Glider is solely intended for use in WoW, and is marketed and SOLD to WoW users. Therefore it is profiting from Blizzards' intellectual property.
Doubtful, they are not profitting from Blizzard's intellectual property. This is just a program that mashes the keys for you in a highly intelligent fashion. In no way does Glider stomp on Blizzard's property.
Let's see, analogy time, You buy a PSP, and you take it home and crack the OS on it to allow Homebrew games. Could sony come back and sue you for manipulating their product? THat's prolly not a good one.
If you bought a Lawnmower and equipped it with a fully functional AI device that could mow the yard for you, could the owners of the lawn mower sue you for tampering with their product and making life easier when everyone else has to suffer with mowing the lawn the hard way?
See, in the botting world, there are Intrusive bots and non-intrusive bots. Glider falls under the category of non-intrusive because the only hooks in the game are receive hooks. Glider has API hooks into WOW to find out where it's at in the world and what's around it, nothing else. On the transmit side? Glider just hooks into the Keyboard API. That's it. So Blizzard owns patents on Keyboard API's now? LOL Again, Blizzard will fail miserably again. Just look at the history of Blizzard suing Glider, Blizzard Suing Mercury, etc. This time around is no different. Blizzard doesn't have a leg to stand on in this legal arena. THey are hoping with their deep pockets that they will find a judge stupid enough to file an injunction against Glider. If Blizzard does win this case (which they won't), it will be because of a stupid Judge and Mercury will just get it overthrown.
I think you guys are missing the real point here. Blizzard has tried to sue mmoglider.com before and failed. This is going to be another time. How they can say that mmoglider.com infringes on Blizzard's copyright is nonsense.
As part of its evasion tactics Glider itself copies the game into RAM. So Gilder breaks copyright when it does that. That's some creative thinking on someones part and they deserve a big cookie for it!
So, by me running Avast, and Avast copies itself into ram as well, Avast scans Blizzards files to make sure they are not infected. This would break the rules too. Any program you load into memory would be a threat.
Of course Glider loads itself into RAM. All programs do. What is your point man! Glider only hooks into the Windows Keyboard API, it does not manipulate Blizzard's programs at all. The only thing Glider does to WoW, is listen for where it's at in the world and pushes the appropriate button for you. What would be the difference in building a physical keyboard overlay hooked up to a camera that looks at the screen and pushes the actual keyboard buttons? WOuld that be an infringement of Blizzard's program as well?
Glider is solely intended for use in WoW, and is marketed and SOLD to WoW users. Therefore it is profiting from Blizzards' intellectual property.
Doubtful, they are not profitting from Blizzard's intellectual property.
The bot is sold, correct? Would the bot be sold if there was no WoW for it to be sold for? No. Is the bot aimed at every and any game out there? No, only WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Is the bot marketed at customers of games everywhere? No, only for customers of WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Therefore, if there was no WoW, there would be no Glider, and there would be no money made by Glider. So, yes. Glider profits from Blizzards' IP.
Glider is solely intended for use in WoW, and is marketed and SOLD to WoW users. Therefore it is profiting from Blizzards' intellectual property.
Doubtful, they are not profitting from Blizzard's intellectual property.
The bot is sold, correct? Would the bot be sold if there was no WoW for it to be sold for? No. Is the bot aimed at every and any game out there? No, only WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Is the bot marketed at customers of games everywhere? No, only for customers of WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Therefore, if there was no WoW, there would be no Glider, and there would be no money made by Glider. So, yes. Glider profits from Blizzards' IP.
So If I made a self-help video about how to use Microsoft Office 2007, would I be infringing off Microsoft? If there were no Microsoft Office, there would be no self-help book for Microsoft Office? According to your statements, I can't write a self-help book on anything without infringing on copyrights. Because I would be making money off Microsoft's product indirectly. So this makes your statement moot.
Glider is solely intended for use in WoW, and is marketed and SOLD to WoW users. Therefore it is profiting from Blizzards' intellectual property.
Doubtful, they are not profitting from Blizzard's intellectual property.
The bot is sold, correct? Would the bot be sold if there was no WoW for it to be sold for? No. Is the bot aimed at every and any game out there? No, only WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Is the bot marketed at customers of games everywhere? No, only for customers of WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Therefore, if there was no WoW, there would be no Glider, and there would be no money made by Glider. So, yes. Glider profits from Blizzards' IP.
