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So VG needs a BIG overhaul, so what is SOE going to do?
Elikal
Member UncommonPosts: 7,912
After the recent shocking revelation from a Sigil dev about the MUCH more catastrophic reality of the making of VG, this puts an end once and for all on the question if VG needs an overhaul. Since it was hastily stitched together by amateurs in merely one year work under terrible circumstances, it can no longer be disputed some major parts of the game needs to be remade.
Things like quests, lore implementations, quest guidance, newbie zones, animations asf, the entire host of things many said often enough. The matter is now settled that there is NEED, the question to SOE I have, especially as a paying customer since launch is, WHAT do you plan to rework and add in the coming year 2008? I really ask this is to be revealed now.
See for details of the recent revelations:
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Comments
are you asking for $OE to add new game enhancements?
The plot thickens.
I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
"You have the right not to be killed"
Thats beacuse Vanguards sucks in its current state, so comparing it to the NGE is SWG is totally ridiculous.
I wont argue that Vanguard needs continued work and overhauling, but its pretty silly to quote that former dev's rant as fact. Even sillier to say things like "can no longer be disputed" and "the matter is now settled" based on that rant.
Personally, I do believe there is SOME truth in Teclisen's post. I also believe there are many perspectives on the entire situation, and he posted just one. He also sounded very bitter and jaded which I am sure he has a right to be. However, that leads to exaggeration and biased opinion which was clearly displayed.
Edit: Typo, yay.
The plot thickens.
Interesting theory.
I wont argue that Vanguard needs continued work and overhauling, but its pretty silly to quote that former dev's rant as fact. Even sillier to say things like "can no longer be disputed" and "the matter is now settled" based on that rant.
Personally, I do believe there is SOME truth in Teclisen's post. I also believe there are many perspectives on the entire situation, and he posted just one. He also sounded very bitter and jaded which I am sure he has a right to be. However, that leads to exaggeration and biased opinion which was clearly displayed.
Edit: Typo, yay.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but Teclisen's post is related to the time before SOE took over the game completely from Sigil about a year ago. SOE have remade several systems in the game during 2007 and have more in the pipeline so the work is ongoing. I don't see what the fuzz is all about.
Newbie zones, didn't they adress them in the talk about "trial island" some weeks backs.
And in the quite old producer's letter, I have cut some alot of it.
But what do you mean with "some major parts of the game needs to be remade." There's no reason to remake something solely based on that it was made by some specific person.
I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
"You have the right not to be killed"
Well you gave me a damn good laugh with this comment! lol
SOE hasn't taken one game, not a single one, and made it better. Every single game they own consistently loses subscribers. EQ2 has no where near the numbers it did at launch, and is very much a soloing ghost town. They absolutely ruined EQ and SWG. Why in the world do you think they have the ability to make VG better? Whoever is in charge at SOE knows not a single thing about gaming.
Well you gave me a damn good laugh with this comment! lol
Yeah, thanks for proving that some people are easily entertained.
But anyway it was a cool reply. Really... it was.
I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
"You have the right not to be killed"
Newbie zones, didn't they adress them in the talk about "trial island" some weeks backs.
And in the quite old producer's letter, I have cut some alot of it.
But what do you mean with "some major parts of the game needs to be remade." There's no reason to remake something solely based on that it was made by some specific person.
I feel too those are important things, especially quests. Many feel a bit "soulless" and like just dropped all over. Some are really good, but especially at the beginning I always feel tossed into the world and now "go and see for yourself".
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
I wont argue that Vanguard needs continued work and overhauling, but its pretty silly to quote that former dev's rant as fact. Even sillier to say things like "can no longer be disputed" and "the matter is now settled" based on that rant.
Personally, I do believe there is SOME truth in Teclisen's post. I also believe there are many perspectives on the entire situation, and he posted just one. He also sounded very bitter and jaded which I am sure he has a right to be. However, that leads to exaggeration and biased opinion which was clearly displayed.
Edit: Typo, yay.
Something to consider.Correct me if I'm wrong, but Teclisen's post is related to the time before SOE took over the game completely from Sigil about a year ago. SOE have remade several systems in the game during 2007 and have more in the pipeline so the work is ongoing. I don't see what the fuzz is all about.
When Sigil controlled the game, Dave Gilbertson/Hasium was in-charge of the direction of the game; but had a 100-man development staff.
When SOE bought Sigil, Dave Gilbertson/Hasium was still in-charge of the direction of the game; but had less than half his staff.
When SOE made layoffs in Vanguard's development staff a few months ago, Dave Gilbertson/Hasium was ousted, replaced with Thom who is split between Vanguard and Planetside (at least those two), and has less than a quarter of the original 100-man team working on Vanguard.
So yes, his post is related to a time before SOE took over the game completely from Sigil...but that's just a change of company logos on the development staff's t-shirts. They were still the exact same people. The 100% cotton threads didn't magically make them more competent at doing their job.
