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The Death of Vanguard?
Winkyman
Member Posts: 31
Im aware of why they nerfed the XP (the whole being broke and only completing 1-35 content thing) in the game, and had it been done DAY ONE I guess it would not feel so much like someone tore my scrotum off and is making me watch while they burn it O_O. From a BUSINESS standpoint, the most subscriptions wins (and currently WoW is the undisputed king). Vanguard is a visually amazing looking game, deep and well designed, and has a TON of potential, but I don't think it will ever see it, or last long enough for them to finish the game. Grind fest games are nothing new, IF I wanted to grind for days to get a level ill play Lin2 thx, If I want to level fast, ill play WoW, thx. What is Vanguard bringing to the masses, that these other games are not? Whats new? EQ was revolutionary in its day, it was THE game in town and its ruleset was unchallenged, thats not the case here, there are more games in a crowded landscape and I just dont see what Vanguard is doing to make itself stand out. That said im playing a 23 shaman atm, and I wil keep playing, but Ive seen WAY too many people quit in the last 3 days to make me think that this game has a future.
Oh and as for the grind thing, hey I dont want to grind endlessly (I think that DAoC had the right system at launch that was a pretty good grind, but did not feel as 'dead' as this game feels now. I also like Blonds, You might like Redheads and someone else might like Goats (damned Irish!), that does not make me wrong nor you right, its an opinion, and I respect others opinons. If you want to grind so be it, I can play a different game, I just get the feeling that the MAJORITY of people want to spend less time brainlessly grinding and more time doing fun stuff.
Neways /rant off
Winl
Edit I forgot the rest of my thinking.
Add the grind. to all the massive bugs, game play problems, Imbalanced PvP (fixed today Im told) terrible coding (chunk neone) and it all starts to add up to an EXTREMELY frustrating game. I don't so much mind the grind (to a degree) if I know im in charge of my destiny, but when I have to take XP deaths and loose HOURS of XP because of stupid game bugs (fall thru the world on a chunk leave no corpse, take XP death and return to bindstone) it really starts to get old. I have guildies qutting as certain stance quests ( and the like abilites./stances/styles watever) are broken or require you to talk to NPCs who are KoS, or that require you to run to areas surrounded by level 50 REALLY angry mobs. Last night a guildy took 11 Deaths, he was caught in a Death loop, GM finally showed up, and summoned his corps, and left him with 40% xp debt. So he goes from 30% into a level to 40% debt thru no fault of his own. THEN the GM asks him to show him what he did so that the GM could tell the devs what needs to be fixed, when my guildie asked if hed get his XP back for this next death the GM said, no sorry we cant do that. Its not one single thing, its the general frustration level I think thats bad.
Neways /rant off for real this time! :P
Wink
Oh and as for the grind thing, hey I dont want to grind endlessly (I think that DAoC had the right system at launch that was a pretty good grind, but did not feel as 'dead' as this game feels now. I also like Blonds, You might like Redheads and someone else might like Goats (damned Irish!), that does not make me wrong nor you right, its an opinion, and I respect others opinons. If you want to grind so be it, I can play a different game, I just get the feeling that the MAJORITY of people want to spend less time brainlessly grinding and more time doing fun stuff.
Neways /rant off
Winl
Edit I forgot the rest of my thinking.
Add the grind. to all the massive bugs, game play problems, Imbalanced PvP (fixed today Im told) terrible coding (chunk neone) and it all starts to add up to an EXTREMELY frustrating game. I don't so much mind the grind (to a degree) if I know im in charge of my destiny, but when I have to take XP deaths and loose HOURS of XP because of stupid game bugs (fall thru the world on a chunk leave no corpse, take XP death and return to bindstone) it really starts to get old. I have guildies qutting as certain stance quests ( and the like abilites./stances/styles watever) are broken or require you to talk to NPCs who are KoS, or that require you to run to areas surrounded by level 50 REALLY angry mobs. Last night a guildy took 11 Deaths, he was caught in a Death loop, GM finally showed up, and summoned his corps, and left him with 40% xp debt. So he goes from 30% into a level to 40% debt thru no fault of his own. THEN the GM asks him to show him what he did so that the GM could tell the devs what needs to be fixed, when my guildie asked if hed get his XP back for this next death the GM said, no sorry we cant do that. Its not one single thing, its the general frustration level I think thats bad.
Neways /rant off for real this time! :P
Wink
Comments
Well, it will continue on because it is SoE All Access Pass and they really don't *have* to devote any resources to it. There will be enough 'Hardcore' subscribers to keep it going. Just as EQ, EQ2, SWG, PlanetSide, et all are 'going'.
Won't die, but won't succeed either.
I'm waiting for the inevitable V:SoH NGE / CU cycle to begin. Just like it did for those other 'Hardcore' games, EQ2 and SWG.
Good Hunting
Calm down there chicken little...
