Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Character customization
Chrysos
Member Posts: 77
I wonder how much dev time and money is put into making customer customization possible. Personally I don't get it. Outside of the time you spend creating your character and the time game reviewers spend waxing lyrical about it what is the use of having 4 different things you can change to your cheeks (see the 2007 CES Conan preview).
You recognize people in game from the name above their head not because their nose is slightly wider than the other dwarfs. I want to try to be unique in game as well but it seems to me that that is better achieved by being able to get distictive clothing and gear. Be honest how many times has anybody actually looked closely enough at another characters face to notice the subtle adjustements they made during character creation, those times that the face isn't obscured by some form of headwear anyway.
I support Belgiums efforts to get noticed ... at all.
Comments
Well I for one " dont like when every one looks the same"
I do notice when people have made some work on there faces, I for one can sit and adjust my char in hours to get
that perfect feel this is me in this game !
love mmorpgs, Frag Dolls
Having limited customisation options to my character's look is a turn off to me, which plays a part in why MMO's other then SWG have little attraction to me. I like how in SWG you can see hundreds, and even thousands, of different characters and each one will have a different look about them - heh people even OCD over it all and make near perfect replica's of their RL looks. The game also has thousands of different clothing and armour colour combinations so even when you can't see your character's face under the armour, you can still make them unique within a crowd (yes, insert that dig here :P)
Of course, appearance customisation appeal of a game wouldn't be enough on it's own to make me want to play it. I would need to find the game fun to play as well
As far as why customization is important, I think it's primarily a western trait. Individualism (albeit individualism that fits in with everyone else, more often than not) is highly prized by western society. Most of America is strongly against school uniforms, and we've made cosmetics a multi-billion dollar industry. We want to determine for ourselves exactly who and what we are, and it's no surprise that desire is carried into video games; on the contrary- in a world based on living vicariously through your character, it seems almost mandatory that the pixels representing you actually do represent you.
It's worth pointing out that this is not a trait typically shared by eastern cultures, most of which seem to stress the "community" concept over the "individual" concept. That's one of the reasons customization tends to be so rudimentary in every Korean and Japanese game on the market; Korean and Japanese gamers don't place a high value on it, so Korean and Japanese game designers focus on elements that their market does value. I mention this for a couple of reasons: one, to point out that there are multiple valid perspectives on the issue, and two, to point out that there are numerous alternatives if you prefer games without detailed customization.
With regard to the idea that the desire for character customization is somehow based on other players noticing the location of certain pixels, I'd say that's really a small part of it. When I get dressed and put on my makeup in the morning, I'm doing it because I want to like the way I look, not because I care what other people think. When I get dressed for a night on the town, I do it because I want to feel sexy, not because I want to have sex. In a video game, the more control I have over the pixels that represent me, the more connected I feel to them. While things like gameplay and performance are also concerns of mine, there's simply no denying that character customization is a huge deal for me. I frequently choose a character race based on the way it looks rather than the way it plays. That's just how I am.
The fact that games like "Star Wars: Galaxies," "City of Heroes/Villains," and the upcoming "Hero's Journey," among others, have chosen to dedicate resources to detailed character customization shows that at least some market research has indicated it to be a priority for a respectable percentage of players (or potential players). Even games with a heavy pvp focus like Dark Age of Camelot have relatively detailed customization in them; while it would certainly be easier on bandwidth to use limited character models during large realm versus realm battles, they chose to provide players with numerous appearance options. That is not something they would've done if it weren't perceived as important to their playerbase.
Anyway, to sum up: when I look at my character, I want to see an individual- an individual that I'd like to be. I don't want to see a clone. The more unique to me that my character is, the more connected to the game I'll feel. The more connected to the game I feel, the longer I'll likely play it. I don't want to feel like one of the nameless, faceless masses. I don't want to feel like a cog in the machine, even if that's exactly what I am. MMOs are all about the illusion of being someone else, being somewhere else. The second you see SkippyTheWonderMuffin jog past with a face exactly like yours, all suspension of disbelief is chucked out the window.
love mmorpgs, Frag Dolls
Well.. quite simply, it's a mmo, and by that nature, some customization, I think, is needed. Yeah, there's the names above the heads generally.. but taking WoW as the first example that comes to mind, if you go to Stormwind, there is no way you're going to be able to keep track of all the people, and may have trouble keeping track of just one, just due to the amount of people there. In such cases, if you're looking for your friend, it's much easier to look for the "gnome with the pink hair in Leia buns and purple robes" than trying to strain your eyes for a certain name in the crowd.
