Yeah man, i can see your point, and your right that the cursor has to be on someone to heal in that game ( soemhting they are working on). And just so you know im not one to be an asshole about disabilities i had a friend of mine lose her arm in the line of duty, that used to play with me, we were able to make it work even with the NGE's system for a long while ( thank you commando the ultimate point and click profession) but eventually we switched to eve, since it could all be done with the mouse. Maybe this little insight will help you to understand my stance on SWG. All that being said, if you are plannign on doing what i think you are doing ( forming your own team with your family) it could be easy to have everyone fill a role even if there is an action combat system, the tech specialist (Carter) i would assume will be more point and click than a soildier like teal'c or Jack.
Oh yes I think your right. We love the show so much we may give it a (albeut 4 games 4 subs a $300) try. But at that cost, its really hard to take a chance on something not all the family can play. But I will share your opinion with my family and we can think on it. TYVM for a new look on it.
i think this game should have FPS couse then you coul'nt just press tab all the time and once a sniper cath you in their sights you got a clear hs on him......
on many other Click and point or whatever you call it i just press tab all the time and we end up shooting or fighing each other in close combat...
until 1 wins when he got 100 hitpoints left from 2k hitpoints
i like FPS couse then you would always have to be focused:) and not just press some random buttons or just click on a guy then you character does the rest:( what a fall
but i guess it is gonna be like all mmo's.... never seen a MMOFPS anyone could point me towards one?
i will not buy this game if it is FPS...i like that;"kiddies can have em"
I am not a "kiddie", I enjoy mmo's and I enjoy FPS. I can't imagine a gamer NOT liking FPS games, unless you just suck at them.
On that note, even though I REALLY enjoy fps games, MMORPG's with FPS controls always bomb. And I want SGW to suceed so let's keep FPS controls out of it ;p
this will most likely be like tabula rasa i cant se how this would work with clicking number 1 and 2 as it then it would require no skill whatsoever kinda makes the whole stargate thing pointless and my self i wont buy this game if its point to click and so wont many others i predict this game will fail
there has not been a successful mmo that has incorperated FPS style controls, and there won't be.
imagine this, you are lagging, trying to aim at a monster and your bullets are not registering because the monster is not where you are looking at.. sorry, but FPS controls in an MMO are ignorant, even age of conan's semi-fps ranger mode is freaking stupid.
there has not been a successful mmo that has incorperated FPS style controls, and there won't be. imagine this, you are lagging, trying to aim at a monster and your bullets are not registering because the monster is not where you are looking at.. sorry, but FPS controls in an MMO are ignorant, even age of conan's semi-fps ranger mode is freaking stupid.
Planetside worked quite fine with me. Since it didn't have the absolutely best graphics in the world it was a matter of toning down the settings to get nice, lagless play. It's hard to make right, but it's definitely fun.
This game will most likely be a Tabula Rasa/Rainbow Six: Vegas mix. I really can't imagine a shooting RPG with a point&click ability spam-fest at all. It takes all the fun out of the Stargate (multiple enemies, get behind cover, hold the trigger, spray&pray you don't get killed in the wave). One thing that's pointing in the direction of Tabula Rasa is that they said a LVL 1 player who'll make good use of tactics and cover will be able to beat a LVL 20 player for example.
I really can't wait to see this game. If it doesn't go the WoW way this will maybe be the first MMO for me that has monthly fee.
there has not been a successful mmo that has incorperated FPS style controls, and there won't be. imagine this, you are lagging, trying to aim at a monster and your bullets are not registering because the monster is not where you are looking at.. sorry, but FPS controls in an MMO are ignorant, even age of conan's semi-fps ranger mode is freaking stupid.
there has not been a successful mmo that has incorperated FPS style controls, and there won't be. imagine this, you are lagging, trying to aim at a monster and your bullets are not registering because the monster is not where you are looking at.. sorry, but FPS controls in an MMO are ignorant, even age of conan's semi-fps ranger mode is freaking stupid.
Idiotard Alert!.. May I direct you to Planetside.
he said successful. planetside was hardly a hit.
FPS style MMO's are always a niche market. It doesnt fit in with the typical MMO gamer's playstyle. Why do you think Star Wars Galaxies is still dead ? That game is cleaner and has more content than it ever had, yet the 80% that left are still gone and nobody new has replaced them. They could bring back all the professions that they dumped and people still wouldnt come back because its a quasi fps game
I can fully understand that people that, to put it bluntly, simply lack the skill are against this type of thing.