So If I made a self-help video about how to use Microsoft Office 2007, would I be infringing off Microsoft? If there were no Microsoft Office, there would be no self-help book for Microsoft Office? According to your statements, I can't write a self-help book on anything without infringing on copyrights. Because I would be making money off Microsoft's product indirectly. So this makes your statement moot.
That self-help book doesn't run Office or Windows for you. That self help book doesn't need to be attached to Office or Windows to work.Glider plays WoW for you. Glider has to be attached to WoW to work. Therefore, your point is moot.
Glider is solely intended for use in WoW, and is marketed and SOLD to WoW users. Therefore it is profiting from Blizzards' intellectual property.
Doubtful, they are not profitting from Blizzard's intellectual property.
The bot is sold, correct? Would the bot be sold if there was no WoW for it to be sold for? No. Is the bot aimed at every and any game out there? No, only WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Is the bot marketed at customers of games everywhere? No, only for customers of WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Therefore, if there was no WoW, there would be no Glider, and there would be no money made by Glider. So, yes. Glider profits from Blizzards' IP.
So If I made a self-help video about how to use Microsoft Office 2007, would I be infringing off Microsoft? If there were no Microsoft Office, there would be no self-help book for Microsoft Office? According to your statements, I can't write a self-help book on anything without infringing on copyrights. Because I would be making money off Microsoft's product indirectly. So this makes your statement moot.
That self-help book doesn't run Office or Windows for you. That self help book doesn't need to be attached to Office or Windows to work.Glider plays WoW for you. Glider has to be attached to WoW to work. Therefore, your point is moot.
hahaha, I doubt that. Let's see, Plugins, Macros, etc all come with those self help books. So yea, if Blizzard wins this (again, which they won't), all self-help computer books would be infringing on copyrights.
I.e.: Screenshots, Flash videos of how to do things in steps, etc.
It's going to be interesting to see the out come of this.
Never mind what it is doing to the game, try looking at it from a different point of view, thay (Blizz) are going after the man who makes it and not the people who use it.
Thats like sueing ford because someone drove over your foot in one of there cars.
Surley if you make a piece of software and sell it thats not illegal it only becomes illegal IF the person you sold it to uses it knowing to do so is illegal.
for example, if i was to breed Pitbulls and sell you a pupp that you later used for illegal dogfighting that means you are in the wrong and not me for selling you the pup in the first place.
I kind of hope this guy wins his case, i think blizz are going after the wrong person here.
Of course Glider loads itself into RAM. All programs do. What is your point man! Glider only hooks into the Windows Keyboard API, it does not manipulate Blizzard's programs at all. The only thing Glider does to WoW, is listen for where it's at in the world and pushes the appropriate button for you. What would be the difference in building a physical keyboard overlay hooked up to a camera that looks at the screen and pushes the actual keyboard buttons? WOuld that be an infringement of Blizzard's program as well?
The "loading of the program into RAM" is a very key point. If copyright is construed such that loading a program into RAM is a copyright violation (and this has been tried before) then every time you run a program, you're violating copyright. This means that computing would come to a total halt due to copyright restrictions, Now, I wouldn't this sort of model past some Ferengi assholes like the RIAA for example, but it's not going to last long in the real world where digital copying is so ubiquitous such that charging people to breathe air would be about as impossible to enforce. Such a model would effectively kill the software industry overnight.
So that's is not an option.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
I think you guys are missing the real point here. Blizzard has tried to sue mmoglider.com before and failed. This is going to be another time. How they can say that mmoglider.com infringes on Blizzard's copyright is nonsense.
As part of its evasion tactics Glider itself copies the game into RAM. So Gilder breaks copyright when it does that. That's some creative thinking on someones part and they deserve a big cookie for it!
So, by me running Avast, and Avast copies itself into ram as well, Avast scans Blizzards files to make sure they are not infected. This would break the rules too. Any program you load into memory would be a threat.
Of course Glider loads itself into RAM. All programs do. What is your point man! Glider only hooks into the Windows Keyboard API, it does not manipulate Blizzard's programs at all. The only thing Glider does to WoW, is listen for where it's at in the world and pushes the appropriate button for you. What would be the difference in building a physical keyboard overlay hooked up to a camera that looks at the screen and pushes the actual keyboard buttons? WOuld that be an infringement of Blizzard's program as well?
