I gotta agree with all the people who said "NCSoft would of lost no real money because no one playing L2X would of played the legal L2" this would be because: Anyone looking to find a free version of any game, obviously doesn't want to pay, and trust me, you gotta look to find these. Therefore, IF they weren't playing L2X, they likely would of been playing one of the free games with a cash-shop. Therefore, in an odd sense, the L2X team was actually stealing money from games like Silkroad Online, Hero Online, Conquer Online, and the like.
Congratulations to the FBI, you just made thousands of people bored.
I have no problem with people doing copyright infringement, and I have no problem with people getting busted for it, its just a twisted version of the cycle of life. Seriously though, NCSoft has to stop making illegitimate claims, especially about their loss of money. If anyone on this thread ever looked at the comments section for L2, over 70% of them hate the game and used the big bold words "GRIND", basically, L2X made L2 better, congratz NC, you suck at sucking, because L2 just plain sucks and you can't even do that right!
*EDIT*
OH! And by the way, if you reverse engineer a game, I don't think theres anything they can do, why? Simply because in essence, their writing from scratch, however, they have a template to look at. So the courts could go either way on that.
I hope you all know how wrong you can be about the courts sometimes, after all look at the mafia trial with Jackie DiNorscio, every one of them mobsters got off clean, and the jury KNEW they were mobsters. Anyway you closed minded people annoy me, I actually read every post, half of em made me want to throw my monitor, the other half I agreed with...
*EDIT*
I agree with you that L2 probably didn't lose to many subscribers due to this emulated server. However I will put my two cents in on the issue of the copying of the game.
With the proper decomplier both images and programming can be taken from a Macromedia Flash project. Though reverse engineering of the code is usually impossible to prove, the copying of the digital art images is protected very strictly by copyright.
Another example of this would be the succus of Wizard's of the Coast shutting down servers that emulate there trading card game Magic: The gathering. The grounds they were able to shut them down for along with sueing the owers of these servers was because they again used artwork that was owned by the company in a way the company did not want it used. A few more recent servers have been started that don't use the artwork just the text, these servers have yet to be shut down.
Both digital images created from scans along with digital images that are vector based (3D graphics) are protected by digital copyright laws.
Legality aside I think on a ethics level that the owner of a piece of creative work should always be the one to decide what is done with it. Even if it is taken in a direction many others oppose.
I gotta agree with all the people who said "NCSoft would of lost no real money because no one playing L2X would of played the legal L2" this would be because: Anyone looking to find a free version of any game, obviously doesn't want to pay, and trust me, you gotta look to find these. Therefore, IF they weren't playing L2X, they likely would of been playing one of the free games with a cash-shop. Therefore, in an odd sense, the L2X team was actually stealing money from games like Silkroad Online, Hero Online, Conquer Online, and the like.
Congratulations to the FBI, you just made thousands of people bored.
I have no problem with people doing copyright infringement, and I have no problem with people getting busted for it, its just a twisted version of the cycle of life. Seriously though, NCSoft has to stop making illegitimate claims, especially about their loss of money. If anyone on this thread ever looked at the comments section for L2, over 70% of them hate the game and used the big bold words "GRIND", basically, L2X made L2 better, congratz NC, you suck at sucking, because L2 just plain sucks and you can't even do that right!
*EDIT*
OH! And by the way, if you reverse engineer a game, I don't think theres anything they can do, why? Simply because in essence, their writing from scratch, however, they have a template to look at. So the courts could go either way on that.
I hope you all know how wrong you can be about the courts sometimes, after all look at the mafia trial with Jackie DiNorscio, every one of them mobsters got off clean, and the jury KNEW they were mobsters. Anyway you closed minded people annoy me, I actually read every post, half of em made me want to throw my monitor, the other half I agreed with...
