I think i remember reading in an article that RWT updates cost them 60k members, that is quite a lot but then again it isnt compared to the amount of people who didnt quit.
Online games group aims for growth the Nintendo way
Dan Sabbagh
div#related-article-links p a, div#related-article-links p a:visited { color:#06c; }
Spending a bank holiday weekend as a level 99 magician might not be everybody's cup of tea, but when the alternative is a trip to Ikea with the family, the attractions of RuneScape, a sword-and-sorcery online computer game, are at least understandable.
On January 21, Martin Luther King Day in the US, when stock markets in the rest of the world were going into meltdown, a record 250,000 people logged into the realm of Gielinor, the creation of Jagex, a little-known Cambridge company.
A million people subscribe to RuneScape, paying £3.20 a month in Britain, and the equivalent of $5 (£2.50) elsewhere, for unfettered access. After the juggernaut of World of Warcraft - which has ten million subscribers - RuneScape is arguably the next most successful multiplayer game, although its ethos is completely different. There is no need to own special software to play it, as RuneScape runs on any browser using Java, although that means the graphics are simple.
Unlike Warcraft, the Jagex philosophy is to ensure that a large part of RuneScape can be played free. Fans, of course, get lured into paying; membership gives them access to more land, more skills and spells, and freedom from adverts. When Jagex allowed subscribers to create their own houses, such is people's obsession with property that 100,000 signed up as paying subscribers. The number of free players is still far greater: in all, six million have played over the past fortnight. Still, the paying players ensure that RuneScape is highly profitable. Accounts for 2006, the latest available, show Jagex making pre-tax profits of £10.2 million on sales of £16.8 million (a margin of 60 per cent). Geoff Iddison, the chief executive of the 400-employee company, says that “revenue and profits are growing at 35per cent”, making it worth well over £100 million.
Yet until recently, Jagex has been run relatively uncommercially: RuneScape has not been promoted; a game launch in 2007 never happened, and profits depend on spotty boys. “I'd estimate the audience is over 60 per cent male, aged between 13 and 18,” says Mr Iddison, probably overemphasising the female contingent.
The new boss came in from eBay to develop “a three-year plan” and dismisses talk of a sale. A US venture capital firm, Insight Venture Partners, may own 35 per cent, but the low-profile founders, led by the original designer, Andrew Gower, own the rest. “We have control and we don't need to raise any more money; we have enough for organic growth,” Mr Iddison says, adding that the plan at present is to see how much the company can be expanded.
RuneScape has already survived one test. Alarmed by the growth of people buying and selling RuneScape treasure on the internet - for example, a million gold (the game's currency) sold for $5 - the company acted to stop it. Imre Jele, head of RuneScape development, said: “We had a big problem with traders in China, and some of the former Russian states, using stolen credit cards to buy subscriptions, and then use bots [automated software] to farm gold. Not only was it cheating; it was getting boring for players to find a load of bots mining.”
Game designers wanted to ban so-called real world trading, but they grappled to find a mechanism to stop it. “What we realised is that we had to stop unequal trading in the game; where suddenly somebody would turn up with a million gold,” Mr Jele says, and so the company introduced a range of restrictions, for which the launch of a “stock market” was crucial. Now only people can trade items of similar value - and for the moment, real world trading is in abeyance. The price of a million gold shot up to $20 to $25 - and the clean-up cost RuneScape 60,000 subscribers.
This month, Jagex's drive for growth brings the launch of Funorb, a website aimed at “the time pressure gamer” on the view that anyone over 21 lacks the time to commit themselves to RuneScape. It will have 18 simple but highly playable 2D games. All can be played free, but extra levels will cost £2 a month. The hope is that Funorb will bring new people to gaming in the lunch hour, as Jagex tries to replicate Nintendo's success in expanding the gaming demographic. If it does, Jagex will one day be worth a lot of gold.
Game designers wanted to ban so-called real world trading, but they grappled to find a mechanism to stop it. “What we realised is that we had to stop unequal trading in the game; where suddenly somebody would turn up with a million gold,” Mr Jele says, and so the company introduced a range of restrictions, for which the launch of a “stock market” was crucial. Now only people can trade items of similar value - and for the moment, real world trading is in abeyance. The price of a million gold shot up to $20 to $25 - and the clean-up cost RuneScape 60,000 subscribers.
I believe they meant the clean-up of RWTers. This would mean that 60k people quit after the update.