As for SOE remaking several systems...nope, everything that's gone in so far was already in production by the original Sigil. They haven't remade anything. That's why most of the stuff that did release like the raid content was so late; all the layoffs and such.
So really, if you choose to believe the story from that developer, know that the exact same bunch of people are working on the game now, except there's much less of them and they have new company t-shirts.
Newbie zones, didn't they adress them in the talk about "trial island" some weeks backs.
And in the quite old producer's letter, I have cut some alot of it.
But what do you mean with "some major parts of the game needs to be remade." There's no reason to remake something solely based on that it was made by some specific person.
I feel too those are important things, especially quests. Many feel a bit "soulless" and like just dropped all over. Some are really good, but especially at the beginning I always feel tossed into the world and now "go and see for yourself".
Isn't that the point of a sandboxy type game?
-----
The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.
I think they had planned to keep the player base in-the-loop through the "In the Works" page. Here's how well that went:
Note: While this page is meant to provide some insight as to what is 'in the works' for Vanguard, it should by no means be considered a complete list or schedule and will frequently be updated and/or changed. Thank you!
http://vgplayers.station.sony.com/inTheWorks.vm
VG is still a huge steaming pile of potential that lacks any direction whatsoever, in my opinion. Even if SOE had an answer, I doubt the current player base would want to hear it.
I'm starting to think that they should not keep anyone in the loop...
I mean c'mon when people start to whine about wowing the game with introduction of flying mounts?
Even though it is blatent I can think of the statement the human is stupid.
I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
"You have the right not to be killed"
Playing vanguard has been alot of fun for me lately. Its sad that a formaer dev wanted to go on about how broken the game is given that alot of people are enjoying it. I would like to ask if anyone knows at what point he became a former dev. I would like to know if he has been involved in the many improvements that have come as of late.
It could use some work i agree. I dont like the idea of "newbie zones." This game has a somewhat sandbox feel and id like it to stay that way. Asking this forum what SOE is going to do is kinda dumb because this isnt a place where SOE would respond.
Please dont lobby for this to be a carebear game. Im glad its hard. Im glad the crafting takes some real effort to get further along in. I cant even run the graphics on anything but low and i really could care less.
Stop trying to make this into a mainstream game and let it be the cool world that it allready is. This game isnt for everybody, but then again no game really is. This is the most fun ive had in a game since UO and AC. Leave it alone please.
Newbie zones, didn't they adress them in the talk about "trial island" some weeks backs.
And in the quite old producer's letter, I have cut some alot of it.
But what do you mean with "some major parts of the game needs to be remade." There's no reason to remake something solely based on that it was made by some specific person.
I feel too those are important things, especially quests. Many feel a bit "soulless" and like just dropped all over. Some are really good, but especially at the beginning I always feel tossed into the world and now "go and see for yourself".
I do think it is time for SOE to adress it and actually make out a set plan for the game. So these things don't have to be raised and discussed over and over. I mean this Teclasan post and the F13 interview.
I'm so broke. I can't even pay attention.
"You have the right not to be killed"
I'm starting to think that they should not keep anyone in the loop...
I mean c'mon when people start to whine about wowing the game with introduction of flying mounts?
Even though it is blatent I can think of the statement the human is stupid.
I totally agree. I imagine it's quite a tightrope for SOE trying to keep the players that are currently paying the bills, all the while, trying to create a game more inviting to casual gamers. I suspect this is the reason for the lack of communication as well. I mean, if SOE plans to impliment changes that the current player base would be happy with, I think they would let it fly on the official forums almost daily. However, if they think the current player base will be upset with the "vision", then they probably would want to keep that quiet until they can count on $$$ from someone else.
Elikal has a valid question regarding the direction of the game, but be prepared for the reply, because it will likely not be what you had visioned for the future of VG. It has happened before following the producers letter, the podcast, and again after the warcry interview. If you don't see the pattern already, it will be made official in an upcoming media release. Worst case scenario is you find out about it when it's patched in. But what company would treat their customers like that?
There still to busy fixing stuff like this. http://forums.station.sony.com/vg/posts/list.m?topic_id=25187
No time to worry about overhauling the game while it's still not running properly.
Lore implementation is in game already and is much more obvious than anything else. Quest guidance I hope will never be added. That's where all the linearity and stupidity in current mmorps are comnig from. I could agree on animations and helmets tho.
REALITY CHECK
Do you remember Thoms producers letter that hit the scene about 2 months ago? I doubt they are yearning to release any more of those considering the hostility that greeted that one.I think they had planned to keep the player base in-the-loop through the "In the Works" page. Here's how well that went:
http://vgplayers.station.sony.com/inTheWorks.vm
VG is still a huge steaming pile of potential that lacks any direction whatsoever, in my opinion. Even if SOE had an answer, I doubt the current player base would want to hear it.
Note: While this page is meant to provide some insight as to what is 'in the works' for Vanguard, it should by no means be considered a complete list or schedule and will frequently be updated and/or changed. Thank you!
