nerfs as I am a healer everyone else I play with obviously isn't. They have bitched and moaned about how the changes have nerfed their characters but then they start a whole new quest... To find that one item that one thing (skill attributes armor etc) that will put them back on top.
the simple fact of the matter is Lineage is for the hardcore. If you not hardcore about it you wont be happy with it. Its a game where the pve and grind is tough and the pvp is tougher. A game that you can immerse yourself in the content or play to fight. If you don't like farmers you can kill them, if they help you pay for your gear you can love them. It still amazes me that every day i run into new people in the game that are as high a level as me... that doesn't happen much in most games... the community base just isn't that large.
While there are lots of things that could be changed upon and improved, once you have played L2 really played it and enjoyed it and experience the thrills that are there and loved them, you don't for get it. You can walk away but every game after has to stand up to the pve and the pvp of L2 and frankly at the moment there isn't any thing out there that can compare.... At least for me and trust me I have looked as the grind became to much for me at one point... but I am back and i love it all the more....
As for people who think that botting is not punished.... every day ever night more and more are banned... How can you yell at ncsoft about the fact that so many in the community are so hard core that they just get more and more accounts and start the botting all over again?
It isn't everyone that bots and hell the game isn't for everyone either, but in the true since of the community if you don't like it kill it and if you can't hack and wanna cry about it just go away we don't someone to reform us we like us the way we are so F U
Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by WARCRYtm Gameloading, i remember to see you here saing the same thing about Arshlord(it will destroy Lineage...) look at it now. WoW came out and every game in US became copy paste of WoW, but none can take his place, they all try to be similar to WoW, to have a similar sucess. The same hapends to L2 on korea. Lineage(s) are losing subs becase Lineage saga is geting old(Lineage1 have 7-8 years), there are few people there that didnt tried one of thous games, and got bored after a long time playng them. Is normal. No game lasts forever, we get tired to do the samme things all over the years. Lineage 3 is the game koreans are w8ing for. PS. Lineage 1 didnt died with L2
and ArchLord WAS well on its way to defeat the success of Lineage 1 and Lineage 2. the game raised to 800k subscribers in the first few months in korea. but then something happened that shouldn't have happened. NHN's showed that they had zero customer support. bugs didn't get fixed, Customers weren't treated right. ArchLords subscriber base collapsed soon. Unlike the west, there are hundreds of MMO's in korea. gamers aren't going to wait untill the company gets it act together. they leave. ArchLord failed because of the customer support, and was forced to close down a lot of servers and move to a cash shop payment system.
Lineage 3 isn't that awaited in Korea. The game is a good 3 years off. there are many other games comming out in those 3 years. Archlord is dieing because it's just a poorly rendered L2 clone. The game doesn't have a single feature that isn't already in L2 and the graphics are way inferior to L2 even though L2 is over 4 years old now(yes thats right, since closed beta has been over 4 years ). Archlord tried to hitch a free ride on the L2 band wagon and fell off. This is happening to all the WoW clones as well. This just goes to show you that no matter how good a game is(L2 and WoW are both awesome games) people will not put up with Developers just throwing the same old things at them. This is just my opinion though.
I've also been playing L2 since open beta . . sort of. I quit for a while, but couldn't find anything better and came back to stay.
A few comments.
Beginning playing in Lineage 2 is not that tough right now. In fact is is downright easy. First of all, with the "Academy" you can actually get into an established clan. This clan will likely have the adena (in-game money) to help you out tremendously. There are also lowbie buffs until you reach level 20. You can exchange weapons with NPC's, use the manor system, and even get a pretty good Oath Armor set after level 20 by doing a ten minute quest. None of this was available to the people who started this game in open beta or early in retail. Simply put, you can easily get to level 40 in two weeks . . where us old-timers might have struggled for several months to get to level 40. Also, with the aforementioned manor system and other additions, adena isn't nearly as difficult to come by.
Yes, there are a lot of cheaters in the game. Many people buy accounts, or buy adena so they can level faster and have the most cherished gear. Yes, there are bots everywhere. But to be honest, I see bots and cheaters in nearly every game I have tried.
The community is very fun. To me, it is the best part of the game. Sometimes it is also the worst part of the game, too. It just depends on who you hang out with and who you have confrontations with.
Originally posted by Kelsonmac I've also been playing L2 since open beta . . sort of. I quit for a while, but couldn't find anything better and came back to stay.
A few comments.
Beginning playing in Lineage 2 is not that tough right now. In fact is is downright easy. First of all, with the "Academy" you can actually get into an established clan. This clan will likely have the adena (in-game money) to help you out tremendously. There are also lowbie buffs until you reach level 20. You can exchange weapons with NPC's, use the manor system, and even get a pretty good Oath Armor set after level 20 by doing a ten minute quest. None of this was available to the people who started this game in open beta or early in retail. Simply put, you can easily get to level 40 in two weeks . . where us old-timers might have struggled for several months to get to level 40. Also, with the aforementioned manor system and other additions, adena isn't nearly as difficult to come by.
