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There is a big global conspiracy against real mmo rpg games
Rekindle
Member UncommonPosts: 1,206
the only three reasons i can think of that each game gets released in modern craptastic fashion are:
1. newb developers that were in diapers when real role playing games were around and so, they have nothing to base it on. If I were playin pnp D&D with these games my character would have to carry a ledger just to keep track of the 5000 people needing bat fur and snake skin.
2. A lack of desire in the industry to invent truly believable worlds that have some challenge to them in both figuring out clues and fighting. The basicalyl dont give a rats ass about creative content and are trying to box up WoW without saying it.
3. A world wide conspiracy against the real rpg gamer who wants a game where hes on A quest (not 500). you dont need static or mindless mobs at every corner but George Bush probaby said we needed that (go back to point #1).
Seriously though, IF I had a gazaillion dollars today I could make a MMO that rpg'rs would like - i know theres a bunch of people on this forum that could too - only becaus we know what a good rpg should be.
The question is - is it the newb developers or a world wide conspiracy that is preventing anyone from crackign the nut that was first cracked in the 70s?
I honestly and truly am astounded at to why companaies
just
dont
get
it
or
just dont care.
ty
.....ps WTS tin foil hats by the Freeport Bank.
Comments
They say there are those that complain and those that criticize just long enough to fix things.
Which one ya gonna be. I hope to see your perfect game out in a few years. No offense but being in a code business it bugs me to see someone lash out at devs as if they were incompetent, if you can do it better... we are all waiting. Lots of times devs get told what to do by others, even what errors are worth fixing so put your blame on the right folks, those playing wow lol Calm down wow fundies, ooo is that an epic over there? <skitters away>
Well there is no conspiracy. Its all about the money.
The kind of game that you would like to see developed, (myself included) would not sell.
I am 62 years old and one thing I have noticed is that when anything gets popular the quaility goes down. It is just a fact of life.
When TV first started, yes I was around then, there were very few stations and they would show programs from all the networks, and they usually picked the better ones. Also a 17 inch black and white TV sold for around $400 to $700 dollars, and believe me that was a lot of money then. With so few viewers the TV stations had to put out good programs. However once the prices of TV came down and more people could afford them the program quality went down the tube.
( pun intended).
So instead of news programs like Edward R. Murrow's "See it now" or drama like "Playhouse 90" which a lot of times would not show commercials so as not to interrupt your viewing, we have crap like Jerry Springer and "Desparate Housewives"
Any way I think you get my point. Game companies are now run by MBA's whose only concern is to get the most money they can and that means appeal to the great unwashed masses.
Publishers want their cash now, not in 5 years.
Likewise, making a truly massive MMO will require some complicated technology that, as of yet, only Eve Online has been able to pull off, and they still have their hiccups.
I also predict one thing hampering MMOs, and games as a whole, is that developers have to continually reinvent the wheel. How many times does a bunny rabbit need to be modelled and animated, then given 3 different skins to represent the level 10, level 20, and level 30 versions?
Every word is spot on. (Except it is Hillary not George behind it -- trust me, I have inside info).
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
The RPG part of MMORPG pretty much comes down to the fact that you're roleplaying in the sense that your character is not you (unless you can really throw fireballs, beat a dragon and kill a dozen people in less than five minutes, in which case tell me how). I think everyone would love to see a game with a dynamic questing system where you never had to do the same thing twice but let's face it that's just way beyond the capabilities of any programmer.
I suppose you could have randomly generated dungeons but would that really foster roleplaying? Probably not. You still get games where you can roleplay (LOTRO, SWG, EVE and UO spring to mind) but the market for proper roleplaying in an online game is relatively small compared to PnP gaming where it's still a very niche market. If you really want to do roleplaying online you're just going to have to find some of the sites that run ongoing campaigns. MMOs are not aimed at roleplayers anymore than FPS games are aimed at soldiers. Heck even in single player RPGs the actual roleplaying part is pretty sub par because you're still limited in your choices.
______________________________
WAR is coming. Look busy.
Eventually, someone...some where...will make a really great, skill based, sandbox style MMO. Until then, well, we'll just have to deal with all of these polished, but generic, linear "MMO's"...
Well, if you think that a good idea is enough to make a game revolution, this is a link for you: http://www.metaplace.com/
Games from the garage are back !
