Meaningful is a word thats definition and substance is relative to the real world because it was there the word was developed. I only compare WAR to RL as a way to better help others understand what meaning is. I don't seek credibility by comparing WAR to RL I only seek to logically prove that WAR in its current state has no meaning. The only way to do this is to compare it to real life. Whether you like it or not all games are to be compared with real life because it is real life they are based upon. A fictional world that is developed by an author is relative to the thoughts of that author which are influenced and restricted by real life. Thoughts are infinite but the probability of a person to think of one thought before another is influenced by real life and therefore all things fictional have a connection to the real life of its author. Not only that but it is people of "real life" who play the games and who experience emotions attributed to RL therefore basing a game upon RL to achieve an emotion from RL is only logical.
Regardless, I understand my attempts are futile so yes this topic is over.
Edit: To the person above me. Simply put you can't. Not so simply put you can have non pointless zerg fest without the loss of gear because all gear is, is the loss of time. Time is what the winners must gain and the losers lose.
Meaningful is a word thats definition and substance is relative to the real world because it was there the word was developed. I only compare WAR to RL as a way to better help others understand what meaning is. I don't seek credibility by comparing WAR to RL I only seek to logically prove that WAR in its current state has no meaning. The only way to do this is to compare it to real life. Whether you like it or not all games are to be compared with real life because it is real life they are based upon. A fictional world that is developed by an author is relative to the thoughts of that author which are influenced and restricted by real life. Thoughts are infinite but the probability of a person to think of one thought before another is influenced by real life and therefore all things fictional have a connection to the real life of its author. Not only that but it is people of "real life" who play the games and who experience emotions attributed to RL therefore basing a game upon RL to achieve an emotion from RL is only logical.
Regardless, I understand my attempts are futile so yes this topic is over.
Edit: To the person above me. Simply put you can't. Not so simply put you can have non pointless zerg fest without the loss of gear because all gear is, is the loss of time. Time is what the winners must gain and the losers lose.
Originally posted by Zeknichov EVE's system is flawless
I'll be forwarding you the bill from my trip to the emergency room after I managed to rupture numerous internal goopy bits from laughing so hard.
Eve's pvp system is every bit as hackneyed as that of any other game. The only difference being that level doesn't play into it as much. Though, having devs in your corp is a definite plus.
The only thing that adding full item loot would do is A) run off any remotely casual player, though, for the harder-core-than-thou pvper that is the end goal, near as I can tell. It will attract the gold farmers like flies, as people get tired of grinding their ass off to buy new gear every day, and C) it would kill off most of the pvp. All you'd have is the same handful of bigger guilds fighting each other over and over, while everyone else stayed in town, sitting around in their underwear, begging for some gear.
I'll be forwarding you the bill from my trip to the emergency room after I managed to rupture numerous internal goopy bits from laughing so hard.
Eve's pvp system is every bit as hackneyed as that of any other game. The only difference being that level doesn't play into it as much. Though, having devs in your corp is a definite plus.
The only thing that adding full item loot would do is A) run off any remotely casual player, though, for the harder-core-than-thou pvper that is the end goal, near as I can tell. It will attract the gold farmers like flies, as people get tired of grinding their ass off to buy new gear every day, and C) it would kill off most of the pvp. All you'd have is the same handful of bigger guilds fighting each other over and over, while everyone else stayed in town, sitting around in their underwear, begging for some gear.
Do name me EVE's flaws that have to do with its PvP system.
A) Hardly. I said EVE's system is flawless so you're basing this on EVE right? I know people who have played EVE for years and absolutely hate PvP, in fact they are what everyone would consider a carebear. They log on for a few hours a day at most to play at whatever pace they wish to play at.
Agreed, this is a problem.
C) Couldn't be further from the truth.
I didn't say make the game UO. I said EVE. Understand the difference and why EVE's system is the best ever developed.
After one has acquired the best equipment, maxed his level and stats can you kill him or will he keep coming back zerg rushing kekekeke. Yes I am going to pull the EVE card. If they keep coming back I keep killing their ships and eventually they have no money they cannot fight me anymore, I've won. Is WAR going to have that aspect or once everyone hits max level and PvPs non-stop for a year everyone will just get bored and leave because the fighting has no value but to be mindless enjoyment like WoW?
Probly not muhc of one , most of the pvp will be in instaneces so that will kind of be the point.
on the map you have to hoof it some.
Besides liek other have siad its good for you if they do keep coming back ... means more money/loot.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
After one has acquired the best equipment, maxed his level and stats can you kill him or will he keep coming back zerg rushing kekekeke. Yes I am going to pull the EVE card. If they keep coming back I keep killing their ships and eventually they have no money they cannot fight me anymore, I've won. Is WAR going to have that aspect or once everyone hits max level and PvPs non-stop for a year everyone will just get bored and leave because the fighting has no value but to be mindless enjoyment like WoW?
Probly not muhc of one , most of the pvp will be in instaneces so that will kind of be the point.
on the map you have to hoof it some.
Besides liek other have siad its good for you if they do keep coming back ... means more money/loot.
