What is/was the NGE?

Lai'Ahna · January 2007

Ok seems I stopped playing SWG right around when they started making this NGE. What-ever that is? Will someone please enlighten me as to what NGE even means? So far all I know is that they did a complete overhaul on the Jedi class. Also that they changed the skill system. No idea in what way though. Thanks for any help.

xersent · January 2007

more like the whole game has changed... i would say.. go try the free trial and your see

jrgambit · January 2007

No one is quite sure what NGE stands for. some possibilities are Negative Gaming Enhancements, No Gaming Enhancements, Not Good Enough, and there are others.

As for the changes, all professions have been removed, and in their place are nine(?) crappy replacements.

If you are serious about playing this again, I suggest you read the official forums and read about the classes and everything else there. It can probably tell you more then us haters can.

Dartje · January 2007

NGE = New Game Experience.

It wasn't for me but why not try the trial ?

Lai'Ahna · January 2007

Thank you all for the replies. I had been considering playing again because someone has asked me to. Changed all the professions? You mean my dancer/Jedi will be no more then? What will she be?

Is JTLS still in the game?

CasualMaker · January 2007

Originally posted by Lai'Ahna

Thank you all for the replies. I had been considering playing again because someone has asked me to. Changed all the professions? You mean my dancer/Jedi will be no more then? What will she be?

Is JTLS still in the game?

NGE = Now Gaming Elsewhere

Jump to Lightspeed is still there. It is about the only thing they didn't screw with and break.

NGE has 9 (actually 12) classes. Not "professions", I mean classes like every other MMO: you pick it up front and are stuck with it. You can't mix various skills to create a unique template; you are a near-carbon copy of everyone else in your class. (The recent partial exception is that they swiped WoW's talent system and call it "expertise". But you are still just getting some optional abilities, only available to your class.) Yes, your dancer/Jedi is no more. Non-Entertainers can use a slitherhorn to play Starwars1, and do the Basic dance, but that is not mixing Entertainer skills. Everyone can now use a survey tool (at the lowest resolution), and craft a small glass, spiced tea and a wafer, but that is not mixing Artisan skills.

Artisans are now called "Traders"; while nominally a single class, they are really 4 (which also can't mix skills): Domestic (Chef/Tailor), Munitions (Armor/Weaponsmith), Structures (Architect/Shipwright), and Engineer (Master Artisan/Droid Engineer/some Weaponsmith).

There are no trainers; you just level up and magically aquire the next special/ability/item. You have no choice about the order of the new abilities. It's a simplistic linear path, aside from the very minor expertise customization.

Lai'Ahna · January 2007

Oh I am glad I left when I did then. Just curious what my old character would be if I do get her when I log in again? I might just have to find out.

CasualMaker · January 2007

When you log in, you are something of a blank slate. The very first thing you must do is choose a class. Your CL is retained and you become that level in whichever class you choose. Expertise points are accumulated based on your level, and you can spend them on a variety of abilities. Entertainers and Traders still do not have Expertise, and even after more than a year, their class quests are still broken and non-functional.

Decay is turned off, and nothing wears out. You can loot tons of weapons, clothing, and powerup items, and sell them to junk dealers for lots of money. There is no more player-run economy, and inflation is at Weimar Republic levels. Crafted weapons and armor are maybe better than looted, but quest-reward gear is always better. So without decay to remove items from use, crafters can't sell much. There is no death penalty, and the "Cloner Express" is a favored method of free travel.

Things they actually managed to do right: no more armor certifications. Even CL1 Traders and Entertainers can wear armor starting at the second phase of advancement. (Progression from CL1 to CL90 is in 4 phases, each looking like a speedometer.) There is no more hindrance or encumbrance from wearing armor (NOT saying that is something done right). Damage is again based more on the weapon used than on the user's CL. As a permanently CL1 Trader, I got up to Naboo on the Legacy Quest series, by leaving the fighting to my pre-NGE CL39 Probot. This worked out well as long as I was able to only engage 1 enemy at a time; even 15-20 levels above didn't one-shot me, and the droid dished enough damage to keep their attention even if I plinked at them.

xersent · January 2007

The one thing that really is a shame.. is all the people that worked so hard to become a jedi pre-NGE .. .. well it was a waste of time.. because now u can pick JEDI as a starter class.. starwars is great and the game was great.. and for some it still may be great.. but from what it was.. . ... ... ... .... ..sds.. .. .. .. .sdssdag.....dfd.....e.re..g.d.f.........sa.da....sd.s.......sda....yeah............no.....sds.....hmmm....... well thats about it really

Lai'Ahna · January 2007

Yes well, if I can re-allocate all my experience points, then what will I have to choose between for them? This is getting confusing for me now.

FreelancerA4 · January 2007

Basically, when you log in, you'll choose one of the nine classes and it will convert all of your skills to combat level (which determines abilities and such now). If you had experience points that were not used for skill boxes before the NGE, I believe that some of it does get transfered. Think of it as WoW in space in terms of its skill system. When you earn X amount of experience you go up to Y level and gain Z abilities, skills, and items. You don't make your own path so much as you choose one you like and follow it to its end.