Wrong.
You're fully *assuming* that people against it "simply lack the skill". That's a very presumptuous and, frankly, arrogant statement to make.
Some people, believe it or not, simply do not enjoy that kind of battle system in a RPG... how skilled they may or may not be at it makes absolutely no difference.
"If you just step away for a sec you will clearly see all the pot holes in the road, and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
RPG originaly came from pen and paper approach and the name role-playing was derived from the fact people were taking a role of a fictional character to get through a story. The type of rule system or even lack of it had nothing to do with the term. Somehow later, mostly as this style of play came to computers the term RPG somehow got twisted to indicate a game with character progression measured by various rule sets. The way the character was progressing, the role play, was pushed to background. So basically an RPG in current terms is something where you drive some kind of alter ego through its destiny in virtual world and this alternate character evolves using some kind of rule system. The type of controls used to accomplish this do not define whether its an RPG or not. To tell the truth, one of the best RPGs I played was Deus Ex. And on the other hand, I dont consider ie Diablo an RPG at all.
While I partially agree I do want to bring one argument up. In a role playing game you take possession of a character to control but this character is not YOU. When you enter combat in an RPG it isn't YOU fighting it's your CHARACTER fighting. It isn't supposed to be YOUR aiming ability or reflexes that matter but those of your CHRACTER. You can certainly have a first-person RPG or a third-person action shooter but you have to be careful how you mix the skills of the player with the skills of the character that they control. It is very easy to end up with an interface that either puts too much focus on the user and removes the character from the equation or one that is fustrating to the user because the game must implement artificial limitations on what you can do due to the stats of your character (ie the game decides your chracter missed even though YOU clearly hit the target).
While the current standard interface does have it's drawbacks it does a very good job at keeping the player and character separate but connected. Your chracter does the actions but you control the mind.
Having said that, I think SGW could work with a variety of systems and I don't really care what they do as long as they do it well.
In my opinion Point and Click makes the game more open to people who like to customise a character and not be that character exactly as in feel like you are in the eyes of that character, unlike Neocron 2.1 where you actually have to go behind a wall to reload and not be shot at. That cannot be done in a point and click game. You can dodge bullets/arrows yourself in point and click, but you can rely on your character to do that. FPS is the more action type of game where you control mostly what your character wants to do, without really much timed actions or anything. Point and Click is a more strategic style of play, but you customise your character to fight the way you want him to fight, but you don't have total control over him. I hope you are starting to see the difference and respect that difference. So please don't mix FPS up with the immuture community just because you don't like FPS, or are bad at FPS.
I have to disagree with this, mostly because you confuse the camera/view system with the control system. These are not the same thing.
While I have issues with the game itself Assassins Creed is a good argument here. This is a third-person game yet you have complete control of your character. In fact the control system is more advanced and "connected" than any first-person game that I can think of.
Whether this game is first-person or third-person has no influence on whether you can do things like dodge, duck, hide behind cover to reload or anything similar.
Let say your on mission to destroy a Goa'uld Mothership, now let say there is a force field blocking your path, so as the science geek its your job to bring the force field, mean while the rest of your team is giving you cover fire while you work. Now to do this so that it stays a FPS but gives you controls to do things like that, all they have to do is creat a key that will allow you two instantly switch between two different mods, will call one combat mode and the other exploration mode. With the simple click of a button you can switch back and fourth between these modes. Now this creats several fuctions, one it means groups will have to work together even more so. Two it gives it a more Stargate feel to it. The bottom line is Stargate is mixture of action and story line. Now forget the game play for second. The simple fact is Stargate Universe doesn't really make for good MMO, its not designed in such a way for it to be a good MMO. So in order to make it work as an MMO you have to change it to make it work. The game will have its share of players but it won't even make a blip on rader in the end.
I don't remember them ever switching between combat mode and exploration mode in either the series or the movie.
Also, Stargate is probably the BEST fictional universe ever for an MMO game. Not only does it allow for a nearly infinite variety of environments, situations, items, races and cultures but the concept itself allows for in-game explination and story continuity with an easier, cheaper and more robust server infrastructure. You couldn't design an IP better suited to an MMO if you tried.
