If you consider a grind fun, then yea it owns. I heard the pvp was fun so I gave it a try. I played a dwarf for a bit. I got to level 20 something and just couldnt do it anymore. Its games like this that kill me. If your going to make PvP the point of a game, then please dont make it an endgame only thing. There were also bots everywhere. I tried to kill one at one point. Heh. He would simply go from mob to mob while I chased him hacking away. Another player tried to help, we couldnt even dent him. He pop'd potion after potion. I think we wasted around 20 mins. I just dont see much of a point in this type of game...
Well, first off, you played a dwarf. Dwarves have the least skills and are the hardest to level. No one plays a Dwarf to pvp. It's unfortunate, sure, but they are there for crafting and gathering mats.
You can pvp at any time but "yes" pvp does tend to be more focused at end game.
I would say it is an excellent pvp game provided that you are in a clan/alliance that sieges a lot or are active in clan wars.
Like Skyrim? Need more content? Try my Skyrim mod "Godfred's Tomb."
Opposite to a game like wow you create your own pvp, your own battleground, be it with you clan, friends or alone. Thats whats great about the game. Theres no natural enemy, no faction, you create it. It makes the pvp more intense. But, and this is a big but, the grind in this game will always be there and its definetely a grind. We are talking staying in the same place for many weeks, killing the same exact mobs thousands of times just to gain the next level where you can advance to survive a little longer in pvp.
You would think that the players at the "end game" in Lineage would be focused on pvp but unfortunately this is rarely the case, they got their sieges every 14 days, few fights here and there for a raid boss before they yet again get sucked into the grind again. Cuz afterall, it never ends in L2.
Originally posted by Tyrantas Most overrated game ever.
lol that award goes hands down to WOW, at least for MMORPGs. I've said this before but hopefully the Blizz kiddies will grow up someday, try some other MMOs, and realize what they have been missing out on all this time.
I agree with the OP that L2 has the best pvp system of any MMO to date.
lol that award goes hands down to WOW, at least for MMORPGs. I've said this before but hopefully the Blizz kiddies will grow up someday, try some other MMOs, and realize what they have been missing out on all this time.
I agree with the OP that L2 has the best pvp system of any MMO to date.
What exactly is it that they've been missing out on? Most MMOs are crap. The few that are really good are usually really good in just one or two areas. WoW is really good in several areas.
I've played both L2 and WoW, and I have to tell you that WoW wins hands down IMO. L2 has fantastically beautiful graphics and PvP that takes forever to get good at. WoW has everything else. And referring to WoW players as "Blizz kiddies" is lame. There's nothing childish about enjoying a well created, quality MMO.
This thread was abou tthe pvp, not the way to get there.
Well, since its very difficult to "get there" then I'd have to say the PVP isn't the best.
I burned out at level 51..... IMO Lineage 1 PVP was better because it was no problem for anyone to get to level 46-49, which were all very viable levels for the castle sieges and what not. I had a good time sieging castles in L1.
So can't say how good or bad the PVP in L2 is...I never made it.... shame really that the grind had to be so horrific since that wasn't the case in L1.
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
How about innovation? Creativity? Flavor? Wow is about as plain vanilla as it gets, always has been. If that's your thing, wonderful. More power to you. But thanks to wow's sub count, other developers are sidelining fresh new ideas for the tired old wow-model, which btw hasn't changed much since EQ laid the foundation a decade ago. All wow did was introduce Blizzard's pre-existing fanbase to it.
Remember, any experience in private L2 servers is quite different from retail. In retail there aren't spammable MP pots or 'ala' Counter Strike server mods.
Overall, while the whole system with clan wars, castle sieges, conquerable fortresses... is quite nice, the game mechanics and community could have been much improved. That includes targeting system, whole years of grind before real highend, *majority* of ebayers and bots, whole chinese farming clans due to crazy crafting requirements, auto-aim and map layout hacks... L2 was good the first year, but went (is going) downstairs due to bad support. Here and in Korea.
