This is great haha! I still got my point across AGAIN. I love how you didnt address that I called you on insults and elitism, yet instead reinforced what I had already mentioned. When are you gonna get that people have other opinions? Sorry if I didnt recommend your game but yeah...unplug.
I thought your initial post was very good, to bad you guys managed to get hostile to each other.
I would only disagree based on Vanguards technical issues alone. Whether is a "better" game or not is subjective and based on playstyles and taste. The reality is the game is in rough shape and needs a lot more work. It was no where near ready for launch. I was a beta tester for 4 months.
As a result, it was rightfully sacked in the reviews. Everything else aside, it was completely unfair and misleading to expect the customers to pay for an unfinished game. Who knows, it might shape up to be an awesome game one day but its not right that that they expect the players to pay for an unfinished game that is still missing some of its advertised features. There was another game that experienced a very similar launch. They promised the moon and delivered a ball of mud.....that game was Horizons.
So in my view, it really comes down to L2 and WoW, unless you have no problem paying to beta, and that is not an easy thing to answer as L2 and WoW are as different as night and day.
Lineage 2 is great. It's really simple, really addictive, and yes the community CAN be good. But seriously, the reality that everyone seems to gloss over is that the economy is completely broken. The only way to get ahead is to buy Adena (gold) from gold farmers. It's not really the gold farmer's fault, it's just bad design. In order to get A or S class (two of the best in the game) gear you need extremely rare drops. We're talking 1% chance that when you kill a mob (that only spawns every 12hrs) you'll get that "piece 2 of 10" drop you need. The gold farmers will see that someone is selling one, buy it up, then sell it back for 3-4 times the amount. An honest, legit player could never hope to afford it, which is what the gold farmers want.
The community is pretty shattered. If you've ever experience the elitist behavior of FFXI's community then maybe you've already lost your cherry for what's coming next. People will kick you out of a group if you dont have the appropriate expensive power-up that they used with their gold farmer purchased money to buy. But can you really blame them? If you arent efficient then you're holding everyone else back. Harsh reality. The game is also marred by stupid teenagers that say dick and fart jokes all day long, must leave every time their mom calls them to do a chore, and will kill you regardless of the consequences it brings for them.
I wouldnt recommend this game, but damn if it isnt one of the best I've played besides these flaws.
*World of Warcraft
WoW is easy mode, plain and simple. You can play for as long as you like with little consequence. If you pick a "carebear" PvE server there is still lots of chance for rewarding PvP through battlegrounds, and the regular pvp servers bring the excitement and paranoia of knowing there's always an enemy nearby. I think it's extremely fun, and would recommend it for anyone that wants a more arcade style experience.
If you're up for raid content, WoW has some of the best hands down. The strategy involved to take down bosses was well thought out and rewarding to execute.
The community is the worst...EVER. Nothing but 12 yr old griefers and nerds over compensating for their...well you know. They talk lots of smack, dont help unless they get something out of it, and roll "greed" on all the gear they dont need, only to d/c conveniently after they have it.
To me, the game lacks real content. The quests are never interesting, and hardly reveal the supposedly vast amounts of story Blizzard claims the game has. The game is so easy to play solo (you can get from 1-70 all by yourself) that no one has an excuse to group up. This isnt always a bad thing, but I would rather play something like Oblivion for 100hrs and feel like I was doing something other than grinding experience.
The biggest reason to play is that the game will run on any pc manufactured in the last 5 years. The system requirements are amazingly low.
*Vanguard: Saga of Heroes
I played this one during open beta and it was utterly horrible. From the get go they were claiming the game has pvp "from the ground up" which would usually imply balance, but they didnt enable the pvp server until a week before launch. Yay balance testing! It's true what everyone (including the devs) say, that the game was released about 3 months early.
Now that the game has been out for a while, most of the earth shattering bugs have been eliminated. The game runs well (regardless of what some others would repeat through hearsay) as long as you have the recommended system requirements. It's the best looking MMO out there, with beautiful landscapes, and colorful pc races.
The community is great as long as you dont play on a FFA PvP server. It's the ultimate gank fest then. I once had a guy that was 10 levels higher than me camp my "corpse" just to kill me over and over again without any reward, just to be a jerk off. The PvE community is great though, and as soon as you ask a question you'll get 5 answers.
