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Reasons why your expectations might be a little high?
onceloving
Member Posts: 106
I saw a few people complaining about how the combat doesn't feel real in the videos they have seen. I think most people have too high of expectations on the physics system of the combat. The fact is that there aren't machines nor servers that can handle the kind of hack slash then interact type of combat you want.
AoC wasn't the first people to think of swinging and then your sword interacting with the environment. For such a thing to happen, every pixel has to be coded basically as an array containing every object that might be interacting with it and then based off complex if then statements, they have to respond in real time. I attempted coding this in 2d, and everytime you add the smallest space, you almost increase the demand on your hardware exponentially. I believe somewhere in their description of combat, AoC stated that there wouldn't be sword shield interaction because it would be too demanding.
You can take Oblivion for an example. It has some interaction between your actions and the environment but they are buggy and very limited. Most computers that are up to today's standards can run the graphics at 50% but very very few machines can run it at full graphics and that limited interaction. That is just a single player game as well. It is much easier to have a single player game with the combat like that then a multiplayer game. Why? The answer is that if you don't want hacking then you do most things server side. If it kills your machine to run the game and interact in a very small environment, how do you have a computer processing all the interactions for 1000 people, much less 10 (as well as running server side operations such as AI, logins, consistency checks, etc).
The point of all of this is to tell you that you shouldn't expect a Next Generation game from AoC. It will be a step in the right direction for sure, but it will be a far cry from what we will one day enjoy playing. You will have a little more skill then hack and slash (fps melee and probably a little less then that) and more nudity and blood then you are used to be without a whole lot more.
Comments
I think people have high expectations of this game because Funcom has led them into having high expectations of the game. Funcom has promised a great deal with this title and they spend a lot of time trying to hype it up. They have released a lot of general information but have with-held a lot of the concrete and specific stuff for a later date- likely for the purposes of hyping it up even more.
Its just their marketing strategy. But I think such a marketing strategy has its problems, and people looking for proof to back up claims, or having higher expectations, are some of those problems. Every business decision has repercussions, and this is one of them.
Now I think if Funcom had gone a different route, and not put so much focus on hype at the expense of content, I don't think they would have the problem they have now. But I'm also not a management suit looking to earn bags of money.
Age of Conan will be a big step in the right direction, and i have high hopes for the game.
I do feel sad that they don't have shield - block interaction, but who knows, that might be implemented later?
There must be a reason why it has won so many awards on E3 though, don't you think so ? :-)
We can all dream that AoC will be this, that and the other, but the bottom line is no one will know until the game is released, like with any game.
From reading other posts about AoC, i see people would prefer the games release date to be pushed back... people fear another Vanguard... something along them lines anyway, you get me
I'm looking forward to how it will all turn out anyway. WoW, WAR and AoC will all be fighting for that number 1 spot.
I say keep your high expectations, i doubt this game will let anyone down.
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WAR is coming, are you prepared?
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Actually, all I can think of when I see AoC is Funcom's last big hyped-up MMO.
Anarchy Online. Yeah. Remember that game? Better yet, remember the utter disaster that was the opening? I don't want to see that again. Mind you I'm sure Funcom learned a lot from that, and I know there's a lot of new blood there. But that, plus the lack of testing, plus the underwhelming combat vids (vague swings at a target in a game where specifically targeting body parts is a feature? Worriesome.) lead me to be concerned.
Of course they hype their own game, seriously thats the best you have? Every single MMO that comes out that has succeeded has hyped their game. Most others that hadn't, the common complaint from users is the population is lacking DUE to the game not hyping(advertising itself) enough.
Its not THEIR marketing strategy, its every product on the planet. "Chop off them heads" sounds better than "We're riddled with bugs and loving every minute of it!".
Your conclusion is that they invested so much in hype that the content paid the expense....How on earth could you ever know this, even if it were true? You think Mr Joe Photoshop at Funcom, the man in charge of creating ads for the game is taking away from the company? "Alright, today everyone stop working on the game, for the next few weeks we will be making posters and videos"
Whats next, the advertisers for Red Bull are taking away from the taste, because they are saying "Red Bull gives you wings" ?
