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MMORPG Playing does not = SKILL
XImpalerX
Member UncommonPosts: 606
Im tired of people saying this and that takes skill or no skill.
You have spells and attacks. You drag these graphical algorithims to a Hotbar. You read said skill and it states.
You do X damage to X target. You heal X target for X health. How much skill does it take to understand this?
THESE below statements are generalized.
It doesnt take skill to read. Reading would be a skill if it wasnt' taught to you from birth. Consider it a passive ability. Typing quickly is a skill. Pushing numbers 1-0 on your keypad is not.
Reacting to in game situations and deciding what skill to use is not a skill. You react to and make decicions to real life situations all the time so it is only natural that you can do this in a video game.
MMOGs do require a small degree of coordination, they require awareness, practice to get things down and an understanding of the underlying mechanics. Of course, you can still just sink a lot of time into the game and let other players carry you... which results in the fabled "Level Capped Newbasaur."
Someone who just sucks flat out and repeatedley breaks snares after being told what to look for and how to react is lacking intelligence and basic deductive reasoning.
What is skill?
According to Dictionary.com
| 1. | the ability, coming from one's knowledge, practice, aptitude, etc., to do something well: Carpentry was one of his many skills. |
| 2. | competent excellence in performance; expertness; dexterity: The dancers performed with skill. |
| 3. | a craft, trade, or job requiring manual dexterity or special training in which a person has competence and experience: the skill of cabinetmaking. |
"MMORPG playing is one of my best skills." Your average person/employer would laugh uncontrollably at this statement.
I know my argument can be turned around in many areas and argued against.
I guess if you were to use the word skill pertaining to an MMO it would be applied to those who excel and are top PvPer's/raiders. As being at the top level in this area requires alot of skill. Understanding each class, knowing how to counter and deal with each class, and positioning actually requires thought and not pushing 1-0.
I know this will offend many MMO players as playing said MMO may be the only illusional "skill" that person has in real life.
Want skill?swing a bat,bounce a ball, jump rope, sing, play piano,etc
Real Life skill is the only skill I need.
Comments
and perfecting skill points, and figuring out which combination of attacks or spells in what order to maximize damage isn't a skill?
Most have no skill but some do.
98% of the teenage population does or has tried smoking pot. If you''re one of the 2% who hasn''t, copy & paste this in your signature.
and perfecting skill points, and figuring out which combination of attacks or spells in what order to maximize damage isn't a skill?
Most have no skill but some do.
Yes that would be mathematical skill. Not game playing skill. If you are better at math than the opposing player these Skill formulas will come easier to you.
X spell casts in 3 sec and does X damage. Y spell casts in 2 sec and does X damage. Z spell casts in 1 sec and does X damage.
You calculate how long it takes for an average mob to get to you. say it takes 6 seconds.
X spell casts in 3 seconds meaning 2 casts before said target arrives to you. But it left the target with 10% health. So you say ok what spell can i cast that does roughly 10% damage and uses a small amount of resources? Ill cast Z move back for 1 second and cast X-X. +1-1+3+3=6 Or you stay in orignal spot cast X-X-Y and take 1 melee attack. 3+3+1=7 seconds. You sacrifice 1 second and absorb 1 attack.
Your right being a mathematician is a skill.
I guess you could say that if you have skills in life that can be applied to skills in a video game..then you are playing that game with skill.
I double posted this for you because everyone should see it, If you honestly believe top end players have no skill at playing the game, you're an ignorant fool.
Math skill (what spells to fire off), skilled co-ordination (fd, firing off spells on long duration, curing at the right time, dps on and off, listening to verbal commands and executing them), critical thinking during AoE's, where to run, when to run, how far to run, using past experience and applying it to new encounters are all skills related and bundled into every MMO differently, its called game mechanics. Therefore you can chose to understand and apply this knowledge set of mechanics, a.k.a SKILL SET to either suck or be elite. If you believe every player does the same thing in a monotonous motion of pressing 1-2-3-4-5-6 *encounter dead, you obviously were never good at MMO's in the first place, or you, yourself fall into the category of a shitty player.
