Finally an MMO to surpass AC! -Spellborn

Wolfsheim · October 2007

Some of ya here mighta heard about Spellborn, but I was totally suprised to find out about it just today here on MMORPG.COM and normally I got my eye out for anything like this. If you haven't seen this yet, then check out the Video Interview with the devs who run through the game in great detail and show off things that Asheron's Call fans have all been seeing only in our dreams before. The designers themselves were big AC fans who played on DT PVP server. They've done what I was beginning to think empossible with current Netcode on MMOs. They go so far beyond what Age of Conan has only barely been able to break away from.

Anyway check it out. I'm pretty psyched now about it..

Smokeysong · November 2007

Pretty? Probably.

I like that you aren't necessarily locked into class types, something AC excels at.

What AC fans have only been seeing in our dreams? Eh? Nothing about this game speaks of an improved AC-like experience that I can see. I don't think you've ever played AC.

As far as comparing it to Age of Conan - you have NO clue what AoC is about. This pretty-boy stuff ain't it.

Wolfsheim · November 2007

Real Time combat, being able to dodge attacks. Combat that is actually effected by how you move, and requires Skill over dice rolls? How is that not in the same style that made AC great and mostly unlike any other MMOs? Why would you think I haven't played it? And how who are you to say I know nothing about Age of Conan, when I've scarely said anything about it. Im on the AOC forums, with the same name. Ive been a member there since the beginning of 2007. I know about every detail regarding that game, and Im excited about it too, but not so much as Spellborn, which takes alot more new ideas and has tested them and shown them off to great detail, unlike AOC which barely shows us any progress, and the combat is glitchy in most every video I've seen that shows PVP. But I dont want to argue about one being better, I like them both. But regardless anyone who's exasperated seeing MMO's all cranked out the same, and who loved AC, should be pretty excited about Spellborn. Your just being overly Cynical and Apathetic, to just say its a pretty boy game full of hype. As you've assumed I dont. You more obviously know nothing about Spellborn, and you probably didnt even watch the video on here with the devs being interviewed like I'd suggested. Your just trolling.

Unknown · November 2007

Real Time combat, being able to dodge attacks. Combat that is actually effected by how you move, and requires Skill over dice rolls? How is that not in the same style that made AC great and mostly unlike any other MMOs...

If that is all you see in AC, then you are missing 98% of what makes AC better than most games in the past 10 years. What you describe is more like an FPS game, not an mmo game.

Does not sound to me like you have ever played AC.

Ravel_RP · November 2007

Originally posted by Laiina

Real Time combat, being able to dodge attacks. Combat that is actually effected by how you move, and requires Skill over dice rolls? How is that not in the same style that made AC great and mostly unlike any other MMOs...
If that is all you see in AC, then you are missing 98% of what makes AC better than most games in the past 10 years. What you describe is more like an FPS game, not an mmo game.

I am sorry to say I have never played AC, so I cannot make a comparison. But I can assure you Spellborn is very much a mmo and a mmorpg at that. The combat system is something they can show to the public. The rest is for players to experience themselves when the game is released. Although, people who are interested can read the dev journals and already get an impression of what the game is to going to be.

Whether that compares in anyway to AC? I don't know, but apparently the OP who plays or has payed AC is hyped about it, but from his post I do not comprehend how Spellborn compares to AC, because I do not know AC at all. But I am curious to learn, since maybe that might mean I have missed out on never playing AC.

Smokeysong · November 2007

Originally posted by Wolfsheim

Real Time combat, being able to dodge attacks. Combat that is actually effected by how you move, and requires Skill over dice rolls? How is that not in the same style that made AC great and mostly unlike any other MMOs? Why would you think I haven't played it? And how who are you to say I know nothing about Age of Conan, when I've scarely said anything about it. Im on the AOC forums, with the same name. Ive been a member there since the beginning of 2007. I know about every detail regarding that game, and Im excited about it too, but not so much as Spellborn, which takes alot more new ideas and has tested them and shown them off to great detail, unlike AOC which barely shows us any progress, and the combat is glitchy in most every video I've seen that shows PVP. But I dont want to argue about one being better, I like them both. But regardless anyone who's exasperated seeing MMO's all cranked out the same, and who loved AC, should be pretty excited about Spellborn. Your just being overly Cynical and Apathetic, to just say its a pretty boy game full of hype. As you've assumed I dont. You more obviously know nothing about Spellborn, and you probably didnt even watch the video on here with the devs being interviewed like I'd suggested. Your just trolling.