ArcAngel3 · January 2007

Hi there Lai'ahna. The NGE is really a completely different game than the original SWG. It's very hard to explain how your old character might fit into the new system. For example we used to have skill points that you could put into different skills, and we used to see trainers to get our new abilities. We could put our points in many different areas and custom make a character. The new system is not at all like this. You have to pick one of nine character classes. For example you can click on an icon of Luke Skywalker and you are a jedi. There is no such thing as mixed professions anymore. For example, I used to be a Teras Kasi Master and a Master Doc. In the NGE there is no Teras Kasi. I chose the new "medic" profession because I liked healing. I then was basically just informed how many "levels" my new "medic" had in light of my previous accomplishments. I was then told what abilities a medic of that level has.

The player community asked, begged, pleaded for the ability to customize our characters again, so SOE has been giving each new "profession" some options when they get to a certain level. Now you can choose one ability, or another, depending on which path of expertise you want to follow. There is some limited customization, but nothing like we had before, and you still cannot mix professions. If you are a jedi, you can choose between two different force powers for example when you are able to get expertise.

Another really big change is the way the game is actually played. There are essentially two control systems available to the player. One works a lot like a first person shooter game. You have to use your mouse to manually target enemies, and click either the left mouse button for a standard attack, or the right mouse button for one of many "special" attacks. This is a bit oversimplified because there are different ways to customize the manual targetting. I'm trying to avoid being even more confusing than necessary.

If you don't like the manual targetting, they restored a form of automatic targetting, once again after players asked and begged for a return of the game play we enjoyed. The new automatic system was very confusing to me. I kept needing to switch between manual and automatic to get things to work for me at first. Eventually I got a key set up to cause my charater to repeatedly do his standard attack, while I used f keys to launch specials. This felt a bit like the old style combat I used to enjoy, but not quite as intuitive.

Combat now is really over a lot faster than before. I could kill a Krayt dragon by myself for example in about 2 minutes. NPC's really die easily. There is much less time for strategy.

Weapons are looted with great ease and abundance, so crafting is much less necessary in the game at this point. I feel bad for crafters who make things that no one really needs anymore. Dancing or music buffs mainly either help crafting (already discussed) or help combat characters level up faster by giving them an xp boost. My Medic is level 90 (highest now) so I don't need a buff. I don't need to go to the cantinas anymore, and when I do, they are much emptier than they used to be.

Creature handler was deleted. People can call mounts again finally. But some people still stare at pets locked in their datapads that they can't call. All of the quests related to unlocking a jedi have been deleted. All force enhancements for those on the jedi path were also deleted. If you were a jedi, you're now an "elder jedi". They have a few perks, but many people mourn the loss of their custom jedi templates.

Lag is still a problem and so are bugs. Combat is more individual oriented than before, although there have been some recent changes made to try to bring back some level of player interdepdence. It's still not as interdependent as it was though. It seems that some people didn't want to "need" any other profession for anything, and that the NGE caters to that preference.

Some of my friends still play because it's star wars, and they've met nice people in the game. Most of my friends quit. Some return to check on the status periodically. I don't want to invest in a game again and experience so many losses again, so I keep myself and my time and money away from SOE. Hope that helps. If you try to play again, Ahazi has some great people on it. My old guild leaders started playing again, and they treat people very well. The guild is called CIA and the guild city is Crimson Island. Good luck and I hope you have fun in whatever game you choose

ARC3

iskareot · January 2007

Lets not forget to also tell you that it is known as the biggest blunder of a MMO game now. It also has actually proved to be the biggest mistake SOE has made I think in it's history.

The NGE was a mistake from the start, with more bugs, issues, bad press, bad gameplay... then ever... I will also share with you the awards it revieved from MMO game of the year from this site( based on votes).

What you should also do is go look it up on the web. Look up it's promise and future based on it's history and current track record.

Here is one for you from SOE's own producers... get ready-- hearing that the game your in is a mistake is hard for alot to handle.

http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=10830

Understand that the maker of SWG quit, the creator of this NGE (or one) was fired --- also understand that there is now such a low playerbase that the game itself feels like a ghost town in most of the cities you would assume to be busy. In fact only one city is left that has any activity -- Eisley... now then also note that most of the game is bugged, or just gone... everything from CH to even the animations for Jedi or most profs..... they just whap whap whap.

Also know that money and crafting is shot... it is a wreck of sorts, SOE claimed they were going to have a crafting revamp... but --- um yeah as you might suspect... they pulled out and failed on making that dilivery.

All in all this product is now in a state of despair and pretty much is on it's last leg... download the trial and just walk around the planets... go look at all the player cities, go look at the game in a whole...from friends lists, to smoothness the game and the challenge is gone.

Here is the list of awards it has recieved:

Enjoy... Taken from the 2006 MMORPG awards based on votes and data....

LEAST FUN:

STAR WARS GALAXIES

Star Wars has no trouble beating out the other games nominated in this field taking 37% of the votes when compared to Dark and Light (16%) and RF Online (11%). Obviously our voters are still a tad bit upset over the giant overhaul of the combat and class system last year. It is more fun than picking the fleas off a Wookie or potty-training an Ewok? Who knows, but I’m not in hurry to experience any of the three anytime soon.