Have you participated in learning a new strategy? have you been in server best, world best guild? have you had the dedication to learn your class and the most effective way to utilize it? probably not, but most people have, now I'm talking about raiding, because 1 hit mob encounters obviously take no skill to push 1 or 2 or even 3 buttons, but when you have an encounter that takes 10+ minutes to beat, with multiple aoes, damage shields, spawning adds, etc, you can't tell me that those participating in the kill have no skill. (Thats like saying hockey takes no skill because all you have to do is windup for a slapshot, fire the puck at 100mph and you'll score, or that since dodging a hit in real life is something your naturally going to do, taking a hit the proper way is not a skill, because hey there both games being played just on a different medium, or lets use golf as another one, wind up fire your ball, is judging the wind speed and direction, and lie of the pin a skill? when all your doing is clubbing a ball?) Its obviously something you have never done, so why don't you create a poll on the subject, and you'll find your ideals are severley mistaken.
I've seen my fair share of retards with damn great gear and full masters apply to the guild I was in and fail horribley because they sucked, now is sucking due to lack of skill? or sucking due to lack of math skill because they couldn't parse higher than a dirge and obviously weren't hitting the right spells/ca's? which is chalked up to experience, potential, aptitude, and ability, all of which constitutes as a skill.
The dicitonary spells it out for you, yet you still believe they take no skill?
Edit: to save the feelings of others, as per request of the moderator.
Just a question here. But wouldn't by the definition given from dictionary.com mean that reading is a skill?
Reading comprehension is a skill which was not addressed by the OP.
Edit: to save the feelings of others, as per request of the moderator.
Most peoples focusing on a MMO focus for reasons that are not related to skills.
Success throught a journey is definitely a key reason. But by no mean the only reason. Some peoples even value success to be so important that it should be determined randomly (which is 99% of the PvP/Raiding in MMO, whichever side is bigger/stronger wins, there is a random in the component of who is online and who isn't, rather than on your capacity as a player). Removing all form of real challenges and "skills" as you see it, it is very important to some players (RvR type/Raiders type). If you are patient and willing to endure anything, you will succeed in a MMO.
Peoples who would value SOME amounts of skills, they are usually show angry monkey comments. If you value "skills", it would be better in a LAN than online.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
ahahah jfc I hope your being sarcastic, however my brother learned to talk and read in my mother's womb that took skill, he popped out of my mom's uterus and was like "sup bishes, I can talk and read"
Doesn't take much skill to post a mmorpg topic in the correct forum either
MMORPGs require Multi-Tasking Skills. Which is why I suck at them. But I still love them.
It's mostly about the knowledge of the game in the end,and if you consider that equaling skill.That is the only skilled required. So how many hours do you have to play to have skill. If you are over 1000 in a game to have that kind of knowledge it proves you have no life.
Thinking that playing an MMO gives you skill is why you'll never amount to anything. Everything that you define skill to in a MMORPG are skills that were around a long time before video games existed.
Thats all i mean.
I've actually said all i wanted to say, so don't expect any more activity from me on this thread
(P.S.) Congratulations on acquiring what is among one of the most useless "skills." cu in the planar void.
Not to be mean or anything but your sentences are hard to understand.
your PvP analogy is all fine and good and I agree numbers will outweigh skill in certain scenario's (as 1 skilled mathematician couldn't do the work of 900 mathematicians with a slightly lower skill set), but what happens in the scenario of equal characters, equal gear, and equal opportunity to attack, one on one, those who have accumulated the better gaming strategy, aptitude, and knowledge of there attacks, what order they go in, when to use special attacks and when to save them, how to use there environment and how that particular game's mechanics offer advantages and disadvantages all combine into PvP skill for that game, does it not?
Or are you saying the OP is ......
Edit: to save the feelings of others, as per request of the moderator.
Like my analogy before, hockey is a game, I knew how to hit an object before, but it doesn't make me a skilled hockey player. I can write, does that mean it takes no skill to be a good novelist? I could read at a young age, does that mean I have the skills to be an english teacher? I can watch TV, does that mean it takes no skill to be a TV producer?
In fact, its the combination of acquired skill and utilizing it in an MMO, under its game mechanics, that give players the COMBINED skills needed to own. These COMBINED attributes are learned from previous or current engagements wether in game or out that form your skill as a player, therefore MMO's take skill. You just proved it yourself indirectly.