Now content in terms of story: This game is lacking, but the quests are fun and give you a real purpose to kill X amount of woodland beasts. Where the game really shines is in the mechanics department. There are so many things you can do it's ridiculous. Want to build a house on a piece of land that you staked out? Go right ahead. Ahoy matey! Build your own ships and sail the world. Gank lowbies if you feel like it. There's also a Diplomacy feature in the game that will actually change the world around you. Like if you think that a certain area is too infested with enemies, you can influence a local official to "spawn" more guards. It works kind of like a Magic the Gathering card game, except that you level up and get new cards the more you do it.
The game definitely needs some optimizations. This is especially true when lots of NPCs are nearby, like in a large city. The game renders NPCs in the direction you are facing, even if they are behind a wall. So when you're facing a large city gate it's rendering 100+ npcs behind it, causing your computer to chunk along.
Leveling is slow, but not a grind fest. The fastest way to level is by completing quests. This is made all the more hard by the fact that the world is HUGE and to get from A to B takes lots of time. This really applies at 9 and under, but at 10 you get your first mount. Some mounts even double as pack horses for extra loot. For me, the large world is a plus, because I like to explore.
*In closing:
Of the 3 you mentioned I would play vanguard. I know I'm one ofthe few willing to put up with sigil/verant/soe's bullshit but its just a cool game with lots of stuff to do.
I would recommend one you havent listed though. EverQuest 2. That game is fun. It's fast, has tons of content for all play styles (solo, raid, group, quester, roleplayer) etc. Most of my friends went from FFXI to that game and love it. The community is the best you'll find in an MMO. The graphics are gorgeous (though a little bland in the design department) and are very optimized. The scripted events will remind you of some of the FFXI cutscenes.
Everquest 2 unfortunately got a bad rep at launch, due to the game sucking balls. It's improved much, though unfortunately most people dont care haha.
Anyway, have fun with whatever you pick!
The economy is not broken. It is just hard. The problem is people want the best of everything right now. I have been playing on my current server for 6 months and am lvl 58 and Just finished getting my B gear and have never bought gold. You have to play the market and craft which a lot of players don't want to do. L2 is a game about forming a comunity that lives and dies as a team. It is not a 1 on 1 PVP game. People who join the game for that and then lvl up a toon buying there stuff off of gold farmers are the ones that jump on these boards and complain about hard the economy or how there class got nerfed. To find groups all you need to do is shout in one of the catecombs and someone will pick you up. Anyone who really plays the game for fun realizes that it is much more fun to hunt in a party then solo.
As far as the other games on the list I have played wow for two months but after experincing the comuity of L2 it just wasn't for me. I never had to group and when I did it was always with a differnt set of people. So if you are into more solo play then wow is probably a good choice. I like wow because it is a gate way mmo. It gives people who would not normally play a MMO a taste of what a MMO is. Some of these people move on to the more mature mmo's that are in the market. A lot of the new people I have met in L2 came from WOW.
I have to admit your post is a little insulting and implies that I am one of the gold buying whiners you've mentioned. " People who join the game for that and then lvl up a toon buying there stuff off of gold farmers are the ones that jump on these boards and complain about hard the economy or how there class got nerfed." This is not so. You've seriously been grinding for 6 months just to get to 58? The max level is 75 and then there are the class changes. 6 months is an unacceptable amount of time to me, especially since half of that grind was for the adena to get your b-grade gear. Now I dont want the fast "I got to 60 in 2 weeks!" leveling of WoW but what's the pay off? Lineage 2 doesnt have any other systems to keep it interesting unless you just want to log in and chat with people for a few hrs, which is fine, though you could do that and a lot more in other games. I had lots of fun grinding out raids, and I got from 1-40 in two weeks just doing that, but seriously after the lvl 35 class transfer I found that it was just grind grind grind without any real depth.
I still stick by the fact that the economy IS broken and was originally created as a time sink so that you dont power/level up too fast. The botters and adena farmers had a field day by exploiting the the fact that people cant stay logged in 24/7 like they can. So they grab all the raids people want at say 3am and, as I've said, sell all the gear for crazy prices, only to inflate the market more with their adena. It has no system of checks and balances and I'd guarantee that 3/5 members of your guild arent 100% legit because they wanted to remain competitive. I wasnt willing to commit to the endless grind, and you may consider that a fault, but it is also the reason I dont play. As I had ALSO mentioned, it's still one of the most fun games around.
So for the thread creator I'd also like to address "playing the market". Only one race can craft anything of use in the game, and that's the dwarves. Every time you craft or upgrade something there's a chance your components will be destroyed. Though this is realistic, it's not fun to lose your hard earned money on that a-grade armor you just ruined. This also means that the time you spend leveling up your crafting characters skills is taking away from the time you level up your main combat character if they are anything but a dwarf fighter class (the only thing they can be besides craftsman).