__________________________________________________ In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten
In my eyes runescape really is ruined. Many of the great features just dissapeared. I think the main reason why Jagex did this is to make their game more open for younger gamers. By introducing the Grand Exchange system it's made impossible for smart players to merchant. Young players have no idea how to do this. Younger players might get lost in the wilderness and lose alot of items with the new Pk rules it's impossible to lose your gear. It seems like Jagex is de-adulting it's game.
I think those must be the initial membership loss immediately after the updates, I do believe they have lost alot more due to this over the months that followed. I believe that reference to 60,000 membership loss was the immediate loss within the first couple of days and since they do not have an option when you cancel membership " did you quit over the updates" it is hard for them to actually gage the reasons for people cancelling. I think those numbers are way higher than what was stated there, and there are still people quitting the game over the updates even now. Some of my friends are just accomplishing some of the goals they had previously set and then are quitting, when we all would still be playing if they had not made such a terrible mistake.... yea they messed that game up real good . lol
In my eyes runescape really is ruined. Many of the great features just dissapeared. I think the main reason why Jagex did this is to make their game more open for younger gamers. By introducing the Grand Exchange system it's made impossible for smart players to merchant. Young players have no idea how to do this. Younger players might get lost in the wilderness and lose alot of items with the new Pk rules it's impossible to lose your gear. It seems like Jagex is de-adulting it's game.
Aaah, its made it harder to merchant, and more difficult to find a niche, but not impossible. Using the GE database, and with around 20m to start, a, lets say, arbitrage with rarer, high value items can be used.
Unless your were a merchant before trade restrictions/GE who bought/sold things like d chains, pHats, etc. This form of "merchanting" is far more efficient.
I don't agree with the updates I enjoyed Runescape alot more before but I can see their reasons for doing it.. It has saved Runescape and because of these updates we still have a good game that we can enjoy. However I think Runescape blatently know they have done wrong and are oblivious to our efforts to help such as posts on the forums on how to stamp out RWT but to bring back to wilderness so I am 50/50 about the update. I just wish Jagex would listen.
I don't agree with the updates I enjoyed Runescape alot more before but I can see their reasons for doing it.. It has saved Runescape and because of these updates we still have a good game that we can enjoy. However I think Runescape blatently know they have done wrong and are oblivious to our efforts to help such as posts on the forums on how to stamp out RWT but to bring back to wilderness so I am 50/50 about the update. I just wish Jagex would listen.
Well, i for one, do not see the reason for the updates. every MMORPG has some form of real world trading, you can't expect runescape to be any different.
Really, who cares. It's Runescape - a MMORPG for kids.
its rated for 13 year olds -.- and i think its good the trade and wild update made more than 10,000 players quit most of those players were scammers and RWTers atleast they got rid of some of them RIGHT? you have to think of the bright side and if you hate runescape, dont post anything on RUNESCAPE FORUMS
its rated for 13 year olds -.- and i think its good the trade and wild update made more than 10,000 players quit most of those players were scammers and RWTers atleast they got rid of some of them RIGHT? you have to think of the bright side and if you hate runescape, dont post anything on RUNESCAPE FORUMS
Actually you are incorrect. The RMTS still play the game, they get paid to play so they are still there just now they are selling fully loaded accounts and logging onto other peoples accounts and getting the stuff they paid for for them while they sleep. The Player loss was in LAW ABIDING MEMBERS those updates affected clans, families, and long time players the most and they are the ones that quit. BTW your numbers are wayy off, Jagex announced that they lost $60,000 members months ago, and I still think they greatly deflated that number to try and make it not look as bad as it truely was at that time. Since then they have lost hundreds of thousands of players and are now hiding their player counter that used to show the number of players online. The counters were showing about 50,0000 players online before they decided to hide them according to everyone I spoke with on that subject.
I am thinking of the bright side of all this, they are hiring for a "New Head of Runescape" so hopefully they are getting rid of the idiot who messed the game up and hopefully are getting someone in there that can make real changes to the game instead of demolish it. That is the bright side of all this, maybe the next guy will do better.
Your right do not go Runescapes game forums if you disagree and want to make good suggestions to their game, they will just delete the posts, and ban you from forums. That is why players can come here and post freely about the game where Jagex cannot control the population by trying to brainwash them into thinking that they needed to do that to their game. The members here have played other games and can compare all games freely without having the Game makers decide what they get to say. That is what this site is for. Being able to speak freely about the games love em or hate em. All opinions are welcome here, the good the bad and the ugly.