Ive only been playing a little over a year and I'm a vet of a few titles as well. Yes L2 has seen some changes but honestly its t little to late. The ideas L2 was built on (the old EQ grind is good) doesn't exist anymore in the MMO market. Its still to hard of a grind and thats why this game will never have mass appeal. Yes levels 1-40 are manageable now but levels 41-78 are not.
Yes, there are a lot of cheaters in the game. Many people buy accounts, or buy adena so they can level faster and have the most cherished gear. Yes, there are bots everywhere. But to be honest, I see bots and cheaters in nearly every game I have tried.
I use to downplay the it like that also. True WoW has 100s of times more farmers and more WoW player buy currency in a day then L2 has subscribers but there is a huge difference in the two games in how its done. I'm not tripping over bots in WoW. Last night my group couldn't get a room for a long while in the catacombs. What the F*ck is that? We report the same people days ago and nothing happens. They are in HUGE groups of 7+ so training isn't an option because of one of two things
they auto log if to much agro is detected they can beat the train L2's bot problem is much much worse then in any other game because the users have NO FEAR of being caught. What kind of game allows more bots running around then actual players in a location???? A poorly administered one. If it was truely any easier the problem overall would not be as bad as it is. Adena is much easier to make now BUT you still need to get into the market. Most players don't want to put up with that hassle. If you don't do the market however, you don't make any money in L2. Players want to be able to make enough by simply playing (ie hunting/grinding) By forcing you into an addition timesink on top of the hidious grind, everyone does one of 3 things
says "f*ck it" and quits says "f*ck it" and buys adena and a few actually put up with it as designed The community is very fun. To me, it is the best part of the game. Sometimes it is also the worst part of the game, too. It just depends on who you hang out with and who you have confrontations with. Agree, the community is the best aspect of the game. I haven't had a good community experience like I have in L2 in any other game. In almost every other MMO, especial games like WoW and EQII guilds are little more then chat common channels. Not in L2, guilds have purpose. But thats another subject altogether. But what now? With item drop gone, will the community keep resisting the bots? I don't think so. You can already see it. No one is training anymore. Why? because theres nothing in it for them. Even I don't want to take my valuable time to go f*ck it bots for 20 minutes or an hour when there is no prospect of getting something out of it. The bots can now wander around in areas of agro mobs and not draw the agro. If you go to them YOU pick up the agro but they are not detected by the mobs. They can auto log if they detect to much agro heading toward them. The cheaters have to many weapons against us and NCSoft does NOTHING. The damage done to this game by NCSoft's lack of action is to late to repair. L2 hit its peak about 6 months back and its probably stable now. Next in the MMO lifespan is the decline. No matter what NCSoft does for L2 now, it will never ever change the 2 most common preceptions the non-players have of the game.
its grind and the cheats. Go ask on the general forum what non-players think of the game. Go to any forum and ask that.
Originally posted by Kelsonmac I've also been playing L2 since open beta . . sort of. I quit for a while, but couldn't find anything better and came back to stay.
A few comments.
Beginning playing in Lineage 2 is not that tough right now. In fact is is downright easy. First of all, with the "Academy" you can actually get into an established clan. This clan will likely have the adena (in-game money) to help you out tremendously. There are also lowbie buffs until you reach level 20. You can exchange weapons with NPC's, use the manor system, and even get a pretty good Oath Armor set after level 20 by doing a ten minute quest. None of this was available to the people who started this game in open beta or early in retail. Simply put, you can easily get to level 40 in two weeks . . where us old-timers might have struggled for several months to get to level 40. Also, with the aforementioned manor system and other additions, adena isn't nearly as difficult to come by.
Ive only been playing a little over a year and I'm a vet of a few titles as well. Yes L2 has seen some changes but honestly its t little to late. The ideas L2 was built on (the old EQ grind is good) doesn't exist anymore in the MMO market. Its still to hard of a grind and thats why this game will never have mass appeal. Yes levels 1-40 are manageable now but levels 41-78 are not.
Yes, there are a lot of cheaters in the game. Many people buy accounts, or buy adena so they can level faster and have the most cherished gear. Yes, there are bots everywhere. But to be honest, I see bots and cheaters in nearly every game I have tried.
I use to downplay the it like that also. True WoW has 100s of times more farmers and more WoW player buy currency in a day then L2 has subscribers but there is a huge difference in the two games in how its done. I'm not tripping over bots in WoW. Last night my group couldn't get a room for a long while in the catacombs. What the F*ck is that? We report the same people days ago and nothing happens. They are in HUGE groups of 7+ so training isn't an option because of one of two things
they auto log if to much agro is detected
they can beat the train
L2's bot problem is much much worse then in any other game because the users have NO FEAR of being caught. What kind of game allows more bots running around then actual players in a location???? A poorly administered one.