So to join this heated debate. I think Tabula Rasa got the aiming system down pat. one a target is aquired you don't have to aim right at the creature to kill it, but aiming at it with the full bead rewards you like better crit chance and whatnot. I believe this to be the best control scheme for SGW. A third person view that you can switch to mouse mode to use the UI. This way it's not the boring point and click. The ability to use cover is much better than with a point and click. It rewards people who like first person shooter games by giving a slight advantage if you aim right at the enemy without alienating people who don't like to have to do that by being able to aquire a target and not worrry if your aiming right at it. I love Halo 3 and other various FPS games. I happen to be good at them but that doesn't mean I want my SGW game to be skill only. Level and equipment should mattter in an MMO and not who can keep their eye on the target better. I believe this to be the only way this game can be played succesfully. As far as puzzles and non-combat things goes.
Tabula Rasa solved that problem by providing a UI mode. My only complaint with that is that you should be able to have an option to toggle so you can make it so you have to hold down the right mouse button for aiming and an option to turn that off so you have to hit a keyboard button to switch between aiming and UI mode for pointing and clicking in puzzles and various interfaces. Any comments on this are welcome, I would like to know what others think of this.
From what they have hinted at, it is going to be an MMORPG, not an MMOFPS. Not sure about that as I haven't been checking in on it lately but go to www.stargateworlds.com for more info. They say that strategy is going to be extremely important in game, not simply getting the highest level and armor and weapon and pounding on others. How you use terrain, teamwork and strategy is what is going to keep people alive.
What the hell does a RPG have to with the way to aim? That only tells you that you will have a character to live (play) the world with.
From what they have hinted at, it is going to be an MMORPG, not an MMOFPS. Not sure about that as I haven't been checking in on it lately but go to www.stargateworlds.com for more info. They say that strategy is going to be extremely important in game, not simply getting the highest level and armor and weapon and pounding on others. How you use terrain, teamwork and strategy is what is going to keep people alive.
What the hell does a RPG have to with the way to aim? That only tells you that you will have a character to live (play) the world with.
Agreed obviously some people have no clue what RPG stands for.
noobs think rpg is tank and heal clicking 1-9 buttons
and to reply to what this guy said before
Originally posted by elondor
there has not been a successful mmo that has incorperated FPS style controls, and there won't be.
imagine this, you are lagging, trying to aim at a monster and your bullets are not registering because the monster is not where you are looking at.. sorry, but FPS controls in an MMO are ignorant, even age of conan's semi-fps ranger mode is freaking stupid.
the aiming isint 100% like on cs or anything if you didnt figure that out..... quite sad someone can be this dumb go try tabula rasa before replying to anything cuase you will only fail at life more every time if you dont
No need to be so crude Raizeen but ya you are right. I think people are getting confused between FPS controls and FPS aiming cause there is a difference. You can still have a reticule of where your aiming at and once locked onto the enemy still be hitting it. Unless you have played Tabula Rasa you may not get that. I totally agree that a regular FPS will not do well. Besides the lag issue it just does not seem to work so far. As far as i'm concerned unless it's going to have a retucule to aim at but not force you to have to keep it on the enemy. Yet still reward the character by keeping it on the enemy. Like more crit percentage, more knockback, more side effects if the weapon has any like life still or damage over time or buffs. Things like that to entice me to want to keep it on the enemy but still cause the intended amount of damage. If no bonuses were given for keeping on the enemy I would be ok but it damn well better be fps style otherwise I just won't be happy and i'll moan and groan while playing it because my love for Stargate preceeds everything.
I am of the "can't stand FPS controls" camp. I'm playing Mass Effect, and loving the atmosphere and story, but I absolutely hate playing through the missions.
That said, whoever mentioned Assassin's Creed - I loved it. The fluidity of movement and character control was great. I'm not sure how such a control scheme could be implemented into an MMO, but hating FPS doesn't mean hating "twitch-based" combat which a fair bit of Assassin's Creed was (especially swordplay; sneaking and stabbing was skill-based but slower-paced).
Personally, what I don't like about FPS is the first-person crosshair aiming (yes, this is probably the essence of FPS.. but not necessarily of skill-based combat). Zoom it out to 3rd person and have the skill portion of combat be more based around use of terrain and counter-attacks than aim. The "counter" system in Assassin's Creed was my favorite.