*EDIT*
And what of the artwork and the game systems that NC designed? Until I hear from people who actually practice copyright law and can speak about it in a convincing manner, I don't buy it. All this sounds to me is that people are upset that they can get caught doing things they shouldn't be doing.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Un-fuggin-believable.... FBI is wasting time shutting down goddamn MMO servers.... I'm sure parents with missing kids are comforted to know their tax dollars are going towards keeping the world safe from Private Lineage II servers.
"Yes." (you must agree to this license before using the software)
Consideration?
User: (in the case of private use of software: none - if you download the client)
NCSoft: Use of their software.
Contract?
Therefore, if you use a downloaded (free) client version of this software, then this does not form a legally binding contract between User and NCSoft (according to business law) because it fails for lack of consideration on the part of the User.
Now, if you had bought the box from the store you would be in breach of contract with NCSoft if you took any of the following actions:
"You may not (a) sublicense, rent, lease, loan or otherwise transfer the Software or the Service (or any part thereof), including without limitation serial codes; (b) modify, adapt, reverse engineer or decompile the Software, or otherwise attempt to derive source code from the Software;"
For that matter, i'm not even sure what grounds the FBI could dismantle his operation on... Unless you are reselling a product you bought from a company, (he was accepting donations) you are committing no crime.
"I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed person."
Un-fuggin-believable.... FBI is wasting time shutting down goddamn MMO servers.... I'm sure parents with missing kids are comforted to know their tax dollars are going towards keeping the world safe from Private Lineage II servers.
Make no mistake what those dopes were doing was against the law however I share Newbinators sentiments here.
Not only that but it begs the question...if NCsoft is soo hardcore about this stuff , why aren't they stopping all the damn botting going on in the legitimate L2?!
This is good news. I really hope this is not just a one time deal but that they will continue to take action against illegal emulators of this kind and not just in the US but also by law enforcement in other parts of the world. It takes a lot of work and invested money to make any such game, and then to have it stolen by a bunch of loafers is just flat out wrong! It does not matter one bit if the game was any good or not or how it compared to the legal servers, it's just wrong. This is a victory for not only commercial companies but independent developers as well, it's great that we are finally getting a little protection at last.
Un-fuggin-believable.... FBI is wasting time shutting down goddamn MMO servers.... I'm sure parents with missing kids are comforted to know their tax dollars are going towards keeping the world safe from Private Lineage II servers.
I appreciate your sentiment, but the FBI has many different divisions. No manpower was taken away from finding missing people or tracking down UFO's!
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Un-fuggin-believable.... FBI is wasting time shutting down goddamn MMO servers.... I'm sure parents with missing kids are comforted to know their tax dollars are going towards keeping the world safe from Private Lineage II servers.
Before you people start bashing fbi maybe you should start to read up on the facts first.
In this case as i have seen and heard the game company took the steps against the person with the private mmo serves and justified soo.
Fbi never iniated the raid without having a case that they had in this case also i dont understand the adolecent cries abut this,
If you dont like to pay dont play the game pure and simple.
Oh mindmeld, you fail to see one thing, 99% of the people playing L2X didn't play it because they didn't want to pay, it was like a whole different game, most of the people playing L2X weren't playing L2 not because it cost money, but because it was one of the worst failures as an MMO that has ever graced store shelves...
I think most people can agree with me when I say, if its there, why not use it? There was no risk to any of the L2X players, and I highly doubt anyone on this forum could give a rats ass whether or not NCSoft went under, hell some of us might even be happy. So some guy stole source code and attempted to make his own game out of it, if I went out and decided to re-program the original tetris, would anyone say anything to me about it? Hell no. Just because this game is well known and because their brining in so much damn money, makes it sound so the worse, I can't believe my tax dollars went to this, as someone before said. I mean seriously, so this guy ends up making a decent sized game out of an already huge game, it took L2 2 freaking years to find this guy... it must not of been that big, or their detective work is worse than a B grade movie. Probably 30% of the player-base for L2X knew where the guy lived, I just want to know, whats making you guys so happy about it being shut down? Now likely 3 or 4 more are going to sprout up, because for 1, they just made around 50'000 people no longer have something to do in their free time. So likely, one or two of those people has what it takes, and will make a new server, just so two years later the FBI can bust them, THIS IS NOT A STEP IN ANY DIRECTION FOR THE ANY MMO-EMU or MMORPG company, because its just going to happen again.
