5.) Fantasy has been played out, soaked in and hung out to dry for the longest now. Amungst multiple MMO communities you find former or current fantasy players wanting to experiment with Sci-Fi. With games like Tabula Rasa, Stargate Words, Jump Gate, Fallen Earth & Hellgate:London amungst others how can you blame them. People want something with tenticles now not pointed ears.
Correction: High-Magic Fantasy has been played out far too much. As far as fantasy goes, we need some games where even at the highest levels a glowy sword of fire is really hard to obtain, limited in supply, or even just downright rare (.0001% drop anyone?). When everyone and their mother has a flaming sword, it just takes the fun out of having one yourself.
A bit off topic, but with the above being said I probably would have liked DDO a hell of a lot more if it were Greyhawk or Forgotten Realms instead of Eberon.
How can I explain this so it sinks in? WoW could lose half of it's playerbase and still be the largest MMO ever, because no single other MMO is going to pull that other 50% away. People try and say that AoC is going to beat WoW, it isn't. AoC, no matter how good, is not going to sell as well because it is an adult game. Parents are not going to be buying it for their kids, or at least not nearly as much so it already loses just based on that one fact. Warhammer will not topple WoW. It is PvP based. If I need to go further into it than that I can. Not all people like a PvP based game, there is a large portion of the WoW community who has never engaged in PvP (or does so on a very limited basis) those people aren't going to leave WoW for Warhammer. Tabula Rasa will not beat WoW. It is Sci-Fi. Many people won't play it just because of that. It is PvE based with some PvP, some won't play it for that reason. It doesn't have traditional controls or playstyle, some people won't play it because of that. Is this sinking in? WoW isn't going anywhere. It certainly isn't going to be beat by any single game coming out. That's not to mention the fact that people have invested a large amount of time into WoW already. You claim this means they are ready to move on. For some this is no doubt true, for others it means they'd rather just keep playing because they don't feel like starting over in an entirely new game again. A very large group of WoW players will not pick up any future MMOs. WoW will be there first and last. Of all those people who played WoW those who leave because of annoying problems with drama, etc. are not going to be coming back to the genre based on this new round of games. In fact, many of them aren't even typical gamers. There are housewives who have never picked up a game before. There are retirees who haven't seen games aside from what their kids/grandkids play. That population isn't moving on to a different game, they are not going to be playing games anymore if they leave. WoW didn't take players from other games. Well...more correctly, it took players from other games and created an entirely new market of several million customers. Even without all the people who had played MMOs before WoW would still be the biggest MMO ever. Hundreds of thousands? That's a pittance compared to what WoW has. Not to mention, there is plenty going on in WoW to keep people interested. The next few patches will be adding in some things that newer games already have, such as voice chat built in. At Blizzcon or E3 or something like that they will probably announce what their next expansion is going to be. When that happens you are going to get some people who will just stick around until the expansion comes out to see how it is (there will also be those who leave only to come back when that expansion hits.) Fantasy isn't going anywhere. Fantasy games have been made for a long, long time. They still sell well. Games like Tabula Rasa will not be pulling in the fantasy crowd. That doesn't mean it's a good thing, or that it should be that way, but people like what they are familiar with. Sure, people say they want new things and they want to try something different, but in the end what they really want is elves, orcs, and dragons. And companies will continue to supply that because it sells. Entire guilds quitting could happen, but you seem to believe that there is some loyalty to a guild in WoW. Maybe with a small population there is, but most will do whatever the hell they feel like and screw over their guild without even thinking about it. If the guild leader says they are going to be moving over to X or Y game, some may come, others will not. Most of the time you aren't going to be getting the entire guild to come play. In the end, it won't be any game that is going to overcome WoW to be the new market leader, all these games will take away some, some will just leave to play single-player games or no games at all, but WoW will still be around, still be turning a profit, and will continue to do so for many years to come.
Haha Im sorry but you sound as if World of Warcraft is some unstoppable invincible force. WoW will last a couple more years at most, I can guarentee that. And not everyone wants 'elves, orcs, and dragons', you might, but not everyone feels that way, more and more sci fi games are being made now.
WoW was a good game while it lasted, but its not going to make it more than 3-4 years.
I bet World of Starcraft will end up taking its place.
And you would be correct. Even if World of Starcraft was just WoW with Starcraft models. It would probably be the only thing capable of even getting close to WoW numberse. Like someone said earlier. No game due out between now and 2010 is going to even make Blizzard/WoW flinch. WoW might not be as you put it an "unstoppable invincible force" but right now it's the only game that started out as a 500 pound gorilla and grew to about 3000 pounds.
In War - Victory. In Peace - Vigilance. In Death - Sacrifice.
On the main subject, not much to say. We'll see in 5 years. It's strange to see that some still seem to think the maximum number of MMOG players in the world has been reached, and any new game will have to take players from the others. Personally I think (and hope) AoC, WAR, Tabla Rasa, etc will all do well, but still not really hit the WoW numbers very much - at least not in Europe and the US.
Personally, I can not bring myself to play another fantasy MMO. This genre has to change from the sword, auto-attack, grind to 50, LFG, crafting crap that it is in currently. Some game is going to change the genre and make a lot of money doing so. Yes WoW will lose subs but will always remain the top MMO if only due to the low system requirements.
I don't know how many people feel the same way as I do but in my mind fantasy is dead. I refuse to endure the leveling grind only to get to max level.