I guess you haven't been privy to the friday bans? LoL It seems almost every friday there is a mass sweep on Kain. I know several players and hell even guild that have been wiped of the face of the map in L2... We are talking 50+ players in a single banning session. And we are talking no petioning the person first, no get out of jail free just banned... POP gone
If it was truely any easier the problem overall would not be as bad as it is.
Adena is much easier to make now BUT you still need to get into the market. Most players don't want to put up with that hassle. If you don't do the market however, you don't make any money in L2. Players want to be able to make enough by simply playing (ie hunting/grinding) By forcing you into an addition timesink on top of the hidious grind, everyone does one of 3 things
says "f*ck it" and quits
says "f*ck it" and buys adena
and a few actually put up with it as designed
I will agree with you here but if you work in a efficient guild there are hundreds of ways of making money... The number one way is raid bosses. Hitting them as often as possible even if that means you call a raid night in which you wait for the spawn and kill off all the farmers so that you can get the spawn of the raid boss to be during your peak hours. One weapon, s-grade armor piece and you get a few hundred crystals to sell in a hungry market. The rift is also a good place to lvl up the soul crystals if you have the lvls to compete in the hero section... No pvp, no fighting just pure grind for one group all the way through the rifts with the hopes of hitting the raid boss (one night alone we hit the raid boss in the rift 5 times... one night 0) *shrugs*... as for making adena its really quite simple. Get one dwarf to 40 to craft c grade shots and in a matter of weeks you can take 5 million adena and make it into 40, 50, 60 million adena. So all those who don't want to try that route.. don't raid... don't go looking for those items that are underpriced for crystal value then i don't feel sorry for you... I just don't.
The community is very fun. To me, it is the best part of the game. Sometimes it is also the worst part of the game, too. It just depends on who you hang out with and who you have confrontations with.
Agree, the community is the best aspect of the game. I haven't had a good community experience like I have in L2 in any other game. In almost every other MMO, especial games like WoW and EQII guilds are little more then chat common channels. Not in L2, guilds have purpose. But thats another subject altogether.
But what now? With item drop gone, will the community keep resisting the bots? I don't think so. You can already see it. No one is training anymore. Why? because theres nothing in it for them. Even I don't want to take my valuable time to go f*ck it bots for 20 minutes or an hour when there is no prospect of getting something out of it.
I really respect your posts Torak but you obviously haven't had the privalage of deleveling someone over and over again.... Take two people to the cat.. take out the healer and pull some mobs... wait for them to log or hunt on the parties dead bodies not allowing the main dd or tank to get the rest of them up. Hell on Kain you can tell the farmers if they no want to die then they very let you xp in this room now. You dlvl some of them enough and it starts hurting their ability to stay where they are. Sure theres no drops, sure they don't care about xp, but its an option and a fun one at that.
The bots can now wander around in areas of agro mobs and not draw the agro. If you go to them YOU pick up the agro but they are not detected by the mobs. They can auto log if they detect to much agro heading toward them.
I am not really sure what this means.... do they have a Bd with silent step dance? I mean how is it possible they are walking through agro mobs and not getting agro? I mean there are ways to sneak through areas and not get within agro range and appear to be in the middle of mobs if someone is looking from the outside but thats just good stratagie.... (my ubar bishop skills have given me the ability to do that lol its call staying alive to get to my party and yeah its an active skill *grin*)
But have you ever thought of using fraps and posting it on the main forums?
The cheaters have to many weapons against us and NCSoft does NOTHING.
The damage done to this game by NCSoft's lack of action is to late to repair. L2 hit its peak about 6 months back and its probably stable now. Next in the MMO lifespan is the decline. No matter what NCSoft does for L2 now, it will never ever change the 2 most common preceptions the non-players have of the game.
its grind
and the cheats.
Go ask on the general forum what non-players think of the game. Go to any forum and ask that.
As for what the non-players of L2 think about the game... *shrugs* I am not sure i really care. If they haven't spent over 6 months in game time then they have not spent enough time with L2 to form an oppinion... No offense to any one but thats just what I feel... Hell almost every L2er hates WoW and vice versa but not to many L2ers have spent time in WoW and vise versa to form a good oppinion of the other game. I tried WoW for a month.. and got tired of having to request that people dual me so that they would stop taking my hunting spot. It wasn't that i didn't necessarly like the mechanics of the game but i live on pvp its the ultimate hi and sweet talking someone to leave somewhere when i was there first isn't an option I am the shoot first then ask questions kinda girl (blood thirsty and aggressive who me?)
