Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Am I taking crazy pills here?
Calgore
Member Posts: 25
This
just seems like the same old story rehashed with a few more toys, and
people are going crazy for it! It's the same "Step into a realm of
magic and mystery with an ever evolving player dependent story. Get
magic swords and kill goblins and junk." that I've been reading on the
backcovers of boxes for the past decade! These fantasy MMOs seem like a
joke, the core of this game is unoriginal, with a few bells added on.
I am not attacking your game, I am just wondering if it's just me or
does this game look like unoriginal grindplay poopsockage with eyecandy
and a few new features.
just seems like the same old story rehashed with a few more toys, and
people are going crazy for it! It's the same "Step into a realm of
magic and mystery with an ever evolving player dependent story. Get
magic swords and kill goblins and junk." that I've been reading on the
backcovers of boxes for the past decade! These fantasy MMOs seem like a
joke, the core of this game is unoriginal, with a few bells added on.
I am not attacking your game, I am just wondering if it's just me or
does this game look like unoriginal grindplay poopsockage with eyecandy
and a few new features.
Comments
The first original roleplaying game was, I believe, Empire of the Petal Throne, which, by the way, would be a good MMORPG. Petal Throne preceded Dungeons and Dragons, and marginally involved Gygax, who sued Petal Throne originator MAR Barker to stop his distribution until Barker's ideas could be applied to D&D and distributed. The case was litigated in the courts for years, and, in the 1990's MAR Barker prevailed, and was able to, once again, distribute his product.
My point is that nothing in MMORPG/RPGs has been ground breakingly new and novel since Petal Throne. All subsequent MMORPG/RPGs have built on the same concepts, and evolved some new hooks.
That, and Gary Gygax really is not a nice person.
Its not so much WHAT this game is doing, but HOW it is doing it.
People have different reasons for coming to this game. For example, the sandbox, no instancing style of play is what will make me play. I played SWG before the NGE and I miss the seamless world. Other people like it because it is attempting to bring back a, for lack of a better word, "harder" style of game.
You can't reinvent the wheel. But you can make it turn a little smoother. Its all about taste and preference; Vanguard and WoW are both fantasy MMORPGs, but from everything we've heard the similarities will end there. There were lots of people who wanted something from the genre that they just werent getting until WoW came out. Yet still there are people now who are not happy with their choices, and some of them are waiting for Vanguard.
Maybe someday they will come out with an entirely new type of game that technology never allowed before that will blow us all away...until then, if we have to make do with a crummy old wheel, we want it to be a wheel that is tailored to our own needs as much as possible.
Which FF Character Are You?
These guys are for the most part the makers of the original EQ. (Which in my humble opinion is still the best MMO to date) Despite the graphics no other game a has storyline as in depth as EQ. Every other game out there currently hand holds you through the levels. Thats fine if I want to play a kiddie game. But its not for me.
I'm looking for a game that doesn't come with a manual....where you aren't told exactly where to go to find 'X" mob or item. Its all about exploring and running into something unexpected on your way there. Thats what made EQ so great.
Im hoping for a EQ clone with new graphics and some added tweaks. I know its not Norrath but I can't wait to find out about the new world we will be living in....All of its myths and legends.
with crafting, player owned houses, magic swords and elves isn't even
that original. Read 3 random fantasy books, and they'll be completely
different. Play 3 different fantasy MMOs and they'll be close to same.
The only difference I see from Vanguard besides the story (which will
still be sidelined and ignored by most) is that Vanguard is less
cartoony then the others. Everything else has been done before again
and again. I'm just asking for something new, maybe a completely
different combat system, with a completely original world, with
critters that are 100% original.
To old, MMOs are low on the inventive and more on the innovative, true.
But is it so much to ask that there be a new story besides a
"mysterious evil force" or something similar? The writers of these
games seem to be nothing more then grade 10 educated plagarizers. Same
with anyone who is involved at the concept stage.
originally posted by ghettochilde
People have different reasons for coming to this game. For example, the sandbox, no instancing style of play is what will make me play. I played SWG before the NGE and I miss the seamless world. Other people like it because it is attempting to bring back a, for lack of a better word, "harder" style of game.