Now to simply invalidate my very valid observations is just silly, and I cant understand your need to defend a GAME by resorting to insulting insinuations. Again this is just one person's opinion and I very much respect yours.
Sorry was not trying to be insulting. Its that you don't get the point. L2 is a game about community. Its supposed to be hard to get equipment and your not ment to do it alone. The game is about building clans and competing as a team. If you belong to a strong clan they help each other get their gear. Pooling their mats to be able to craft things. Helping each other with adena. My point was if you approach the game as how quickly I level; how quickly I get my gear etc. you will be very disappointed in the game. However, if you like a game that is about team work and community you will love l2. It comes down to your playing style. If you like to solo and reach the highest level "fast" what ever "fast" means to you the l2 is not the place for you.
Having an active clan member you have played for months with leave l2 is like some one quitting a basketball team in the middle of the season. That is the level of importance of your fellow clan members. With that said that level of commitment does not happen in a day. People have gone to war with other clans that accept a member that is clan hopping to see what gear they can scam from the clan so when you join you have to earn your place on the team before you can expect a lot of help.
The net - net I enjoy the game but seldom look at the exp bar as my gauge for how much I enjoy it. When I get a level or a new piece of equipment it means something. So back to my original recommendation, if you like team play and community based game join L2 you will love it. If you like to solo and want fast rewards play wow. No comment on vanguard as I have not played it. I may try it after it stabilizes.
I don't know why people say you can't craft anything. There are dwarven craft shops. Yes, there is a fee but it is usually marginal compared to the item you are making. It still does not take away the possibility of crafting for profit. People who post that you can't craft anything if you are a race other than dwarf are just ignorant.
Wouldnt giving items and money to a dwarf crafting station imply that the computer is crafting the item for you? Would that not also imply that you arent crafting the item yourself?
Sorry was not trying to be insulting. Its that you don't get the point. L2 is a game about community. Its supposed to be hard to get equipment and your not ment to do it alone. The game is about building clans and competing as a team. If you belong to a strong clan they help each other get their gear. Pooling their mats to be able to craft things. Helping each other with adena. My point was if you approach the game as how quickly I level; how quickly I get my gear etc. you will be very disappointed in the game. However, if you like a game that is about team work and community you will love l2. It comes down to your playing style. If you like to solo and reach the highest level "fast" what ever "fast" means to you the l2 is not the place for you.
Having an active clan member you have played for months with leave l2 is like some one quitting a basketball team in the middle of the season. That is the level of importance of your fellow clan members. With that said that level of commitment does not happen in a day. People have gone to war with other clans that accept a member that is clan hopping to see what gear they can scam from the clan so when you join you have to earn your place on the team before you can expect a lot of help.
The net - net I enjoy the game but seldom look at the exp bar as my gauge for how much I enjoy it. When I get a level or a new piece of equipment it means something. So back to my original recommendation, if you like team play and community based game join L2 you will love it. If you like to solo and want fast rewards play wow. No comment on vanguard as I have not played it. I may try it after it stabilizes.
Sorry was not trying to be insulting. Its that you don't get the point. L2 is a game about community. Its supposed to be hard to get equipment and your not ment to do it alone. The game is about building clans and competing as a team. If you belong to a strong clan they help each other get their gear. Pooling their mats to be able to craft things. Helping each other with adena. My point was if you approach the game as how quickly I level; how quickly I get my gear etc. you will be very disappointed in the game. However, if you like a game that is about team work and community you will love l2. It comes down to your playing style. If you like to solo and reach the highest level "fast" what ever "fast" means to you the l2 is not the place for you.
Having an active clan member you have played for months with leave l2 is like some one quitting a basketball team in the middle of the season. That is the level of importance of your fellow clan members. With that said that level of commitment does not happen in a day. People have gone to war with other clans that accept a member that is clan hopping to see what gear they can scam from the clan so when you join you have to earn your place on the team before you can expect a lot of help.
The net - net I enjoy the game but seldom look at the exp bar as my gauge for how much I enjoy it. When I get a level or a new piece of equipment it means something. So back to my original recommendation, if you like team play and community based game join L2 you will love it. If you like to solo and want fast rewards play wow. No comment on vanguard as I have not played it. I may try it after it stabilizes.
Hey it's no problem. Good input!