How can I explain this so it sinks in? WoW could lose half of it's playerbase and still be the largest MMO ever, because no single other MMO is going to pull that other 50% away. People try and say that AoC is going to beat WoW, it isn't. AoC, no matter how good, is not going to sell as well because it is an adult game. Parents are not going to be buying it for their kids, or at least not nearly as much so it already loses just based on that one fact. Warhammer will not topple WoW. It is PvP based. If I need to go further into it than that I can. Not all people like a PvP based game, there is a large portion of the WoW community who has never engaged in PvP (or does so on a very limited basis) those people aren't going to leave WoW for Warhammer. Tabula Rasa will not beat WoW. It is Sci-Fi. Many people won't play it just because of that. It is PvE based with some PvP, some won't play it for that reason. It doesn't have traditional controls or playstyle, some people won't play it because of that. Is this sinking in? WoW isn't going anywhere. It certainly isn't going to be beat by any single game coming out. That's not to mention the fact that people have invested a large amount of time into WoW already. You claim this means they are ready to move on. For some this is no doubt true, for others it means they'd rather just keep playing because they don't feel like starting over in an entirely new game again. A very large group of WoW players will not pick up any future MMOs. WoW will be there first and last. Of all those people who played WoW those who leave because of annoying problems with drama, etc. are not going to be coming back to the genre based on this new round of games. In fact, many of them aren't even typical gamers. There are housewives who have never picked up a game before. There are retirees who haven't seen games aside from what their kids/grandkids play. That population isn't moving on to a different game, they are not going to be playing games anymore if they leave. WoW didn't take players from other games. Well...more correctly, it took players from other games and created an entirely new market of several million customers. Even without all the people who had played MMOs before WoW would still be the biggest MMO ever. Hundreds of thousands? That's a pittance compared to what WoW has. Not to mention, there is plenty going on in WoW to keep people interested. The next few patches will be adding in some things that newer games already have, such as voice chat built in. At Blizzcon or E3 or something like that they will probably announce what their next expansion is going to be. When that happens you are going to get some people who will just stick around until the expansion comes out to see how it is (there will also be those who leave only to come back when that expansion hits.) Fantasy isn't going anywhere. Fantasy games have been made for a long, long time. They still sell well. Games like Tabula Rasa will not be pulling in the fantasy crowd. That doesn't mean it's a good thing, or that it should be that way, but people like what they are familiar with. Sure, people say they want new things and they want to try something different, but in the end what they really want is elves, orcs, and dragons. And companies will continue to supply that because it sells. Entire guilds quitting could happen, but you seem to believe that there is some loyalty to a guild in WoW. Maybe with a small population there is, but most will do whatever the hell they feel like and screw over their guild without even thinking about it. If the guild leader says they are going to be moving over to X or Y game, some may come, others will not. Most of the time you aren't going to be getting the entire guild to come play. In the end, it won't be any game that is going to overcome WoW to be the new market leader, all these games will take away some, some will just leave to play single-player games or no games at all, but WoW will still be around, still be turning a profit, and will continue to do so for many years to come.
I will be stunningly impressed if WoW still has 50% of its subscribers still actively playing by 12/31/07. I mean, Paris Hilton becoming a construction worker kind of impressed lol. I by no means use "impressed" lightly at all. That means WoW will not only have to survive a brutal population cut caused by Age of Conan, but other F2P games like 2Moons, SUN, or Cabal Online which are going to appeal to those who can not afford the AoC monthly fee.
Wow is a great game for what it is. It does have an end and the climb to that end was fun for most to get to.
Just about every post I read about bashing WoW always points to the end game...how fun it was leveling up but the end game sucks.
Well...so it was fun until the end.
It was/is an mmo that had a clear end. So take it for what it was. A fun easy solo/multiple player game that brought milllllllions of new players into the market place. This can never be a bad thing.
It will last for years I think simply because of the market it appeals to.
Man, you guys are freakin awesome. You are like better than Nostrodamus...better than Miss Cleo....better than the little floating head Genie on Pee-Wees Playhouse. You can all see into the future...what the hell are all you doin playin MMO's and not playin the lottery??? You guys are nuts! Can you tell me who is going to win the next Super Bowl? I wanna make a bet.
I swear people act like that game stole their wife, beat them up and took their lunch money, and just all around ruined their life. What does it matter how much longer it will live? Do you really think you'll get any benefit at it's downfall? I think some of you really need to go outside, get some sun or hit the beach. It's summer after all, and here you are counting the ways and days until WoW finally dies off.
Man, you guys are freakin awesome. You are like better than Nostrodamus...better than Miss Cleo....better than the little floating head Genie on Pee-Wees Playhouse. You can all see into the future...what the hell are all you doin playin MMO's and not playin the lottery??? You guys are nuts! Can you tell me who is going to win the next Super Bowl? I wanna make a bet.
Pfft....
Even though you reference me too I completely back you on the comment... i'm speaking through logic.... I mean theareticly speaking .. if the 19 MMO's being released from October - Febuary get 100,000 subscribers which is miniscule that will be 1.9 million but logically you already know War and AoC may in fact reach 1 mill, GOds & heroes 200k, Tabula Rasa 200K +... thats just 4 games that I have a guestimate about ... either ro may be bigger or worse and theres 15 more ... WoW dead ... yes Starcraft MMO is awsome and I would be there I would play it but thats a distant dream that Blizzard needs to start working on because the Age of WoW is over. I will miss WoW though and appreciate it for what it has done for the MMO market.
Games Enjoyed: UO,EQ,AC,EQ2,COX,LOTRO Games Played(-Above):WoW,MXO,GW(beta),RFO,ArchLord,V:SOH,Rappelz,Ryzom,DDO Games I felt were a rip-off: DDO,ArchLord,V:SOH - all newer how ironic
Man, you guys are freakin awesome. You are like better than Nostrodamus...better than Miss Cleo....better than the little floating head Genie on Pee-Wees Playhouse. You can all see into the future...what the hell are all you doin playin MMO's and not playin the lottery??? You guys are nuts! Can you tell me who is going to win the next Super Bowl? I wanna make a bet.
Pfft....
Even though you reference me too I completely back you on the comment... i'm speaking through logic.... I mean theareticly speaking .. if the 19 MMO's being released from October - Febuary get 100,000 subscribers which is miniscule that will be 1.9 million but logically you already know War and AoC may in fact reach 1 mill, GOds & heroes 200k, Tabula Rasa 200K +... thats just 4 games that I have a guestimate about ... either ro may be bigger or worse and theres 15 more ... WoW dead ... yes Starcraft MMO is awsome and I would be there I would play it but thats a distant dream that Blizzard needs to start working on because the Age of WoW is over. I will miss WoW though and appreciate it for what it has done for the MMO market.
Neither WAR nor AoC will reach 1 million subscribers. Please don't let yourself be pulled in the words of fans. Warhammer fans and Age of Conan fans often speak llike its completely normal for an MMO in this time and age to reach 1 million subscribers. Its not, its an exception, a big expection.
WoW won't die in the next 10 years. period. Just thinking it will die is absurd. if Ultima Online, which peaked at 250k subscribers can survive for 10 years, so can WoW, easily.
I will miss WoW though and appreciate it for what it has done for the MMO market.
Expect WoW to be around for well over 2 years to come. You know that UO is still up and running? That People are still paying a monthly fee for it?
