Ok, I'm pretty sure we all know what PvE means, but in case people forgot, it's Player vs. Environment. So with that out of the way, let's take a look at what Eve Online offers for PvE. This is a Sci - Fi game so we probably won't be seeing much in terms of animals and monsters. We do however encounter a wide variation of drones, ships and space structures. I can see why this unfamiliar territory might confuse a lot of us High Fantasy folks. How can these flying objects compare to the ferocity of a Ice Giant or a Dragon. Well, think of it as a futuristic fantasy adventure where all your enemies wear armor and instead of fire breathing Dragons, they breath lasers and bullets. I guess in a way EO has just as much to offer in terms of PvE as most High Fantasy games, but I think the problem a lot of folks are referring to is the lack of diversity. When playing EO, you don't really get a good look at who your fighting most of the time, so your visual environment isn't what really makes your PvE experience. EO is more about the combat aspects which in my opinion has more to do with PvP, even if it is AI that your fighting. Although EO does offer some very high quality graphics for spacial environments, I just think people don't understand the complexity behind ground environments vs. spacial anomolies. Perhaps if EO ever implements their planetary and space station exploration, I'll agree it's a great PvE game, but as is, EO is nothing but PvP in my opinion.
Yea you are largly correct here EvE because of it setting has a hard time in making a convincing PvE setting. After all its set in space and space is full of well.....Space.
I have been reading all these posts about comparing eve to other games & it just cant be done .
they arn`t even close in game design the enviroments are complety different .
I have played wow & enjoyed it
I have played lineage II & enjoyed it
I have played swg & dident enjoy it
I have played EQ2 and kinda enjoyed it
I played DDO & enjoyed it
but while I was off playing these & many other games I always kept my eve accounts going..
eve is a pvp based game centered around resource aquisation & being able to hold on to those resources & make them productive
to try to conpare eve to wow or l2 or eq2 is just pointless ........and we eve players bitch & complain just as mutch to the dev as any other
I will continue to play eve as the community is great the game is fun & I enjoy all the acpects of the game ..I make a great many things to sell in eve & I really enjoy that part of the game ......Being based in 00 space can be borring & it can be thrilling its up to the player ...
In the next year I will give vanguard & AoC & spellborn & LoTR online all a go ...but will still keep my eve accounts a going
Originally posted by Gameloading If i defeat a level 60 warrior with my level 56 Paladin does mean I'm a good players, Not that my character is stronger then the warrior. Its the exact same thing.
That makes about as much sense as a horse riding the jockey. Levels don't mean shit, compared to two completely different classes, thats like comparing apples to oranges and bannanas to pickles. No it doesn't mean the character is stronger, it all depends on how the player "developes" the character and the resources around him/her.
You just ran yourself into a wall buddy, keep running but look out for those lamp posts, those are killers.
[[ DEAD ]] - Funny - I deleted my account on the site using the cancel account button. Forum user is separate and still exists with no way of deleting it. Delete it admins. Do it, this ends now.
This is probly not the right spot for this but ohh well I have played eve and I have seen how many awards EVE has won and I very confused, cuz when I think of Eve I think of..ZZZZZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz....................Ohhhh what sorry fell asleep what was I saying ohh yea Eve well when I think of It I think of how much of a snooz fest it is. How can it win anyhting.
Dont forget the "zzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzz booommmm! ah damn i fell asleep and got ganked by a TP PK bot", as for the PvE really nobody can say EVE deserves that award, it's plain silly... Damn Skippy!!!!!!!
If i defeat a level 60 warrior with my level 56 Paladin does mean I'm a good players, Not that my character is stronger then the warrior. Its the exact same thing.
I completely misunderstood your point and therfore, should not comment on your post again. Sorry.
How "dare" I tell you that you can never catch up to a veteran EVE player..? Uhm..you DID play the game, didn't you? A veteran will ALWAYS have more skills then one who started at a later time, because the skill system is based on real time, not on actual time spend ingame playing.
Skill POINTS. Not SKILLS.
Skill POINTS are irrelevant after a few months. SKILLS are never irrelevant, nor do veterans have a significant advantage in them.
Your problem is that you think skill POINTS correspond to levels in other games. Higher level = better. More skill POINTS does not make you more effective at the game. Its a common misconception with people who lack SKILLS and blame it on skill POINTS. That does not make skill POINTS in any way relevant compared to SKILLS.You understand my point, and you know just as well as I do that one who plays longer will always be stronger then one who plays less, no matter how much time is put into the game, because of the skill system.