Sigh, I see your point. I find it very sad how from the very beginning ALL things were greeted with hatered that devs said about changes. There is a handfull of Vanboiz who worship Brads drug-twisted "vision" like a religion. I dont understand their ideal as less as teenagers cutting themselves in their arms for fun. They adamantly fight against ANYTHING that brings more fun and takes out tedium. Why they fight against fun so much is beyond me, and it is WAY outside the range of things I can understand in a variety of tastes. Like the "meaningful travel" - myth. Its just IMPOSSIBLE, but people demand it and repeat this myth, which is just a meaningless and empty phrase.
Sorry to be so harsh about this, but IMO those people have done a great deal of damage giving the false impression the game was mostly right from day one.
There was a time when companies and players could talk about things openly and fair. Then I watched the SWG forums go down in flame. I saw how reason and fair debate was lost to a mob of frenzy. No matter how wrong we thought NGE was, it was a loss of all ways of fair and polite way of conversing with one another. It was a moment of turning. Since then flaming, aggro talk and yelling EVERYTHING down has ruled the day.
Yes, its no wonder companies STOPPED talking to forum users about their plans, you are right, alas. The many reasonable forums still have were just silenced in the waves and waves or hate and flame and aggression. What a sad turn. I hope SOE changes the game and just stays away from forum bitches, they are as few as they are vocal. They just dont listen to reason and successfully destroyed all public environments where gamers and devs could talk.
But still. Something inside me defies to give up to the yellers and flamers and haters, and I want to see dialogue, talk, conversation and reason. Reason for men? A hilarious thing I know I know.
I think people should get it into their head that Brad and his selected few created a myth they knew it was just a cheap way to attract some kind of people. Brad & Co. created this "hardcore myth" which VG never was really supposed to be, but they used it to connect to the EQ1 myth, the "glamour" people feel in recalling the "good old days", which like ALL good old days usually are seen much through the pink glasses. It would be quite decend of Brad to once admit the very thing was nothing but a nice catchphrase which MUCH backfired. Having been in beta I vividly recall how EVERY critic was YELLED down by fans and the devs did ZERO to help them, as would have been their responsibiliy! ALL the problems VG has NOW where KNOWN, we few critical beta testers SAID SO, but we were yelled down, still are, and SIgil did not listen or respond at all. They created this hardcore myth, which they KNEW it could never be, and now they set this game into a perception what its supposed to be which it never was and never CAN be! They just FED those unrealistic expectations, and I really would like Brad or any write some clarification open letter to admit "hey sorry for misleading you, there aint no Eq1 remade, cause fashion changed and gaming isnt like 1999".
To say it brutally clear: VG can only be safed from shutting down by getting RID of those harcore yellers who want to turn back the wheel of time 10 years ONCE AND FOR ALL.
People don't ask questions to get answers - they ask questions to show how smart they are. - Dogbert
Thats to strange i soloed both the unicorn and the shadowhound quest on my ranger , except for a few key parts and never had one problem but seems like they fixed it if you read the last few posts , but how the heck did it get borked in the first place cause it sure wasnt like that when i did those quests
Thats to strange i soloed both the unicorn and the shadowhound quest on my ranger , except for a few key parts and never had one problem but seems like they fixed it if you read the last few posts , but how the heck did it get borked in the first place cause it sure wasnt like that when i did those quests
That seems to be one of the major problems with the game and one of the reason it takes them so long to fix it. Patching things always finds a way to screw something that wasnt broken.
Yeah *g* Thats a general SOE problem
Thats to strange i soloed both the unicorn and the shadowhound quest on my ranger , except for a few key parts and never had one problem but seems like they fixed it if you read the last few posts , but how the heck did it get borked in the first place cause it sure wasnt like that when i did those quests
That seems to be one of the major problems with the game and one of the reason it takes them so long to fix it. Patching things always finds a way to screw something that wasnt broken.
Well i hear you there caldis , but am afraid its not just something that happens in vangaurd. Iive seen the same things in WOW for example when i was doing the grand marshal grind twice blizzard intruduced bugs that totally affected my rogue and my ability to have fun in there BG,s
The first one was a bug that affected you when you got feared and you would run around in a feared state than boom you would fall through the earth .This was only in AB it didnt effect you in any of there other bg,s but it took blizzard quite awell to fix that i played about 1 1/2 months with that little bug. so for 1 1/2 months i fell through the world more in one day in wow than i have in the whole year ive played vanguard now multiply thet one day times well say 50 days it took them to fix that
The second bug was even worse started after one of blizzards patches you would be fighting someone and all your abilities would lock up and not work and the only way to get them to start working again was to de- target and than reselect your target . well as a rogue i lost all my combo points at that time in the game for de-targeting someone so yes it was game beaking for me . took blizzard about 3 months to fix that in fact they didnt even bother till there next big patch because it didnt effect everyone, it only effected warriors and rogues in pvp so no big deal they can't quit playing they will lose all there rank well get it next patch fuck em
So i guess because i dont pretend that vanguard is the only game ive ever seen bugs in its alot easier for me to enjoy it