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I was excited until I read about Instancing...
admriker4
Member Posts: 1,070
I was pettty excited about this game, at least until another poster mentioned instancing.
If I understood him correctly, anytime you enter a zone you get the option to choose zone 1, zone 2, zone 3, etc. If a zone is full of players (no idea of the cap), then you have to enter another zone.
You can still chat with everyone in that zone, but you wont physically see them because they might be in another instance of that zone.
EQ2 did this crap and I quit immediately. There was some forest near a starter town in EQ2, once I tried to enter it and loading screen asks me which instance did I want. It felt like I was playing inside a small box with 12 other people.
If your in a group of say 8 players and you all try to enter a zone together but it only has room for 6, two of you get left out. Lame.
Can someone please explain to me why a so-called 3rd generation MMO has to resort to this ? A second generation MMO - Star Wars Galaxies, 5 yrs old didnt have to settle for this instancing junk. In fact that entire game (minus a few instances later added) was 100% in-game. Housing was even in-game.
LOTR also has a lot of loading into zones but at least everyone is in the same one (Minus the housing)
I pay to play in a MMO, not a multiplayer box. This is a real turnoff for me and has me rethinking my purchase. Course I suppose thats why Funcom has its NDA still in place with only mere hours left till early launch.
I hope this instancing junk is only for a few zones
Comments
If you couldn't stand EQ2's instancing you will absolutely HATE AoC's. It's much worse. Sorry.
no, you don't get a pop up window asking which zone you want to enter.
If you are in a group, all of you enter the same zone.
Instancing is a bit on the heavy side in the n00b areas of the game to help with the lag of lots of people being in the same place at the same time.
Once you are out in the open world, you will see a tremendous difference.
It's very similar to AO in it's zoning / instancing. Not surprising really, since it's Funcom.
Without some kind of instancing in Tortage (n00b island) the game would likely be unplayable.
It is a necessary evil, until we all have nasa computers and internet2.
if this is true,then it really sux,and its kinda weird that this board aint thread spammed with cons of aoc
As for the rest. Is a matter of opinion. I only wanted to make you notice an error.
There are complain threads everyday about the cons of AoC, and if you look back a few pages, 70% of the threads are of these type.
well i suppose it depends on the size. Are we talking 30 people, 300, or 3,000 per instance ?
I still dont understand how Star Wars Galaxies could have no instances and zoning in it. Its graphics were state of the art at launch and had at the time hundreds of thousands of players on. I didnt have to choose an instance or wait for a loading screen anytime i entered the cantina. And the best part, my house was in-game as well.
MMO's feel much much smaller to me when Im not actually playing with a mass of people
Actually the loading time is getting alot better now. I wouldn't worry to much about it if I were you. Now take it from me as the Doomsayer for months that Im starting to see the potentials that could make AOC - not just huge but massive. OFC Funcom has huge amount of work to do and slightest mistake in first week could ruin it all.
What I can promise you is that you will not find better looking - more realistic and in many ways - fun game to play for the next year or so. Games like assins creed and the witcher meet the MMO comunity and big things can happen. And dont forget that those games had loading screens to
As long as the direct gameplay is not suffering cause of the grapichs - then the game will be a hit. Im now running the game in top res and highest quality and still getting around 20-45 fps in Tortage but up to 80 fps in less crowded places. And the performance is alot better.
Still - alot to be done but this is actually for the first time in the last 3-4 months that I can see it click.
As for instancing - thats both good and bad.
There is normal mode (solo) and epic mode (grouping). It gives you more variety than all current MMOs put together. And... it will actually reduce the annoying part of spending alot of time doing quests - just because all the others are doing them to.
Anyone with a realistic understanding of PC limitations knows this.
The graphic quality of AoC has to be seen to be believed....it's beyond amazing. You can't have 2000+ people in one starting area and have it be playable. It's just not realistically feasable.
As for the rest. Is a matter of opinion. I only wanted to make you notice an error.
maybe it isnt true now, but when I played EQ2 at launch several times when trying to enter that old forest zone, someone in the group got left out because it was full. We either had to leave the zone instance and try another together or leave that person behind.
Either way, I dont like playing in an instance with a small group of players. I play MMO's, key word being MASSIVE.
Its not as instance as you think.