MY PICK: DARK AND LIGHT

How much fun can you have in a game that crashes every ten minutes, has ridiculously poor design, and game breaking bugs? Not much, if any, I assure you. Why not hop on a Dragon and soar through the sky? Make sure to avoid looking at the ground if you enjoy getting more than 10 FPS. Take a hot air balloon ride across the massive landscape? If you do then everyone within 2 km will crash out as soon as you hop aboard only to be told they are already logged in when they try and restart! I wouldn’t recommend this ‘game’ even to a masochist.

MOST DESOLATE:

STAR WARS GALAXIES

Once again, the majority spoke and gave SWG another dubious award gaining 51% of the votes for this category. Coming in at second place was Dark and Light (23%) followed by Dark Age of Camelot (9%) at a distant third. In my introduction to the voting last week I suggested giving preference to game whose population had dropped rapidly rather than a game that never had the big numbers so I’m not too surprised at this outcome. Maybe by this time next year, everyone will be over it, or playing a new Star Wars game.

MY PICK: DARK AGE OF CAMELOT

It’s truly a sad state of affairs when even the mighty zerg army of Albion is reduced to a couple eight man groups in peak hours. While it never quite had the numbers the SWG enjoyed its demise is more significant to me because it represents the downfall of one of the best PvP games in the last ten years. All good things must come to an end though, so out with old and in with the new.

WORST USE OF A POPULAR IP OR LICENSE:

STAR WARS GALAXIES

Seeing a trend here? With 63% of the votes, Star Wars beat out Dungeons and Dragons Online (37%) and The Matrix Online (4%) for the worst of the MMOG conversions. I’m pretty sure that no permanent damage was done to the franchise, but for most of the voters SWG betrayed the original concept of the movie, much like the newest Trilogy did. DDO has fallen pretty far from last year when it won “Most Anticipated for 2006”. Shows how much you can trust award votes.

MY PICK: DUNGEONS AND DRAGONS ONLINE

This was a tough call since I was torn between DDO and Lord of the Rings. Being an old PnP gamer who still keeps 1st edition books I was appalled at the shallow gameplay and simplistic mechanics which are totally at odd with the flavor of the AD&D system. Why pay monthly for a poor mans’s Guild Wars when you can just log on to a NWN Persistent World for free and get better Modules to boot?

MOST SHAMELESS DEVELOPER:

SONY ONLINE ENTERTAINMENT

With a staggering 77% of the votes SOE won in a blowout and the next closest was Dark and Light’s very own NP Cube (16%) and Turbine (3%). What can you say? When the gibbering hordes have spoken all you can do it stand aside and watch them play ‘Pin the Punk Card’. Keep your chin up Sony, at least the PS3 works great right?

MY PICK: NP CUBE

Sony may have their enemies, but for me I have to give the nod in this category to the guys from Reunion Island. Without comparing lies, mismanagement, and audience alienation stories, I can safely say that NP Cube has done more than anyone else to damage to the reputation of small time Devs everywhere and when you hurt the folks with little pockets it means a lot more in my book. Plan on dropping that NDA sometime guys?

MOST LIKELY TO BE CANCELLED IN 2007:

STAR WARS GALAXIES

Star Wars wins its fourth award tonight in a close fought battle of bargain-bin hopefuls taking 29% of the votes edging out it’s faithful runner up Dark and Light (17%) and Archlord (15%). The voters continued to vent their rage on their favorite meat puppet and SWG beat out other games on the chopping block with less than a tenth of their subscribers. I can only hope that by the time next year’s awards roll around we won’t have to look at any of the games that received votes here.

MY PICK: AUTO ASSAULT

How much longer can you go on with a handful of subscriptions and server merges before you call it quits? NetDevil may just choose to skate along on the razor edge of profit margin, but MMOs are only worth running if you love your own game. I don’t think any amount of extra work can turn this title into a money maker however.

BIGGEST STINKER:

STAR WARS GALAXIES

For some reason space opera games seem to win all the awards, good or bad here. Once again, Star Wars crapped its way past the competition gaining 40% of the overall votes. In a close second Dark and Light claimed 29% followed by Dungeons and Dragons Online (10%). This year the old school Pre-CU/NGE gangstas came out in ‘force’ and sent a message. Are they just Rebel scum without a cause? Will something good ever come of this franchise? Will I ever stop causing trouble by provoking die-hard fans? Difficult to answer, these questions are...uncertain the future is.

Pretty much what the reviews and mass majority of players that left say is pretty dead on.

Sure it is a different game... but that seems to be the excuse vs what it really is.

(Sorry most people use common sense and consider this somewhat of a BIG RED FLAG OF "OH CRAP THERE MIGHT BE SOMTHING WRONG WITH THIS GAME" type concept... just maybe lol.

