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A few yes/no Questions that could possibly be answered in more detail
tylerthedrui
Member Posts: 304
I don't keep up much with the news on this game, and have been getting hopefuly that maybe it will be something other than a 100% WoW clone as pretty much 99% of the upcoming games are 100% sure to be. If the answer to any of these questions is a clear 'yes', then I will not even consider picking up this game since I don't have time to get involved in another shitty MMORPG.
1. Will there be instances in any way, shape, or form (non-persistent world)?
2. Will players increase their power in-game using PvE (yuck!)?
3. Will the game feature an extensive grind/rewards system?
EDIT: After reading the posts I realize that this question is very formulaic and the answers are tough to answer in a yes/no sense, especially the instancing question. I will definitely be taking a look at WAR since PvE is optional, and the grind/rewards system is abnormal rather than WoWish. I would hope that the grind/rewards system is skill-based.
The 'instances' answer is interesting since the instances involve both enemy and allied players. In fact, the game sounds less like an MMORPG and more like a strategy/war game. I can tolerate instancing in such games, and guild wars style games. I can't tolerate instancing in so-called persistent worlds.
I will likely be trying out WAR if nothing better appears within a year of it's release.
Comments
$OE lies list
http://www.rlmmo.com/viewtopic.php?t=424&start=0
"
And I don't want to hear anything about "I don't believe in vampires" because *I* don't believe in vampires, but I believe in my own two eyes, and what *I* saw is ******* vampires! "
2. Yes, like most (if not all) MMOs you'll be able to do quests, which will result in getting items, gear, and other things. You can also gain levels and items through PvP, so it's up to you really. They've said that you can progress from level 1 to max level (40 ranks) by 100% PvP, 100% PvE, or a combination of both. it's up to the player.
3. If you are asking if you'll be rewarded, yes, like all other MMOs. If you're asking if that's the entire goal of the game, no. The begging, middle, and end game is all about RvR and pushing the battlefront towards your opponents capital city.
I don't really understand your first paragraph. There are 0 games coming out that even resemble WoW other than they are MMOs. WAR is the closest thing simply because it has Orcs, Dwarfs, and Elves.
Vanguard -nothing like WoW
Yulgang - Nothing like WoW
Pirates of the Burning Sea- Nothing like WoW
WAR - Gameplay and Graphics are nothing like WoW other than race selection.
AoC - Nothing like WoW
Darkfall - Nothing like WoW
Huxley - Nothing like WoW
The list goes on and on. I think saying any game is a "WoW clone" doesn't make much sense and saying that if a game has any instancing or PvE rewards then you're not going to play it pretty much means you shouldn't be playing MMOs anymore.
All of the upcoming ones, and almost every single one in the past except for a few have instances in some form and PvE rewards. AoC which is truly different from anything seen still has instancing and PvE rewards.
Also, if you could point me to these 99% of games that are WoW clones, I'd love to see them, since I've seen thist statement a thousand times and each time I ask to be pointed to these clones, but no one has given me a single game or link to one.
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I live to fight, and fight to live.
To be fair, LotRO is pretty much a WoW clone, only with better graphics and an actual story to follow. Plus, single faction. But to your questions:
1) Yes, there are instances, but most of the gameworld is persistant. Since you're the one that brought up WoW, I'll explain the differences. PvP will occur in both the persistant world and the instances. There are quests, goals, and all sorts of reasons to play in the persistant zones, so don't expect everyone to just queque up and wait for the instances. There are nearly 40 PvP instances planned. Unlike WoW, where there are only 3 BGs that never accomplish anything, WAR's instances matter. They are located all over the map at key points, and they contribute to the overall war effort. You earn victory points. In the Tier 4 zones at least (endgame), instances will open up and lock down depending on how the war is going. Say the Dwarfs capture the neutral zone. The content in the neutral zone will lock down, including the instance, and the conflict will move into the enemy's territory (opening a new instance). This keeps going all the way up to capturing the enemy city.
Also unlike WoW, instances don't give all the rewards. We can all agree that the introduction of BGs in WoW killed PvP in the persistant world. But why? Because all the incentives and rewards were in the BGs. Rank rewards, rep rewards, and faster honor. All you got for PvP in the regular game was repair costs. WAR differs from this, as there are things to do related to the PvP gameplay. You cannot just win the war by playing the instances. There are goals in the persistant world that need completing. There are Public Quests in the RvR zones that earn you rewards.
As for PvE, instancing will be kept at a minimum. I think they suggested that only boss fights would be instanced, and not the whole dungeons.
