In my opinion the best chat system is used in WoW. You only see gold spammers in cities and they dont use the trade chat. Communication is zone based and thats the perfect way IMO. You can create your own channels if you want to talk to friends if you aren't in a group or in a guild with them. Commands are easy to learn. I know when AOC was launched everyone was begging for the WoW chat system, me as well.
Barrens Chat and Trade Channel
The quality of the typed words have nothing to do with how well the system is designed and how easy it is to use.
A lot of it has to do with what the player is there to do. Are you going to play the game or sit and chat all night via Barrens Chat style? I think developers should start putting heavy filters and limits on general chat because of the growing popularity of spammers. If you are talking in chat all day/night then you must be bored and not playing the game. Then you get put on my ignore list or reported. I think they should get rid of chat. If you need help or a question just use a /who command for your area and ask someone nearby with a simple personal message.
Filters are a under-rated function in many mmorpgs. I agree that people have various chat preferences. Games should have filters which automatically inform local players of the preferences of those people nearby. Why would I bother inviting player X into my group if I want to grind and I know player X wants to chat on some given encounter. In fact, my preferences might change from hour to hour and I could set my preferences accordingly. A screening process could increase my group invite turn-over rate.
Global chat is a standard feature of MMO's, and all MMO's from now on will include it, because that's what players want. Lack of global chat only accomplishes one thing, frustrating the players, and making them all use third party software to communicate, which is a pain in the arse. If you want to play the game with no global chat, then just turn it off.
I disagree. Not only would some people enjoy the extra roleplaying afforded by realistic chat, but if you want to eliminate ooc retail of ingame money in one fell swoop then eliminate global chat.
Global chats okay, personally I like the way it is in FFXI, their is no global chat, but theirs a limited ranged shout unless you get a linkshell So personally, I would like to see more mmos without a global chat.
Proximity yell is realistic, I agree that it is a viable option for roleplaying. In fact, some games could notch it up by giving an indication of which direction the yell is coming from. Especially, if the yell is for a call of aid.
We had it in SWG, planetary chat, but no one used it. Most people talked in /tell, guild, group or spacial chat. I liked the fact the channels were dead and spammers didn't even bother with it. Sure people spammed, but in spacial, and you could get away from it or mute it easier than having it flash across your screen while you were out in the wild.
Right you are about the value with a mute feature. Some games provide a sort of workaround by allowing you to create a new window and funnel all of one type of chat to that window. Shrink that window and move it to a corner and you have a custom mute workaround.
The problem with global chat is that players abuse it to discuss crap. But more importantly it becomes an area where "old timers" abuse newcomers. Thereby alienating newcomers to a game. This is a problem in any game where the population reaches a size whereby it is possible to become anonymous. Or reroll enough characters to have anonymous "alts".
As most of us know, MMO's are about communities, and WOW has in many ways become to large for its own good, the vast majority of players know nothing about MMO's other than WOW and don't understand why MMO veterans become disgusted with WOW on a regular basis. The don't understand the lack of community building experiences in WOW and how its either raid (can't even say pvp since arenas arrived) or chat. And the chat experience in any of the populated areas is essentially spammed by people with big mouths and no thought, or hoping to piss off as many as they can. A mentoring system of sorts is a good idea but its also a bad idea, if you get rewards for mentoring a lowbie it's just another system whereby people will abuse it, (aka roll with someone they know and not help out newbies over and over so they can maxx whatever reward is available)
You make some good points. Yes, there can be abuse by allowing general chat. Much can be done to mitigate this issue by logging and profiling, and punishment of harrassment.
You mentioned the game WoW in your comment. There are many servers in WoW as I am sure you know. Within those many servers there are many different people. I think it is important to note that a game shouldn't be too strict with their censoring of communication. It is a game afterall, and anything which transpires in a game should be taken lightly. Essentially, the moderation of communication should be kept at a minimum when it comes to censorship. Fortunately, in WoW the chat is mostly zone based and the realms with WoW are vast, so it is possible to find an enjoyable nitch within the world.
I don't see how a mentoring system could be a threat to game balance. The quests and rewards granted within a mentoring system could be moderated in the same fashion as traditional quests by daily limits. Furthermore, I don't think the game provider will mind if they are retaining their current player base by whatever means possible.