If in group everyone always ends up in same instance.
While in group if someone is in another instance -> right click on his name -> summon to this instance.
The instances are made based on how many players are in the same zone, ( number of players varies depends on map .. when new instance will be created )
Let say Tortage Island is very small map and pretty narrow the number of players will be very very low as you dont want to get stuck in city because there are 200 players in town -> you can move thru players -> collision is on.
Same goes for majority of quests in Tortage you would not want to find a quest boss who is camped by 50 players waiting on their turn.
Once you leave tortage zones are pretty bigger so dont expect much instancing there.
( or do have no clue how many concurrent players will aoc have )
Note:
- The border kingdoms are NOT instanced at all
- You wont get in situation that you cant group with your friend because you are in diffrend instance and he cant join.
- The majority of instances will be in Tortage and all maps where you build player city ( as all guilds can own a city they will create as much instances as they need .. each of the 3 maps for building city support multiple cities on it ) -> players cant attack player cities only keeps. ( cities are attacked by NPC's )
I think I covered the majority of your questions/concerns.
p.s. I thought I would hate it but now to choose between playing on insanly made maps or big seamless world of nothingness ....
Futilez[Do You Have What It Takes ?]
Anyone with a realistic understanding of PC limitations knows this.
The graphic quality of AoC has to be seen to be believed....it's beyond amazing. You can't have 2000+ people in one starting area and have it be playable. It's just not realistically feasable.
I think thats a copout excuse to save funcom some money. I bet it could be done.
Star Wars Galaxies when it launched had state of the art graphics. Definitely it was the best for its time 5 years ago. And we didnt have to settle for loading screens when we entered someone's house or a cantina. And we certainly didnt have to choose a zone when entering a dungeon / cave area.
If a game 5 years ago could do it with the best graphics back then, surely funcom can do it now.
As for the rest. Is a matter of opinion. I only wanted to make you notice an error.
maybe it isnt true now, but when I played EQ2 at launch several times when trying to enter that old forest zone, someone in the group got left out because it was full. We either had to leave the zone instance and try another together or leave that person behind.
Either way, I dont like playing in an instance with a small group of players. I play MMO's, key word being MASSIVE.
No MMO games out there are massive. Lets put it this way.We have starting areas that are overrun by thousands of ppl when the game starts. The game has to be created with this in mind. Still there are huge amount of collisions between players doing the same quests and it will slow ppl down lvling and gets annoying in the long run.
Then 2 months later those same areas are ghostlands. Most quests that were build for the launchday are no longer functioning in a world of 2-3 ppl running around. Or just become sooo boring since you feel so alone.
Instanced zoning takes care of this. It allows for enjoyable content when the game is launched - and same goes when you play it 2-3 months later.
So its not all bad. Thankfully the MMO gaming has become alot better than when I started playing. Then we had to Q up in front of bosses for up to 2 hours in none instanced gameplay - waiting while 5 other groups killed him - and he spawned again.
WAR fanboys
... please lock thread.
Anyone with a realistic understanding of PC limitations knows this.
The graphic quality of AoC has to be seen to be believed....it's beyond amazing. You can't have 2000+ people in one starting area and have it be playable. It's just not realistically feasable.
I think thats a copout excuse to save funcom some money. I bet it could be done.
Star Wars Galaxies when it launched had state of the art graphics. Definitely it was the best for its time 5 years ago. And we didnt have to settle for loading screens when we entered someone's house or a cantina. And we certainly didnt have to choose a zone when entering a dungeon / cave area.
If a game 5 years ago could do it with the best graphics back then, surely funcom can do it now.
Your an idiot.
Anyone with a realistic understanding of PC limitations knows this.
The graphic quality of AoC has to be seen to be believed....it's beyond amazing. You can't have 2000+ people in one starting area and have it be playable. It's just not realistically feasable.
I think thats a copout excuse to save funcom some money. I bet it could be done.
Star Wars Galaxies when it launched had state of the art graphics. Definitely it was the best for its time 5 years ago. And we didnt have to settle for loading screens when we entered someone's house or a cantina. And we certainly didnt have to choose a zone when entering a dungeon / cave area.
If a game 5 years ago could do it with the best graphics back then, surely funcom can do it now.