Obraik · January 2007

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

Hi there Lai'ahna. The NGE is really a completely different game than the original SWG. It's very hard to explain how your old character might fit into the new system. For example we used to have skill points that you could put into different skills, and we used to see trainers to get our new abilities. We could put our points in many different areas and custom make a character. The new system is not at all like this. You have to pick one of nine character classes. For example you can click on an icon of Luke Skywalker and you are a jedi. There is no such thing as mixed professions anymore. For example, I used to be a Teras Kasi Master and a Master Doc. In the NGE there is no Teras Kasi. I chose the new "medic" profession because I liked healing. I then was basically just informed how many "levels" my new "medic" had in light of my previous accomplishments. I was then told what abilities a medic of that level has.
The player community asked, begged, pleaded for the ability to customize our characters again, so SOE has been giving each new "profession" some options when they get to a certain level. Now you can choose one ability, or another, depending on which path of expertise you want to follow. There is some limited customization, but nothing like we had before, and you still cannot mix professions. If you are a jedi, you can choose between two different force powers for example when you are able to get expertise.
Another really big change is the way the game is actually played. There are essentially two control systems available to the player. One works a lot like a first person shooter game. You have to use your mouse to manually target enemies, and click either the left mouse button for a standard attack, or the right mouse button for one of many "special" attacks. This is a bit oversimplified because there are different ways to customize the manual targetting. I'm trying to avoid being even more confusing than necessary.
If you don't like the manual targetting, they restored a form of automatic targetting, once again after players asked and begged for a return of the game play we enjoyed. The new automatic system was very confusing to me. I kept needing to switch between manual and automatic to get things to work for me at first. Eventually I got a key set up to cause my charater to repeatedly do his standard attack, while I used f keys to launch specials. This felt a bit like the old style combat I used to enjoy, but not quite as intuitive.
Combat now is really over a lot faster than before. I could kill a Krayt dragon by myself for example in about 2 minutes. NPC's really die easily. There is much less time for strategy.
Weapons are looted with great ease and abundance, so crafting is much less necessary in the game at this point. I feel bad for crafters who make things that no one really needs anymore. Dancing or music buffs mainly either help crafting (already discussed) or help combat characters level up faster by giving them an xp boost. My Medic is level 90 (highest now) so I don't need a buff. I don't need to go to the cantinas anymore, and when I do, they are much emptier than they used to be.
Creature handler was deleted. People can call mounts again finally. But some people still stare at pets locked in their datapads that they can't call. All of the quests related to unlocking a jedi have been deleted. All force enhancements for those on the jedi path were also deleted. If you were a jedi, you're now an "elder jedi". They have a few perks, but many people mourn the loss of their custom jedi templates.
Lag is still a problem and so are bugs. Combat is more individual oriented than before, although there have been some recent changes made to try to bring back some level of player interdepdence. It's still not as interdependent as it was though. It seems that some people didn't want to "need" any other profession for anything, and that the NGE caters to that preference.
Some of my friends still play because it's star wars, and they've met nice people in the game. Most of my friends quit. Some return to check on the status periodically. I don't want to invest in a game again and experience so many losses again, so I keep myself and my time and money away from SOE. Hope that helps. If you try to play again, Ahazi has some great people on it. My old guild leaders started playing again, and they treat people very well. The guild is called CIA and the guild city is Crimson Island. Good luck and I hope you have fun in whatever game you choose
ARC3

This is a pretty good sum up of things

iskareot · January 2007

Originally posted by Obraik

Let's add some common sense statements to this TRUE yet sad explanation that is somewhat sugar coated in some senses but is yet true...
Arc is CORRECT in what was said... but there is no comment after them... this is what I THINK should be added to them or at least added for the "think about it a second concept".

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

Hi there Lai'ahna. The NGE is really a completely different game than the original SWG. It's very hard to explain how your old character might fit into the new system. For example we used to have skill points that you could put into different skills, and we used to see trainers to get our new abilities. We could put our points in many different areas and custom make a character. The new system is not at all like this. You have to pick one of nine character classes. For example you can click on an icon of Luke Skywalker and you are a jedi. There is no such thing as mixed professions anymore. For example, I used to be a Teras Kasi Master and a Master Doc. In the NGE there is no Teras Kasi. I chose the new "medic" profession because I liked healing. I then was basically just informed how many "levels" my new "medic" had in light of my previous accomplishments. I was then told what abilities a medic of that level has.
Yep it's different..(lol) Click and go prof, no real learning the game first..like we used to do - in this sense you just click and go -- instant Jedi, and level... you can die over and over and over and its without loss or penalty.. challenge is gone. ALSO you cannot just change classes freely if you do not like one.. in fact you have to pay and when I mean pay I mean alot of creds... ALTHOUGH the nice thing is that creds are now more useless and meaningless then before. Pretty much the work or effort needed to be anything has been deleted from the game... it is geared more for combat and combat only.. due to the botching and failure of getting out the crafting revamp on time, it seems that it was not important to do so. Crafting is no longer a major role in SWG and is not really needed at all to get by.   The game is easy with no loss or penalty in damage of equipment.
The player community asked, begged, pleaded for the ability to customize our characters again, so SOE has been giving each new "profession" some options when they get to a certain level. Now you can choose one ability, or another, depending on which path of expertise you want to follow. There is some limited customization, but nothing like we had before, and you still cannot mix professions. If you are a jedi, you can choose between two different force powers for example when you are able to get expertise.
Yes it's sad that the people that remained in the game after hundreds of thousands left it that, this talent point system was ripped off directly from WOW... the sad part is that it is still not the old way of being two things or three that you want.. in fact you still cannot choose to be what you want.. it is guided and and very structured. LET'S also not forget that the bugs are now more horried then ever, because due to the change on top of bad bugs such as PERMA AGGRO -- that's right imagine being stuck in aggro with your weapon for no reason at all until you log out, try to mount or fly out... somthing that simple yet somthing you never had to deal with before... and that's just one thing! There is countless others that are a joke and silly to even mention.   Now then again, if you use the concept or ask youself , "Why would I want less in a game that I once had more in??" Then you will join about 200k players if not more when you think that.
Another really big change is the way the game is actually played. There are essentially two control systems available to the player. One works a lot like a first person shooter game. You have to use your mouse to manually target enemies, and click either the left mouse button for a standard attack, or the right mouse button for one of many "special" attacks. This is a bit oversimplified because there are different ways to customize the manual targetting. I'm trying to avoid being even more confusing than necessary.
Yes it was a big change, bugged filled and horrid for a MMO engine that did not support this, hence why you see people move like Benny Hill on crack and the feel of your toon is no longer smooth with great animations... in fact you jerk and twitch like your smoking crack daily.    They tried to take a SIM MMO and make it like a ARCADE style multiplayer game.. you no longer need stratagy, it's how fast you click your best skill.. the UI is another story and blunder of SOE's that alone made alot of people just quit.   In short, the old way is gone.. they tried to make a make shift one of the target locking because more people complained then they have playing the game about getting the old way back.
See a pattern here?? Ask yourself "Why in the Hell are they adding things back in a bastardized version if the NGE was so great or the best idea in the first place?" , "Why are they trying to bring back things and spending the time doing so if the NGE did not need them from the start?"   "Why would people allow themselves to pay these people that just randomly jump from one bad idea to the next?" ------   Yeah we all asked these.