Gameloading that is so not true. I don't think you have given the game a fair chance at all. So many factors come into play when people fight in EVE. I myself have defeated veteran players with alot more skill points than me. The difference between a skill at level 4 and level 5 is very little. People (you included) who still claim that skill points are everything, just frankly don't know what they are talking about.
Also I do agree that EQII has better PVE. But I will say "Just pull up your big boy pants and deal with it"
Could you please point out where I said that skill points are everything? go ahead. I would apreciate if you would NOT put words in my mouth. Moving on, the so veteran you faced is STILL stronger then your character (or ship). It doesn't matter if you beat him or not, in terms of numbers, he is still stronger then you. If i defeat a level 60 warrior with my level 56 Paladin does mean I'm a good players, Not that my character is stronger then the warrior. Its the exact same thing.
No it is not the exact same thing.. You are still caught up in the mindset of levels. The difference between a level 56 pally and a 60 warrior is vastly more than a level 4 vs a level 5 skill in EVE. Also go ahead and play with words. Your intent was to say skill points are everything. Other wise your argument is shallow. I know what you meant and so does everone else.
Support Bacteria, its the only culture some people have.
How "dare" I tell you that you can never catch up to a veteran EVE player..? Uhm..you DID play the game, didn't you? A veteran will ALWAYS have more skills then one who started at a later time, because the skill system is based on real time, not on actual time spend ingame playing.
Skill POINTS. Not SKILLS.
Skill POINTS are irrelevant after a few months. SKILLS are never irrelevant, nor do veterans have a significant advantage in them.
Your problem is that you think skill POINTS correspond to levels in other games. Higher level = better. More skill POINTS does not make you more effective at the game. Its a common misconception with people who lack SKILLS and blame it on skill POINTS. That does not make skill POINTS in any way relevant compared to SKILLS.You understand my point, and you know just as well as I do that one who plays longer will always be stronger then one who plays less, no matter how much time is put into the game, because of the skill system.
Gameloading that is so not true. I don't think you have given the game a fair chance at all. So many factors come into play when people fight in EVE. I myself have defeated veteran players with alot more skill points than me. The difference between a skill at level 4 and level 5 is very little. People (you included) who still claim that skill points are everything, just frankly don't know what they are talking about.
Also I do agree that EQII has better PVE. But I will say "Just pull up your big boy pants and deal with it"
Could you please point out where I said that skill points are everything? go ahead. I would apreciate if you would NOT put words in my mouth. Moving on, the so veteran you faced is STILL stronger then your character (or ship). It doesn't matter if you beat him or not, in terms of numbers, he is still stronger then you. If i defeat a level 60 warrior with my level 56 Paladin does mean I'm a good players, Not that my character is stronger then the warrior. Its the exact same thing.
No it is not the exact same thing.. You are still caught up in the mindset of levels. The difference between a level 56 pally and a 60 warrior is vastly more than a level 4 vs a level 5 skill in EVE. Also go ahead and play with words. Your intent was to say skill points are everything. Other wise your argument is shallow. I know what you meant and so does everone else.
Its pretty obvious that you DON'T understand what I mean. the point still stands, one who had the time to train level 5 will ALWAYS be stronger then someone who trained to level 4 in terms of numbers. NOT ONCE did I say that a one with lower skills couldn't win of those with higher skills. I'm not playing with words, it seems you completely fail to understand the point I was trying to make. I never said that skill point are everything, I think its better if you actually fully READ a post before you comment on it.
Well when you have a site full of fanboys so up Eve's ass, that's what you get.
I think its more a case of that this internet site has more eve fans visiting itthan any other game rather than some sort of bot cheat.
If you want to fix this then raise the profile of this site in your communitys forum. Be it just linking to an interesting forum topic or just telling people about this site in generall. Of course this assumes your game has a community.
As far as im concerned, the readers choice awards have no clout anymore. I dont even pay attention to them anymore. I have to agree that it's not that the EVE fanboi's pumped the vote. It's just that people hate WoW because it's the "cool" thing to do and therefor voted against it. It's not like it matters, people that play WoW and Blizzard Ent. could give two shits about these awards, they make no difference to them or their player base. WoW will continue to dominate for a long time coming, and there is NOTHING you can do about it, no matter how many awards your pathetic MMO garners.
