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ATSTs - should they have been made repairable? Imperials only debate
hubertgrove
Member Posts: 1,141
Pre-CU, one of the most ungodly grinds involved getting Imperial FP to get an ATST. By the time I got one, it was powerful but not that powerful, and any moderately equipped Rebel PC could knock it out without too much trouble.
But, because it was a 'one strike and you're out' item, noone ever used them. Mine, certainly just sat in my datapad and was never called up. It was for looking at and not touching.
Do you think Sony should have implemented a repair-delay system - ie. if you hgave your ATST out in battle and it gets killed, then it takes 24 hours to 'repair' (ie. you can't use it again for 24 hours and there is an additional cash and materials cost to get it back in operation).
I would like to hear your views though not, of course, if you are rebel scum of the kind I used to kill with such sweet sorrow on my regular patrols of the Anchorhead-Bestine Gap.
Comments
The grind to get one was harsh, for a regular player, so I think It would have been warranted to have it autorepair after x hours. All water under the bridge, though. Maybe the EMU people can do something with the idea.
As to usefulness... well, I used mine to help boost group size for missions. My jedi-in-training guildmates were QUITE grateful, I assure you. I just sat in our cantina, overt and with the ATST out, drawing strange looks from the occasional visitor. Well, we WERE a REBEL guild, after all.
Sita Baresi
Imperial Captain / spy for the rebellion
In the early days you could have up to three out at a time. Now, that was a site to behold. Unbalanced? Sure, but it did make you swell up with imperial pride when you saw it.
I do wish they were repairable. Especially since they can no longer be obtained. When I go back to visit every six months, I love to just go out into the middle of nowhere to pull out my atst. No one will ever see it again unless it's in a screenshot.
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
Tried: WoW, Shadowbane, Anarchy Online, Everquest, WWII Online, Planetside
Beta: Lotro, Tabula Rasa, WAR.
AT-ST's should never have been made as Pets, but rather as Combat Vehicles.
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
The grind to get one was harsh, for a regular player, so I think It would have been warranted to have it autorepair after x hours. All water under the bridge, though. Maybe the EMU people can do something with the idea.
As to usefulness... well, I used mine to help boost group size for missions. My jedi-in-training guildmates were QUITE grateful, I assure you. I just sat in our cantina, overt and with the ATST out, drawing strange looks from the occasional visitor. Well, we WERE a REBEL guild, after all.
Sita Baresi
Imperial Captain / spy for the rebellion
You see, many people would say that was an exploit, but not me. I would have cited that as a perfect example of clever players coming together for a mutual benefit to take advantage of a game kink. That's what was so marvelous about SWG.
It wasn't that much of a grind if you were shrewd about when and where you purchased it
Can't counter an argument with a valid discussion point? Fishermage(aka Fisherprice) recommends you cut and paste: ad hominem
"You will come to the conclusion that the only people crazier than the managers who thought this a good idea are those who put up with it and pay for it." - Salvaje (who paid to play the NGE for 18 months) /golfclap
That aside, the fact was, they were factional pets, not vehicles. Mainly because combat capable vehicles opened up an entirely new can of worms for the devs. They had enough on their plate ignoring longstanding bugs from beta.
They were in the game before vehicles came out.
So, the rules for any other factional pet (as opposed to critter pets, or droid pets) applied to them.
They were subject to constant nerfing and rule changes as players found the seams in the dev's work on them. For example, three of them out at once. For example using them against non-factional mobs (think krayt dragons). For example, being able to call them only while overt, then revert to covert and they're still out.
I remember an Imp helping me and some guildies on Endor with an ATST against various mobs, mostly the evil Ewok types during hte "Ring of Death" days.
ATSTs should have been no more or no less repairable than any other faction pet. If you could toss an health heal canister at them, and that cannister healed your stormie, it should have healed your ATST.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
Master smugglers had ways of getting their hands on all sorts of factional goodies, and yes, you needed to be smart about where you bought your swag!
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
There was discussion of having combat vehicles, such as rebel hover tanks. But as we have seen never did materialize. So in that regards, AT-ST should not have been allowed in as pets. The AT-ST's themselves were a "can of worms." Considering that rebels would have to invent tactics or exploits against, such as the "/conv exploit", since missile launchers or other heavy weapons had little effect.
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
There was discussion of having combat vehicles, such as rebel hover tanks. But as we have seen never did materialize. So in that regards, AT-ST should not have been allowed in as pets. The AT-ST's themselves were a "can of worms." Considering that rebels would have to invent tactics or exploits against, such as the "/conv exploit", since missile launchers or other heavy weapons had little effect.
Eventually the devs figured out that because the ATST (as originally presented) had no counter on the reb side, and since nerfing it into uselessness was, to coin a phrase, unstarwarsy, you're quite correct. ATSTs were basically a can of worms unto themselves, and obviously the concept of a rebel counter was discussed but the entire issue of combat vehicles wound up not being something they wanted to pursue, probably because it was in the "too hard" box.
So the solution was to just make factional pets go away entirely and avoid the entire issue.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
That might not be very 'Starwarsy' but it sounds incredibly 'SOEsy' - promise much, deliver little - and that little, unnecessary, broken and wrong.
The way they implemented them was bizarre.
Akevv Ostone
No Longer SWG Free
I think they should have been driven by players. Having them walk around on their own like a pet was out of place. You should have called them, climbed in and have a crosshair like the current commando. If the thing got disabled, then a repair kit or a garage should have gotten them back in working order.The way they implemented them was bizarre.
Well, the implementation (especially after you could drive one around in JK II, inflating player expectations) was definitely lacking.
The catch was, drivable combat vehicles were probably the proverbial Bridge Too Far for the SWG dev team. Just too hard.
I'll go so far as to say that no matter how "starwarsy" an ATST is, the implementation was so lacking that we'd have been better off not having them at all.
A friend of mine was on TC the day they tested the player attackable AT AT, and a TKM took it down without working up a sweat.
Obviously, that was not ready for primetime, either.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
There was discussion of having combat vehicles, such as rebel hover tanks. But as we have seen never did materialize. So in that regards, AT-ST should not have been allowed in as pets. The AT-ST's themselves were a "can of worms." Considering that rebels would have to invent tactics or exploits against, such as the "/conv exploit", since missile launchers or other heavy weapons had little effect.
I think they did help ease the rebel/imperial balance in the older days. I mean when grinding faction was a pain. I only say this because the rebels outnumbered imperials by quite a margin on most servers at that time.
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
Tried: WoW, Shadowbane, Anarchy Online, Everquest, WWII Online, Planetside
Beta: Lotro, Tabula Rasa, WAR.
yes it was wrong to have a all powerfull pet....but.... Whats worse is that pet made into a unrepairable useless waste of datapad. Instead of leaving it alone an making it pve only it was nerfed to uselessness. I recall faction back then took long to get. As a reward you could purchase one of the few things that actually followed cannon. this like many other changes lead too a future of gameplay changes that lead up to the current crap fest...I can only imagine the crying if a ATAT made the light of day..OMG the Empire has big stuff that the rebels didnt!! Lol...