Secondly.. and yeah, this may come across as a shallow answer, but the truth of it is, it's fun for lots of people. When I got a hold of WoW, one of the first things I did was go through the different character types and customizations. It's fun to see what you can come up with. There are some games that I would play/demo if only for the character creator, and I know I have a couple of friends that would do the same.
I will say this much though... the large number of people..generally males.. who pick the elf/catperson/etc female and have them running around in almost nothing? It's got to be said.. that's kind of creepy and sad. I'll admit, especially as the tech goes on, there's some good-looking models and such out there... but to be lusting over a game character? IT'S JUST PIXELS, PEOPLE. (Sorry, bit of a rant.. but it has to be said.
)
To some point, that level of detail you are describing (4 ways to tweek your cheeks, face I hope) is sort of on a "feel good" level. Honestly after many years of MMOing, no one really ever looks at that. You pick out your friends by distinguishing major characteristics / coloration or name labels not by face in MMO's. (Not unless you have a 50+ inch screen display
) But because these are rooted in RPG's we are creating an alternate persona and generally want to be able to make it look the way we want. Sort of like how we look in the mirror, we like to look at our avatars and identify with it as an individual avatar.
Realistically, is it important to gameplay.....its arguable but overall I would say no. A crappy game doesn't get any better with great customization. Take SWG for example. Now I don't dislike the game but a great many people who post here do. Many will say the game is garbage. (I won't) SWG offers one of the BEST in terms of customization but it hasn't kept or brought back a large portion of the older players. Similar situation goes for CoX, I don't think there is a game out there that does it better but again, we don't see an overwhelming amount of subs out there. (although a respectible amount and a decent game)
Now take WoW which has very limited character customization in terms of the actual avatar: millions of subs...so is it all that important? I would say its in the top 10 but definitally not number 1. Quality in gameplay / performance is ALWAYS going to come out on top.
Other then that, its more important to some then others. Its a matter of taste. I like a fair amount of customization. WoW feels very limited and cookie cutter (sort of on level with L2) at creation. Vanguard/SWG was a bit to much: do I really need to customize my lower jaw? Thats over detaily bubblegum to me. I am far more interested in customizing the characters body and stature then anything else. Fat / skinny / tall / short / muscular / lean / pot belly....this is generally over looked by most customization toolsets. The face is only part of it.
When was the last time you saw a short, fat, pot bellied, bald mage in a game?
Actually AoC's character creation screen has a slider or two for the... other cheeks as well
. It has enough options for the entire body that you can make a truly disgustingly ugly fat slob for a character if you wish, sort of an upright Jabba the Hutt, although with an IP like Conan, I suspect most will go for either heavily muscular types or exceptionally skinny ones.
As to high levels of detail in the face, while each little bit won't make much of a difference, with the graphics in question you will be able to see and take note of those features.
Edit: for an example, I scaled down some of the character pics to be a little closer to what you would see ingame. Its essentially the same character every time, with only a few sliders adjustments in between them.
No man is an island, entire of itself; every man is a piece of the continent, a part of the main. any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in mankind, and therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee.
Hemingway
probably my reason for picking up CoH/CoV is character creation. u walk around Paragon City, seeing unique toons(toon is the term for character in CoH/CoV) left and right! its awesome!
But, one thing i have to add, is that i get a lil bored of my character seeing him for 50 lvls. yes u can do costume changes, but that costs ALOT of money, and u cant rly do it until ur a rly high lvl, OR have alot of money with another toon. but still, its nice.
But wat i'd REALLY like too see in an MMO, is AWESOME character creation in the beggining, but ALSO throughout the game. im not sure how u can keep ur character looking unique while getting armor everyone else can buy but....i think im getting an idea. i think ill post a new thread.
I hope MMO devs read all these threads and realize how much a players character is important.
^^
I agree with the OP. Facial customizations really don't affect the actual character customization/indivuduality in a game. The real customizations are Hair, Body Proportions, and... Large facial structures like the post above mine shows (Even these go unnoticed alot)
If the time taken to rig and create the cheek bone differences was put into different shirt styles end-game; it would go alot further.
