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Jeff WHY CAN"T THEY bring back some PRE-CU servers WHY WHY WHY, WHY NOT?
ajax7
Member Posts: 363
Mr. Freeman, I don't hate you at all you probally a ok guy .
I hate what happened to the game I loved, I was a big Star Wars fan but not any longer not only did I stop playing SWG after 11-15-2005 I also stopped being a fan of Star Wars the ammount of time I put into the game to build my different avatars was all taken away from me I feel i was cheated and lied to and betrayed by your company and SOE.
Answer one question that will bring many people to a final resting place on this issue,
WHY CAN"T THEY bring back some PRE-CU servers WHY WHY WHY, WHY NOT?
Thanks Ajax
Ajax
Comments
Good lord, don't have an aneurysm. He just spent the last week or so telling us he doesn't know, but that likely choices are it would cost more money than it would get back, or they are contractually unable to do so.
SWG Team Mtg.
You don't expect an honest reply do you?
SOE employees have their "+5000000 versus honest replies" non-disclosure agreement sheild to protect them from revealing their true intent. If they dare forget, they have Smedley watching over their impotent carcasses to keep them in line.
"SWG was a world, now it's just a game" -adamrk-
"When the game was good, you didn't have to ask where the population was, because it was everywhere. When the game was good you didn't have to ask which server had population, because they all did. When the game was good you didn't have to beg friends to give it a try, because they were already playing. " - Salty Pete
You don't expect a dishonest one, do you?
Jeff Freeman
But he doesn't want to tell us, so nothing is wrong here. Everyone, who enjoyed PreCU, still hates him along with SOE.
Definitely not. I haven't been on the project for a long time, and don't work there any more.
But if I did, I couldn't tell you.
What I want has nothing to do with it.
Oh, I think you're exaggerating.
Jeff Freeman
You don't expect a dishonest one, do you?
From a Smedley lap puppy? Yes, I do.
"SWG was a world, now it's just a game" -adamrk-
"When the game was good, you didn't have to ask where the population was, because it was everywhere. When the game was good you didn't have to ask which server had population, because they all did. When the game was good you didn't have to beg friends to give it a try, because they were already playing. " - Salty Pete
"SWG was a world, now it's just a game" -adamrk-
"When the game was good, you didn't have to ask where the population was, because it was everywhere. When the game was good you didn't have to ask which server had population, because they all did. When the game was good you didn't have to beg friends to give it a try, because they were already playing. " - Salty Pete
It's not that they can't. It's that they don't want to. And the whole needing permission from LEC thing is a bogus excuse, if they go to LEC and show them that if they do alternate servers they will get X number of returning subs (and thus make more money) you think LEC is going to say no? Of course not, their response would be, "how soon can you do it?".
No, there are no pre-CU or CU servers simply because SOE does not want to do it, despite the obvious fact that the NGE has gone nowhere and will go nowhere. Too many in management who are unfortunately STILL there (Smed, McDaniel, Torres) have too much face to lose.
These guys are like suicide cultists. There is no reasoning with them. Their path is set and they aren't going to be talked out of anything.
If SOE rolled back, they would face the task of supporting the old system or, worse, both systems.
If SOE rolled back, many of you would wet yourselves with excitement as you keyed credit card numbers into station accounts.
If SOE rolled back, many of you would start complaining about how buggy things are.
If SOE rolled back, many of you would quit after 1 or 2 months because you're just remembering the best of the Pre-CU game and not the reality.
SOE now appreciates the wisdom of the saying "A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush" and, unfortunately for those vets petitioning for a rollback, that wisdom was learned too late. SOE simply can't gamble on wasting resources for a fraction of the old playerbase that could come back only to potentially turn around and leave again. The game you may have enjoyed is gone.
You don't expect a dishonest one, do you?
sadly....yes
at this point, yes i do.
SWG ADDICT...clean since the NGE
All we want is a few NEW PreCU servers, which cannot be THAT hard to support (after you saw SWGemu, you can understand).
I think even they can imagine PreCU servers could keep at least 50k people, but remember we had 300k players in those days. So there is also another potential. I'm not even counting post-CU/NGE players who heard so much about PreCU and would try it.
And noone wants resources from SOE, remember in PreNGE, EA was runing servers for SOE in Japan. Same thing can happen now too, another company could run servers if SOE really cannot do it.
There is probably another, very big reason why they won't (not can't) do it. You can create countless theory, but never learn which is the truth.
Edit* I wanted to add this:
I don't think there would be more "bug whine" than now. With NGE, SWG had its most buggy days since early publishes, plus NGE had/still has deadly bugs about combat, lag and game play at all. But "majority" (as they call it) kept playing it. Didn't they whine? They did. Didn't SOE promise to fix ALL bugs in 6 months? They did...
