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For those who say the game has no challenges.
Grindalyx
Member UncommonPosts: 657
Have you played long enough to reach the wight lord in the great barrows? Have you tried to do the fornost instant? Have you tred to kil the orc in master of the black siege (non instant)? Grant it the first 15 lvls or so are easy and the challenges don't start until you get to the great barrows. But isn't that the case with most MMO's. The lower lvls are always easy to make the learning curve easier.
This game gets alot more difficult as you lvl up. The way it should be. Heck try going into Garth argwen and taking out Ivar bloodhand. I garuntee you it is not an easy task. Nor is the red maid in the same instant. I ran across people in the game who gave up on Garth arwen instant cause it was to hard.
This game has a good balance of hard content and easy content. This can also be said about any other good game. Well that is my opinion anyway.
Comments
-Kzar-
At no point did I feel like a new warrior, learning the skills needed to engage in those higher battles. Think about that, if someone were to put a sword in your hand and chuck you some armor, how easy would you find it to go head to head with a wild Board, having never used either item before?
The Reality is, we need a new means of Combat. Something that introduces player skill in a meaningful way. For anyone here who has played "The Legend of Dragoon" on PSone, you'll recall the dragoon combat wheel thing. You had to time combat moves just so, to get the maximum effect. Initially this was hard to do, because it was new to you. But over time, it got easier, because you'd done it more and more often. But then you'd learn new, stronger skills. Now you have lower power skills that you are good with, and higher power skills that you are a new too. So you will miss a lit, but again, over time, the PLAYER gets better at employing those skills. It was not twitch play, the combat was turn based. Maybe something like this might make me feel more involved in the combat mechanism of the game. As of now, it simply feels so easy most of the time as to not even need me to press the button.
This problem is not native to LotRO, but has always been present and becomes more and more odious as our genre ages. We need a revolution, i think. Again, jmho.
Frank 'Spankybus' Mignone
www.spankybus.com
-3d Artist & Compositor
-Writer
-Professional Amature
This morning my minstrel was fighting with a hunter a few levels lower and a mob that was orange to me and purple to him jumped us from nowhere just as I finished off a mob that was yellow to me and I was down on health and morale. We won but only because of my uber healing skills (and a crapload of luck, and a handy potion and a food buff ). Seriously at the end of the fight I was down to less than 1/4 health and my power was completely exhausted.
I miss DAoC
Challenge is subjective. What one person may find a challenge, another may find easy. And not only that, but it all depends on how you challenge yourself too - LOTRO does allow for that at any level.
Recently I was doing a quest to kill wargs in the Lone Lands with my hobbit burglar. I managed to find a pick up group to complete a bunch of other quests, but after we split I needed to kill a couple more wargs for the turn-in and the next stage in the quest chain. My burglar was level 20, and these wargs were level 25+. Each battle was very very close and I had to use every trick in the book to take each one down. I died a few times, or had to stun and run, but I managed it in the end right down to the wire - out of power and almost out of morale. It was a challenge that I chose for myself; just as I have challenged myself right from level one.
Ever tried to solo an elite? Ever ran the guantlet into a camp full of goblins, hoping a few of them will peel off just so you have time to pickup a quest item or open a chest full of goodies? Ever tried to kill 16 level 25 elite trolls with a champ/hunter duo of the same level and had to kite each one for 2 minutes and use traps, slows, bows, and campfire tactics just to drop them? Ever tried the Great Barrows with half a group and no healer? Ever been at half of your morale because of dread and had to tank a boss with 14k morale? - All of these, and many more situations like them, are challenging.
But of course... you could always choose the easy, safe route through the game. Then again, that isn't possible after level 25 in most cases.
In all honesty the combat in DDO is very engaging and very skill-oriented, allowing much greater challenge in the gameplay. That's not what the majority of MMO players want unfortunately and therefore this is what we get. While I'm not thrilled about it, it also means my wife can play at a very high level of competancy, and that's more important to me than my personal epeen and some huge impact of skill on my player.
Although Asheron's Call 1 had it right IMO. You could take 30 mobs at once if you were good enough. Level didn't matter much, it was all about how good you were. I really do miss that... Maybe Ken Troop will get a new project to lead now that Turbine is doing so well off LotRO. I can only hope.
Lot of quests are not doable even with full group. You need two or three groups working together , or a raid to complete them
MMO wish list:
-Changeable worlds
-Solid non level based game
-Sharks with lasers attached to their heads
Lot of quests are not doable even with full group. You need two or three groups working together , or a raid to complete them Garth Argawan ( sp ?), those are some very tough quests for sure. They can be done with a single group but everyone better thave their acts together. Last time I went in there it cost me 125 in silver for repairs by the time I finished.
