It has been Daym near 3 years since the NGE changed everything, and while I miss AFKing professions for the Hologrind or AFK'ing dancer Xp for the exchange in the Village for Force XP....and I miss Bol's to the North Spin Groups...
It has been Daym near 3 years since the NGE changed everything, and while I miss AFKing professions for the Hologrind or AFK'ing dancer Xp for the exchange in the Village for Force XP....and I miss Bol's to the North Spin Groups...
I am sick of you all whining.
Would I change it back? Yes. Would I keep the new content? Yes.
Will it ever happen? No
So get over it { Mod Edit }
You should take your own advice. If you don't like these posts then don't read them. You whining about the whiners will not help.
It has been Daym near 3 years since the NGE changed everything, and while I miss AFKing professions for the Hologrind or AFK'ing dancer Xp for the exchange in the Village for Force XP....and I miss Bol's to the North Spin Groups...
I am sick of you all whining.
Would I change it back? Yes. Would I keep the new content? Yes.
Will it ever happen? No
So get over it { Mod Edit }
rofl... I couldn't have said that better myself. In fact, I've said that on here many times, and been reported so I hope your post stays. Its something these people need to hear. They act like their lives are over because the nge hit. It gets very tiring.
your right that current games dont do anything to aid in roleplay.
but even with this all you have to do is try to droleplay just a bit and more often than not people will at least try to roleplay back.
your right about the themepark commercialization on most games that are all about volume and to hell with any quality.
they create games that are dumb and easy alot like a arcade game they have little if any chalange or suprise for me and I can see a future where I dont play MMOs any more.
developers seem to think that quality roleplay worlds cant be profitable, but there wrong,, a well designed world actually builds game loyalty that rarely exists today.
I would really love it if they got awayfrom the shooting gallery games or fighting arenas and created alternate universes.
some of the bigest things I look for in a new game is if food and water are important to the game world,, imagine just crossing a desert in most MMOs also I look for weather and climate blizzard cold, burning heat, rain, wind storms, after this are chaotic acts of nature,, crop blights, floods, volcanos, earthquakes, fires, ect all add to the the immersion of a universe.
I would love a game where you are droped on a world with limited supplies and know nothing about it at all, where you have to cooperate with others to build a society and learn about the new world your in, hopefully a world that is organic and not hemed in so if you see a lake you can fish in it or swim it or build a boat and cross it.
I dont mean where the game excludes grind players just have choices, and example is a garden a war monger can drop seed and water and go off adventuring and return to a default crop,, but a roleplayer can tend his crop and he will get a higher yeald for the extra work.
that is my wish.
make a world, not a game, we dont want another game.
I understand totally. I have always been disapointed at the lack of roleplaying in the MMOs I haave tried (SWG, pre-NGE being one of them). Sometimes you get a good group who will facilitate it, but more often than not ... nada.
I recently uninstalled my WoW from my PC for just that reason. When WoW came out I wanted to be part of the world. I love the history and lore of the world of Azeroth. The relationships between characters like Arthas & Lady Sylvanas. The history of the Orcs and their time with the Demon driven burning crusade. I wanted to be a character in that world. I wanted to play an Undead Warlock who recently broke away from the Lich-King's control and was trying to find a new existance in unlife, a noble Orc warrior trying to make a name for himself among the tribes, a Human descendant of those betrayed by Medivh, who was trying to cleanse the world of the unclean forsaken...
I'm sure you get the idea.
Instead ... I was surrunded by people discussing the mathematics of the combat modifiers in open chat, constantly challenged to duels by 12 year olds who do nothing all day but play the game and scream "Noob!" , and insult your mother when you'd rather actually READ the text of the quests your taking instead of fight their Rogue...
Again, you get the idea.
And yet, I am now trying Warhammer: Age of Reckoning. Will it be any different? ...probably not. Why do I still try? Because I have hope ... I have hope, and I'm hopelessly addicted to the MMO experience. I have literally been waiting for MMOs since I was a kid. I remember coming up with the idea for a computer based virtual/perpetual world where you could play your (at the time I was playing pen & paper games like D&D, R.I.F.T.S. and Shadowrun) character among thousands of other players. Now here it is, and I have gone through more than 20 MMOs to find my favorite one. SWG (pre-NGE, although I didn't mind the Combat Upgrade too much ... no more robotic doctor buff lines!), WoW, and EQ have come the closest. Now I'm trying W.A.R. for my fantasy fix, and I'm waiting for Stargate Worlds for my Sci-Fi fix.