No Glider loads itself AND WoW onto your computers RAM and thus "copies" that which is covered by copyright. It's up to Blizzard to decide what infringes on their copyright and what doesn't; that's the great thing about copyright.
...And if you can build a machine that can look at a monitor, recognize what it sees and perform the correct functions within the time it takes to adequately play WoW - you have much more important things to do with your life! Please for all MANKIND I ask you to stop playing WoW! I am sure that blizzard employees and sharholders agree with me! You deserve a lifetime suppy of big cookies for building a machine that can do that!
"The liberties and resulting economic prosperity that YOU take for granted were granted by those "dead guys"
Of course Glider loads itself into RAM. All programs do. What is your point man! Glider only hooks into the Windows Keyboard API, it does not manipulate Blizzard's programs at all. The only thing Glider does to WoW, is listen for where it's at in the world and pushes the appropriate button for you. What would be the difference in building a physical keyboard overlay hooked up to a camera that looks at the screen and pushes the actual keyboard buttons? WOuld that be an infringement of Blizzard's program as well?
The "loading of the program into RAM" is a very key point. If copyright is construed such that loading a program into RAM is a copyright violation (and this has been tried before) then every time you run a program, you're violating copyright. This means that computing would come to a total halt due to copyright restrictions, Now, I wouldn't this sort of model past some Ferengi assholes like the RIAA for example, but it's not going to last long in the real world where digital copying is so ubiquitous such that charging people to breathe air would be about as impossible to enforce. Such a model would effectively kill the software industry overnight.
So that's is not an option.
Most programs load themselves into RAM. Like WoW loads itself into RAM unless glider is operating then Glider loads it. If WoW loads itself into RAM then Blizzards copyright is intact. If Glider loads WoW then it is broken by Glider.
"The liberties and resulting economic prosperity that YOU take for granted were granted by those "dead guys"
A lot of you are missing the point. Blizzard OWNS WoW and everything in it. You agreed to that when you clicked on the I Agree button after scrolling down and not reading the EULA. You are paying Blizzard to play the game and you are, for lack of a better word, leasing your account(s). If at any time you decide you want to do something against the EULA you risk losing access because you broke Blizzard's "law" and therefore they can punish you by suspension, ban, etc.
So someone who is making a living by helping people violate that AND don't forget they can probably show how it hurts other innocent customers which in turn hurts Blizzards business is asking for trouble. Just because you get away with something for a while, even though you know it's wrong, doesn't mean you aren't going to get caught sooner or later. Blizzard has DEEP pockets and that means big fancy law firms with eight names on the sign that live for squashing people's nuts and billing $1200/hr for the privilege.
If I remember correctly, doesn't Wow Glider use a hacked WoW executable in order to facilitate its reading of the WoW memory locations and its avoidance of Blizzards warden program.
That is where the copyright infringement comes from. Glider took the actual Wow executable, hacked it, embedded it into their bot, and then SOLD it as their own comercial product.
I can give you a long list of professions and services that are not so morally correct, but people make a legal living through them.. so the point is?
Our own stance on bots in games, morally correct or not by where we are at in our lives in terms of moral development, this really seems to muddy the argument of who's in the wrong. Like people have said.. the issue is a third party application loading the primary software into RAM, and there have been district court rulings in the past that continue to uphold the judgment that this is infact infringement of the Copyright Act by the user. I think that's where it gets interesting because the defendant claims that there is not sufficient grounds on all 5 points of the Copyright Act that must prove the party in the wrong to hold him liable for anything.
If I remember correctly, doesn't Wow Glider use a hacked WoW executable in order to facilitate its reading of the WoW memory locations and its avoidance of Blizzards warden program. That is where the copyright infringement comes from. Glider took the actual Wow executable, hacked it, embedded it into their bot, and then SOLD it as their own comercial product.
I can tell from this post that you know nothing of programming. LOL
Gishgeron, An items worth equals the amount of time a gamer spends ATK to get the gold needed to buy the item. If players can buy the gold with no time spent then the items cost will increase to match it. If players can use a bot to collect the gold while they themselves are at work or asleep the items cost will increase to match it. So yes taking botters and gold sellers out will help. WoW does infact have an economy - it is a kind of planned economy and not the open market economy you are thinking of. I agree it is not a great economy that the real world should adopt, but for the purposes of a MMORPG which is supposed to be played for fun it does ok.
