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Newbie Station and Beyond
Toxilium
Member UncommonPosts: 905
I want two honest opinions here; one from someone who played Pre-CU and someone who started Post-CU. I've only ever played the Newbie Station as I don't know if it's worth buying. Give me some insight on how the game expands.
Population?
Game World Size / Creativity?
End Game?
Content?
PvP?
Comments
No reason why you shouldn't be able to get off n00bie station and see Tatooine (and the other worlds) for themselves.
Keep in mind that PvP is basically reserved, for the most part, for level 90 toons. There are no level regulated battlefields as you have in WoW.
The end game is PvP, ongoing collections, and the heroic instances.
Game world size: deceptively huge, because the brutal reality is that planets have been stratified by level. As you grind your way through the levels, via the Legacy Quest series, you'll move from Tatooine through Naboo, Corellia, and Talus. The worlds are huge, but they're irrelevant to your level grind. The collections system does send you all over the various worlds to kill 200 klickniks, 150 devil gulginaws, etc. Some of the old feel of the original sandbox game can be percieved through collections.
Population depends on the server. A few are better populated than others, but none are populated as they once were before the CU and NGE drove away the original player base.
CH, Jedi, Commando, Smuggler, BH, Scout, Doctor, Chef, BE...yeah, lots of SWG time invested.
Once a denizen of Ahazi
I will give you 100% honest breakdown as I played Pre-CU/CU/and NGE.
I had the most fun towards the end of the CU, believe it or not. Clearly the NGE is a big step in the wrong direction for any game but it is all we have.
1.) Populations: I don't care what anyone tells you, they are bad, real bad. I play on Bloodfin, which is one of the most populated servers, and the MOST I have EVER seen on the entire server at any given time in the past 6 months is 60-70 players. Players generally hang out in Mos Eisley and Rustess. Pre-CU there were players on all planets and most cities, as well as in the wild. Today they are few and far between. The total population of SWG, though unconfirmed, is around 10,000 players spread out over 20+ servers.
Like I said, I don't care what anyone tells you, that is the honest to God truth. Lowca, Flurry, Kauri, and others are simply dead, less than 50 - 100 active players on the entire server. Ghost towns from Pre-CU and CU are scattered all over the place. It's very depressing.
2.) Game World: This is a BIG plus for SWG. The worlds are vast and cool, especially if you are into Star Wars. The problem is that as I said before there are ghost towns all over the place, which really hurts the scenery. Another negative is that they are adding instanced zones to the game now for a cheap and easy method of programming. Still, a very good set of planets.
3.) End Game: There really isn't any. There aren't enough people to have large PvP, and the combat was sped up 5X to simulate FPS (though it is simply RPG combat) and it causes combat lag. The combat is really the downfall of this game, it's bad, very bad. There really isn't any end game to speak of other than sitting around Mos Eisley or Rustess with the same 40 people day in and day out PvP'ing. That is 100% truth.
4.) PvP: Like I said, the combat in this game really isn't up to par. It's a BAD version of Tabula Rasa. Pre-CU had really cool animations and motions for melee combat which has now been replaced by bad particle effects. There just aren't enough people on the servers to enjoy variation in PvP, most are Jedi and Boutny Hunter, though Bounty Hunter was just nerfed so I figure you'll see more Jedi now.
Other than that the economy really is inflated and dead. It's a typical loot-based game now so the true need for player crafted items isn't as vital. The combat stinks, especially if you've played AoC. The quests are some of the WORST in any MMO I have ever seen, so bad it's painful to grind up. There is no creativity in the questing.
Overall the game has never been GREAT, Pre-CU had a lot of issues but had a great skill system and a sandbox world with really cool crafting and community. The CU started off really badly but got better, however it did remove some of the sandboxy feel of the game. The NGE removed all that felt "free" in the game and essentially copied WoW, in a bad way. It's slightly better now than it was when the NGE launched but it's not up to par with games like AoC, WoW, or even for the population level -- Vanguard.
I would suggest trying Vanguard over this game as the populations are about the same and it works much better now.
I was looking into Vanguard only to realize you need somone who has an account to send you a code. I asked for one many times on forums but never got one.
I was looking into Vanguard only to realize you need somone who has an account to send you a code. I asked for one many times on forums but never got one.
Yeah that's a strange deal there with the buddy system. If you go to the official Vanguard boards I'm sure you could probably find one. If not, if you lurk here as well you might get one.
Don't get me wrong, Vanguard isn't a great game either, however having played both relatively recently I can say it is better than SWG. I much prefer AoC to both because the questing and combat are head and shoulders better. SWG is just too lacking, buggy, and the servers are just too dead.
