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M. PIRE secedes from BoB
tvalentine
Member, Newbie CommonPosts: 4,216
in EVE Online
not sure if secede is the right word, but tbh i didnt see it comein. Wonder if this will effect the war in any major way. Would post a link but my net is messed up right now.
Playing: EVE Online
Favorite MMOs: WoW, SWG Pre-cu, Lineage 2, UO, EQ, EVE online
Looking forward to: Archeage, Kingdom Under Fire 2
KUF2's Official Website - http://www.kufii.com/ENG/ -
Comments
It will likely only have a major effect if others follow suit. I doubt one corp leaving would have -too- big of an impact, but it could possibly start a chain.
If you read the boards there have aparently been some uproar between BoB's pet, it is claimed that they don't pay rent for being in bob space... however others on the other hand have said the opposite.. who is right ? I don't know but it can be one of the reasons for it.
Lets say they do pay rent, in that case they need protection and BoB does not come to the rescue then what are you paying for ?
But if you look at the whole war, you see multiple fronts, BoB and MC are the strong ones while their weaker pets try to hold the flanks....
Flanks are bound to fail at some points if the pressure is too great or BoB have to weaken their own fleet by spreading it out too much.
I have a good friend in a leadership role in a BoB pet. The rent they pay is ridiculous and BoB never shows up to help them. I have refused many times to join him because being a slave is not my idea of having fun. He spends literally two days a week just paying the rent. It is a wonder they don't all rebel.
Yeah BoB pets pay rent. I used to be in a BoB pet alliance 2 years ago (ISS) and we had to pay a ridiculious amount and BoB even let their merc corps use us as target practice then when we defended ourselves from the mercs BoB kicked us out.
just read on the forums R.I.S.E. is thinking about leaving, after hearin the stories of BoB charging 6bil to rent to their ALLIES i really dont have much respect for them. And sir molle seems like an ass.
/discuss
Playing: EVE Online
Favorite MMOs: WoW, SWG Pre-cu, Lineage 2, UO, EQ, EVE online
Looking forward to: Archeage, Kingdom Under Fire 2
KUF2's Official Website - http://www.kufii.com/ENG/ -
If so then im not suprised the Pets are revolting.
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Retired from: Neocron, Everquest, Everquest 2, Guild Wars, RF Online and Final Fantasy VII
Currently Playing : EvE Online.
If so then im not suprised the Pets are revolting.
I don't know if it is week but yeah it is alot, and atleast if it is for a week then atleast you can and should expect some kind of protection by BoB ? not against BoB :-P
Its per month to have exclusive claim to a Region. which at that point why is the alliance asking to claim an entire Region if they can not exploit it enough to pay that rent. BoB has never said in any rent contracts I have seen that you don't have to defend your territory and that as soon as you cry they'll come a running right away. I think its more alliances are over extending themselves when it comes to renting space.
Yeah did read it was per month and for each corp if I do remember it right now...
however ... I belive you should expect some kind of help or protection from your landlords, in the same way that your landlords expect you to fight for them.
When I played the game, my corp (I was the CEO) we always sticked up for our friends... we where strictly anti-pirates and if weaker corp asked for our help we would help, also the same went for our friends... we would do so even if the enemy was stronger than us but we would atleast try or die trying.
We where not afraid wasting a few battleships here and there :-P
Its for the alliance, I've looked into it for my alliance. The way BoB handles it is very much a vassal system, Their the king your the Baron. Its your responsability to defend your area and if you need help they will divert what resources they can to assist you. They will do that problem is some people seems to think that means We say were getting attacked and we have the entire BoB fleet here instantly. And if Bob even attampted to do that they would have fallen very quickly.
it's part of a clever ploy by seleene.
could we please get correspondent writers and moderators, on the eve forum at mmorpg.com, who are well-versed on eve-online and aren't just passersby pushing buttons? pretty please?
M.Pire got treated better by their enemies in the north than by their allies in the south.
I think that says it all..
Stk is the reason why they left.. and i for one am glad stk aka sha karn are one of the biggest front running. corps i know..
A lot of whats being said in this post is conjecture. Some of it is right and some of it is very wrong.
I don't think anyone tells you and your corp "You must go to Delve and be our pet", "you are now going to go to Querious and pay us 6 billion a week", etc.
Bob makes a proposal. People negotiate that proposal. Often the corp votes on that.
All these statements about Slaves etc. is both inaccurate and lacking in precision, and thus way off the mark.
Also the amounts stated here are wrong, and the time periods are also wrong.
Lastly, when a corp agrees to rent terms, and everyone pays part of that rent, it ends up being a pretty small amount. Whether the corps chose to pay weekly or monthly, and charge their corp weekly or monthly, is up to them.
I've never heard of anyone having to work two days a week to pay their rent. You might want to suggest to him that there's better ways to make money than mining veldspar HAHA. Yes, my group pays rent. It takes me all of a couple of hours each MONTH to make the isk needed to pay my share.
Lastly, M.Pire came out to our area, and were completely wiped out. So sad.
