That's a very nice concept, Mythic is very much capable of making PVP work (DAoC is/was a very good MMO). Also very nice is that this system encourages new players/characters to be part of the whole PVP experience. The only downside (for me) is the fact that the graphics are very WOW/cartoonish which might be in style with the whole Warhammer thing, but I don't have to like it. I'd rather see something more 'realistic'.
It looks out to be a refreshing gameplay though and I hope they won't go for the full WOW clone/copy when it comes to graphic and game mechanics. DAoC had a lot of variables, it was quite easy to NOT do things right and people who had some 'skill' and put thought into their character (gear, fighting, teamwork) really had an advantage. I hope this will be the case again. If the gameplay is good, PVE and PVP/RVR are nicely done and the graphics aren't TOO Gamecube-like I'll probably be hooked on this one.
That's a very nice concept, Mythic is very much capable of making PVP work (DAoC is/was a very good MMO). Also very nice is that this system encourages new players/characters to be part of the whole PVP experience. The only downside (for me) is the fact that the graphics are very WOW/cartoonish which might be in style with the whole Warhammer thing, but I don't have to like it. I'd rather see something more 'realistic'. It looks out to be a refreshing gameplay though and I hope they won't go for the full WOW clone/copy when it comes to graphic and game mechanics. DAoC had a lot of variables, it was quite easy to NOT do things right and people who had some 'skill' and put thought into their character (gear, fighting, teamwork) really had an advantage. I hope this will be the case again. If the gameplay is good, PVE and PVP/RVR are nicely done and the graphics aren't TOO Gamecube-like I'll probably be hooked on this one.
DAoC pvp was horrible you stun/crowd control everyone and type /assist or /target name and they were horrible at balancing. The RvR was great. Now If they take the great RvR add WoW class balance and combat you get an awsome game.
-- "Any free people have the right to choose how it wants to be govern thats the essence of democracy. It's sad when America has chosen for the stability and consistency of a dictatorship and doing it democratically" -utnow
Talk MMO jive all you want, whether or not you like this game will depend of its bottom line concept: the Games Workshop version of Warhammer.
I'm confused.
What do you mean by "the Games Workshop version of Warhammer".
What's the other version of Warhammer? It is a 20+ years old franchise created by Games Workshop and I would be very surprised if any other publisher not licensed by Games Workshop could legally create any sort of Warhammer game.
Back when Blizzard starting copying the Warhammer World for their Warcraft franchise there even was a legal action taken by Games Workshop. That ended in a compromise though and was as far as I remember eventually settled out of court.
That's a very nice concept, Mythic is very much capable of making PVP work (DAoC is/was a very good MMO). Also very nice is that this system encourages new players/characters to be part of the whole PVP experience. The only downside (for me) is the fact that the graphics are very WOW/cartoonish which might be in style with the whole Warhammer thing, but I don't have to like it. I'd rather see something more 'realistic'. It looks out to be a refreshing gameplay though and I hope they won't go for the full WOW clone/copy when it comes to graphic and game mechanics. DAoC had a lot of variables, it was quite easy to NOT do things right and people who had some 'skill' and put thought into their character (gear, fighting, teamwork) really had an advantage. I hope this will be the case again. If the gameplay is good, PVE and PVP/RVR are nicely done and the graphics aren't TOO Gamecube-like I'll probably be hooked on this one.
DAoC pvp was horrible you stun/crowd control everyone and type /assist or /target name and they were horrible at balancing. The RvR was great. Now If they take the great RvR add WoW class balance and combat you get an awsome game.
Balancing isn't the greatest thing in the world, people should stop thinking like that. If everything is equal, everything works similarly well, what's my incentive to try something? The mere fact that classes/realms had some edge over another meant that you would play different characters, different realms and thus keep you leveling and playing.
First Crybernia was OP so everyone hops there, then Midgard rules with their "honestly, we got nerfed we didn't do too much damage" Zerkers. So, everyone goes there. Back and forth, all the time. BECAUSE of that the game stays interesting, it changes and you can/will have emotions over certain things/classes/topics. Balancing just means that things are boring, bland and essentially make the game not worth investing time in.