The same situation happens all over the place. Take the show Arrested Development for example. Even thought it got so many emmy's and awards and blah blah blah. They still cancelled it because it didn't get high viewer ratings.
So please, just ignore the Readers Choice awards and get over it. World of Warcraft is here to stay and it will remain the big dog in the pound for many years to come no matter what you try to say or do.
"Without funk, is there hope for panda?" -Derivative of Ishmael
Just my take on what PVE entails in most games including WOW, EQ2, AC, RYZOM, AO, etc, etc. I apologise first that it may seem to be a rant (i guess it is)
PVE usually refers to player versus entity or player versus environment - basically things under computer rather than player control. In most games in the past this relates to encounters out in the wild, in instances or locked away in hard to reach dungeons - generally this PVE stuff gets everywhere and makes up a major component of the game, even those who PVP still have some involvement in the PVE now and again even if its just running from some p***ed off mobs who they aggroed on the way past.
Games like EQ (this is what most modern PVE games got based on unfortunately - there is a lot of room for improvement) have quite a diversity in PVE ranging from instances ala Lost Dungeons of Norrath, raids as take place in the planes and general PVE that happens everywhere from north freeport to the plains of karana. PVE in these games isnt something you always call up on demand (though it can include that) its there around you to see all the time from rats in the newbie zone to gods in the planes. In short these games ooze PVE (and in many cases the PVP side can suck and be neglected at its expense).
I like EVE - i have played it on and off and have a main character with about 10.5 million skillpoints - im not a vet but do pop back to it from time to time and have played over several years. One thing I cannot say though is that EVE makes a good PVE game, it lacks much of the above - I can fly through dozens of systems and never get chased by an NPC, the mobs come in limited sizes - frig, cruiser, BS, etc and I have missioned extensively - usually after any update to the mission system a few days later you are back in a rut of running the exact same missions over and over and can even imagine what the placement of the rats will be and what waves to expect.
EVE does not have grouping mechanics like those in other MMO games (yes I know about gangs but how many people run gangs into missions) and in the game you are unlikely to get trained, have your healer disconnect or go OOM or have a bad pull (though you can aggro everything in some missions by shooting static objects). You are also never going to feel the sheer joy of surviving a bad pull due to player skill and teamwork or get to cheer after the boss falls at the end of a good dungeon run.
In short EVE cannot really compete as a PVE game, there is some PVE content there but it is in its most basic of forms and only really provides a way to farm isk, faction or modules. EVE is however a lot of fun in my eyes and one hell of a PVP game to boot.
EVE does not have grouping mechanics like those in other MMO games (yes I know about gangs but how many people run gangs into missions) and in the game you are unlikely to get trained, have your healer disconnect or go OOM or have a bad pull (though you can aggro everything in some missions by shooting static objects). You are also never going to feel the sheer joy of surviving a bad pull due to player skill and teamwork or get to cheer after the boss falls at the end of a good dungeon run.
Have you ever done 8/10+ complexes or tried out what you can find with the new exploration system?
I doubt you can fly them solo without the help of Logistics ships (healers) / Tanks / Damage dealers. The new exploration deadspace complexes have timed and other event triggers for reinforcements and other stuff.
EVE does not have grouping mechanics like those in other MMO games (yes I know about gangs but how many people run gangs into missions) and in the game you are unlikely to get trained, have your healer disconnect or go OOM or have a bad pull (though you can aggro everything in some missions by shooting static objects). You are also never going to feel the sheer joy of surviving a bad pull due to player skill and teamwork or get to cheer after the boss falls at the end of a good dungeon run.
There is nohealer class in eve you just fit an a repairer module based on your tank and thats it.
This pretty much tells me that you ahvent really played that much if at all.
EVE does not have grouping mechanics like those in other MMO games (yes I know about gangs but how many people run gangs into missions) and in the game you are unlikely to get trained, have your healer disconnect or go OOM or have a bad pull (though you can aggro everything in some missions by shooting static objects). You are also never going to feel the sheer joy of surviving a bad pull due to player skill and teamwork or get to cheer after the boss falls at the end of a good dungeon run.
There is nohealer class in eve you just fit an a repairer module based on your tank and thats it.
