Lucky for me I have you to be my personal internet pyschologist right?
My points about the death penalty and travels times were in direct relation to what VG was originally designed as and where I think it keeps changing course to become more accessible. You say I am wrong, but both SIGIL and SOE have repeatedly stated those were barriers to fun and they have made changes to those aspects. The producers letter further suggests more "accessible" changes are coming. Whatever, keep up your faith I guess. You are always feel right despite ugly things like facts.
I love how you start a post directly about me as "you just dont get it", but somehow when I respond directly to you it is somehow a vendetta. Hypocrisy at its finest.
Whatever, keep up your faith I guess. You are always feel right despite ugly things like facts. [?]
I honestly do not fully comprehend your posts. For example, you said I was "extrapolating" things but you probably meant I was either 1) interpreting or 2) constructing. Think of extrapolating as predicting. I think you are trying to somehow put me the defensive due to your personal issues.
I often quote John Adams when I say "facts are stubborn things." You on the other hand have no facts because you
Do not play Vanguard
Miss points entirely
Make more posts about me than about Vanguard
The fact is that 45000 customers have not quit due to travel and death penalty; they quit because of 1) performance and 2) bugs. I am happy to state, as a matter of fact, that performance is much better and every game-breaking bug I am aware from release has been fixed. Performance is still an issue, and Vanguard will not obtain the lower income or Asian markets due to high system requirements; it has nothing to do with the issues you raised: death penalty, travel. You are simply missing the point.
----- WoW and fast food = commercial successes. I neither play WoW nor eat fast food.
You continually post "I don't understand what you are saying" and I am the one who doesn't get it?
You continually make personal attacks and assumptions about the person posting and not their views.
You ignore facts like the devs making changes to the game about travel and death penalty and instead blame me as if I am making that as a suggestion.
Perhaps the problem is you just can't see anything objectively and placing blame on me (or whoever your are assualting at the time).
As for your "facts" care to share where you get 45k subs
The fact is that 45000 customers have not quit due to travel and death penalty; they quit because of 1) performance and 2) bugs.
So now you know how many subs the game has and why everyone else quit? Those are some FACTS you have there. Care to share your source of that information?
I anxiously await you dodging another question and instead performing more internet psychology.
Originally posted by Daffid011 Placing blame on me (or whoever your are assualting at the time).
I think you are trying to say you are Phil Donahue while acting like Bill O'Reilly. (see, e.g., the use of the word "assaulting.") www.youtube.com/watch
[I again honestly do not fully understand your language. Similar with "extrapolating," assault is the threat of an imminent battery. It is impossible to assault a person online.]
All you want to do is:
Post
So I post
So you can post again
I am actually getting bored with this, but do not interpret my boredom as as either contrition or capitulation. You do not 1) play, 2) you miss points, and you have a 3) persecution-complex. I am more than willing to address any aspect of Vanguard and even answer questions.* The game Daffid wants to play 1) post, 2) so I post 3) so he can post again is too boring and way off topic.
*No frivolous questions.
----- WoW and fast food = commercial successes. I neither play WoW nor eat fast food.
Well I have to say a big thank you guys and/or gals. I contributed to Vanguard beta, and have the game sitting on my shelf still, and in hopes of persuading my guild (mostly ex-EQ 1) in EQ 2 to move to a game with more depth and complexity I have been trawling through these threads hoping to discover what the true state of play is in VG.
But tbh all I'm seeing is people sniping at each other in a personal way; an apparent inability to speak freely, openly and objectively about the game; and the expression of a lot of pipe-dreams about what the game should be or could be.... when I just wanted to know what it is, right now, today.
Frankly if this is a snapshot of the state of the community for this game currently I'll give it a miss thanks. I'm in a mature experienced but casual guild and I really don't think I could convince them this is a good place to be right now.
