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Greatest Sandbox MMO
Uberfatkid
Member Posts: 98
in LFGame
Which MMO out there today represents SWG pre NGE the most? Where you can build towns and have great meaningful crafting. Where there is more to the game than just PvP.
Comments
There IS nothing. The formula Raph created was insanely unique....it was a hybrid of creative style. SWG wasn't actually a sandbox game. It just happened to blend VERY good sandbox elements into a familiar MMO setting and it worked very well considering.
With a more detailed tutorial, and more detailed UI to help explain things (like skills and items...even locations could have been assisted with better UI) the game would have grown. The issue is...there was no direction, and the UI did not help guide the new player very well at all. Of all the things they should have taken from WoW...the UI was a biggie and they missed it. WoW's UI will detail many things for you on simple mouseover. It nearly gives you a spreadsheet on functions and figures for everything in the game, and does so in a way that isn't invasive and is actually user friendly.
Either way, the greatest sandbox MMO cannot be replicated....because it wasn't a sandbox MMO. It was a blend of rollercoaster and sandbox, and it was something I doubt anyone else will ever get so close to right again. Raph sometimes (most times) has great ideals that he just cannot refine. Heavy dreamers and thinkers are like that...they need someone to mold the concept and reign it in when it wanders too far. No one ever gave Raph such a person, and its sad. They simply shut him out....and make fun of his far reaching dreams. Had SOE been competent enough....they would have been able to see the good in what he dreamed of. Instead, all they saw were figures and sales.
Bah....I rant, and its off topic anyway.
The sandbox MMO is a dream. To do it best, you have to blend it. No one is blending...they either try too much sandbox, or have too much rollercoaster.
Well maybe not SWG type MMO's, but what is the closest to a sandbox MMO out now?
There IS nothing. The formula Raph created was insanely unique....it was a hybrid of creative style. SWG wasn't actually a sandbox game. It just happened to blend VERY good sandbox elements into a familiar MMO setting and it worked very well considering.
With a more detailed tutorial, and more detailed UI to help explain things (like skills and items...even locations could have been assisted with better UI) the game would have grown. The issue is...there was no direction, and the UI did not help guide the new player very well at all. Of all the things they should have taken from WoW...the UI was a biggie and they missed it. WoW's UI will detail many things for you on simple mouseover. It nearly gives you a spreadsheet on functions and figures for everything in the game, and does so in a way that isn't invasive and is actually user friendly.
Either way, the greatest sandbox MMO cannot be replicated....because it wasn't a sandbox MMO. It was a blend of rollercoaster and sandbox, and it was something I doubt anyone else will ever get so close to right again. Raph sometimes (most times) has great ideals that he just cannot refine. Heavy dreamers and thinkers are like that...they need someone to mold the concept and reign it in when it wanders too far. No one ever gave Raph such a person, and its sad. They simply shut him out....and make fun of his far reaching dreams. Had SOE been competent enough....they would have been able to see the good in what he dreamed of. Instead, all they saw were figures and sales.
Bah....I rant, and its off topic anyway.
The sandbox MMO is a dream. To do it best, you have to blend it. No one is blending...they either try too much sandbox, or have too much rollercoaster.
I would have to disagree. The fault in SWG's pre-CU days largely fell upon the unbalanced classes and its poor launch reviews. I remember back in the good old days when I would stack knock-backs with my Carbineer and TKM action, so damn OP. There were also a few noticeable bugs, but the UI itself can't be used to blame for its relative amount of unpopularity. The hype-machine that was WoW pre-release was also nonexistent in SWG's beta days. The whole point of the Sandbox MMO is for the new player to not be guided with step-by-step instructions and questlines - in SWG, you could do whatever the hell you wanted to do.
Back to the point. I often hear that many SWG players went to Ryzom, but I'm too sure about the state of the game right now. Ryzom has the same skill-based gameplay. I have never played it so I cannot really give a clearcut recommendation.
Eve is the best sandbox out atm.
Doesnt have everything SWG did, but its somthing
Hard game though, gotta be social.
Eve for sure. Its not for everyone, its very dark and cut throat, but its the best "sandbox" MMO there is.
I agree with the above, to my knowledge the most sandboxy games out there are EvE Online and Ryzom.
Both are very different in their own ways and both have what's part of the sandbox approach: a very steep learning curve including not even being close to having skilled or seen everything there is even after years of playing.
Referring to the initial question again, there's no town building in that understanding in both, though. If that's the most important thing for you, there's still other games out ther that have it without being sandboxy (Horizons I'd consider a hybrid...).
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Ryzom will be back up soon, so I'd recommend giving it a try.
Thanks for all teh replys so far.
From reading these posts I am interested in EVE and Ryzom, what are some features taht set these MMO's aside fromt he rest? How is the population in each of these games?