Yes, stun nukers were OP, bombing was mad but at least it took some thinking and skill, the fight mechanics were very nicely done, people who put in effort clearly had an advantage. VN being filled with hatred towards the other realms, animosity towards other's classes/playstyles is the BEST THING THAT EVER COULD HAPPEN as it pulled you into the game. There is nothing more boring than things which don't require effort/thought and where you're unable to go wrong or make mistakes whatever stupid deciision you take (aka balancing).
Mind you, for the most part of my 5 year DAoC 'career' I was with the zerg so I've been on the receiving end mostly hehe. Yet the fact that Hib and Midgard (which ALWAYS seemed to have at least one very OP class at any time) had a clear advantage didn't make the game less interesting for me. Albs had the numerical advantage and (therefore?) Hib&Mid had a class advantage. Not balanced but interesting and fun.
Mythic did a whole lot more good than the crybabies on VN gave them credit for, even now after having played a zillion other MMO's I still fidn that DAoC had a lot of things spot on, it's just that at that time we didn't realise it.
That's a very nice concept, Mythic is very much capable of making PVP work (DAoC is/was a very good MMO). Also very nice is that this system encourages new players/characters to be part of the whole PVP experience. The only downside (for me) is the fact that the graphics are very WOW/cartoonish which might be in style with the whole Warhammer thing, but I don't have to like it. I'd rather see something more 'realistic'. It looks out to be a refreshing gameplay though and I hope they won't go for the full WOW clone/copy when it comes to graphic and game mechanics. DAoC had a lot of variables, it was quite easy to NOT do things right and people who had some 'skill' and put thought into their character (gear, fighting, teamwork) really had an advantage. I hope this will be the case again. If the gameplay is good, PVE and PVP/RVR are nicely done and the graphics aren't TOO Gamecube-like I'll probably be hooked on this one.
DAoC pvp was horrible you stun/crowd control everyone and type /assist or /target name and they were horrible at balancing. The RvR was great. Now If they take the great RvR add WoW class balance and combat you get an awsome game.
Yea nothing like being stunned or frozen an entire fight in WoW while someone beats ya to death with no chance of the CC being removed. And WoW has /assist and /target also. DaOC classes might not be totally balanced given there are like 38 of them but WoW classes are so unbalnced its just sad considerin there are so few of them.
WoW pvp continues to be the weakest part of that game while DaOC RvR and combat far exceeds it.
got a question here. When do you show the part for us pvp lovers? All i saw on that video clip was something about tiers and zones and when i woke up the same guy was telling that if you manage to capture enemy hq, you will lose it, no matter what you do.
Pretty intresting concept; I do like how players at any level can contribute too.
A couple things come to mind though; First of all, are they implementing any systems to stop higher level players from jumping down a tier? Even if they didn't recieve victory points, a few higher level characters in the first tier could keep the other side from gaining any there too.
I also have to wonder how you are going to be able to interact with the rest of the world, and whether or not you can travel and help out diffrent races in thier battles.
Yea nothing like being stunned or frozen an entire fight in WoW while someone beats ya to death with no chance of the CC being removed. And WoW has /assist and /target also. DaOC classes might not be totally balanced given there are like 38 of them but WoW classes are so unbalnced its just sad considerin there are so few of them. WoW pvp continues to be the weakest part of that game while DaOC RvR and combat far exceeds it.
You couldn't assist in WoW becuase almost every class had an AoE fear or some form of escaping an assist train(example: ice block).
I'll need to play DAoC again to comment further on it but there was some classes completly destroyed in pvp.
In Warhammer Online there going to be umm 24 classes if there 4 classes per race. So we can only hope that every class can kick ass or you'll get to end game to find out your class sucks and wasted months of leveling.
-- "Any free people have the right to choose how it wants to be govern thats the essence of democracy. It's sad when America has chosen for the stability and consistency of a dictatorship and doing it democratically" -utnow
will this game have open pvp or is it all zoned instanced equal groups capture the flag minigames? will there be any kind of persistency? can you permanently conquer an enemy zone, territory or base?