It's the phenomenon of the first MMORPG you play. UO made MMORPGs big, so to speak, with Meridian 59 paving the way for that. Many people started with UO, and some stayed there.
Nothing else will happen with WoW, remember that WoW finally was a MMORPG for the absolute Mass Market, Millions of Players all over the World started with WoW as their first MMORPG, and they'll always think back of it in fond memories, and many of them will try out other MMORPGs, find that they aren't as fun as WoW for them, and come back to WoW.
Man, you guys are freakin awesome. You are like better than Nostrodamus...better than Miss Cleo....better than the little floating head Genie on Pee-Wees Playhouse. You can all see into the future...what the hell are all you doin playin MMO's and not playin the lottery??? You guys are nuts! Can you tell me who is going to win the next Super Bowl? I wanna make a bet.
Pfft....
Even though you reference me too I completely back you on the comment... i'm speaking through logic.... I mean theareticly speaking .. if the 19 MMO's being released from October - Febuary get 100,000 subscribers which is miniscule that will be 1.9 million but logically you already know War and AoC may in fact reach 1 mill, GOds & heroes 200k, Tabula Rasa 200K +... thats just 4 games that I have a guestimate about ... either ro may be bigger or worse and theres 15 more ... WoW dead ... yes Starcraft MMO is awsome and I would be there I would play it but thats a distant dream that Blizzard needs to start working on because the Age of WoW is over. I will miss WoW though and appreciate it for what it has done for the MMO market.
Neither WAR nor AoC will reach 1 million subscribers. Please don't let yourself be pulled in the words of fans. Warhammer fans and Age of Conan fans often speak llike its completely normal for an MMO in this time and age to reach 1 million subscribers. Its not, its an exception, a big expection.
WoW won't die in the next 10 years. period. Just thinking it will die is absurd. if Ultima Online, which peaked at 250k subscribers can survive for 10 years, so can WoW, easily.
and your right ... I dont mean die as in be gone completely as WoW will be on the VH1 version of 2000's in 2100 but if it ever goes down to 1 million it will be considered dead so to speak ... it will be like the NY Yankees losing Clemens, Pettite, Mussina, Rodriguez, & Jeter .... wouldnt be anywhere near what it use to be and even though their money bags would still be fatter than most if not all mmo's monthly. The only reason I believe other MMO's can reach one million is strictly because WoW and a few other services or providers as gotten our AGE of kids and adults to become acustomed to paying monthly fee's for gaming weather it be a PC MMO or a Xbox live Gold account... also ... AOC and a few others will be released on 360 ... that is a completely different playerbase than the MMO market... Pretty much every household has a console game system not all house holds play ONLINE PC games...
Games Enjoyed: UO,EQ,AC,EQ2,COX,LOTRO Games Played(-Above):WoW,MXO,GW(beta),RFO,ArchLord,V:SOH,Rappelz,Ryzom,DDO Games I felt were a rip-off: DDO,ArchLord,V:SOH - all newer how ironic
I think you guys are over looking something key here. Just because WAR is going to have 500,000 subscribers (or whatever) doesn't mean World of Warcraft is going to lose 500,000 subscribers. These games share only a small part of the market, most of their foundation comes from a completely different market or even a brand new never before seen market.
I personally am leaving WoW for WAR, but I know that WAR's target audience isn't WoW players, but Warhammer and Games Workshop fans in general. They aren't trying to do WoW but better, they're trying to do Warhammer right the first time.
Sure, WoW is going to lose some subscribers every time a new game comes out, but the number WoW loses isn't directly related to the number gained by the other MMO.
How can I explain this so it sinks in? WoW could lose half of it's playerbase and still be the largest MMO ever, because no single other MMO is going to pull that other 50% away. People try and say that AoC is going to beat WoW, it isn't. AoC, no matter how good, is not going to sell as well because it is an adult game. Parents are not going to be buying it for their kids, or at least not nearly as much so it already loses just based on that one fact. Warhammer will not topple WoW. It is PvP based. If I need to go further into it than that I can. Not all people like a PvP based game, there is a large portion of the WoW community who has never engaged in PvP (or does so on a very limited basis) those people aren't going to leave WoW for Warhammer. Tabula Rasa will not beat WoW. It is Sci-Fi. Many people won't play it just because of that. It is PvE based with some PvP, some won't play it for that reason. It doesn't have traditional controls or playstyle, some people won't play it because of that. Is this sinking in? WoW isn't going anywhere. It certainly isn't going to be beat by any single game coming out. That's not to mention the fact that people have invested a large amount of time into WoW already. You claim this means they are ready to move on. For some this is no doubt true, for others it means they'd rather just keep playing because they don't feel like starting over in an entirely new game again. A very large group of WoW players will not pick up any future MMOs. WoW will be there first and last. Of all those people who played WoW those who leave because of annoying problems with drama, etc. are not going to be coming back to the genre based on this new round of games. In fact, many of them aren't even typical gamers. There are housewives who have never picked up a game before. There are retirees who haven't seen games aside from what their kids/grandkids play. That population isn't moving on to a different game, they are not going to be playing games anymore if they leave. WoW didn't take players from other games. Well...more correctly, it took players from other games and created an entirely new market of several million customers. Even without all the people who had played MMOs before WoW would still be the biggest MMO ever. Hundreds of thousands? That's a pittance compared to what WoW has. Not to mention, there is plenty going on in WoW to keep people interested. The next few patches will be adding in some things that newer games already have, such as voice chat built in. At Blizzcon or E3 or something like that they will probably announce what their next expansion is going to be. When that happens you are going to get some people who will just stick around until the expansion comes out to see how it is (there will also be those who leave only to come back when that expansion hits.) Fantasy isn't going anywhere. Fantasy games have been made for a long, long time. They still sell well. Games like Tabula Rasa will not be pulling in the fantasy crowd. That doesn't mean it's a good thing, or that it should be that way, but people like what they are familiar with. Sure, people say they want new things and they want to try something different, but in the end what they really want is elves, orcs, and dragons. And companies will continue to supply that because it sells. Entire guilds quitting could happen, but you seem to believe that there is some loyalty to a guild in WoW. Maybe with a small population there is, but most will do whatever the hell they feel like and screw over their guild without even thinking about it. If the guild leader says they are going to be moving over to X or Y game, some may come, others will not. Most of the time you aren't going to be getting the entire guild to come play. In the end, it won't be any game that is going to overcome WoW to be the new market leader, all these games will take away some, some will just leave to play single-player games or no games at all, but WoW will still be around, still be turning a profit, and will continue to do so for many years to come.