People have high expectations for almost every new MMO thats even the slightest bit different. Period. A lot of people are bored, and would like something fun to play.
I think in the end, your last sentence sums everything up quite well.
Of course they hype their own game, seriously thats the best you have? Every single MMO that comes out that has succeeded has hyped their game. Most others that hadn't, the common complaint from users is the population is lacking DUE to the game not hyping(advertising itself) enough.
Its not THEIR marketing strategy, its every product on the planet. "Chop off them heads" sounds better than "We're riddled with bugs and loving every minute of it!".
Your conclusion is that they invested so much in hype that the content paid the expense....How on earth could you ever know this, even if it were true? You think Mr Joe Photoshop at Funcom, the man in charge of creating ads for the game is taking away from the company? "Alright, today everyone stop working on the game, for the next few weeks we will be making posters and videos"
Whats next, the advertisers for Red Bull are taking away from the taste, because they are saying "Red Bull gives you wings" ?
People have high expectations for almost every new MMO thats even the slightest bit different. Period. A lot of people are bored, and would like something fun to play.
I think in the end, your last sentence sums everything up quite well.
Yikes! Way to take what I said and blow it all out of proportion.
I say that I think funcom's spent overly too much time hyping and all of a sudden I'm against all forms of advertising!
Hype is a very dangerous fire to be playing with. It relies more on manipulating a customers imagination than it does on representing reality. Funcom says "We have real time, super realistic combat with decapitations and aiming on body parts" and maybe you immediately picture such fight scenes from a movie like 300. You start to think that the game is like playing the movie. Your imagination runs wild and you envision all sorts of things happening. But thats the hype taking over. In reality it is not really like that... but they have made you FEEL like it could be. And all of a sudden your basing your decisions, and your attitude towards other people, based on that feeling.
Now how far can you really trust hype? How far can you trust hype without direct proof of how it plays out? How far can you trust it when the people who are giving it to you have the first priority of taking your money? Would you trust McDonalds to tell the complete truth about the quality of their meat? How much would you trust WalMart? What about a company that has deceived you personally in the past and is being given a second chance?
There is such a thing as too much hype. And I think it is trouble to unconditionally trust anything that is so dependent on hype. Maybe we just have different definitions of hype. You equate it to advertising in general. I equate it to advertising without evidence. One is more dependent on showing things as they are, the other is more dependent on showing things as we envision them to be.
You are right though, the last sentence does sum everything up quite well. Funcom is in the business of making money. My stance is that you can never 100% trust any group of people that seek to take something from you. I'm not saying you should never trust any company ever again. I'm just saying you need to be careful. You CAN trust what they actually show you, so you can see with your own eyes. It is this problem that I think is most responsible for the criticism's against AoC.
There is a reason why most legal systems stress that the jury must be impartial to the case. Because if they have a stock in the decision, they are inclined to base their decision on personal feelings and motivations, and not the facts. I am not an employee of funcom nor am i an employee of its competition. I have no stock in whether they succeed or fail. So I will look at things as I see them, and not cloud my thoughts with coke bottle glasses of $$$.
So in summary... too much hype is dangerous.. for the consumer. It causes high expectations, and can be very misleading. It is too easy for a company to abuse hype to inflate sales. But the customer can protect his interests by being smart enough to distinguish between the hype and the reality, and being wary of hype overuse.
This and many more helpful tips available in my all new publication - "How To Be a Responsible Consumer". Only $19.99 at most retailers.
Because it looks very good. Real-time comabt looks way better than the cartoony scene. Siege combat, battlekeeps,drunken brawling. I am a member on the official forums and so many people who are currently playing WOW,Guild Wars, SWG,EQ are coming to play this game. Funcom also has hyped this game up alot and people like how it looks. Plus the fact that AOC looks nothing like the other games, it has its own lore dating back to the 1930's from Robert E Howard's books which this game is based on. Just a few reasons why people have high expectations of this game
This game is DIFFERENT!
