One point re: the GTA example. Console games also get purchased by places like Blockbuster Video and the like, which pc games do not, which I imagine helps boost console game sales by a fair bit.
I don't think a PS3/360 port of the game is impossible. I don't think it's worth the hassle from a financial standpoint at this point. Depends on what their marketing people tell them the interest level is from the console market, I guess.
If there's enough money to be had, it'll happen. Otherwise, they'll probably wait it out, and see how AoC does on the 360.
About cross playing, I would think Mythic would make them in different servers because they are more aware of such problems in the users, but really? Is THIS the ONLY problem people have with console-mmorpg and THAT is why you consider it impossible?
You keep going on about the virtues and accomplishments of the consoles, but you aren't listening to us. I have a couple PS2 and a 360, and I play them weekly. The games I have are quite fun. But how big their playerbase is or features it has is not the the problem. We've given very specific reasons for why we loathe multi-platorm launches for PC games. I'll list them again.
1) Controls. Most console users use gamepads exclusively. Most console users play in front of the living room tv or in bed. Most console users EXPECT gamepad support for their games. Peripherals are a rarity. So if a game company wants to get maximum coverage from a console port, they need to include gamepad support for the game.
Gamepads are the leading source of "console-itis." In order to make PC games work with gamepads, developers often dumb down the options and interface. They sometimes call it "steamlining," but really they're just depriving us PC users of possible features. You mentioned Oblivion. Great game, it truly was. But its interface sucked, and it sucked hard. No one using a PC liked that interface, it was clunky and irritating. Menus, inventory, all of it could have been done better if it had been designed with only the keyboard and mouse in mind. And we, the PC gamers, blame this on the XBox port of the game.
This is even more greatly amplified when we're talking about MMOs. MMOs are extremely complex. There are multitudes of gameplay options, toolbars full of skills, emotes, tons of pop-up menus with reams of information. And the chat window. There's so much, I cannot fathom not having a keyboard and mouse. If an MMO is multi-platform, then they'll dumb down the options and interface for gamepad use. As we've already covered, most console users aren't set up to make use of a keyboard and mouse. And if they made the game with no gamepad support, they may as well not port it at all.
But regardless of all that, and restating what we've already said; If the game released for the 360 with no gamepad support, and the only way to play it was with a keyboard and mouse, we'd be fine with that. In such a case, the port would not have ruined the game for PC users.
2) Interactivity. A major part of MMOs is the community. There is a lot of typing involved. But when console users have the option of using a gamepad, they rarely put it down to type out even the shortest of sentences. So playing with them on the same servers is like playing with a bunch of mimes. And we all hate mimes.
This is, of course, a moot point if the game were released with keyboard and mouse support only, as the console users would then have their fingers already on the keys. But again, such a decision would greatly reduce their potential audience on the 360. In my opinion, there'd be so few buyers of a keyboard and mouse only game, it wouldn't be worth the effort.
3) Time and Effort. This is our weakest arguement, but still a good point. Time used to port the game to multiple platforms is time taken away from developing the game. Multi-platform causes more bugs and issues. We'd rather them spend their time and resources making a better game, not making ports.
This is less an issue with the 360, though, since it's already pretty close to a computer anyway.
On a final note, I don't think the core console audience is truly ready for MMOs. MMOs require constant patching and updates. They're riddled with bugs (though the best games have only minor bugs). And there's lag. Gods, there is LAG. Moreso than any other genre, MMOs have tons of issues with lag. From 3 second screen freezes for an individual, to 15 minute serverwide crashes, you WILL experience lag in some form everytime you play the game. And for console users, who are used to no-fuss plug-and-play, all these issues may be too annoying for them.
So to recap. We don't care how big the console market is. Our only issue is with console-itis. Console-itis could be avoided by making the game keyboard and mouse only (NO gamepad support at all), but then it would alienate most of the 360 users. So there'd be no point to port it.
Seriously. It's Are'el. This forum doesn't allow apostrophes in usernames.
can anyone imagine hacking a Wii control w/ nunchuck to play an MMO? you'd still want a kb on the side for chatting, but man, that'd be cool as hell I think... and good for your health!
my bro used the usb/xbox converter for Dance Dance Revolution to hook up a Xbox S-controller to his PC, downloaded software to program it, and is going to try it out for WoW.
It'd be perfect for a class like rogues (who only really use 3-4 abilities per fight anyway)
I love console games, and I think a MMO on console would be pretty uber (if it was a good MMO of course)
About cross playing, I would think Mythic would make them in different servers because they are more aware of such problems in the users, but really? Is THIS the ONLY problem people have with console-mmorpg and THAT is why you consider it impossible?
You keep going on about the virtues and accomplishments of the consoles, but you aren't listening to us. I have a couple PS2 and a 360, and I play them weekly. The games I have are quite fun. But how big their playerbase is or features it has is not the the problem. We've given very specific reasons for why we loathe multi-platorm launches for PC games. I'll list them again.
1) Controls. Most console users use gamepads exclusively. Most console users play in front of the living room tv or in bed. Most console users EXPECT gamepad support for their games. Peripherals are a rarity. So if a game company wants to get maximum coverage from a console port, they need to include gamepad support for the game.
Gamepads are the leading source of "console-itis." In order to make PC games work with gamepads, developers often dumb down the options and interface. They sometimes call it "steamlining," but really they're just depriving us PC users of possible features. You mentioned Oblivion. Great game, it truly was. But its interface sucked, and it sucked hard. No one using a PC liked that interface, it was clunky and irritating. Menus, inventory, all of it could have been done better if it had been designed with only the keyboard and mouse in mind. And we, the PC gamers, blame this on the XBox port of the game.
This is even more greatly amplified when we're talking about MMOs. MMOs are extremely complex. There are multitudes of gameplay options, toolbars full of skills, emotes, tons of pop-up menus with reams of information. And the chat window. There's so much, I cannot fathom not having a keyboard and mouse. If an MMO is multi-platform, then they'll dumb down the options and interface for gamepad use. As we've already covered, most console users aren't set up to make use of a keyboard and mouse. And if they made the game with no gamepad support, they may as well not port it at all.
But regardless of all that, and restating what we've already said; If the game released for the 360 with no gamepad support, and the only way to play it was with a keyboard and mouse, we'd be fine with that. In such a case, the port would not have ruined the game for PC users.
2) Interactivity. A major part of MMOs is the community. There is a lot of typing involved. But when console users have the option of using a gamepad, they rarely put it down to type out even the shortest of sentences. So playing with them on the same servers is like playing with a bunch of mimes. And we all hate mimes.
This is, of course, a moot point if the game were released with keyboard and mouse support only, as the console users would then have their fingers already on the keys. But again, such a decision would greatly reduce their potential audience on the 360. In my opinion, there'd be so few buyers of a keyboard and mouse only game, it wouldn't be worth the effort.