I know it can be a reao pain to be a new player on the official lineage 2 servers.
I'm not saying this is the best way to do it but it for sure helped me:
From start I played on private servers for a year and a half. No modded servers or such just abit bosted rates (5x) and -learned- the game. When i went to the official servers i knew pretty much all there was to know even tho i was a noob there.
Forget grinding. Making money is the #1 thing to focus on. buying/selling crafting and such boosts your economy alot. With better gear lvls come quicker and you won't have to struggle as much to get there. Up to lvl 65+ lvls come pretty fast with the right gear.
Doing quests and always having the "making more money" in mind makes you forget the experience bar. If I would focus on getting lvls I would hate the game.. Cause you can't get your first character there fast, with legit means.
The game is so much more than the grind. Just try to see it and explore.
Just don't go alone! Start playing with some friends or make sure to make friends in game.
Still the best game out there imo.
When lightning strikes once, Venaja strikes twice!
If this game has the best PvP then it sure must be hard to find. I leveled from 1-40 in maybe two months of boring grinding and never saw the hint of any PvP.
I was told there was some at "higher levels" but after two months of grinding I couldnt take it anymore. I dont mind a steep leveling curve but I need some kind of PvP action as well to keep me interested and I didnt see any, at all.
I played so many mmorpgs i donno where to start about pvp. The pvp is beyond best in l2, why is that ? There are factors where pvp is "pvp" in l2. You lose items, if you die you lose exp. There is a risk to lose. Not like in WOW (lol) where you dont lose nothing expect few gold on repairs..... The WoW pvp players shoud pvp in l2 and say "wtf im the best" Hahahahaha i woud love to see them say that. They woud die and people woud delevel them to lvl 1, lol. I am at l2 since the start, if some one knows what prelude is . I had a hell knight, lvl 78 with +8 dark panther.... 5-6 players where needed to kill me. Not like in WOW where 5-6 players comes and you are dead in 1-2 seconds lol. So if you woud like to test the actual pvp, i suggest you some serius private servers where you can be lvl 79-80 in few days and you can test your pvp skills. But be warned, if you make to much shit.... they will develel you .
And remember, l2 is not WOW.
Games played: Owerall ower 500+ MMORPG's played: SWG, ALL GW, WOW, L2, EVE, etc...
Best pvp games in order of goodness at the time, not currently. (PvP changes over time due to patches, expansions, and changes)
#1 1997 - 1999 Ultima Online. Skill based, loot pvp, better you play better you do. Can take on 2 v 1 easily.
#2 Asheron's Call from release till mid 2002. Only game out there were a level 90 has a chance vs a level 126. Friend of mine fought 12 people vs himself. Took 2 and a half hours, but he killed them all. AC you could dodge spells, arrows, etc. So pvp was extremely intense.
#3 Dark Age of Camelot Release till toa. Only pvp game out there to offer permanent incentives for pvp. As you kill you gain levels, and get skills and become more powerful. Pre-toa 2 - 3 v 1's was possible.
#4 Eve online. Land control, full loot, skill based. The only draw back to it... extremely hard learning curve, and not very soloist oriented. But... still a blast.
Those are what most North Americans will tell you are the top 4. Beyond the top four it gets a little open.
EQ1 and EQ2 both heavily focused on PVE and thus.. the pvp is horribly unbalanced. WoW suffers from the same issues.
Lineage and most of the Asian grind games, while having pvp... just arent well done by NA standards. Poor group mechanics such as assisting, crowd control etc. Add onto that extremely harsh leveling requirements and gear requirements and your looking at time invested near that of a doctoral thesis.
Anyways... thats my thoughts. This is obviously a L2 forum, so its going to be pro-l2, just like if you go to a wow forum or daoc forum you would get the same.
This thread was abou tthe pvp, not the way to get there.
Well, since its very difficult to "get there" then I'd have to say the PVP isn't the best.