This pretty much tells me that you ahvent really played that much if at all.
EVE has a healer "class" even if its underdog, but its used though and not just for missionrunning, and
yes in know what i am talking about i fly them myself
I agree with the majority of posters that Eve won by default, as it was up against WoW. There's really no contest, I've played both and although WoW is very popular, it is an extremely tedious and boring experience.
Originally posted by Gameloading Originally posted by HashBrick
Originally posted by Gameloading If i defeat a level 60 warrior with my level 56 Paladin does mean I'm a good players, Not that my character is stronger then the warrior. Its the exact same thing.
I completely misunderstood your point and therfore, should not comment on your post again. Sorry. Fixed your post for you, buddy.
No you, completely mis-understand the whole mmorpg market. Oh ya and nice way to fix up that post and then cover it up, it orginally said some bullshit that made absolutely no sense. You'd make a damn good president of the United States, dumb as hell and devious to boot.
[[ DEAD ]] - Funny - I deleted my account on the site using the cancel account button. Forum user is separate and still exists with no way of deleting it. Delete it admins. Do it, this ends now.
If i defeat a level 60 warrior with my level 56 Paladin does mean I'm a good players, Not that my character is stronger then the warrior. Its the exact same thing.
I completely misunderstood your point and therfore, should not comment on your post again. Sorry.
Fixed your post for you, buddy.
No you, completely mis-understand the whole mmorpg market. Oh ya and nice way to fix up that post and then cover it up, it orginally said some bullshit that made absolutely no sense. You'd make a damn good president of the United States, dumb as hell and devious to boot.
oh haha, so now I "Mis-understand the whole mmorpg market". Good sir, you didn't understand my point. just accept that. Also, I didn't cover up anything. Nice way of throwing out flames by the way. Do you always do that to try to make your point?
JESUS TAP-DANCING CHRIST!!! Does anyone have anything better to do than "flame" or call eachother "noobs" and "trolls?" FUCK! We all understand that we have our favorite games so how about just keeping things a little more mellow. Like how i'm handling my fucking mood right fucking now! Each game has something unique to bring to the table and each game has its own cult following. FUCK! MMORPG.com didnt make a site for antisocialites to fight like little children. Keep to the fucking point! And calm THE FUCK DOWN! Watch your fucking language too! I dont want to see fucking "noobs" and "trolls" ever again! It hurts peoples fucking feelings.
I'm sure mmorpg will make sure you wont see me again, Peace!
*And before mmorpg.com critically hits me for 400k hp, my only wish is for all of you to just get along for 24 hours. Make me proud!
Comments
Yea you are largly correct here EvE because of it setting has a hard time in making a convincing PvE setting. After all its set in space and space is full of well.....Space.
I have been reading all these posts about comparing eve to other games & it just cant be done .
they arn`t even close in game design the enviroments are complety different .
I have played wow & enjoyed it
I have played lineage II & enjoyed it
I have played swg & dident enjoy it
I have played EQ2 and kinda enjoyed it
I played DDO & enjoyed it
but while I was off playing these & many other games I always kept my eve accounts going..
eve is a pvp based game centered around resource aquisation & being able to hold on to those resources & make them productive
to try to conpare eve to wow or l2 or eq2 is just pointless ........and we eve players bitch & complain just as mutch to the dev as any other
I will continue to play eve as the community is great the game is fun & I enjoy all the acpects of the game ..I make a great many things to sell in eve & I really enjoy that part of the game ......Being based in 00 space can be borring & it can be thrilling its up to the player ...
In the next year I will give vanguard & AoC & spellborn & LoTR online all a go ...but will still keep my eve accounts a going
That makes about as much sense as a horse riding the jockey. Levels don't mean shit, compared to two completely different classes, thats like comparing apples to oranges and bannanas to pickles. No it doesn't mean the character is stronger, it all depends on how the player "developes" the character and the resources around him/her.
You just ran yourself into a wall buddy, keep running but look out for those lamp posts, those are killers.
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy
Fixed your post for you, buddy.
Skill POINTS are irrelevant after a few months. SKILLS are never irrelevant, nor do veterans have a significant advantage in them.