This dude is a WoW fanboy obviously but Warhammer will take tons of pvp fans. Tabula Rasa will take tons of Sci-fi fans and AoC will take tons and tons of adults and kids whos parents dont give a crud. Trust me WoW will get hurt BADDD and trust me one of those 3 may very well surpass WoW so dont say what you dont know! We will wait and see.
I myself am getting sick of fantasy so ill try Tabula but ill prolly still try AoC and WAR!
Yeah the most successful MMO of all time will die some day but only after Blizzard's coffers are overflowing. A pointless thread.
----------------------- Past MMOs- Planetside, WoW. Current MMO: Current Games: L4D, Skyrim Tried- ATITD, EQ2, SoR, Vanguard,SL,LOTRO,SotNW,SWTOR. Anticipating- GW2, Planetside2
I only played WoW a short time, but it impressed me as one of the best mmols out there. I'd say the nr 1 reason it will die is:
A sudden shift in the Earths rotation results in a lifeless planet, so people just naturally stop playing. Course the solar powered WoW servers continue to operate well into the next millenium..
1.) What goes around comes around, WoW masterfully took hundreds of thousands of players from other games to theirs and with the Fall launch of so many potenionally good games you can only assume millions will be leaving WoW even if it isn't a permanant vacation away. 2.) MMO's are like cars in the end... If you can afford it you always want to upgrade because it starts to toll on you 3.) Theres nothing new to explore, nothing new to accomplish. WoW has had such a strong player base that there are no secrets left and the "achiever & explorer" classifications will want new terrain. 4.) PvP was the focus on many "IN-Production" titles allowing those tired of WoW who prefer PVP the option of leaving their once obsession to explore newer more innovative forms of PvP. 5.) Fantasy has been played out, soaked in and hung out to dry for the longest now. Amungst multiple MMO communities you find former or current fantasy players wanting to experiment with Sci-Fi. With games like Tabula Rasa, Stargate Words, Jump Gate, Fallen Earth & Hellgate:London amungst others how can you blame them. People want something with tenticles now not pointed ears. 6.) Contrary to popular Nay-Say belief the new line of MMO's will bring something new to the board, In game group voice chat so you wont have to use vent, Better versions of Seige & PvP, Twitch reflex combat, New Worlds, New Stories, New objectives, New Secrets, New players things are evolving and are taken more serious these days. 7.) Even if someone says I will never leave WoW I love WoW... word of mouth is like crack to MMO's while you peddeling through the plains of WoW and people keep expressing how much they love "Insert Name" your going to be a little curious to find out. and you know what they say Curiosity killed the WoW. 8.) Cut off arm, Nade the opposition, 50 vs 50 seige, death mayham, destruction all in graphical direct x 10 beauty... oh and Guilds like to stick together. If a guild shifts titles thats possibly 20 plus people no longer playing. 9.) Because you say it will not. 10.) Due to the BC appearantly people already started leaving WoW and it's rating lowered from 8.4 - 8.3 for the first time since release to a 8.1 .... if it keeps going down its equivilent to the 7.9 VG which is making upgrades and appearantly gaining soem steam... which will be cut short as most people already have a MMO they are just waiting for. The more people leave WoW the less fun certain players associated with them will have when all their buddies are gone sending them IM's about how fun this other game is.
you need therapy and you should definetly not play mmo's. please visit myspace.com for further online interaction as the people there will pretend to give a crap. we wont.
wtf is up with all the creepy emo posts lately?
Games i'm playing right now...
"In short, I thought NGE was a very bad idea" - Raph Koster talking about NGE on his blog at raphkoster.com
1.) What goes around comes around, WoW masterfully took hundreds of thousands of players from other games to theirs and with the Fall launch of so many potenionally good games you can only assume millions will be leaving WoW even if it isn't a permanant vacation away. You sir, are 100% incorrect. WoW has 8+ million players. A couple hundred thousand players from other games makes zero difference to WoW. I am still surprised how little posters ont his site know about WoW players. The majority of WoW players do NOT come from other mmorpgs. The roughly 20 million Blizzard fans have always existed, but were ignored by the mmorpg industry. 2.) MMO's are like cars in the end... If you can afford it you always want to upgrade because it starts to toll on you Incorrect. There are many different reasons people buy cars. Your mother can afford a car. Do you see her upgrading it? Your school teacher, the cop when he's off duty, the college professer, all can afford a car, do you see them constantly upgrading it? 3.) Theres nothing new to explore, nothing new to accomplish. WoW has had such a strong player base that there are no secrets left and the "achiever & explorer" classifications will want new terrain. Incorrect. WoW can always release new expansions whenever their playerbase seems to start peaking. How many expansions has EQ released? How many? 4.) PvP was the focus on many "IN-Production" titles allowing those tired of WoW who prefer PVP the option of leaving their once obsession to explore newer more innovative forms of PvP. Incorrect. You do not know Blizzard fans, and players. They are NOT the same as the general mmorpg players. Blizzard fans will play anything by Blizzard as long as possible. Next, WoW was never a PvP game. It was roughly 50% PvE/50% PvP when it released. Right now, it's roughly 75% PvE/25%PvP. But again, it's a Blizzard game, and there are roughly 20 million online Blizzard players on Battlenet. Please go login to Battlenet and tell me what's that ad that's at the top of the site, 24 hours a day, and what does it say? 5.) Fantasy has been played out, soaked in and hung out to dry for the longest now. Amungst multiple MMO communities you find former or current fantasy players wanting to experiment with Sci-Fi. With games like Tabula Rasa, Stargate Words, Jump Gate, Fallen Earth & Hellgate:London amungst others how can you blame them. People want something with tenticles now not pointed ears. Incorrect - when it comes to WoW. You are correct only when it comes to other mmorpgs. Blizzard's majority of HIT games are all fantasy games. Diablo 1, Diablo 2, Warcraft, and Worlds of Warcraft. Next, WoW is also a Sci -Fi game. Did you ever complete the dungeon in which you have to fight the 40 foot tall giant female? Then later the super giant guy? Then later get the computer disks? And read the holocron message about spaceships, planetary colonizing? *Edit* It's called "Uldaman". 