Jef, I take off my hate...I mean, hat. This is a great article, perhaps the best I have read concerning SWG in ages. I would play along with the roleplayers when I happed to cross their city on Tatooine (the one with the really nice cantina, what was it's name, you also did the krayt skull quest nearby). They scared the hell out of me the first time I came upon them (4 months after launch). I eventually played along only to find my toon in jail for the evening. In GC, everyone was laughing their asses off at my misfortune, we had a policy not to insult RP, and to play along when it came about.
I think that city was the first place I visit every time I go back to see what the game is like. My core guildies are strangely still there (we were a space faring guild). The RP is nowhere to be found...
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
"Even without the abortion that was the early NGE, roleplayers tend to burn twice as bright and live half as long, as the play style is a full time job if done correctly."
A good article with only one item I disagree with, that provided above. I believe Role-Players are play on much longer than of the typical gamer. The reasons for this is that Role-Players can spend time doing something which really serves no purpose for playing the game; and example, having two RP'ers sit down at a table and begin plotting out loud; or start up a bar fight, while hurling one-lines at each other. So there is that added bit of fun.
RP'ers tend to be more loyal and passionate about the game they are involved with. They like communities and as long as the communities are there, they will stay even if the game mechanics have bugs.
However what Role-Players need that the majority of MMO's do not provide is dynamic story content by developers. Sure it is a good thing for players to provide content, but they also need the developers to provide content and to let the player have impact to the story. After all, role-playing games allow players to change the outcome of the campaign. Yet in MMO's this is not possible. SWG is an example of a static theme-park. Players cannot change the story-arc of Star Wars. Oh wait, there is the Secret Rebel Base... but it is still at the same spot that everyone knows about. So why hasn't the Emperor conducted a strike?
The technology to allow players to impact the story-arc is available, even in a massive environment. A problem I see is that a number of game developers have never played table-top RPG's... Technically growing up on C-RPG's where as long as there is level advancements, then the computer game is a RPG.
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
I was on the same server with the same group of people for ages, and the RP community had it's ups and downs. The biggest problems I had was each "community" seemed exclusive of any other, so there were always conflicting ideas of what was going on. Would have been nice to have a server wide concensus and even maybe an overarching server "storyline"
But yes, the update to the game killed it for me as it did for many.
Great article - rare to see such good writing outside Newsweeks and Times'. Still, I'd like to suggest you style wrtiing guides to correct a few things like too long sentences and excessive use of adjectives.
SWG has a place in my heart. It was one of my 1st mmo's, briefly trying EQ before that. Once I found out there was a Star Wars game, I was hooked, even before I had read what it was about or that it was an MMO. As a day 2 swg'er I found many days and nights of roleplay over 4years, with these highlights:
Agamemnon-NST-Kauri, loner, crafter, travelling salesman, got interested in bio-engineering field, made millions, lost it all on cheap girls in Mos Vegas, pan handled for a while in Mos Eisley when he was down on his luck. Worked his way back into the medical profession, joined the rebellion after seeing the Imperials slaughter the townspeople of Anchorhead. Became a covert operative, scouting out imperial bases and coordinating terrorist attacks against said bases during cover of night with a small special elite team of Agents. Watched an assasination happen during a wedding, wounded severely during the battle of Ruestess. Retired with full medical benefits. Opened up a Bio-engineering lab with a chef friend that had grander ideas. Took over general management operation of a strip club.
Indagadadaveeda-NST-Kauri-Crafter, part time dance enthusiast. Became a pretty busy chef, opened up a shop near anchorhead which spread to several chain stores across the known galaxy. Opened up several houses of ill-repute, with full time wait staff, illicit drug use, band gigs and nightly shows/dancers, manager of the strip joint. Arrested by Imperial Investigator for criminal activity, charges included racketeering, spice smuggling, prostitution, and illegal gambling. Completed 6months incarceration at Naboo Correctional Facility and reprocessing before returning to Tattooine to re-open a single strip joint with a few tasteful dancers....last seen being shoved into a speeder by suspected Jabba henchman.
Mordacacca-Smuggler-Chimera-Escaped trandoshan slave captivity, bummed around Mos Eisley doing odd jobs and muscle for hire. Was picked up in Mos Entha during a run in with local law enforcement, who ironically found smuggled spice in the saddlebags of his firends(borrowed) speeder. Was arrested, detained temporarily at the transfer point in Mos Eisley Imperial Detention Center. Caught a flu bug from a fellow prisoner, was transferred to Dathomir Prison only to escape during the aftermath of a Rebel Raid on the prison. Returned to Mos Eisley, accidentally helping spread an epidemic on 2 planets, and started working in the underworld circles for Lady V, had a run in with Jabba henchmen and forced to go to work for Jabba smuggling items to Talus from Tattooine for the Hutts. Had a legit front man business partner who helped fund expeditions but also sold items for him on the blackmarket.