And also, botting is still pretty much alive... so is RWT, they tried hard; but failed.
Maybe there are a few people botting but the number of bots actually has decreased, places where yews etc were where there were 5 level 3's cutting the tree you were cutting, they have mostly gone. And yes RWT obviously isn't totally gone but it is harder for them to do it and less people do it now because its not worth the effort.
True, but what im saying is their efforts to bring down botting etc brought down runescape, thats MY view atleast...
Mass banning worked perfect, but they did not really have enough time for that, the two times they DID do it we saw a MAJOR decline in the bot population.
Fact is, I miss Runescape... Behind the crappy browser based graphics, it used to be a deep game with an awesome economy, amazing PvP and what not.
True, but what im saying is their efforts to bring down botting etc brought down runescape, thats MY view atleast...
Mass banning worked perfect, but they did not really have enough time for that, the two times they DID do it we saw a MAJOR decline in the bot population.
Fact is, I miss Runescape... Behind the crappy browser based graphics, it used to be a deep game with an awesome economy, amazing PvP and what not.
Actually, you can still merchant... it's almost better now then before the update. Yes pures are in trouble because they have no use, but the people that ever thought of making pures in the first place are insane! There no good. Runescapes economy is going up, even though you don't think the new updates were good. Most people take advantage of them.
Actually, you can still merchant... it's almost better now then before the update. Yes pures are in trouble because they have no use, but the people that ever thought of making pures in the first place are insane! There no good. Runescapes economy is going up, even though you don't think the new updates were good. Most people take advantage of them.
I have to strongly disagree that the econonmy is going up, in it's current state it is very, very broken.
When they removed the wilderness pk they also removed the demand for player made items, and threw the game into a majorly off balanced tailspin. Since Runite armor, weapons, and crafted dhide do not degrade or need to be replaced a player only needs one of them in the game. Any player who crafts in the game crafts many of these items, not just one, and since there are more sellers than buyers of these items The supply and demand of the game is thrown way off. With the old wilderness it created a huge demand for Pots, food, armor ,weapons, runes, and arrows that no longer exists. There is no reason to craft these items any more because the profit is gone. Pots sit on the exchange forever now when you used to be able to sell supersets in 2 min if you just hopped to the right world to do so. The entire system is very broken because the supplies it takes to make the items cost more than the crafted items themselves so there is no profit in skill training and no reason to exist. That in combination with the trade limits means you can no longer convienance merchant and there is no longer any real reason for convienace merchanting simply because most of convienance merchanting took place due to the old wilderness. Players were in a hurry to get back to fighting and would buy at a higher price not to have to go to faly w2 in order to buy what they needed to get back to the war. They have not done anything to repair this broken crippled economy since the updates, I do not see how they really can within the new framework, unless they start making all items degradable and create a new demand for all player crafted items I do not see it happeneing any time soon.
Agreed Devil. Stength potions are now 750ea, from when they used to sell 1k each. I am now going to be conducting a test- I have put 600 lobsters in the G.E. selling at 248ea. If the econemy had actually gotten better, then we should see them sell rather quickly, since they sold very fast before (especially at that price).
__________________________________________________ In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten
Comments
Did it say how they lost 60k mems from RWT?
From http://business.timesonline.co.uk/tol/business/industry_sectors/media/article3285256.ece
Online games group aims for growth the Nintendo way
div#related-article-links p a, div#related-article-links p a:visited {
color:#06c;
}
Spending a bank holiday weekend as a level 99 magician might not be everybody's cup of tea, but when the alternative is a trip to Ikea with the family, the attractions of RuneScape, a sword-and-sorcery online computer game, are at least understandable.
On January 21, Martin Luther King Day in the US, when stock markets in the rest of the world were going into meltdown, a record 250,000 people logged into the realm of Gielinor, the creation of Jagex, a little-known Cambridge company.
A million people subscribe to RuneScape, paying £3.20 a month in Britain, and the equivalent of $5 (£2.50) elsewhere, for unfettered access. After the juggernaut of World of Warcraft - which has ten million subscribers - RuneScape is arguably the next most successful multiplayer game, although its ethos is completely different. There is no need to own special software to play it, as RuneScape runs on any browser using Java, although that means the graphics are simple.