I don't have time to list all the features that set them apart, but here's a few about Ryzom:
* Spellcrafting - you can combine elements to create your own unique versions of spells
* Extensive crafting system
* Ryzom Ring allows you to create your own scenarios and allow others to play through them
With regards to the population, Ryzom has a small to medium sized population, but I can honestly say that it's the best community I've ever experienced. The players are very friendly and helpful!
Vanguard and Ultima Online are the only sandbox games right now.. since EA has taken many huge craps on UO.. i suggest VG because it is constantly improving.. its a very good game
Remember Old School Ultima Online
There are player owned stations and conquarble outposts (despite the wording the outposts are the largest of the two). I'd keep my eyes on EVE over the next 6 or so months though if you are interested in town building. Eve is adding abulation to the game (the ability to walk around the space stations,) which is going to have a heavy element of player assembled spaces on stations (from my understanding).
EVE, dont forget about EVE
Oh, god, I don't know even where to begin with eve.
The basics, eve is a space MMO. It is currently the 7th largest MMO by market share. It also operates on a single server with over 5,000 solar systems (these systems are seperated into regions, empires, and by security status).
At any given time there are between 24,000 and 40,000 people logged onto the single server. No "instances" at all really, but the emphasis tends to be towards PVP. Pvp is what fuels the game economy-- the most complex crafting system currently in any game.
The crafting system is not as inovative as the early days of SWG (where you could make really unique items). The crafting of EVE does, however, require complex coordination between miners, moon miners (for tech 2), those who make components for things like capital ships, retailers and blueprint holders. Eve is currently the ONLY MMO with an economist on staff to moniter and adjust the game economy.
I've got a production alt, so I know a bit about this.
There are no classes in eve, and your skill "training" is done in real time (you simply quque up a skill to train and it ticks away even while off-line). This means you can pretty much train to do whatever you want. There are so many ways to play eve that everyone's end-game is going to be different. For one person it might be carving out a trade empire, for another it might be the life of a pirate, and for others its alliance warfare (the game favors socialization heavly).
Alliances are huge groups of corps (think guilds) who join together to claim space in 0.0. There is an in-depth soveriegnty system for claiming space which requires alliances to put up player owned structures and run complex logistical organizations.
For a lot of people this is "end game." The thing about eve is there always other people who want what you've got. Wars are fought in lawless 0.0 space between these huge alliances. Typically these wars last weeks or months, not a couple of days or hours.
There is also a rather detailed exploration system, missions system, etc, etc... but I could go on for hours.
A thing to keep in mind is the game is PVP oriented--heavily. There is a severe penalty for dieing (which drives the economy). When you lose a ship you lose the whole thing. No respawning somewhere else in a brand new ship.
Also, there are parts of eve that you are mostly safe in, but never completely safe. Meaning someone can engage you anytime and any place. If they do this in high-sec the police show up and immediately kill your attacker. If they do this in "low-sec" space they are eventually kicked out of empire space entirely, and since 0.0 is completely lawless, there are no restrictions placed on people for trying to kill you.
If you have any specific questions, go ahead and pm me or post them here.
Cheers.
S
*edit*
Its a p2p game, however I am currently paying nothing for my three EVE accounts. This is because CCP allows you to use game currency to buy play time.
I never heard this before. I did a free trial for EVE a while back, so this might be enough to bring me back. How is this accomplished, though their website or a terminal on a space station somewhere?
If I'm not mistaken, it's done via the Eve website. Players purchase game time cards, then other players can purchase these cards from them using in-game ISK. That way players with money get the ISK they want and players who don't want to pay can use their ISK to pay for playing.
It is indeed a very nice thing from CCP (which kept me ingame even though I didn't have the time to play while I was abroad). Here's more information about it, I hope the link works without logging into the forums:
http://myeve.eve-online.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=801929
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Istaria is also a sand-box game. Though it is level based.
Well its fantasy,but i enjoyed Ac1 more than any other sandbox mmorpg I have ever tried
If you can stand the grfx (which are still good) then the ultimate Sandbox game would be WURM Online. Everything is hand crafted you get thirsty and fatigued you can create player cities. Although i havent done PvP i've heard its extremely fun but also hard at the same
Its also skill based
Define sandbox
I consider Ultima Online (1997-1999) a sandbox game. No skill trees, no quests. You wanted to be an archer you pickup a bow and use it until you are good. 100% player economy. If you die, all your items/weapons/armor stay on you corpse for players and monsters to loot.There is too much great stuff to list.
Everyone (well a lot of people) can't wait for Darkfall to come out (have fun waiting). The more i read up on it, the more it looks exactly like Ultima except prettier and with a few more things. But basicly the same concept.
I play vanguard and it is the furthest thing from a sandbox game there is. It is an incredible game, but it follows the same outline as most P2P games.