Wow, you're so damn wrong. Botters usually farm items to sell to get gold. Because my server is large there is a good number of botters, I've seen them in specific farming areas. When you go on the AH, all the prices are extremely low because you've got about 8 botters competing with each other to sell their shyte for gold they need for a mount or buying arena points.
If you take botters out of the game, there will be less supply. Less supply = More Demand = Higher Gold Price.
I do think botting really hurts the game but I don't think Blizzard should win this.. he has every right to create a bot and sell it..it's his costumers that decide to actually use it.
World of Warcraft is a proof that MMORPG quality should affect schedule/budget and not the other way around.
Most of the guys posting in here seem to have no idea of how important it is for MDY to win this thing.
It is not about "omg stop botters plx they inflate the economy on my server wtf11", it's not about "botters suck in real life lolz", it's not even about your so beloved World of Warcraft.
If Blizzard wins this with their specific argumentation and construction of copyright, it may easily cause an assload of similar cases and in a manner of speaking shutdown 3rd party software development.
Some food for thought: just imagine Microsoft to hop on that same bandwagon right after.
I find it interesting how Blizzard will chase after this guy for writing the program, when he's not the one committing the actual offense of using it.
This looks like it could go the way of BitTorrent sites: They provide a means of accessing the illegal content, but they aren't infringing copywrite as the content isn't stored in his "RAM" as the Blizzard lawyers claim...hope he gets a smart laywer.
-hacking the wow.exe or hooking up to it in any way
-messing around with any files or data in the wow folder
-altering, modifying or in any way fiddling around with the games values in the memory (like other bots did in the past)
-sending back false data to the server
-etc.
MMOGlider does only READ memory content used by your OS and responds with keystrokes.
Now you all can moan any way you like, but this is not about if botting is unethical, cheating or if botters ruin your personal gaming experience in WoW.
If Blizzard gets through with only READING the memory of an OS is a violation of copyright, alot of developers can pack their bags. With their latest change in their Warden, Blizzard is already pushing the limits another time, now on the next level trying to establish their interpretation of copyright.
More than protecting a video game from botters, this is rather about protecting the freedom of development and stopping a multimillion juggernaut from twisting the law to their likes.
Yes, but most third party programs are free and not sold.
The copyright litmus test is about whether you make money from it. Obviously if you make a third party program that is an add on or useful to the original companies customers, no one minds, not until you sell it with out permission that is.
Without profit it is pretty hard to prove copyright infringement, although they do seem to be getting better at it.
Oh and most instructional books will have permission and acknowlegde the license, just have a look inside any of the for Dummies books.
If it would be that easy and just about the commercial aspect, any gaming company could in the broader sense i.e. charge Corel for selling a programm that takes an ingame screenshot from your clipboard.
For everyones interest: MMOGlider is not -hacking the wow.exe or hooking up to it in any way -messing around with any files or data in the wow folder -altering, modifying or in any way fiddling around with the games values in the memory (like other bots did in the past) -sending back false data to the server -etc. MMOGlider does only READ memory content used by your OS and responds with keystrokes. Now you all can moan any way you like, but this is not about if botting is unethical, cheating or if botters ruin your personal gaming experience in WoW. If Blizzard gets through with only READING the memory of an OS is a violation of copyright, alot of developers can pack their bags. With their latest change in their Warden, Blizzard is already pushing the limits another time, now on the next level trying to establish their interpretation of copyright. More than protecting a video game from botters, this is rather about protecting the freedom of development and stopping a multimillion juggernaut from twisting the law to their likes.
I believe Volgore said what needed to be said, so really Volgore ended this discussion. Kudos to you Volgore for saying it Big Bird style.
Followed this one for a while. The copying into memory is an interesting twist. I hear the latest version of glider does not use a launcher I wonder if this is why? I can't see how that argument would fly to be honest. The precedent it would set would allow microsoft to shut down numerous competitors.
Of course I wonder what Blizzard will do about the open source bot that is superior in many ways?
Comments
Doubtful, they are not profitting from Blizzard's intellectual property. This is just a program that mashes the keys for you in a highly intelligent fashion. In no way does Glider stomp on Blizzard's property.