6.) Contrary to popular Nay-Say belief the new line of MMO's will bring something new to the board, In game group voice chat so you wont have to use vent, Better versions of Seige & PvP, Twitch reflex combat, New Worlds, New Stories, New objectives, New Secrets, New players things are evolving and are taken more serious these days. Incorrect - when it comes to WoW. WoW itself was NEVER advertised as bringing anything new to mmorpgs. They never claimed it was going to revolutionize the industry. All WoW did, was take the most fun parts of other games, including Blizzard's own games, and put it all into one game rulled up, and omitted as much unfun things players disliked in other mmorpgs (example: the insane downtime in EQ). 7.) Even if someone says I will never leave WoW I love WoW... word of mouth is like crack to MMO's while you peddeling through the plains of WoW and people keep expressing how much they love "Insert Name" your going to be a little curious to find out. and you know what they say Curiosity killed the WoW. Incorrect - when it comes to WoW. Forget about what anyone says. It's what players say with their WALLETS and POCKET BOOKS. 8 million wallets/pocket books say you are wrong. 8.) Cut off arm, Nade the opposition, 50 vs 50 seige, death mayham, destruction all in graphical direct x 10 beauty... oh and Guilds like to stick together. If a guild shifts titles thats possibly 20 plus people no longer playing. Incorrect - when it comes to WoW. Using your own example - 20 plus people is less than nothing in WoW. BTW, did you know Battlenet has over 20+ MILLION players? This means only 40% of Blizzard's total FANS have played WoW so far. Blizzard's fanbase is OLDER than any other mmorpg guild in existance. Whenever Blizzard makes any new game, they are guaranteed to have millions try that game, and stick to that game, because of Battlenet. 9.) Because you say it will not. Incorrect. You say nay, I say yay. Your #9 moots it's ownself. 10.) Due to the BC appearantly people already started leaving WoW and it's rating lowered from 8.4 - 8.3 for the first time since release to a 8.1 .... if it keeps going down its equivilent to the 7.9 VG which is making upgrades and appearantly gaining soem steam... which will be cut short as most people already have a MMO they are just waiting for. The more people leave WoW the less fun certain players associated with them will have when all their buddies are gone sending them IM's about how fun this other game is. Incorrect. Ratings mean nothing. It's who's voting with their wallets and pocket books. Next, WoW can shrink down to 25 players playing, and it will still NOT LOSE MONEY. ----------------------- Now go find some other mmorpg you enjoy , and PLAY IT!
It's amazing how easily I showed everysingle one of your reason's to be incorrect. It was fun.
*Goes back to playing a bit of Diablo 2 muhahahaaaa!*
1.) What goes around comes around, WoW masterfully took hundreds of thousands of players from other games to theirs and with the Fall launch of so many potenionally good games you can only assume millions will be leaving WoW even if it isn't a permanant vacation away. You sir, are 100% incorrect. WoW has 8+ million players. A couple hundred thousand players from other games makes zero difference to WoW. I am still surprised how little posters ont his site know about WoW players. The majority of WoW players do NOT come from other mmorpgs. The roughly 20 million Blizzard fans have always existed, but were ignored by the mmorpg industry. I agree with the green. 2.) MMO's are like cars in the end... If you can afford it you always want to upgrade because it starts to toll on you Incorrect. There are many different reasons people buy cars. Your mother can afford a car. Do you see her upgrading it? Your school teacher, the cop when he's off duty, the college professer, all can afford a car, do you see them constantly upgrading it? I'd add I still play the second MMO I ever played .. AO. Personally I think its superior still to 90% of the junk thats been released in the last two years. No ..you dont always upgrade. Green is right again. 3.) Theres nothing new to explore, nothing new to accomplish. WoW has had such a strong player base that there are no secrets left and the "achiever & explorer" classifications will want new terrain. Incorrect. WoW can always release new expansions whenever their playerbase seems to start peaking. How many expansions has EQ released? How many? Well yes fundamentally true green .. however at the rate they are releasing them this could indeed hamper WOWs ability to hold onto its insane player base. But no its not a game killer. 4.) PvP was the focus on many "IN-Production" titles allowing those tired of WoW who prefer PVP the option of leaving their once obsession to explore newer more innovative forms of PvP. Incorrect. You do not know Blizzard fans, and players. They are NOT the same as the general mmorpg players. Blizzard fans will play anything by Blizzard as long as possible. Next, WoW was never a PvP game. It was roughly 50% PvE/50% PvP when it released. Right now, it's roughly 75% PvE/25%PvP. But again, it's a Blizzard game, and there are roughly 20 million online Blizzard players on Battlenet. Please go login to Battlenet and tell me what's that ad that's at the top of the site, 24 hours a day, and what does it say? I think alot of players will defect to PVPcentric games like WAR when its released. But hardly a mass exodus .. people who play to complete will be the ones to go .. the blizzard and warcraft fans arnt going anywhere. 5.) Fantasy has been played out, soaked in and hung out to dry for the longest now. Amungst multiple MMO communities you find former or current fantasy players wanting to experiment with Sci-Fi. With games like Tabula Rasa, Stargate Words, Jump Gate, Fallen Earth & Hellgate:London amungst others how can you blame them. People want something with tenticles now not pointed ears. Incorrect - when it comes to WoW. You are correct only when it comes to other mmorpgs. Blizzard's majority of HIT games are all fantasy games. Diablo 1, Diablo 2, Warcraft, and Worlds of Warcraft. Next, WoW is also a Sci -Fi game. Did you ever complete the dungeon in which you have to fight the 40 foot tall giant female? Then later the super giant guy? Then later get the computer disks? And read the holocron message about spaceships, planetary colonizing? Actually there was a survey not to long ago in which the end results showed Sword and Sorcerer style Fantasy to still be the most popular setting for MMORPGs even with the insane insurgence of them on the market. Yes the sci-fi niche is coming up in the games list .. EVE for instance was THE top rated game for monthes and AO has always been in the top of the pack .. but Fantasy remains strong. Dont fool yourself. Another point to green. 6.) Contrary to popular Nay-Say belief the new line of MMO's will bring something new to the board, In game group voice chat so you wont have to use vent, Better versions of Seige & PvP, Twitch reflex combat, New Worlds, New Stories, New objectives, New Secrets, New players things are evolving and are taken more serious these days. Incorrect - when it comes to WoW. WoW itself was NEVER advertised as bringing anything new to mmorpgs. They never claimed it was going to revolutionize the industry. All WoW did, was take the most fun parts of other games, including Blizzard's own games, and put it all into one game rulled up, and omitted as much unfun things players disliked in other mmorpgs (example: the insane downtime in EQ). Dungeons and Dragons online had in game VOIP .. and we see where it is in the list. Siege and PVP was perfected in DAOC .. its not killing WOW .. twitch was done to a degree in Planetside .. what a tank that was .. new worlds, new story , new secrets ..these come up in EVERY new MMO .. WOW still persists. 