-Currently looking forward to FFXIV
-Currently playing EvE and Global Agenda
Personally, I think counting Vanguard out of anything is just plain silly.
It is very, very, very far from death.
IMO though the next 30 to 60 days will determine whether it will be an EQ2 "type" earner (in terms of numbers, subs) or whether it will be a Lineage2 "type" that will develope over time.
I sincerely believe alot has to happen in those 30-60 days, performance on mediocre machines has to improve 25-30%, much better introductions to classes and races have to be written into the game, much more defined UI, better quest handling, LOD handling, much better communication from the development team and community teams. And of course alot more bugs need to be ironed out.
All things being equal and some quality fixes in place, I thoroughly believe Vanguard can have a great ride.
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You dont need to level alot to have fun.
~Redslayer-Saga of Ryzom~ Active again!
~Kinch/Lotu-WoW~ Retired
True RedSlayer - Eve ~ Current Primary game
Like it or not, Blizzard set the stage for MMOs, its the new standard that all other MMOs will be judged against. This is no WoW. The game has glaring bugs that are not simple fixes. Precaching and post chuck data release would have to be rewritten to solve the chunking issue, and thats prolly a very hard thing to do.
Falling thru the world etc, is, I think a 'z' axis issue as the game does not really have a static 0 'z' axis because of levitate and flying mounts. Also flying near a mob the mob still chases you thru the sky, so they are not leached to a static 'z' axis. Think these make for difficult code problems to fix, not undoable certainly. but not going to be 'fixed' in a week either.
Like I said I like blonds, and this game seems to be a redhead.
Wink
I honestly have no Idea how much funding Sigil has or doesnt have. Nor did I follow the game more than checking their website once or twice a month during its development. I read the FAQ and Brad's vision for the game. But as a rational human I also know that what a person wants to put into a game for launch and what is acctually in the game at launch are always 2 different things.
So to all the disapointed fans who read and apparently believed everything would be in the game even though a rational mind would have conceded that some stuff would not make it into launch.
Time/money and many many other thing effect what can go into a game in a certain time period. While Vanguard is in no way a "perfect" game. (On a side note there has never been a "perfect" game, as humans make games and no human is perfect, nothing a human makes is perfect) It is a good game with lots to offer.
I say relaxe. take a nice long deep breath of fresh air and enjoy the ride. This game has tons of potential and is a fun game as it is.
Yeah more naysayers trying their best to find something to rubbish this game about and yet its top of the poll and the community is thriving 3 days in.
Vanguard is going to go from strength to strength and posts like this do nothing to prevent it.
If you don't like the game, fine, play something else (no game is for everyone).
Stop trolling here.
Now playing: VG (after a long break from MMORPGS)
Played for more than a month: Darkfall online, Vanguard SOH, Everquest, Horizons, WoW, SWG, Everquest II, Eve
I find that statement ever so true with almost ALL MMO's these days, it's generally knee jerk to some silly change.
Not to say the thread creator is doing such. Only thats just how it is in general.
Lin2 is a dead game very few non chinese/bot players. HARDCORE game, and its a shame because it has so much to offer, but the grind killed it in NA anyways, I fear thats what will happen here.
Wink
Wink
LMAO! No you don't. But you do need to level if you want to explore new places (higher level mobs), gain new abilities, and "set yourself free" on a nice flying mount.
Like it or not, Blizzard set the stage for MMOs, its the new standard that all other MMOs will be judged against. This is no WoW. The game has glaring bugs that are not simple fixes. Precaching and post chuck data release would have to be rewritten to solve the chunking issue, and thats prolly a very hard thing to do.
Falling thru the world etc, is, I think a 'z' axis issue as the game does not really have a static 0 'z' axis because of levitate and flying mounts. Also flying near a mob the mob still chases you thru the sky, so they are not leached to a static 'z' axis. Think these make for difficult code problems to fix, not undoable certainly. but not going to be 'fixed' in a week either.
Like I said I like blonds, and this game seems to be a redhead.
Wink Aye, I noted the question mark. Doesn't really change the "feel" of the title. To me it kind of reminds me of watching the original Batman when I was a kid. The joker or whoever would catch Batman and Robin and put them in some overly complicated trap and then you would get "Great announcer voice guy" "Is this the end of Batman and Robin?!?" "Have they finally met their match?!?" Basically, Hes implying that it COULD be the end of Batman and Robin. Now, You didn't come out and say that this was the death of Vanguard, However you implied it was a distinct possibility which to me seems a bit "The sky is falling"ish to me at this stage in the game.
-Currently looking forward to FFXIV
-Currently playing EvE and Global Agenda
Wink
That's the thing Wink, if you don't agree with them, if you don't think the game is perfect and nothing needs to be done, if your dismissive and rude to everyone who might think some things might need to be worked on then your just wrong.
Not only are you wrong, but your a child and you need to get back to WoW that you play from your "Barbie PC". (Hehehe, I kid you not I actually read that in /shout last night).