I can say the exact same thing about AoC (except the dead servers).
i played for 2 weeks before the NGE and for 1 week after (lucky me)
population? it was good (on my old dialup it was killer...the most (on my server) populated city is the start point for all new players...that was murder on my system). PvP was crazy and was everywhere. i saw 3 bounty hunters take out targets in the middle of a (packed) Cantina to the shock of everyone inside. endgame did not exist as the game was basically all about your (everyday) life in the game.
now for the NGE
very small population, most people you see are inside cities and they are basically there spamming trade stuff (or have robots doing it for them). bots are out in the wilderness (but they wont trouble you, there is plenty to kill out there). Player cities are everywhere (its bloody annoying to try and drive across the planet with cities every 500m or so). PvP is more focussed (only happens in a few locations). i never got to the endgame but it was pretty much raids for better gear.
MMO wish list:
-Changeable worlds
-Solid non level based game
-Sharks with lasers attached to their heads
Yesterday Bloodfin was in heavy status (that was around 900 players, pre-NGE), thou usually is in medium but the free account time helps. Using the new searching tool I was able to count around 800 concurrent players (not including those that play in /anonimous mode, and lots of pvp vets play this mode, so easily count around 1000). Bria was also in heavy, then 5-6 in medium and the others in light/ very light. I hope something is done with those. But anyway there are around 8-10 healthy servers.
OP,
Just curious, is it SWG alone are you looking at or are you interested in any MMOs or specific genre? You mentioned you wanted to try VG.
Is it SW that prompted you to try it or is it the Sci-fi genre?
I am not trying to recruit for other games or disuade you from SWG if you enjoy it. But if you haven't made up your mind and are trying trials and like Sci-fi, you may want to try the EVE trial and see what you think.
Just like this game there are those that love and hate EVE and of course every one is entitled to their own opinion. One negative of EVE I see new players complain about is that they can never be as super uber as someone with a couple years under their belt. I as many others believe EVE is not about being uber. It is a game of patience, teamwork, and risk versus reward. It is about out witting someone else's uberness with stratagy and thinking. Believe me there is more than one way to skin a cat in EVE.
It is almost like a chess game set in space with thousands all playing on ONE server. If games like chess never interested you, you may find it boring. Like chess, in EVE you can be killed at any time. They have newbie zones, but no safe zones.
I would say if you are trying different trials to see what sticks and like Sci-fi give the EVE trial a shot. Its game play is very unique. Most either love it or hate it. You may love it.
http://www.eve-online.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjTfutSmEOs
http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/14/view/forums
"Suddenly, thousands of Trekies whose heads are full of facts of things like the stardate when the Cardassians farted on Deep Space nine are irrlelevant." - hardcoremoviecritic
Definitelly EvE Online is the king for sandbox sci-fi mmos out there. I have active accounts in both games, and are quite different. I like the strategic and polithic dimension and the mass production market simulation in EvE Online and the decorating, detailed crafting, and history aspect of SWG.
Dialup? Oh boy. That was only viable before they did the CU. I played the beta and about 6 months into launch on a dialup. During summer and holidays, my cousin moved in with me, so we were two computers running SWG on 1 dialup line heh.
Worked like a charm back then, well if my cousin warned me before entering Coronet... I better not be in combat when he did that hehe.
CU could be played on dialup, but it was bad... NGE, made dialup impossible..
I realize this may steer a little off topic, hoever it does speak to how one person thinks of the current game and may affect the OPs thoughts on whether or not to pursue it if he/she have not made up his/hers mind.
Yes the crafting is detailed. Yes the actual act of crafting is fun for me even in the NGE. But with no decay 95% of what I craft in the NGE doesn't sell compared to pre-NGE. In part because quest loot items historicaly are better than crafted items. But the main reason is there is no form of decay on items in game. Buy it once and no reason to buy again without decay. I understand that many people don't want to lose their super uber items. But even if the old decay system is out of the question, there certainly were alternatives that could have been implemented.
The idea of repair kits were kicked out because crafters would only be making those instead of the dozens of wonderful schematics they could craft from.
My theory to solve this would have been. Have decay. When the items were out to 0.0 they don't go away. But they do need to be repaired. Allow the person owning them to repair as a point drawn in their expertise tree. They choose if they want to repair by sacrificing that point or they can take it to a crafter and pay the fee to repair. The crafter would also have to spend that expertise point if they want to repair. The repairer buys the appropriate repair kit from the right crafter. But the repair has to buy an original or comparable item from a crafter to use as spare parts to use with the repair kit. Have this work for quest rewards, no trade, bio linked, and crafted items only. All other loot items can be relooted and thus doesn't matter if it wears out. And no looted items can be used for these spare parts.