7.) Even if someone says I will never leave WoW I love WoW... word of mouth is like crack to MMO's while you peddeling through the plains of WoW and people keep expressing how much they love "Insert Name" your going to be a little curious to find out. and you know what they say Curiosity killed the WoW. Incorrect - when it comes to WoW. Forget about what anyone says. It's what players say with their WALLETS and POCKET BOOKS. 8 million wallets/pocket books say you are wrong. I personally ignore people in game going on about other games ..so that doesnt effect me at all. In fact I find it kinda offensive. Love the game your playing or don't play it. WOW will persist because the game is simply really good. Any game developer will tell you it set a high bar for them to match and is the standard which MMOs are gonna be held to for a while to come. Thats just fact. A dev for WAR recently stated that they will have a higher then average monthy cost because the price of development has gone up do to the need to match WOWs performance .. thats saying something. 8.) Cut off arm, Nade the opposition, 50 vs 50 seige, death mayham, destruction all in graphical direct x 10 beauty... oh and Guilds like to stick together. If a guild shifts titles thats possibly 20 plus people no longer playing. Incorrect - when it comes to WoW. Using your own example - 20 plus people is less than nothing in WoW. BTW, did you know Battlenet has over 20+ MILLION players? This means only 40% of Blizzard's total FANS have played WoW so far. Blizzard's fanbase is OLDER than any other mmorpg guild in existance. Whenever Blizzard makes any new game, they are guaranteed to have millions try that game, and stick to that game, because of Battlenet. Its rare entire guilds shift games unless they know each other in real life. And DX10 is more trouble then its worth right now. We will be seeing MMOs developed for it of course (because microsoft is PAYING developers to use it), but that doesnt make it better and WOW isn't gonna suffer for its lack. However I wouldnt say Blizzards fanbase is older then any other. UOs gets that credit since it came out before Warcraft. And despite being a fundamentally 2d game they still have huge subscription numbers. Most people I know who want to play Tabula Rasa are so gungho because Lord British is the producer .. thats a following. Still for the most part green gets the point. 9.) Because you say it will not. Incorrect. You say nay, I say yay. Your #9 moots it's ownself. I refuse to comment further on this one. 10.) Due to the BC appearantly people already started leaving WoW and it's rating lowered from 8.4 - 8.3 for the first time since release to a 8.1 .... if it keeps going down its equivilent to the 7.9 VG which is making upgrades and appearantly gaining soem steam... which will be cut short as most people already have a MMO they are just waiting for. The more people leave WoW the less fun certain players associated with them will have when all their buddies are gone sending them IM's about how fun this other game is. Incorrect. Ratings mean nothing. It's who's voting with their wallets and pocket books. Next, WoW can shrink down to 25 players playing, and it will still NOT LOSE MONEY. No one can argue WOW has been on a downward slide .. but I think thats in part to the fact that the fanboy posts have started to die off and the people with honest opinions are starting to chime in. LOTRO is where WOW was a few monthes ago .. and it will be where WOW is now in a few more for the same reason. The games beating WOW are ones with solid gameplay and depth that WOW doesnt have .. doesn't make WOW bad. Its an excellent game. Well except Guildwars .. I still dont get that game. >.< ----------------------- Now go find some other mmorpg you enjoy , and PLAY IT! Agreed.
It's amazing how easily I showed every single one of your reason's to be incorrect. It was fun.
*Goes back to playing a bit of Diablo 2 muhahahaaaa!*
Now that thats over .. I should point out ..I don't play WOW anymore either. Not because I thought it wasnt fun ..but I had just done and seen it all. That goes back to the expansion question .. they didnt release the one they did fast enough and the future development isnt going any faster. Wow is another EQ, AO, or UO ... it will never die .. its a genre classic .. but its lonely at the top and theres some mean customers climbing up reeeal fast. Wow wont be the top MMO forever ..but it will endure so long as MMORPGs do. In other words ..theres no such thing as a WOW killer.
This just seems to be a daily occurance, "[balnk][blank][WoW][balnk]" thread (use your imagination). The debate just keeps going back and forth and neither side can really prove anything cuz at the end of the day THEY'RE ALL OPINIONS that ppl are trying to force on each other.
If we must have this going on, why not create a WoW sticky, where ppl can debate all they want. It would free up the forums significantly, not to mention all the bandwidth that will be saved.
First off for all of you that truly beleive that WOW has 8 million people paying subscription fees , your way off. blizzard states ' Over 8 million subscibers" that means over 8 million have at 1 time or another started an account, not payed or are keeping on paying. Second , for everyone that seems to think WOW is here to stay and will never be dethroned, there was another game that had players with that same mentality a few years back it "was" called Everquest. Wow will die one day, but not one day soon, it will creep around for quite a few years to come and blizzard will "try" and save its golden ticket from a sad death, but in the end they will fail due to players being bored with the same old game play they have had for over 2 years, it happens to all games and WOW will not be an exception, so all you die hard fans just hang in there but be prepared for a long bumpy ride that your game will take later this year.
Here in australia, its called tall poppy syndrome.
When someone succeeds and continues to rise and rise, all those still below him/her/it will want to cut them back down to size.
Here is a perfect example of those players who've had their favourite MMORPG dwindle in population due to the behemoth of WOW.
WOW will make all future MMORPG strive that much harder to give us what we want... so we in turn give them what the want, our money.
Stop all this tall poppy syndrome, WOW succeeds because its a freakin' good game. I stoped playing after about 8 months but its one of my most memorable MMORPG's to date.
Comments
A bit off topic, but with the above being said I probably would have liked DDO a hell of a lot more if it were Greyhawk or Forgotten Realms instead of Eberon.
WoW was a good game while it lasted, but its not going to make it more than 3-4 years.
I bet World of Starcraft will end up taking its place.
