WoW - Why it sucks (IMO)

Elemenz · June 2008

First I'm not a troll, hater or whatever, just a regular player opening up over WoW for my own relief, but someone could also read between the lines and see all the constructive criticism. As if...

I thought I'd make a list, but there's so much stuff close to each other, I wouldn't be able to hold them seperated, so here I go shooting random from one topic to another.

I'm over 25 and haven't really played that many MMORPG's. The first I experienced was Diablo II back in 2000. Actually it should be called just "MOG" because it had no "Massive Role Playing" in it.

I played Guild Wars for a short time when it came out but my first personal contact with WoW started as late as early 2008.

I got me the free 10 day trial, then bought the game which came with and additional 30 days, and quit playing after my 60 day game card expired late april. At that point I had a human lvl ~45 paladin, warrior, rogue, hunter, ~25 mage, and horde ~20 hunter, druid. So I tried out a little bit of everything, and here is my conclusion: it all sucks. WoW should actually be called WoI as in World of Illusion. I have to admit, it is one of the best games atm, big studio production, all the effort put into it, but that's why it's so deceptive.

It gives you the illusion of freedom of choice etc, but in the end you are only running in a tube from A to B without any real freedom, every action, quest, all scripted upon you... so moist and delicious, the cake is a lie, you all know it but you still want some. And Blizzard keeps cashing in.

Before going into the details, here's my almost philosophical take on games in general.

There can not be a perfect game. We are all different with our own preferences. Period. That's why there are so many games. Ever thought of making a MMORPG? Thought it would be perfect? Sure it would, but only for you or the group close to you. Every game out there atm is either too dynamic, too realistic, too this and that, or as in most cases lacking all of those properties.

    I have to start with the fact that WoW is a product, and products are made to make profit.

In this case the main incomes are the monthly fees. That's why all the limitations and restrictions.

Without them the realms would be explored in no time, the product being used up,

and customers would be more likely to stop p(l)aying, starting other games or activities. That's how business works. Here's a little conspiracy thingy about the whole worlds consumer industry:

Do you really think things can't be made to last longer? Cars, appliances, clothing, you name it...

They can, but won't, because it's no business if stuff wouldn't need to be replaced.

Or, they would have to charge 100 times the current price for a product. So the best business is to supply both disease and cure at the same. Patch WoW with some new changes now and then to keep the p(l)ayers happy enough to keep going, but don't make them too happy.



    Damn. I just can't keep my focus. I've been trying to think of a way to keep it together but I just can't do it. Too much of the same shit. Looks like this is going to be a much shorter post than I first thought it would after all. Let me try to pull it together.

    The whole WoW world, the environments, zones, places, items, monsters, quests, every fucking thing about WoW is without any trace of dynamic logic, making it for me simply the most amazing piece of mystery, how it has been able to gain the kind of popularity it did. The only thing I liked was the AH, which sadly got dominated time to time by no-life players who went farming for goods in amounts that forced others to sell the same goods for 90% less than they were worth.

   So, instead of making the game dynamic, deep, giving freedom of choice etc, they just pumped it full with tits, hot chicks, phallus like huge weapons (Duff man says OOH YEAH *high five*), simple repetitive meaningless quests, and sold it all to the tasteless zombie generation of our nation?

    Gotta try to get myself into details... aargh, bad memories... the pain.....

The fixed radius mobs who circle the same tiny area like idle bots, hostility motivation based on nothing else but your level. Oh such a cute effort from Blizzard, look, a wolf killed a prop mob bunny, "realism" hurray... but what's this, a cow walking around a pack of wolves who don't react? Why bother with the bunny, WHY? If you're going to do something dynamic and realistic, do it all the way or don't even think about it!

    An orc follows my mage, my plan: jump down the cliff with a magic feather, he won't dare follow me down that deadly drop, if, then I have him trapped down here. What happens? He walks down the 90*degree straight drop down wall like spiderman in reversed gear, then returns to his "original position" by walking - who am I kidding - FLYING up the same wall again, and because that isn't fubar enough, he does it with a 200% speed bonus!