3) Time and Effort. This is our weakest arguement, but still a good point. Time used to port the game to multiple platforms is time taken away from developing the game. Multi-platform causes more bugs and issues. We'd rather them spend their time and resources making a better game, not making ports.
This is less an issue with the 360, though, since it's already pretty close to a computer anyway.
On a final note, I don't think the core console audience is truly ready for MMOs. MMOs require constant patching and updates. They're riddled with bugs (though the best games have only minor bugs). And there's lag. Gods, there is LAG. Moreso than any other genre, MMOs have tons of issues with lag. From 3 second screen freezes for an individual, to 15 minute serverwide crashes, you WILL experience lag in some form everytime you play the game. And for console users, who are used to no-fuss plug-and-play, all these issues may be too annoying for them.
So to recap. We don't care how big the console market is. Our only issue is with console-itis. Console-itis could be avoided by making the game keyboard and mouse only (NO gamepad support at all), but then it would alienate most of the 360 users. So there'd be no point to port it.
1) Moot point in the case of WAR. the game is being released for the PC first and an X-box 360 version would be a port. We had seen the interface at work and it is definitly a mouse+keyboard interface. They might add gamepad support for the x-box version but that would not affect the pc version.
2) FFXI support gamepad, keyboards and mouses. The community might be defined in many ways and there are problems because japanese and westerns are all in same server with language barrier problems. but the people there talk.
I always assumed a console MMorpg would support keyboard and mouse. gamepads could be optional.
3) If the port will make WAR get 10 mils subscriber instead of 500K, I see that as a very positive sign and much much much more resources for the game instead of less. the X-box 360 is not actually another "platform" by the way. it is a pc, same processor, same ram, same Graphic card. that is exactly the reason why they could make a Xbox client on the fly just for fun (as they have no declared plans of releasing it there, I must assume the xbox client was made by one of the programmers in his spare time or something), so the problems with extra bugs should be minimal.
Finally, yes MMorpg requires multiple patches, but already now Xbox 360 games get patched a lot. Especially just released game, the people are already aware of this and accept it.
Even if they would take, say, 20% of the x-box players because of the gamepad issue (if there is any issue there), that would still about double or triple their subs.
But thanks, you expressed the reasons as nobody else did. Now all is much clearer.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
1) Moot point in the case of WAR. the game is being released for the PC first and an X-box 360 version would be a port. We had seen the interface at work and it is definitly a mouse+keyboard interface. They might add gamepad support for the x-box version but that would not affect the pc version. 2) FFXI support gamepad, keyboards and mouses. The community might be defined in many ways and there are problems because japanese and westerns are all in same server with language barrier problems. but the people there talk. I always assumed a console MMorpg would support keyboard and mouse. gamepads could be optional. 3) If the port will make WAR get 10 mils subscriber instead of 500K, I see that as a very positive sign and much much much more resources for the game instead of less. the X-box 360 is not actually another "platform" by the way. it is a pc, same processor, same ram, same Graphic card. that is exactly the reason why they could make a Xbox client on the fly just for fun (as they have no declared plans of releasing it there, I must assume the xbox client was made by one of the programmers in his spare time or something), so the problems with extra bugs should be minimal. Finally, yes MMorpg requires multiple patches, but already now Xbox 360 games get patched a lot. Especially just released game, the people are already aware of this and accept it. Even if they would take, say, 20% of the x-box players because of the gamepad issue (if there is any issue there), that would still about double or triple their subs. But thanks, you expressed the reasons as nobody else did. Now all is much clearer.
This whole conversation has really become moot. I mean seriously what more could you or anyone else say other than i like or dislike the idea of WAR going onto the 360. I don't see how it even matters since you'll just reitterate your opinion over and over as if no one else matters. I don't like the idea of it going console. Think about the amount of players needed for Warhammer to work. How would even an Xbox 360 version work? They'd have to rebuild the game to work completely different, completely different servers, they'd have to have a seperate Xbox 360 team. I think they merely showed off the capability because they could otherwise they'd of stated by now its their intention to do a 360 launch.
I'll ramble on because I can ramble on forever.
Btw all the RPG's you listed for the xbox yes they're OK. But any serious RPG console player knows the machine to have for RPGs is the PS2 (not 3 the 3 sucks right now). How do i Know this? Because I love my ps2 RPG's I have droves and droves of them. I even beta tested the FFXI online game on my PS2. It was a nightmarish experience, I frankly dont know what the asian players see in that game.
Its why I'll never buy an MMO on a console the limitations and uber zoning needs frankly suck.
If they want to release WAR on a console fine, but if it affects the quality of future expansions because such and such idea won't work on a console but it'll work on a pc so we're just not going to do it at all scenario happens they'll lose more players then they'll make with a console launch. ( i love run on sentences).
BTW Xbox 360 IS another platform. Its architecture and pipelines are completely different. On the top most I dont know a crap about programming architecture yes it is a pc. It runs like a pc, it runs a VERSION of direct x but it is NOT a pc and you don't program for it like you would a PC.
Please Refer to Doom Cat with all conspiracies & evil corporation complaints. He'll give you the simple explination of..WE"RE ALL DOOMED!
This site clearly states that the difference between the xbox 360 version and the PC version are " difficult to tell them apart." So there is no reason that they should not put this game on the 360 with the GAMEPAD or the keyboard or mouse. During the communication between the 2 systems in the game the players could not tell that the character that they were playing with was running on an xbox 360. Actually working on the xbox game helped improve the PC version so all u PC nerd should be happy.
Right now I am using my 360 far more than my gaming PC I just built. Too many stupid issues I am waiting for patches/updates/drivers to fix. For many MMOs I had to have multiple boot setups to run various video drivers (or other specific items) to get the games to run well when using new hardware. Personally I am tired of that and if a game is available for both the 360 and PC then I would seriously consider the 360 version, or both even assuming I could use a single login for them.
Freeing up the computer for others to use (specifically a gaming girlfriend) while still being able to play the game I want is appealing. As mentioned above FFXI had no play issues with controller, keyboard only, nor a setup mixing them devices. It was designed that way however. WAR and AoC are both on my will pre-order list and I wouldn't mind getting a PC and 360 version of both.
People have this great divide between console and PC gaming I just don't understand. I play both and always will. Somethings do not work well on one setup or the other and some things work well on both. MMOs fall under the side of easily designed to work on both. The big issue is many UI designers only think in one way which only works well on PCs. SE made a fully customizable action/event system which made a keyboard only necessary for communication and programming. Considering how lackluster SE is overall I have faith that the minds working on WAR could make a great interface which could function on consoles and PCs.
http://xbox360.qj.net/Warhammer-Online-Age-of-Reckoning-Was-Running-on-Xbox-360-at-E3/pg/49/aid/39229 This site clearly states that the difference between the xbox 360 version and the PC version are " difficult to tell them apart." So there is no reason that they should not put this game on the 360 with the GAMEPAD or the keyboard or mouse. During the communication between the 2 systems in the game the players could not tell that the character that they were playing with was running on an xbox 360. Actually working on the xbox game helped improve the PC version so all u PC nerd should be happy.