The only thing i would honestly change in L2 is that the areas in town aren't safe. The only areas where you can't kill should be in the guild halls,. or even castles... I know I know what about all those solo people who don't like to be in clans or all those clans that can't afford one of the before mentioned safe spots? well simple you find somewhere on the map and make it yours.. (ok maybe not so simple and maybe not the best idea but gosh darn it i HATE gate fighting with a passion and i hate not being able to kill people who are scamming in shop mode... >.<)
Needless to say I like my L2.. I don't like everything that happens in the game but hey i don't like everything that happens in Real Life either. I choose to pay for L2 as it is because i have yet to find a game to stand up to it. I take it for it good sides that i truely feel out weigh the bad. I work around the things I don't like or just find ways to make me feel better around them (like deleving an enmies guilds accadamy person ^_^) While I think NcSoft could make some improvements I honestly feel that the communitee has really make the game what it is, finding ways to get around game guard and cheating and hacking, not the Developers... Yes they can make changes to make it harder but a 1,000 people working against game guard are going to have better results than 10 who are working for it. I think they try but *shrugs*
I guess you haven't been privy to the friday bans? LoL It seems almost every friday there is a mass sweep on Kain. I know several players and hell even guild that have been wiped of the face of the map in L2... We are talking 50+ players in a single banning session. And we are talking no petioning the person first, no get out of jail free just banned... POP gon Never witnessed or heard of a "friday night ban" in fact weekends, its usually much worse. I will agree with you here but if you work in a efficient guild there are hundreds of ways of making money... The number one way is raid bosses. Hitting them as often as possible even if that means you call a raid night in which you wait for the spawn and kill off all the farmers so that you can get the spawn of the raid boss to be during your peak hours. One weapon, s-grade armor piece and you get a few hundred crystals to sell in a hungry market. The rift is also a good place to lvl up the soul crystals if you have the lvls to compete in the hero section... No pvp, no fighting just pure grind for one group all the way through the rifts with the hopes of hitting the raid boss (one night alone we hit the raid boss in the rift 5 times... one night 0) *shrugs*... as for making adena its really quite simple. Get one dwarf to 40 to craft c grade shots and in a matter of weeks you can take 5 million adena and make it into 40, 50, 60 million adena. So all those who don't want to try that route.. don't raid... don't go looking for those items that are underpriced for crystal value then i don't feel sorry for you... I just don't.
Currency buying is a problem in every game unfortunatly. The mechanics in L2 allow you easily avoid most of what you are refering to. The "seven Signs" eliminates almost any need to buy weapon at all. Yeah you need to live in the asorted catacombs but its free. /shrug, people are idiots lol, whatcha gonna do? I made 2 million last night just cleaning out my vault. Selling Soul Shot works great IF you have access to crystals. If you read my money guild you would see my point there. (I will add more later) If you crystalze drops its basically free. You can make a killing on DSS very early on. If you get a decent drop. You gotta level anyway, use the drops. I really wonder about people who sit in Dion and try to sell that low/mid grade piece of junk they got off a mob at a premium price. Sorry, not gonna happen. Crystalize it and do something with the crystals. You loose nothing because no one is going to buy that piece of lower junk anyway at full price. Looks like only a few people like me and you use their heads. I really respect your posts Torak but you obviously haven't had the privalage of deleveling someone over and over again.... Take two people to the cat.. take out the healer and pull some mobs... wait for them to log or hunt on the parties dead bodies not allowing the main dd or tank to get the rest of them up. Hell on Kain you can tell the farmers if they no want to die then they very let you xp in this room now. You dlvl some of them enough and it starts hurting their ability to stay where they are. Sure theres no drops, sure they don't care about xp, but its an option and a fun one at that.
LoL, first, thanks, secondly generally speaking I'm pretty happy with just getting rid of a bot team and leave it at that. My point was this.. Why do I need to take an hour or more of my time to do the job of a GM and get rid of bots? Bots are NCSofts problem not mine. The very fact I even see or know they are there in the numbers they are is a major problem that NCSoft needs to address. I'm tire of taking hours and hours of MY play time training and harrassing them. They shouldn't be there to begin with. I've made my share of money off of them, but the fact of the matter is this alone is what will always keep L2 a second rate game. Now that there is no item drop, you can see a proportionate amount of people just not doing anything about it. NCSoft handed the game to the bots in that respect. Taking item drop out was a mistake IMHO. But have you ever thought of using fraps and posting it on the main forums? Yes, I was banned from the forum for making a single post about the bots. Look a few pages back here and you will see where my head exploded with franz. So....f**k'em.