I miss DAoC
Yeah, I like this game more and more. Last night our group knocked off the Goblin King and then went down and killed those elite spiders. We had three burglars in the group, so lotsa stunning and fellowship conjunctions. I think there are plenty of challenges for solo and group play.
I agree, trying to play this game for more than two weeks proved to be a very hard challenge.
Even more so not removing it from the harddrive
And finaly resisting the urge to post about how bad it is here.
Needless to say, I wasn't a big enough fighter to resist the final challenge LoTRO brought me. My sauce.... Is weak.
Played so far: 9Dragons, AO, AC, AC2, CoX, DAoC, DF, DnL, DR, DDO, Ent, EvE, EQ, EQ2, FoMK, FFO, Fury, GW, HG:L, HZ, L1, L2, M59, MU, NC1, NC2, PS, PT, R:O, RF:O, RYL, Ryzom, SL, SB, SW:G, TR, TCoS, MX:O, UO, VG, WAR, WoW...
It all sucked.
I think its unfair that people constantly refer to WoW and other established mmo's when putting forward their opinions. How long has WoW had to get to where it is today, give lotro its due, its a newly released game that will improve over time. As I see it, it has a pretty good base from which to work.
Yeah i'd go with that, just a shame the combat in LOTRO, the combat requires spamming any red button that lights up. Or in a minstrels case spamming the same buttons and making sure he heals now and again. Not exactly... challenging.
The guy about the lone-lands made me giggle though, what was so hard about the wargs... you head south at the INN, go past the wolves and wait at the ruins (before the spiders and goblin camp) 4 spawn there (before the elite type mob) every 3 minutes.
Not exactly "challenging", and hardly difficult. The only hard part i found was finiding enough "quests" to level.... but then i solo'ed every quest bar the group and chapter ones. come level 25 i had to even do some red quests (such as delivering the diplomatic gift tot he giants) and walking around some red wights to kill "borrowers" (again... same quest from bree-land but different levels)
did i enjoy the atmosphere of the game - yes. Did i enjoy some of the quests - yes.
combat good - no. does the game get tedious and lacks challenge - yep
I'm confused as to whether this game is challenging or not. Most battles are simply a walk over or a wipeout for the party. There is not any point n between. There is never a struggle in combat it always feels on or off... we are gonna win or at some point we stop winning and have no chance of recovery.
One thing I will say is that I am beginning to think ( no offense no one singled out) that an increasing number of MMORPG players are the most talentless much of morons from any genre (even Battlefeild has it asshats but such poor is is not rewarded... in MMO's it is). Last night outside the great barrows half my group wanted to take a level 40 into the barrows with them to "make it go well". Half the team were DC/ing... the other half were button mashing. Evident by their willfullness to break loremaster stuns on spiders. When I mentioned this someone replied "well you wont be able to stun the later [wrights] ones"..... Well that wasn't the bleedin point !
IMHO its attitudes like this with most players not understanding the powers they posses NOt communicating. Not reading labels and simply throwing a 40+ @ a level 20 fellowship quest.because there button mashing fanatics Choosing dmg dmg dmg dmg over any real tactics. And if that fails well its back to kicking a player and spamming ...
MNS 4 GB q's need....
Over and over....
I'm becoming quite fed up with PUG groups in MMO's they feel like there getting worse.. Damn I need a good (MATURE !) guild on EU server snowbourne... any takers
Sorry it's too easy for me.
I beta tested it for a long time, mostly played Hobbit Burglar.
It's not nearly as hard as old school EQ1 was. I miss the challenge.
Sony Online Entertainment Steals Customers Money
Sorry it's too easy for me.
I beta tested it for a long time, mostly played Hobbit Burglar.
It's not nearly as hard as old school EQ1 was. I miss the challenge.
I will admit it is not as hard or difficult as EQ1, and the game is not for everyone. But there are challenges in the game. Not everything is a walk in the park. My hunter is lvl40 and i yet to find a group that can kill the mob in master of the black tide. The quest is green to me now. This is a quest that requires killing your way thru elite trolls nad orcs. To get to a tent full of elite trolls and orcs that you have to kill off to get to the named mob you have to kill to finish the quest.
Grant it the combat system isn't perfect and i would like more control over it than the game gives us. Turbine is working on that. The champion is getting much love come the evendim update. Are there things about this game i would love to see differant? Yes of course. To me the game is challenging cause i challenge myself in the game in the way i play.
I also like to help out others in my kinship. Some of them play only for a few hours a day and some play weaker classes. Some don't know how to play their class to it's full potential. This is true with lots of people in the game. As some find things difficult and challenging were others don't. If you are going to compare this game to EQ1 then i will agree this game is not challenging. But if you rate this game on it's owne merits and don't compare it to other games i don't agree it is to easy.