To be perfectly honest, and I'm really not trying to be antagonistic, but that all sounds like propoganda. I read the article. It's incomplete. By 'telling them apart," did they mean visually, or interactively? Was the gamepad user dropping the control often to type out converstaions, or was he merely following the rest around and fighting? Were the testers in the same room, thus capable to talking to each other? And was the control scheme for PC users ever "simplified" in order to be more compatable with gamepads?
Those are the real questions that should have been asked and answered.
As for, "actually working on the xbox game helped improve the PC version," that's a tune we've all heard sung before. Bethesda proclaimed that their work with the XBox360 helped them create a more interactive and streamlined game for PC users. They beemed with pride while saying so. Then we get Oblivion, and the UI was crap. It was even worse that Morrowind's interface, which again was created that way because of a multi-platform launch. So, I bloody don't care if Mythic is happy with the "improvements" their work with the XBox provided. They're not going to say, "well, this has pretty much neutered the PC version, but we'll run with it anyway on the hopes of more profit."
Seriously. It's Are'el. This forum doesn't allow apostrophes in usernames.
This whole conversation has really become moot. I mean seriously what more could you or anyone else say other than i like or dislike the idea of WAR going onto the 360. I don't see how it even matters since you'll just reitterate your opinion over and over as if no one else matters. I don't like the idea of it going console. Think about the amount of players needed for Warhammer to work. How would even an Xbox 360 version work? They'd have to rebuild the game to work completely different, completely different servers, they'd have to have a seperate Xbox 360 team. I think they merely showed off the capability because they could otherwise they'd of stated by now its their intention to do a 360 launch. I'll ramble on because I can ramble on forever. Btw all the RPG's you listed for the xbox yes they're OK. But any serious RPG console player knows the machine to have for RPGs is the PS2 (not 3 the 3 sucks right now). How do i Know this? Because I love my ps2 RPG's I have droves and droves of them. I even beta tested the FFXI online game on my PS2. It was a nightmarish experience, I frankly dont know what the asian players see in that game. Its why I'll never buy an MMO on a console the limitations and uber zoning needs frankly suck. If they want to release WAR on a console fine, but if it affects the quality of future expansions because such and such idea won't work on a console but it'll work on a pc so we're just not going to do it at all scenario happens they'll lose more players then they'll make with a console launch. ( i love run on sentences). BTW Xbox 360 IS another platform. Its architecture and pipelines are completely different. On the top most I dont know a crap about programming architecture yes it is a pc. It runs like a pc, it runs a VERSION of direct x but it is NOT a pc and you don't program for it like you would a PC.
The point is NOT YOU disliking the idea. the point was people disliking the idea AND saying "this is impossible, will never ever happen!"
It is perfectly reasonable, in my book, as you did, to say "I do not like the idea, because of this this and that"
What I did not accept was the "I do not like the idea ,therefore it should not be done/it is impossible to accomplish"
For the sake of argument let's continue, yes, I know the PS2 is a more RPG friendly than the X-Box.. so what? still a console. The X-box was mentioned because they released a demo client on it. no other reasons. the RPGs were mentioned to prove the X-box 360 is NOT only a FPS/drivers console. And defining KOTOR an "ok" rpg is kinda reductive. Yes, it was on the X-box, not the 360, but still.....
About the systems being so different: then answer this: Why Mythic would have done a X-box 360 version then? if the systems are so different and programming the games on them requires big amount of effort, why wasting that time when the company has no current plans of DOING an x-box 360 version?
Logically you have to admit that if they did a version (and they DID), it must have taken relativly little time for them to do.... OR they have a secret agreement with Microsoft to release the game on the x-box and have been working on the version for a while.
Frankly, i see the first option as the most probable, but you can take your pick.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
Originally posted by Volkmar Logically you have to admit that if they did a version (and they DID), it must have taken relativly little time for them to do.... OR they have a secret agreement with Microsoft to release the game on the x-box and have been working on the version for a while. Frankly, i see the first option as the most probable, but you can take your pick.
Response:
If I remember correctly (it's been a long time) part of the reason they had a client running on a 360, was to show how easy it was to cross a game over from PC to the 360.
Digression:
With the way consoles are evolving, a keyboard/mouse setup for a console isn't far-fetched and there are several games that can be played with the keyboard/mouse setup that people don't even realize.
Dirge of Cerberus could be played with a Keyboard/Mouse and it's a PS2 game.
To me a 360 version would be very tempting, since I'm already considering buying one instead of a PS3 due to hardly any product exclusivity left. Hell, there's even talk about FF 13 being released on the 360.
The only contested point for me would be whether 360 players and PC players are on the same servers.
My vote is for seperate servers for various reasons.
--------------------------------------------- I live to fight, and fight to live.
Hell, there's even talk about FF 13 being released on the 360.
Off topic, but that's some very interesting news! As an avid FF fan, I was cursing the fact that I would someday have to buy a PS3. In fact, Final Fantasy was the only good reason for me to even consider it. But if it's possibly coming to the 360, there's some hope for me yet!
Seriously. It's Are'el. This forum doesn't allow apostrophes in usernames.
Hell, there's even talk about FF 13 being released on the 360.
Off topic, but that's some very interesting news! As an avid FF fan, I was cursing the fact that I would someday have to buy a PS3. In fact, Final Fantasy was the only good reason for me to even consider it. But if it's possibly coming to the 360, there's some hope for me yet!
Off topic still, but at least one Dragon Quest game was announced as in development (aka could still be canned) for the Japanese market. There is also talk of the new SE MMO being vista/360 exclusive as of last report. The big event SE is holding in May will tell us more specifics most likely.
On topic: For generic USB mouse support all MS has to do is a minor dashboard update on consumer machines. Anyone who has seen a developer console setup has seen a mouse interact with the 360 directly. It is just a lacking feature on the consumer machines. Why I have no idea, but it is. New HDTVs also run at resolutions that are about the average for most MMO players (realize MO players tend not to have the bleeding edge of technology as upgrade at a slower rate since their primary game generally doesn't benefit as much).
Yes Mythic played with the idea that maybe they would be able to make a consol version of WAR. Which would be able to play with pc owners. But I personally dont think that they will go through with the plan as there are just so many problems to solve.
How would the consol players be able to chat with pc players.
Would it be possible to convert the controls to a gamepad.
Would latency be a problem.
And so on....
There are just so many problems with doin this that I cant see them getting it too work without pissing one of the crowds off, if they could even get it to work.