Let's see, analogy time, You buy a PSP, and you take it home and crack the OS on it to allow Homebrew games. Could sony come back and sue you for manipulating their product? THat's prolly not a good one.
If you bought a Lawnmower and equipped it with a fully functional AI device that could mow the yard for you, could the owners of the lawn mower sue you for tampering with their product and making life easier when everyone else has to suffer with mowing the lawn the hard way?
See, in the botting world, there are Intrusive bots and non-intrusive bots. Glider falls under the category of non-intrusive because the only hooks in the game are receive hooks. Glider has API hooks into WOW to find out where it's at in the world and what's around it, nothing else. On the transmit side? Glider just hooks into the Keyboard API. That's it. So Blizzard owns patents on Keyboard API's now? LOL Again, Blizzard will fail miserably again. Just look at the history of Blizzard suing Glider, Blizzard Suing Mercury, etc. This time around is no different. Blizzard doesn't have a leg to stand on in this legal arena. THey are hoping with their deep pockets that they will find a judge stupid enough to file an injunction against Glider. If Blizzard does win this case (which they won't), it will be because of a stupid Judge and Mercury will just get it overthrown.
So, by me running Avast, and Avast copies itself into ram as well, Avast scans Blizzards files to make sure they are not infected. This would break the rules too. Any program you load into memory would be a threat.
Of course Glider loads itself into RAM. All programs do. What is your point man! Glider only hooks into the Windows Keyboard API, it does not manipulate Blizzard's programs at all. The only thing Glider does to WoW, is listen for where it's at in the world and pushes the appropriate button for you. What would be the difference in building a physical keyboard overlay hooked up to a camera that looks at the screen and pushes the actual keyboard buttons? WOuld that be an infringement of Blizzard's program as well?
Doubtful, they are not profitting from Blizzard's intellectual property.
The bot is sold, correct? Would the bot be sold if there was no WoW for it to be sold for? No. Is the bot aimed at every and any game out there? No, only WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Is the bot marketed at customers of games everywhere? No, only for customers of WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Therefore, if there was no WoW, there would be no Glider, and there would be no money made by Glider. So, yes. Glider profits from Blizzards' IP.
Doubtful, they are not profitting from Blizzard's intellectual property.
The bot is sold, correct? Would the bot be sold if there was no WoW for it to be sold for? No. Is the bot aimed at every and any game out there? No, only WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Is the bot marketed at customers of games everywhere? No, only for customers of WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Therefore, if there was no WoW, there would be no Glider, and there would be no money made by Glider. So, yes. Glider profits from Blizzards' IP.
So If I made a self-help video about how to use Microsoft Office 2007, would I be infringing off Microsoft? If there were no Microsoft Office, there would be no self-help book for Microsoft Office? According to your statements, I can't write a self-help book on anything without infringing on copyrights. Because I would be making money off Microsoft's product indirectly. So this makes your statement moot.
Doubtful, they are not profitting from Blizzard's intellectual property.
The bot is sold, correct? Would the bot be sold if there was no WoW for it to be sold for? No. Is the bot aimed at every and any game out there? No, only WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Is the bot marketed at customers of games everywhere? No, only for customers of WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Therefore, if there was no WoW, there would be no Glider, and there would be no money made by Glider. So, yes. Glider profits from Blizzards' IP.
So If I made a self-help video about how to use Microsoft Office 2007, would I be infringing off Microsoft? If there were no Microsoft Office, there would be no self-help book for Microsoft Office? According to your statements, I can't write a self-help book on anything without infringing on copyrights. Because I would be making money off Microsoft's product indirectly. So this makes your statement moot.
That self-help book doesn't run Office or Windows for you. That self help book doesn't need to be attached to Office or Windows to work.Glider plays WoW for you. Glider has to be attached to WoW to work. Therefore, your point is moot.
Doubtful, they are not profitting from Blizzard's intellectual property.
The bot is sold, correct? Would the bot be sold if there was no WoW for it to be sold for? No. Is the bot aimed at every and any game out there? No, only WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Is the bot marketed at customers of games everywhere? No, only for customers of WoW, which is Blizzards' IP. Therefore, if there was no WoW, there would be no Glider, and there would be no money made by Glider. So, yes. Glider profits from Blizzards' IP.