Its like this, if someone gets busted for having 10 pounds of weed in their house, do you think its going to stop any new drug dealers from sprouting up? In fact, in some cases, it could do the exact opposite of what the FBI or government intended, in fact shutting down L2X could of been their worst mistake yet, who can tell for sure, its too early.
(for anyone who thinks I'm on the side of the emu-companies, I'm not. I am actually in the process of developing my own MMO with some long time friends of mine, so I can see where NCSoft is coming from, lets just hope NC learns from this and changes their crappy games, maybe to less-crappy games.)
I look forward to seeing other MMO-EMU's sprouting up, and I look forward to them being crushed... another turn in the wheel of life...
Good, the FBI stapled his balls. And ya..if you want to get away with not paying for a mmorpg then play the many free ones that are floating around or GET A JOB. If you have one and don't make squat...get an education and find a better one.
Un-fuggin-believable.... FBI is wasting time shutting down goddamn MMO servers.... I'm sure parents with missing kids are comforted to know their tax dollars are going towards keeping the world safe from Private Lineage II servers.
How about the FBI is wasting their time busting losers that don't want real jobs that just want to rip off the people who bust their ass to maintain the game servers and develop the software. * Real world alert* games cost lots of money to produce and what they are doing is money well spent by my tax dollars.
Emulated servers are indeed a copyright infringment issue, therefore they are illegal to operate.
"Whosoever shed last blood By man shall his blood be shed For immunity of God make he the man Destroy all that which is evil So that which is good may flourish And I shall count thee among my favored sheep And you shall have the protection of all the angels in Heaven."
(for anyone who thinks I'm on the side of the emu-companies, I'm not. I am actually in the process of developing my own MMO with some long time friends of mine, so I can see where NCSoft is coming from, lets just hope NC learns from this and changes their crappy games, maybe to less-crappy games.)
I look forward to seeing other MMO-EMU's sprouting up, and I look forward to them being crushed... another turn in the wheel of life...
Yes, but that's the point. It doesn't matter that they make a crappy game or not. You can't judge something on being "right" or "wrong" just because on a whim you like the idea of something or not.
Otherwise, if l2 was the greatest game of all time, would it make it "right" that the fbi shut these illegal servers down but if it's crappy then it's wrong?
As far as NC Soft goes, they are a company. Any of you who actually have jobs, whether they are in large or small companies, knows that it is a bit less insidious than some star chamber where a select few plot to take your paychecks.
These people are artists, programmers, what have you and they want to work in the game industry. You may or may not like what they do in their games (whether it's WoW or L2 or Eve) but the long and the short of it is that people want/need paychecks, insurance, stability.
Some of you might not care about that at your point in life, but believe me, there comes a time when you suddenly realize that retirement is coming up and you have nothing to fall back on. Regardless of whether you like that we have to work to make our living, it is a fact.
So companies (of any size) need to be able to thrive in order to continue to exist and continue to provide jobs to their employees.
Yes, the players that play these illegal servers will most likely not play the real game. That's very understandable. However, some have come over to the real game as is evidenced by their posts on the L2 boards.
But no, NC most likely did not lose the amount that is stated by the FBI. But regardless, they did spend their own money to make the art, game designs, and code in order for their company to thrive and to continue in the business that they chose.
You just don't have the right to make use of this just because you feel (and I mean the "collective you") that the game "should" be about something else. What you do have the right to do is to say "screw you", I'm not playing your crappy game and I will put my money in another place.
If NC thrives or dies it is a result of people voting with their dollars.
There is a reason we have law. It is not to inconvenience people but to help society thrive and to allow its members to live to the best of their ability.