There is a huge difference between 5 years ago and now. And star wars galaxies did not have insanely high requirements when it launched. I remember preordering it and playing it on launch day with my computer that was at the time 2 years old.
As for the instancing, Trust me you wont even NOTICE your in a "zoned map" the only thing you'll notice sadly, is the loading screens which I admit do suck, but they are getting better, and if you have a 10,000 rpm HD you won't even see them for more then 10 seconds. Instancing isn't for everyone, but a lot of people like or atleast don't mind having to be in a zoned map, especially since you won't even notice you're in one once you hit 20+.
It's the main reason I won't be buying it. I wish a developer would have the guts to create a game without instancing (before you say Vanguard - I said game not steaming pile of you know what).
As far as I'm concerned there hasn't been a real MMO for ages. In case people have forgotten, the first "M" stands for "massive". Sorry, nothing "massive" about 50 people in a zone. AoC like most other "M"MOs these days are multiplayer games - not massive multiplayer games. 1st generation MMOs had it right. Maybe someday we'll feel the same emersion again by actually being part of the same world as everybody else on the same server. Competition for mobs? Crowding? Never bothered me. I had the most fun rolling on a new EQ server when it launched and having 500+ players in noobee zones. That was exciting. This getting held by the hand, taken from quest giver to quest giver in a seemingly empty world is not.
Anyone with a realistic understanding of PC limitations knows this.
The graphic quality of AoC has to be seen to be believed....it's beyond amazing. You can't have 2000+ people in one starting area and have it be playable. It's just not realistically feasable.
I think thats a copout excuse to save funcom some money. I bet it could be done.
Star Wars Galaxies when it launched had state of the art graphics. Definitely it was the best for its time 5 years ago. And we didnt have to settle for loading screens when we entered someone's house or a cantina. And we certainly didnt have to choose a zone when entering a dungeon / cave area.
If a game 5 years ago could do it with the best graphics back then, surely funcom can do it now.
SWG has NOTHING on the graphics of AOC, even considering the time difference.Once again...you don't have to choose a zone when entering one. You will probably never notice the zone instancing at all. There are enough people in each instance that it seems very well populated. If you've ever played AO...think Temple Of The Three WInds. New instances of zones are only created when a zone gets full. If an instance of that zone becomes empty, it is destroyed until needed again.
You'll have to experience it for yourself, I guess. AoC has the graphics of the most advanced single-player games, but in an MMO environment. We get to have our cake and eat it too...but there is a price.
A price more than worth paying, in MY experience.
As for the rest. Is a matter of opinion. I only wanted to make you notice an error.
maybe it isnt true now, but when I played EQ2 at launch several times when trying to enter that old forest zone, someone in the group got left out because it was full. We either had to leave the zone instance and try another together or leave that person behind.
Either way, I dont like playing in an instance with a small group of players. I play MMO's, key word being MASSIVE.
No MMO games out there are massive. Lets put it this way.We have starting areas that are overrun by thousands of ppl when the game starts. The game has to be created with this in mind. Still there are huge amount of collisions between players doing the same quests and it will slow ppl down lvling and gets annoying in the long run.
Then 2 months later those same areas are ghostlands. Most quests that were build for the launchday are no longer functioning in a world of 2-3 ppl running around. Or just become sooo boring since you feel so alone.
Instanced zoning takes care of this. It allows for enjoyable content when the game is launched - and same goes when you play it 2-3 months later.
So its not all bad. Thankfully the MMO gaming has become alot better than when I started playing. Then we had to Q up in front of bosses for up to 2 hours in none instanced gameplay - waiting while 5 other groups killed him - and he spawned again.
hmm well SWG didnt have collision detection so masses in one area didnt pose a problem.
I can see it being beneficial having instances for a boss you need. Fighting with 4 other groups who are camping a mob always sucked.
However I still liked the feeling of being in a cantina with 150 other people, stepping outside and seeing another 200 people selling goods and another 100 people in line for buffs. Thats massive, thats what I want.
I dont want to be inside some zone with 20 other people.
Wow that is unfortunate. At least now I can look forward to other games besides this. Dam crappy funcom.
I don't mind instancing in games if its done right! I'm going to reference FFXI cause its a prime example of how you do instancing correctly!