I just want to add... nah, i think everything was explained in the post above.
I am the type of player where I like to do everything and anything from time to time.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holodomor - pre-WW2 genocide.
Good topic, I hope dev's listen to this and take it to heart.
Character customization is important to a lot of people. Sometimes people want to roll play a little and try to imagine they are their favorite anime toon or maybe some action hero.. It's the small things like that, that can change someones perspective on the MMO and turn even a grinder into a cool and fun experience.
Most european/NA players don't need the micro detail setting like chin size or what color nose hairs your toon has.. BUT, there has to be the ability to replicate to some degree the image you are trying to achieve.
I guess it's like adding spices and seasoning to a good meal. Do you need them, no, but it makes the experience that much better.
I don't think devs are spending thier time wisely with all the controls they have in character customization. The actual character customization thing actually causes several adverse effects in development.
First every detail that can be manipulated has to be rigged for every head, limiting the amount of different heads plausible and wasting development resources.
Second the actual detail possible gets washed out a little from all the manipulation. There are several customizations that could cause unwanted effects like texture stretching.
Third all the facial bones and manipulators, or morph targets added will cause a performance hit.
I think a much better solution is to use the option method like choose from 8 base heads, each base head has different options for brow, cheek, Jaw, and nose that affects the actual model; or is simply a replacement of the head. This way each option can be fine tuned to work well, and it drops the need for the additional bones. Lastly it adds in a layer for texture/normal maps that go ontop of the original texture for different facial features.
Then place alot more resources in Armor/Clothing, hair, and body proportion variety.
Seriously, as videogames become more lifelike, we can only expect this sort of thing.
Now excuse me while I roll a blood elf...
First of all, Great Post!
I just want to say something about the comparison between ocidental players and oriental players, as much as i believe there is a big difference between them.
Ocidental players (Like me) really look further for customization: We want the illusion of living another life (Most of us, not everybody, of course, that would be too much to say everybody thinks like this), we want to feel an exciting world, controling "Ourselves" dressed up like Knights, Mages... Jedis (Why not?). We need that because our social life is poor. Wait, im not saying we do not have a social life, well, i believe we have even more than oriental maybe, but our relations are poor.
Oriental players wants only to socialize, and it doesn't matter if they look just equal. They play differently (They also want an illusion, but not of not being who they are, but of owning things, they own their characters, and want them to get strong), but at the end, we are all mmorpg addicted people.
Ocidental or oriental, we want to escape from a constant torture, and this is real life. You cant escape from the fact that Mmorpg addicted people, do prefer to hang out with their online friends. There are obviously the not addicted players, but i do not believe they feel the Mmorpg thing as much as we do, they are important, of course, but we live it to the very end.
My hopes on mmorpgs? Only one, that developers can make Mmorpgs more and more to help us, the addicteds (we will continue to be addicted anyway), to have important subjective experiences while we play. And that mean, to go even further on playing, not to have fun, but to live.
This is my opinion, and i do not intend to be speaking the truth. Im only blablablaing... ^^
Spes Messis In Semine
every little bit counts, and there isnt really any harm in devs spending a day more in giving more customization options.
CoH had great customization, and so did DDO,
besides devs can always put a auto-orient button to assign the same model for all those who want it like that
With the jumps in technology today, no it doesn't "harm" so much now a days but 5 years ago when most of these games that are live now where developed it was a big concern.
Alot of trade offs had to be made. There is a reason something like Lineage II had very limited customization. It was for performance. Remember, that game was developed a long time ago in MMO land. (its been live 4 yrs, 3 in NA) System requirements where intentinally kept low and customization kept to a minimum not because of the moronic babbling about Asians not wanting to be "individuals" you read here but simply because of this. Mass combat. You had to be able to put hundreds of character models on screen at the same time during a siege. If you had an overly detailed level of customization, PC's of the day would have melted down into piles of ash. They traded the detailed customization for performance. It was a logical choice that paid off for them in the long run. Its the same choice Blizzard made with WoW, very low system requirements and almost zero in real character customization at creation.
Today thats not so much an issue as it was say as little as 5 years ago. The next generation of games we are more then likely going to be able have our cake and eat it to when it comes to customization. You can see a very high level of customization in most of the newer games and its really just going to become a standard in the next 2 years. Its going to be a non-issue no matter where the game is from.