I burned out at level 51..... IMO Lineage 1 PVP was better because it was no problem for anyone to get to level 46-49, which were all very viable levels for the castle sieges and what not. I had a good time sieging castles in L1.
So can't say how good or bad the PVP in L2 is...I never made it.... shame really that the grind had to be so horrific since that wasn't the case in L1.
I wonder how most MMOers define a PvP game. Personally I define it as killing or challenging wits of another player. SO would in my humble opinion Lineage II wouldnt be defined as a PvP game. If I have to spend 90% of my game time in PvE than I dont define the game as a PvP game. If I cant level through PvP nor gain equipment through PvP than I do not define the game as a PvP game. If all of your quests are PvE oriented, I dont define that game as a PvP game. I dont care if you throw some PvE in the game. Whilst killing a player a mob come and helps him, yea, i still consider that PvP.
I define Fury as a PvP game. Im not saying its a good one. Im just saying it is one. So back to the original question, is Lineage II even a PvP game at all? I say no...
Test it and you will find your answer.
Games played: Owerall ower 500+ MMORPG's played: SWG, ALL GW, WOW, L2, EVE, etc...
If you attack ppl you meet when you are out hunting you can get pvp at any lvl
It's no like you can wait for everyone to come attack you first.
And the fine thing about L2 is that you can attack that other person anytime, anyhwere as long as you arent inside a town. Nothing stops you from trying to whop his ass.
When lightning strikes once, Venaja strikes twice!
Did you even attack someone while out hunting? No? There! If you attack ppl you meet when you are out hunting you can get pvp at any lvl It's no like you can wait for everyone to come attack you first. And the fine thing about L2 is that you can attack that other person anytime, anyhwere as long as you arent inside a town. Nothing stops you from trying to whop his ass.
Well yeah I could run into purple monsters (or whatever higher level mobs are, I forget) and try to kill them too but the reason why I didnt do neither is because randomly killing people at low level is suicide. The penatlies for becoming red is huge, specially if you dont have a clan to back you up, so its really not a viable option. Which is probably why you dont get randomly attacked so often either.
Also I dont like randomly killing people for no reason. If I want to do that I would play an FPS game. Lineage 2 offers a meaningful and fun PvP (or so I heard) but it requires a year or so of leveling to reach there and that is just plain ridicilous.
The lvling is just a challange, not for old ppl with fulltime jobs or noobs that Give up easily.
Good that this is the way you think of L2, i'm sure that Lineage 2 doesn't want any noobs/unpro gamers to play this game.
You realize of course... your losing people faster than your gaining them... and with out new people joining, all that work, time and effort... wont mean much when its just you left right?
The Community is pretty much the same as it was 2 years ago. Some ppl left others joined.
But 90% of those who still play aren't exactly noobs.
Also, with new updates comes new ppls in hordes. When C5 came the new server Franz was filled to it's limits and is still marked as "heavy" on the server selection screen every day.
And no.. Franz did not steal those players from the pre-existing servers.
Most came from private servers and some players vere brand new to the game.
And last.. the new community manger presented some stats on the game when she started in june (or when it was) and all numbers were pointing out that the population was higher then ever,
So, I wouldn't say game is dying.
Just because the game was not fo you and you left.
When lightning strikes once, Venaja strikes twice!
Comments
totally agree. this game got the best pvp system
Without Sacrifice.. There is no Victory
Kenshin
Grind for a YEAR to pvp in castle seiges ! This is why the game is dieing.
If you consider a grind fun, then yea it owns. I heard the pvp was fun so I gave it a try. I played a dwarf for a bit. I got to level 20 something and just couldnt do it anymore. Its games like this that kill me. If your going to make PvP the point of a game, then please dont make it an endgame only thing. There were also bots everywhere. I tried to kill one at one point. Heh. He would simply go from mob to mob while I chased him hacking away. Another player tried to help, we couldnt even dent him. He pop'd potion after potion. I think we wasted around 20 mins. I just dont see much of a point in this type of game...