First of all, I did watch the video. Second, I didn't say anything against it's quality in any way, it may turn out to be the best MMO of all time functionally speaking. Personally, I didn't see anything that made me think so, but then I don't read in to videos of games what others seem to do; I think most people make up what they want to see in a game from a video, and that actually playing the game will be the only real indicator as to its functional and esthetic quality, and that one's own experience will be large (but not necessarily the most important) factor.

What I said was that it's nothing like Asheron's Call, and it's nothing like Age of Conan. Will it have a better combat system than AoC? Possibly. Will it do other things better than AoC? Possibly. Is it intended for the same audience as AoC? NO! Would I play Spellborn in place of AoC? No more than I would read Nathaniel Hawthorne in place of Robert E. Howard.

I will disagree with myself here just a little, and say AoC has been tempered to appeal to the mass audiences, so in that case both games are designed to appeal to the same market; both want to emulate the success of WoW (or surpass it). Otherwise, though, the look, feel, and play of AoC will be very different than that of The Chronicles of Spellborn, regardless of mechanics.

Third, when I played AC and now when I think back upon it, there is nothing about Spellborn that makes me think of an improved AC. There is nothing in Spellborn that I 'dreamed about' as an AC player. Spellborn's feel is so different than AC, just watching the video, I can hardly see where one would make the comparison. They are both MMOs, but they are very different.

As to calling me a troll - you, sir, are the troll. You come here fan-boying to support a game you like saying it is the answer to our dreams BECAUSE we are AC fans, when clearly, though it may be a great game, it has little in common with AC. You gripe about AoC in the same manner that some few whiners do on the AoC forums, making judgements based upon mostly bad videos of gameplay about a game that you've NEVER PLAYED. You complain about the sameness of all MMOs, when there are very clear differences in the MMOs out there. (I've made this point on the AoC forum.) Is UO the same as EQ? DAoC? WoW? Horizons? AC? TR (Tabula Rasa)? SWG? Eve? Are these games really just cookie-cutter versions of each other? No. They don't even all have the same universal elements in common.

You are the one who comes around cynically griping and moaning; you are the one Cynical and Apathetic, and I couldn't stress that more, your attitude about current MMOs and AoC are proof of that. If you read my posts on the AoC forums (under the name 'Tief") you will find they are very supportive of AoC and the MMO industry.

I'll make a prediction for you. When you play Spellborn you will be excited enough at first, but very soon it will begin to feel like 'every other MMO' out there, and you will lose interest. Why? Because it is not the actual games that you are so bored with, but the genre as a whole. I've experienced this myself; when I quit playing AC I thought it was because I was tired of AC, I started playing EQ2 immediately, and in 4 months canceled my subscription to EQ2. I didn't play an MMO for over a year and a half.

Smokeysong · November 2007

I must say Wolfsheim, that in reviewing your posts on the AoC forums I find that you are not negative at all, that your posts are generally constructive and sound hopeful about AoC. I agree with you on most of your opinions, such as cursed items, displayed names, dancing, and others.

You did on occasion make statements that sounded a bit authoritative about AoC to me, and one post that sounded like you were speaking as though you were speaking for everyone, but I certainly wouldn't discount your opinions because of your 'style'.

You are clearly a very knowledgeable MMO gamer with a lot of experience, and I respect you as such.

One thing that confuses me though, since you describe yourself as an AC kind of guy. One of your posts states clearly that you think healers shouldn't fight and fighters shouldn't heal. Since this is a flexibility found in Spellborn and a main benefit of AC in its ability to not limit you in class definitions, I once again question your view of AC.

I want to make it clear here that I don't know much about Spellborn at all, and that my impression of it is from the one video interview and that I watched it specifically looking for similarities to AC, and might have missed some things about Spellborn I would have liked more. Still, my main points, that Spellborn will be a very different experience than AC or AoC, stand up. But then, though there are many striking similarities between EQ2 and WoW, I find them to be very different games, so maybe that will clue you in to where I'm coming from.

Leoj · November 2007

I agree with you 100 percent. I love AC and I didn't even play until the game was on a decline of players, but I've been looking for that game that can give me that feeling again. I've been following Spellborn for a while now and the first thing it made me think of was AC. The feel seems the same as well as the creativity behind the game...which is what I think has been missing in mmos. I really hope TcOS makes it to the US because I have no doubt it will give me that fresh feel to the mmo genre again. If you haven't checked this game out yet, listen to the original poster because I think he knows what he is talking about.

Raui · November 2007

I haven't found any major similiarties between Asheron's Call and Spellborn, other than its flexibility.