Well I played lineage 2 for a year and i grew to hate that game. I started playing in open bata. The bots. the item drops on death, the open pvp in which people would kill you just to steal your armor and weapons when they droped so that they could sell to make money to sell on ebay, the grieffers, the out of controle market where you had to buy adeana wfith real life money to up grade your armor if you didnt want to farm low lvl mobs for a month. The ksing, the haveing to spend all of the money you made from lvling to buy soul shots to lvl your charaacter, the pvp system. i can go on and on. And believe me i was in many clans. The comunity is not that good. If you didnt like to pvp they would kick you out of there clan becouse they wonted some one who would show up for castle sieges. As far as soloing goes, forget it, if you solo in l2 you are open game for some ganker or grieffer. I switched to wow and love it.They have taken care of all of the above issues. Wow also has what would be considered blue servers or pve servers where people can choose if they want to pvp or not. Its not forced on them and you dont have to be ganked by some high lvl character who just wants your armor, Something that lineage 2 hasent got the brains to do in north america. l2 may have a lot of asian coustemers but they dont have that many in north america and eruop compaired to other mmorpgs like wow or eq or eq2. Why? becouse of the affore mintioned probulems and becouse they dont have blue servers. If they would fix those it would become a much better game and could be a serious contender in this country but apperantly l2 dosent care about market share or makeing a lot of money in this country and in Europ lol. When i quit back over a year ago, there was an artical in gammer mag which said l2 only had 64000 paying coustemers in north america and i deffently can understand why lol i forget which month, how depressing and l2 had such potentel. Of corse they may have more people now but i dont believe they have many more becouse they havent added any new north american servers sence i quit and only have 10 servers to service north america and europ in which they just added a new europen server. If l2 was such a great game they would have as many servers as wow over one huntred and thirty to service north america alone rofl. Dont believe every thing you reed in this websight go to ige.com where they sell money for games and look at the servers for your self. The amount of servers tells the true story rofl.
Well as of recently there is no item drop on death unless you are red but you exaggerate it a little bit. Dunno maybe in beta it was a higher drop rate.
If you couldn't make money in L2..........How could you not is really the question..... Look at my money guild. If you spent all your cash on SS thats your fault for not leveling up a Dwarf. Weapon trade up for Ancient Adena, weapons are basically free. L2 has the easiest economy if you put your time in.
And guilds kicking you out for not showing up to sieges........well..........duh its the whole point of the game. I'd kick you out to for not showing up to a siege, you are useless to the guild.
Sounds like you didn't like the game from the start. PvE sounds more your bag.
Your complaints are long gone.
Critizing a game is fine but at least make sure you are on the current version not the one from two years ago.
Ha ha ha uh i had all most a 50% item drop rate, and thats no exaggeration, all most every other time i died i droped items. My rl wife hunted with me so she would pick them up and save them for me, this all the time having no karma. I never had karma the entire time i played. I would also do the same for her. As far as spinding all of the money on ss yes i did becoue the people in my guild or clan would complane all the time that i wasent doing any damage if i didnt , so yes i used them or the clannys wouldnt group with us. As far as makeing money I stand by what i said, the drops i got from mobs in which i would sell to players for the going rate didnt cover much more than the price of the ss. And i dont like the idea of haveing to set up a dwarf character to play that i dont really want, or dont really like to play, just to make money for me to be able play the ones i did like.That is a total wast of time and money, my money in which i pay monthly to play the game. I think most people would agree with me on that one. As far as ancent adeana that must have came in after i quit i dont really remember it. but its been a while sence i played. But if i did get some i would have desposed of it in the most profitable way. As far as .....duh...... pvp no i dont like pvp and i know thousands of people who dont, they play on the pve servers in wow or eq or eq2 ect ect in which btw each one of those games has more people in north america and eurojp playing then does l2. As far as me being usless to a guild i think you got that backwards. The guilds were usless to me. I dont belong to them i belong to me, this is america after all, you know the land of the free. If a guld wont let you play the way you want to play what good are they. Besides im the one paying to play the game, the guilds didnt pay my monthly fees there for they have no right to tell me how to play. If i dont want to go to a castle siege im not going period i dont care if they dont like it either. So much said for the community lol You are right about one thing though i didnt like the game from the start and was much happer when i found wow and eq2 in which both are much better games. I stuck with l2 for so long in hopes that the devs would be smart enough to put up blue servers but allass, they werent. Thats why the game has done so poorly in the free world compaired to the other mmorpgs lol. I mean geeze look at all of the rpgs out there the ones who do the best in the free world and make the most money and are the most profitable and the most popular are the ones with blue servers or pve servers peorid. That should tell the devs something. When i moved to wow i set up a hord guild on a pve server and ran it the way i tought it should be ran, we became the biggest hord guiild on the server while i was the guild master so you cant tell me any thing about guilds either dude. Maby the game has greatly improved sence i left. Ive been playing wow for 2 years now ,i dont really know. All i know is how l2 was when i played it, and it was how i described. Still the improvements are not enough for me to consider ever going back and finishing that game unless they put up blue servers stop the ksing and stop the item loss on death and controle the market. My shellen knight and shellin elder are both 56 thats where i stoped lol the lvl cap was 60 at that time and silver rangers had just got nerfed so i quit playing my silver ranger at lvl 40
Lineage 2 is not a casual game . . . and that is what makes it so appealing to me.
