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For the reviewers ...
olepi
Member EpicPosts: 3,071
I've seen lots of reviews on this forum, and also on other websites, where someone reviews the game but leaves out whole areas of the game. So here are some thoughts on how to review the game:
- first, divide the game into "on ship" and "off ship". Saying something like the gameplay is boring is of no value; saying that "on ship" gameplay is too slow, or "off ship" gameplay is too clunky does have value. One reviewer said the "graphics are not up to snuff", which has no value at all.
- second, the game is mostly centered around PvP and group encounters. If all you have done is solo the starter instance, then you have not played the game, and should not review it. Get into a large group (6 if possible), and go after some high ranking convoys. It is a thrill to have 6 lvl 20's knock off two lvl 50 NPC's!
- join a Society, the game is oriented towards cooperative play. Just like above, if all you have done is solo around, and maybe group a bit, you have not really played the game. Once you get into a Society (guild) and know the players, their ships, and their capabilities, you can plan a strategy for success.
- level up to at least 20 or so before trying to review the game. I saw one review where the screenshots showed a starter lvl 1 ship with no mods on it. Buy a higher level ship, outfit it with some mods, and you will care about whether you lose it. Also, different ships have greatly different characteristics: turning rate for example. The starter ships are junk, and handle poorly; don''t think the whole game is like that.
- for the avatar (or "off ship") combat, level to 20 or so and pick up some skills. Do some of the quests, learn to grapple and board other ships, before you review the game. I saw one review where the screenshot showed a lvl 1 pirate with no skills at all: of course it is boring fighting with that character! That's like playing WoW with the starter weapon, and then complaining that the weaponry in WoW is boring.
- for the economy and crafting, you need to build some structures, sell on the AH, and get a feel for what you can make in how much time, and where you can sell it for how much. Since it takes days to bank and use your labor, you need to do this for several days at least. Better still, get into a Society and become a part of a production chain. When people are counting on you to get that load of hemp from Tampa all the way back to Bartica, and you have several PvP zones to avoid, and NPC pirates to outrun, the economic game starts to make sense and be fun!
Summary: if you have a lvl 1 ship, no skills, have not grouped, are not part of a Society, haven't PvP'd, and haven't spent days using your labor, you haven't really played the game and probably should not review it.
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2025: 48 years on the Net.
Comments
I hate to say it, but if you have to play to level 20 (no idea how long that is) and find a good group before you can really 'get a feel' for this game, then it's probably seriously lacking in some areas. WoW or LOTRO pull you in right in the newbie instance and give you a feel for both standard gameplay and the world as a whole right from the starter instance - sure you might not be 'uuber' with the WoW starter weapon or skills, but at least you have a flavor for playstyle, and I'd say it's still exciting - especially LOTRO. The newbie levels are some of the best I've ever encountered there.
I'm interested in trying Pirates, but I'll wait a few months for a free trial - $50 for the box and then $15 a month is priced way too high for what looks like a forced grouping, PvP centric game - especially when games like LOTRO are only $10 a month.
When scary things get scared, that's bad...
I have to say I don't really agree.
While it's true that PotBS really does require more "seasoning" and especially grouping and guilding to really play effectively, this in itself is a barrier to entry, as it were, and merits noting in reviews. The fact that the game is really not that user-friendly (and at this stage, it isn't that non-beta-participant friendly) is an important component of any review of the game. It's always a bad call to say "don't even think about your opinion of the game until you have played it a week and are level 20, have joined an active guild and spent a lot of time doing X". That's just lame, imo.
Well part of the problem with reviewing PotBS (and the OP did touch on this) is that it's really a tale of two games.
By that I mean that there's the initial starter zones (mostly PvE) where you learn to sail, make some levels, follow the storyline and generally play solo unless you've created a character specificaly to join a society and fill a need economicaly.
But after that point, there comes the "real" game. By that I mean that after a certain point (around level, oh I don't know, maybe 15'ish +) you start getting into zones where PvP is the focus of the game, really almost to the exclusion of anything else. The economy exists only to feed PvP/RvR. There's nothing to spend money on other than new ships, new productions lines etc. So making a fat pile of cash and banking it really doesn't accomplish anything from either a roleplaying or game mechanics standpoint.
Really, it's somewhat deceiving early on in that you're feeling like maybe you can solo, maybe you can be a merchant prince etc. and then you run into the *only* goal of the game which is Nation based and guild/society based map domination and RvR. It's a very different play experience from that point on than it was initially. Not better, not worse.. I'm not qualified to tell other people what they'll enjoy and what they won't. But it's just very different. If you're not prepared to PvP hard and exclusivley then this game is really going to take you from the blind side and shock you with how PvP-centric it is. I mean it's really an understatement to even say it's PvP-centric as that almost hints that there's something else to do. There's really not. If you're not actively fighting in PvP then you're working an invisible economy/crafting system for the benefit of PvP.