Your problem is that you think skill POINTS correspond to levels in other games. Higher level = better. More skill POINTS does not make you more effective at the game. Its a common misconception with people who lack SKILLS and blame it on skill POINTS. That does not make skill POINTS in any way relevant compared to SKILLS.You understand my point, and you know just as well as I do that one who plays longer will always be stronger then one who plays less, no matter how much time is put into the game, because of the skill system.
Gameloading that is so not true. I don't think you have given the game a fair chance at all. So many factors come into play when people fight in EVE. I myself have defeated veteran players with alot more skill points than me. The difference between a skill at level 4 and level 5 is very little. People (you included) who still claim that skill points are everything, just frankly don't know what they are talking about.
Also I do agree that EQII has better PVE. But I will say "Just pull up your big boy pants and deal with it"
Could you please point out where I said that skill points are everything? go ahead. I would apreciate if you would NOT put words in my mouth. Moving on, the so veteran you faced is STILL stronger then your character (or ship). It doesn't matter if you beat him or not, in terms of numbers, he is still stronger then you. If i defeat a level 60 warrior with my level 56 Paladin does mean I'm a good players, Not that my character is stronger then the warrior. Its the exact same thing.No it is not the exact same thing.. You are still caught up in the mindset of levels. The difference between a level 56 pally and a 60 warrior is vastly more than a level 4 vs a level 5 skill in EVE. Also go ahead and play with words. Your intent was to say skill points are everything. Other wise your argument is shallow. I know what you meant and so does everone else.
Support Bacteria, its the only culture some people have.
Skill POINTS are irrelevant after a few months. SKILLS are never irrelevant, nor do veterans have a significant advantage in them.
Your problem is that you think skill POINTS correspond to levels in other games. Higher level = better. More skill POINTS does not make you more effective at the game. Its a common misconception with people who lack SKILLS and blame it on skill POINTS. That does not make skill POINTS in any way relevant compared to SKILLS.You understand my point, and you know just as well as I do that one who plays longer will always be stronger then one who plays less, no matter how much time is put into the game, because of the skill system.
Gameloading that is so not true. I don't think you have given the game a fair chance at all. So many factors come into play when people fight in EVE. I myself have defeated veteran players with alot more skill points than me. The difference between a skill at level 4 and level 5 is very little. People (you included) who still claim that skill points are everything, just frankly don't know what they are talking about.
Also I do agree that EQII has better PVE. But I will say "Just pull up your big boy pants and deal with it"
Could you please point out where I said that skill points are everything? go ahead. I would apreciate if you would NOT put words in my mouth. Moving on, the so veteran you faced is STILL stronger then your character (or ship). It doesn't matter if you beat him or not, in terms of numbers, he is still stronger then you. If i defeat a level 60 warrior with my level 56 Paladin does mean I'm a good players, Not that my character is stronger then the warrior. Its the exact same thing.No it is not the exact same thing.. You are still caught up in the mindset of levels. The difference between a level 56 pally and a 60 warrior is vastly more than a level 4 vs a level 5 skill in EVE. Also go ahead and play with words. Your intent was to say skill points are everything. Other wise your argument is shallow. I know what you meant and so does everone else.
Its pretty obvious that you DON'T understand what I mean. the point still stands, one who had the time to train level 5 will ALWAYS be stronger then someone who trained to level 4 in terms of numbers. NOT ONCE did I say that a one with lower skills couldn't win of those with higher skills. I'm not playing with words, it seems you completely fail to understand the point I was trying to make. I never said that skill point are everything, I think its better if you actually fully READ a post before you comment on it.Anyone capable of rational thought know's this to be true.
Who here with a straight face can say EVE offers a richer PVE environment than EQII FFXI or even Ryzom?
That being said I saw something posted elsewhere on this thread that bears repeating.
What is the fact we're even debating EVE being the best PVE MMO saying about the state of MMO's today?
ZV
Dutchess Zarraa Voltayre
Reborn/Zero Sum/Ancient Legacy/Jagged Legion/Feared/Nuke & Pave.
I think its more a case of that this internet site has more eve fans visiting itthan any other game rather than some sort of bot cheat.
If you want to fix this then raise the profile of this site in your communitys forum. Be it just linking to an interesting forum topic or just telling people about this site in generall. Of course this assumes your game has a community.
I find it amazing that by 2020 first world countries will be competing to get immigrants.
The same situation happens all over the place. Take the show Arrested Development for example. Even thought it got so many emmy's and awards and blah blah blah. They still cancelled it because it didn't get high viewer ratings.