If you don't like the manual targetting, they restored a form of automatic targetting, once again after players asked and begged for a return of the game play we enjoyed. The new automatic system was very confusing to me. I kept needing to switch between manual and automatic to get things to work for me at first. Eventually I got a key set up to cause my charater to repeatedly do his standard attack, while I used f keys to launch specials. This felt a bit like the old style combat I used to enjoy, but not quite as intuitive.
Confusing... Yep, the real old way was one button -- TAB -- now it is a series of mistakes and clumsy controls that are still once again bastardized versions of what we once had. Again ask yourself "Why?" -- "Who in thier right mind would screw this up.. take it out, then bring it back in while messed up as it is??"   "This makes no sense you may think??" --- Again so did the masses and why we left.     They have spent more time trying to bring back crappy versions of what we once had because they realized WE LIKED IT AND ENJOYED IT after the fact.   This alone tells you how out of touch this staff is with this product.

Combat now is really over a lot faster than before. I could kill a Krayt dragon by myself for example in about 2 minutes. NPC's really die easily. There is much less time for strategy.
Yep, read the forums... there is no challenge and most people are tired of the PVE in the game... the only thing left is PVP which is fine.. but it's once again buggy -- so you PVP in a buggy game that is still ridden with lag and a bad feel.
Nothing is a challenge, you have no loss, no decay, so you can keep going forever and lose nothing... JUST like a Arcade game with no loss....the challenge is to simply loot somthing... you can also travel instantly and do anything anytime without worry or fear. Nothing will do you harm or really mess you up.. no real challenge at all.
Weapons are looted with great ease and abundance, so crafting is much less necessary in the game at this point. I feel bad for crafters who make things that no one really needs anymore. Dancing or music buffs mainly either help crafting (already discussed) or help combat characters level up faster by giving them an xp boost. My Medic is level 90 (highest now) so I don't need a buff. I don't need to go to the cantinas anymore, and when I do, they are much emptier than they used to be.
Sad...now you do not need to craft because these weapons are easy to get... you don't even need creds really.. you can actually go through the game without reading or working for creds like before... is this good??? Well, as you can see -- most people left the game. You do the math.
Cantinas are shot--- the Entertaining profession is useless and pretty much is just there... go ask that community what they think of the NGE... your answers will come.   Sad? Yep -- they once had purpose and could be different... could be two classes or all -- they could heal in party's or camps... BUT that is when you needed camps and healing... -- those are gone too... In fact, most things are gone.
Creature handler was deleted. People can call mounts again finally. But some people still stare at pets locked in their datapads that they can't call. All of the quests related to unlocking a jedi have been deleted. All force enhancements for those on the jedi path were also deleted. If you were a jedi, you're now an "elder jedi". They have a few perks, but many people mourn the loss of their custom jedi templates.
Like we said... most things are just gone.. alot of content was deleted and lost.   As you can see, most people left the game due to alot of just this... it's sad but true -- they made the game into Hello Kitty Online and expect people to follow like lemmings with anything they push on you.   In fact, now Jedi is such a shell of it's former self that it is no longer even the same remotely.   It is a joke to most that knew what it was like and the Elder status is somewhat of a joke as well.    They did ruin Jedi in this game... thats for sure.... JUST because somthing is free does not always make it good.
Lag is still a problem and so are bugs. Combat is more individual oriented than before, although there have been some recent changes made to try to bring back some level of player interdepdence. It's still not as interdependent as it was though. It seems that some people didn't want to "need" any other profession for anything, and that the NGE caters to that preference.
So yeah... after one year of the NGE version of SWG, there is still mega bugs and mega lag... ALSO they keep trying to bring back versions of what we once had in our pre-NGE version we all enjoyed.   It seems the NGE is sinlge minded and pretty much does not want you to think out of the box on what you should be or do.   In fact it does not allow you to be half as diverse as you once were.... good idea, take away being a individual and make you a lemming... (As you can see this did not work out for most).
Some of my friends still play because it's star wars, and they've met nice people in the game. Most of my friends quit. Some return to check on the status periodically. I don't want to invest in a game again and experience so many losses again, so I keep myself and my time and money away from SOE. Hope that helps. If you try to play again, Ahazi has some great people on it. My old guild leaders started playing again, and they treat people very well. The guild is called CIA and the guild city is Crimson Island. Good luck and I hope you have fun in whatever game you choose
So yes, there is people that play just because it's the only MMO that has a Star Wars label... some people pay them because they do not know any better or understand that there is better products out there.   Investing any time into this game now would be a mistake and is no longer even worth it.   SOE has made this game into a giant failure as you can find out on the web... not from us perse..
I would advise in poking your eyes with a toothpick first before you pay SOE or the game... ALSO as a vet odds are you have a free trial... most of us get sent these time to time now trying to get us back..
Last time I went back, I was stuck in aggro for 20 mins just standing still in Coronet ALONE.. I took screen shots and actually sent them to SOE and some Devs.... they are "working on it" -- but have been since launch of the NGE over a year ago.
In short this version of SWG is a failure and a mess, it is now known in the MMO community as WHAT NOT TO DO to a game or playerbase.   It has no future at all and is losing players faster then it's gaining them.
The game you may have once liked it gone... this is a ARCADE game with bad gameplay and no future.   The staff is a joke and the game is a wreck for most.
So yeah... DO YOUR RESEARCH and then choose.   Odds are you have some common sense and can see what it is really like without all the sugar coating.
(Sorry Arc) you did tell it like it is... but I added the harshness to it. He needed to see more of the real crap out there on it.
ARC3