Bilcli-Merchant-Chimera-a former jazz musician, played some small gigis in the Bestine/Anchorhead/Eisley scene. Peddled a little contraband now and then. Got clean in rehab after an overdose of spice, nearly died of an epidemic in Mos Eisley due to a low immune system from spice. Attended a funeral of a close friend that was actually interrupted by sand people. Ran away screaming like a coward. Went into collectibles and opened up a shop called "Needful Things" just outside of Mos Eisley. Hired staff and made a nice little profit selling certain "hard to come by" items on the market that we're of questionable sources.
I had countless others, 5 accounts and 8 characters per account, all but 3 leveled to max by the time I had had enough of the NGE. It was a really great game, I loved it, but it changed to much for me and after losing a guild of 478 people to just 3 online...I could no longer login and enjoy the roleplay. The new enhancements didn't help me much in that regard either, I do not like fps's which essentially that's what it became, it was far to difficult to roleplay any longer. I'm a long time roleplayer from Chainmail, to DND/ADD, Gurps, SW, Shadowrun, Traveller and Hero. I miss those days as well and especially the sci-fi ones. Now that I have an opportunity to develop a game, I give my all to get just a bit of that "ole roleplayer" mentality back into my game as we design it from the ground up. It's always in my mind.
Nice to see there are still some roleplayers out there. When I am in game, no matter which game it is, I am in character. Perhaps my "in character" doesn't completely fit the genre of the game but I am in character. Each of my characters have their own personality. Some are witty, some grumpy, some curious and adventurous.
I have a character that is currently exploring a vast world and is very inquisitive about the things she finds and the people she meets. I sit here behind my keyboard giggling my arse off at the reactions she gets.
"I have a level 70 main." random player says.
"You have a main? Like, in your pocket or something?" I would say.
"Um, no I have a level 70 Warrior." he replies.
"You own a warrior, and he is level 70?" I said.
"Yes."
"Where is he?" I say while looking around.
And so on...
Anyway, I find it fun. SWG, was a great place for this type of play. Unfortunately the many changes drove me away.
Mm, having played SWG myself for about a year (far past the NGE so I never got to play it before that), and having RP just about all the time, I do have to agree that the community wasn't really the greatest
But for anyone really looking for RP, hands down I have to say to come to City of Heroes (Virtue Server). No way I can really say how much RP there is (as well as some not so good, though its avoidable). Its just a hugely well put together situation since just about any character can fit in the CoH universe (Fantasy, Space, etc) with some modifications. Though the best RP you will find in Super Groups obviously.
Obviously its still a lot of hit and miss, just depends if you happen to join a less then great SG, but really, by far you should try CoH.
I never considered myself a RP'er in SWG but found myself doing it quite often. I tended to do things on my own or in small groups, whether hunting krayt, kimo's, or doing corvette runs. Not much RP went on then, just chatting with friends. When my bars would go black and I had to find Doc's or Ent's, that is when the RP would kick in and I liked it very much. The odd times when one or more of us would be flagged after killing Imp NPC's and opposing faction players would race by then stop for PVP would bring about RP also.
I remeber many times when I would have to get new armor and weapons made and Haanoverfist would give me grief for breaking his creations and threaten to charge me double to replace them. So many different ways to become immersed in RP even when you didn't consider yourself a RP'er. Things changed and did away with most of the game aspects that promoted RP, though some players still strive to keep it alive when SOE tries to make it harder for them.
With games like WoW where you find yourself grinding to earn funds to raid and in raids you are using VoN programs during raids to coordinate, you find very little if any RP'ing occuring. I'll keep waiting for another game to come out that offers all the things that made SWG worth not just playing, but being a part of the community.
1. When I first meet RPers in Eisley it was my mos memerable moment in SWG EVER. Not one instance, not all things devs added in NGE is worth 1/10 of that moment.
2. Too bad SOE wont bring back old pre NGE servers for RP community
3. I think, that maybe if those guys who work on SWG emulator ever manage to get online oroginal game and open full RP server than that old RP feeling will be back.
SOE did not understand that I was only roleplaying about 4 years ago but with the lack of players on most of the SWG servers these days , one would have to come up with some idea of amusing themselves.
Roleplaying that you are on a single player game - I can see that.
i wanted to RP in SWG but i came right when the hologrind began. even the coveted preCU was not RP friendly. i tried to RP a novice scout.., now i'm a PK spy who never /replies, chats, or accepts invites..
SWGs community, new or old, will suck any RP spirit you have out of you, and replace it with a jaded thirst for virtual blood, a craving for cheap GCW points, and a hunger for the most hateful of hate tells.
Never RPed in MMO's, that's what I play pen and paper games for (also my typing skills leave much to be desired). I'm sure the author could find a group to learn them with if he lives in even a medium sized city in the states. Game shops usually have groups the play in house and welcome newcommers.