So If I made a self-help video about how to use Microsoft Office 2007, would I be infringing off Microsoft? If there were no Microsoft Office, there would be no self-help book for Microsoft Office? According to your statements, I can't write a self-help book on anything without infringing on copyrights. Because I would be making money off Microsoft's product indirectly. So this makes your statement moot.
That self-help book doesn't run Office or Windows for you. That self help book doesn't need to be attached to Office or Windows to work.Glider plays WoW for you. Glider has to be attached to WoW to work. Therefore, your point is moot.
hahaha, I doubt that. Let's see, Plugins, Macros, etc all come with those self help books. So yea, if Blizzard wins this (again, which they won't), all self-help computer books would be infringing on copyrights.I.e.: Screenshots, Flash videos of how to do things in steps, etc.
It's going to be interesting to see the out come of this.
Never mind what it is doing to the game, try looking at it from a different point of view, thay (Blizz) are going after the man who makes it and not the people who use it.
Thats like sueing ford because someone drove over your foot in one of there cars.
Surley if you make a piece of software and sell it thats not illegal it only becomes illegal IF the person you sold it to uses it knowing to do so is illegal.
for example, if i was to breed Pitbulls and sell you a pupp that you later used for illegal dogfighting that means you are in the wrong and not me for selling you the pup in the first place.
I kind of hope this guy wins his case, i think blizz are going after the wrong person here.
So that's is not an option.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
So, by me running Avast, and Avast copies itself into ram as well, Avast scans Blizzards files to make sure they are not infected. This would break the rules too. Any program you load into memory would be a threat.
Of course Glider loads itself into RAM. All programs do. What is your point man! Glider only hooks into the Windows Keyboard API, it does not manipulate Blizzard's programs at all. The only thing Glider does to WoW, is listen for where it's at in the world and pushes the appropriate button for you. What would be the difference in building a physical keyboard overlay hooked up to a camera that looks at the screen and pushes the actual keyboard buttons? WOuld that be an infringement of Blizzard's program as well?
No Glider loads itself AND WoW onto your computers RAM and thus "copies" that which is covered by copyright. It's up to Blizzard to decide what infringes on their copyright and what doesn't; that's the great thing about copyright.
...And if you can build a machine that can look at a monitor, recognize what it sees and perform the correct functions within the time it takes to adequately play WoW - you have much more important things to do with your life! Please for all MANKIND I ask you to stop playing WoW! I am sure that blizzard employees and sharholders agree with me! You deserve a lifetime suppy of big cookies for building a machine that can do that!
"The liberties and resulting economic prosperity that YOU take for granted were granted by those "dead guys"
Upon a bit of reflection, this is really an area where the courts can't help, because there's no law that specifically addresses this issue.
Blizz will need to seek relief in the legislature or Congress, not in the courts. It's a brave new legal world.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
So that's is not an option.
Most programs load themselves into RAM. Like WoW loads itself into RAM unless glider is operating then Glider loads it. If WoW loads itself into RAM then Blizzards copyright is intact. If Glider loads WoW then it is broken by Glider.
"The liberties and resulting economic prosperity that YOU take for granted were granted by those "dead guys"
A lot of you are missing the point. Blizzard OWNS WoW and everything in it. You agreed to that when you clicked on the I Agree button after scrolling down and not reading the EULA. You are paying Blizzard to play the game and you are, for lack of a better word, leasing your account(s). If at any time you decide you want to do something against the EULA you risk losing access because you broke Blizzard's "law" and therefore they can punish you by suspension, ban, etc.
So someone who is making a living by helping people violate that AND don't forget they can probably show how it hurts other innocent customers which in turn hurts Blizzards business is asking for trouble. Just because you get away with something for a while, even though you know it's wrong, doesn't mean you aren't going to get caught sooner or later. Blizzard has DEEP pockets and that means big fancy law firms with eight names on the sign that live for squashing people's nuts and billing $1200/hr for the privilege.
If I remember correctly, doesn't Wow Glider use a hacked WoW executable in order to facilitate its reading of the WoW memory locations and its avoidance of Blizzards warden program.
That is where the copyright infringement comes from. Glider took the actual Wow executable, hacked it, embedded it into their bot, and then SOLD it as their own comercial product.