Example you quest loot a lvl 80 pistol. It wears out and you buy a repair kit and a lvl 80 pistol from a crafter as spare parts. Or even four lvl 20 pistols to total lvl 80. The later would even allow begining crafters to sell items as they grind up their toon. You could even put a formula in to make a judgement on which to do. Such as one high level item repairs 100% and for each lower item used to total lvl 80, 5% is reduced from full repair. In this case 80% total repair.
Crafters would be useful for almost all their schematics. The owners would still keep that uber item. Buying more of lower lvl compared to one higher lvl could reduce cost of repair because lower lvl would be more accessable. Although it would have to be re-repaired sooner.
There is a lot that could have been done to make crafting an impact again on the NGE game.
And yes I know for those that feel the old system is better, I agree. But they will not bring back the old system. I just think this would have been a good/decent compromise for the NGE.
It would still never get in. The NGE system is almost 3 years old. If they implemented I think the current players would yell "you changed the way my game played after all this time. I don't think this is fair"...oh wait, nevermind.
"Suddenly, thousands of Trekies whose heads are full of facts of things like the stardate when the Cardassians farted on Deep Space nine are irrlelevant." - hardcoremoviecritic
The crafting systems is still detailed (now even you can RE looted weapons), it's the trading system that needs a boost. Read about the new weponsmith system designed for this summer, it doesen't make weapons decay but it certainly boots selling and "coolness" of the process of making a weapon (subcomponents, chose the skin of weapon, etc).
EvE has the opposite. Very cool trading/market simulation, but the crafting is poor in the sense that you can't customize the items. Every t1 or t2 item is the same.
That is what I wanted to express with the comparison, both games have the best in each area of crafting/trading gaming. But let's not enter into the off topic area
Agreed Eves crafting is no where near as pleasurable a SWG. I also agree for the actual act of crafting SWG is the best.
I can't think of a viable solution to generate sales in SWG for earned leveled (grinding toon)schematic items. At least through vendor system changes. The WS upgrade is a bonus but once the weapon is purchased, again no need to rebuy. I fear the WS upgrade will be mute after a few months.
And please correct me if I'm wrong. The RE system is limited to WS and SW. DE, Arhitect, Taylor, Armor, etc do not have a RE system.
As far as of topic, yeah it's close but the OP did ask for comparisons for pre and post NGE and its content. No decay speaks to both.
"Suddenly, thousands of Trekies whose heads are full of facts of things like the stardate when the Cardassians farted on Deep Space nine are irrlelevant." - hardcoremoviecritic
Tailors and armor crafters do also use the RE system, all four archetipes of crafters in SWG do have that skill in the expertise. First it was just the shipwright (named "structures")
I know ith the SW RE it was in place so the space mission quest reward items can REed to have an uber space component. Also to just improve space loot in general. I played SW and did this.
Does the system work the same way with quest reward items for the other professions or does it only improve generic loot? Also I did play when they added these systems but never tried them. Probably why I forgot they existed and thought I would have to be corrected. I don't recall seeing these RE items in vendors. That doesn't mean they weren't there. I might have just been too ignorant of the system to identify them. Have you seen these items in significant amount in vendors? Are these systems acually fun to play and/or is regular crafting more fun?
"Suddenly, thousands of Trekies whose heads are full of facts of things like the stardate when the Cardassians farted on Deep Space nine are irrlelevant." - hardcoremoviecritic
Well I can't answer those questions, I'm not into crafting and every time I look at it I find it too complex (thou cool) But take a look at the first mini guide SOE put out for the new RE for tailors, weapons and armorsmiths:
http://starwarsgalaxies.station.sony.com/players/content.vm?id=66925&resource=features
From a launch Vet
Yesterday Bloodfin was in heavy status (that was around 900 players, pre-NGE), thou usually is in medium but the free account time helps. Using the new searching tool I was able to count around 800 concurrent players (not including those that play in /anonimous mode, and lots of pvp vets play this mode, so easily count around 1000). Bria was also in heavy, then 5-6 in medium and the others in light/ very light. I hope something is done with those. But anyway there are around 8-10 healthy servers.
LMAO, you counted 800 players online Bloodfin yesterday??? LMAO...
Ok, you do realize that they changed the server statistics that reflect server populations being "Heavy" or "Medium" a LONG time ago right?
That was figured out when someone posted an internal server population statistic for a Friday night, which we verified through an IP trace of all servers.
So basically it doesn't take much now for a server to be considered medium or heavy.
I will bet you any amount of money there were nowhere near 800 players on Bloodfin at one time.
Don't suppose you have a screenshot to prove it, I can log on right now and take one if you like....