Like I said again, its MORE insulting to me to hear from someone who only played this game to level 40, which is NO WHERE NEAR THE END GAME to say what his "opinions" are of that end game. Nor is it "elitism" when I have invested the time to level 76+ and CAN ACTUALLY COMMENT on the end game because I played it, while YOU have never even gotten close to it.
Sorry was not trying to be insulting. Its that you don't get the point. L2 is a game about community. Its supposed to be hard to get equipment and your not ment to do it alone. The game is about building clans and competing as a team. If you belong to a strong clan they help each other get their gear. Pooling their mats to be able to craft things. Helping each other with adena. My point was if you approach the game as how quickly I level; how quickly I get my gear etc. you will be very disappointed in the game. However, if you like a game that is about team work and community you will love l2. It comes down to your playing style. If you like to solo and reach the highest level "fast" what ever "fast" means to you the l2 is not the place for you.
Having an active clan member you have played for months with leave l2 is like some one quitting a basketball team in the middle of the season. That is the level of importance of your fellow clan members. With that said that level of commitment does not happen in a day. People have gone to war with other clans that accept a member that is clan hopping to see what gear they can scam from the clan so when you join you have to earn your place on the team before you can expect a lot of help.
The net - net I enjoy the game but seldom look at the exp bar as my gauge for how much I enjoy it. When I get a level or a new piece of equipment it means something. So back to my original recommendation, if you like team play and community based game join L2 you will love it. If you like to solo and want fast rewards play wow. No comment on vanguard as I have not played it. I may try it after it stabilizes.
Hey it's no problem. Good input!
Like I said again, its MORE insulting to me to hear from someone who only played this game to level 40, which is NO WHERE NEAR THE END GAME to say what his "opinions" are of that end game. Nor is it "elitism" when I have invested the time to level 76+ and CAN ACTUALLY COMMENT on the end game because I played it, while YOU have never even gotten close to it.
When YOU get to the end game, try again. ok?
You're just making yourself look bad now. Let it go. How many times must I say this? It's an opinion. Ok so you dont agree. I've not once said yours is wrong. What I have been saying is that you keep bragging about how L337 you are. The OP was asking what we thought of the game. I said my view, you've said yours.
As a matter of fact you're just making the L2 community look bad by pursuing this. Are you setting the example that L2 players are overly-competitive and cant handle when other people voice their opposing opinion? Just settle for the middle ground, which is where all of us should be.
Sorry was not trying to be insulting. Its that you don't get the point. L2 is a game about community. Its supposed to be hard to get equipment and your not ment to do it alone. The game is about building clans and competing as a team. If you belong to a strong clan they help each other get their gear. Pooling their mats to be able to craft things. Helping each other with adena. My point was if you approach the game as how quickly I level; how quickly I get my gear etc. you will be very disappointed in the game. However, if you like a game that is about team work and community you will love l2. It comes down to your playing style. If you like to solo and reach the highest level "fast" what ever "fast" means to you the l2 is not the place for you.
Having an active clan member you have played for months with leave l2 is like some one quitting a basketball team in the middle of the season. That is the level of importance of your fellow clan members. With that said that level of commitment does not happen in a day. People have gone to war with other clans that accept a member that is clan hopping to see what gear they can scam from the clan so when you join you have to earn your place on the team before you can expect a lot of help.
The net - net I enjoy the game but seldom look at the exp bar as my gauge for how much I enjoy it. When I get a level or a new piece of equipment it means something. So back to my original recommendation, if you like team play and community based game join L2 you will love it. If you like to solo and want fast rewards play wow. No comment on vanguard as I have not played it. I may try it after it stabilizes.
Hey it's no problem. Good input!
Like I said again, its MORE insulting to me to hear from someone who only played this game to level 40, which is NO WHERE NEAR THE END GAME to say what his "opinions" are of that end game. Nor is it "elitism" when I have invested the time to level 76+ and CAN ACTUALLY COMMENT on the end game because I played it, while YOU have never even gotten close to it.
When YOU get to the end game, try again. ok?
You're just making yourself look bad now. Let it go. How many times must I say this? It's an opinion. Ok so you dont agree. I've not once said yours is wrong. What I have been saying is that you keep bragging about how L337 you are. The OP was asking what we thought of the game. I said my view, you've said yours.
As a matter of fact you're just making the L2 community look bad by pursuing this. Are you setting the example that L2 players are overly-competitive and cant handle when other people voice their opposing opinion? Just settle for the middle ground, which is where all of us should be.