What a great piece on role-playing in MMO's, /applaud.
I enjoyed role-play on occasion, with a particular group of folks that were really into that. I also did a lot of adventuring with non-roleplayers.
Things that helped roleplay for me, and immersion in general were the early option to equip any weapon, and use various types of armour. I also liked the apprentice system that linked you up with others in your profession that had a higher level of skill. I loved the active pub life in the cantinas, and felt this was encouraged by systems like mind buffs and healing of battle fatigue. Having camps that allowed certain buffs and heals also added to role-play, as did going to the med-centers for healing.
All of the diverse professions with their interdependent systems, the realistic crafting, buying and selling of goods also helped. I loved going to tailors for outfits for upcoming events (like ingame weddings), had to have a tux right? lol . Gun shopping was one of my favourite pastimes. I also loved hunting to get meat for a chef friend of mine. He'd then make the best foods and drinks to help me be a better hunter. Very, very cool, very immersive, and great for role-playing.
I think someone got the idea that people don't like this in a videogame, and tbh, I just think they're wrong. I don't know anyone that said, "wow this immersion really sucks." People loved it. What they didn't love was being unable to complete their quests, having targets spawn in trees, or trying to use skills that didn't seem to work properly. They also didnt' like quests that consisted of gunning down 10 guys standing in a field around a flag that was supposed to represent an enemy base.
I really think SOE and LEC got some bad marketting research that led them to do what they did to their game. I could go into the flawed sampling design and confirmation bias in the results, but I'd probably even bore myself with that. I do hope, though, that some MMO company with an attractive IP (Ryzom looks kinda like this, but I don't know what a "Ryzom" is) realizes the great potential in immersive game systems like SWG used to have. I'm kinda hoping that StarTrek Online will have immersive elements to it. I guess time will tell .
Mm, having played SWG myself for about a year (far past the NGE so I never got to play it before that), and having RP just about all the time, I do have to agree that the community wasn't really the greatest But for anyone really looking for RP, hands down I have to say to come to City of Heroes (Virtue Server). No way I can really say how much RP there is (as well as some not so good, though its avoidable). Its just a hugely well put together situation since just about any character can fit in the CoH universe (Fantasy, Space, etc) with some modifications. Though the best RP you will find in Super Groups obviously. Obviously its still a lot of hit and miss, just depends if you happen to join a less then great SG, but really, by far you should try CoH.
I have to agree with this. I play CoH on Liberty mainly. Virtue is notorious for its role-play community. If you're not a role-player, people in game warn you not to play on that server lol.
It has been Daym near 3 years since the NGE changed everything, and while I miss AFKing professions for the Hologrind or AFK'ing dancer Xp for the exchange in the Village for Force XP....and I miss Bol's to the North Spin Groups...
I am sick of you all whining.
Would I change it back? Yes. Would I keep the new content? Yes.
Will it ever happen? No
So get over it { Mod Edit }
rofl... I couldn't have said that better myself. In fact, I've said that on here many times, and been reported so I hope your post stays. Its something these people need to hear. They act like their lives are over because the nge hit. It gets very tiring.
I just don't understand why you guys would keep reading threads then that talk about the "good old days" etc.. If it bugs you so much, why read it?
If other people want to discuss something that matters to them, why intrude and tell them they're idiots?
Do you go out of your way to listen in on others when they talk about things that don't interest you in rl? Do you jump into the conversation you dislike and tell people to shut up and call them names?
It really seems like this is what you're doing here.
Man I so agree. I've been playing SWG, MxO, and even Second Life and I rarely if ever find dull immersion. Even those that are "RP'rs" spend alot of time simply chatting ooc about their new toys. In SL you would think this would be custom built for full immersion but not really. Even there it is all pvp or raunchy based rp. Never a mixture or anythign that resembles LIFE.
But I still search. I found that when i couldn't find what I needed I simply created it. I did on sl and I am trying on SWG. It is really hard to get people to slow down and see the beauty of SWG. I know the changes the devs made years ago made things difficult but I feel it really shouldn't matter...not to a RP'r. So any low level characters out there (Imperial or Rebel) or any others, feel free. I am will to do what ever is needed to form a group of pure RP's. We do not have to be o the same side, nor do we even have to mission or grind. RP is about more than just the moment...it is about the association the story of this person and that person. In my humble opinion.
It has been Daym near 3 years since the NGE changed everything, and while I miss AFKing professions for the Hologrind or AFK'ing dancer Xp for the exchange in the Village for Force XP....and I miss Bol's to the North Spin Groups...
I am sick of you all whining.
Would I change it back? Yes. Would I keep the new content? Yes.