We do know what happend and not. If there are really 50k or more people playing NGE, 150k people would play buggy, laggy PreCU anytime.
Now I miss pre CU as much as the next guy, in fact I think of it often.
Yet I have to say this posting is just plain pathetic.
Thanks.
What about a new SW MMO Jeff? heard any rumors we haven't?
In my opinion this is the real reason LA won't allow SOE to go back to/add some pre-cu servers into the mix. It's obvious just how much many SWG vets loved the game. Would you want to put all those people right back into what they loved again, or would you rather withhold that version knowing it may very well hurt the subs on your new game? If you read between the lines it all adds up. They might not have enough time to recoup the costs of backward coding pre-cu servers before it becomes known there's another SW MMO on the way, many of the SWG vets might be reluctant to leave their pre-cu servers after all they went through to get them back (therefor hurting sales of their new SW MMO, guaranteed they won't want two SW MMO's operating at the same time (especially if SOE is running them both, though doubtful stranger things have happened), and considering past reactions how do you think people will react if they bring a bunch of people back to pre-cu, make them all fuzzy like and then shut everything down cold for a new SW MMO? If I was LA I'd just let things go as they are now, which would give you every reason in the world to shut down SWG when the next game is ready to go. In the meantime you sit back and lick the jar to get every last penny out of your current investment.
Think about it
PS - Sorry about the grammer, I had to cram this post out at work and I don't have the time to edit it properly. Hopefully you all get the jist of it though
Long time reader, first time poster.
Some of you just don't get it.
If Mr. Freeman knows, he can't say. Such is the way of an NDA that EVERY employee of nearly EVERY creative business signs upon departure, whether that departure is voluntary or involuntary. I'm quite surprised that more dev studios don't require their employees to sign a non-compete clause as well, but that is neither here nor there. Further, even if he isn't under an NDA about every little thing, that creates a very big vague area for him. He has to chose his words carefully, and even then just about anything he says could be frowned upon by SOE and their lawyers could get involved.
Look, if you're trying to goad him into blasting his former employer or fellow coworkers, he's not going to do it. Noone in their right mind would, if they want to continue to be viable for employ by another company. This is especially true given the nature of the game biz: everyone knows everyone. For Freeman to blast SOE, John Smedly, Julio Torres, or even the janitor, it would be highly unethical (save the "THE NGE WAS UNETHICAL!" comments), not to mention be akin to shooting himself in the face on several fronts. He would effectively blacklist himself in the game design market, thus making the prospect of future emplolyment difficult at best. Freeman is a very public figure in our little world, and would STILL be a very public figure if it weren't for the NGE that he has unfairly been targetted as being the one sole architect of.
I'm sure there are reasons why old style servers can't be brought online. Probably more than one reason. I'd hazard a guess that it is due to licensing restrictions in the SOE/LEC contract, but that would only be a guess. The more sucessful emu projects going around right now show that it is indeed technoligically feasible to DO it. It's not just feasible, it is actually being DONE. By a handful of guys that were on the outside looking in with ambition and purpose being their guide. As the technological barrier is broken by the emu's, then there are other reasons as to why; and those reasons probably can't be discussed without lawyers present.
SOE and LA weren't out to screw anyone. They took a risk to make the game better, fully mindful that you can't please everyone all the time. As a veteran, you have to understand that the long time 6+ month player is a rarity, player churn being what it is. SOE/LA weren't out to make veterans quit, thus losing their sub payment every month. They took a risk to make the game better and generate more subscriptions. Yes, it was a money making move/risk, but SOE/LA is in the business to make money. It's not providing a charitable service out of the kindness of their hearts. SOE/LA have much higher bosses to answer to than players, and that comes in the form of investors. Unless you work for free, donate the balance of your paycheck to charity, or have never asked for a raise, then you have absolutely no ground to stand on accusing SOE/LA of doing it to make more money.
It's a business. It is ALL about the money. And that doesn't make it bad or inherently evil. That's just life.
But I've derailed my own post, so I'll do my best to steer it back with a short closing:
Hating Freeman, SOE, Smedley, Torres, or anyone else involved with the game isn't doing anyone any good. We will never know the 'directors cut' of the NGE story. The only people that DO know have moved on to other things, and probably don't care anymore. You would do best in channelling that hate into something more positive, and in short, just moving on with your life. It's old news. It's not even interesting anymore. It's more of the same rhetoric being said over and over again.
The old game is dead.
Move on.
It's just;
You hate the way they've done to you,
You hate/don't like their new product, is called NGE,
And hating a company means you will not pay for their products anymore...