Don't try that psychological bullshit on me, just like your initial post. You said its a great game but you don't recommend it? WTF? Why dont you make up your mind or actually make sense?
If you *THINK* its a great game, then exactly why aren't you recommending it? Don't you mean its not such a great game? I really don't get your logic.
As for making the L2 community look bad...LOL. Are you kidding me? I'm actually making it look good because I actually KNOW WTF I'm talking about because I played and made it to level 76+ which takes a LOT of time to do. I can give the new user MORE ACCURATE info on the game as for your 40 levels in 2 weeks of play. Maybe your more of the WoW crowd?
L2 is a HARDCORE game. Get it? You just couldn't handle what you called the "grind" to reach end user content. BUT for some reason you keep harping about what an expert you are on this game AND the end content, which YOU have NEVER experienced. Hell, just for that alone, I think people will see what kind of community L2 has. Someone like you who are more WoW minded and "kiddie" oriented defintely is NOT a "plus" orientation for the L2 community. Just the fact alone that this game weeds gamers like you out, give L2 a HUGE plus.
Don't try that psychological bullshit on me, just like your initial post. You said its a great game but you don't recommend it? WTF? Why dont you make up your mind or actually make sense?
If you *THINK* its a great game, then exactly why aren't you recommending it? Don't you mean its not such a great game? I really don't get your logic.
As for making the L2 community look bad...LOL. Are you kidding me? I'm actually making it look good because I actually KNOW WTF I'm talking about because I played and made it to level 76+ which takes a LOT of time to do. I can give the new user MORE ACCURATE info on the game as for your 40 levels in 2 weeks of play. Maybe your more of the WoW crowd?
L2 is a HARDCORE game. Get it? You just couldn't handle what you called the "grind" to reach end user content. BUT for some reason you keep harping about what an expert you are on this game AND the end content, which YOU have NEVER experienced. Hell, just for that alone, I think people will see what kind of community L2 has. Someone like you who are more WoW minded and "kiddie" oriented defintely is NOT a "plus" orientation for the L2 community. Just the fact alone that this game weeds gamers like you out, give L2 a HUGE plus.
You're doing it again. If you'll go back and re-read all of my posts I have never once claimed to be an expert nor do I "continue" to harp on the game. I keep stating that we have different views. My comments on the game are limited to 2 posts, while your posts repeat how you're a hardcore gamer and that you arent intelligent enough to say anything but insults, for what I view as no reason at all.
Ok you're hardcore. Let me get you a metal and while I'm at I'll see if someone can give you a reach around. Seriously, why do you persist?
I don't know why people say you can't craft anything. There are dwarven craft shops. Yes, there is a fee but it is usually marginal compared to the item you are making. It still does not take away the possibility of crafting for profit. People who post that you can't craft anything if you are a race other than dwarf are just ignorant.
Wouldnt giving items and money to a dwarf crafting station imply that the computer is crafting the item for you? Would that not also imply that you arent crafting the item yourself? Or, how about buying materials from other players or grouping with others and gaining materials in the process. Or, how about you actually playing a dwarf but buying the recipe off of another player and using that to craft. Those aren't solo projects. Let's not play semantics.
Oh, thosewhoharp, your opinion is wrong. It's not an opinion. You have no idea what you are talking about. The only way to obtain s or a grade is to get it from drops? Are you smoking crack?
Don't try that psychological bullshit on me, just like your initial post. You said its a great game but you don't recommend it? WTF? Why dont you make up your mind or actually make sense?
If you *THINK* its a great game, then exactly why aren't you recommending it? Don't you mean its not such a great game? I really don't get your logic.
As for making the L2 community look bad...LOL. Are you kidding me? I'm actually making it look good because I actually KNOW WTF I'm talking about because I played and made it to level 76+ which takes a LOT of time to do. I can give the new user MORE ACCURATE info on the game as for your 40 levels in 2 weeks of play. Maybe your more of the WoW crowd?
L2 is a HARDCORE game. Get it? You just couldn't handle what you called the "grind" to reach end user content. BUT for some reason you keep harping about what an expert you are on this game AND the end content, which YOU have NEVER experienced. Hell, just for that alone, I think people will see what kind of community L2 has. Someone like you who are more WoW minded and "kiddie" oriented defintely is NOT a "plus" orientation for the L2 community. Just the fact alone that this game weeds gamers like you out, give L2 a HUGE plus.