Sure, you can grind your way up to 50 rather easily in Lineage 2 . . .then the game requires some dedication if you're going to advance further. I don't feel sorry for the lazy idiots who grind a character up to 40, then create a new character and grind it up to 40 . . rinse/repeat . . . then they proclaim that the game sucks. It's not my problem that they put themselves in that position.
If you want to really enjoy the high-level aspect of the game, then you have to become high level. I don't want to play a game that casual players have the same advancement rate as really hardcore players. Still, even if you start now, you will be able to get to a high level faster than any of the veteran players could.
Bots are rampant in Lineage 2. So what? If they are in a room I want, I just take it from them. No need to kill them. No need to train them. Just bring your clan down to the room and kill everything in sight before the bots can get to it. Generally, bots have one person watching the monitor. When they see that they are not getting any kills . . . they move every single time.
Lineage 2, like any other game, is what you make of it. A little dedication goes a long way. It is NOT difficult to level up to 75+, especially if you have a good clan. If you're stuck at 50, get bored and feel like you need to re-roll, you simply need to change who you are clanned with.
It's hard enough to get clan members to help brez you when you die, good luck getting a clan to come down to free up an area for you so you can level. Most people in clans are off by themselves with their 2-3-4 boxes grinding out.
Also, the difficulty of the game is not getting to 75, it's getting to 75 while managing real life and hopefully not ebaying your gear. That's difficult. But if you're going to ebay your gear, then hitting 75 is just a matter of time. If you're going to play the market, the other forgotten or bypassed part of the game, then it will be difficult. The game takes a lot of time.
Cryomatrix
Catch me streaming at twitch.tv/cryomatrix You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
Thats what makes the game good in my opinion...and thats why i truely recommend new mmo/rpg' ers to try this. if you reach the max lvl easily, it wont be fun , what i saw with WoW. And damn its so true that it is hard to manage ur social life while working hard to reach high lvls. Still this game stays on top of what i tried untill now.Dont watch my xfire profile now and say that i havnt tried much, thats because its created in end may this year.:)
Sure, you can grind your way up to 50 rather easily in Lineage 2 . . .then the game requires some dedication if you're going to advance further. I don't feel sorry for the lazy idiotswho grind a character up to 40, then create a new character and grind it up to 40 . . rinse/repeat . . . then they proclaim that the game sucks. It's not my problem that they put themselves in that position.
Originally posted by loopylizard Sure, you can grind your way up to 50 rather easily in Lineage 2 . . .then the game requires some dedication if you're going to advance further. I don't feel sorry for the lazy idiotswho grind a character up to 40, then create a new character and grind it up to 40 . . rinse/repeat . . . then they proclaim that the game sucks. It's not my problem that they put themselves in that position.
You should just write a huge guide and have them sticky it. This is where you go over all the points that you keep having to go over. Remember when I pmed you my nooblet questions, you could make a beginner's guide to L2 post, have it stickied, and you'd be immortalized in these chats.
You give fair representation of a game that you love so much. Most people are biased, but you give it as you see it.
Cryomatrix
Catch me streaming at twitch.tv/cryomatrix You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
Comments
Isn't it strange the number 2's in games never do as well? You would think game companies would learn by now..
AC and AC2 (AC2 closed)
EQ and EQII (EQ still has more subs then EQII)
And even when you look at L1 and L2, L2 never hit the same numbers as L1 although L2 did do very well comparitively. It did far far better then any other sequel. But yes the life cycle of the MMO clearly shows that the games have a very clear lifecycle. They are 99% predicable the only variable is the length of time which is only effected by the overall quality. The absolute consistant factor in all games lifecycles is the launch. A poorly launched game NEVER recovers.
Still the industry marches on......
Holy Grails and marching morons.....
where do we fit in? We the players seek the grail and we all (industry and community) march on
WoW revoloutionized the MMO industry. It made MMO games less grindy basically. Plus not to mention the Warcraft fans (numbering over 6 million) would want to play WoW, so Blizzard was already building upon it's devoted player base.
Yes, L2 will loose subs...but before the game is declaired "dead" I guarentee Lineage III will be out. And if NCsoft starts kicking ass with L2 and marketing it, like they are slowly doing, then I doubt the game will die anytime soon, if anything it will grow. The graphics of L2 are stunning. It's Lore (which isn't implemented in the game, yet anyway) is awesome. I think you get my point.
But people gotta stop thinking that a 3 year old game is dying because it lost less than 1/3 of it's subs in the world when a revolutionary game was released.