While I understand that flexibility differs from game to game, the only loose-leaf similiarities is the fact that both games are generally more free in your character's development ... but .. that only goes so far.

I do like what I see about the battle system, I imagine that it would be very competitive .. however, I've found that, while major systems like Character Development and Combat are important to look at, to truthfully replicate a game's dynamics is to replicate its feeling.

This game, as welloff and promising as you might think it is, doesn't do that for me. Now, granted, like many, I only saw one video. That doesn't mean that I'm right, and it doesn't mean that I'm wrong, it means that I only have limited information.

I hope that you're right and it is much like AC .. but, realisticly, the game of Asheron's Call can never be mimiced by another game developer unless it carries the title, the storyline, the passion, and the dedication that Asheron's Call has from the time of its release to present day.

Sadly, all that AC is missing is the dedication of the developer. If we had that -- if AC was in the spotlight still -- We wouldn't even need to search for a game that rivals AC in playability style.

Edit: Actually, the more I look into it, the more I'm curious. It seems to promise a lot.. I guess, in the end, only time will tell. I'll give it a try and probably be back here 6-12 months after its release to talk about what I've discovered.

Wolfsheim · November 2007

Originally posted by Smokeysong

I must say Wolfsheim, that in reviewing your posts on the AoC forums I find that you are not negative at all, that your posts are generally constructive and sound hopeful about AoC. I agree with you on most of your opinions, such as cursed items, displayed names, dancing, and others.
You did on occasion make statements that sounded a bit authoritative about AoC to me, and one post that sounded like you were speaking as though you were speaking for everyone, but I certainly wouldn't discount your opinions because of your 'style'.
You are clearly a very knowledgeable MMO gamer with a lot of experience, and I respect you as such.
One thing that confuses me though, since you describe yourself as an AC kind of guy. One of your posts states clearly that you think healers shouldn't fight and fighters shouldn't heal. Since this is a flexibility found in Spellborn and a main benefit of AC in its ability to not limit you in class definitions, I once again question your view of AC.
I want to make it clear here that I don't know much about Spellborn at all, and that my impression of it is from the one video interview and that I watched it specifically looking for similarities to AC, and might have missed some things about Spellborn I would have liked more. Still, my main points, that Spellborn will be a very different experience than AC or AoC, stand up. But then, though there are many striking similarities between EQ2 and WoW, I find them to be very different games, so maybe that will clue you in to where I'm coming from.

Well I was going to reply to the post before this one, then I was shocked to read this one right after so its good that I gave it awhile before checking back here. Thanks for having looked at my posts on AoC, and I never called ya a troll. Maybe you inferred that, but its not quite my style to use terms that everyone else Over uses, and Over generalizes and I could tell from that post your a smart reasonable person. But from your first response it was like the typical Cynical responses you get on all forums when anyone speaks positively about anything,

As for AoC. I cant remember posting about Healers being strickly for healing. Maybe I had a quote from someone else in my message. I do think all classes should have specific abilities that are designed to be better than other classes, but there should be a variety of other abilities as well. A healer class should heal better than another class, unless they just ignore building the skills and some other class puts extra skill into it. Like a Druid in WoW can build any number of aspects of its class very well, but a straight priest that actually concentrates on its healing should be the best there is at that skill, but priests can tank excellent as well because they heal so well. You cant expect to get great DPS too if you already Heal and Tank great.

Now Ill try to say why AC is a bit like Spellborn, unlike other MMOs. Most have the ability within the engine to create the kind of monthly events, quest chains, lore, and writing that AC has. They however Do-Not have the ability to create a similar feel to combat. No other MMO since AC and maybe Ultima Online had Real Time combat that was exciting and exhilarating requiring SKILL as opposed to just luck and dice roles. A low level could beat a high level using SKILL in AC because of the gameplay mechanics. Other MMOs are pure Lock-On, Dice Role, Whack-A-Mole affairs requiring with no choice in the outcome of most battles, when your too weak. Your screwed and retrying 1000x wont give you any more chance of winning that battle, because the MATH is against you. AC didnt have combat depending on MATH alone, and Spellborn doesnt have dice rolls at all. Everything else may or may not be the same, but everything else can be. In other MMOS they have no way to be similar because the engine wont allow it. Everything is in place that needs to be in Spellborn to capture the moments I loved in AC. Whether it will or not remains to be seen. But it has all the potential to. Tell me another MMO that has that potential. AoC does, but since I haven't been able to see good videos to confirm the combat works as smoothly as it claims. Im not convinced it can be.