Will it ever happen? No
So get over it { Mod Edit }
AFK'ing is not RP'ing.. it is AFK'ing, your points are moot
Comments
I'm sorry...but Whine more.
It has been Daym near 3 years since the NGE changed everything, and while I miss AFKing professions for the Hologrind or AFK'ing dancer Xp for the exchange in the Village for Force XP....and I miss Bol's to the North Spin Groups...
I am sick of you all whining.
Would I change it back? Yes.
Would I keep the new content? Yes.
Will it ever happen? No
So get over it
{ Mod Edit }
MMO History: 2528 days in SW:G
You should take your own advice. If you don't like these posts then don't read them. You whining about the whiners will not help.
rofl... I couldn't have said that better myself. In fact, I've said that on here many times, and been reported so I hope your post stays. Its something these people need to hear. They act like their lives are over because the nge hit. It gets very tiring.
your right that current games dont do anything to aid in roleplay.
but even with this all you have to do is try to droleplay just a bit and more often than not people will at least try to roleplay back.
your right about the themepark commercialization on most games that are all about volume and to hell with any quality.
they create games that are dumb and easy alot like a arcade game they have little if any chalange or suprise for me and I can see a future where I dont play MMOs any more.
developers seem to think that quality roleplay worlds cant be profitable, but there wrong,, a well designed world actually builds game loyalty that rarely exists today.
I would really love it if they got awayfrom the shooting gallery games or fighting arenas and created alternate universes.
some of the bigest things I look for in a new game is if food and water are important to the game world,, imagine just crossing a desert in most MMOs also I look for weather and climate blizzard cold, burning heat, rain, wind storms, after this are chaotic acts of nature,, crop blights, floods, volcanos, earthquakes, fires, ect all add to the the immersion of a universe.
I would love a game where you are droped on a world with limited supplies and know nothing about it at all, where you have to cooperate with others to build a society and learn about the new world your in, hopefully a world that is organic and not hemed in so if you see a lake you can fish in it or swim it or build a boat and cross it.
I dont mean where the game excludes grind players just have choices, and example is a garden a war monger can drop seed and water and go off adventuring and return to a default crop,, but a roleplayer can tend his crop and he will get a higher yeald for the extra work.
that is my wish.
make a world, not a game, we dont want another game.
I understand totally. I have always been disapointed at the lack of roleplaying in the MMOs I haave tried (SWG, pre-NGE being one of them). Sometimes you get a good group who will facilitate it, but more often than not ... nada.
I recently uninstalled my WoW from my PC for just that reason. When WoW came out I wanted to be part of the world. I love the history and lore of the world of Azeroth. The relationships between characters like Arthas & Lady Sylvanas. The history of the Orcs and their time with the Demon driven burning crusade. I wanted to be a character in that world. I wanted to play an Undead Warlock who recently broke away from the Lich-King's control and was trying to find a new existance in unlife, a noble Orc warrior trying to make a name for himself among the tribes, a Human descendant of those betrayed by Medivh, who was trying to cleanse the world of the unclean forsaken...
I'm sure you get the idea.
Instead ... I was surrunded by people discussing the mathematics of the combat modifiers in open chat, constantly challenged to duels by 12 year olds who do nothing all day but play the game and scream "Noob!" , and insult your mother when you'd rather actually READ the text of the quests your taking instead of fight their Rogue...
Again, you get the idea.
And yet, I am now trying Warhammer: Age of Reckoning. Will it be any different? ...probably not. Why do I still try? Because I have hope ... I have hope, and I'm hopelessly addicted to the MMO experience. I have literally been waiting for MMOs since I was a kid. I remember coming up with the idea for a computer based virtual/perpetual world where you could play your (at the time I was playing pen & paper games like D&D, R.I.F.T.S. and Shadowrun) character among thousands of other players. Now here it is, and I have gone through more than 20 MMOs to find my favorite one. SWG (pre-NGE, although I didn't mind the Combat Upgrade too much ... no more robotic doctor buff lines!), WoW, and EQ have come the closest. Now I'm trying W.A.R. for my fantasy fix, and I'm waiting for Stargate Worlds for my Sci-Fi fix.
I still have hope...
Jef, I take off my hate...I mean, hat. This is a great article, perhaps the best I have read concerning SWG in ages. I would play along with the roleplayers when I happed to cross their city on Tatooine (the one with the really nice cantina, what was it's name, you also did the krayt skull quest nearby). They scared the hell out of me the first time I came upon them (4 months after launch). I eventually played along only to find my toon in jail for the evening. In GC, everyone was laughing their asses off at my misfortune, we had a policy not to insult RP, and to play along when it came about.
I think that city was the first place I visit every time I go back to see what the game is like. My core guildies are strangely still there (we were a space faring guild). The RP is nowhere to be found...