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Well I think they thought of Vanguard not going to make it is just silly. They are tweaking the game play every day. For instance… My bard speed was all together at like 170%, then they nerfed it to 140 something.... people bitched and now it's perfect and reasonable at 164%. They are actively changing the game to suit players. The Xp nerf I didn’t even notice. I've been questing with my guild and quest XP payouts seem to be excellent. The servers are teaming with people. Our guild has over 110 individuals and growing by several and hour. People in game and on Vent are excited by the game and are glad they got it. It's not perfect but they are actively working on it diligently. I saw several things fixed in todays patch. Small stuff... no game breakers. I know the negative comments are personal opinion, and often have a ring of truth. But this launch has been excellent by MMo standards. The game is fun and is what you make of it. If you have no imagination and no friends I can see how you might dislike it.
Like it or not, Blizzard set the stage for MMOs, its the new standard that all other MMOs will be judged against. This is no WoW. The game has glaring bugs that are not simple fixes. Precaching and post chuck data release would have to be rewritten to solve the chunking issue, and thats prolly a very hard thing to do.
Falling thru the world etc, is, I think a 'z' axis issue as the game does not really have a static 0 'z' axis because of levitate and flying mounts. Also flying near a mob the mob still chases you thru the sky, so they are not leached to a static 'z' axis. Think these make for difficult code problems to fix, not undoable certainly. but not going to be 'fixed' in a week either.
Like I said I like blonds, and this game seems to be a redhead.
Wink
Lame rebuttal Winky. Going with that logic, I should be able to post a topic that asks, "Is Winkyman a liar, a cheat, and a thief?" And then say oh I was just asking; I didn't mean to imply Winkyman was a liar, cheat or thief.
And this game is far more WoW-like than I prefer. It's easy, and it's very soloable, at least up to lvl 12 which is how far I've progressed.
Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon.
In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
Like it or not, Blizzard set the stage for MMOs, its the new standard that all other MMOs will be judged against. This is no WoW. The game has glaring bugs that are not simple fixes. Precaching and post chuck data release would have to be rewritten to solve the chunking issue, and thats prolly a very hard thing to do.
Falling thru the world etc, is, I think a 'z' axis issue as the game does not really have a static 0 'z' axis because of levitate and flying mounts. Also flying near a mob the mob still chases you thru the sky, so they are not leached to a static 'z' axis. Think these make for difficult code problems to fix, not undoable certainly. but not going to be 'fixed' in a week either.
Like I said I like blonds, and this game seems to be a redhead.
Wink
Lame rebuttal Winky. Going with that logic, I should be able to post a topic that asks, "Is Winkyman a liar, a cheat, and a thief?" And then say oh I was just asking; I didn't mean to imply Winkyman was a liar, cheat or thief.
And this game is far more WoW-like than I prefer. It's easy, and it's very soloable, at least up to lvl 12 which is how far I've progressed.
You explained what I was getting at with the batman thing better with this then I did. Thanks.-Currently looking forward to FFXIV
-Currently playing EvE and Global Agenda
Originally posted by Deathstrike2
LMAO! No you don't. But you do need to level if you want to explore new places (higher level mobs), gain new abilities, and "set yourself free" on a nice flying mount.
Then play more? The only way to "fix" this for some would be to make leveling at WoW speed (I acually liked WoW btw, But it did get boring pretty quick because of the ease to level solo), And then the no lives would get max level in no time at all, I have quite a few friends playing this game, And none of them (Even one who plays 1.5 hours a day durring the week abd saturday, And 3-5 hours on sunday) complain about leveling speed...
You simply can't expect (Even in WoW just to a much lesser extent) to put little to no effort/time in and get things as fast people who play 15 hours a day... Its not impossible to level... Just hard. Just enjoy yourself and stop worrying so much about leveling, and you will have alot more fun...I learned this the hard way... Reaching max level only makes you bored... And have nothing left to accomplish, Other then raid... for minamal reward (I hate raiding personally).
If you don't like the game, Then thats your opinion... And you should try a different game... untill you find one you like. Don't know what else to tell you...
Disclaimer-- This is not a "go back to *******" post.
~Redslayer-Saga of Ryzom~ Active again!
~Kinch/Lotu-WoW~ Retired
True RedSlayer - Eve ~ Current Primary game
With all the great new games due to come out in the next year i dont have alot of faith in Vanguard being a blockbuster, but if you think it will die after six months youve either just started playing mmo's with the release of wow, or just extremely ignorant. just look at Auto Assault, ive never seen a bigger flop of an mmo (and a potentionaly good mmo) but its still up and running and its been long past 6 months.
The dommination of games goes in cycles, wows huge share of the mmo market is nothing new, EQ had it at one time and wow isnt the one who took it away from them, it was a combination of many good games long before wow , and with the release of many more good games very close it will probably start the cycle again untill another UO/EQ1/WOW comes along to rule the roost for a year or 2.