Ya know the thing about SWG was that people actually thought of themselves as their character. So they didn't run around acting like asshats.(those that did very quickly became alienated to the entire server) Everygame I've seen since then has had so many multiple alts that you its easy to be an asshat and then login as someone else and not suffer the consequences of being a jerk.
This is why I'm in favor of all characters on a server sharing the same last name (or something like that)
Absolutely agree with ya there. Since you were limited to one toon (unless you unlocked of course) you were kinda careful about being a tool all the time. Too much time was vested in your character that it just wasn't logical to up and delete and reroll a new one because ya felt like being a bane to the community only to realize you've become ostracized by the community. Combine that with the lack of a global channel and it made for an experience I've yet to come across again since. While global channels might be a necessity nowadays, there's too many 'look at me!! look at me!!!!' attention deprived individuals behind the keyboards to keep them tolerable for me.
Yep, I agree.
Having one toon only per server kept you honest. I felt like I had a reputation to protect. And a lack of global chat really seemed to have an amazing effect on the community. It made central meeting place important for social networking.
Zone-based chat = good. This is where the community comes from, and you rarely feel alone in a zone.
World-based chat (i.e. Trade channel, perhaps) = bad. This sacrifices immersion and the sense of importance of geographic locations.
Individual tells = good. For convenience, and doesn't bust immersion too much.
Actual voice (i.e. Vent) chat = bad. Roleplay suffers, and in big groups, especially raids, conversation degrades to the level of one person (raid-or-group leader) calling out commands like a football coach. Zero roleplay; everything degenerates into some kind of artificial team sports.
However, the voice chat may be where things are heading.
We had it in SWG, planetary chat, but no one used it. Most people talked in /tell, guild, group or spacial chat. I liked the fact the channels were dead and spammers didn't even bother with it. Sure people spammed, but in spacial, and you could get away from it or mute it easier than having it flash across your screen while you were out in the wild.
I agree with this.
In SWG cities felt alive and kicking, because people were actually speakin.. There were what you could call "city noise"...
In AoC or EQ2 or Vanguard or Whatever game these days.. Everything is just sterile... No life no nothing.. Everything being said is done so on some global channel... And the day someone actually speaks to you in spatial is the day you get a heartattack because of the shock of someone actually speaking in the area.
I'd pay big money for a Sandbox game with good spatial chat and no global outside of guild chat.
It is kind of distracting, and immersion breaking. You are standing right next to someone, and it seems they are ignoring you, even if you say something in spatial.
But actually they aren't, they are in global chatting away about the movie they saw last night, or which zone is best for levels 13-15 etc., and they don't even realize you said anything, and then they run off.
I don't know how to fix this, because global chat is just to useful to get rid of.
One interesting solution I have seen in WoW is spatial proximity chat bubbles which display text as well as audible emotes. I am with you about the issue of distraction from the immediate region by extraneous elements.
I like it because most games I've played , the LFG was barren, and a quick global could fill your party.
I dislike it because global is one of the ways the undesirables meet each other to form Voltron, and where the players who refuse to teach themselves( forums, wiki's, etc) spam help for something they could have learned by reading the tutorial.
All in all, it's a great tool, just needs some governing or strict rules.
People say that it needs to be there for trading and for grouping. It does not. If you want to group, you will gather at your point of interest and meet with others. You will hold a realistic immediate area conversation and you will group.
If you want to trade, you go to the resident market and you hold realistic haggles with players that you meet in the immediate area. Mail system is rather strange, immediate delivery of a solid steel kite shield.. no.
Player hubs and realistic distance shouts are where its at. Nothing beats meeting up with someone out in the wild and just having a regular /say conversation.
EDIT: To add another snippet... The idea of "muting" the global chat does not meet the goals those of us seek when we say we want to eliminate 'global'. That would just seclude you from the game, defeating the purpose. I think I speak for others when I say we just want there to be realistic area communication to get that cozy immersion. People meet up, barter, play games. (EQ1 Trading Caves anyone?)