Well, first off, you played a dwarf. Dwarves have the least skills and are the hardest to level. No one plays a Dwarf to pvp. It's unfortunate, sure, but they are there for crafting and gathering mats.
You can pvp at any time but "yes" pvp does tend to be more focused at end game.
I would say it is an excellent pvp game provided that you are in a clan/alliance that sieges a lot or are active in clan wars.
Godfred's Tomb Trailer: https://youtu.be/-nsXGddj_4w
Original Skyrim: https://www.nexusmods.com/skyrim/mods/109547
Serph toze kindly has started a walk-through. https://youtu.be/UIelCK-lldo
Opposite to a game like wow you create your own pvp, your own battleground, be it with you clan, friends or alone. Thats whats great about the game. Theres no natural enemy, no faction, you create it. It makes the pvp more intense. But, and this is a big but, the grind in this game will always be there and its definetely a grind. We are talking staying in the same place for many weeks, killing the same exact mobs thousands of times just to gain the next level where you can advance to survive a little longer in pvp.
You would think that the players at the "end game" in Lineage would be focused on pvp but unfortunately this is rarely the case, they got their sieges every 14 days, few fights here and there for a raid boss before they yet again get sucked into the grind again. Cuz afterall, it never ends in L2.
Most overrated game ever.
lol that award goes hands down to WOW, at least for MMORPGs. I've said this before but hopefully the Blizz kiddies will grow up someday, try some other MMOs, and realize what they have been missing out on all this time.
I agree with the OP that L2 has the best pvp system of any MMO to date.
lol that award goes hands down to WOW, at least for MMORPGs. I've said this before but hopefully the Blizz kiddies will grow up someday, try some other MMOs, and realize what they have been missing out on all this time.
I agree with the OP that L2 has the best pvp system of any MMO to date.
What exactly is it that they've been missing out on? Most MMOs are crap. The few that are really good are usually really good in just one or two areas. WoW is really good in several areas.
I've played both L2 and WoW, and I have to tell you that WoW wins hands down IMO. L2 has fantastically beautiful graphics and PvP that takes forever to get good at. WoW has everything else. And referring to WoW players as "Blizz kiddies" is lame. There's nothing childish about enjoying a well created, quality MMO.
This thread was abou tthe pvp, not the way to get there.
And when it comes to the pvp in Lineage 2, it is above all.
Depending on how old a server is and what the rate of new ppl coming to it determines when you will start seeing pvp regularly..
On a fresh server like Franz yuo can find good pvp from 30+ cause of the constantly growing population.
On the older servers the pvp start later (after 61 when you can wear A-grade) when you get involved with clans who have wars and such.
Who ever says the only pvp is on sieges, needs to get som clanwars going. or just randomly flag ppl for fun and you will get more than you can handle.
So in my opinion it's the best.
When lightning strikes once, Venaja strikes twice!
Well, since its very difficult to "get there" then I'd have to say the PVP isn't the best.
I burned out at level 51..... IMO Lineage 1 PVP was better because it was no problem for anyone to get to level 46-49, which were all very viable levels for the castle sieges and what not. I had a good time sieging castles in L1.
So can't say how good or bad the PVP in L2 is...I never made it.... shame really that the grind had to be so horrific since that wasn't the case in L1.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
How about innovation? Creativity? Flavor? Wow is about as plain vanilla as it gets, always has been. If that's your thing, wonderful. More power to you. But thanks to wow's sub count, other developers are sidelining fresh new ideas for the tired old wow-model, which btw hasn't changed much since EQ laid the foundation a decade ago. All wow did was introduce Blizzard's pre-existing fanbase to it.
Dwarf PvP in retail, and repeat that again. It takes some balls, that's true:
http://www.megaupload.com/es/?d=3776D0WK
Remember, any experience in private L2 servers is quite different from retail. In retail there aren't spammable MP pots or 'ala' Counter Strike server mods.