I didn't quite understand your post.
PvP will be instanced. Okay.
It's good for me if they keep coming back because it means more money and loot? If I never lose my loot then when I already have the best gear why do I care?
I wouldn't mind your posts so much if you clearly state that it is YOUR OPINION and stop talking to people like they're inferior.
but you do... and i dont agree with your EVE PVP is the greatest ever created statement in the slightest.
on a different note, i think maybe they should have a 15 through 25% durability loss upon death and in order to stop your items from permananly breaking you had to shell out some $$$$ or get the materials to do it yourself, not too much money but enough to put a small dent in your pocket.
What you describe, the EVE system, is a simulation and fit perfectly the devs intent there. But WAR devs intent is NOT the same. they want to create a world of perpetual war where WAR is everywhere.
Would that world be the same IF you had to go back to PVE everytime you died? Nope. everybody would be gathering supplies for X time and then fighting for Y. They want you to fight X+Y.
Coming from EVE you should know that corporation objectives can vary. In WAR we concentrate on the CONQUEST and not on the War of attrition. So what if your enemy can come back? now the Town is ours and if he come back he will find some nice tons of archers waiting to make a porcupine out of him, let him come.
I'm sure EVe has war of conquest too, where you actually go and acquire sectors yes? I'm sure THAT is the most fun part of the game, isn't it? massive fleet clashing against each other ? missiles flying? laser going etc? do you really prefer the ganking of attacking helpless miners or ambushing ships? I suppose that is fun too, but which one you prefer?
WAR is all about the first. the second CAN happen too... but it do not punish the loser, but still reward the winner. you get loot, xp and gold from killing enemies in pvp. they do not lose their stuff, the loot is random generated.
Have a nice day.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
Originally posted by Zeknichov Do name me EVE's flaws that have to do with its PvP system.A) Hardly. I said EVE's system is flawless so you're basing this on EVE right? I don't recall saying that. I'm simply laughing at your contention that Eve's pvp scheme is somehow perfect, or the best.I know people who have played EVE for years and absolutely hate PvP, in fact they are what everyone would consider a carebear. They log on for a few hours a day at most to play at whatever pace they wish to play at. Key here is the fact that they've played for years. How often do they go into 0.0, 0.1 space? Probably not much, if ever. And if they did wander out to say, sub .7 space, and get ganked and lose their ship, and get podded, they've in all likelihood got insurance, and a clone, not too mention by this point enough money to resupply, more than once, even. Now what happens if someone really has it out for them? Eventually they run out of ISK. Being vets, it's no big deal for them, but what about the newer player that doesn't have all the connections of someone that's been there since the beginning? Remember, we're speaking about a game starting out, not one that's been out for years.B) Agreed, this is a problem.C) Couldn't be further from the truth. Ok, so why do so many of the players avoid 0.0, 0.1, etc like the plague? Why is CCP forced to put desirable rewards there to drive people into the lower security areas? Simple. People don't want to risk the things they have worked very hard for, particularly if it's in a fight where they have no chance to fight back, or escape even.Shadowbane suffered from the same problem in the early days. One or two big guilds would wipe out everything, and then it was just them going back and forth. Now that there's hardly any players, there seems to be a better distribution, and they reset every what, 3 months? But at the start? Yeesh. I didn't say make the game UO. I said EVE. Understand the difference and why EVE's system is the best ever developed.Insurance and clones? SciFi vs Fantasy? Both skill based, both open pvp with full loot. Not seeing much difference. Hell, I could even make a correlation about miners getting ganked for their ore.
After one has acquired the best equipment, maxed his level and stats can you kill him or will he keep coming back zerg rushing kekekeke. Yes I am going to pull the EVE card. If they keep coming back I keep killing their ships and eventually they have no money they cannot fight me anymore, I've won. Is WAR going to have that aspect or once everyone hits max level and PvPs non-stop for a year everyone will just get bored and leave because the fighting has no value but to be mindless enjoyment like WoW?
Probly not muhc of one , most of the pvp will be in instaneces so that will kind of be the point.
on the map you have to hoof it some.
Besides liek other have siad its good for you if they do keep coming back ... means more money/loot.
I didn't quite understand your post.
PvP will be instanced. Okay.
It's good for me if they keep coming back because it means more money and loot? If I never lose my loot then when I already have the best gear why do I care?
Firstly I didnt understand a word either.
But PvP will not just be instanced, there will be instanced gameplay as well as for lack of a better word "openworld" gameplay. This was confirmed the devs themselves, they said that you wont be able to "win" the war by just doing the instanced PvP as its required that you also do the openworld PvP.
Theres no perma-death and no full loot system.
But you will be able to "win" over your enemy, for a time atleast. It will ofcourse become boring in time, as will most games.
"I cherish the memories of a question my grandson asked me the other day when he said..Grandpa, were you a hero in the war?...No, but i served in a company of heroes" Sgt. Mike Ranney E-company 506PIR 101'st airborn
It will ofcourse become boring in time, as will most games.