And you would be correct. Even if World of Starcraft was just WoW with Starcraft models. It would probably be the only thing capable of even getting close to WoW numberse. Like someone said earlier. No game due out between now and 2010 is going to even make Blizzard/WoW flinch. WoW might not be as you put it an "unstoppable invincible force" but right now it's the only game that started out as a 500 pound gorilla and grew to about 3000 pounds.
In War - Victory.
In Peace - Vigilance.
In Death - Sacrifice.
On that note... The Daedalus Project did a survey on how many accounts people had. 71% said they had 1, and 22% said they had 2.
http://www.nickyee.com/daedalus/archives/000343.php
On the main subject, not much to say. We'll see in 5 years. It's strange to see that some still seem to think the maximum number of MMOG players in the world has been reached, and any new game will have to take players from the others. Personally I think (and hope) AoC, WAR, Tabla Rasa, etc will all do well, but still not really hit the WoW numbers very much - at least not in Europe and the US.
Personally, I can not bring myself to play another fantasy MMO. This genre has to change from the sword, auto-attack, grind to 50, LFG, crafting crap that it is in currently. Some game is going to change the genre and make a lot of money doing so. Yes WoW will lose subs but will always remain the top MMO if only due to the low system requirements.
I don't know how many people feel the same way as I do but in my mind fantasy is dead. I refuse to endure the leveling grind only to get to max level.
WoW will live for many years to come, just drop it already.
Lol WoW shoulda been dead a long time ago. The game sucks. I don't know about you all, but I'm ready for the next generation.
I will be stunningly impressed if WoW still has 50% of its subscribers still actively playing by 12/31/07. I mean, Paris Hilton becoming a construction worker kind of impressed lol. I by no means use "impressed" lightly at all. That means WoW will not only have to survive a brutal population cut caused by Age of Conan, but other F2P games like 2Moons, SUN, or Cabal Online which are going to appeal to those who can not afford the AoC monthly fee.
Wow is a great game for what it is. It does have an end and the climb to that end was fun for most to get to.
Just about every post I read about bashing WoW always points to the end game...how fun it was leveling up but the end game sucks.
Well...so it was fun until the end.
It was/is an mmo that had a clear end. So take it for what it was. A fun easy solo/multiple player game that brought milllllllions of new players into the market place. This can never be a bad thing.
It will last for years I think simply because of the market it appeals to.
Man, you guys are freakin awesome. You are like better than Nostrodamus...better than Miss Cleo....better than the little floating head Genie on Pee-Wees Playhouse. You can all see into the future...what the hell are all you doin playin MMO's and not playin the lottery??? You guys are nuts! Can you tell me who is going to win the next Super Bowl? I wanna make a bet.
Pfft....
I swear people act like that game stole their wife, beat them up and took their lunch money, and just all around ruined their life. What does it matter how much longer it will live? Do you really think you'll get any benefit at it's downfall? I think some of you really need to go outside, get some sun or hit the beach. It's summer after all, and here you are counting the ways and days until WoW finally dies off.
WoW will never die, just like poverty in africa.
Even though you reference me too I completely back you on the comment... i'm speaking through logic.... I mean theareticly speaking .. if the 19 MMO's being released from October - Febuary get 100,000 subscribers which is miniscule that will be 1.9 million but logically you already know War and AoC may in fact reach 1 mill, GOds & heroes 200k, Tabula Rasa 200K +... thats just 4 games that I have a guestimate about ... either ro may be bigger or worse and theres 15 more ... WoW dead ... yes Starcraft MMO is awsome and I would be there I would play it but thats a distant dream that Blizzard needs to start working on because the Age of WoW is over. I will miss WoW though and appreciate it for what it has done for the MMO market.
Games Enjoyed: UO,EQ,AC,EQ2,COX,LOTRO
Games Played(-Above):WoW,MXO,GW(beta),RFO,ArchLord,V:SOH,Rappelz,Ryzom,DDO
Games I felt were a rip-off: DDO,ArchLord,V:SOH - all newer how ironic
Neither WAR nor AoC will reach 1 million subscribers. Please don't let yourself be pulled in the words of fans. Warhammer fans and Age of Conan fans often speak llike its completely normal for an MMO in this time and age to reach 1 million subscribers. Its not, its an exception, a big expection.Even though you reference me too I completely back you on the comment... i'm speaking through logic.... I mean theareticly speaking .. if the 19 MMO's being released from October - Febuary get 100,000 subscribers which is miniscule that will be 1.9 million but logically you already know War and AoC may in fact reach 1 mill, GOds & heroes 200k, Tabula Rasa 200K +... thats just 4 games that I have a guestimate about ... either ro may be bigger or worse and theres 15 more ... WoW dead ... yes Starcraft MMO is awsome and I would be there I would play it but thats a distant dream that Blizzard needs to start working on because the Age of WoW is over. I will miss WoW though and appreciate it for what it has done for the MMO market.
WoW won't die in the next 10 years. period. Just thinking it will die is absurd. if Ultima Online, which peaked at 250k subscribers can survive for 10 years, so can WoW, easily.
Expect WoW to be around for well over 2 years to come. You know that UO is still up and running? That People are still paying a monthly fee for it?
It's the phenomenon of the first MMORPG you play. UO made MMORPGs big, so to speak, with Meridian 59 paving the way for that. Many people started with UO, and some stayed there.
Nothing else will happen with WoW, remember that WoW finally was a MMORPG for the absolute Mass Market, Millions of Players all over the World started with WoW as their first MMORPG, and they'll always think back of it in fond memories, and many of them will try out other MMORPGs, find that they aren't as fun as WoW for them, and come back to WoW.
Neither WAR nor AoC will reach 1 million subscribers. Please don't let yourself be pulled in the words of fans. Warhammer fans and Age of Conan fans often speak llike its completely normal for an MMO in this time and age to reach 1 million subscribers. Its not, its an exception, a big expection.Even though you reference me too I completely back you on the comment... i'm speaking through logic.... I mean theareticly speaking .. if the 19 MMO's being released from October - Febuary get 100,000 subscribers which is miniscule that will be 1.9 million but logically you already know War and AoC may in fact reach 1 mill, GOds & heroes 200k, Tabula Rasa 200K +... thats just 4 games that I have a guestimate about ... either ro may be bigger or worse and theres 15 more ... WoW dead ... yes Starcraft MMO is awsome and I would be there I would play it but thats a distant dream that Blizzard needs to start working on because the Age of WoW is over. I will miss WoW though and appreciate it for what it has done for the MMO market.