"I cherish the memories of a question my grandson asked me the other day when he said..Grandpa, were you a hero in the war?...No, but i served in a company of heroes" Sgt. Mike Ranney E-company 506PIR 101'st airborn
Can't believe the forums are so dead were having x-box debates.but anyways besides the technical issues,would be the licenseing to make it for x-box,the upfront royalties,and subscription rolayties. one good mmo can cut the average game sales of the more shallow games drastically.To make this up I believe the royalties involved would be to high to make it worthwhile for mythic.there already gonna have to pay royalties to GDW,and emergent tech(for gamebryo).Only so many ways to divide up $15 per month(plus m$ charges thier user's a fee just for the privilage to game on-line).I would argue the above reasons over technical reasons.
I think they should port it to the ps3 and x-box360 ... why not just require use of keyb/mouse . same thing. Tho they may not becuase of future desire to upgrade (ie can the platforms handle to upgrades)
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
emrgent technologies who makes the engine for daoc,war and probly 40 other games,supports cross platform.its a matter of how much royalties will M$ demand for this game.since it may be the last game many will need to buy.thats the issue.PC versions require no royalties.Its all a business thing.
Yeah, Xbox/360 had some rpgs, but seriously, if you were a hardcore rpg player what where you going to buy? PS2, or an Xbox/Xbox360. This is neither here nor there, though.
Mate alot of rpg's coming out to 360. If your an RPG fan you'll need to get one just to play exclusive games like blue dragon, fable 2, elveon and mass effect. Excluding MMO's 360 is t3h rpg platform.
Yes Mythic played with the idea that maybe they would be able to make a consol version of WAR. Which would be able to play with pc owners. But I personally dont think that they will go through with the plan as there are just so many problems to solve. How would the consol players be able to chat with pc players. Would it be possible to convert the controls to a gamepad. Would latency be a problem. And so on.... There are just so many problems with doin this that I cant see them getting it too work without pissing one of the crowds off, if they could even get it to work.
there is a keyboard keypad add-on for the xbox 360 currently in production at microsoft. beside, what do you think the xbox 360 they used for the demo was using? something right? so they either were using a keyboard+mouse combo trough the usb ports OR they already converted the controls to a game pad.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
Yeah, Xbox/360 had some rpgs, but seriously, if you were a hardcore rpg player what where you going to buy? PS2, or an Xbox/Xbox360. This is neither here nor there, though.
Mate alot of rpg's coming out to 360. If your an RPG fan you'll need to get one just to play exclusive games like blue dragon, fable 2, elveon and mass effect. Excluding MMO's 360 is t3h rpg platform.
There are currently only 5 RPGs available on the 360 as of right now...that's only 1 more than the PS3, and it's been out an entire year longer.
Also, there are only 5 more RPGs in production for the 360 than the PS3. Considering the ties that Microsoft has to the computer gaming industry, that's not terribly impressive.
Eleveon is not a 360 exclusive...where'd you come up with this? It's coming out on PS3 and PC as well. Check your sources before you post falsehoods.
And yes, the 360 will have Fable 2, Mass Effect, and Blue Dragon, but all of those games are being published by Microsoft. Microsoft has no problem forcing the release of an incomplete game that they feel has been in development for too long...remember the first Fable? Oh, yeah, they're the same company that wanted to force the release of Vanguard LAST MARCH, and I hear the game STILL isn't complete; could you imagine what Vanguard would have been like last March?
Besides, I'm sold on Mass Effect and Fable, because I've seen the results of those developers' previous games, but Blue Dragon is a crapshoot from Mistwalker (a developer who hasn't had a single game published yet).
And I like how you didn't mention the PS3 exclusive RPGs that are getting more hype than anything on X360 (save Mass Effect): Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy XIII Versus, and Shin Megami Tensai...just to name a few.
Stop being a fanboy and face the facts: while the 360 is doing a lot more for RPG fans than it's predecessor, it's far from "the RPG platform". Sony caters FAR more to the Japanese audicence, because they, unlike most American console gamers, are RPG-crazy. Common sense dictates that the PS3 will end up having more RPGs than the 360...hell, they're already catching up in numbers with far fewer overall games being developed for the newer console.
Achiever 60.00% Explorer 33.33% Killer 80.00% Socializer 26.67%
According to this survey, I'm an item-whoring ganker. I guess I should have stuck with WoW then...lmao.
Yes Mythic played with the idea that maybe they would be able to make a consol version of WAR. Which would be able to play with pc owners. But I personally dont think that they will go through with the plan as there are just so many problems to solve. How would the consol players be able to chat with pc players. Would it be possible to convert the controls to a gamepad. Would latency be a problem. And so on.... There are just so many problems with doin this that I cant see them getting it too work without pissing one of the crowds off, if they could even get it to work.
there is a keyboard keypad add-on for the xbox 360 currently in production at microsoft. beside, what do you think the xbox 360 they used for the demo was using? something right? so they either were using a keyboard+mouse combo trough the usb ports OR they already converted the controls to a game pad.
What offends the hell out of me is that they are 'debeloping a special keyboard'. Come on, seriously... why are they doing this? I remember when I got my 360 last Fall and tried a keyboard. It worked - but it was useless because games weren't made to use it. And forget a mouse working. Mind you... the point is, you can already use a keyboard with the 360. But Microsoft is STILL going to develope a Microsoft-only keyboard for their beloved 360? C'mon guys...
Grab the latest issue of Game Informer if you REALLY want to get angry. Microsoft has been offering huge cash incentives to game developers if they make their games: 360 exclusive (well duh) - Windows Vista exclusive (ouch) - and... here's the kicker... Microsoft Live Gold Exclusive.
That last one kills me. Some developers have mentioned that Microsoft wants new PC games to have multiplayer 'only' on the Microsoft Live network and have been suggesting that patches can only be retreived on this network, and mods/bonuses/downloadabl content be -purchased- instead of offered for 'free' like... well, like PC gaming has almost always been. Now, why are 'game developers' talking about this? Game Informer mentions that developers are 'afraid to anger Microsoft' and they are the only ones getting 'the facts' from Microsoft regarding its intentions. They are generally upset and disturbed over what Microsoft is trying to do to the gaming world.
So, get ready PC gamers. Soon, we'll have to pay to play any PC game online, regardless if its an MMO or not. Soon we'll have to pay for downloadable content, patches, probably even tech support. Just like we'll have to pay for Vista and a PC that can handle Vista and the games made for it.
.... and these idiot 'kids' complain about the price of the PS3? They have NO effing clue...
**EDIT** And just as a side note... remember that 'game developers' usually don't own the companies these days. So Microsoft pressures the 'suits' above the game developers. And, in turn, the suits pressure the game developers. Money is money.
The only reason the majority of games being published are on consoles is because of how much easier it is to make a game for a console. They cut alot of their costs by doing so. That has always been a known fact.