    What better use of a bow than taking out enemies from a distance? Taking out enemies from a distance while standing on higher ground which they can't reach! Due to issues unknown my hunter just can't get himself to hit the target! No, seriously? You say it's been made that way by intention?

    "Yes. We can't allow that. As well as outrunning enemies, so we made them all as fast as you. And they always know where you are. You can't hide. They all got super senses, see through everything. And you can't take cover from projectiles behind things that unless they cover your dimensions by 2000%. Find a epic sized castle, that should stop the arrows from hitting you. Maybe. Yeah, and all projectiles come with a laser guide system. They never miss even if the shooter wouldn't predict your next moves."

Can't transfer anything I find to my alternative characters. All is "binds when equipped". Or when picked up. Or when looked at. Or when spoken of. Did someone think about this "sharp sword"? WHAM! Now it's bound to you. Nope. You can't take it off and give it to someone else.

No class or race has the brain capacity to learn more than 2 professions. They can cast armageddon hellfire from the skies and teleport themselves, but try to teach them basic blacksmithing, leatherworking, tailoring, skinning or mining, they go ERRRR DAAH? Me not can do that. Me only walk and breath. Not can do multitask. Naaarg......

I just gotta take a break... got so pissed off already by remembering how annoying all the restrictions are.

Thatim · June 2008

No freedom?

I don't know, but sure there are some restrictions, but it still is pretty free in my eyes?

What do you want? Everyone is a healingtankdpszomgwtf if you ...

... Goddamn I fell for it.

I am writing another post to defend WoW.

Waste of time, but..

If you don't like it, don't play it? I mean, I only like 2 mmorpg's atm, but I aint saying on each forum about how bad this game is.

Sure its your opinion, but why, why, whyyyyy are you sharing it if you don't want to get critisised?

bloodshiver · June 2008

First I got to say... After reading your post, The first thing that comes to my mind is the fact that your cheap. Everything you mentioned points right back to the fact that you have not played allot of MMOs, and the ones you have played are "free to play" excluding WoW.

For the Record, D2 was not and should not ever be considered an MMO. Just my opinion, but I think that D1 and D2 were both trials for blizzard to see exacty how the server and fan base would test out, for those were both there beginning into online play.

Now, let me dig into the rest. I do think you expect way to much. I only know of a few games with "total" freedom, and the lands where so vast that you hardly ran into anyone. Not to mention the content was so vague there was little to do. Between the too, you constantly found yourself running 5-10 mins to a checkpoint, to a quest that you had done 10k times - simply to make grinding for money easier. If no one had guessed im referring to SWG.

So, now we know that both have been made, within two seperate games. Both wow with tons of quests and content vs SWG with complete freedom. Lets run some numbers. WoW was in production for neerly 5 1/2 years, and with SWG in production for neerly 4 years. we are looking at a fair number of saying 6-7 years for a game that no company wants to take a risk at making. Also, remember that most DEVs overlap games, after finishing one project they move onto another. So anotherwords, you may see one game you love, and the next you might hate, and they both had a mix of some of the same DEVs in them.

Most companies would not take that risk to build "the perfect" game... for that is like putting all your eggs in one basket. Most people dont know that even though WoW was/is a giant and now is making blizz rich. It took the game neerly 2 years to break even after the game was completed, mater of fact, When they where developing BC they where still in debt from there first. This is why most MMOs eather make or break the company, and also why most new game companies (unless a break off from an old or larger one) dont even bother with production.

as for the other 2 good points that where made, You mentioned that your guided, and the game makes it take longer than neccesary. Is the point of playing a game to waste time? MMOs are not ment to spend 50 dollars on and defeat in less than 22 hours. (just IMO - those are more of a rip off).