People say that it needs to be there for trading and for grouping. It does not. If you want to group, you will gather at your point of interest and meet with others. You will hold a realistic immediate area conversation and you will group.
If you want to trade, you go to the resident market and you hold realistic haggles with players that you meet in the immediate area. Mail system is rather strange, immediate delivery of a solid steel kite shield.. no.
Player hubs and realistic distance shouts are where its at. Nothing beats meeting up with someone out in the wild and just having a regular /say conversation.
EDIT: To add another snippet... The idea of "muting" the global chat does not meet the goals those of us seek when we say we want to eliminate 'global'. That would just seclude you from the game, defeating the purpose. I think I speak for others when I say we just want there to be realistic area communication to get that cozy immersion. People meet up, barter, play games. (EQ1 Trading Caves anyone?)
I agree. I think it can't be over-emphasized how important meeting new people can be for an immersive environment. I think that 70% of the time I have done so, I have been pleasantly surprised in my gaming experiences.
Global chats are a double edged sword.They are usful finding people to fill in key roles in parties, or to help get info about the game. Bad thing is that you get people spamming it with useless crap (remember old Barren's Chat?). Also if it is accessible from lvl you get gold spammers. To fix that issue is to put a lvl requirement to use it, and to allow right clicking of names to block. I hate having to open up my friends list, then selecting block/ignore then trying to type in a name like asdfkjahllejkhiu as its shooting up my chat box.
Oh and for the people who don't like global chats, there is usually an option to turn it off. Which i do unless looking for a group etc. Oh and there should be two 'global' chats, one for trade, one for general 'talk'.
Comments
Barrens Chat and Trade Channel
The quality of the typed words have nothing to do with how well the system is designed and how easy it is to use.
Filters are a under-rated function in many mmorpgs. I agree that people have various chat preferences. Games should have filters which automatically inform local players of the preferences of those people nearby. Why would I bother inviting player X into my group if I want to grind and I know player X wants to chat on some given encounter. In fact, my preferences might change from hour to hour and I could set my preferences accordingly. A screening process could increase my group invite turn-over rate.
I disagree. Not only would some people enjoy the extra roleplaying afforded by realistic chat, but if you want to eliminate ooc retail of ingame money in one fell swoop then eliminate global chat.
Proximity yell is realistic, I agree that it is a viable option for roleplaying. In fact, some games could notch it up by giving an indication of which direction the yell is coming from. Especially, if the yell is for a call of aid.
Right you are about the value with a mute feature. Some games provide a sort of workaround by allowing you to create a new window and funnel all of one type of chat to that window. Shrink that window and move it to a corner and you have a custom mute workaround.
You make some good points. Yes, there can be abuse by allowing general chat. Much can be done to mitigate this issue by logging and profiling, and punishment of harrassment.
You mentioned the game WoW in your comment. There are many servers in WoW as I am sure you know. Within those many servers there are many different people. I think it is important to note that a game shouldn't be too strict with their censoring of communication. It is a game afterall, and anything which transpires in a game should be taken lightly. Essentially, the moderation of communication should be kept at a minimum when it comes to censorship. Fortunately, in WoW the chat is mostly zone based and the realms with WoW are vast, so it is possible to find an enjoyable nitch within the world.
I don't see how a mentoring system could be a threat to game balance. The quests and rewards granted within a mentoring system could be moderated in the same fashion as traditional quests by daily limits. Furthermore, I don't think the game provider will mind if they are retaining their current player base by whatever means possible.
Absolutely agree with ya there. Since you were limited to one toon (unless you unlocked of course) you were kinda careful about being a tool all the time. Too much time was vested in your character that it just wasn't logical to up and delete and reroll a new one because ya felt like being a bane to the community only to realize you've become ostracized by the community. Combine that with the lack of a global channel and it made for an experience I've yet to come across again since. While global channels might be a necessity nowadays, there's too many 'look at me!! look at me!!!!' attention deprived individuals behind the keyboards to keep them tolerable for me.
Yep, I agree.
Having one toon only per server kept you honest. I felt like I had a reputation to protect. And a lack of global chat really seemed to have an amazing effect on the community. It made central meeting place important for social networking.