This is a pretty good sum up of things

Thats scarey to see Obriak agree with this in any form lol...

ArcAngel3 · January 2007

Hey there Iskareot . Np re. what you added to my initial post. I think you really just added some of the emotions a lot of people feel when looking at the issues I was highlighting. You also do a good job of communicating how ugly some of the problems are and how bizarre the thinking behind the NGE seems to be. When I made my post I was in a helpful, mellow frame of mind and was sipping mint tea lol ^_^.

Come to think of it, I'm having another mint tea right now 0_o (starting to wonder if it has mood altering and addictive properties).

To the OP, as Iskareot seems to highlight, their is a lot of pain and frustration (maybe outrage is a better word) in the player community in response to SOE's style of dealing with people and the Star Wars game. There are pockets of health I suppose, and some players that are really decent still, in spite of the fact that they've been frankly abused, but there is a fair amount of grief and animosity present as well.

Some new players tell vets to stop whining and get over it, showing a real lack of understanding and empathy for all the losses and frustration. Some vets basically say that anyone who likes the NGE must have the intelligence of a bowl of fruit. SOE moderators also tend to delete and lock any forum posts that paint SOE or the NGE in a bad light. I don't want to generalize here though, many vets are very respectful of and helpful to new players, because they're people with class, and are able to keep their frustration focused on SOE. LIkewise some new players have understanding and empathy, and wish they could have seen SWG when it had so much more to it.

As for bugs. There are a number of threads highlighting them on the forums. You may want to check them out before paying for this product. A couple of months ago I copied a post that highlighted all known bugs and issues, and converted it into a word document. The document is 17 pages long, single spaced.

The bugs that were a real bother to me, that I posted about beginning in Nov/Dec 2005, are still in the game today. SOE has said that they're "working on" them. In my mind, after over a year, a medic's ability to target and resurrect a dead player should be working properly. Also, the new heals don't function if you are in auto-target mode. They used to heal enemies as well when they first came out, but at least they fixed that. Now they don't heal enemies or friends in auto-target mode, so once again you'd have to switch between auto and manual target modes repeatedly to get the game to work for you. I'd rather develop a hemorrhoid.

Now I'm feeling angry again lol, time for more mint tea -_^

ARC3

iskareot · January 2007

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

Hey there Iskareot . Np re. what you added to my initial post. I think you really just added some of the emotions a lot of people feel when looking at the issues I was highlighting. You also do a good job of communicating how ugly some of the problems are and how bizarre the thinking behind the NGE seems to be. When I made my post I was in a helpful, mellow frame of mind and was sipping mint tea lol ^_^.
Come to think of it, I'm having another mint tea right now 0_o (starting to wonder if it has mood altering and addictive properties).
To the OP, as Iskareot seems to highlight, their is a lot of pain and frustration (maybe outrage is a better word) in the player community in response to SOE's style of dealing with people and the Star Wars game. There are pockets of health I suppose, and some players that are really decent still, in spite of the fact that they've been frankly abused, but there is a fair amount of grief and animosity present as well.
Some new players tell vets to stop whining and get over it, showing a real lack of understanding and empathy for all the losses and frustration. Some vets basically say that anyone who likes the NGE must have the intelligence of a bowl of fruit. SOE moderators also tend to delete and lock any forum posts that paint SOE or the NGE in a bad light. I don't want to generalize here though, many vets are very respectful of and helpful to new players, because they're people with class, and are able to keep their frustration focused on SOE. LIkewise some new players have understanding and empathy, and wish they could have seen SWG when it had so much more to it.
As for bugs. There are a number of threads highlighting them on the forums. You may want to check them out before paying for this product. A couple of months ago I copied a post that highlighted all known bugs and issues, and converted it into a word document. The document is 17 pages long, single spaced.
The bugs that were a real bother to me, that I posted about beginning in Nov/Dec 2005, are still in the game today. SOE has said that they're "working on" them. In my mind, after over a year, a medic's ability to target and resurrect a dead player should be working properly. Also, the new heals don't function if you are in auto-target mode. They used to heal enemies as well when they first came out, but at least they fixed that. Now they don't heal enemies or friends in auto-target mode, so once again you'd have to switch between auto and manual target modes repeatedly to get the game to work for you. I'd rather develop a hemorrhoid.
Now I'm feeling angry again lol, time for more mint tea -_^
ARC3