1) Bob renters pay X bil/month for an area of space. Could be an entire region, or could be any number of constellations within a region. Before they were taken out you could even just rent rights to use a complex in BoB space.
2) Bob renters are charged for their entire alliance, not on a per-corp basis.
3) The rental agreement varies from renter to renter. No two are identical and not all BoB allies are 'renters/pets'.
More than that I can't get into as I'm not privy to the details of any renter agreements, not even the one we were in for Feythabolis. Suffice to say that BoB is known to waive rent for renters who are actively defending space during times of heated combat. Generally speaking if an alliance is under heavy attack BoB waives the rent to allow that money to go into reinforcing the defense of the area.
Also: Some bob allies do *not* pay rent. As such it's unfair to call those allies 'pets' as they are not beholden in any way to BoB.
Hope this helps clear things up.
Also: Just to squelch the rumor that RISE is going to flip: RISE is moving to a new area of operations. We're not abandoning our friends and allies.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
Either way, people in eve are just tired of having bob force everybody into massive pvp engagements that take hours every day for weeks on end, that the server can't handle and which get hideously boring, when you're sitting there with the server node slowly dying over the course of 2 hours, desyncing everyone.
I think the battles going beyond the server's capability are the main reason people in eve united to finally eliminate bob.
Even though ALL the CCP devs that are playing eve have been clumped together in bob for some reason, Bob was fine, until they declared they wanted to take over all of 0.0...
There's just something fundamentally wrong in an MMORPG when the developers guild (alliance) announces in a New York Times interview, they want to take over all space from their paying customers...
In addition, BoB has won a lot of battles with cheesy tricks, borderline exploits, T2 ammo bpo's that didn't belong in the game, and a lot of meta gaming.
Overall, their meta-gaming made the game a lot less fun for most people, and diminished any idea of honorable combat.
Some schmuck in BoB even said publicly "the players should be happy the devs are with us, cause we tell them what to fix in the game"
Sure, they'll tell them what BoB wants fixed, which is unlikely to match what other players want fixed in EVE.
Basically admitting to the problems, CCP has announced a new plan of having 10 (12?) Ombudsman from the player base come to Iceland once a year to check if everything is right.
Of course, this expensive measure does nothing, really... It won't even out the advantage the only alliance with direct access to the developers has. They know first what new toys come out, and how to use them to best effect, and lots of less tangible and obvious advantages: Any bug and glitch, they can directly ask for the workaround.
This quick firsthand knowledge also leads to the effect that BoB members know how to create artificial lag in a system, which they make copious use of if creating lag is to their advantage.
A lot of people have just over these issues, and I know of no other game, where this kind of thing has happened.
Hence, the current result of a LOT of people on the whole server having finally gotten together with the idea to destroy the crooked alliance of the selfish devs.
Most of us just want to go back to smaller fleet engagements with just a few dozen ships, that the servers can handle and that therefore is fun. If that's possible is another question...
The best thing for eve would be if the devs could find it in their hearts to spread out and play in different alliances, be there with and for all the players, not give a single alliance a permanent unjust advantage for years on end.
A big thanks to all the alliances that could bury their differences to band together to excise the miniature Hitlers from this game. Its just too bad the battles can't be a little more epic due to the never ending server problems during large fleet engagements.
From here, it looks like a mistake to have thrown everything on a single server that just keeps bogging down. Any theoretical advantages of the "one-world, singler-server" concept seem to pale, when the action just freezes up for hours at a time.
So BoB are the reason we have massive fleet battles the servers can't handle? BoB, not game mechanics of soverenity (sp), POS warfare and staff like that. BoB also create artificial lag. I guess, they themselves don't suffer from that lag. And how they do it? May be by bringing tons of usless T1 frigates into the fight? Or was it Goons who did that? BoB also got all their BPOs from devs? Yes and Sir Molle actually has the one and only "I win" button, which he received from the leading dev, who of course is also a member of BoB. Wow, I demand my own tin foil hat now11!!!!!!!!!1111 Actually yes, BoB are the cause of all problems in Eve. They even downed the servers today because they need some extra time to finish their "Plan of world domination Mk II".
hehe very funny...
one of the lag producing methods they've used it to have everybody in system keep creating contracts continuously..
and while they themselves get hit by the lag as well, its to their advantage if they are being attacked by overwhelming numbers.
and your stupid "I win button" comments don't have anything to do with the points I made, which is really just a collection of the things that have transpired over time, can be found in Sir Molle's New York Times interview, in forum discussions and are generally acknowledged to the point that CCP has come out with the Ombudsman strategy to make sure things are kept a little straighter in the future.
And I don't see you disputing the major advantage gained by having all the devs in your alliance.
Which is, tbh, not true. SOME Devs are / were in Bob. Not all. The rest ist spread over the Galaxy. From what i heard in irc one is in a Missionrunning-Corp, one is mainly into exploration and so on..
I thought there's some in goons as well. So either both sides are getting help, or perhaps, just maybe, the devs are just playing the game like the rest of us.