Played (more than a month): SWG, Second Life, Tabula Rasa, Lineage 2, Everquest 2, EvE, MxO, Ryzom.
Tried: WoW, Shadowbane, Anarchy Online, Everquest, WWII Online, Planetside
Beta: Lotro, Tabula Rasa, WAR.
"Even without the abortion that was the early NGE, roleplayers tend to burn twice as bright and live half as long, as the play style is a full time job if done correctly."
A good article with only one item I disagree with, that provided above. I believe Role-Players are play on much longer than of the typical gamer. The reasons for this is that Role-Players can spend time doing something which really serves no purpose for playing the game; and example, having two RP'ers sit down at a table and begin plotting out loud; or start up a bar fight, while hurling one-lines at each other. So there is that added bit of fun.
RP'ers tend to be more loyal and passionate about the game they are involved with. They like communities and as long as the communities are there, they will stay even if the game mechanics have bugs.
However what Role-Players need that the majority of MMO's do not provide is dynamic story content by developers. Sure it is a good thing for players to provide content, but they also need the developers to provide content and to let the player have impact to the story. After all, role-playing games allow players to change the outcome of the campaign. Yet in MMO's this is not possible. SWG is an example of a static theme-park. Players cannot change the story-arc of Star Wars. Oh wait, there is the Secret Rebel Base... but it is still at the same spot that everyone knows about. So why hasn't the Emperor conducted a strike?
The technology to allow players to impact the story-arc is available, even in a massive environment. A problem I see is that a number of game developers have never played table-top RPG's... Technically growing up on C-RPG's where as long as there is level advancements, then the computer game is a RPG.
And that is why...
Conservatives' pessimism is conducive to their happiness in three ways. First, they are rarely surprised -- they are right more often than not about the course of events. Second, when they are wrong they are happy to be so. Third, because pessimistic conservatives put not their faith in princes -- government -- they accept that happiness is a function of fending for oneself. They believe that happiness is an activity -- it is inseparable from the pursuit of happiness.
I agree with Melsinda (:waves:)
I was on the same server with the same group of people for ages, and the RP community had it's ups and downs. The biggest problems I had was each "community" seemed exclusive of any other, so there were always conflicting ideas of what was going on. Would have been nice to have a server wide concensus and even maybe an overarching server "storyline"
But yes, the update to the game killed it for me as it did for many.
-Fell Shadarach - Master Smuggler
-Nichos Plakar - Master Bounty Hunter
Great article - rare to see such good writing outside Newsweeks and Times'. Still, I'd like to suggest you style wrtiing guides to correct a few things like too long sentences and excessive use of adjectives.
SWG has a place in my heart. It was one of my 1st mmo's, briefly trying EQ before that. Once I found out there was a Star Wars game, I was hooked, even before I had read what it was about or that it was an MMO. As a day 2 swg'er I found many days and nights of roleplay over 4years, with these highlights:
Agamemnon-NST-Kauri, loner, crafter, travelling salesman, got interested in bio-engineering field, made millions, lost it all on cheap girls in Mos Vegas, pan handled for a while in Mos Eisley when he was down on his luck. Worked his way back into the medical profession, joined the rebellion after seeing the Imperials slaughter the townspeople of Anchorhead. Became a covert operative, scouting out imperial bases and coordinating terrorist attacks against said bases during cover of night with a small special elite team of Agents. Watched an assasination happen during a wedding, wounded severely during the battle of Ruestess. Retired with full medical benefits. Opened up a Bio-engineering lab with a chef friend that had grander ideas. Took over general management operation of a strip club.
Indagadadaveeda-NST-Kauri-Crafter, part time dance enthusiast. Became a pretty busy chef, opened up a shop near anchorhead which spread to several chain stores across the known galaxy. Opened up several houses of ill-repute, with full time wait staff, illicit drug use, band gigs and nightly shows/dancers, manager of the strip joint. Arrested by Imperial Investigator for criminal activity, charges included racketeering, spice smuggling, prostitution, and illegal gambling. Completed 6months incarceration at Naboo Correctional Facility and reprocessing before returning to Tattooine to re-open a single strip joint with a few tasteful dancers....last seen being shoved into a speeder by suspected Jabba henchman.
Mordacacca-Smuggler-Chimera-Escaped trandoshan slave captivity, bummed around Mos Eisley doing odd jobs and muscle for hire. Was picked up in Mos Entha during a run in with local law enforcement, who ironically found smuggled spice in the saddlebags of his firends(borrowed) speeder. Was arrested, detained temporarily at the transfer point in Mos Eisley Imperial Detention Center. Caught a flu bug from a fellow prisoner, was transferred to Dathomir Prison only to escape during the aftermath of a Rebel Raid on the prison. Returned to Mos Eisley, accidentally helping spread an epidemic on 2 planets, and started working in the underworld circles for Lady V, had a run in with Jabba henchmen and forced to go to work for Jabba smuggling items to Talus from Tattooine for the Hutts. Had a legit front man business partner who helped fund expeditions but also sold items for him on the blackmarket.