So if it was the way WoW handled instancing is what soured you towards the concept, WAR is going to do it differently. You won't spend your entire endgame career in instances.
2) Yes, but not solely. Well, they can, but they will progress much slower than if they were to RvR as well. Supposedly, the best rewards are from RvR, particularly capturing enemy cities. So unlike WoW, where raiders pwned everyone in PvP, that won't be the case here.
3) What? You never want to level up or get new gear? What kind of MMORPG is that? Yes, there is leveling, though it's broken up into 4 Tiers instead of multiple levels. How this will differ from other games is still unseen. You also gain gear rewards, and possibly skill rewards. Unlike WoW, though, your gear won't be your defining factor for strength. Abilities and skill come first.
So I answered yes to all your questions. But they weren't definitive. WAR is NOT a WoW clone. It has many things in common, as they are both MMOs. But it should be a more interesting experience than WoW, thanks to the constant RvR war.
Seriously.
It's Are'el. This forum doesn't allow apostrophes in usernames.
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I live to fight, and fight to live.
2. Yes, like most (if not all) MMOs you'll be able to do quests, which will result in getting items, gear, and other things. You can also gain levels and items through PvP, so it's up to you really. They've said that you can progress from level 1 to max level (40 ranks) by 100% PvP, 100% PvE, or a combination of both. it's up to the player.
3. If you are asking if you'll be rewarded, yes, like all other MMOs. If you're asking if that's the entire goal of the game, no. The begging, middle, and end game is all about RvR and pushing the battlefront towards your opponents capital city.
I don't really understand your first paragraph. There are 0 games coming out that even resemble WoW other than they are MMOs. WAR is the closest thing simply because it has Orcs, Dwarfs, and Elves.
Vanguard -nothing like WoW
Yulgang - Nothing like WoW
Pirates of the Burning Sea- Nothing like WoW
WAR - Gameplay and Graphics are nothing like WoW other than race selection.
AoC - Nothing like WoW
Darkfall - Nothing like WoW
Huxley - Nothing like WoW
The list goes on and on. I think saying any game is a "WoW clone" doesn't make much sense and saying that if a game has any instancing or PvE rewards then you're not going to play it pretty much means you shouldn't be playing MMOs anymore.
All of the upcoming ones, and almost every single one in the past except for a few have instances in some form and PvE rewards. AoC which is truly different from anything seen still has instancing and PvE rewards.
Also, if you could point me to these 99% of games that are WoW clones, I'd love to see them, since I've seen thist statement a thousand times and each time I ask to be pointed to these clones, but no one has given me a single game or link to one.
I'm sorry for my demeanor. I've been playing MMOs since before they were called MMOs and have been frustrated with the slow-change of the industry.
A wow clone? Look up auto assault, the new SWG, LotRO, Age of Conan, etc. I'd like you to point to me reasons that AoC is different than WoW! And for the sake of my sanity, I hope it is different! The upcoming games that I'm just now learning about don't look like WoW clones as much, however; which bolsters my attitude towards MMOs greatly! Still, I wouldn't say there are 0 other games that resemble WoW. While they will have new features, the core of the gameplay of certain games will be the same as WoW. Farm mobs, hand in quests, etc. I have the feeling that people can no longer distinguish between a WoW clone because WoW has defined the MMORPG market itself rather than defining the current MMORPG style. People drop alot of ideas that could have been great ones because the new idea is a game that 'isn't an MMORPG' because it isn't like WoW. Telling me not to play MMORPGs because what I am asking for is not like an MMORPG is succumbing to the same practice of making all MMORPGS into WoW.
Please don't come on here telling me not to play MMOs anymore. I do know what I'm talking about in regards to MMOs and also know that they can be designed without PVE and instancing. Coming from where I have, I wouldn't be surprised if every upcoming MMORPG was simply WoW (purchased from blizzard), but applied with different areas, theme, interface, and 3d models. The ignorant masses of Taco bell eaters and mac users would readily accept these new games as innovative if that were the case. Haha, just playing, but still, I wouldn't be overly surprised. You learn to be skeptical towards MMORPGs after having played the same thing too many years. I will of course try out WAR and give it fair trial.
I still find your post to leave out the grey area very much, and perhaps that's because my question left out the grey area. So I will digress on my earlier judgments in the hope that you take a more moderate approach to explaining the features of this new game to me.
Thanks for your posts! The answers were very informative.