I can give you a long list of professions and services that are not so morally correct, but people make a legal living through them.. so the point is?
Our own stance on bots in games, morally correct or not by where we are at in our lives in terms of moral development, this really seems to muddy the argument of who's in the wrong. Like people have said.. the issue is a third party application loading the primary software into RAM, and there have been district court rulings in the past that continue to uphold the judgment that this is infact infringement of the Copyright Act by the user. I think that's where it gets interesting because the defendant claims that there is not sufficient grounds on all 5 points of the Copyright Act that must prove the party in the wrong to hold him liable for anything.
I'm not a lawyer, but I find it very interesting.
I can tell from this post that you know nothing of programming. LOL
Wow, you're so damn wrong. Botters usually farm items to sell to get gold. Because my server is large there is a good number of botters, I've seen them in specific farming areas. When you go on the AH, all the prices are extremely low because you've got about 8 botters competing with each other to sell their shyte for gold they need for a mount or buying arena points.
If you take botters out of the game, there will be less supply. Less supply = More Demand = Higher Gold Price.
Good thing I don't buy anything from the AH.
I do think botting really hurts the game but I don't think Blizzard should win this.. he has every right to create a bot and sell it..it's his costumers that decide to actually use it.
World of Warcraft is a proof that MMORPG quality should affect schedule/budget and not the other way around.
Most of the guys posting in here seem to have no idea of how important it is for MDY to win this thing.
It is not about "omg stop botters plx they inflate the economy on my server wtf11", it's not about "botters suck in real life lolz", it's not even about your so beloved World of Warcraft.
If Blizzard wins this with their specific argumentation and construction of copyright, it may easily cause an assload of similar cases and in a manner of speaking shutdown 3rd party software development.
Some food for thought: just imagine Microsoft to hop on that same bandwagon right after.
I find it interesting how Blizzard will chase after this guy for writing the program, when he's not the one committing the actual offense of using it.
This looks like it could go the way of BitTorrent sites: They provide a means of accessing the illegal content, but they aren't infringing copywrite as the content isn't stored in his "RAM" as the Blizzard lawyers claim...hope he gets a smart laywer.
Kinda harsh on the Glider bot maker but I guess it serves him right...
A. He makes a bot to help other losers to cheat and gain unfair and unbalanced advantages over others. Which in return breaks the game!
B. He is trying to profit out of someone elses game!
Good on ya Blizzard!
For everyones interest:
MMOGlider is not
-hacking the wow.exe or hooking up to it in any way
-messing around with any files or data in the wow folder
-altering, modifying or in any way fiddling around with the games values in the memory (like other bots did in the past)
-sending back false data to the server
-etc.
MMOGlider does only READ memory content used by your OS and responds with keystrokes.
Now you all can moan any way you like, but this is not about if botting is unethical, cheating or if botters ruin your personal gaming experience in WoW.
If Blizzard gets through with only READING the memory of an OS is a violation of copyright, alot of developers can pack their bags. With their latest change in their Warden, Blizzard is already pushing the limits another time, now on the next level trying to establish their interpretation of copyright.
More than protecting a video game from botters, this is rather about protecting the freedom of development and stopping a multimillion juggernaut from twisting the law to their likes.
Yes, but most third party programs are free and not sold.
The copyright litmus test is about whether you make money from it. Obviously if you make a third party program that is an add on or useful to the original companies customers, no one minds, not until you sell it with out permission that is.
Without profit it is pretty hard to prove copyright infringement, although they do seem to be getting better at it.
Oh and most instructional books will have permission and acknowlegde the license, just have a look inside any of the for Dummies books.
WAR is not WOW - http://javairasfolly.jandell.net/?page_id=377
www.afkcafe.com
If it would be that easy and just about the commercial aspect, any gaming company could in the broader sense i.e. charge Corel for selling a programm that takes an ingame screenshot from your clipboard.
*edit: typo(s)
I believe Volgore said what needed to be said, so really Volgore ended this discussion. Kudos to you Volgore for saying it Big Bird style.
Followed this one for a while. The copying into memory is an interesting twist. I hear the latest version of glider does not use a launcher I wonder if this is why? I can't see how that argument would fly to be honest. The precedent it would set would allow microsoft to shut down numerous competitors.
Of course I wonder what Blizzard will do about the open source bot that is superior in many ways?