Maybe if you are in your twenties or less you don't see this but when you get to your thirties, forties and more all of this becomes more evident.
It doesn't mean you have to believe everything society tries to push down your throat but it does mean that a system that benefits all groups fairly is one that will allow us to do what we would like to do with or lives.
As you people start investing in your own lives I'm pretty sure your tune will change (or you will move to a compound in Montana and right your manifestos )
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
(for anyone who thinks I'm on the side of the emu-companies, I'm not. I am actually in the process of developing my own MMO with some long time friends of mine, so I can see where NCSoft is coming from, lets just hope NC learns from this and changes their crappy games, maybe to less-crappy games.)
I look forward to seeing other MMO-EMU's sprouting up, and I look forward to them being crushed... another turn in the wheel of life...
Yes, but that's the point. It doesn't matter that they make a crappy game or not. You can't judge something on being "right" or "wrong" just because on a whim you like the idea of something or not.
Otherwise, if l2 was the greatest game of all time, would it make it "right" that the fbi shut these illegal servers down but if it's crappy then it's wrong?
Ever notice how people's sense of morality seems to end when it saves them money?
The interesting case would be the FBI closing a private server that had not stolen source code. For example an emulator like L2J that has not stolen copyrighted source code.
In the case of L2J or other emulators that have not stolen source code and do not modify someone elses copyrighted work (the client). How can a EULA for the client software which is unused in the operation of the server be used to justify (worse be called law) the closing of that server?
While actually using your client in violation of a valid contract (assuming the EULA is such) with a server such as L2J would likely be a breach of contract on the users part it would not be "criminal copyright infringement" and certainly there is no breach or even contract involving the server operator.
What some may reason in opposition is similar to shutting down "unoffical" webservers because a browser has a EULA prohibiting connecting to any but the offical web server.
Also simple desire or even necessity for mmorpg companies to avoid competition does not create law. Lest we find ourselves in a situation where by EULA and aggressive litigation all private companies begin to write there own laws preventing competition.
Had L2extreme not stolen source code this would be an interesting problem. Though as it is. The news is of nothing more then theft and the interesting issue is ignored.
Most of the ppl, who played on extreme wouldn't NEVER pay for real L2. Its too much of grinding.. Who got the time to grind 10hours/day for 2 years without getting even on the highest lvl. The fact is, that real L2 is boring, and private servers ain't. Private servers offers more PvP and the PvP is the reason I liked L2. Anyways, there is alot of other private servers with more than 10k player online all the time, I am just wondering when is it their time to get busted..
Regardless of how many people "might" have bought a particular game or CD vs downloading it, the intellectual property owner has every right to restrict access to people who pay them for it. If you don't pay, you should not play..... but I digress....
Well, I obviously do not agree with intellectual property, despise having art and projects stolen. There's a difference between copyright and plagiarism.
The world is made out of stolen ideas and dumb people who get caught in dumber concepts anyway
Anyway, back to the subject. This was stupid on both sides, specially when it comes to running a stolen source of a horrible game and getting caught. Can you say pwn3d?
The interesting case would be the FBI closing a private server that had not stolen source code. For example an emulator like L2J that has not stolen copyrighted source code. In the case of L2J or other emulators that have not stolen source code and do not modify someone elses copyrighted work (the client). How can a EULA for the client software which is unused in the operation of the server be used to justify (worse be called law) the closing of that server? While actually using your client in violation of a valid contract (assuming the EULA is such) with a server such as L2J would likely be a breach of contract on the users part it would not be "criminal copyright infringement" and certainly there is no breach or even contract involving the server operator. What some may reason in opposition is similar to shutting down "unoffical" webservers because a browser has a EULA prohibiting connecting to any but the offical web server. Also simple desire or even necessity for mmorpg companies to avoid competition does not create law. Lest we find ourselves in a situation where by EULA and aggressive litigation all private companies begin to write there own laws preventing competition. Had L2extreme not stolen source code this would be an interesting problem. Though as it is. The news is of nothing more then theft and the interesting issue is ignored.