You're doing it again. If you'll go back and re-read all of my posts I have never once claimed to be an expert nor do I "continue" to harp on the game. I keep stating that we have different views. My comments on the game are limited to 2 posts, while your posts repeat how you're a hardcore gamer and that you arent intelligent enough to say anything but insults, for what I view as no reason at all.
Ok you're hardcore. Let me get you a metal and while I'm at I'll see if someone can give you a reach around. Seriously, why do you persist?
er I think you have some kind of chip on your shoulder. I said you have never played the end content and you have no clue what your talking about there because of THAT. How exactly did I "insult" you since you keep insinuating that I did? QUOTE me where I specifically insulted you other than the fact that I pointed out you never got past level 40?
Are you somehow implying than that you actually KNOW what your talking about when you made your comments about the End Game, when you didnt even experience it?
Also, why should I stop when you keep INSULTING me?
- it has quite nice background graphics, although quite sloppy and cartonish
- it has a well made class system with interesting spells, atacks, quite ballanced
- quite easy to lvl and get gear
CONS:
- horribile character design
- I don't like the fact that you have to chose between horde or aliance. It somehow restricts you since you have your side decided from the begining
- weak pvp system... only some areas, only if the other guy agrees, only if he's from the opposing faction
- no castle control, no real reason for clan wars
Lineage2
Pros
- it is almost 1 year older than WOW but it still has stunning graphics, great artwork and char design for it's age
- good and open pvp system, you can kill anybody and almost anywhere with a certain risk
- good clan system which offers a solid reason for clan wars, castle sieges
- castle control and siege
- the most addictive game... you will hate the guy that killed you, you always wanna know who betrayed who, who fights who, who you should negociate an ally or who you should atack
Cons
- the grinding is huge... the game might be way to hard to play, i mean lvl and get decent items for a lot of ppl
Comments
I thought your initial post was very good, to bad you guys managed to get hostile to each other.
I would only disagree based on Vanguards technical issues alone. Whether is a "better" game or not is subjective and based on playstyles and taste. The reality is the game is in rough shape and needs a lot more work. It was no where near ready for launch. I was a beta tester for 4 months.
As a result, it was rightfully sacked in the reviews. Everything else aside, it was completely unfair and misleading to expect the customers to pay for an unfinished game. Who knows, it might shape up to be an awesome game one day but its not right that that they expect the players to pay for an unfinished game that is still missing some of its advertised features. There was another game that experienced a very similar launch. They promised the moon and delivered a ball of mud.....that game was Horizons.
So in my view, it really comes down to L2 and WoW, unless you have no problem paying to beta, and that is not an easy thing to answer as L2 and WoW are as different as night and day.
The economy is not broken. It is just hard. The problem is people want the best of everything right now. I have been playing on my current server for 6 months and am lvl 58 and Just finished getting my B gear and have never bought gold. You have to play the market and craft which a lot of players don't want to do. L2 is a game about forming a comunity that lives and dies as a team. It is not a 1 on 1 PVP game. People who join the game for that and then lvl up a toon buying there stuff off of gold farmers are the ones that jump on these boards and complain about hard the economy or how there class got nerfed. To find groups all you need to do is shout in one of the catecombs and someone will pick you up. Anyone who really plays the game for fun realizes that it is much more fun to hunt in a party then solo.
As far as the other games on the list I have played wow for two months but after experincing the comuity of L2 it just wasn't for me. I never had to group and when I did it was always with a differnt set of people. So if you are into more solo play then wow is probably a good choice. I like wow because it is a gate way mmo. It gives people who would not normally play a MMO a taste of what a MMO is. Some of these people move on to the more mature mmo's that are in the market. A lot of the new people I have met in L2 came from WOW.
I have to admit your post is a little insulting and implies that I am one of the gold buying whiners you've mentioned. " People who join the game for that and then lvl up a toon buying there stuff off of gold farmers are the ones that jump on these boards and complain about hard the economy or how there class got nerfed." This is not so. You've seriously been grinding for 6 months just to get to 58? The max level is 75 and then there are the class changes. 6 months is an unacceptable amount of time to me, especially since half of that grind was for the adena to get your b-grade gear. Now I dont want the fast "I got to 60 in 2 weeks!" leveling of WoW but what's the pay off? Lineage 2 doesnt have any other systems to keep it interesting unless you just want to log in and chat with people for a few hrs, which is fine, though you could do that and a lot more in other games. I had lots of fun grinding out raids, and I got from 1-40 in two weeks just doing that, but seriously after the lvl 35 class transfer I found that it was just grind grind grind without any real depth.