Yeah man... like I said, your dead on and I did not hijack your post... it is smooth and calm. BUT I had to add some harshness to it so that this person can at least get the idea that there MIGHT BE SOMTHING WRONG WITH IT.

Lol....

Frustration is not even the word anymore, I think most went to "disgust".. I know I did.

I think I realized the mess this was going to be at the Summit meetings, when the crowd stood up and BOOED the devs damn near off the stage for what they did to Jedi -- I could tell this was going to get worse.

Then when only 15 or so people showed up at the San Francisco Summit meeting -- (about as much Devs that were there) I could see that the game was in trouble... 15 or so people????lol... At one time they had to turn people away from Fan Fests and WE HAD TO PAY... this was free with food... and people still said "Nope not worth it".. ---

I just think at this stage people need to (Like ARC did) tell them the truth... make sure they see the big picture on this product.. before they even waste the HD space on thier computer.

It's just not worth it.

(I still think the people that are left still playing actually do not know there is more polished products out there)... I just have to.

Obraik · January 2007

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

Hey there Iskareot . Np re. what you added to my initial post. I think you really just added some of the emotions a lot of people feel when looking at the issues I was highlighting. You also do a good job of communicating how ugly some of the problems are and how bizarre the thinking behind the NGE seems to be. When I made my post I was in a helpful, mellow frame of mind and was sipping mint tea lol ^_^.

He does? Heh, I'm thankful the forum people here added an ignore function to the forums, I'm testing it on Iskareot at the moment

Lai'Ahna · January 2007

Ok I went in and chose Bounty Hunter. I have lvl 54. No skills though. Can't find them either. I then went and made a new character on the server my friend is playing on. Took a while to figure out to get out of that trainee space port. When I did... OUCH! All you said is there. Terrible!

I stayed long enough to jerk move and run into stuff a while. Then had to leave as I just could not take any more.

ArcAngel3 · January 2007

Originally posted by Lai'Ahna

Ok I went in and chose Bounty Hunter. I have lvl 54. No skills though. Can't find them either. I then went and made a new character on the server my friend is playing on. Took a while to figure out to get out of that trainee space port. When I did... OUCH! All you said is there. Terrible! I stayed long enough to jerk move and run into stuff a while. Then had to leave as I just could not take any more.

Hey there Lai'Ahna. I've found myself having a lot of fun in City of Heroes, since leaving SWG. A lot of my guild-mates also made the same move. I like it because, well lol, it works . That's a big plus coming from SWG. There are very few bugs, and customer support if you do find a problem has really been excellent. In SWG I sent a bug report that an NPC (the sith commander) wouldn't follow me. About six months later I read a post saying that this had been corrected. That was waaay too late for me I'm afraid. I had the exact same problem in City of heroes once. I sent a ticket and got a response in 5 minutes 0_0. I couldn't believe it. The staff person then corrected the problem on the spot, and the NPC followed me to safety, ending the mission successfully. I was sure not used to that kind of helpfulness.

I also like City of Heroes because I was a TKM and Master Doc. My character build was really suited to combat with groups. The team combat in CoH is really exceptional. Professions are called "archtypes" and they are all very wonderfully complimentary of each other with regard to their powers, heals and buffs. I also like the fact that you never have to camp a spawn. All important mission areas are intanced, so you and your team can go in at anytime and enjoy. There are also a number of areas where many teams can work together to go after huge monsters and villains. Some archtypes can solo easily, others are better suited for team play.

For PvP there are designated zones that are very clearly marked. PVP zones have different themes to them. One has you complete a quest to unlock a missle strike. Villain players can harass you as you attempt to complete the quest. Another PvP zone has villains and heroes competing for bunkers that are portected by turrets. Still another allows you to take out bounties on villains in the same zone. You get paid when you take them out

The one down-side of CoH that I've heard, and felt to a small degree, is that the instanced missions can be repetative. This can be true if you do the same kind of mission over and over. One thing about CoH though, is that we get free content expansions on a fairly regular basis. They try to keep adding variety to the game through these, and I think they are successful. The latest content expansion for example now has heroes picking up new missions from police scanners . Once we complete a number of these, we get what's called a safe-guard mission. It's very different. We enter a zone, and have a set amount of time to prevent a bank robbery, a jail break, an arson attempt, a jewlery store robbery and random acts of vandalism lol. Every time you complete an objective, you get more time in the zone. It's big fun.