For those saying it is too difficult for an MMO, I would counter them with the fact strategy games are avaliable for consoles and they take alot more interaction from a keyboard and mouse than an rpg ever has. It really wouldn't be much a strain to make a xbox version of WAR. To top it off, microsoft already has implemented into xbox live ways for computer games and console games to inter mix. Developers don't like the idea simply because of the disadvantage console gamers receive. (PS3 has a few MMOs being released for it this fall already because of incentives from Sony)
One last thing.... you can hook keyboards and mice up to both an xbox 360 and PS3 now. They aren't too diffirent from computers anymore. Just a hella lot easier to program a game to.
Will they do it? Who knows, but more and more studios are switching to making console games and those who havent are likely to make their games compatible to consoles for a bit of extra revenue.
One point re: the GTA example. Console games also get purchased by places like Blockbuster Video and the like, which pc games do not, which I imagine helps boost console game sales by a fair bit. I don't think a PS3/360 port of the game is impossible. I don't think it's worth the hassle from a financial standpoint at this point. Depends on what their marketing people tell them the interest level is from the console market, I guess. If there's enough money to be had, it'll happen. Otherwise, they'll probably wait it out, and see how AoC does on the 360.
It'll be a long wait cause AoC ins't out on 360 till 2008. IGN saying it will be out on 360 in 2007, but thats unlikely especially since they haven't even anounced they are gona make it for 360. depressing for a impaciant guy with 360 and a taste for mmo's.
Yeah, Xbox/360 had some rpgs, but seriously, if you were a hardcore rpg player what where you going to buy? PS2, or an Xbox/Xbox360. This is neither here nor there, though.
Mate alot of rpg's coming out to 360. If your an RPG fan you'll need to get one just to play exclusive games like blue dragon, fable 2, elveon and mass effect. Excluding MMO's 360 is t3h rpg platform.
There are currently only 5 RPGs available on the 360 as of right now...that's only 1 more than the PS3, and it's been out an entire year longer.
Also, there are only 5 more RPGs in production for the 360 than the PS3. Considering the ties that Microsoft has to the computer gaming industry, that's not terribly impressive.
Eleveon is not a 360 exclusive...where'd you come up with this? It's coming out on PS3 and PC as well. Check your sources before you post falsehoods.
And yes, the 360 will have Fable 2, Mass Effect, and Blue Dragon, but all of those games are being published by Microsoft. Microsoft has no problem forcing the release of an incomplete game that they feel has been in development for too long...remember the first Fable? Oh, yeah, they're the same company that wanted to force the release of Vanguard LAST MARCH, and I hear the game STILL isn't complete; could you imagine what Vanguard would have been like last March?
Besides, I'm sold on Mass Effect and Fable, because I've seen the results of those developers' previous games, but Blue Dragon is a crapshoot from Mistwalker (a developer who hasn't had a single game published yet).
And I like how you didn't mention the PS3 exclusive RPGs that are getting more hype than anything on X360 (save Mass Effect): Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy XIII Versus, and Shin Megami Tensai...just to name a few.
Stop being a fanboy and face the facts: while the 360 is doing a lot more for RPG fans than it's predecessor, it's far from "the RPG platform". Sony caters FAR more to the Japanese audicence, because they, unlike most American console gamers, are RPG-crazy. Common sense dictates that the PS3 will end up having more RPGs than the 360...hell, they're already catching up in numbers with far fewer overall games being developed for the newer console.
Myself and most people prefer the 360. 2nd of all MMO's are coming to 360, AoC, huxley pherhaps this and some other less interestings. 3rd the japenese markets stinks, final fantasy etc. it's all the same and it all can piss off. yeah blue dragon looks shite too. You only named 2 RPGs for ps3 and they both sound poop. if you go on the link theres lots coming to 360 and all the best exclusives are 360. I doubt PS3 will be playing with PC. 360 does pawn ps3 for rpg's thats MMOs too, ones without crazy japenese haircuts, airbrushed cartoons with little gender differences.
Comments
One point re: the GTA example. Console games also get purchased by places like Blockbuster Video and the like, which pc games do not, which I imagine helps boost console game sales by a fair bit.
I don't think a PS3/360 port of the game is impossible. I don't think it's worth the hassle from a financial standpoint at this point. Depends on what their marketing people tell them the interest level is from the console market, I guess.
If there's enough money to be had, it'll happen. Otherwise, they'll probably wait it out, and see how AoC does on the 360.
You keep going on about the virtues and accomplishments of the consoles, but you aren't listening to us. I have a couple PS2 and a 360, and I play them weekly. The games I have are quite fun. But how big their playerbase is or features it has is not the the problem. We've given very specific reasons for why we loathe multi-platorm launches for PC games. I'll list them again.
1) Controls. Most console users use gamepads exclusively. Most console users play in front of the living room tv or in bed. Most console users EXPECT gamepad support for their games. Peripherals are a rarity. So if a game company wants to get maximum coverage from a console port, they need to include gamepad support for the game.
Gamepads are the leading source of "console-itis." In order to make PC games work with gamepads, developers often dumb down the options and interface. They sometimes call it "steamlining," but really they're just depriving us PC users of possible features. You mentioned Oblivion. Great game, it truly was. But its interface sucked, and it sucked hard. No one using a PC liked that interface, it was clunky and irritating. Menus, inventory, all of it could have been done better if it had been designed with only the keyboard and mouse in mind. And we, the PC gamers, blame this on the XBox port of the game.
This is even more greatly amplified when we're talking about MMOs. MMOs are extremely complex. There are multitudes of gameplay options, toolbars full of skills, emotes, tons of pop-up menus with reams of information. And the chat window. There's so much, I cannot fathom not having a keyboard and mouse. If an MMO is multi-platform, then they'll dumb down the options and interface for gamepad use. As we've already covered, most console users aren't set up to make use of a keyboard and mouse. And if they made the game with no gamepad support, they may as well not port it at all.
But regardless of all that, and restating what we've already said; If the game released for the 360 with no gamepad support, and the only way to play it was with a keyboard and mouse, we'd be fine with that. In such a case, the port would not have ruined the game for PC users.
2) Interactivity. A major part of MMOs is the community. There is a lot of typing involved. But when console users have the option of using a gamepad, they rarely put it down to type out even the shortest of sentences. So playing with them on the same servers is like playing with a bunch of mimes. And we all hate mimes.
This is, of course, a moot point if the game were released with keyboard and mouse support only, as the console users would then have their fingers already on the keys. But again, such a decision would greatly reduce their potential audience on the 360. In my opinion, there'd be so few buyers of a keyboard and mouse only game, it wouldn't be worth the effort.
3) Time and Effort. This is our weakest arguement, but still a good point. Time used to port the game to multiple platforms is time taken away from developing the game. Multi-platform causes more bugs and issues. We'd rather them spend their time and resources making a better game, not making ports.
This is less an issue with the 360, though, since it's already pretty close to a computer anyway.