I still stick by the fact that the economy IS broken and was originally created as a time sink so that you dont power/level up too fast. The botters and adena farmers had a field day by exploiting the the fact that people cant stay logged in 24/7 like they can. So they grab all the raids people want at say 3am and, as I've said, sell all the gear for crazy prices, only to inflate the market more with their adena. It has no system of checks and balances and I'd guarantee that 3/5 members of your guild arent 100% legit because they wanted to remain competitive. I wasnt willing to commit to the endless grind, and you may consider that a fault, but it is also the reason I dont play. As I had ALSO mentioned, it's still one of the most fun games around.
So for the thread creator I'd also like to address "playing the market". Only one race can craft anything of use in the game, and that's the dwarves. Every time you craft or upgrade something there's a chance your components will be destroyed. Though this is realistic, it's not fun to lose your hard earned money on that a-grade armor you just ruined. This also means that the time you spend leveling up your crafting characters skills is taking away from the time you level up your main combat character if they are anything but a dwarf fighter class (the only thing they can be besides craftsman).
Now to simply invalidate my very valid observations is just silly, and I cant understand your need to defend a GAME by resorting to insulting insinuations. Again this is just one person's opinion and I very much respect yours.
Hey it's no problem. Good input!
Hey it's no problem. Good input!
Like I said again, its MORE insulting to me to hear from someone who only played this game to level 40, which is NO WHERE NEAR THE END GAME to say what his "opinions" are of that end game. Nor is it "elitism" when I have invested the time to level 76+ and CAN ACTUALLY COMMENT on the end game because I played it, while YOU have never even gotten close to it.
When YOU get to the end game, try again. ok?
Hey it's no problem. Good input!
Like I said again, its MORE insulting to me to hear from someone who only played this game to level 40, which is NO WHERE NEAR THE END GAME to say what his "opinions" are of that end game. Nor is it "elitism" when I have invested the time to level 76+ and CAN ACTUALLY COMMENT on the end game because I played it, while YOU have never even gotten close to it.
When YOU get to the end game, try again. ok?
You're just making yourself look bad now. Let it go. How many times must I say this? It's an opinion. Ok so you dont agree. I've not once said yours is wrong. What I have been saying is that you keep bragging about how L337 you are. The OP was asking what we thought of the game. I said my view, you've said yours.
As a matter of fact you're just making the L2 community look bad by pursuing this. Are you setting the example that L2 players are overly-competitive and cant handle when other people voice their opposing opinion? Just settle for the middle ground, which is where all of us should be.
Hey it's no problem. Good input!
Like I said again, its MORE insulting to me to hear from someone who only played this game to level 40, which is NO WHERE NEAR THE END GAME to say what his "opinions" are of that end game. Nor is it "elitism" when I have invested the time to level 76+ and CAN ACTUALLY COMMENT on the end game because I played it, while YOU have never even gotten close to it.
When YOU get to the end game, try again. ok?
You're just making yourself look bad now. Let it go. How many times must I say this? It's an opinion. Ok so you dont agree. I've not once said yours is wrong. What I have been saying is that you keep bragging about how L337 you are. The OP was asking what we thought of the game. I said my view, you've said yours.
As a matter of fact you're just making the L2 community look bad by pursuing this. Are you setting the example that L2 players are overly-competitive and cant handle when other people voice their opposing opinion? Just settle for the middle ground, which is where all of us should be.
Don't try that psychological bullshit on me, just like your initial post. You said its a great game but you don't recommend it? WTF? Why dont you make up your mind or actually make sense?
If you *THINK* its a great game, then exactly why aren't you recommending it? Don't you mean its not such a great game? I really don't get your logic.
As for making the L2 community look bad...LOL. Are you kidding me?
I'm actually making it look good because I actually KNOW WTF I'm talking about because I played and made it to level 76+ which takes a LOT of time to do. I can give the new user MORE ACCURATE info on the game as for your 40 levels in 2 weeks of play. Maybe your more of the WoW crowd?
L2 is a HARDCORE game. Get it? You just couldn't handle what you called the "grind" to reach end user content. BUT for some reason you keep harping about what an expert you are on this game AND the end content, which YOU have NEVER experienced. Hell, just for that alone, I think people will see what kind of community L2 has. Someone like you who are more WoW minded and "kiddie" oriented defintely is NOT a "plus" orientation for the L2 community. Just the fact alone that this game weeds gamers like you out, give L2 a HUGE plus.