Not same elves, dwarves, orcs high fantasy scene...but dark, gloomy and truly barbaric.
the world looks great, the list of features is so huge that no matter would they introduce 10% of them, it would still make AoC most immersive mmo ever.
Do I think this will be the second coming? ..no, but I do think this will be darn good game!
I saw a few people complaining about how the combat doesn't feel real in the videos they have seen. I think most people have too high of expectations on the physics system of the combat. The fact is Is that a fact? Says who? that there aren't machines nor servers that can handle the kind of hack slash then interact type of combat you want. You don't now what type of combat i want.
AoC wasn't the first people to think of swinging and then your sword interacting with the environment. For such a thing to happen, every pixel has to be coded basically as an array containing every object that might be interacting with it and then based off complex if then statements, they have to respond in real time. I attempted coding this in 2d, and everytime you add the smallest space, you almost increase the demand on your hardware exponentially. I believe somewhere in their description of combat, AoC stated that there wouldn't be sword shield interaction because it would be too demanding.
Do you know what an array is? You did 'some' attempts to code in 2d? Pixels need to be coded?
AofC is 3d...you know, polygons and such...it doesn't use PIXELS to detect collision.
Also, the objects used for collision are always much lower in the poygon department then the visible models.
But ofcourse, you already knew that....le't's call Funcom and spread your wisdom before they make a big mistake.
You can take Oblivion for an example. It has some interaction between your actions and the environment but they are buggy and very limited. The fact Oblivion is buggy doesn't mean it's a hardware problem. Most computers that are up to today's standards can run the graphics at 50% (today's standards in WHAT country?) but very very few machines can run it at full graphics and that limited interaction. That is just a single player game as well. It is much easier to have a single player game with the combat like that then a multiplayer game. Why? Well? The answer is that if you don't want hacking then you do most things server side. If it kills your machine to run the game and interact in a very small environment, (who's machine? the client or the server? Such things do NOT kill a server) how do you have a computer processing all the interactions for 1000 people, much less 10 (as well as running server side operations such as AI, logins, consistency checks, etc). That's why it's server side, servers are a 'bit' more powerful the your pc at home.
The point of all of this is to tell you that you shouldn't expect a Next Generation game from AoC. Define next-gen It will be a step in the right direction for sure, but it will be a far cry from what we will one day enjoy playing. We? Unless you're one of the creators or are actually an extensive beta-tester you're wisdom means...ehm...crap? You will have a little more skill then hack and slash (fps melee and probably a little less then that) and more nudity and blood then you are used to be without a whole lot more.
Overall i agree with the idea that hyped games often do not deliver the goods but you sir know %$"#% about the game and your view as a programmer is hilarious. Go play ´Hello Kitty´s adventerous Island´
im not expecting the combat the be the best thing since sliced bread but looking forward to it alot more then another hotkey 1-10 combat game...also i think funcom is trying to make the lore and story important part and willing to sacrifice sales such as the levels 1-20 which some people are complaining that they want to jump into the game but that can also be bad if not done right
I didn't mean for you to take my general statements literally about what I said (killing a server x.x). This post was in response to another thread that I didn't feel like posting on because it had become a flame war. This was just a general address to the hype some people might have about what type of combat system it would have, not to the actual game. It doesn't matter if there are pixels or polygons, you still have to code every single interaction which means everything is a micro grid if you want it to be realistic and that takes a rediculous amount of processing power.
Like I said, this game will probably be a lot of fun and a step in the right direction.
That is a pathetic way to do collision detection. You dont put every pixel in an array. That would just be asanine.
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You sir are retarded.
some day we wont play 2d side scrolling games
..... some day an Iphone wont be $599 
...... No freaking shi*. i think this will be the freshest game in a long time .. but thats just me .. and only time will tell.