ArchLord WAS well on its way to defeat the success of Lineage 1 and
Lineage 2. the game raised to 800k subscribers in the first few months
in korea. but then something happened that shouldn't have happened.
NHN's showed that they had zero customer support. bugs didn't get
fixed, Customers weren't treated right. ArchLords subscriber base
collapsed soon. Unlike the west, there are hundreds of MMO's in korea.
gamers aren't going to wait untill the company gets it act together.
they leave. ArchLord failed because of the customer support, and was
forced to close down a lot of servers and move to a cash shop payment
system.
Lineage 3 isn't that awaited in Korea. The game is a good 3 years off. there are many other games comming out in those 3 years.
So the end justifys the means ??
Sorry but the game "SUCKS" because of all the bots and cheaters.
You brag about a commuity that is full of people who cheat ???
just like the real world...
I've been playing since closed-beta... getting close to 3 years now... and have never boughten adena, nor botted. It's definitely a rough game to play, but has been made easier from chronicle to chronicle. I'm now on my sub, and have a lvl 77 main. It's a game that if you are willing to dedicate to, it'll keep you hooked. There are so many things I still want to accomplish in this game.. and now with the prospects of Territory Wars in the next release update (Interlude: The Chaotic Throne)... it's only going to even get better.... already looking forward to 2007 for that update....
new cg clip http://files.filefront.com/L2_CG_downzip/;6007522;;/fileinfo.html
L2_CG
So the end justifys the means ??
Sorry but the game "SUCKS" because of all the bots and cheaters.
You brag about a commuity that is full of people who cheat ???
LoL, try to stay on topic, we are not talking about WoW
the simple fact of the matter is Lineage is for the hardcore. If you not hardcore about it you wont be happy with it. Its a game where the pve and grind is tough and the pvp is tougher. A game that you can immerse yourself in the content or play to fight. If you don't like farmers you can kill them, if they help you pay for your gear you can love them. It still amazes me that every day i run into new people in the game that are as high a level as me... that doesn't happen much in most games... the community base just isn't that large.
While there are lots of things that could be changed upon and improved, once you have played L2 really played it and enjoyed it and experience the thrills that are there and loved them, you don't for get it. You can walk away but every game after has to stand up to the pve and the pvp of L2 and frankly at the moment there isn't any thing out there that can compare.... At least for me and trust me I have looked as the grind became to much for me at one point... but I am back and i love it all the more....
As for people who think that botting is not punished.... every day ever night more and more are banned... How can you yell at ncsoft about the fact that so many in the community are so hard core that they just get more and more accounts and start the botting all over again?
It isn't everyone that bots and hell the game isn't for everyone either, but in the true since of the community if you don't like it kill it and if you can't hack and wanna cry about it just go away we don't someone to reform us we like us the way we are so F U
^_^
Lineage 3 isn't that awaited in Korea. The game is a good 3 years off. there are many other games comming out in those 3 years.
Archlord is dieing because it's just a poorly rendered L2 clone. The game doesn't have a single feature that isn't already in L2 and the graphics are way inferior to L2 even though L2 is over 4 years old now(yes thats right, since closed beta has been over 4 years
while(horse==dead)
{
beat();
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while, but couldn't find anything better and came back to stay.
A few comments.
Beginning playing in Lineage 2 is not that tough right now. In fact is
is downright easy. First of all, with the "Academy" you can actually
get into an established clan. This clan will likely have the adena
(in-game money) to help you out tremendously. There are also lowbie
buffs until you reach level 20. You can exchange weapons with NPC's,
use the manor system, and even get a pretty good Oath Armor set after
level 20 by doing a ten minute quest. None of this was available to the
people who started this game in open beta or early in retail. Simply
put, you can easily get to level 40 in two weeks . . where us
old-timers might have struggled for several months to get to level 40.
Also, with the aforementioned manor system and other additions, adena
isn't nearly as difficult to come by.
Yes, there are a lot of cheaters in the game. Many people buy accounts,
or buy adena so they can level faster and have the most cherished gear.
Yes, there are bots everywhere. But to be honest, I see bots and
cheaters in nearly every game I have tried.
The community is very fun. To me, it is the best part of the game.
Sometimes it is also the worst part of the game, too. It just depends
on who you hang out with and who you have confrontations with.
http://aion.24-hrgaming.net
Well as of recently there is no item drop on death unless you are red but you exaggerate it a little bit. Dunno maybe in beta it was a higher drop rate.
If you couldn't make money in L2..........How could you not is really the question..... Look at my money guild. If you spent all your cash on SS thats your fault for not leveling up a Dwarf. Weapon trade up for Ancient Adena, weapons are basically free. L2 has the easiest economy if you put your time in.
And guilds kicking you out for not showing up to sieges........well..........duh its the whole point of the game.