I don't know if 200k PreCU players affects SOE's sales while there are millions of other MMO players in the world. But please don't forget, while Blizzard is getting a better name in MMO industry, SOE's name went worse and worse with their own decisions.
Hell, they even talked about NGE and criticized SOE on newspapers, TVs... Many game magazines wrote NGE is crap and SOE sucked this time too etc. If SOE thinks there is no good or bad advertisement, their decisions are normal, but I don't think they are that stupid to think that.
I have begun to play SWG again after a year because i need it....i hate SOE
The best example of why they should not to make Pre-CU servers can be found in DAOC and their Classic Server expansion.
When these rolled back servers first went live (minus TOA) they were packed with returning players.. They ended up with 3 servers, some with more players on them than had ever been seen in the games glory days. But....
Many of the players came from other servers...so the net gain was zero....and many of those returned to their original servers afterwards. But far more people came back to the game...my guild at the time left WOW to go back and re-roll on the Classic servers. ( I decided to stay with WOW at the time). Within 7 months.... that same guild decided to re-roll on a new WOW server (no transfers back then) and gave up on DAOC for good.
Why did they join and then leave again? Because they just couldn't capture the magic that they had the first go around. In the end, they grew bored because it really wasn't that much different (even with new zones, classes etc) and apparently many other folks agreed, because today the Classic servers are a former shell of themselves (in terms of their glory days). And what's worse.... Classic servers are still the most populated.
So in the end.....its very hard to permanently resurrect an old game....in fact, almost no one has ever managed to pull it off... (except maybe for Eve...their numbers grow steadily upward) So from SOE's perspective, is it better to spend money on the next new game, which might have a chance of hitting the big time, or pouring resources into a sure finanancial dead end?
The math is pretty simple......
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I have been following this fairly closely ever since the start. I also want to clerify that I have never played SWG at all. And never will unless they bring back a pre CU server. Mainly because I had not gotten involved with playing MMO's. At the time I was playing StarFleet Command 3 (the developers being Taldren adn they had a U.S. office at the time.) I was a member of the battleclinic community when it was extremely small and supported mainly freelancer and the SFC series of games. It was a farely small community. SFC3 was never really a big hit. In fact everyone knew just about everyoen else. You had to go out of your way pretty much to change your IGN to something someone could not reconize if you wanted to do covert ops or for whatever the reasons. Anyways I guess most get the idea. It was a Small Community
Taldrens forums were flooded with talk about SWG when it came out, and continued to be that way. It was insane. I actually use to spend several hours a day easy reading in game stories or just the happenings for that day from players playing SWG. It was almost like reading a book that never ended in some cases. . SWG was the whole reason I honestly started MMo's.
I just had to experiance it for myself. Anyways by the time I finally decieded I was gonna make a switch from standard online gameing to my first MMo. Crap basically hit the fan. And the game was totally changed from what made it seem so appealing. I kick myself in the arse to this day for not trying the game out Pre-CU . Who would have thoguht $OE would have ever changed direction 180 degrees from the way the game was heading. Well I wouldn't even call it 180 degrees. I would call it what a few people have on these forums. A whole different game.
Anyways guess most get the picture. I was outside looking in, Then when I wanted to go in there was no point.....
So to try and fill the void of what actually caught my attention . I went to Eve , then Anarchy Online , Then back to Eve , to Wow, To Anarchy Online (still have a current account atm don't actually play tho). Somewhere in there i played GW for awhile before any expansions came out. I haven't actually been able to find a Game that just caught my imagination like the stories from posters about SWG on the Taldren forums. The game seemed so deep and complex on many lvl's from what I read. And hell I never bloody played it! Darn you $OE.
Not that any of the Mmo's I have played are bad. Thats simply not the case. They all had and still have their Goods and Bads for my tastes. But I couldn't / can't find anything with Game mechanics quite like what inspired me to play MMo's.
* Eve-Online, has a player Driven economy. Crafting "if thats what you wanna call it" in Eve "or would production be a better term" is indepth and actually mattered and very few things are better than what can be crafted. You can spend all your playing time schemeing up ways to make money, Or suppling your guild with surplus to annialate others. I Don't think crafting went exactly this direction in SWG. But its the closest thing that i personally can compare it to from my understanding of how it worked in SWG.
*Anarchy Online. Is the Community hands down. The public resources created by the community and supported by the community for the game are only surpassed by Wow. Players Run Online DB's. Auno, Aomainframe . Helpbot. Recipebot. ect. 3rd Party programs that improve the game such as Clicksaver , CSPmap . Public raidbots " tho personally... I don't like the Public raidbots." in some way or another improve the gameplay. And in some cases like CSP Map , Helpbot, Recipebot ,Clicksaver improve gameplay by 100%. And all player created. Mater of fact the game is simply unplayable with out a few of the programs mentioned above. The players picked up where the Dev's left off. Not to mention AO has to be one of the most helpfull informative communitys i haev ever experianced. This is nto to say there not drama . But if you have a real issue or really need help with something . Theres bound to be someone that will go out of their way to help you.