You're premature exit out of this thread shows me that your flustered and can't respond to any of the points I made (which you haven't responded to one, why?), its too bad because even though your lacking any stable argument, I can see where your coming from albeit misguided under the principle of generalization, its obviously wrong since you can't even defend it anymore
Hey, I'm not the one whining about MMO skills, I was taught well on how not to be a newb its no concern for me whether the populous accepts being a good raider takes skill or not, I'm a 2nd year programmer and english major in real life, those are my main skills, whereas I can say your FAR from anything intelligent based on your arguements
Congratulations on your *lack of skill
/evac please
*Edit: to save the feelings of others, as per request of the moderator.
Like my analogy before, hockey is a game, I knew how to hit an object before, but it doesn't make me a skilled hockey player. I can write, does that mean it takes no skill to be a good novelist? I could read at a young age, does that mean I have the skills to be an english teacher? I can watch TV, does that mean it takes no skill to be a TV producer?
In fact, its the combination of acquired skill and utilizing it in an MMO, under its game mechanics, that give players the COMBINED skills needed to own. These COMBINED attributes are learned from previous or current engagements wether in game or out that form your skill as a player, therefore MMO's take skill. You just proved it yourself indirectly.
You're premature exit out of this thread shows me that your flustered and can't respond to any of the points I made (which you haven't responded to one, why?), its too bad because even though your lacking any stable argument, I can see where your coming from, but its obviously wrong since you can't even defend it anymore
Hey, I'm not the one whining about MMO skills, I was taught well on how not to be a newb its no concern for me whether the populous accepts being a good raider takes skill or not, I'm a programmer and english major in real life, those are my main skills, whereas I can say your FAR from anything intelligent based on your arguements
Congratulations on your pussying-out skill
/evac please
You've made 21 posts on this site so far and nearly all of them contain some sort of personal attack. Whats your deal?
Don't derail the thread! wtf.
I'm glad your interested in me, perhaps you want to make a banner for me too? another addition to my fan club? In all seriousness, I'm only debating facts, if there too real for you or if there too harshly worded, perhaps you should visit the hello kitty forums, I hear there really..........nice?
Maybe you need to read the rules of conduct and pay attention to the Personal Attack part. You can debate all the facts you want but why resort to name calling.
Maybe you need to read the rules of conduct and pay attention to the Personal Attack part. You can debate all the facts you want but why resort to name calling.
I read the rules of conduct and the use of "ignorant fool" and "newb" isn't name calling when its true, especially when the OP realized he failed and backs out of any further discussion because he is incapable of admitting he is wrong. It's too bad that some peoples pride interfere with there common sense, but I've debated enough to know that him backing down out of the thread he created is symbolic with lack of material on a losing side.
oh! I did get a warning, I said butthurt, my bad, ill save myself a ban and edit out the mean parts, I'm too used to certain flaming webpages with no moderation.
back on topic.
Real Skill
-In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08-
|
RISING DRAGOON ~AION US ONLINE LEGION for Elyos
Tha'ts great hehe.
How does one person being better than another not entail 'skill?'
This argument sucks.
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Well, PvP in MMO, if 1 vs 1, is fair about 5% of the time. GvG is almost never fair, it would be way under 1%. RvR "cannot" be fair. I assume that in a fair fight, it would take "skill", but who would play a game where 95% of the time he is not doing something he enjoy? I am not saying someone can't enjoy skilled-oriented battles in MMO-PvP, I say that someone wouldn't be playing the game for these. (if 2 opponents want to fight, it is still not automatically qualifying as a "fair" fight, it is comon that 1 of the fighter is clearly no match for his opponent, weither he understands it or not, it gives a false sensation of skill to the winner, but it was butchery nonetheless, no matter if on an "emotional level" they get the idea the fight was fair).
See, in order to require "skill", it must be a challenging fight, this is something I do as a "minority" % in PvE solo/grouping, in PvP or Raiding the % of skill go down the drain dramatically.
Again, there are very little "skill reasons" to play MMOs, if I would be playing mostly for challenging stuff, I wouldn't be playing MMOs. That doesn't mean I can't enjoy challenges and skill stuff, it means, it isn't the reason why I play the game. PvP/Raiding offers even less "skill" encounters and challenges, you almost invariably crush the "challenge" or are crushed by it. I enjoy solo/grouping in PvE for some reasons, I assume there must be "some reasons" to enjoy PvP or Raiding...but it isn't challenge or skill.