So please, just ignore the Readers Choice awards and get over it. World of Warcraft is here to stay and it will remain the big dog in the pound for many years to come no matter what you try to say or do.
"Without funk, is there hope for panda?" -Derivative of Ishmael
http://gravgaming.net
A site for pro and recreational gaming.
PVE usually refers to player versus entity or player versus environment - basically things under computer rather than player control. In most games in the past this relates to encounters out in the wild, in instances or locked away in hard to reach dungeons - generally this PVE stuff gets everywhere and makes up a major component of the game, even those who PVP still have some involvement in the PVE now and again even if its just running from some p***ed off mobs who they aggroed on the way past.
Games like EQ (this is what most modern PVE games got based on unfortunately - there is a lot of room for improvement) have quite a diversity in PVE ranging from instances ala Lost Dungeons of Norrath, raids as take place in the planes and general PVE that happens everywhere from north freeport to the plains of karana. PVE in these games isnt something you always call up on demand (though it can include that) its there around you to see all the time from rats in the newbie zone to gods in the planes. In short these games ooze PVE (and in many cases the PVP side can suck and be neglected at its expense).
I like EVE - i have played it on and off and have a main character with about 10.5 million skillpoints - im not a vet but do pop back to it from time to time and have played over several years. One thing I cannot say though is that EVE makes a good PVE game, it lacks much of the above - I can fly through dozens of systems and never get chased by an NPC, the mobs come in limited sizes - frig, cruiser, BS, etc and I have missioned extensively - usually after any update to the mission system a few days later you are back in a rut of running the exact same missions over and over and can even imagine what the placement of the rats will be and what waves to expect.
EVE does not have grouping mechanics like those in other MMO games (yes I know about gangs but how many people run gangs into missions) and in the game you are unlikely to get trained, have your healer disconnect or go OOM or have a bad pull (though you can aggro everything in some missions by shooting static objects). You are also never going to feel the sheer joy of surviving a bad pull due to player skill and teamwork or get to cheer after the boss falls at the end of a good dungeon run.
In short EVE cannot really compete as a PVE game, there is some PVE content there but it is in its most basic of forms and only really provides a way to farm isk, faction or modules. EVE is however a lot of fun in my eyes and one hell of a PVP game to boot.
/RANT off
I doubt you can fly them solo without the help of Logistics ships (healers) / Tanks / Damage dealers. The new exploration deadspace complexes have timed and other event triggers for reinforcements and other stuff.
What more does Wow or EQ2 provide?
There is nohealer class in eve you just fit an a repairer module based on your tank and thats it.
This pretty much tells me that you ahvent really played that much if at all.
There is nohealer class in eve you just fit an a repairer module based on your tank and thats it.
This pretty much tells me that you ahvent really played that much if at all.
EVE has a healer "class" even if its underdog, but its used though and not just for missionrunning, and
yes in know what i am talking about i fly them myself
You mean the Logistics class dont you?
Well yea you do ahve a point there but in the end who uses them in PvE nowadays really [Shrugs].
Not for agent missions but for the real big deadspace complexes it can mean the difference between success and total annihilation.
Not for agent missions but for the real big deadspace complexes it can mean the difference between success and total annihilation.
Ahh yes i see when i origonally replied to you i was just thinking of missions not complexes.
Fixed your post for you, buddy.
No you, completely mis-understand the whole mmorpg market. Oh ya and nice way to fix up that post and then cover it up, it orginally said some bullshit that made absolutely no sense. You'd make a damn good president of the United States, dumb as hell and devious to boot.
Fixed your post for you, buddy.
No you, completely mis-understand the whole mmorpg market. Oh ya and nice way to fix up that post and then cover it up, it orginally said some bullshit that made absolutely no sense. You'd make a damn good president of the United States, dumb as hell and devious to boot.
oh haha, so now I "Mis-understand the whole mmorpg market". Good sir, you didn't understand my point. just accept that. Also, I didn't cover up anything. Nice way of throwing out flames by the way. Do you always do that to try to make your point?I'm sure mmorpg will make sure you wont see me again,
Peace!
*And before mmorpg.com critically hits me for 400k hp, my only wish is for all of you to just get along for 24 hours. Make me proud!
Ahh the nooby wow kiddy comes ^
Care to back up your comment.