*World of Warcraft I played and left before the expansion was released. It honestly didn't appeal to me at first glance. But because I simply could not find a game to fill the void of what I wanted to play. I took a break and decieded to try somethign else. And this led to me playing Wow. For awhile anyways. no pro's or con's here tbh. it is what it is. I got into a great up and coming guild and we went thru ZG, MC, AQ20, BWL , AQ40, in a matter of months . Extremely fast. I only played for about 6 months. You do the math. I was in a great guild . We learned and were clearing all of the above at a insane rate. Learning and beating the 20 mans when we didn't have 40 mans scheduled. I was one of the few druids in the guild. I was always busy adn had something to do.
My Druid got geared out the yin yang. Great Experiance, Great group of people i played with. But it still was missing something.
Ok to the point
I simply don't understand $OE's logic in not re-opening Pre-CU servers. I mean seriously there has been so much bloody hype , drama , free advertisement about how great the game use to be. Literally everywhere any MMo gameing forums for whatever game ect. Has had posts about how great and how wanted the old version of the game is. They would not even have to advertise they are opening Pre-Cu servers. Word of mouth in any Mmo community travels fast. "Leeeroooy" or "Chuck Norris garabage " ring a bell. I seriously doubt $OE's servers could handle the load from the first few days alone.
And in my eyes I honestly don't see how it would be that bloody complicated. Are they consolidating servers atm? or even planning to? From what I understand they are.
If So the easiest way for them to see just how big of an influx of players it would bring would be to simlpy open up Pre-CU servers at this point. No character transfers , No server character rollbacks for players to have there old characters. Everyone starts out fresh.
Simply open up a Server Pre-CU. At a given patch point that involves the old game. Since Jedi seemed to be such an Issue to some and a fairly hot topic for debate. Maybe pre-Jedi.
If the number of Subs start to climb drastically. Which means $$$$$$$$$$$$$. then they simply start working out a way to implement / or manage a Dev team to spend time with both builds. if the numbers don't change that much after a few months. Shut it down simple as that . wouldn't be any worse than it is now.
In all honesty as much hype that goes around on all forums that involve a MMO. I think they would draw in a Huge chunk of the market. From new and old players. New players wanting to see what the hell all the fuss was about. old players wanting back their old found memories of what used to be.
And if it doesn't then simply shut the server down. Easy as that. They don't have a huge ammount of time invested in restoring characters . ect.
Thanks and Sorry I rambled on alittle.
Jay
**** Edit***
Just wanted to add i have played other MMo's but not for a long enough time to really mention. And that if Pre -Cu servers came out i would definately play.
/clap. Excellent first post.
1. SOE won't publish a competing product. That's a dumb business decision.
2. SOE won't pay to support the old product - trust me. I've worked in enough industries where you had to support multiple platforms. It sucks. Even doubling the hardware needed to run it would be a huge investment.
3. You (the general you) say you'd be fine with pub 13 and no CSR support. But you wouldn't. You'd be back to being angry about the things you were angry about pre-NGE and pre-CU (I read the forums. To call the SWG community satisfied at any point in time is to debase that word beyond recognition). You'd be PISSED as hell when your items disappeared, and there was no way to retrieve it. You'd hate that the game was stale. You would grow angry when obviously unbalanced specials (headhit3 anyone?) were allowed to continue to dominate. As time wore on, and systems/hardware/code broke down, you would grow angry at the POS product that was animating the corpse of your beloved SWG. And in the end, people would move on. And a number of those people would be people that were playing SWG NGE, so Sony has now *lost* money by putting it out.
They might gain some trust back from people. Might. But that's a very nebulous thing.
The game is dead. You had a hell of a time playing it when you played (I assume, if you want it back this badly). You made friends, you had tremendous adventures, you got stories you still tell your guild. It's over. That doesn't mean all that time is wasted. Just that it's past. I would kill to have a game that allowed templating to the degree SWG did, that had the flexibility to allow me to be a doc/swords for months, then swap over to pike/swds/TK, then back, then add Force Sensitive abilities (I never wanted to go full Jedi). But it's gone. I miss it, and I look for it, but I remember it fondly.
I don't rant at SquareEnix for the time I wasted playing FF VII, now that the game is done. Granted, I can pick it back up again and replay it, but it's not the same.
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