Overall, while the whole system with clan wars, castle sieges, conquerable fortresses... is quite nice, the game mechanics and community could have been much improved. That includes targeting system, whole years of grind before real highend, *majority* of ebayers and bots, whole chinese farming clans due to crazy crafting requirements, auto-aim and map layout hacks... L2 was good the first year, but went (is going) downstairs due to bad support. Here and in Korea.
I know it can be a reao pain to be a new player on the official lineage 2 servers.
I'm not saying this is the best way to do it but it for sure helped me:
From start I played on private servers for a year and a half. No modded servers or such just abit bosted rates (5x) and -learned- the game. When i went to the official servers i knew pretty much all there was to know even tho i was a noob there.
Forget grinding. Making money is the #1 thing to focus on. buying/selling crafting and such boosts your economy alot. With better gear lvls come quicker and you won't have to struggle as much to get there. Up to lvl 65+ lvls come pretty fast with the right gear.
Doing quests and always having the "making more money" in mind makes you forget the experience bar. If I would focus on getting lvls I would hate the game.. Cause you can't get your first character there fast, with legit means.
The game is so much more than the grind. Just try to see it and explore.
Just don't go alone! Start playing with some friends or make sure to make friends in game.
Still the best game out there imo.
When lightning strikes once, Venaja strikes twice!
If this game has the best PvP then it sure must be hard to find. I leveled from 1-40 in maybe two months of boring grinding and never saw the hint of any PvP.
I was told there was some at "higher levels" but after two months of grinding I couldnt take it anymore. I dont mind a steep leveling curve but I need some kind of PvP action as well to keep me interested and I didnt see any, at all.
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Now you made me post and i even registered.
I played so many mmorpgs i donno where to start about pvp. The pvp is beyond best in l2, why is that ? There are factors where pvp is "pvp" in l2. You lose items, if you die you lose exp. There is a risk to lose. Not like in WOW (lol) where you dont lose nothing expect few gold on repairs..... The WoW pvp players shoud pvp in l2 and say "wtf im the best" Hahahahaha i woud love to see them say that.
They woud die and people woud delevel them to lvl 1, lol. I am at l2 since the start, if some one knows what prelude is 
. I had a hell knight, lvl 78 with +8 dark panther.... 5-6 players where needed to kill me. Not like in WOW where 5-6 players comes and you are dead in 1-2 seconds lol. So if you woud like to test the actual pvp, i suggest you some serius private servers where you can be lvl 79-80 in few days and you can test your pvp skills. But be warned, if you make to much shit.... they will develel you 
.
And remember, l2 is not WOW.
Games played: Owerall ower 500+
MMORPG's played: SWG, ALL GW, WOW, L2, EVE, etc...
delvling isnt such a problem.. depends on the way you pve to get the 4% back, [or the rate of server
Without Sacrifice.. There is no Victory
Kenshin
Best pvp games in order of goodness at the time, not currently. (PvP changes over time due to patches, expansions, and changes)
#1 1997 - 1999 Ultima Online. Skill based, loot pvp, better you play better you do. Can take on 2 v 1 easily.
#2 Asheron's Call from release till mid 2002. Only game out there were a level 90 has a chance vs a level 126. Friend of mine fought 12 people vs himself. Took 2 and a half hours, but he killed them all. AC you could dodge spells, arrows, etc. So pvp was extremely intense.
#3 Dark Age of Camelot Release till toa. Only pvp game out there to offer permanent incentives for pvp. As you kill you gain levels, and get skills and become more powerful. Pre-toa 2 - 3 v 1's was possible.
#4 Eve online. Land control, full loot, skill based. The only draw back to it... extremely hard learning curve, and not very soloist oriented. But... still a blast.
Those are what most North Americans will tell you are the top 4. Beyond the top four it gets a little open.
EQ1 and EQ2 both heavily focused on PVE and thus.. the pvp is horribly unbalanced. WoW suffers from the same issues.