What happens if the enemy captured your Tier 1? I mean I know the zone is controlled by them, but how do the newbies level if the zone is under enemy's control?
What happens if the enemy captured your Tier 1? I mean I know the zone is controlled by them, but how do the newbies level if the zone is under enemy's control?
Well you level up on PVE or PVP, they can't come into your PVE zone, so it makes sense that you can still level up on both.
got a question here. When do you show the part for us pvp lovers? All i saw on that video clip was something about tiers and zones and when i woke up the same guy was telling that if you manage to capture enemy hq, you will lose it, no matter what you do.
First of all that video was about the RvR aspects of the game and explaining how they worked that was what the tier and zones bit was about. And yes you do lose your Enermys HQ eventually but this is just so the enermy can continue to have fun and you can always take it back again after all.
You see with RvR every PvP victory contributes towards your Races overall zone rating which gets you closer to sacking the enermys city.
What happens if the enemy captured your Tier 1? I mean I know the zone is controlled by them, but how do the newbies level if the zone is under enemy's control?
If you watch the video at the begining it explains that in each Tier there are 2 types of zones PvE and RvR.
PvE - zones can only be acced by the owning races race and it is basically a PvE leveling zone even if your enermy has won that zone they still cant access the PvE areas.
RvR - these zones can be accessed by anyone and PvP here is non consential and brutal and all kills inthis zone contribute towards yuor races overall tier rating so you could wrestle controll back to your own races.
For example enermy has control of tier 3. To deny the enermy access to tier 4 everyone goes to tier 1 and kills newbs and gets controll of that zone somehow therefore denying access to level 2 and 3 by default.
I have to say i really like the way this games RvR content is going and being a fan of warhammer tabletop im very happy now all i need is for my favourate race to be represented.
will this game have open pvp or is it all zoned instanced equal groups capture the flag minigames? will there be any kind of persistency? can you permanently conquer an enemy zone, territory or base?
Ok ssstupido don't really know yet, but i'm going to take an educated guess and say the pvp is going to be instanced. Just from the way the map is set up, and from the way it has been explained that if you are of the opposeing faction you can't enter the enemy's zone.
I seriously doubt that it will have pvp capture the flag games, but there will be RvR quests for each side. Each RvR instance in each teir will i'm assumeing be persistant and sides do not have to be equal. You can conquer the enemy capital city for a certain amount of time, then it is given back to them at some point and you'd have to capture it again. Probably like after a week or something like that maybe more. Not sure if anything really happens if you cap a zone, but from the video doesn't seem like much happens from it.
I know! This game WILL be awesome! I am 100% sure for once. Flame me all you want I know I'm right
$OE lies list http://www.rlmmo.com/viewtopic.php?t=424&start=0 " And I don't want to hear anything about "I don't believe in vampires" because *I* don't believe in vampires, but I believe in my own two eyes, and what *I* saw is ******* vampires! "
will this game have open pvp or is it all zoned instanced equal groups capture the flag minigames? will there be any kind of persistency? can you permanently conquer an enemy zone, territory or base?
This all sounds good, but i think we're all thinking of seeing 80+ players fighting at the gates of a city, but in reality I dont think it will be this mad all of the time, take WoW as an example theres some PvP objectives in the expanison, in 1 zone every 6 hours 5 towers become capturable, I was in the zone when this happened so I hopped on to my mount and road to the nearest tower expecting a nice fight (good old world PvP before BG's), got there I saw 2 horde (im alliance), thought ok this just started Im sure loads will turn up soon. The most I saw were 5 horde riding to each tower and clearing out the 1 or 2 alliance there, this zone would of had 100's of players in it.
In comparison an instanced battle ground like alteric valley 40v40 battle is so much more fun (before blizz made it eazy mode and each side gnore each other), the good old AV match could last hours, even days.
so where is every 1.
Too busy leveling
Not realy sure what the objective was
Carebears
Dont like World PvP
Other
What Im trying to say is, will world/none instanced PvP work? Even if WAR is designed around PvP will players want to contribute, the biggest let down I will see if I go to a T1 town and see just a handful of guys.
How are mythic goona convince ppl to put down there quest log and join in the battles?