You mentioned restrictions - Most MMOs put restrictions in because of issues that where in the past. I actually like the decent gear that has the BOP. Why should anyone use there supertoon to farm for all the good gear? BOP for the greens and anything that you put on your toon, also keeps the market in the game fresh. Luckly, these all can be recycled if they are an enchanter

These are just some things to think about. I just dont think allot of people realize what a company puts on the table when they enter the MMO world, and most of the free to play MMOs... well... you get what you pay for., and some that you pay to play... you get even less.

Pappy13 · June 2008

Originally posted by Elemenz

First I'm not a troll, hater or whatever, just a regular player opening up over WoW for my own relief, but someone could also read between the lines and see all the constructive criticism.
Sweet. Finally someone with constructive criticism.
I'm over 25 and haven't really played that many MMORPG's. The first I experienced was Diablo II back in 2000.
Diablo II? An MMORPG? Um, okaaaaaay.
So I tried out a little bit of everything, and here is my conclusion: it all sucks.
Well that's not too constructive if you ask me. But lets' continue reading...
WoW should actually be called WoI as in World of Illusion. I have to admit, it is one of the best games atm, big studio production, all the effort put into it, but that's why it's so deceptive.

    It gives you the illusion of freedom of choice etc, but in the end you are only running in a tube from A to B without any real freedom, every action, quest, all scripted upon you... so moist and delicious, the cake is a lie, you all know it but you still want some. And Blizzard keeps cashing in.
Still looking for some constructive criticism.
Before going into the details...
Where's the constructive criticsm. I've seen nothing yet.
The whole WoW world, the environments, zones, places, items, monsters, quests, every fucking thing about WoW is without any trace of dynamic logic, making it for me simply the most amazing piece of mystery, how it has been able to gain the kind of popularity it did. The only thing I liked was the AH, which sadly got dominated time to time by no-life players who went farming for goods in amounts that forced others to sell the same goods for 90% less than they were worth.
Still waiting.
So, instead of making the game dynamic, deep, giving freedom of choice etc, they just pumped it full with tits, hot chicks, phallus like huge weapons (Duff man says OOH YEAH *high five*), simple repetitive meaningless quests, and sold it all to the tasteless zombie generation of our nation?
Well there was maybe a hint of constructive criticism there, but nothing tangible. You want to give maybe an example of how Blizzard should have made it dynamic, deep, freedom of choice etc?
The fixed radius mobs who circle the same tiny area like idle bots, hostility motivation based on nothing else but your level. Oh such a cute effort from Blizzard, look, a wolf killed a prop mob bunny, "realism" hurray... but what's this, a cow walking around a pack of wolves who don't react? Why bother with the bunny, WHY? If you're going to do something dynamic and realistic, do it all the way or don't even think about it!
So your beef is that the mobs attacked a bunny and not a cow? Whoa, that's some scathing criticism there.  Perhaps wolfs don't like cows, they just like bunnies?
An orc follows my mage, my plan: jump down the cliff with a magic feather, he won't dare follow me down that deadly drop, if, then I have him trapped down here. What happens? He walks down the 90*degree straight drop down wall like spiderman in reversed gear, then returns to his "original position" by walking - who am I kidding - FLYING up the same wall again, and because that isn't fubar enough, he does it with a 200% speed bonus!
What are you talking about? Never before seen or heard of this and I've been playing for over 3 years. You witnessed this in 2 months of playtime and all below the level of 50? Are you talking in BG's or just normal PvP? Where exactly did this occur?
What better use of a bow than taking out enemies from a distance? Taking out enemies from a distance while standing on higher ground which they can't reach!
You have me at a disadvantage here. The ONLY limitation is you have to be within range and they have to be within line of sight. I shoot at and hit stuff with my hunter using a bow while standing on higher ground all the time.
Due to issues unknown my hunter just can't get himself to hit the target! No, seriously? You say it's been made that way by intention? Yes. We can't allow that.
Oh, you are talking about when you are standing on a roof or something where the mobs physically cannot get to you and they evade. Well you see that's put into the game to prevent you from taking advantage of the game. It really wouldn't be too fair for you to kill things that have no way to kill you now would it? This is too prevent people from getting an unfair advantage. They are called rules in most games and they are designed to encourage fair play. I generally look at those things as a positive rather than a negative.
As well as outrunning enemies, so we made them all as fast as you.
You realize you have a skill that allows you to run faster as a hunter right?
And they always know where you are. You can't hide.
Not true. You have another skill called Feign Death as a hunter. Try it. It really does work. Mages have invisibility, rogues have vanish. There's plenty of escapability in the game.
They all got super senses, see through everything. And you can't take cover from projectiles behind things that unless they cover your dimensions by 2000%. Find a epic sized castle, that should stop the arrows from hitting you. Maybe.
Not sure what you are talking about again as line of sight is very much a real thing in the game. Yeah, you may not be able to hide behind a tree or a bush, but run around a corner of a building and I guarantee that the mob won't be able to hit you until they round the corner and get LOS on you.
Yeah, and all projectiles come with a laser guide system. They never miss even if the shooter wouldn't predict your next moves."
Well it's not true that they never miss, but you're right that they can still hit you on the move.
Can't transfer anything I find to my alternative characters. All is "binds when equipped".
Here's a hint, don't equip it if you want to use it on an alt.
Or when picked up. Or when looked at. Or when spoken of.
Are you sure you played the game for 2 months?
No class or race has the brain capacity to learn more than 2 professions.
At a time. You can learn them all, you just cant learn them all at once. So you want to be able to have 1 character and level every profession with that 1 character? Don't you think that would kinda put a damper on people having alts?
I just gotta take a break... got so pissed off already by remembering how annoying all the restrictions are.
Restrictions? In WoW? Well that's a new one on me. Most folks come here claiming that WoW is the easiest MMORPG there is and yet you claim there are all these restrictions and things you can't do. Well maybe that's why you thought DII was an MMORPG.