Comments
i think this game should have FPS couse then you coul'nt just press tab all the time and once a sniper cath you in their sights you got a clear hs on him......
on many other Click and point or whatever you call it i just press tab all the time and we end up shooting or fighing each other in close combat...
until 1 wins when he got 100 hitpoints left from 2k hitpoints
i like FPS couse then you would always have to be focused:) and not just press some random buttons or just click on a guy then you character does the rest:( what a fall
but i guess it is gonna be like all mmo's.... never seen a MMOFPS anyone could point me towards one?
I am not a "kiddie", I enjoy mmo's and I enjoy FPS. I can't imagine a gamer NOT liking FPS games, unless you just suck at them.
On that note, even though I REALLY enjoy fps games, MMORPG's with FPS controls always bomb. And I want SGW to suceed so let's keep FPS controls out of it ;p
this will most likely be like tabula rasa i cant se how this would work with clicking number 1 and 2 as it then it would require no skill whatsoever kinda makes the whole stargate thing pointless and my self i wont buy this game if its point to click and so wont many others i predict this game will fail
there has not been a successful mmo that has incorperated FPS style controls, and there won't be.
imagine this, you are lagging, trying to aim at a monster and your bullets are not registering because the monster is not where you are looking at.. sorry, but FPS controls in an MMO are ignorant, even age of conan's semi-fps ranger mode is freaking stupid.
Planetside worked quite fine with me. Since it didn't have the absolutely best graphics in the world it was a matter of toning down the settings to get nice, lagless play. It's hard to make right, but it's definitely fun.
This game will most likely be a Tabula Rasa/Rainbow Six: Vegas mix. I really can't imagine a shooting RPG with a point&click ability spam-fest at all. It takes all the fun out of the Stargate (multiple enemies, get behind cover, hold the trigger, spray&pray you don't get killed in the wave). One thing that's pointing in the direction of Tabula Rasa is that they said a LVL 1 player who'll make good use of tactics and cover will be able to beat a LVL 20 player for example.
I really can't wait to see this game. If it doesn't go the WoW way this will maybe be the first MMO for me that has monthly fee.
Idiotard Alert!.. May I direct you to Planetside.
he says successful mmos...
Idiotard Alert!.. May I direct you to Planetside.
he said successful. planetside was hardly a hit.
FPS style MMO's are always a niche market. It doesnt fit in with the typical MMO gamer's playstyle. Why do you think Star Wars Galaxies is still dead ? That game is cleaner and has more content than it ever had, yet the 80% that left are still gone and nobody new has replaced them. They could bring back all the professions that they dumped and people still wouldnt come back because its a quasi fps game
Wrong.
You're fully *assuming* that people against it "simply lack the skill". That's a very presumptuous and, frankly, arrogant statement to make.
Some people, believe it or not, simply do not enjoy that kind of battle system in a RPG... how skilled they may or may not be at it makes absolutely no difference.
and the cash shop selling asphalt..." - Mimzel on F2P/Cash Shops
While I partially agree I do want to bring one argument up. In a role playing game you take possession of a character to control but this character is not YOU. When you enter combat in an RPG it isn't YOU fighting it's your CHARACTER fighting. It isn't supposed to be YOUR aiming ability or reflexes that matter but those of your CHRACTER. You can certainly have a first-person RPG or a third-person action shooter but you have to be careful how you mix the skills of the player with the skills of the character that they control. It is very easy to end up with an interface that either puts too much focus on the user and removes the character from the equation or one that is fustrating to the user because the game must implement artificial limitations on what you can do due to the stats of your character (ie the game decides your chracter missed even though YOU clearly hit the target).
While the current standard interface does have it's drawbacks it does a very good job at keeping the player and character separate but connected. Your chracter does the actions but you control the mind.
Having said that, I think SGW could work with a variety of systems and I don't really care what they do as long as they do it well.
I have to disagree with this, mostly because you confuse the camera/view system with the control system. These are not the same thing.
While I have issues with the game itself Assassins Creed is a good argument here. This is a third-person game yet you have complete control of your character. In fact the control system is more advanced and "connected" than any first-person game that I can think of.
Whether this game is first-person or third-person has no influence on whether you can do things like dodge, duck, hide behind cover to reload or anything similar.
I don't remember them ever switching between combat mode and exploration mode in either the series or the movie.