"How are mythic goona convince ppl to put down there quest log and join in the battles?"
Did you even watch the video? as he said you will progress faster if you use both pvp and pve, i believe that's reason enough for most players to go battle.
What he didn't mention is what you gain/loose by taking over those areas.. if there's no loss or gain this will be as carebear and uninspiring as WoW is.
Comments
That's a very nice concept, Mythic is very much capable of making PVP work (DAoC is/was a very good MMO). Also very nice is that this system encourages new players/characters to be part of the whole PVP experience. The only downside (for me) is the fact that the graphics are very WOW/cartoonish which might be in style with the whole Warhammer thing, but I don't have to like it. I'd rather see something more 'realistic'.
It looks out to be a refreshing gameplay though and I hope they won't go for the full WOW clone/copy when it comes to graphic and game mechanics. DAoC had a lot of variables, it was quite easy to NOT do things right and people who had some 'skill' and put thought into their character (gear, fighting, teamwork) really had an advantage. I hope this will be the case again. If the gameplay is good, PVE and PVP/RVR are nicely done and the graphics aren't TOO Gamecube-like I'll probably be hooked on this one.
--
"Any free people have the right to choose how it wants to be govern thats the essence of democracy. It's sad when America has chosen for the stability and consistency of a dictatorship and doing it democratically" -utnow
What do you mean by "the Games Workshop version of Warhammer".
What's the other version of Warhammer? It is a 20+ years old franchise created by Games Workshop and I would be very surprised if any other publisher not licensed by Games Workshop could legally create any sort of Warhammer game.
Back when Blizzard starting copying the Warhammer World for their Warcraft franchise there even was a legal action taken by Games Workshop. That ended in a compromise though and was as far as I remember eventually settled out of court.
It's no good coming to our game if you want to make pants...
It's only worth coming to our game if you want to burn things to the ground,
grind things to dust, standing on top of the battlements waving severed heads
at people going "We're better than you" in lots of glorious ways."
*wipes away a tear*
God bless you, sir. God bless you.
_________________
The above post is purely my opinion. If you disagree, that's your right. However, don't be an ass about it.
Balancing isn't the greatest thing in the world, people should stop thinking like that. If everything is equal, everything works similarly well, what's my incentive to try something? The mere fact that classes/realms had some edge over another meant that you would play different characters, different realms and thus keep you leveling and playing.
First Crybernia was OP so everyone hops there, then Midgard rules with their "honestly, we got nerfed we didn't do too much damage" Zerkers. So, everyone goes there. Back and forth, all the time. BECAUSE of that the game stays interesting, it changes and you can/will have emotions over certain things/classes/topics. Balancing just means that things are boring, bland and essentially make the game not worth investing time in.
Yes, stun nukers were OP, bombing was mad but at least it took some thinking and skill, the fight mechanics were very nicely done, people who put in effort clearly had an advantage. VN being filled with hatred towards the other realms, animosity towards other's classes/playstyles is the BEST THING THAT EVER COULD HAPPEN as it pulled you into the game. There is nothing more boring than things which don't require effort/thought and where you're unable to go wrong or make mistakes whatever stupid deciision you take (aka balancing).
Mind you, for the most part of my 5 year DAoC 'career' I was with the zerg so I've been on the receiving end mostly hehe. Yet the fact that Hib and Midgard (which ALWAYS seemed to have at least one very OP class at any time) had a clear advantage didn't make the game less interesting for me. Albs had the numerical advantage and (therefore?) Hib&Mid had a class advantage. Not balanced but interesting and fun.
Mythic did a whole lot more good than the crybabies on VN gave them credit for, even now after having played a zillion other MMO's I still fidn that DAoC had a lot of things spot on, it's just that at that time we didn't realise it.
Yea nothing like being stunned or frozen an entire fight in WoW while someone beats ya to death with no chance of the CC being removed. And WoW has /assist and /target also. DaOC classes might not be totally balanced given there are like 38 of them but WoW classes are so unbalnced its just sad considerin there are so few of them.
WoW pvp continues to be the weakest part of that game while DaOC RvR and combat far exceeds it.