As to number 3. I'm not really interested in making my character look cooler since I've realized that nobody ever cares much about anyone else's character and, well, polygons on a screen have no value to me. I LOVE the idea of a faction of guild increasing together as a unified unit, perhaps even sharing characters - although most people aren't ready for such a thing. I added the word 'extensive' to the question to allow for some tolerated grind/rewards.
The line with ABILITIES/SKILL answered this question with a 'no' for me. Since I would consider those to be a non-grind/reward system.
The RvR sounds awesome. Will the 'quests' be mostly PvP quests? Will PvE factor into the FactionVfaction war?
$OE lies list
http://www.rlmmo.com/viewtopic.php?t=424&start=0
"
And I don't want to hear anything about "I don't believe in vampires" because *I* don't believe in vampires, but I believe in my own two eyes, and what *I* saw is ******* vampires! "
judge a game on its own merit, not by how much you think it resembles the market leader.
Of course I'll give all games fair consideration, although the chain you mentioned is exactly what I want to escape. Different games will offer different varieties of it, and in time (possibly in the next decade) MMORPGs will arrive that don't involve such things. I prefer a more dynamic style of gamplay, rather than static. That isn't everyone's preference, but to me it is. This usually involves pvp, etc.
Also, please do not tell me to steer clear of RPGs. Everyone seems to reply to this thread with that same response. Just because someone doesn't like one aspect does not mean there are other likeable aspects of the game. There is a grey area in this argument.
Thanks for the input and all, but I will still be considering WAR, depending on how much it steers clear of repetitive gameplay.
Of course I'll give all games fair consideration, although the chain you mentioned is exactly what I want to escape. Different games will offer different varieties of it, and in time (possibly in the next decade) MMORPGs will arrive that don't involve such things. I prefer a more dynamic style of gamplay, rather than static. That isn't everyone's preference, but to me it is. This usually involves pvp, etc.
Also, please do not tell me to steer clear of RPGs. Everyone seems to reply to this thread with that same response. Just because someone doesn't like one aspect does not mean there are other likeable aspects of the game. There is a grey area in this argument.
Thanks for the input and all, but I will still be considering WAR, depending on how much it steers clear of repetitive gameplay.
In my opinion, in other words the reason I'm following WAR, is because it's content appears more dynamic then the rest. It sort of continues the WoW spirit, take the same old content and freshing it up, making it more immersive. For example, in Generic MMO, the quest would be "Kill 10 Birds". In WAR it's "Kill 10 Vultures! They're eating those Dwarf corpses damnit! I wanted to hang those on my wall as trophies!"(Actual quest by the way).
I also think RvR imrpoves the system a great deal. For one of the first times in a MMO, you can lose. In WoW, no matter what, your capitial will still be there. The lich king will never take hold of it or w/v. In LoTR Sauron will never win. AoC is a mystery rapped in an enigma, the Devs don't say **** about it. But in WAR, the Orcs(or and of the factions at all) can march right past your defenses if you aren't prepaired. They can slaughter your friends and family, deface your nations great works, uriniate on your stuff, and generally do a bunch of stuff that will really piss you off the next time you log back in. If you don't play WoW for a year and log back in, nothing will have changed. If you don't play WAR for a year, your nation will be ruins. That, to me, is next generation.
Oh anyway, PvP quests. In the begining of the game, about 66% of the content will be PvE and 33% PvP. At the end game, 66% of it will be PvP and 33% PvE. They're saying that you can PvP the entire game and not have a problem but you'll make it easier on yourself if you do both.
The most important quests in RvR are scenarios. They're instanced PvP. It resembled Unreal Tourniment a lot more than WoW though. There's no "capture the flag" for example because that makes no f'ing sense. Scenario examples have been "Dwarf Gyrocopters crash. Dwarfs have to save their allies before the Greenskins kill them.", "Some Gobolin grabbed an ancient artfiact. Kill him and grab it/Protect him.", and something involving control area victories where once you controled the areas your faction would fire at the enemies walls to break into their capitial.
There's public quests too, which are PvE bt seem pretty cool. They remind me a lot of CoH's giant monsters but it's a bit more detialed. For example, you'll help your faction cut down some wood but then the forest willl get pissed at you and send a giant tree monster to attack you. In another one you have to rally villagers to fight Chaos, once you do the Chaos Warriors start attacking you and you have to save your troops/survive. Then, Chaos getts really pissed at you and sends a Chaos Giant. Check out Paul's video blogs for what Giants/Chaos Giants look like.
Then there's objectives, which have been described as "One side tries to build a bridge, the other side tires to knock it down." I haven't seen to many of these first hand though. Check out thw zones on the official website, they have some examples/hints about the zone content.