Don't try that psychological bullshit on me, just like your initial post. You said its a great game but you don't recommend it? WTF? Why dont you make up your mind or actually make sense?
If you *THINK* its a great game, then exactly why aren't you recommending it? Don't you mean its not such a great game? I really don't get your logic.
As for making the L2 community look bad...LOL. Are you kidding me?
I'm actually making it look good because I actually KNOW WTF I'm talking about because I played and made it to level 76+ which takes a LOT of time to do. I can give the new user MORE ACCURATE info on the game as for your 40 levels in 2 weeks of play. Maybe your more of the WoW crowd?
L2 is a HARDCORE game. Get it? You just couldn't handle what you called the "grind" to reach end user content. BUT for some reason you keep harping about what an expert you are on this game AND the end content, which YOU have NEVER experienced. Hell, just for that alone, I think people will see what kind of community L2 has. Someone like you who are more WoW minded and "kiddie" oriented defintely is NOT a "plus" orientation for the L2 community. Just the fact alone that this game weeds gamers like you out, give L2 a HUGE plus.
You're doing it again. If you'll go back and re-read all of my posts I have never once claimed to be an expert nor do I "continue" to harp on the game. I keep stating that we have different views. My comments on the game are limited to 2 posts, while your posts repeat how you're a hardcore gamer and that you arent intelligent enough to say anything but insults, for what I view as no reason at all.
Ok you're hardcore. Let me get you a metal and while I'm at I'll see if someone can give you a reach around. Seriously, why do you persist?
Don't try that psychological bullshit on me, just like your initial post. You said its a great game but you don't recommend it? WTF? Why dont you make up your mind or actually make sense?
If you *THINK* its a great game, then exactly why aren't you recommending it? Don't you mean its not such a great game? I really don't get your logic.
As for making the L2 community look bad...LOL. Are you kidding me?
I'm actually making it look good because I actually KNOW WTF I'm talking about because I played and made it to level 76+ which takes a LOT of time to do. I can give the new user MORE ACCURATE info on the game as for your 40 levels in 2 weeks of play. Maybe your more of the WoW crowd?
L2 is a HARDCORE game. Get it? You just couldn't handle what you called the "grind" to reach end user content. BUT for some reason you keep harping about what an expert you are on this game AND the end content, which YOU have NEVER experienced. Hell, just for that alone, I think people will see what kind of community L2 has. Someone like you who are more WoW minded and "kiddie" oriented defintely is NOT a "plus" orientation for the L2 community. Just the fact alone that this game weeds gamers like you out, give L2 a HUGE plus.
You're doing it again. If you'll go back and re-read all of my posts I have never once claimed to be an expert nor do I "continue" to harp on the game. I keep stating that we have different views. My comments on the game are limited to 2 posts, while your posts repeat how you're a hardcore gamer and that you arent intelligent enough to say anything but insults, for what I view as no reason at all.
Ok you're hardcore. Let me get you a metal and while I'm at I'll see if someone can give you a reach around. Seriously, why do you persist?
er I think you have some kind of chip on your shoulder. I said you have never played the end content and you have no clue what your talking about there because of THAT. How exactly did I "insult" you since you keep insinuating that I did? QUOTE me where I specifically insulted you other than the fact that I pointed out you never got past level 40?
Are you somehow implying than that you actually KNOW what your talking about when you made your comments about the End Game, when you didnt even experience it?
Also, why should I stop when you keep INSULTING me?
WOW:
Pros
- it has quite nice background graphics, although quite sloppy and cartonish
- it has a well made class system with interesting spells, atacks, quite ballanced
- quite easy to lvl and get gear
CONS:
- horribile character design
- I don't like the fact that you have to chose between horde or aliance. It somehow restricts you since you have your side decided from the begining
- weak pvp system... only some areas, only if the other guy agrees, only if he's from the opposing faction
- no castle control, no real reason for clan wars
Lineage2
Pros
- it is almost 1 year older than WOW but it still has stunning graphics, great artwork and char design for it's age
- good and open pvp system, you can kill anybody and almost anywhere with a certain risk
- good clan system which offers a solid reason for clan wars, castle sieges
- castle control and siege
- the most addictive game... you will hate the guy that killed you, you always wanna know who betrayed who, who fights who, who you should negociate an ally or who you should atack
Cons
- the grinding is huge... the game might be way to hard to play, i mean lvl and get decent items for a lot of ppl
- 90% is grinding and 10% is pvp
Vanguard:
Pros
- I have no clue, only played Beta
Cons
- plastic looking chars
- huge bugs