As another said the amount of challenge you find in the game is up to the person who is playing. If you do nothing but light blue green quests it is a cake walk. If you do quests that are higher lvl than you are it isn't. I gave a few example of very challenging content in the game there are alot more and i sure there are even more that i haven't came across yet. The game gets harder as you lvl wich is the way i think it should be.
Alot of new gamers are playing this game for the first time. So it only makes since that the game would be have a easy learning curve at low lvls so that the these gamers can learn the game. That learning curve starts to get harder at lvl 15 and keeps getting harder as you lvl.
I'd rather gouge my eyes out then get in noob pugs. I zone/dc/suicide if I have to pug and I see 1 idiot aggro something incorrectly. I have a real question how is the end game pvp and the crafting in LOTR?
As for the mmo comments. Of course its lame. It's level based. All level based games suffer the same fatal flaw. You get a few levels above the content leveling in noob land and you don't die through the entire game unless you suck or get stuck in the above mentioned pathetic pug. All NPC's suck. They are NPC's. If I still found NPC's challenging in a MMO I'd probably kill myself. I don't play wow. I have the box. I installed it. I started. I decided I'd rather blow my brains out then level to 60 in wow. It is insanely boring to me to have this content forced and levels so strictly enforced.
Fundamentally that is why I haven't been doing alot of MMO's lately. When you handicap the games content with level modifiers you may as well just say we are making a game to attract as many players as possible and don't care if you know how to easily beat the game. You don't see hard core gamers picking up easy games do you? So why is there nothing in your games for hardcore gamers? I mean seriously. You game content is a joke if you think levels ever work.
I'd rather play guild wars where the pvp is actually fun and challenging. At least there the levels aren't really even important.
Played in top 50 pvp guilds as a monk in guild wars. I've seen all sorts of warriors in games. The really good are fun to watch. I won't heal the warrior if he wants to overextend. I won't suicide or sacrifice a group for one idiot. Most games if you have 2 experienced healers you can go through any content and most groups. It is not rocket science. Kill the healers, kill the casters, kill the warriors. Generally speaking that strategy works quiet well. Healers jobs are to heal the group but most important to keep the other healer alive.
In pve the healers job is easier. Don't aggro. Let the warriors pull and the casters anhilate and you keep the warriors up. I dont see to many games that vary much from that recipe for success. How you get into any pug that doesn't understand that strategy is beyond me. However, it still amazes me to see the typical wammo/paladin I can kill 50 dudes. Screw your mana! Lets pwnzers! Run off and think that his healers are going to follow that idea to there own death.
Yeah i'd go with that, just a shame the combat in LOTRO, the combat requires spamming any red button that lights up. Or in a minstrels case spamming the same buttons and making sure he heals now and again. Not exactly... challenging.
Mmmhit the red button in every case, never use the blue, yellow or green one as the situation warrents. Not cool , I would kick you from my group pretty fast cause obviously you need a simpler game.
As a minstrel which heal? The quick one that give a little morale back , or the slower one that gives more health or one of the oh shit lets heal the entire party and get all the aggro on us. Don't forget to buff the party also , and be sure to use the anthem of compassion every few ticks to keep the aggro off yourself. Exactly how often is that now and what is the lead up for it? Oops a undead add just jumped in better mez him too. oh my gawd we are getting in trouble , now what was that ability that gives everyone a super buff for 15 secs?
The guy about the lone-lands made me giggle though, what was so hard about the wargs... you head south at the INN, go past the wolves and wait at the ruins (before the spiders and goblin camp) 4 spawn there (before the elite type mob) every 3 minutes.
Not exactly "challenging", and hardly difficult. The only hard part i found was finiding enough "quests" to level.... but then i solo'ed every quest bar the group and chapter ones. come level 25 i had to even do some red quests (such as delivering the diplomatic gift tot he giants) and walking around some red wights to kill "borrowers" (again... same quest from bree-land but different levels)
At level 33 I have a dozen solo quests left and at least another dozen group quests, That is not including theepic line. I deleted some gray quests just cause why bother with them. I had no problem finding quests. I hear they get scarce in the mid 30's but the expansion next week is supposed to take care of that.did i enjoy the atmosphere of the game - yes. Did i enjoy some of the quests - yes.
combat good - no. does the game get tedious and lacks challenge - yep
I am sure you will be happier playing a different game, have a good day..
I miss DAoC
Barrows - Check
Fornost - Check
Orc Master - Check
The game is very very easy lol I leveled fater in this game than any MMO including WoW ( comparing my first time through each of course ).
Since i have left for a few weeks to try some other things, its just too easy. People at max level 2 weeks after a game hits the shelves is like, pretty rediculous in an MMO. Its not one person on a server mind you, many many people got that far that fast. The game is just way to easy. But that was their intention, it is for the casual crowd.
I guess i found out what crowd i am in.
-Allegria