2. Yes, like most (if not all) MMOs you'll be able to do quests, which will result in getting items, gear, and other things. You can also gain levels and items through PvP, so it's up to you really. They've said that you can progress from level 1 to max level (40 ranks) by 100% PvP, 100% PvE, or a combination of both. it's up to the player.
3. If you are asking if you'll be rewarded, yes, like all other MMOs. If you're asking if that's the entire goal of the game, no. The begging, middle, and end game is all about RvR and pushing the battlefront towards your opponents capital city.
I don't really understand your first paragraph. There are 0 games coming out that even resemble WoW other than they are MMOs. WAR is the closest thing simply because it has Orcs, Dwarfs, and Elves.
Vanguard -nothing like WoW
Yulgang - Nothing like WoW
Pirates of the Burning Sea- Nothing like WoW
WAR - Gameplay and Graphics are nothing like WoW other than race selection.
AoC - Nothing like WoW
Darkfall - Nothing like WoW
Huxley - Nothing like WoW
The list goes on and on. I think saying any game is a "WoW clone" doesn't make much sense and saying that if a game has any instancing or PvE rewards then you're not going to play it pretty much means you shouldn't be playing MMOs anymore.
All of the upcoming ones, and almost every single one in the past except for a few have instances in some form and PvE rewards. AoC which is truly different from anything seen still has instancing and PvE rewards.
Also, if you could point me to these 99% of games that are WoW clones, I'd love to see them, since I've seen thist statement a thousand times and each time I ask to be pointed to these clones, but no one has given me a single game or link to one.
I'm sorry for my demeanor. I've been playing MMOs since before they were called MMOs and have been frustrated with the slow-change of the industry.
A wow clone? Look up auto assault, the new SWG, LotRO, Age of Conan, etc. I'd like you to point to me reasons that AoC is different than WoW! And for the sake of my sanity, I hope it is different! The upcoming games that I'm just now learning about don't look like WoW clones as much, however; which bolsters my attitude towards MMOs greatly! Still, I wouldn't say there are 0 other games that resemble WoW. While they will have new features, the core of the gameplay of certain games will be the same as WoW. Farm mobs, hand in quests, etc. I have the feeling that people can no longer distinguish between a WoW clone because WoW has defined the MMORPG market itself rather than defining the current MMORPG style. People drop alot of ideas that could have been great ones because the new idea is a game that 'isn't an MMORPG' because it isn't like WoW. Telling me not to play MMORPGs because what I am asking for is not like an MMORPG is succumbing to the same practice of making all MMORPGS into WoW.
Please don't come on here telling me not to play MMOs anymore. I do know what I'm talking about in regards to MMOs and also know that they can be designed without PVE and instancing. Coming from where I have, I wouldn't be surprised if every upcoming MMORPG was simply WoW (purchased from blizzard), but applied with different areas, theme, interface, and 3d models. The ignorant masses of Taco bell eaters and mac users would readily accept these new games as innovative if that were the case. Haha, just playing, but still, I wouldn't be overly surprised. You learn to be skeptical towards MMORPGs after having played the same thing too many years. I will of course try out WAR and give it fair trial.
I still find your post to leave out the grey area very much, and perhaps that's because my question left out the grey area. So I will digress on my earlier judgments in the hope that you take a more moderate approach to explaining the features of this new game to me.
I can point out many reasons why all of those are different than WoW. You're description of WoW clones having "Farm mobs, hand in quests, etc. " would mean that every single MMO to ever exist except for a very rare few is like WoW. So you're basically saying that if it's an MMO, and has MMO features then it's a WoW clone. WoW wasn't the first to have quests and farming mobs. If you've been playing MMOs since before they were called MMOs then you would know this.
I didn't realize you wanted features. I'll just list the ones that I think are evolutionary to the genre.
Public Quests - You don't talk to a quest giver, you get the quest as soon as you enter the Quest's area, and everyone in that area can participate. You get rewards based on how much you participate.
RvR from day 1 - As soon as you start the game you can access PvP and you can do it as much as you want whenever you want. It's not FFA PvP, it's in areas designated for it. There are 4 types of PvP, one of which is instanced. (scenarios)
Unique Classes - Weapons/Armor are made to be class/race specific. So a Dwarf Hammerer won't use the same hammers as an Empire Warrior Priest. The Hammerer will also only use hammers.
No Heal bots - All of the Healing classes increase the effectiveness of their heals by being in combat, so they're made to be hybrids, and if you only focus on combat or on healing, you won't be as effective as if you did both.
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I live to fight, and fight to live.