John P Cooper
A couple things come to mind though; First of all, are they implementing any systems to stop higher level players from jumping down a tier? Even if they didn't recieve victory points, a few higher level characters in the first tier could keep the other side from gaining any there too.
I also have to wonder how you are going to be able to interact with the rest of the world, and whether or not you can travel and help out diffrent races in thier battles.
I'll need to play DAoC again to comment further on it but there was some classes completly destroyed in pvp.
In Warhammer Online there going to be umm 24 classes if there 4 classes per race. So we can only hope that every class can kick ass or you'll get to end game to find out your class sucks and wasted months of leveling.
--
"Any free people have the right to choose how it wants to be govern thats the essence of democracy. It's sad when America has chosen for the stability and consistency of a dictatorship and doing it democratically" -utnow
that was not real PVP son
i hope i dont have to explain that to you in detail
War hammer will "definitely" beat WoW to death as far as the gameplay goes.
But there will be enough idiot still playing WoW for a long time, so the numbers won't voucher for it.
What deserves to be done, deserves to be "well" done...
First of all that video was about the RvR aspects of the game and explaining how they worked that was what the tier and zones bit was about. And yes you do lose your Enermys HQ eventually but this is just so the enermy can continue to have fun and you can always take it back again after all.
You see with RvR every PvP victory contributes towards your Races overall zone rating which gets you closer to sacking the enermys city.
If you watch the video at the begining it explains that in each Tier there are 2 types of zones PvE and RvR.
PvE - zones can only be acced by the owning races race and it is basically a PvE leveling zone even if your enermy has won that zone they still cant access the PvE areas.
RvR - these zones can be accessed by anyone and PvP here is non consential and brutal and all kills inthis zone contribute towards yuor races overall tier rating so you could wrestle controll back to your own races.
For example enermy has control of tier 3. To deny the enermy access to tier 4 everyone goes to tier 1 and kills newbs and gets controll of that zone somehow therefore denying access to level 2 and 3 by default.
I seriously doubt that it will have pvp capture the flag games, but there will be RvR quests for each side. Each RvR instance in each teir will i'm assumeing be persistant and sides do not have to be equal. You can conquer the enemy capital city for a certain amount of time, then it is given back to them at some point and you'd have to capture it again. Probably like after a week or something like that maybe more. Not sure if anything really happens if you cap a zone, but from the video doesn't seem like much happens from it.
I know! This game WILL be awesome! I am 100% sure for once. Flame me all you want I know I'm right
$OE lies list
http://www.rlmmo.com/viewtopic.php?t=424&start=0
"
And I don't want to hear anything about "I don't believe in vampires" because *I* don't believe in vampires, but I believe in my own two eyes, and what *I* saw is ******* vampires! "
Far as i know a mix of both.
Put your WoW hater hats down for a second
This all sounds good, but i think we're all thinking of seeing 80+ players fighting at the gates of a city, but in reality I dont think it will be this mad all of the time, take WoW as an example theres some PvP objectives in the expanison, in 1 zone every 6 hours 5 towers become capturable, I was in the zone when this happened so I hopped on to my mount and road to the nearest tower expecting a nice fight (good old world PvP before BG's), got there I saw 2 horde (im alliance), thought ok this just started Im sure loads will turn up soon. The most I saw were 5 horde riding to each tower and clearing out the 1 or 2 alliance there, this zone would of had 100's of players in it.
In comparison an instanced battle ground like alteric valley 40v40 battle is so much more fun (before blizz made it eazy mode and each side gnore each other), the good old AV match could last hours, even days.
so where is every 1.
- Too busy leveling
- Not realy sure what the objective was
- Carebears
- Dont like World PvP
- Other
What Im trying to say is, will world/none instanced PvP work? Even if WAR is designed around PvP will players want to contribute, the biggest let down I will see if I go to a T1 town and see just a handful of guys.How are mythic goona convince ppl to put down there quest log and join in the battles?
Did you even watch the video? as he said you will progress faster if you use both pvp and pve, i believe that's reason enough for most players to go battle.
What he didn't mention is what you gain/loose by taking over those areas.. if there's no loss or gain this will be as carebear and uninspiring as WoW is.