Zone-based chat = good. This is where the community comes from, and you rarely feel alone in a zone.
World-based chat (i.e. Trade channel, perhaps) = bad. This sacrifices immersion and the sense of importance of geographic locations.
Individual tells = good. For convenience, and doesn't bust immersion too much.
Actual voice (i.e. Vent) chat = bad. Roleplay suffers, and in big groups, especially raids, conversation degrades to the level of one person (raid-or-group leader) calling out commands like a football coach. Zero roleplay; everything degenerates into some kind of artificial team sports.
However, the voice chat may be where things are heading.
I agree with this.
In SWG cities felt alive and kicking, because people were actually speakin.. There were what you could call "city noise"...
In AoC or EQ2 or Vanguard or Whatever game these days.. Everything is just sterile... No life no nothing.. Everything being said is done so on some global channel... And the day someone actually speaks to you in spatial is the day you get a heartattack because of the shock of someone actually speaking in the area.
I'd pay big money for a Sandbox game with good spatial chat and no global outside of guild chat.
It is kind of distracting, and immersion breaking. You are standing right next to someone, and it seems they are ignoring you, even if you say something in spatial.
But actually they aren't, they are in global chatting away about the movie they saw last night, or which zone is best for levels 13-15 etc., and they don't even realize you said anything, and then they run off.
I don't know how to fix this, because global chat is just to useful to get rid of.
One interesting solution I have seen in WoW is spatial proximity chat bubbles which display text as well as audible emotes. I am with you about the issue of distraction from the immediate region by extraneous elements.
oh yes and you'll enforce this how? taking some linux distro and stripping down to nothing but your game?
Ummm, I'm pretty sure the designers of games can pick and choose what type of chat channels will be included in their game.
So they would make a game that only included guild, group, and spatial. I'm not sure what point you're trying to make.
I like and dislike Global Chat systems.
I like it because most games I've played , the LFG was barren, and a quick global could fill your party.
I dislike it because global is one of the ways the undesirables meet each other to form Voltron, and where the players who refuse to teach themselves( forums, wiki's, etc) spam help for something they could have learned by reading the tutorial.
All in all, it's a great tool, just needs some governing or strict rules.
My thoughts on the Global Chat feature:
I think it can be banished with no hassle.
People say that it needs to be there for trading and for grouping. It does not. If you want to group, you will gather at your point of interest and meet with others. You will hold a realistic immediate area conversation and you will group.
If you want to trade, you go to the resident market and you hold realistic haggles with players that you meet in the immediate area. Mail system is rather strange, immediate delivery of a solid steel kite shield.. no.
Player hubs and realistic distance shouts are where its at. Nothing beats meeting up with someone out in the wild and just having a regular /say conversation.
EDIT: To add another snippet... The idea of "muting" the global chat does not meet the goals those of us seek when we say we want to eliminate 'global'. That would just seclude you from the game, defeating the purpose. I think I speak for others when I say we just want there to be realistic area communication to get that cozy immersion. People meet up, barter, play games. (EQ1 Trading Caves anyone?)
Global chat systems suck.
Personal tells and guild chats are just fine. The global LFG channel and the trade channel in WoW suck.
I prefer a trade channel or LFG channel to be localized.
That Guild Wars 2 login screen knocked up my wife. Must be the second coming!
Interesting suggestion. Guild rosters would probably become much more heavily populated if such a protocol was established.
I agree. I think it can't be over-emphasized how important meeting new people can be for an immersive environment. I think that 70% of the time I have done so, I have been pleasantly surprised in my gaming experiences.
Global chats are a double edged sword.They are usful finding people to fill in key roles in parties, or to help get info about the game. Bad thing is that you get people spamming it with useless crap (remember old Barren's Chat?). Also if it is accessible from lvl you get gold spammers. To fix that issue is to put a lvl requirement to use it, and to allow right clicking of names to block. I hate having to open up my friends list, then selecting block/ignore then trying to type in a name like asdfkjahllejkhiu as its shooting up my chat box.
Oh and for the people who don't like global chats, there is usually an option to turn it off. Which i do unless looking for a group etc. Oh and there should be two 'global' chats, one for trade, one for general 'talk'.
*edit*
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