It is my belief that most players play for the "success" they get in the game (this can either be progression, reputation, social stuff, exploration or much more...they can all equal success in a way or another). Skills or challenges have very little to do with that. They are not anathema, but they are not encouraging it either...and are nearly absent from the game. Most of my deaths I am surprised, completely, and usually I either did horribly wrong or meet something way beyond my powers; or there was just bad random component/lag...it is extremely rare that I died to a challenge which is well done.
- "If I understand you well, you are telling me until next time. " - Ren
This ofcourse, is not true. Two players with the same gear can accomplish vastly different things depending on their abilities. Some players can juggle multiple CC's as well as keep very solid dps, pop their short term buffs exactly when they need them and keep a proper rotation of skills to maximize their dps.
Where as other players need to stop, put up their one CC, tab through all the targets and start mashing the closest damage key.
There is ofcourse any amount of inbetweens, but my point still stands, a level of skill does exist and it does make a radical difference in what a player is able to accomplish in Games like WoW or EQ2.
after 6 or so years, I had to change it a little...
I thought this was about PvP, not raiding. Even raiding is skill. Don't be naive, everyone knows that some people are naturally better at raiding even. It's about situational awareness, communication, and skill choice.
As for PvP, explain to me why some people dominate with similar or even worse gear? All the way back to UO, gear didn't really matter, all about skill. Even in WoW, I dominated 1v1 PvP with my rogue with crap gear. You cannot honestly say that you can win a battle totally based on gear.
The entire "click buttons" is watered down and a flat out embarrassing argument. Can I say the math takes no skill, it's just moving a pencil on paper? Nuclear physics? You just use pencils. In MMOs, the choice of skills and strategy is just as skilfull as clicking on people in an FPS.
Hmm. Do I really need to explain how this contradicts everything you said?
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These are the "real life skills" used to play MMO's. If you struggle in real life with any of these skills you will struggle with them in an MMO.
1. READING. Playing some adventure games forces you to read and to read carefully. It’s important to read carefully enough to get information which will help you solve problems. You can improve your reading by practice.
2. LOGICAL THINKING. There are many different kinds of thinking, and they can all be improved by trying them and by practicing them. An example of logical thinking: You need to get into a building, but it’s locked. Logically, what methods or steps must be used? When you need to get into a building, here are the steps that need to be taken: Get keys from pocket, select correct key, insert key into lock, turn key, open door handle, pushdoor open -- each step is important. The methods used to open a door are obvious, but most students need to think the steps through before they can use them. Another example of a thinking skill is the ability to think in sequential order. It’s amazing how hard that is for some people. Things need to be done in the correct order – in real life and in computer simulations.
3. OBSERVATION SKILLS. It’s amazing how little people really see – in real life and in simulations. Real observers – scientists, quarterbacks, etc. – notice every detail and use it in planning strategy. The LOOK AT command in simulations allow you to observe.
4. MAP-MAKING AND READING SKILLS. I’m surprised at how many students are poor at reading maps. Many eighth graders don’t remember the relation between North South East and West. Many don’t remember that on maps, North is usually at the top. Practicing working with maps improves these skills. Students also find it helpful to create a map when using most simulation or role-playing games.
5. VOCABULARY DEVELOPMENT. Most students who use simulations improve their vocabulary. You’ll encounter words which you don’t know, but which you need to know to be successful at the simulation the game is providing.
6. FAMILIAR KNOWLEDGE. Familiar knowledge is knowledge of common things. In simulation games, experiences are expanded. You get to go places and have experiences which you couldn’t really have in real life.
7. SPELLING. Sometimes it’s important to spell things correctly in order to succeed in many simulation games. Anytime you spell a word correctly, you help yourself to remember the correct spelling.
8. NOTE TAKING. Just taking notes, keeping them orderly, and being able to find them is good study skills practice. And successful role-playing gamers often do just this.
9. PROBLEM SOLVING. Problem solving ability can be learned and practiced. At almost every step in simulation games you’re expected to solve a problem. This skill is an important skill in school, college, and in almost every career.
10. STRATEGY PLANNING. What methods should be used over the long hall to solve a problem? What steps need to be taken? Strategy planning is one method of problem solving.
So in other words you need to practice and develop these real life skills in order to have skill playing an MMO.
I think what the OP is really trying to say is that playing an MMO gets you nowhere in life and everything you do and acheive in the game will be lost/forgotten and you have nothing in the physical realm to show for it.
I suppose you do not agree writing is a skill either.