SignusM · June 2008

No freedom, true. The new generation of games following WoW are all theme park designed. You're forced to pick a linear class, that gives you a handful of abilities, that get a little stronger as you level up.

You go from one quest hub to another doing pointless "kill 20 of that" quests. It tells you exactly where to go on a night bright and colorful map, and then you run back to do it again. They aren't really quests, its an insult to the name. Hunting for the Holy Grail was a quest, following the Green Knight was a quest. Bringing back 20 hooves is a TASK. Don't worry about trying to FIND these pointless tasks, everyone has a giant exclamation point over there head just incase you didn't stumble upon the 20 of them as soon as you entered the area.

WoW didn't innovate in any area. They just took some successful ideas from the MMOs before it, simplified it, watered it down, made sure there was no difficulty whatsoever, so that a retarded monkey could successfully reach level 60 with no gripe. You die? No problem! No penalty. We'll show you just where to go!

The whole pull of WoW is it has the addictive mentality of good MMOs, with none of risk vs reward. Risk vs Reward creates a deeper game experience, but most of the people who play WoW never played another MMO, and they have no idea what else is out there, so they're satisfied with the level of ease, and get addicted nonetheless. Its just shallow reward reward reward. That is until you get to max level, when you have to raid 4 times a week every day just to get a chance at getting some armor that will become totally obsolete by the next expansion!

Sadly, most gamers nowadays say "I've played a few MMOs, and WoW is the best one out there." They say this because they only try the MMOs that came out AFTER WoW, when the industry started going way down hill. They'll never get to experience the wonderful, innovative, and memorable games like Dark Age of Camelot, EverQuest, Asheron's Call, or Ultima Online. Truly sad.

adammain · June 2008

Originally posted by Elemenz

I got me the free 10 day trial, then bought the game which came with and additional 30 days, and quit playing after my 60 day game card expired late april. At that point I had a human lvl ~45 paladin, warrior, rogue, hunter, ~25 mage, and horde ~20 hunter, druid. So I tried out a little bit of everything, and here is my conclusion: it all sucks.

Stopped reading after that.