On a final note, I don't think the core console audience is truly ready for MMOs. MMOs require constant patching and updates. They're riddled with bugs (though the best games have only minor bugs). And there's lag. Gods, there is LAG. Moreso than any other genre, MMOs have tons of issues with lag. From 3 second screen freezes for an individual, to 15 minute serverwide crashes, you WILL experience lag in some form everytime you play the game. And for console users, who are used to no-fuss plug-and-play, all these issues may be too annoying for them.
So to recap. We don't care how big the console market is. Our only issue is with console-itis. Console-itis could be avoided by making the game keyboard and mouse only (NO gamepad support at all), but then it would alienate most of the 360 users. So there'd be no point to port it.
Seriously.
It's Are'el. This forum doesn't allow apostrophes in usernames.
can anyone imagine hacking a Wii control w/ nunchuck to play an MMO? you'd still want a kb on the side for chatting, but man, that'd be cool as hell I think... and good for your health!
my bro used the usb/xbox converter for Dance Dance Revolution to hook up a Xbox S-controller to his PC, downloaded software to program it, and is going to try it out for WoW.
It'd be perfect for a class like rogues (who only really use 3-4 abilities per fight anyway)
I love console games, and I think a MMO on console would be pretty uber (if it was a good MMO of course)
too bad they killed True Fantasy Live Online....
You keep going on about the virtues and accomplishments of the consoles, but you aren't listening to us. I have a couple PS2 and a 360, and I play them weekly. The games I have are quite fun. But how big their playerbase is or features it has is not the the problem. We've given very specific reasons for why we loathe multi-platorm launches for PC games. I'll list them again.
1) Controls. Most console users use gamepads exclusively. Most console users play in front of the living room tv or in bed. Most console users EXPECT gamepad support for their games. Peripherals are a rarity. So if a game company wants to get maximum coverage from a console port, they need to include gamepad support for the game.
Gamepads are the leading source of "console-itis." In order to make PC games work with gamepads, developers often dumb down the options and interface. They sometimes call it "steamlining," but really they're just depriving us PC users of possible features. You mentioned Oblivion. Great game, it truly was. But its interface sucked, and it sucked hard. No one using a PC liked that interface, it was clunky and irritating. Menus, inventory, all of it could have been done better if it had been designed with only the keyboard and mouse in mind. And we, the PC gamers, blame this on the XBox port of the game.
This is even more greatly amplified when we're talking about MMOs. MMOs are extremely complex. There are multitudes of gameplay options, toolbars full of skills, emotes, tons of pop-up menus with reams of information. And the chat window. There's so much, I cannot fathom not having a keyboard and mouse. If an MMO is multi-platform, then they'll dumb down the options and interface for gamepad use. As we've already covered, most console users aren't set up to make use of a keyboard and mouse. And if they made the game with no gamepad support, they may as well not port it at all.
But regardless of all that, and restating what we've already said; If the game released for the 360 with no gamepad support, and the only way to play it was with a keyboard and mouse, we'd be fine with that. In such a case, the port would not have ruined the game for PC users.
2) Interactivity. A major part of MMOs is the community. There is a lot of typing involved. But when console users have the option of using a gamepad, they rarely put it down to type out even the shortest of sentences. So playing with them on the same servers is like playing with a bunch of mimes. And we all hate mimes.
This is, of course, a moot point if the game were released with keyboard and mouse support only, as the console users would then have their fingers already on the keys. But again, such a decision would greatly reduce their potential audience on the 360. In my opinion, there'd be so few buyers of a keyboard and mouse only game, it wouldn't be worth the effort.
3) Time and Effort. This is our weakest arguement, but still a good point. Time used to port the game to multiple platforms is time taken away from developing the game. Multi-platform causes more bugs and issues. We'd rather them spend their time and resources making a better game, not making ports.
This is less an issue with the 360, though, since it's already pretty close to a computer anyway.
On a final note, I don't think the core console audience is truly ready for MMOs. MMOs require constant patching and updates. They're riddled with bugs (though the best games have only minor bugs). And there's lag. Gods, there is LAG. Moreso than any other genre, MMOs have tons of issues with lag. From 3 second screen freezes for an individual, to 15 minute serverwide crashes, you WILL experience lag in some form everytime you play the game. And for console users, who are used to no-fuss plug-and-play, all these issues may be too annoying for them.
So to recap. We don't care how big the console market is. Our only issue is with console-itis. Console-itis could be avoided by making the game keyboard and mouse only (NO gamepad support at all), but then it would alienate most of the 360 users. So there'd be no point to port it.
1) Moot point in the case of WAR. the game is being released for the PC first and an X-box 360 version would be a port. We had seen the interface at work and it is definitly a mouse+keyboard interface. They might add gamepad support for the x-box version but that would not affect the pc version.
2) FFXI support gamepad, keyboards and mouses. The community might be defined in many ways and there are problems because japanese and westerns are all in same server with language barrier problems. but the people there talk.
I always assumed a console MMorpg would support keyboard and mouse. gamepads could be optional.
3) If the port will make WAR get 10 mils subscriber instead of 500K, I see that as a very positive sign and much much much more resources for the game instead of less. the X-box 360 is not actually another "platform" by the way. it is a pc, same processor, same ram, same Graphic card. that is exactly the reason why they could make a Xbox client on the fly just for fun (as they have no declared plans of releasing it there, I must assume the xbox client was made by one of the programmers in his spare time or something), so the problems with extra bugs should be minimal.
Finally, yes MMorpg requires multiple patches, but already now Xbox 360 games get patched a lot. Especially just released game, the people are already aware of this and accept it.
Even if they would take, say, 20% of the x-box players because of the gamepad issue (if there is any issue there), that would still about double or triple their subs.
But thanks, you expressed the reasons as nobody else did. Now all is much clearer.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
This whole conversation has really become moot. I mean seriously what more could you or anyone else say other than i like or dislike the idea of WAR going onto the 360. I don't see how it even matters since you'll just reitterate your opinion over and over as if no one else matters. I don't like the idea of it going console. Think about the amount of players needed for Warhammer to work. How would even an Xbox 360 version work? They'd have to rebuild the game to work completely different, completely different servers, they'd have to have a seperate Xbox 360 team. I think they merely showed off the capability because they could otherwise they'd of stated by now its their intention to do a 360 launch.
I'll ramble on because I can ramble on forever.
Btw all the RPG's you listed for the xbox yes they're OK. But any serious RPG console player knows the machine to have for RPGs is the PS2 (not 3 the 3 sucks right now). How do i Know this? Because I love my ps2 RPG's I have droves and droves of them. I even beta tested the FFXI online game on my PS2. It was a nightmarish experience, I frankly dont know what the asian players see in that game.
Its why I'll never buy an MMO on a console the limitations and uber zoning needs frankly suck.
If they want to release WAR on a console fine, but if it affects the quality of future expansions because such and such idea won't work on a console but it'll work on a pc so we're just not going to do it at all scenario happens they'll lose more players then they'll make with a console launch. ( i love run on sentences).