AC had great monthly events with the admins taking part. The lore was very indepth and detailed, the way magic items and loot worked was great, but those things can be put in any MMO on the market. but most everyone that loves AC more than any other MMO will say its the PVP that was the #1 Reason. Being able to loot those you killed, and being able to employ vast amounts of skill in any battle made every battle unique.

Well I hope thats clear enough, I gotta run so I dont even have time to reread this to check but hopefully you get my meaning. Theres tons of detail you can see about the Lore and massive attention going into Spellborn on their forums. Its remarkably more than you might find on any other MMO in development. The DEV journals and diaries are so expansive, yet down to earth with the community, its a great sign of whats to come. The whole reason Im excited is because its so completly different from anything in the MMO genre, which I too am tired of, and seen it all before. Even the overused template of D&D concepts have been thrown out in Spellborn and new ideas to replace the old stats ideas. Read up on Spellborns system of how skills work.

Wolfsheim · November 2007

Originally posted by Raui

I haven't found any major similiarties between Asheron's Call and Spellborn, other than its flexibility.
While I understand that flexibility differs from game to game, the only loose-leaf similiarities is the fact that both games are generally more free in your character's development ... but .. that only goes so far.
I do like what I see about the battle system, I imagine that it would be very competitive .. however, I've found that, while major systems like Character Development and Combat are important to look at, to truthfully replicate a game's dynamics is to replicate its feeling.

This game, as welloff and promising as you might think it is, doesn't do that for me. Now, granted, like many, I only saw one video. That doesn't mean that I'm right, and it doesn't mean that I'm wrong, it means that I only have limited information.
I hope that you're right and it is much like AC .. but, realisticly, the game of Asheron's Call can never be mimiced by another game developer unless it carries the title, the storyline, the passion, and the dedication that Asheron's Call has from the time of its release to present day.
Sadly, all that AC is missing is the dedication of the developer. If we had that -- if AC was in the spotlight still -- We wouldn't even need to search for a game that rivals AC in playability style.

Edit: Actually, the more I look into it, the more I'm curious. It seems to promise a lot.. I guess, in the end, only time will tell. I'll give it a try and probably be back here 6-12 months after its release to talk about what I've discovered.

Well it helps too that the developers themselves talk alot about AC and were players on a FFA pvp server who wants to recapture what they loved there, but also to improve things they think lacking not only from AC but in all the MMOs they've played.

Such as the concept of having to use constantly new improved armor and weapons to be more powerful. The character should be more powerful, not his loot. Anything a powerful character picks up should be powerful in his hands because of his skill. In Spellborn you can wear anything you want, and wield anything you want. Some higher level items may look nicer, but they wont have any stats or inherent buffs to make you require using them. You can run around half naked if you want to. You can personalizae abilities for your armor and weapons by slotting them with glyphs that give those items the abilities you want. You can customize colors of armor and weapons you want to be wear too.

How sick are you all of seeing characters in other MMOs of the same level range all carrying the same "Uber Powerful Weapon and Armor" of their class/level. In Spellborn everyone can look unique because they can wear anything they want anytime and still be as effective. Any mobs you kill, you can take their armor and weapons for yourself as well, since all mobs will actually have in their inventory what you see on them. You can constantly be changing how you look based on your mood or whims at the time, rather than being locked down to ugly items you hate but you want its stats. (The Pope Hat/beret in ScarlettMonestary Anyone?)

There are still Classes though, its not Totally skill based like AC. But.. at higher levels you can begin learning pretty much any skill from any other class, so you can become multiclassed this way.

Raui · December 2007

Well, its interesting. I did a little bit of research and I've found that this game seems to have a lot of potential. The ideas they bring forth are just the kind of ideas that some of the people I've talked with in AC were looking for in a game.

I'm not saying I'm willing to abandon an 8 year dedication to AC, just that It would be nice to find a game that I can finally retire to when AC is gone.

As I said in my other post, only time will truthfully tell. If its true that a lot of the Devs of this game are former AC players (among other MMOs), then I'm sure they'll be more than willing to bring it to the US.

Unfortunately it hasn't happened yet, unless it happened in the last week since I've been to their main forums. Presumably, if it is brought to the US, AC will be hard pressed to maintain its playerbase once the word gets out that this is stacking up against it.

I imagine if this game takes off, AC will have finally met its maker and the days of AC will be numbered. Its a sad sight to behold, but a sight we all knew would happen. With the promise of a ground-breaking AC-like game, comes the promise of demise for AC itself.

I look forward to the coming months when we learn more about it.

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Finally an MMO to surpass AC! -Spellborn

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Finally an MMO to surpass AC! -Spellborn

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