What a shame. Like everybody else I had high (maybe too high?) expectations for this game as a progression in the EQ line and the MMORPG market... one day maybe it will be, but right now it still seems to be missing that elusive something, and I'm afraid that seems to be reflected here too.
Maybe I'll check back in another few months when you're all a little happier.
"If I knew then what I know now... I'ld probably do the same stupid thing "
Hmmm... Well I have to say a big thank you guys and/or gals. I contributed to Vanguard beta, and have the game sitting on my shelf still, and in hopes of persuading my guild (mostly ex-EQ 1) in EQ 2 to move to a game with more depth and complexity I have been trawling through these threads hoping to discover what the true state of play is in VG. But tbh all I'm seeing is people sniping at each other in a personal way; an apparent inability to speak freely, openly and objectively about the game; and the expression of a lot of pipe-dreams about what the game should be or could be.... when I just wanted to know what it is, right now, today. Frankly if this is a snapshot of the state of the community for this game currently I'll give it a miss thanks. I'm in a mature experienced but casual guild and I really don't think I could convince them this is a good place to be right now. What a shame. Like everybody else I had high (maybe too high?) expectations for this game as a progression in the EQ line and the MMORPG market... one day maybe it will be, but right now it still seems to be missing that elusive something, and I'm afraid that seems to be reflected here too. Maybe I'll check back in another few months when you're all a little happier.
why would you think a puplic forums like this would give you a snapshot of the community of vanguard
This is where haters and fanboys bash it out bro it in no way refects the community of vanguard , which by the way is fantastic on my server for the most part . you get the odd retard in chat once in awhile like anygame but i dont pay any attension to them
swede2 is exactly right. I play several MMORPGs (Vanguard, EQ 1, and EQ 2 - i n fact, I play WoW on free servers as well) but do not consider myself representative of any game.
As a matter of fact, the only thing I represent is myself and my own ideas.
I do not think even the entire MMMORPG community is representative of the gaming community. My experiences with posting online albeit briefly is that most "active posters" tend to be passionate: love, hate, flame, and hype their games. I analyze what others write objectively, in good faith, and fairly. I also have high standards with what I write on MMORPG and impose a duty of good faith, honesty in fact, fair dealing, and fairness on myself.
I assure you, speaking for myself, I am quite unique, fit no stereotypes, and represent no one but me.
----- WoW and fast food = commercial successes. I neither play WoW nor eat fast food.
If you call the last four pages "community" you need your head examined. Bashing each other constantly...
Morgaur is not a native English speaker so give the guy a break. He wrote a decent review and deserves a bit of credit for his efforts. That's more than most Americans can write in a foreign language without smashing their head off a table until something decent comes out.
I agree with various points made by BOTH of you even though you differ in areas. There are parts of the game that are very broken and there are others that are highly innovative. Here's an interesting comparison. When I played V:SoH only one thing came to mind.
V:SoH = Horizons: Empire of Istaria
New graphics that slow even the best systems down, highly innovative gameplay and an interesting community of players. However, the gameplay is hindered by poorly structured programming, which causes you to die, fall through the map and have your bags emptied spontaneously; not to mention horrible support. Both game share highly similar strengths and weaknesses.
It's just a bloody game. Relax . Trolling, stalking profiles to see how many times they log, post, or play with their mouse... grow up.
Originally posted by OrphesYou still have the overhead cost amongst others. For example the cost for the personal that only works with VG. You have just as good options on equal "tests" that can be done with the same result without no need for this. If they bougth the code for this example why keep the cost that it brings by haveng the servers live, paying the above overhead etc etc. When they just could have the game running internaly.
Bad code is still badcode even if it's not Vanguard.
This is just plain common sense.
Career opportunities always exists withing a company.