Actually, it's the same thing. US courts have ruled that you CANNOT create software for the expicit purpose of allowing people to connect in violation of their EULA. And also ruled that the company in question is able to seek compensatory damages. Do a quick Google for Blizzard vs BNetD; it was a case where a group of people created their own Battle.net server, using their own code (not Blizzard's).
- The Battle.net service was ALREADY free, so Blizzard was losing no subscription fees.
- BNetD was also free.
- The BNetD software was not stolen, it was created.
- However, connecting to BNetD was against the EULA for Battle.net games (Warcraft, Starcraft).
Even though Blizzard was not losing money, and even though the server software was not stolen from them, the courts ordered BNetD shut down, and Blizzard/Vivendi successfully sued them for damages.
From this, we can see:
- It does not matter if you stole the server source, or created a new server code - it's STILL going to get you shut down and possibly sued.
- It does not matter if you are charging or not; it is just as illegal either way.
- While MMO companies might not be actively pursuing emu runners (except Bliz, which shuts down every WOW emu they can find), that does not mean they cannot START doing so tomorrow, if they choose to - and the more cases like this that back their legal rights up, the more likely we are to see them getting active in this area.
They make it sound as if l2extreme was charging a monthly fee, which it absolutely wasn't. I don't see how shutting down l2extreme really matters to ncsoft anyways. Most of the people playing l2extreme will never play on the real servers because l2extreme offered a much faster paced leveling system, and it was free.
Comments
I agree with you that L2 probably didn't lose to many subscribers due to this emulated server. However I will put my two cents in on the issue of the copying of the game.
With the proper decomplier both images and programming can be taken from a Macromedia Flash project. Though reverse engineering of the code is usually impossible to prove, the copying of the digital art images is protected very strictly by copyright.
Another example of this would be the succus of Wizard's of the Coast shutting down servers that emulate there trading card game Magic: The gathering. The grounds they were able to shut them down for along with sueing the owers of these servers was because they again used artwork that was owned by the company in a way the company did not want it used. A few more recent servers have been started that don't use the artwork just the text, these servers have yet to be shut down.
Both digital images created from scans along with digital images that are vector based (3D graphics) are protected by digital copyright laws.
Legality aside I think on a ethics level that the owner of a piece of creative work should always be the one to decide what is done with it. Even if it is taken in a direction many others oppose.
And what of the artwork and the game systems that NC designed? Until I hear from people who actually practice copyright law and can speak about it in a convincing manner, I don't buy it. All this sounds to me is that people are upset that they can get caught doing things they shouldn't be doing.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Un-fuggin-believable.... FBI is wasting time shutting down goddamn MMO servers.... I'm sure parents with missing kids are comforted to know their tax dollars are going towards keeping the world safe from Private Lineage II servers.
EULA/terms of use
Acceptance?
"Yes." (you must agree to this license before using the software)
Consideration?
User: (in the case of private use of software: none - if you download the client)
NCSoft: Use of their software.
Contract?
Therefore, if you use a downloaded (free) client version of this software, then this does not form a legally binding contract between User and NCSoft (according to business law) because it fails for lack of consideration on the part of the User.
O + A + C != K in this case.
Theory of Recovery? (for NCSoft)
Equitable: Quasi-Contract - at best.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now, if you had bought the box from the store you would be in breach of contract with NCSoft if you took any of the following actions:
"You may not (a) sublicense, rent, lease, loan or otherwise transfer the Software or the Service (or any part thereof), including without limitation serial codes; (b) modify, adapt, reverse engineer or decompile the Software, or otherwise attempt to derive source code from the Software;"
For that matter, i'm not even sure what grounds the FBI could dismantle his operation on... Unless you are reselling a product you bought from a company, (he was accepting donations) you are committing no crime.
"I refuse to engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed person."