I'd kick you out to for not showing up to a siege, you are useless to the guild.
Sounds like you didn't like the game from the start. PvE sounds more your bag.
Your complaints are long gone.
Critizing a game is fine but at least make sure you are on the current version not the one from two years ago.
Ha ha ha uh i had all most a 50% item drop rate, and thats no exaggeration, all most every other time i died i droped items. My rl wife hunted with me so she would pick them up and save them for me, this all the time having no karma. I never had karma the entire time i played. I would also do the same for her. As far as spinding all of the money on ss yes i did becoue the people in my guild or clan would complane all the time that i wasent doing any damage if i didnt , so yes i used them or the clannys wouldnt group with us. As far as makeing money I stand by what i said, the drops i got from mobs in which i would sell to players for the going rate didnt cover much more than the price of the ss. And i dont like the idea of haveing to set up a dwarf character to play that i dont really want, or dont really like to play, just to make money for me to be able play the ones i did like.That is a total wast of time and money, my money in which i pay monthly to play the game. I think most people would agree with me on that one. As far as ancent adeana that must have came in after i quit i dont really remember it. but its been a while sence i played. But if i did get some i would have desposed of it in the most profitable way. As far as .....duh...... pvp no i dont like pvp and i know thousands of people who dont, they play on the pve servers in wow or eq or eq2 ect ect in which btw each one of those games has more people in north america and eurojp playing then does l2. As far as me being usless to a guild i think you got that backwards. The guilds were usless to me. I dont belong to them i belong to me, this is america after all, you know the land of the free. If a guld wont let you play the way you want to play what good are they. Besides im the one paying to play the game, the guilds didnt pay my monthly fees there for they have no right to tell me how to play. If i dont want to go to a castle siege im not going period i dont care if they dont like it either. So much said for the community lol You are right about one thing though i didnt like the game from the start and was much happer when i found wow and eq2 in which both are much better games. I stuck with l2 for so long in hopes that the devs would be smart enough to put up blue servers but allass, they werent. Thats why the game has done so poorly in the free world compaired to the other mmorpgs lol. I mean geeze look at all of the rpgs out there the ones who do the best in the free world and make the most money and are the most profitable and the most popular are the ones with blue servers or pve servers peorid. That should tell the devs something.
Sure, you can grind your way up to 50 rather easily in Lineage 2 . .
.then the game requires some dedication if you're going to advance
further. I don't feel sorry for the lazy idiots who grind a character
up to 40, then create a new character and grind it up to 40 . .
rinse/repeat . . . then they proclaim that the game sucks. It's not my
problem that they put themselves in that position.
If you want to really enjoy the high-level aspect of the game, then you
have to become high level. I don't want to play a game that casual
players have the same advancement rate as really hardcore players.
Still, even if you start now, you will be able to get to a high level
faster than any of the veteran players could.
Bots are rampant in Lineage 2. So what? If they are in a room I want, I
just take it from them. No need to kill them. No need to train them.
Just bring your clan down to the room and kill everything in sight
before the bots can get to it. Generally, bots have one person watching
the monitor. When they see that they are not getting any kills . . .
they move every single time.
Lineage 2, like any other game, is what you make of it. A little
dedication goes a long way. It is NOT difficult to level up to 75+,
especially if you have a good clan. If you're stuck at 50, get bored
and feel like you need to re-roll, you simply need to change who you
are clanned with.
http://aion.24-hrgaming.net
Also, the difficulty of the game is not getting to 75, it's getting to 75 while managing real life and hopefully not ebaying your gear. That's difficult. But if you're going to ebay your gear, then hitting 75 is just a matter of time. If you're going to play the market, the other forgotten or bypassed part of the game, then it will be difficult. The game takes a lot of time.
Cryomatrix
You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
Thats what makes the game good in my opinion...and thats why i truely recommend new mmo/rpg' ers to try this. if you reach the max lvl easily, it wont be fun , what i saw with WoW. And damn its so true that it is hard to manage ur social life while working hard to reach high lvls. Still this game stays on top of what i tried untill now.Dont watch my xfire profile now and say that i havnt tried much, thats because its created in end may this year.:)
Renith
Sure, you can grind your way up to 50 rather easily in Lineage 2 . . .then the game requires some dedication if you're going to advance further. I don't feel sorry for the lazy idiots
It takes one to know one
Fight!
You should just write a huge guide and have them sticky it. This is where you go over all the points that you keep having to go over. Remember when I pmed you my nooblet questions, you could make a beginner's guide to L2 post, have it stickied, and you'd be immortalized in these chats.
You give fair representation of a game that you love so much. Most people are biased, but you give it as you see it.
Cryomatrix
You can see my sci-fi/WW2 book recommendations.
Yeah, I was going to add a manor system "how to" in there this weekend maybe. I've been pretty busy with RL this past week.
kk bye!