Also, Stargate is probably the BEST fictional universe ever for an MMO game. Not only does it allow for a nearly infinite variety of environments, situations, items, races and cultures but the concept itself allows for in-game explination and story continuity with an easier, cheaper and more robust server infrastructure. You couldn't design an IP better suited to an MMO if you tried.
So to join this heated debate. I think Tabula Rasa got the aiming system down pat. one a target is aquired you don't have to aim right at the creature to kill it, but aiming at it with the full bead rewards you like better crit chance and whatnot. I believe this to be the best control scheme for SGW. A third person view that you can switch to mouse mode to use the UI. This way it's not the boring point and click. The ability to use cover is much better than with a point and click. It rewards people who like first person shooter games by giving a slight advantage if you aim right at the enemy without alienating people who don't like to have to do that by being able to aquire a target and not worrry if your aiming right at it. I love Halo 3 and other various FPS games. I happen to be good at them but that doesn't mean I want my SGW game to be skill only. Level and equipment should mattter in an MMO and not who can keep their eye on the target better. I believe this to be the only way this game can be played succesfully. As far as puzzles and non-combat things goes.
Tabula Rasa solved that problem by providing a UI mode. My only complaint with that is that you should be able to have an option to toggle so you can make it so you have to hold down the right mouse button for aiming and an option to turn that off so you have to hit a keyboard button to switch between aiming and UI mode for pointing and clicking in puzzles and various interfaces. Any comments on this are welcome, I would like to know what others think of this.
Even though it's obvious that SGW would use FPS style, it wouldn't really suit the exploration side of things IMO.
What the hell does a RPG have to with the way to aim? That only tells you that you will have a character to live (play) the world with.
What the hell does a RPG have to with the way to aim? That only tells you that you will have a character to live (play) the world with.
Agreed obviously some people have no clue what RPG stands for.
noobs think rpg is tank and heal clicking 1-9 buttons
and to reply to what this guy said before
Originally posted by elondor
there has not been a successful mmo that has incorperated FPS style controls, and there won't be.
imagine this, you are lagging, trying to aim at a monster and your bullets are not registering because the monster is not where you are looking at.. sorry, but FPS controls in an MMO are ignorant, even age of conan's semi-fps ranger mode is freaking stupid.
the aiming isint 100% like on cs or anything if you didnt figure that out..... quite sad someone can be this dumb go try tabula rasa before replying to anything cuase you will only fail at life more every time if you dont
jaxinknight to answer your question I was army before I got into law enforcement and now I am archaeologist and elected official
No need to be so crude Raizeen but ya you are right. I think people are getting confused between FPS controls and FPS aiming cause there is a difference. You can still have a reticule of where your aiming at and once locked onto the enemy still be hitting it. Unless you have played Tabula Rasa you may not get that. I totally agree that a regular FPS will not do well. Besides the lag issue it just does not seem to work so far. As far as i'm concerned unless it's going to have a retucule to aim at but not force you to have to keep it on the enemy. Yet still reward the character by keeping it on the enemy. Like more crit percentage, more knockback, more side effects if the weapon has any like life still or damage over time or buffs. Things like that to entice me to want to keep it on the enemy but still cause the intended amount of damage. If no bonuses were given for keeping on the enemy I would be ok but it damn well better be fps style otherwise I just won't be happy and i'll moan and groan while playing it because my love for Stargate preceeds everything.
Make a few servers for FPS
Make a few servers with point and click....
Problem solved
Uhh... what?
........ you just won your self in a hall of fame for noobs
It will be point and click, as stated in the new podcast.
I am of the "can't stand FPS controls" camp. I'm playing Mass Effect, and loving the atmosphere and story, but I absolutely hate playing through the missions.
That said, whoever mentioned Assassin's Creed - I loved it. The fluidity of movement and character control was great. I'm not sure how such a control scheme could be implemented into an MMO, but hating FPS doesn't mean hating "twitch-based" combat which a fair bit of Assassin's Creed was (especially swordplay; sneaking and stabbing was skill-based but slower-paced).
Personally, what I don't like about FPS is the first-person crosshair aiming (yes, this is probably the essence of FPS.. but not necessarily of skill-based combat). Zoom it out to 3rd person and have the skill portion of combat be more based around use of terrain and counter-attacks than aim. The "counter" system in Assassin's Creed was my favorite.