You can bet whatever you want, but the new search feature let's you even see all those concurrent 800 player names. It takes time to filter each class, genre, faction so you don't cap at 32 max visualized. Maybe it was a peak, I don't know, but that number is correct at that time. I agree is not a good overall statistic, since for it being ok it will need lot of data for more timezones and along a week..but hey, I'm there to play not to counter discussions.
For comparisong, at that same time, Radiant counted 150, put it around 200 because /anon (or more because it's a full pvp server with lots of veterans). Radiant was listed as light server. Oh btw Radiant has very high GCW stats for being light ^^
And btw pre-NGE heavy status was 900, very heavy 1200, extreme heavy 1500. Yesterday there were 800 no anon (you can add another 100-200 anon pvp vets) and it was precisely at heavy status.
The re system for the tailors, weaponsmiths etc is different then the Re system for the shipwright and actually I do both lol and they are both fun
The re system for the tailors etc is taking junk loot and old clothing and converting them into power bits and modifier bits. You then take these pieces and convert those into attachements for clothing or powerups etc
Tailor does attachments and power ups for clothing , Armoursmith/weaponsmith does attachments and power ups for for armour and Droid engineering does them for weapons. Its like the old skilltape system only in this case its not looted its created from junk loot. It can be very umm hard to get one to capped level but its basically a trade in and of itself due to the time involved. You can create the bits and sell them or attachements and sell those. Its probably one of the areas of the games that is never stagnant as people are always changing mods on their suits to try different things. If you want to replace an attachment with a new one the armoursmiths etc have a tool to remove the old attachment and remake the empty socket and put the new one on for you.
Welcome.
I started playing some 4 months ago.
I checked the forums before to choose a server that was populated and that had characteristics that would appeal to me (no open pvp, English language).
So, population wise, Bria is great. I also tried Starsider and it's great, specially experimenting with the roleplay. I hear there are some empty servers though.
And I had the luck to find a nice and helping guild.
Game world size-wise, it's awesome: no barriers (invisible walls) or instancing (not against it though) AND you can go up the highest mountain (I like it because it adds to the immersion); the worlds (and moons) are huge! That being said, one world is instanced and full of invisible walls - Kashyyyk (I don't know about Mustafar); the landscape loads as you move but at a SLOW rate - that means enemies and mobs, houses, vegetation and geographical formations appear as you move. Doing so at a high speed is problematic as you can't find enemies and as you lag through loading Player Cities. and it breaks all immersion having trees and grass appearing less that 30 feet away from you. And the textures of mountains change as you move too.
Creativity? Nice, though if you've seen the movies you've seen most of the important locations. And don't rush into Theeds palace to see the Queen or something: the interior is lacking in furniture and interesting NPCs.
Note: space is beautiful!
End game? Yeah, talk about END game: thing only start to happen at lvl 90 (but you can start having fun right away in space). As you have 90 lvls, finding someone your lvl to duel might be hard. To enjoy the fights for posts, you MUST choose Empire or Rebellion - so if you're a Bounty Hunter like me, there's no way to remain a free lancer (unless you settle with casual PVP and dungeoneering): you have to align yourself (that goes for the battle of Restuss as well). Besides doing epic lvl dungeons and completing collections, there's not much more to it (no crafting, as it's restricted to Traders).
I'm not going to lie to you - it's not the best game, BUT it is Star Wars. I'm a fan, and playing in that universe, online with friends, is awesome. Having met Darth Vader during the anniversary celebration was awesome, having my little silly R5 droid following me around is great, hanging out in Jaba's Palace just for the sake of it is awesome, protecting your outpost in Corellia from the Rebel scum is awesome, watching Jedi battles (as improbable as it would be in the time the game is settled) is awesome, adventuring in dangerous Dathomir is awesome and so on.
If you like the movies, get out of Tansari Station, get your vehicle in Eisley and give it a shot. If you like the game until you finish Tatooine's part of the Legacy Quest, then you may be able to endure until lvl 45-50 when it gets easier to lvl up and then enjoy the "end content": aligning youserlf with a faction can be fun, and doing all the other things I mentioned with your guild can be rewarding. Besides, you can always use the other slot on your server to make a Trader to make things (and credits) for your main toon!
If you want help, send me a Private Message here in mmorpg.com!
HONEST OPINIONS ABOVE--- I started playing in 2003, and am still a player. I recommend you try the free trial...
I would not invest money in a game you may or may not like, if you can play it for free to get a feel for it.
I agree with those saying pick up the free trial. Once you've got a server picked out, don't feel afraid to jump into that trial. I'd recommend following a keybinding guide when you first hop in and turning on auto-aiming.
Even if you pay for the game afterwards, you got 14 days free! You rascally businessman, you.