BTW Xbox 360 IS another platform. Its architecture and pipelines are completely different. On the top most I dont know a crap about programming architecture yes it is a pc. It runs like a pc, it runs a VERSION of direct x but it is NOT a pc and you don't program for it like you would a PC.
Please Refer to Doom Cat with all conspiracies & evil corporation complaints. He'll give you the simple explination of..WE"RE ALL DOOMED!
http://xbox360.qj.net/Warhammer-Online-Age-of-Reckoning-Was-Running-on-Xbox-360-at-E3/pg/49/aid/39229
This site clearly states that the difference between the xbox 360 version and the PC version are " difficult to tell them apart." So there is no reason that they should not put this game on the 360 with the GAMEPAD or the keyboard or mouse. During the communication between the 2 systems in the game the players could not tell that the character that they were playing with was running on an xbox 360. Actually working on the xbox game helped improve the PC version so all u PC nerd should be happy.
Freeing up the computer for others to use (specifically a gaming girlfriend) while still being able to play the game I want is appealing. As mentioned above FFXI had no play issues with controller, keyboard only, nor a setup mixing them devices. It was designed that way however. WAR and AoC are both on my will pre-order list and I wouldn't mind getting a PC and 360 version of both.
People have this great divide between console and PC gaming I just don't understand. I play both and always will. Somethings do not work well on one setup or the other and some things work well on both. MMOs fall under the side of easily designed to work on both. The big issue is many UI designers only think in one way which only works well on PCs. SE made a fully customizable action/event system which made a keyboard only necessary for communication and programming. Considering how lackluster SE is overall I have faith that the minds working on WAR could make a great interface which could function on consoles and PCs.
To be perfectly honest, and I'm really not trying to be antagonistic, but that all sounds like propoganda. I read the article. It's incomplete. By 'telling them apart," did they mean visually, or interactively? Was the gamepad user dropping the control often to type out converstaions, or was he merely following the rest around and fighting? Were the testers in the same room, thus capable to talking to each other? And was the control scheme for PC users ever "simplified" in order to be more compatable with gamepads?
Those are the real questions that should have been asked and answered.
As for, "actually working on the xbox game helped improve the PC version," that's a tune we've all heard sung before. Bethesda proclaimed that their work with the XBox360 helped them create a more interactive and streamlined game for PC users. They beemed with pride while saying so. Then we get Oblivion, and the UI was crap. It was even worse that Morrowind's interface, which again was created that way because of a multi-platform launch. So, I bloody don't care if Mythic is happy with the "improvements" their work with the XBox provided. They're not going to say, "well, this has pretty much neutered the PC version, but we'll run with it anyway on the hopes of more profit."
Seriously.
It's Are'el. This forum doesn't allow apostrophes in usernames.
The point is NOT YOU disliking the idea. the point was people disliking the idea AND saying "this is impossible, will never ever happen!"
It is perfectly reasonable, in my book, as you did, to say "I do not like the idea, because of this this and that"
What I did not accept was the "I do not like the idea ,therefore it should not be done/it is impossible to accomplish"
For the sake of argument let's continue, yes, I know the PS2 is a more RPG friendly than the X-Box.. so what? still a console. The X-box was mentioned because they released a demo client on it. no other reasons. the RPGs were mentioned to prove the X-box 360 is NOT only a FPS/drivers console. And defining KOTOR an "ok" rpg is kinda reductive. Yes, it was on the X-box, not the 360, but still.....
About the systems being so different: then answer this: Why Mythic would have done a X-box 360 version then? if the systems are so different and programming the games on them requires big amount of effort, why wasting that time when the company has no current plans of DOING an x-box 360 version?
Logically you have to admit that if they did a version (and they DID), it must have taken relativly little time for them to do.... OR they have a secret agreement with Microsoft to release the game on the x-box and have been working on the version for a while.
Frankly, i see the first option as the most probable, but you can take your pick.
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
If I remember correctly (it's been a long time) part of the reason they had a client running on a 360, was to show how easy it was to cross a game over from PC to the 360.
Digression:
With the way consoles are evolving, a keyboard/mouse setup for a console isn't far-fetched and there are several games that can be played with the keyboard/mouse setup that people don't even realize.
Dirge of Cerberus could be played with a Keyboard/Mouse and it's a PS2 game.
To me a 360 version would be very tempting, since I'm already considering buying one instead of a PS3 due to hardly any product exclusivity left. Hell, there's even talk about FF 13 being released on the 360.
The only contested point for me would be whether 360 players and PC players are on the same servers.
My vote is for seperate servers for various reasons.
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I live to fight, and fight to live.
Seriously.
It's Are'el. This forum doesn't allow apostrophes in usernames.
Off topic still, but at least one Dragon Quest game was announced as in development (aka could still be canned) for the Japanese market. There is also talk of the new SE MMO being vista/360 exclusive as of last report. The big event SE is holding in May will tell us more specifics most likely.
On topic: For generic USB mouse support all MS has to do is a minor dashboard update on consumer machines. Anyone who has seen a developer console setup has seen a mouse interact with the 360 directly. It is just a lacking feature on the consumer machines. Why I have no idea, but it is. New HDTVs also run at resolutions that are about the average for most MMO players (realize MO players tend not to have the bleeding edge of technology as upgrade at a slower rate since their primary game generally doesn't benefit as much).
Yes Mythic played with the idea that maybe they would be able to make a consol version of WAR. Which would be able to play with pc owners. But I personally dont think that they will go through with the plan as there are just so many problems to solve.
How would the consol players be able to chat with pc players.
Would it be possible to convert the controls to a gamepad.
Would latency be a problem.
And so on....
There are just so many problems with doin this that I cant see them getting it too work without pissing one of the crowds off, if they could even get it to work.
"I cherish the memories of a question my grandson asked me the other day when he said..Grandpa, were you a hero in the war?...No, but i served in a company of heroes"
Sgt. Mike Ranney E-company 506PIR 101'st airborn
"Society in every state is a blessing, but government even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one ..." - Thomas Paine
Mate alot of rpg's coming out to 360. If your an RPG fan you'll need to get one just to play exclusive games like blue dragon, fable 2, elveon and mass effect. Excluding MMO's 360 is t3h rpg platform.
360+ rpg's = http://uk.xbox360.ign.com/articles/716/716474p1.html
My blog:
"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day, if you teach him how to fish, you feed him for a lifetime"
Mate alot of rpg's coming out to 360. If your an RPG fan you'll need to get one just to play exclusive games like blue dragon, fable 2, elveon and mass effect. Excluding MMO's 360 is t3h rpg platform.
360+ rpg's = http://uk.xbox360.ign.com/articles/716/716474p1.html
Ummm...not quite.