This is so true, also the fun, companionship, challenge and "wonder" of these worlds seems to be much harder to find these days. But saying that the players put a lot of it there, all they needed was the right setting. Vanguard might just be the answer; it certainly looks beautiful ... who knows! But it will never be the "same old story." Most games are pretty unique to themselves (except maybe the korean ones, etc) Us as players have changed a lot, we have higher expectations, need more stimulus and have taken off our rose- colour specs! These games can become an extension of ourselves where we can do battle, adventure, build, become special in some way and hopefully share it all with friends ... At the moment Vanguard seems to be trying hard to create an atmosphere where we have the freedom to do all these things! At least we can dream!!
Ammie
Describe here a new feature that hasn't been done in an MMO that its relevant to the genre.
There you go, its that simple - put your money where your mouth is and tells us whats missing.
Currently Playing: GW2
Currently Following: Elder Scrolls Online
Games in my wake: Anarchy Online, Archlord (beta), Asherons Call, Asherons Call 2, City of Heroes, Dark Age of Camelot (SI to Catacombs), DDO, EVE Online, EverQuest II (beta), Guild Wars, Horizons, Lineage II,LORTO, Rift, RF Online (beta), RYL, Saga of Ryzon, Shadowbane, Star Wars Galaxies, Vanguard, WAR, WoW
Vanguard from what I am reading is trying to do two things:
1. Offer a new world experience for the dedicated Everquest fans. They realize that Everquest is aging and hemmoraging subscribers. Probably because the veterans have gobbled up the content and are ready for something different, but not something so foreign that they won't feel comfortable trying it.
2. Grab new subscribers ( duh!)
I believe they do not want to stray too far from such a successful model like EQ, hence the similarities are obvious. However, that being said, they do have some new concepts I havent seen before like
Diplomacy- while skill "cards" are being implemented already by the genius of Guild Wars. The concept of making a city more than a place where you get your quests and shop is nice. Inthe past, "political intrigue" was a term thrown about in games (I think it was Shadowbane and UO) but usually was a role playing thing that players did themselves or just chalked up to assasinating top players. Now, I hope at least, this game has the city being an adventure area instead of rapidly clicking through the text to get your "Kill X" assignment.
Caravans - more of a conveinence feature - not being a Beta player, but what I have been reading, I make it akin to City of Heroes/Villians. You can stay with your group even if you log off. Log back on and you don't have to catch up with them again.
The combat I think is the meat of any MMO, VSoH throws in lots of anti bot options like EQ2 in you and your parties success depends on managing dynamic battle conditions that arise. You have lots of choices instead of mashing the same series of buttons. They say it will be easy to learn, but difficult to master. My only concern is that it may be too difficult to manage and may scare away some at later levels.
Ok my time is up. ::steps down from the podium::
For those of you that are the least bit curious, I have some time on my hands, so let me explain what Empire of the Petal Throne was.
It was a fantasy world that took place on an alien planet. Humans formed two main empires, alien creatures, exotic cities/temples, and lots of politics within each empire. I remember the road sytem as elevated roads, the alien races were civilized, subjugated, and hostile to humans, and there were both magical and alien artifacts as treasure. All this was done in a swords and sorcery theme, there were no science fiction gadgets.
The uniforms and armor were exotic looking, and enameled in various color by faction.
MAR Barker was a professor at the University of Wisconsin, I believe. He may have been sociology, or anthropology, or something like that. He developed this entire world, it had it's own religions, cultures, etc drawn together of ideas from various ancient human cultures, and enhanced by his own ideas. It was a work of love by a very enlightened mind. He took his work of love to Gary Gygax, who decided to steal the system and apply it to D&D to make boatloads of cash.
MAR Barker eventually got his world back from Gygax, but by then everything was goblins and orcs. I always remember his work, and really would like to see one of this hobby's leaders, yes, even SOE, look into bringing this world into the MMORPG market. It would definately be a breath of fresh air in this genre.
I'll start my own SWG... with Black Jack... and Hookers!!!
In fact, forget the SWG!!!!
Original story
Original world
Fun crafting system
Player designed weaponry/armor
Mounts that actually behave like the animal they are
An actual player-dependent storyline, not just an event tossed every month or so.
Gore
Community involvement in post-release evolution that is listened to
I'd still do him.
True statement though. Anyone who is looking for something "groundbreaking" or "revolutionary" will be disappointed nearly all the time. Most games are baby steps from the ones that came before them... This game, imo just seems to be taking more baby steps on all fronts than the other AAA games coming out.