Also, like SWG used to have, there is a great opportunity to build a custom character. You can choose from many power sets in each archtype, and in each power set, you can choose any number of different power combinations. You can also customize your appearance completely. If you make a mistake in your character build, you can do a respec mission to make changes . Unlike SWG the respecs also actually work without bugs. I still remember the respec "gift" that SOE gave everyone. When you respeced, you started at level one, even if you had been a level 90. Nice gift lol. At first SOE said they couldn't restore levels, but I heard they eventually agreed to do this. I had a respec device, and that was also bugged. SOE provided a work around for the bug, but I never trusted it, so didn't use it.

Well that's my experience with CoH anyways. I've been playing it for about 10 months now. We've received 2 expansions in that time frame. Another friend of mine has had a great time playing Ryzom. She says that you can really customize your charater there too. Apparently the areas you can explore are really cool as well. I haven't tried it, but I've heard good things about it. So if you're looking for online fun, there are some neat options available I think. I hope you find something you enjoy

ARC3

Lai'Ahna · January 2007

Thank you everyone for your help.

My yacht and skills finally showed up. Items are also reappearing in my inventory now. I still can not access my things I left in banks. Nor my buildings terminals. I can drop and pick up items in them.

ArcAngel3 , CoH sounds fun. Is there player housing? How about non-combat professions? I love fluff too. Is there fluff in CoH? Thank you

iskareot · January 2007

We did the COH thing too, it was fun and makes good on what it is supposed to be. It delivers what it promises no doubt about it. It also is a smooth and polished product.

We liked it but we needed some more depth... so we did the WoW thing... at least I can fish and craft... and it is polished and busy-- very busy.. maybe too busy.

EvE is cool, deep and has some killer points to it, although no ground... grr.

None the less Since Obriak has blocked me I'm sure it's ok to say that he missed the boat on the common sense law of not buying somthing that is broken. I guess you just have to ask yourself what you will ALLOW yourself to tolerate.

That is what this comes down to now.

So since he blocked me I guess I can call him a "Boob" as well now lol...... or somthing along the lines of "I must be doing somthing right"... Oh Obriak how fun you are at times, how fun you are.

Man if you came to the summits they may have used tar and feathers on you though lol....

Hey if I was wrong about this product, it would be doing well... and people would be flocking to it... it would have great reviews, and a good rep.... Looks like I'm not far off the mark though lol.

ArcAngel3 · January 2007

Originally posted by Lai'Ahna

Thank you everyone for your help. My yacht and skills finally showed up. Items are also reappearing in my inventory now. I still can not access my things I left in banks. Nor my buildings terminals. I can drop and pick up items in them.

ArcAngel3 , CoH sounds fun. Is there player housing? How about non-combat professions? I love fluff too. Is there fluff in CoH? Thank you

There's no individual housing in CoH. Your supergroup (aka guild) gets to build its own base or batcave so to speak . You can customize it as you like. While doing hero missions you collect something called salvage. You need specific salvage pieces to be able to make certain things for your base. A base can have some functional things like teleporters to all the different game zones (like planets in SWG). Without the teleporters you need to take an L train like in Chicago lol. Within zones, travel is by using superpowers like fly, self-teleport, or superjump. You leap tall buildings in a single bound . You can also make decorations for your base, and have many different rooms with different themes. There are statues and plants, furniture etc. We did our base like an ancient temple or something for a while, but now have a more space age look. Other functional items in our base include a temporary buff (called inspirations) vending machine, and some clone tubes. We also have storage containers filled with power enhancements and bits of salvage.

In addition to crafting things for your base, salvage can also be used to create temporary power enhancements for yourself. If I can find the right salvage, I can make myself resistant to hold powers for an hour for example.

Other "fluff" would be going to the tailor for a makeover. As you progress in the game you unlock new costume slots, so that you can create a number of different outfits for yourself. In the next free expansion, there are plans to include salvage that will allow us to custom make our own costume pieces. That should be fun.

As for other fluff, this game doesn't really have anything like the old SWG camping or fishing. I used to love SWG for camping, fishing and for playing the horn in the cantina. I was a Master Musician for a loong time before focusing on combat in SWG. There really isn't anything comparable to being an entertainer in CoH. My friend says that Ryzom has more of that kind of thing. People say that WoW has non-combat stuff also, but I don't know anything about WoW really. I might have tried it, but I like the Super hero genre better, and most of my SWG guild friends didn't want to become elves or something like that lol

Anyways, if you want the base building, power crafting code for CoH, you need to buy the good versus evil edition. The original game didn't have it. City of Villains has the base features also. If you get the good versus evil edition, you can create and play heroes or villains and build bases for both, so that's what I'd recommend. I've read on forums that EVE also has some interesting fluff, but haven't tried that either.

Hope that's useful info.. Gives you some options anyways . If you figure out the new SWG stuff though, and have friends there, and find yourself enjoying it, don't feel guilty ok? lol -_^. I'd just advise that you try to avoid getting too attached to things in that game, cuz you never know when SOE might wreck it either by design or by accident.

ARC3

Lai'Ahna · January 2007

ArcAngel3, Thanks so much! I will look into CoH soon then. Yes I do not plan on becoming to attached to anything in SWG. I am only back there for my friend. I am not at all pleased with the way they took away our characters customization of professions.

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