2-nd there's nothing wrong with Sir Molle's interview. Yes, he said BoB wants to eventually control all of 0.0. Future will tell how realistic is this goal, and it's certainly not against the rules of the game. Try to stop him instead of complaining on the forums.
Now to the famous dev scandal. What we know for sure so far is that there was 1 dev who abused his position. He got overexcited with his position in BoB and to help himself to move up the alliance ladder he spawned some 2-nd rate T2 BPOs and "donated" them to BoB. Are you sure BoB leaders knew that those BPOs were illegal? Are you sure that BoB got that far because of that dev and his T2 BPOs? What that dev did was stupid, irresponsible and childish, but it had no significant impact on the world of Eve. I'm sure this thing won't happen again, because CCP are monitoring the situation more closely than before.
Your claim that all devs are in BoB doesn't deserve a reply tbh...
Hate to break this to you. BOB isn't doing that. Stupid SOV game mechanics are. Also, blob warfare didn't start with bob and it won't end with BoB. In fact the 'coalition' is more guilty of blobs than bob are and typically have gangs 2-3 times the size of the gangs that bob fields. Primarily because Goonswarm's tried and true tactic is: Swarm them with numbers. While bob's tactic is: Bring better ships with better skills so as to not need as many pilots online at any given time.
You, quite obviously, don't have a clue about EVE politics. BoB is a target because they are perceived, correctly, as one of the biggest 'threats' to everyone else in the game. However, Goons are worse in many folk's opinions and thus we have a 2 sided war which has polarized the EVE alliances to one side or the other.
This is patently untrue. I know for a fact that the devs are not all in bob. As a matter of fact there are more devs in the 'coalition' than there are in BoB. In fact... the corporation with the MOST "devs" in it is likely the White Wolf Enterprises corporation which was recently made 'public' to the White Wolf community at large.
Again, BoB is not the developers' guild. Yes, there are some devs/gms in BOB just as there are some Devs/GM's in every major (and most minor) alliances in the game.
Yes, lets drag the 1 actual incident where BoB benefited from cheating back out because it always gets so much attention. Please... quit living in the past. It happened once, the BPO's no longer exist, and the dev who did it has since been dealt with.
BoB didn't start the meta gaming. Goons didn't even start it. Metagaming is, unfortunately, part of EVE and something no alliance can survive without doing to some extent or another. Be it getting spies into enemy alliances or using logon traps or paying members of enemy factions for pos passwords. Also, 99% of the game community has never been impacted by anything BoB has done.
A) I have never seen this anywhere
They did that so that players could see that CCP is being honest with their steps to prevent issues. The Ombudsmen aren't there to prevent issues. The new measures and teams CCP has put in place are what will prevent it. And has.
Hate to break this to you but this is patently untrue. I have flown in BoB fleets and been on BoB TS. Nothing of the sort ever occurs. However, on the other hand, if you could explain why, often, when you pop Goonswarm ships their wrecks are so often full to the brim with hundreds of bookmarks? Hmm? Nice try though. BoB is not any better, nor any worse, than any other 0.0 alliance in the game. Yeah, they're a lot more arrogant than some, but they aren't exploiters or hackers or cheaters.
When I was fighting AGAINST BoB I never had a situation where BoB hacked into our TS and deleted every channel then tried to get people to click on a link to a site which installs spyware. When fighting against GOONS, however, we had exactly that happen, not once but twice, and goons gladly bragged about it as well.
Check your facts before pointing fingers and screaming "exploits" about everything.
Most of us fighting on the BoB side of the war want the same thing. You really need to lose the tinfoil hat about the devs though. It's unfounded.
As has been pointed out many times: They already are spread out. Just because T20 was in BoB doesn't mean every dev in the game was/is in BoB.
Having multiple servers wouldn't really help the issue with fleet lag, however. Even if you split EVE into 4 servers with 50,000 players on each you'd STILL have lag because you'd still have huge blob fleet engagements because that is just human mentality:
"Boss... they have 20 ships"
"Quick, get our allies so we can field more"
"err.... Admiral? Their boss is fielding 30 ships"
"Quick, get our allies so we can field more!"
etc...etc... and so on.
Blob warfare started long before EVE had over 50,000 players. It's not going away and splitting servers will not solve the problem.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell
1) Contracts do not generate lag unless you are trying to open and view contracts. They don't even impact 'market' DB lag. You are thinking of the GoonSwarm tactic of making multiple copies of bookmarks and storing them in their cargobays so that when they jump into systems they generate horrible lag. Thankfully that practice seems to have died off. Their new tactic seems to be to make as many 14 day trial noob accounts as possible and jump in huge numbers of newbships and/or shuttles along with their fleet to generate as much lag as they possibly can. This can be easily verified by looking at the killboards after any major encounter with them.
2) No bob Fleet I have ever flown with has ever done this.
Actually, as I pointed out and as you can easily find out by just reading the dev blogs instead of believing everything you read on forums, the Ombudsmen are just observers that can see for themselves that CCP has in fact instituted new procedures, controlls and teams to monitor their employees to prevent a repeat of anything even remotely like the T20 scandal.
"A ship-of-war is the best ambassador." - Oliver Cromwell