Bilcli-Merchant-Chimera-a former jazz musician, played some small gigis in the Bestine/Anchorhead/Eisley scene. Peddled a little contraband now and then. Got clean in rehab after an overdose of spice, nearly died of an epidemic in Mos Eisley due to a low immune system from spice. Attended a funeral of a close friend that was actually interrupted by sand people. Ran away screaming like a coward. Went into collectibles and opened up a shop called "Needful Things" just outside of Mos Eisley. Hired staff and made a nice little profit selling certain "hard to come by" items on the market that we're of questionable sources.
I had countless others, 5 accounts and 8 characters per account, all but 3 leveled to max by the time I had had enough of the NGE. It was a really great game, I loved it, but it changed to much for me and after losing a guild of 478 people to just 3 online...I could no longer login and enjoy the roleplay. The new enhancements didn't help me much in that regard either, I do not like fps's which essentially that's what it became, it was far to difficult to roleplay any longer. I'm a long time roleplayer from Chainmail, to DND/ADD, Gurps, SW, Shadowrun, Traveller and Hero. I miss those days as well and especially the sci-fi ones. Now that I have an opportunity to develop a game, I give my all to get just a bit of that "ole roleplayer" mentality back into my game as we design it from the ground up. It's always in my mind.
Long live Roleplay!
http://www.forceofarms.com/index.php
Come to LotRO RPP'ers.
If you're in North America, I recommend the Landroval server (unofficial RP server). Avoid Brandywine, saw alot of the leet kids there.
The world isn't as involved as old SWG, but it's getting there. At least it has some of the world sim feel of SWG.
Nice to see there are still some roleplayers out there. When I am in game, no matter which game it is, I am in character. Perhaps my "in character" doesn't completely fit the genre of the game but I am in character. Each of my characters have their own personality. Some are witty, some grumpy, some curious and adventurous.
I have a character that is currently exploring a vast world and is very inquisitive about the things she finds and the people she meets. I sit here behind my keyboard giggling my arse off at the reactions she gets.
"I have a level 70 main." random player says.
"You have a main? Like, in your pocket or something?" I would say.
"Um, no I have a level 70 Warrior." he replies.
"You own a warrior, and he is level 70?" I said.
"Yes."
"Where is he?" I say while looking around.
And so on...
Anyway, I find it fun. SWG, was a great place for this type of play. Unfortunately the many changes drove me away.
-They call me Velsha
I am looking forward to an MMO set in the star wars universe to role-play in.
SWG is Star Wars flavored, not Star Wars.
S*D
This game is dead would be more accurate.
Mm, having played SWG myself for about a year (far past the NGE so I never got to play it before that), and having RP just about all the time, I do have to agree that the community wasn't really the greatest
But for anyone really looking for RP, hands down I have to say to come to City of Heroes (Virtue Server). No way I can really say how much RP there is (as well as some not so good, though its avoidable). Its just a hugely well put together situation since just about any character can fit in the CoH universe (Fantasy, Space, etc) with some modifications. Though the best RP you will find in Super Groups obviously.
Obviously its still a lot of hit and miss, just depends if you happen to join a less then great SG, but really, by far you should try CoH.
I never considered myself a RP'er in SWG but found myself doing it quite often. I tended to do things on my own or in small groups, whether hunting krayt, kimo's, or doing corvette runs. Not much RP went on then, just chatting with friends. When my bars would go black and I had to find Doc's or Ent's, that is when the RP would kick in and I liked it very much. The odd times when one or more of us would be flagged after killing Imp NPC's and opposing faction players would race by then stop for PVP would bring about RP also.
I remeber many times when I would have to get new armor and weapons made and Haanoverfist would give me grief for breaking his creations and threaten to charge me double to replace them. So many different ways to become immersed in RP even when you didn't consider yourself a RP'er. Things changed and did away with most of the game aspects that promoted RP, though some players still strive to keep it alive when SOE tries to make it harder for them.
With games like WoW where you find yourself grinding to earn funds to raid and in raids you are using VoN programs during raids to coordinate, you find very little if any RP'ing occuring. I'll keep waiting for another game to come out that offers all the things that made SWG worth not just playing, but being a part of the community.
Tomrin Alindale - Scylla Server (RIP)
Kraig Tarlson - Scylla Server (RIP)
Few points about topic:
1. When I first meet RPers in Eisley it was my mos memerable moment in SWG EVER. Not one instance, not all things devs added in NGE is worth 1/10 of that moment.