There are currently only 5 RPGs available on the 360 as of right now...that's only 1 more than the PS3, and it's been out an entire year longer.
Also, there are only 5 more RPGs in production for the 360 than the PS3. Considering the ties that Microsoft has to the computer gaming industry, that's not terribly impressive.
Eleveon is not a 360 exclusive...where'd you come up with this? It's coming out on PS3 and PC as well. Check your sources before you post falsehoods.
And yes, the 360 will have Fable 2, Mass Effect, and Blue Dragon, but all of those games are being published by Microsoft. Microsoft has no problem forcing the release of an incomplete game that they feel has been in development for too long...remember the first Fable? Oh, yeah, they're the same company that wanted to force the release of Vanguard LAST MARCH, and I hear the game STILL isn't complete; could you imagine what Vanguard would have been like last March?
Besides, I'm sold on Mass Effect and Fable, because I've seen the results of those developers' previous games, but Blue Dragon is a crapshoot from Mistwalker (a developer who hasn't had a single game published yet).
And I like how you didn't mention the PS3 exclusive RPGs that are getting more hype than anything on X360 (save Mass Effect): Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy XIII Versus, and Shin Megami Tensai...just to name a few.
Stop being a fanboy and face the facts: while the 360 is doing a lot more for RPG fans than it's predecessor, it's far from "the RPG platform". Sony caters FAR more to the Japanese audicence, because they, unlike most American console gamers, are RPG-crazy. Common sense dictates that the PS3 will end up having more RPGs than the 360...hell, they're already catching up in numbers with far fewer overall games being developed for the newer console.
Achiever 60.00%
Explorer 33.33%
Killer 80.00%
Socializer 26.67%
According to this survey, I'm an item-whoring ganker. I guess I should have stuck with WoW then...lmao.
What offends the hell out of me is that they are 'debeloping a special keyboard'. Come on, seriously... why are they doing this? I remember when I got my 360 last Fall and tried a keyboard. It worked - but it was useless because games weren't made to use it. And forget a mouse working. Mind you... the point is, you can already use a keyboard with the 360. But Microsoft is STILL going to develope a Microsoft-only keyboard for their beloved 360? C'mon guys...
Grab the latest issue of Game Informer if you REALLY want to get angry. Microsoft has been offering huge cash incentives to game developers if they make their games: 360 exclusive (well duh) - Windows Vista exclusive (ouch) - and... here's the kicker... Microsoft Live Gold Exclusive.
That last one kills me. Some developers have mentioned that Microsoft wants new PC games to have multiplayer 'only' on the Microsoft Live network and have been suggesting that patches can only be retreived on this network, and mods/bonuses/downloadabl content be -purchased- instead of offered for 'free' like... well, like PC gaming has almost always been. Now, why are 'game developers' talking about this? Game Informer mentions that developers are 'afraid to anger Microsoft' and they are the only ones getting 'the facts' from Microsoft regarding its intentions. They are generally upset and disturbed over what Microsoft is trying to do to the gaming world.
So, get ready PC gamers. Soon, we'll have to pay to play any PC game online, regardless if its an MMO or not. Soon we'll have to pay for downloadable content, patches, probably even tech support. Just like we'll have to pay for Vista and a PC that can handle Vista and the games made for it.
.... and these idiot 'kids' complain about the price of the PS3? They have NO effing clue...
**EDIT** And just as a side note... remember that 'game developers' usually don't own the companies these days. So Microsoft pressures the 'suits' above the game developers. And, in turn, the suits pressure the game developers. Money is money.
The only reason the majority of games being published are on consoles is because of how much easier it is to make a game for a console. They cut alot of their costs by doing so. That has always been a known fact.
For those saying it is too difficult for an MMO, I would counter them with the fact strategy games are avaliable for consoles and they take alot more interaction from a keyboard and mouse than an rpg ever has. It really wouldn't be much a strain to make a xbox version of WAR. To top it off, microsoft already has implemented into xbox live ways for computer games and console games to inter mix. Developers don't like the idea simply because of the disadvantage console gamers receive. (PS3 has a few MMOs being released for it this fall already because of incentives from Sony)
One last thing.... you can hook keyboards and mice up to both an xbox 360 and PS3 now. They aren't too diffirent from computers anymore. Just a hella lot easier to program a game to.
Will they do it? Who knows, but more and more studios are switching to making console games and those who havent are likely to make their games compatible to consoles for a bit of extra revenue.
My blog:
Mate alot of rpg's coming out to 360. If your an RPG fan you'll need to get one just to play exclusive games like blue dragon, fable 2, elveon and mass effect. Excluding MMO's 360 is t3h rpg platform.
360+ rpg's = http://uk.xbox360.ign.com/articles/716/716474p1.html
Ummm...not quite.
There are currently only 5 RPGs available on the 360 as of right now...that's only 1 more than the PS3, and it's been out an entire year longer.
Also, there are only 5 more RPGs in production for the 360 than the PS3. Considering the ties that Microsoft has to the computer gaming industry, that's not terribly impressive.
Eleveon is not a 360 exclusive...where'd you come up with this? It's coming out on PS3 and PC as well. Check your sources before you post falsehoods.
And yes, the 360 will have Fable 2, Mass Effect, and Blue Dragon, but all of those games are being published by Microsoft. Microsoft has no problem forcing the release of an incomplete game that they feel has been in development for too long...remember the first Fable? Oh, yeah, they're the same company that wanted to force the release of Vanguard LAST MARCH, and I hear the game STILL isn't complete; could you imagine what Vanguard would have been like last March?
Besides, I'm sold on Mass Effect and Fable, because I've seen the results of those developers' previous games, but Blue Dragon is a crapshoot from Mistwalker (a developer who hasn't had a single game published yet).
And I like how you didn't mention the PS3 exclusive RPGs that are getting more hype than anything on X360 (save Mass Effect): Final Fantasy XIII, Final Fantasy XIII Versus, and Shin Megami Tensai...just to name a few.
Stop being a fanboy and face the facts: while the 360 is doing a lot more for RPG fans than it's predecessor, it's far from "the RPG platform". Sony caters FAR more to the Japanese audicence, because they, unlike most American console gamers, are RPG-crazy. Common sense dictates that the PS3 will end up having more RPGs than the 360...hell, they're already catching up in numbers with far fewer overall games being developed for the newer console.
Myself and most people prefer the 360. 2nd of all MMO's are coming to 360, AoC, huxley pherhaps this and some other less interestings. 3rd the japenese markets stinks, final fantasy etc. it's all the same and it all can piss off. yeah blue dragon looks shite too. You only named 2 RPGs for ps3 and they both sound poop. if you go on the link theres lots coming to 360 and all the best exclusives are 360. I doubt PS3 will be playing with PC. 360 does pawn ps3 for rpg's thats MMOs too, ones without crazy japenese haircuts, airbrushed cartoons with little gender differences.
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Warhammer fanatic since '85.