I'd say the costs of running the game are abosrbed by the company as a whole. Billing is the same for all SOE games, bandwidth for SOE probably isnt a problem, there less people most likely playing SOE games then a year or so ago (cough.. star wars galaxies cough). The staff on VG maybe graduates on low pay. Its these people I keep thinking are VG purpose at SOE. I am simply unwilling to beleive SOE or any company would employ fresh faced graduates on a time and mission critical game. Doesn't work like that. Least not at big companies like SOE.
I will also say something crazy like there is no such thing as bad code there is only code which need refactoring and fixing. Unless of course VG is that deeply flawed. Though I guess there has been discussion of its use of the unreal engine. Ahem don't want to upset any fanboys here...
Bad code? Since 90% of prgramming jobs I have been told is modifying existing code I would imagine part of the job is making bad code.. well at least tolerable. I think this fits VG very well.
Anyways were going to have to disagree here but it light of the fact SOE is not rolling in $$$ with VG. What do you think they bought the game for ?
Comments
Lucky for me I have you to be my personal internet pyschologist right?
My points about the death penalty and travels times were in direct relation to what VG was originally designed as and where I think it keeps changing course to become more accessible. You say I am wrong, but both SIGIL and SOE have repeatedly stated those were barriers to fun and they have made changes to those aspects. The producers letter further suggests more "accessible" changes are coming. Whatever, keep up your faith I guess. You are always feel right despite ugly things like facts.
I love how you start a post directly about me as "you just dont get it", but somehow when I respond directly to you it is somehow a vendetta. Hypocrisy at its finest.
I honestly do not fully comprehend your posts. For example, you said I was "extrapolating" things but you probably meant I was either 1) interpreting or 2) constructing. Think of extrapolating as predicting. I think you are trying to somehow put me the defensive due to your personal issues.
I often quote John Adams when I say "facts are stubborn things." You on the other hand have no facts because you
The fact is that 45000 customers have not quit due to travel and death penalty; they quit because of 1) performance and 2) bugs. I am happy to state, as a matter of fact, that performance is much better and every game-breaking bug I am aware from release has been fixed. Performance is still an issue, and Vanguard will not obtain the lower income or Asian markets due to high system requirements; it has nothing to do with the issues you raised: death penalty, travel. You are simply missing the point.
-----
WoW and fast food = commercial successes.
I neither play WoW nor eat fast food.
You continually post "I don't understand what you are saying" and I am the one who doesn't get it?
You continually make personal attacks and assumptions about the person posting and not their views.
You ignore facts like the devs making changes to the game about travel and death penalty and instead blame me as if I am making that as a suggestion.
Perhaps the problem is you just can't see anything objectively and placing blame on me (or whoever your are assualting at the time).
As for your "facts" care to share where you get 45k subs
The fact is that 45000 customers have not quit due to travel and death penalty; they quit because of 1) performance and 2) bugs.
So now you know how many subs the game has and why everyone else quit? Those are some FACTS you have there. Care to share your source of that information?
I anxiously await you dodging another question and instead performing more internet psychology.
I think you are trying to say you are Phil Donahue while acting like Bill O'Reilly. (see, e.g., the use of the word "assaulting.") www.youtube.com/watch
[I again honestly do not fully understand your language. Similar with "extrapolating," assault is the threat of an imminent battery. It is impossible to assault a person online.]
All you want to do is:
I am actually getting bored with this, but do not interpret my boredom as as either contrition or capitulation. You do not 1) play, 2) you miss points, and you have a 3) persecution-complex. I am more than willing to address any aspect of Vanguard and even answer questions.* The game Daffid wants to play 1) post, 2) so I post 3) so he can post again is too boring and way off topic.
*No frivolous questions.
-----
WoW and fast food = commercial successes.
I neither play WoW nor eat fast food.
Hmmm...
Well I have to say a big thank you guys and/or gals. I contributed to Vanguard beta, and have the game sitting on my shelf still, and in hopes of persuading my guild (mostly ex-EQ 1) in EQ 2 to move to a game with more depth and complexity I have been trawling through these threads hoping to discover what the true state of play is in VG.