Its all well and good to criticize a game. I personally just stopped playing WoW about 2 weeks ago, and Ive been playing since beta. But to be 25 levels away from the cap, where most of what WoW has to offer ( whether that be good or bad ) doesnt really give you the right to say the game sucks as a whole. Thats like reading a book half way through and concluding that the ending must suck.

Its ok though, you said yourself this is your first MMO. Be warned that most games in the genre are like this, especially so far after release. You missed the entire population leveling together, the havoc that created and all the good times spawned from that.

Its not that the game sucks, its that the point at which you entered the game was lackluster.

Pappy13 · June 2008

Originally posted by SignusM

No freedom, true.
You go from one quest hub to another doing pointless "kill 20 of that" quests. It tells you exactly where to go on a night bright and colorful map, and then you run back to do it again.
You're free to skip the quests.
Sadly, most gamers nowadays say "I've played a few MMOs, and WoW is the best one out there." They say this because they only try the MMOs that came out AFTER WoW, when the industry started going way down hill. They'll never get to experience the wonderful, innovative, and memorable games like Dark Age of Camelot, EverQuest, Asheron's Call, or Ultima Online. Truly sad.
If they were so wonderful, innovative and memorable, why is it that most don't play them anymore? My own opinion? They were wonderful, innovative and memorable for their time, but times have changed. You may not like the changes, but some people do.

SignusM · June 2008

Originally posted by Pappy13

Originally posted by SignusM

No freedom, true.
You go from one quest hub to another doing pointless "kill 20 of that" quests. It tells you exactly where to go on a night bright and colorful map, and then you run back to do it again.
You're free to skip the quests.
Sadly, most gamers nowadays say "I've played a few MMOs, and WoW is the best one out there." They say this because they only try the MMOs that came out AFTER WoW, when the industry started going way down hill. They'll never get to experience the wonderful, innovative, and memorable games like Dark Age of Camelot, EverQuest, Asheron's Call, or Ultima Online. Truly sad.
If they were so wonderful, innovative and memorable, why is it that most don't play them anymore? My own opinion? They were wonderful, innovative and memorable for their time, but times have changed. You may not like the changes, but some people do.

People stop playing for a few reasons. With EQ, its difficult for any new players to get into it due to the number of expansions and content they'd have to work through to get on an even level with everyone else. With DAoC, Mythic made one fatal flaw with a bad expansion, but the game is seeing a revival until WAR comes out. Ultima Online is still being played 11 years after its release!

Its because these games are old. Most people either don't want to deal with the classic systems because they're not as flashy, or because they're too used to the level of ease and simplicity of WoW and are scared off.

Unknown · June 2008

I don't bash people who dislike the game..everyone has their opinion.

But I'm one of those that truly love the game. It's easy to pick up and play..which I like..not every game should need to require a Masters degree to get into it. I've played a ton of MMO's..embarassingly too many actually. This was the first one that my wife actually (out of the blue and without my input) just started playing, mainly due to the broad art style and easy-to-do quests.

There is a method to Blizzard's madness of keeping the quests relatively easy to follow and repetitive..because its easier for a wider scope of player to accomplish, and as we know, that equals account retention.

I used to be very very anti-WoW..but as you get older and time spent to gaming dwindles more and more..you need something that can provide fun in smaller doses..and WoW has mastered that.

Pappy13 · June 2008

Originally posted by SignusM

Originally posted by Pappy13

Originally posted by SignusM

No freedom, true.
You go from one quest hub to another doing pointless "kill 20 of that" quests. It tells you exactly where to go on a night bright and colorful map, and then you run back to do it again.
You're free to skip the quests.
Sadly, most gamers nowadays say "I've played a few MMOs, and WoW is the best one out there." They say this because they only try the MMOs that came out AFTER WoW, when the industry started going way down hill. They'll never get to experience the wonderful, innovative, and memorable games like Dark Age of Camelot, EverQuest, Asheron's Call, or Ultima Online. Truly sad.
If they were so wonderful, innovative and memorable, why is it that most don't play them anymore? My own opinion? They were wonderful, innovative and memorable for their time, but times have changed. You may not like the changes, but some people do.