2. Too bad SOE wont bring back old pre NGE servers for RP community
3. I think, that maybe if those guys who work on SWG emulator ever manage to get online oroginal game and open full RP server than that old RP feeling will be back.
Let's hope they wil make it
SOE did not understand that I was only roleplaying about 4 years ago but with the lack of players on most of the SWG servers these days , one would have to come up with some idea of amusing themselves.
Roleplaying that you are on a single player game - I can see that.
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i wanted to RP in SWG but i came right when the hologrind began. even the coveted preCU was not RP friendly. i tried to RP a novice scout.., now i'm a PK spy who never /replies, chats, or accepts invites..
SWGs community, new or old, will suck any RP spirit you have out of you, and replace it with a jaded thirst for virtual blood, a craving for cheap GCW points, and a hunger for the most hateful of hate tells.
zirzo- CL90 imp spy, Valcyn
oxirz- CL36 imp smuggler, Bria
Never RPed in MMO's, that's what I play pen and paper games for (also my typing skills leave much to be desired). I'm sure the author could find a group to learn them with if he lives in even a medium sized city in the states. Game shops usually have groups the play in house and welcome newcommers.
What a great piece on role-playing in MMO's, /applaud.
I enjoyed role-play on occasion, with a particular group of folks that were really into that. I also did a lot of adventuring with non-roleplayers.
Things that helped roleplay for me, and immersion in general were the early option to equip any weapon, and use various types of armour. I also liked the apprentice system that linked you up with others in your profession that had a higher level of skill. I loved the active pub life in the cantinas, and felt this was encouraged by systems like mind buffs and healing of battle fatigue. Having camps that allowed certain buffs and heals also added to role-play, as did going to the med-centers for healing.
All of the diverse professions with their interdependent systems, the realistic crafting, buying and selling of goods also helped. I loved going to tailors for outfits for upcoming events (like ingame weddings), had to have a tux right? lol
. Gun shopping was one of my favourite pastimes. I also loved hunting to get meat for a chef friend of mine. He'd then make the best foods and drinks to help me be a better hunter. Very, very cool, very immersive, and great for role-playing.
I think someone got the idea that people don't like this in a videogame, and tbh, I just think they're wrong. I don't know anyone that said, "wow this immersion really sucks." People loved it. What they didn't love was being unable to complete their quests, having targets spawn in trees, or trying to use skills that didn't seem to work properly. They also didnt' like quests that consisted of gunning down 10 guys standing in a field around a flag that was supposed to represent an enemy base.
I really think SOE and LEC got some bad marketting research that led them to do what they did to their game. I could go into the flawed sampling design and confirmation bias in the results, but I'd probably even bore myself with that. I do hope, though, that some MMO company with an attractive IP (Ryzom looks kinda like this, but I don't know what a "Ryzom" is) realizes the great potential in immersive game systems like SWG used to have. I'm kinda hoping that StarTrek Online will have immersive elements to it. I guess time will tell
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I have to agree with this. I play CoH on Liberty mainly. Virtue is notorious for its role-play community. If you're not a role-player, people in game warn you not to play on that server lol.
rofl... I couldn't have said that better myself. In fact, I've said that on here many times, and been reported so I hope your post stays. Its something these people need to hear. They act like their lives are over because the nge hit. It gets very tiring.
I just don't understand why you guys would keep reading threads then that talk about the "good old days" etc.. If it bugs you so much, why read it?
If other people want to discuss something that matters to them, why intrude and tell them they're idiots?
Do you go out of your way to listen in on others when they talk about things that don't interest you in rl? Do you jump into the conversation you dislike and tell people to shut up and call them names?
It really seems like this is what you're doing here.
Man I so agree. I've been playing SWG, MxO, and even Second Life and I rarely if ever find dull immersion. Even those that are "RP'rs" spend alot of time simply chatting ooc about their new toys. In SL you would think this would be custom built for full immersion but not really. Even there it is all pvp or raunchy based rp. Never a mixture or anythign that resembles LIFE.
But I still search. I found that when i couldn't find what I needed I simply created it. I did on sl and I am trying on SWG. It is really hard to get people to slow down and see the beauty of SWG. I know the changes the devs made years ago made things difficult but I feel it really shouldn't matter...not to a RP'r. So any low level characters out there (Imperial or Rebel) or any others, feel free. I am will to do what ever is needed to form a group of pure RP's. We do not have to be o the same side, nor do we even have to mission or grind. RP is about more than just the moment...it is about the association the story of this person and that person. In my humble opinion.
Rex Obviate
vREXv Obviate on starsider.
No Apologies
AFK'ing is not RP'ing.. it is AFK'ing, your points are moot
No Apologies