Not only that but it begs the question...if NCsoft is soo hardcore about this stuff , why aren't they stopping all the damn botting going on in the legitimate L2?!
Something smells fishy here....
Dutchess Zarraa Voltayre
Reborn/Zero Sum/Ancient Legacy/Jagged Legion/Feared/Nuke & Pave.
This is good news. I really hope this is not just a one time deal but that they will continue to take action against illegal emulators of this kind and not just in the US but also by law enforcement in other parts of the world. It takes a lot of work and invested money to make any such game, and then to have it stolen by a bunch of loafers is just flat out wrong! It does not matter one bit if the game was any good or not or how it compared to the legal servers, it's just wrong. This is a victory for not only commercial companies but independent developers as well, it's great that we are finally getting a little protection at last.
M59, UO, EQ1, WWIIOL, PS, EnB, SL, SWG. MoM, EQ2, AO, SB, CoH, LOTRO, WoW, DDO+ f2p's, Demos & indie alpha's.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
In this case as i have seen and heard the game company took the steps against the person with the private mmo serves and justified soo.
Fbi never iniated the raid without having a case that they had in this case also i dont understand the adolecent cries abut this,
If you dont like to pay dont play the game pure and simple.
-Semper ubi sub ubi!
always wear underwear
I think most people can agree with me when I say, if its there, why not use it? There was no risk to any of the L2X players, and I highly doubt anyone on this forum could give a rats ass whether or not NCSoft went under, hell some of us might even be happy. So some guy stole source code and attempted to make his own game out of it, if I went out and decided to re-program the original tetris, would anyone say anything to me about it? Hell no. Just because this game is well known and because their brining in so much damn money, makes it sound so the worse, I can't believe my tax dollars went to this, as someone before said. I mean seriously, so this guy ends up making a decent sized game out of an already huge game, it took L2 2 freaking years to find this guy... it must not of been that big, or their detective work is worse than a B grade movie. Probably 30% of the player-base for L2X knew where the guy lived, I just want to know, whats making you guys so happy about it being shut down? Now likely 3 or 4 more are going to sprout up, because for 1, they just made around 50'000 people no longer have something to do in their free time. So likely, one or two of those people has what it takes, and will make a new server, just so two years later the FBI can bust them, THIS IS NOT A STEP IN ANY DIRECTION FOR THE ANY MMO-EMU or MMORPG company, because its just going to happen again.
Its like this, if someone gets busted for having 10 pounds of weed in their house, do you think its going to stop any new drug dealers from sprouting up? In fact, in some cases, it could do the exact opposite of what the FBI or government intended, in fact shutting down L2X could of been their worst mistake yet, who can tell for sure, its too early.
(for anyone who thinks I'm on the side of the emu-companies, I'm not. I am actually in the process of developing my own MMO with some long time friends of mine, so I can see where NCSoft is coming from, lets just hope NC learns from this and changes their crappy games, maybe to less-crappy games.)
I look forward to seeing other MMO-EMU's sprouting up, and I look forward to them being crushed... another turn in the wheel of life...
Emulated servers are indeed a copyright infringment issue, therefore they are illegal to operate.
"Whosoever shed last blood
By man shall his blood be shed
For immunity of God make he the man
Destroy all that which is evil
So that which is good may flourish
And I shall count thee among my favored sheep
And you shall have the protection of all the angels in Heaven."
Otherwise, if l2 was the greatest game of all time, would it make it "right" that the fbi shut these illegal servers down but if it's crappy then it's wrong?
As far as NC Soft goes, they are a company. Any of you who actually have jobs, whether they are in large or small companies, knows that it is a bit less insidious than some star chamber where a select few plot to take your paychecks.
These people are artists, programmers, what have you and they want to work in the game industry. You may or may not like what they do in their games (whether it's WoW or L2 or Eve) but the long and the short of it is that people want/need paychecks, insurance, stability.