But tbh all I'm seeing is people sniping at each other in a personal way; an apparent inability to speak freely, openly and objectively about the game; and the expression of a lot of pipe-dreams about what the game should be or could be.... when I just wanted to know what it is, right now, today.
Frankly if this is a snapshot of the state of the community for this game currently I'll give it a miss thanks. I'm in a mature experienced but casual guild and I really don't think I could convince them this is a good place to be right now.
What a shame. Like everybody else I had high (maybe too high?) expectations for this game as a progression in the EQ line and the MMORPG market... one day maybe it will be, but right now it still seems to be missing that elusive something, and I'm afraid that seems to be reflected here too.
Maybe I'll check back in another few months when you're all a little happier.
"If I knew then what I know now... I'ld probably do the same stupid thing
"
This is where haters and fanboys bash it out bro it in no way refects the community of vanguard , which by the way is fantastic on my server for the most part . you get the odd retard in chat once in awhile like anygame but i dont pay any attension to them
swede2 is exactly right. I play several MMORPGs (Vanguard, EQ 1, and EQ 2 - i n fact, I play WoW on free servers as well) but do not consider myself representative of any game.
As a matter of fact, the only thing I represent is myself and my own ideas.
I do not think even the entire MMMORPG community is representative of the gaming community. My experiences with posting online albeit briefly is that most "active posters" tend to be passionate: love, hate, flame, and hype their games. I analyze what others write objectively, in good faith, and fairly. I also have high standards with what I write on MMORPG and impose a duty of good faith, honesty in fact, fair dealing, and fairness on myself.
I assure you, speaking for myself, I am quite unique, fit no stereotypes, and represent no one but me.
-----
WoW and fast food = commercial successes.
I neither play WoW nor eat fast food.
If you call the last four pages "community" you need your head examined. Bashing each other constantly...
Morgaur is not a native English speaker so give the guy a break. He wrote a decent review and deserves a bit of credit for his efforts. That's more than most Americans can write in a foreign language without smashing their head off a table until something decent comes out.
I agree with various points made by BOTH of you even though you differ in areas. There are parts of the game that are very broken and there are others that are highly innovative. Here's an interesting comparison. When I played V:SoH only one thing came to mind.
V:SoH = Horizons: Empire of Istaria
New graphics that slow even the best systems down, highly innovative gameplay and an interesting community of players. However, the gameplay is hindered by poorly structured programming, which causes you to die, fall through the map and have your bags emptied spontaneously; not to mention horrible support. Both game share highly similar strengths and weaknesses.
. Trolling, stalking profiles to see how many times they log, post, or play with their mouse... grow up.
It's just a bloody game. Relax
I'd say the costs of running the game are abosrbed by the company as a whole. Billing is the same for all SOE games, bandwidth for SOE probably isnt a problem, there less people most likely playing SOE games then a year or so ago (cough.. star wars galaxies cough). The staff on VG maybe graduates on low pay. Its these people I keep thinking are VG purpose at SOE. I am simply unwilling to beleive SOE or any company would employ fresh faced graduates on a time and mission critical game. Doesn't work like that. Least not at big companies like SOE.
I will also say something crazy like there is no such thing as bad code there is only code which need refactoring and fixing. Unless of course VG is that deeply flawed. Though I guess there has been discussion of its use of the unreal engine. Ahem don't want to upset any fanboys here...
Bad code? Since 90% of prgramming jobs I have been told is modifying existing code I would imagine part of the job is making bad code.. well at least tolerable. I think this fits VG very well.
Anyways were going to have to disagree here but it light of the fact SOE is not rolling in $$$ with VG. What do you think they bought the game for ?
Not to verify new employes on. That is one of the most stupid ideas I heard of.
I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
"You have the right not to be killed"
I see things have been happening here. Its always nice to debate, if one can stick to the topic and avoid bashing people for their views.
Thanks for all the cheese