Lineage and most of the Asian grind games, while having pvp... just arent well done by NA standards. Poor group mechanics such as assisting, crowd control etc. Add onto that extremely harsh leveling requirements and gear requirements and your looking at time invested near that of a doctoral thesis.
Anyways... thats my thoughts. This is obviously a L2 forum, so its going to be pro-l2, just like if you go to a wow forum or daoc forum you would get the same.
Well, since its very difficult to "get there" then I'd have to say the PVP isn't the best.
I burned out at level 51..... IMO Lineage 1 PVP was better because it was no problem for anyone to get to level 46-49, which were all very viable levels for the castle sieges and what not. I had a good time sieging castles in L1.
So can't say how good or bad the PVP in L2 is...I never made it.... shame really that the grind had to be so horrific since that wasn't the case in L1.
I wonder how most MMOers define a PvP game. Personally I define it as killing or challenging wits of another player. SO would in my humble opinion Lineage II wouldnt be defined as a PvP game. If I have to spend 90% of my game time in PvE than I dont define the game as a PvP game. If I cant level through PvP nor gain equipment through PvP than I do not define the game as a PvP game. If all of your quests are PvE oriented, I dont define that game as a PvP game. I dont care if you throw some PvE in the game. Whilst killing a player a mob come and helps him, yea, i still consider that PvP.
I define Fury as a PvP game. Im not saying its a good one. Im just saying it is one. So back to the original question, is Lineage II even a PvP game at all? I say no...
Test it and you will find your answer.
Games played: Owerall ower 500+
MMORPG's played: SWG, ALL GW, WOW, L2, EVE, etc...
Ok.. to both of you.
Did you even attack someone while out hunting?
No? There!
If you attack ppl you meet when you are out hunting you can get pvp at any lvl
It's no like you can wait for everyone to come attack you first.
And the fine thing about L2 is that you can attack that other person anytime, anyhwere as long as you arent inside a town. Nothing stops you from trying to whop his ass.
When lightning strikes once, Venaja strikes twice!
PVP in lineage is based on bots.The one who have more and better bots will win.
Also casters and archers are overpowered compared with melee chars.
Well yeah I could run into purple monsters (or whatever higher level mobs are, I forget) and try to kill them too but the reason why I didnt do neither is because randomly killing people at low level is suicide. The penatlies for becoming red is huge, specially if you dont have a clan to back you up, so its really not a viable option. Which is probably why you dont get randomly attacked so often either.
Also I dont like randomly killing people for no reason. If I want to do that I would play an FPS game. Lineage 2 offers a meaningful and fun PvP (or so I heard) but it requires a year or so of leveling to reach there and that is just plain ridicilous.
My gaming blog
The lvling is just a challange, not for old ppl with fulltime jobs or noobs that Give up easily.
Good that this is the way you think of L2, i'm sure that Lineage 2 doesn't want any noobs/unpro gamers to play this game.
And playing with tactics always win.
Without Sacrifice.. There is no Victory
Kenshin
You realize of course... your losing people faster than your gaining them... and with out new people joining, all that work, time and effort... wont mean much when its just you left right?
The Community is pretty much the same as it was 2 years ago. Some ppl left others joined.
But 90% of those who still play aren't exactly noobs.
Also, with new updates comes new ppls in hordes. When C5 came the new server Franz was filled to it's limits and is still marked as "heavy" on the server selection screen every day.
And no.. Franz did not steal those players from the pre-existing servers.
Most came from private servers and some players vere brand new to the game.
And last.. the new community manger presented some stats on the game when she started in june (or when it was) and all numbers were pointing out that the population was higher then ever,
So, I wouldn't say game is dying.
Just because the game was not fo you and you left.
When lightning strikes once, Venaja strikes twice!
OMG guys.... There is an easy way.
I payed some money and got powerleveling my char from 20 to 65 in 5 days.
Its easy, all yuo need is just have some money.