Some of you might not care about that at your point in life, but believe me, there comes a time when you suddenly realize that retirement is coming up and you have nothing to fall back on. Regardless of whether you like that we have to work to make our living, it is a fact.
So companies (of any size) need to be able to thrive in order to continue to exist and continue to provide jobs to their employees.
Yes, the players that play these illegal servers will most likely not play the real game. That's very understandable. However, some have come over to the real game as is evidenced by their posts on the L2 boards.
But no, NC most likely did not lose the amount that is stated by the FBI. But regardless, they did spend their own money to make the art, game designs, and code in order for their company to thrive and to continue in the business that they chose.
You just don't have the right to make use of this just because you feel (and I mean the "collective you") that the game "should" be about something else. What you do have the right to do is to say "screw you", I'm not playing your crappy game and I will put my money in another place.
If NC thrives or dies it is a result of people voting with their dollars.
There is a reason we have law. It is not to inconvenience people but to help society thrive and to allow its members to live to the best of their ability.
Maybe if you are in your twenties or less you don't see this but when you get to your thirties, forties and more all of this becomes more evident.
It doesn't mean you have to believe everything society tries to push down your throat but it does mean that a system that benefits all groups fairly is one that will allow us to do what we would like to do with or lives.
As you people start investing in your own lives I'm pretty sure your tune will change (or you will move to a compound in Montana and right your manifestos
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Otherwise, if l2 was the greatest game of all time, would it make it "right" that the fbi shut these illegal servers down but if it's crappy then it's wrong?
Ever notice how people's sense of morality seems to end when it saves them money?
The interesting case would be the FBI closing a private server that had not stolen source code. For example an emulator like L2J that has not stolen copyrighted source code.
In the case of L2J or other emulators that have not stolen source code and do not modify someone elses copyrighted work (the client). How can a EULA for the client software which is unused in the operation of the server be used to justify (worse be called law) the closing of that server?
While actually using your client in violation of a valid contract (assuming the EULA is such) with a server such as L2J would likely be a breach of contract on the users part it would not be "criminal copyright infringement" and certainly there is no breach or even contract involving the server operator.
What some may reason in opposition is similar to shutting down "unoffical" webservers because a browser has a EULA prohibiting connecting to any but the offical web server.
Also simple desire or even necessity for mmorpg companies to avoid competition does not create law. Lest we find ourselves in a situation where by EULA and aggressive litigation all private companies begin to write there own laws preventing competition.
Had L2extreme not stolen source code this would be an interesting problem. Though as it is. The news is of nothing more then theft and the interesting issue is ignored.
Well, I obviously do not agree with intellectual property, despise having art and projects stolen. There's a difference between copyright and plagiarism.
The world is made out of stolen ideas and dumb people who get caught in dumber concepts anyway
Anyway, back to the subject. This was stupid on both sides, specially when it comes to running a stolen source of a horrible game and getting caught. Can you say pwn3d?
[Here's a list of all the games I've played and/or my computer specs to show how much more seasoned or technologically advanced I am than you.]
- The Battle.net service was ALREADY free, so Blizzard was losing no subscription fees.
- BNetD was also free.
- The BNetD software was not stolen, it was created.
- However, connecting to BNetD was against the EULA for Battle.net games (Warcraft, Starcraft).
Even though Blizzard was not losing money, and even though the server software was not stolen from them, the courts ordered BNetD shut down, and Blizzard/Vivendi successfully sued them for damages.
From this, we can see:
- It does not matter if you stole the server source, or created a new server code - it's STILL going to get you shut down and possibly sued.
- It does not matter if you are charging or not; it is just as illegal either way.
- While MMO companies might not be actively pursuing emu runners (except Bliz, which shuts down every WOW emu they can find), that does not mean they cannot START doing so tomorrow, if they choose to - and the more cases like this that back their legal rights up, the more likely we are to see them getting active in this area.
Owyn
Commander, Defenders of Order
http://www.defendersoforder.com