WoW won't die in the next 10 years. period. Just thinking it will die is absurd. if Ultima Online, which peaked at 250k subscribers can survive for 10 years, so can WoW, easily.
and your right ... I dont mean die as in be gone completely as WoW will be on the VH1 version of 2000's in 2100 but if it ever goes down to 1 million it will be considered dead so to speak ... it will be like the NY Yankees losing Clemens, Pettite, Mussina, Rodriguez, & Jeter .... wouldnt be anywhere near what it use to be and even though their money bags would still be fatter than most if not all mmo's monthly. The only reason I believe other MMO's can reach one million is strictly because WoW and a few other services or providers as gotten our AGE of kids and adults to become acustomed to paying monthly fee's for gaming weather it be a PC MMO or a Xbox live Gold account... also ... AOC and a few others will be released on 360 ... that is a completely different playerbase than the MMO market... Pretty much every household has a console game system not all house holds play ONLINE PC games...
Games Enjoyed: UO,EQ,AC,EQ2,COX,LOTRO
Games Played(-Above):WoW,MXO,GW(beta),RFO,ArchLord,V:SOH,Rappelz,Ryzom,DDO
Games I felt were a rip-off: DDO,ArchLord,V:SOH - all newer how ironic
I think you guys are over looking something key here. Just because WAR is going to have 500,000 subscribers (or whatever) doesn't mean World of Warcraft is going to lose 500,000 subscribers. These games share only a small part of the market, most of their foundation comes from a completely different market or even a brand new never before seen market.
I personally am leaving WoW for WAR, but I know that WAR's target audience isn't WoW players, but Warhammer and Games Workshop fans in general. They aren't trying to do WoW but better, they're trying to do Warhammer right the first time.
Sure, WoW is going to lose some subscribers every time a new game comes out, but the number WoW loses isn't directly related to the number gained by the other MMO.
This dude is a WoW fanboy obviously but Warhammer will take tons of pvp fans. Tabula Rasa will take tons of Sci-fi fans and AoC will take tons and tons of adults and kids whos parents dont give a crud. Trust me WoW will get hurt BADDD and trust me one of those 3 may very well surpass WoW so dont say what you dont know! We will wait and see.
I myself am getting sick of fantasy so ill try Tabula but ill prolly still try AoC and WAR!
Yeah the most successful MMO of all time will die some day but only after Blizzard's coffers are overflowing. A pointless thread.
-----------------------
Past MMOs- Planetside, WoW.
Current MMO:
Current Games: L4D, Skyrim
Tried- ATITD, EQ2, SoR, Vanguard,SL,LOTRO,SotNW,SWTOR.
Anticipating- GW2, Planetside2
I only played WoW a short time, but it impressed me as one of the best mmols out there. I'd say the nr 1 reason it will die is:
A sudden shift in the Earths rotation results in a lifeless planet, so people just naturally stop playing. Course the solar powered WoW servers continue to operate well into the next millenium..
you need therapy and you should definetly not play mmo's. please visit myspace.com for further online interaction as the people there will pretend to give a crap. we wont.
wtf is up with all the creepy emo posts lately?
Games i'm playing right now...
"In short, I thought NGE was a very bad idea" - Raph Koster talking about NGE on his blog at raphkoster.com
It's amazing how easily I showed everysingle one of your reason's to be incorrect. It was fun.
*Goes back to playing a bit of Diablo 2 muhahahaaaa!*
It's amazing how easily I showed every single one of your reason's to be incorrect. It was fun.
*Goes back to playing a bit of Diablo 2 muhahahaaaa!*
Now that thats over .. I should point out ..I don't play WOW anymore either. Not because I thought it wasnt fun ..but I had just done and seen it all. That goes back to the expansion question .. they didnt release the one they did fast enough and the future development isnt going any faster. Wow is another EQ, AO, or UO ... it will never die .. its a genre classic .. but its lonely at the top and theres some mean customers climbing up reeeal fast. Wow wont be the top MMO forever ..but it will endure so long as MMORPGs do. In other words ..theres no such thing as a WOW killer.
Which Final Fantasy Character Are You?
Final Fantasy 7
For God's SAKE! this needs to stop.
MMORPG.com should just change its domain to www.comeandjointhewickedawesomeWOWdebateforumwhereitneverends.ca (hello Canada!).
This just seems to be a daily occurance, "[balnk][blank][WoW][balnk]" thread (use your imagination). The debate just keeps going back and forth and neither side can really prove anything cuz at the end of the day THEY'RE ALL OPINIONS that ppl are trying to force on each other.
If we must have this going on, why not create a WoW sticky, where ppl can debate all they want. It would free up the forums significantly, not to mention all the bandwidth that will be saved.
RUN! bandwidth monster
First off for all of you that truly beleive that WOW has 8 million people paying subscription fees , your way off. blizzard states ' Over 8 million subscibers" that means over 8 million have at 1 time or another started an account, not payed or are keeping on paying. Second , for everyone that seems to think WOW is here to stay and will never be dethroned, there was another game that had players with that same mentality a few years back it "was" called Everquest. Wow will die one day, but not one day soon, it will creep around for quite a few years to come and blizzard will "try" and save its golden ticket from a sad death, but in the end they will fail due to players being bored with the same old game play they have had for over 2 years, it happens to all games and WOW will not be an exception, so all you die hard fans just hang in there but be prepared for a long bumpy ride that your game will take later this year.
Here in australia, its called tall poppy syndrome.
When someone succeeds and continues to rise and rise, all those still below him/her/it will want to cut them back down to size.
Here is a perfect example of those players who've had their favourite MMORPG dwindle in population due to the behemoth of WOW.
WOW will make all future MMORPG strive that much harder to give us what we want... so we in turn give them what the want, our money.
Stop all this tall poppy syndrome, WOW succeeds because its a freakin' good game. I stoped playing after about 8 months but its one of my most memorable MMORPG's to date.
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MMORPG's I've Played: World of Warcraft: 10/10 - Rappelz: 7/10 - Ragnarok Online: 8/10 - DnD Online: 2/10 - Runescape: 6/10 - LotR Online: 5/10 - Anarchy Online: 7/10 - CoV: 8/10 - Rohan Online: 8/10 - Guild Wars: 7/10 - Flyff: 8/10 - Warhammer Online: 8/10
My HARDCORE Story