People stop playing for a few reasons. With EQ, its difficult for any new players to get into it due to the number of expansions and content they'd have to work through to get on an even level with everyone else. With DAoC, Mythic made one fatal flaw with a bad expansion, but the game is seeing a revival until WAR comes out. Ultima Online is still being played 11 years after its release!

Its because these games are old. Most people either don't want to deal with the classic systems because they're not as flashy, or because they're too used to the level of ease and simplicity of WoW and are scared off.

So why is that a "bad" thing? What's wrong with simplicity? It's a game, not a lifestyle. Some of the best games of all time have been simple. You really think PacMan was a tough game? Heck forget about video games and think about games you played as a kid. Is there anything really that difficult about hide n seek? Cops n robbers? Checkers? No, the only question you have to ask is can just about anyone play it and is it fun to play? If the answer to those 2 questions is yes, then the game is going to be popular. I don't really see a whole lot of people bagging on PacMan.

Elemenz · June 2008

Originally posted by Thatim

If you don't like it, don't play it? I mean, I only like 2 mmorpg's atm, but I aint saying on each forum about how bad this game is.
Sure its your opinion, but why, why, whyyyyy are you sharing it if you don't want to get critisised?

Bad reply.

How about you read before answering?

I did say I quit WoW.

And where do I say I don't want to get critisised?

That's exactly what I want. Wake people up, even if it makes them angry, just get everyone to talk about good or bad things in (a) game(s), so the word grows and hopefully gets out to a stage where the industry takes things into concideration.

DeadlyMage · June 2008

i play both eq and wow and enjoy them. WoW only gets fun at the end game raids. so try some of those

Elemenz · June 2008

Originally posted by SignusM

No freedom, true. The new generation of games following WoW are all theme park designed. You're forced to pick a linear class, that gives you a handful of abilities, that get a little stronger as you level up.
You go from one quest hub to another doing pointless "kill 20 of that" quests. It tells you exactly where to go on a night bright and colorful map, and then you run back to do it again. They aren't really quests, its an insult to the name. Hunting for the Holy Grail was a quest, following the Green Knight was a quest. Bringing back 20 hooves is a TASK. Don't worry about trying to FIND these pointless tasks, everyone has a giant exclamation point over there head just incase you didn't stumble upon the 20 of them as soon as you entered the area.
WoW didn't innovate in any area. They just took some successful ideas from the MMOs before it, simplified it, watered it down, made sure there was no difficulty whatsoever, so that a retarded monkey could successfully reach level 60 with no gripe. You die? No problem! No penalty. We'll show you just where to go!
The whole pull of WoW is it has the addictive mentality of good MMOs, with none of risk vs reward. Risk vs Reward creates a deeper game experience, but most of the people who play WoW never played another MMO, and they have no idea what else is out there, so they're satisfied with the level of ease, and get addicted nonetheless. Its just shallow reward reward reward. That is until you get to max level, when you have to raid 4 times a week every day just to get a chance at getting some armor that will become totally obsolete by the next expansion!
Sadly, most gamers nowadays say "I've played a few MMOs, and WoW is the best one out there." They say this because they only try the MMOs that came out AFTER WoW, when the industry started going way down hill. They'll never get to experience the wonderful, innovative, and memorable games like Dark Age of Camelot, EverQuest, Asheron's Call, or Ultima Online. Truly sad.

Excellent reply.

OFP (operation flashpoint) is no MMORPG, a strategic combat simulator, but it did have a story, and even though it's SP (ofc you got online DM/ CTF/ etc), it got a very intense pull to it. The reason why, I think, is the fact that OFP had only 2 save times during every mission, 1 automatic checkpoint in the middle and 1 whenever the player wanted. Even if you used the option to fast forward x times the real ingame time speed (since some missions took really long) the intensity didn't water down. But, that's just hard to put into MMORPG's. Got to find a golden middle path between fast respawn that has no penalty and having only 1 life.

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