Unlike Warcraft, the Jagex philosophy is to ensure that a large part of RuneScape can be played free. Fans, of course, get lured into paying; membership gives them access to more land, more skills and spells, and freedom from adverts. When Jagex allowed subscribers to create their own houses, such is people's obsession with property that 100,000 signed up as paying subscribers. The number of free players is still far greater: in all, six million have played over the past fortnight. Still, the paying players ensure that RuneScape is highly profitable. Accounts for 2006, the latest available, show Jagex making pre-tax profits of £10.2 million on sales of £16.8 million (a margin of 60 per cent). Geoff Iddison, the chief executive of the 400-employee company, says that “revenue and profits are growing at 35per cent”, making it worth well over £100 million.
Yet until recently, Jagex has been run relatively uncommercially: RuneScape has not been promoted; a game launch in 2007 never happened, and profits depend on spotty boys. “I'd estimate the audience is over 60 per cent male, aged between 13 and 18,” says Mr Iddison, probably overemphasising the female contingent.
The new boss came in from eBay to develop “a three-year plan” and dismisses talk of a sale. A US venture capital firm, Insight Venture Partners, may own 35 per cent, but the low-profile founders, led by the original designer, Andrew Gower, own the rest. “We have control and we don't need to raise any more money; we have enough for organic growth,” Mr Iddison says, adding that the plan at present is to see how much the company can be expanded.
RuneScape has already survived one test. Alarmed by the growth of people buying and selling RuneScape treasure on the internet - for example, a million gold (the game's currency) sold for $5 - the company acted to stop it. Imre Jele, head of RuneScape development, said: “We had a big problem with traders in China, and some of the former Russian states, using stolen credit cards to buy subscriptions, and then use bots [automated software] to farm gold. Not only was it cheating; it was getting boring for players to find a load of bots mining.”
Game designers wanted to ban so-called real world trading, but they grappled to find a mechanism to stop it. “What we realised is that we had to stop unequal trading in the game; where suddenly somebody would turn up with a million gold,” Mr Jele says, and so the company introduced a range of restrictions, for which the launch of a “stock market” was crucial. Now only people can trade items of similar value - and for the moment, real world trading is in abeyance. The price of a million gold shot up to $20 to $25 - and the clean-up cost RuneScape 60,000 subscribers.
This month, Jagex's drive for growth brings the launch of Funorb, a website aimed at “the time pressure gamer” on the view that anyone over 21 lacks the time to commit themselves to RuneScape. It will have 18 simple but highly playable 2D games. All can be played free, but extra levels will cost £2 a month. The hope is that Funorb will bring new people to gaming in the lunch hour, as Jagex tries to replicate Nintendo's success in expanding the gaming demographic. If it does, Jagex will one day be worth a lot of gold.
?
I believe they meant the clean-up of RWTers. This would mean that 60k people quit after the update.
__________________________________________________
In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten
In my eyes runescape really is ruined. Many of the great features just dissapeared. I think the main reason why Jagex did this is to make their game more open for younger gamers. By introducing the Grand Exchange system it's made impossible for smart players to merchant. Young players have no idea how to do this. Younger players might get lost in the wilderness and lose alot of items with the new Pk rules it's impossible to lose your gear. It seems like Jagex is de-adulting it's game.
I think those must be the initial membership loss immediately after the updates, I do believe they have lost alot more due to this over the months that followed. I believe that reference to 60,000 membership loss was the immediate loss within the first couple of days and since they do not have an option when you cancel membership " did you quit over the updates" it is hard for them to actually gage the reasons for people cancelling. I think those numbers are way higher than what was stated there, and there are still people quitting the game over the updates even now. Some of my friends are just accomplishing some of the goals they had previously set and then are quitting, when we all would still be playing if they had not made such a terrible mistake.... yea they messed that game up real good . lol
Who cares?
PS... Membership is a ripoff!
I quit runescape because of the trading update...now i can't merchant or give my friends stuff...irritating..
Unless your were a merchant before trade restrictions/GE who bought/sold things like d chains, pHats, etc. This form of "merchanting" is far more efficient.
Behind the scenes June
Woo, two new quests! Yay!
i miss the wilderness
who doesn't
Well, i for one, do not see the reason for the updates. every MMORPG has some form of real world trading, you can't expect runescape to be any different.