So it's not unreasonable to ask that players level significantly before posting reviews of *this* particular game. Some games are easy to judge from very early on, but this is not one of them. What you get at 5th level is NOTHING like what you'll get at 25th.
then it's not unreasonable for players to quit well before they reach the "fun levels"
hehehe Well that depends on your definition of fun I suppose.
I really enjoyed my first few weeks of play in the lowbie zones where I was solo'ing and doing my own thing. It was only after experiencing that shock I mentioned regarding the RvR focus of this game that I realized that the *real* game wasn't for me. Even so, I tried to stay PvE and enjoy the aspect of the game which did appeal to me until the repetitive nature of the PvE missions and the truly awful AI started to sink in. At that point, with a downward spiral of enjoyment in the PvE part of the game and frustration about being forced to group to partake of the PvP part I realized that it just wasn't going to be what I'd hoped and I moved on.
There are lots of goals for lots of different players though. Clearly there's a lot of players who love the RvR and PvP combat which can be quite good when balanced well. The problem on that front is that it was rarely balanced well (in my experience) in that one side or the other tends to bring overwhelming firepower and force a "Kobyashi Maru" type character test of the hopeless situation on you either for or against. hehehe
But again, individual mileage does vary. The overall point, in trying to stay on topic, is simply that it's not easy to review PotBS until you've had some exerience with the *real* game.. which doesn't start until you've leveled a bit.
then it's not unreasonable for players to quit well before they reach the "fun levels"
Yes, and I think this can be a problem. Kind of the opposite of LoTRO type play. In LoTRO, you kill wolves and bears at level 1, 5, 10, 20, ... just bigger wolves each time. People get bored of that by level 20, and complain. In LoTRO, you start off running at 5mph, and at level 20 you still run 5mph.In PoTBS, you start off sailing at 5mph, but by level 8 you should be able to literally sail rings around the starter ship. By level 20, you have lots of ships to choose from, and they have dramatically different capabilities. People start off in the starter ship, think that is all there is (like in other games), and get bored.
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2025: 48 years on the Net.
Ofc any professional reviewer should play the game long enough to see it all, and make a balanced review. But from non-professional reviewer, a review telling something like "I played the game 5 hours, and didn't have fun. Combat sucked, and it was generally boring" is already a good review (altough one should make longer and a bit more detailed description).
And another thing for the reviewers.......PotBS is almost a pure sandbox MMO. How many years have been since one of those got reviewied?
You might wanna see PotBS as a world then a game. Same as in EVE. Noone will hold your hand and tell you of everything. There is so much more to explore.
Agreed O, and in fact I'll use "forced grouping" as an example. Now, sadly a few of the posters here will quickly state "it's not forced grouping"...then post to someone not liking the game "it's only fun if you group"...well, that's forced grouping. I suppose you could say it's not "forced monitor" as well, since technically I could play the game without it...but it wouldn't be much fun.
If you really believe grouping is where the fun begins, then let the devs know that and hopefully they'll build on it. Include early missions that require a group in order to advance, even if it's just a single mission...and make the grouping UI more prominent and user friendly.
My game, DDO, gets a lot of heat for being "group driven" or "forced grouping"...so what? That's the game!!! If you don't want grouping, there's a million solo friendly games out there, but thankfully DDO has continued to focus on grouping and uses a 3rd level mission requiring a group to access like 99% of the content of the game.
here we go again...
no, it's not.
I have to use the car analogy
If I want to buy a new car, say a 4x4, then it is not enough just to see it, just to sit it in, just to drive it on the parking lot. That might be enough to say you don't like it, but has really nothing to do with the car itself. If you want to actually review the car, you need to drive on the highway, off-road, check the mileage over time, high speed, low speed, turn rate, etc, etc.
So a first impression:
i don't like that car because it is red and I like blue <-- not a review, just a random personal impression.
I don;t like the car because it drinks too much gas, is noisy on the highway, not that good off-road, etc, <- a real review.
If you don't play and level some, get a better ship, do some grouping and PvP, build up an economy, etc, then you are saying the game is boring because it is red, and you like blue
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2025: 48 years on the Net.
Well, maybe the key would be to have some introductory missions at low level that introduce the PvP in a meaningful way as well as grouping then. Either way, the experience when you start the game shouldn't be entirely different than the one you have a month later...let alone substantially less enjoyable. IMO, that's a fairly unhealthy situation for a new game especially.
It's not a sandbox game. A sandbox game is where you, or your PA, can carve out a space in the sandbox and make it their own. You can't do that in PotBS. You are a member of a faction, and you play a map game of port flips until someone "wins" and then the map resets. That isn't a sandbox, it's a factional RvR map game.
EVE is a sandbox because you can do whatever you want. You are not tied to other players unless you want to be (there are many fine solo producers in EVE who are some of the top mercantilists in the game for example), a PA can "take over" space for its own (not for a faction) and for a long period of time (not until a map reset). It just is a completely different kind of game.
I have never been forced into a group. I like the solo play and the group play...but i don't see forced grouping as an issue.