Currently Playing: GW2
Currently Following: Elder Scrolls Online
Games in my wake: Anarchy Online, Archlord (beta), Asherons Call, Asherons Call 2, City of Heroes, Dark Age of Camelot (SI to Catacombs), DDO, EVE Online, EverQuest II (beta), Guild Wars, Horizons, Lineage II,LORTO, Rift, RF Online (beta), RYL, Saga of Ryzon, Shadowbane, Star Wars Galaxies, Vanguard, WAR, WoW
i love fantasy RPG's always have and always will!
but i don't blame someone els for wanting something different and new, i just think you may be waiting a while. i suppose AOC could be that game for you if it turns out as good as the fans hope.
it is still a fantasy RPG but they are trying some new things, so who knows.
that is so then how many games can there be where technical limitations
dictate content?
Heck they can be similar,
just not "An evil force is rising through the world with an army of
blah blah blah". Or, "A world locked in strife as factions do battle
against one another"
My point is, that this game isn't all that crazy innovative. It makes a few baby steps but doesn't do anything too new.
-
Do not hate it, but instead embrace the diversity.
nice try at being an e-badass, kid. The fantasy genre is wider then
goblins, magic swords and repetitive storylines, yet the fantasy MMO
genre is not. You should take the internet less seriously.
Haha, nice try at being an e-badass, kid. The fantasy genre is wider then goblins, magic swords and repetitive storylines, yet the fantasy MMO genre is not. You should take the internet less seriously.
Oh so now you're putting words in my mouth AND judging my age? nice!
I didn't say anything about goblins or repetitive storylines.
In all honesty though, if you want to be someone special and make the first non-repetitive story go ahead and show us what you got little man!
"I think I can" Choo choo!
-
Do not hate it, but instead embrace the diversity.
I have come to like fantasy mmo's, i am thinking this is gonna be one of the best evolved fantasy mmo's thus far.
playing eq2 and two worlds
Original story
Original world
Fun crafting system
Player designed weaponry/armor
Mounts that actually behave like the animal they are
An actual player-dependent storyline, not just an event tossed every month or so.
Gore
Community involvement in post-release evolution that is listened to
Well, everyone proclaims having an original story and an original world.
Everyone thinks that theire crafting system is fun.
Player designed weapnry and armor are nice, but the game is still quite heavily focused on loot, which if it isnt now the minute the raiders take over the game crafted stuff wont be useful past the very earliest of levels.
Mounts acting like the animal they are? Sounds like marketing gibberish to me.
Gore? are you sure you are talking about EQ3 here or are you talking about age of conan. EQ3 will have no gore because they dont want an M rating, and then enforce it.
Player dependent storyline: more marketing gibberish saying that you will have a quest depending on what class you chose... hmm sounds pretty damn familiar to me.
EVERY game promises community involvement. None actually deliver it except A tale in the desert and second life.
None of your above points are lacking from any other game. Most everything has been promised and touted by marketing departments before, from every game that has come in this genre. If you are looking for EQ3 congratulations you have found it
http://www.speedtest.net/result/7300033012
playing eq2 and two worlds
I agree with pretty much everyone in this thread.
The OP says this game is unoriginal, just some pretty extra bells and whistles.
From what I have read the game is pretty much the same ole crapola with some extra bells and whistles. But if the remade your favorite sci-fi, horror, or fantasy movie with all new special effects, you would most likely go watch that movie too.
As far as the rest of the people that are trying to defend the game. I like the people behind this game, and I have already pre-ordered it, because I think they are going to surprise us all, everyone from the biggest hater, to the most devoted fanatic of this game, is most likely going to be OMG! Look what these guys are doing! How fricking cool!
I have read very little to support my belief in this,and I have seen even less. But I have noticed little hints with in the lore, the faqs, and the forums to make mee feel that there is something they are not telling us, and it is something big and wonderful.
Not so nice guy!
Oh for the record I'm not really defending them, its just my view on MMOs. Sure I love them, but I know what I'm getting, I love new things to do but at the core every MMO is pretty much the same just with different window dressing and technical flashy bits.
Currently Playing: GW2
Currently Following: Elder Scrolls Online
Games in my wake: Anarchy Online, Archlord (beta), Asherons Call, Asherons Call 2, City of Heroes, Dark Age of Camelot (SI to Catacombs), DDO, EVE Online, EverQuest II (beta), Guild Wars, Horizons, Lineage II,LORTO, Rift, RF Online (beta), RYL, Saga of Ryzon, Shadowbane, Star Wars Galaxies, Vanguard, WAR, WoW