Yes but it was the MANNER IN WHICH JAGEX CARRIED THESE UPDATES OUT which has upset lots of people.
its rated for 13 year olds -.- and i think its good the trade and wild update made more than 10,000 players quit most of those players were scammers and RWTers atleast they got rid of some of them RIGHT? you have to think of the bright side and if you hate runescape, dont post anything on RUNESCAPE FORUMS
hmmmm
Actually you are incorrect. The RMTS still play the game, they get paid to play so they are still there just now they are selling fully loaded accounts and logging onto other peoples accounts and getting the stuff they paid for for them while they sleep. The Player loss was in LAW ABIDING MEMBERS those updates affected clans, families, and long time players the most and they are the ones that quit. BTW your numbers are wayy off, Jagex announced that they lost $60,000 members months ago, and I still think they greatly deflated that number to try and make it not look as bad as it truely was at that time. Since then they have lost hundreds of thousands of players and are now hiding their player counter that used to show the number of players online. The counters were showing about 50,0000 players online before they decided to hide them according to everyone I spoke with on that subject.
I am thinking of the bright side of all this, they are hiring for a "New Head of Runescape" so hopefully they are getting rid of the idiot who messed the game up and hopefully are getting someone in there that can make real changes to the game instead of demolish it. That is the bright side of all this, maybe the next guy will do better.
Your right do not go Runescapes game forums if you disagree and want to make good suggestions to their game, they will just delete the posts, and ban you from forums. That is why players can come here and post freely about the game where Jagex cannot control the population by trying to brainwash them into thinking that they needed to do that to their game. The members here have played other games and can compare all games freely without having the Game makers decide what they get to say. That is what this site is for. Being able to speak freely about the games love em or hate em. All opinions are welcome here, the good the bad and the ugly.
I believe taking out Staking, Trading, and PKing ruined the game big time...
Makes me miss the old days, Runescape Classic... ooh... good ol' days... even the community back then was... sooo much more mature.
EDIT: and the counter is still there.
And also, botting is still pretty much alive... so is RWT, they tried hard; but failed.
Maybe there are a few people botting but the number of bots actually has decreased, places where yews etc were where there were 5 level 3's cutting the tree you were cutting, they have mostly gone. And yes RWT obviously isn't totally gone but it is harder for them to do it and less people do it now because its not worth the effort.
?
True, but what im saying is their efforts to bring down botting etc brought down runescape, thats MY view atleast...
Mass banning worked perfect, but they did not really have enough time for that, the two times they DID do it we saw a MAJOR decline in the bot population.
Fact is, I miss Runescape... Behind the crappy browser based graphics, it used to be a deep game with an awesome economy, amazing PvP and what not.
OK that's fair enough..
?
Actually, you can still merchant... it's almost better now then before the update. Yes pures are in trouble because they have no use, but the people that ever thought of making pures in the first place are insane! There no good. Runescapes economy is going up, even though you don't think the new updates were good. Most people take advantage of them.
I have to strongly disagree that the econonmy is going up, in it's current state it is very, very broken.
When they removed the wilderness pk they also removed the demand for player made items, and threw the game into a majorly off balanced tailspin. Since Runite armor, weapons, and crafted dhide do not degrade or need to be replaced a player only needs one of them in the game. Any player who crafts in the game crafts many of these items, not just one, and since there are more sellers than buyers of these items The supply and demand of the game is thrown way off. With the old wilderness it created a huge demand for Pots, food, armor ,weapons, runes, and arrows that no longer exists. There is no reason to craft these items any more because the profit is gone. Pots sit on the exchange forever now when you used to be able to sell supersets in 2 min if you just hopped to the right world to do so. The entire system is very broken because the supplies it takes to make the items cost more than the crafted items themselves so there is no profit in skill training and no reason to exist. That in combination with the trade limits means you can no longer convienance merchant and there is no longer any real reason for convienace merchanting simply because most of convienance merchanting took place due to the old wilderness. Players were in a hurry to get back to fighting and would buy at a higher price not to have to go to faly w2 in order to buy what they needed to get back to the war. They have not done anything to repair this broken crippled economy since the updates, I do not see how they really can within the new framework, unless they start making all items degradable and create a new demand for all player crafted items I do not see it happeneing any time soon.
Agreed Devil. Stength potions are now 750ea, from when they used to sell 1k each. I am now going to be conducting a test- I have put 600 lobsters in the G.E. selling at 248ea. If the econemy had actually gotten better, then we should see them sell rather quickly, since they sold very fast before (especially at that price).
__________________________________________________
In memory of Laura "Taera" Genender. Passed away on Aug/13/08 - Rest In Peace; you will not be forgotten