The entire game, every zone and major events are all a separate instance, but there is hardly any loading and every single player is welcome to squeeze into a particular zone if you want and it does happen sometimes during special holiday events! There is no separating the players in instances of the same zone if too many enter, 95% of all the dungeons and caves and ruins in the game are the same way and any amount of groups can enter these and play together competing over camps and pulling certain mobs.
The only place that instances separate players by group are major boss fights {BCNMs, Major Storyline Bosses, End Game Raids like Dynamis{64-man though}, etc...}
After having played AoC {and yes I have a top of the line PC, over $2300 spent on it} and yes I set every setting as high and as low as possible and somewhat in the middle to test loading when I played and it didn't make any difference. The game looked beautiful, but the loading was horrendous on all settings, and the instancing was pathetic. Its an MMO, and I want to play with other players, not just know they're there in another instance but can't see em. I don't care about seeing the pubs on that beast trying to eat me or each individual blade of grass swaying.
Funcom really fucked up bad, and its not just the graphics being so detailed and instancing as it didn't matter what settings I was running the loading was horrible.
Kemih ~ 13 Red Mage | Currently playing FFXI & LOTRO, awaiting Warhammer Online & Aion...
As for the rest. Is a matter of opinion. I only wanted to make you notice an error.
maybe it isnt true now, but when I played EQ2 at launch several times when trying to enter that old forest zone, someone in the group got left out because it was full. We either had to leave the zone instance and try another together or leave that person behind.
Either way, I dont like playing in an instance with a small group of players. I play MMO's, key word being MASSIVE.
No MMO games out there are massive. Lets put it this way.We have starting areas that are overrun by thousands of ppl when the game starts. The game has to be created with this in mind. Still there are huge amount of collisions between players doing the same quests and it will slow ppl down lvling and gets annoying in the long run.
Then 2 months later those same areas are ghostlands. Most quests that were build for the launchday are no longer functioning in a world of 2-3 ppl running around. Or just become sooo boring since you feel so alone.
Instanced zoning takes care of this. It allows for enjoyable content when the game is launched - and same goes when you play it 2-3 months later.
So its not all bad. Thankfully the MMO gaming has become alot better than when I started playing. Then we had to Q up in front of bosses for up to 2 hours in none instanced gameplay - waiting while 5 other groups killed him - and he spawned again.
hmm well SWG didnt have collision detection so masses in one area didnt pose a problem.
I can see it being beneficial having instances for a boss you need. Fighting with 4 other groups who are camping a mob always sucked.
However I still liked the feeling of being in a cantina with 150 other people, stepping outside and seeing another 200 people selling goods and another 100 people in line for buffs. Thats massive, thats what I want.
I dont want to be inside some zone with 20 other people.
Dude, Maybe you're not listening.. The zones are NOT small. The only "small" zones will be tortage. The larger zones after you reach 20+ are HUGE and can hold a lot of players.
*faints*
As for the thread topic, I hardly notice it. It never once felt empty outside to me, unlike Guild Wars.
Funcom didn't "fuck" up, they actually reduced the loading times by like 5x. Maybe you should also look into buying a faster harddrive a 7200 rpm or 10,000 rpm would make the games loading screens be almost instant.
EQ2 spawns copies of zones at 100. Thats a lot for such an old game. And when it happens you are just happy it did happen. You are still not forced to split your group. Either you choose the low populated zone or you enter the populated one. Then there are 108 ppl. Man, how i wish you guys would know what you are babbling about.
I have to agree with you 100%
3rd generation MMO's seem to be cutting corners (prolly to save money). Yes AoC's graphics are amazing, but the technology has also advanced. I see no reason why the latest servers couldnt handle the masses in a single world like the 1st gen (and SWG) did with little issues.
I'd rather they cut corners with those amazing graphics than with my massive gameplay experience. If I want great graphics, Ill play Oblivion.
Look at LOTR. It has amazing graphics and doesnt force you into instance zones. Sure there are tons of loading screens which I wish it didnt have, but at least everyone is in the same zone. LOTR has the best graphics Ive seen of any MMO (havent seen conan yet) and they could do it. I can live with loading into the Prancing Pony because I knew when I left everyone would be outside (and not instanced split up)
Im still going to give conan its due shot, after all i spent the $50 but this has left me uneasy