Exactly. The devs just need to calculate how much time that will be, so they plan their expansions right. Good expansions, not play-for-a-month-and-leave-again type of expansions like has lately happened with City of Heroes. They have to remember they're appealing to "veterans" of the game with expansions, with the added bonus of causing some hype in order to attract new players, of course.
Comments
Regardless, I understand my attempts are futile so yes this topic is over.
Edit: To the person above me. Simply put you can't. Not so simply put you can have non pointless zerg fest without the loss of gear because all gear is, is the loss of time. Time is what the winners must gain and the losers lose.
Which FF Character Are You?
I'll be forwarding you the bill from my trip to the emergency room after I managed to rupture numerous internal goopy bits from laughing so hard.
Eve's pvp system is every bit as hackneyed as that of any other game. The only difference being that level doesn't play into it as much. Though, having devs in your corp is a definite plus.
The only thing that adding full item loot would do is A) run off any remotely casual player, though, for the harder-core-than-thou pvper that is the end goal, near as I can tell.
It will attract the gold farmers like flies, as people get tired of grinding their ass off to buy new gear every day, and C) it would kill off most of the pvp. All you'd have is the same handful of bigger guilds fighting each other over and over, while everyone else stayed in town, sitting around in their underwear, begging for some gear.
I'll be forwarding you the bill from my trip to the emergency room after I managed to rupture numerous internal goopy bits from laughing so hard.
Eve's pvp system is every bit as hackneyed as that of any other game. The only difference being that level doesn't play into it as much. Though, having devs in your corp is a definite plus.
The only thing that adding full item loot would do is A) run off any remotely casual player, though, for the harder-core-than-thou pvper that is the end goal, near as I can tell.
It will attract the gold farmers like flies, as people get tired of grinding their ass off to buy new gear every day, and C) it would kill off most of the pvp. All you'd have is the same handful of bigger guilds fighting each other over and over, while everyone else stayed in town, sitting around in their underwear, begging for some gear.
Do name me EVE's flaws that have to do with its PvP system.
A) Hardly. I said EVE's system is flawless so you're basing this on EVE right? I know people who have played EVE for years and absolutely hate PvP, in fact they are what everyone would consider a carebear. They log on for a few hours a day at most to play at whatever pace they wish to play at.
C) Couldn't be further from the truth.
I didn't say make the game UO. I said EVE. Understand the difference and why EVE's system is the best ever developed.
on the map you have to hoof it some.
Besides liek other have siad its good for you if they do keep coming back ... means more money/loot.
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
on the map you have to hoof it some.
Besides liek other have siad its good for you if they do keep coming back ... means more money/loot.
I didn't quite understand your post.
PvP will be instanced. Okay.
It's good for me if they keep coming back because it means more money and loot? If I never lose my loot then when I already have the best gear why do I care?
but you do... and i dont agree with your EVE PVP is the greatest ever created statement in the slightest.
on a different note, i think maybe they should have a 15 through 25% durability loss upon death and in order to stop your items from permananly breaking you had to shell out some $$$$ or get the materials to do it yourself, not too much money but enough to put a small dent in your pocket.
OP: there is a conflict of intent going on here.
What you describe, the EVE system, is a simulation and fit perfectly the devs intent there. But WAR devs intent is NOT the same. they want to create a world of perpetual war where WAR is everywhere.
Would that world be the same IF you had to go back to PVE everytime you died? Nope. everybody would be gathering supplies for X time and then fighting for Y. They want you to fight X+Y.
Coming from EVE you should know that corporation objectives can vary. In WAR we concentrate on the CONQUEST and not on the War of attrition. So what if your enemy can come back? now the Town is ours and if he come back he will find some nice tons of archers waiting to make a porcupine out of him, let him come.
I'm sure EVe has war of conquest too, where you actually go and acquire sectors yes? I'm sure THAT is the most fun part of the game, isn't it? massive fleet clashing against each other ? missiles flying? laser going etc? do you really prefer the ganking of attacking helpless miners or ambushing ships? I suppose that is fun too, but which one you prefer?
WAR is all about the first. the second CAN happen too... but it do not punish the loser, but still reward the winner. you get loot, xp and gold from killing enemies in pvp. they do not lose their stuff, the loot is random generated.
Have a nice day.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
on the map you have to hoof it some.
Besides liek other have siad its good for you if they do keep coming back ... means more money/loot.
I didn't quite understand your post.
PvP will be instanced. Okay.
It's good for me if they keep coming back because it means more money and loot? If I never lose my loot then when I already have the best gear why do I care?
Firstly I didnt understand a word either.
But PvP will not just be instanced, there will be instanced gameplay as well as for lack of a better word "openworld" gameplay. This was confirmed the devs themselves, they said that you wont be able to "win" the war by just doing the instanced PvP as its required that you also do the openworld PvP.
Theres no perma-death and no full loot system.
But you will be able to "win" over your enemy, for a time atleast. It will ofcourse become boring in time, as will most games.
"I cherish the memories of a question my grandson asked me the other day when he said..Grandpa, were you a hero in the war?...No, but i served in a company of heroes"
Sgt. Mike Ranney E-company 506PIR 101'st airborn