The problem is, somehow along the way the entire industry has been brain washed into thinking a MMORPG game is a game where you have the following characeristics:
You have areas that have content based on your level.
You have a book and in that book you have a list and that list contains your list of workorders to complete.
While working on work order #24 you may encounter additonal work orders.
My points are games today are
1.far, far far too task driven
2. Ask for too much suspension of disbelief - each one of these morons at this camp are standing around with a job for me to do.
These tasks detract from whats really important in an online game: making my own adventure. Many would say "well make your own" and trust me I've tried. EQ2 came the closest but seeing all those mindless mobs wandering around doing nothing just makes me ill. Where is the fanstasy in walking up to "a wood cutter" and killing him because your work order says to. I could ignore those quests and move on but where do i draw the line on MY suspension of disbelief.
Games need less quests, more thought out. Vanguard stood the best chance at this and I was hoping to Rekindle that original sandbox feel but they went down the treadmill route as well.
Each game is going to have a finite set of quests to do, and each game will have limits on what content you are exposed to at each level. What these craptastic games of the modern age lack is any creative innovation on the exposure of these game elements to the player.
Think. Filter. Speak.
Remember that and you will go far.
The way MMO's go is not about the Developers actually. Its all about the marketing. Generally Devs get a game thought of and designed. They start working on it and the idea gets better and better. They think of more cool stuff and add more. They keep working and creating a work of art. Then comes the publisher and says "Get this game in peoples hands because we want money." and the Devs have to rush out a product too early.
Almost all MMOs come out in unfinished states. They almost always release in what would be considered unacceptable if it were on a single-player console system. Thats 0% dev fault. Read devlogs and reviews on devs that worked on past games. They always say "we had a million ideas but we didnt have time..."
Publishers want to make money so they stop funding at a certain point and that stop causes the game out early.
Dont bash the people who agree that the games arnt perfect. I bet there are 100's of coders out there pissed off at thier bosses for being told to release a game before they finished this or that.
Your "perfect" MMO only exists if you dump insane amounts of money into it before its released. Not a risk many want to make.
Im afraid that all your compaints are vague. And you offer no constructive ideas as to how to improve the problem. At least when my baby cries, he says "Baba".
Fact is there is no One MMORPG that has everything that everyone wants. Many companies offer certain features they do well. The companies work hard to keep those features prominant and smooth and sometimes this is at a cost of sacrificing other areas of the game. If you give a game long enough, they will continue to add on features. It takes time and some amount of patience on the players part. One problem tho, is that by the time the games have all the features you want, people complain "bah! that game is too old"
Torrential
Torrential: DAOC (Pendragon)
Awned: World of Warcraft (Lothar)
Torren: Warhammer Online (Praag)
holy hell batman someone with 670 posts outta be able to pick out a semi whimisical post on these forums.
no need to compare me to your baby unless you're just trying to derail a semi serious conversation.
I guess its a big suprise to some of you that many of the older gamers consider modern mmos to be teh suk.
"The real rpg gamer" doesn't play computer RPGs. They make friends and create the true RPG experience, where rules and content are only limited by the imagination of the participants.
Coding skills vs creative department are two different areas of discussion.
In vanguard trees were not collidable - whoever decided to populate the rest of the game world without fixing that should have been fired. That is - if you care enough about emersion to make trees a solid mass in your universe.
Creators lack creativity and lots of released games lack quality.
haha now someone gets it!
now make a funny about a 30 million $$ ++ game struggling because trees are not collidable objects.
Imagine this.
You and yoru team have been givin an average MMOs budget. Your pay is DIRECTLY tied to the success of this game, if it bombs, you will not be paid. Now imagine a baord meeting discussing the game.
Option A) Create a standard MMO akin to the many out there albiet with a few twists, this is the likliest road to success, and food on your table.
Option
Create a totally unique MMO and take a do-or-die shot at it. This would likely fail if it wasnt unique enough.
Option C) Attempt to combine the above two options, this approach might still fail, but not as likely as option B.
As you can see, most people will go with option A, because it presents the greatest chance of success. Devs today jsut can't risk their entire careers on a single shot at total uniqueness.
I think it's the objective of your past self to make you cringe.