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Certifications [new player read this]
cosy
Member UncommonPosts: 3,228
CCP give you a helping hand whit certificates
why certificates are implemented ? because many ppl dont know what to do in eve so eve give you something to do
old player used evemon for this, readed forums etc and now will be on game
how certificates are working ? easy CCP put on a list the common(no maxed skills) skills needed to fly a ship so when u get the skills u get a certificate for that
so when a n00b want to fly a battleship he can look on the certificate list pick battleship skills and buy that skills
is this "breaking" the sandbox ?
imo yes
is this bad for game ?
can bring more subscribers but this will make live easy for not so "intelligent" players because it points what player should do and dont let player think
ccp money: +1
evolution: -1
BestSigEver :P
Comments
But players like you, who can't even write a grammatically correct sentence, belong to the crowd of the "intelligent" people, right?
The elitism is strong with you, young padawan..
Certificates will help new players into the game, give them some sort of progress, and help corps recruit new players. I don't see any downside of this feature. If you don't like it, you don't have to use it, as all certificates can be kept private.
I don't see how the certification planner is really any different than what everybody's already been doing for years with Evemon.
I think less reliance on out-of-game 3rd party tools as a core part of the game is a good thing, even though I love Evemon to death and will still use it.
Certifications; another sign CCP is going weak and starts catering for the masses (and thus steers away from the initial concept/idea).
Yeah, maybe its a tool, but I recognize it for what it really is, another way to add goals into the game for players to log and keep track of. LoTRO, WAR, COX, all of these games gave awards for accomplishing certain things,which some folks love to collect.
CCP added skills to the mix, but notice some of these include silly ones like killing a friendly CEO, probably some for killing an enemy ceo as well.
Just a way to add concrete goals into a sandbox game. Maybe some folks won't like that, but some people can't get into EVE w/o such goals, and CCP above all else, would love to see more players get into the game.
We are all still free to ignore this completely (I probably will) and it doesn't affect my gameplay a bit.
For anyone decrying this as making it too easy for the masses, you'd better not be using EVEMON, or EFT because true hardcore players would scoff at you and say you're dumbing down the game. Real players can plan their skills and fit ships w/o them.
But who wants to? Nice to have a bit off help sometime, the purpose of games is to have fun, and not spend time driving nails into your head to prove you're hardcore.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
But players like you, who can't even write a grammatically correct sentence, belong to the crowd of the "intelligent" people, right?
The elitism is strong with you, young padawan..
Certificates will help new players into the game, give them some sort of progress, and help corps recruit new players. I don't see any downside of this feature. If you don't like it, you don't have to use it, as all certificates can be kept private.
I agree, obviously everyone's primary language is english.
As far as the Certificates themselves, they seem like fluff, nothing wrong with that, but I'm pretty sure they have no effect on anything and thus are useless to me.
Certificates is just one in a row of late CCP failures...
Certificates won't help any player to do the most important - learn the game.
Along with focus on PvE content it is just another step to make the game linear MSO game...
I think its a cool mechanic helps new players work on specific skills so they can specialize easier and gives older players all these cool certs for bragging rights.
i played Eve for a year + and never once used Evemon or the fitting tool (didn't know they existed the first six months anyway).
I planned all my skills out on pen and paper and didn't follow what the cool kids were doing on all the eve fansites.
anyway, helping out new players isn't ruining the game. I think the majority of the older players in eve would rather new players stay away which is sad imo. we need new players in this game or CCP will close up shop.
Edit: I'm not playing eve atm are the certificates in game or are they on test for the midus expansion in Dec?
Playing: Nothing
Looking forward to: Nothing
I don't see how anyone can view this as a failure. It's not as if CCP is taking away your ability to do whatever you want. But considering how many new players quit the game because they just plain don't know what to do, this is a very good addition. It doesn't make the game any less sandbox. It just gives people ideas of what types of things they can do in the sandbox. It gives players set goals to work towards, and these goals give them nothing over another player who chooses to ignore the certificates.
The most common thing you'll read on these forums (or any EVE related forums for that matter) are the incredibly steep learning curve. For those of us who play (or have played) the game, I think it goes without saying that this MMO does not cater to those who want to "jump in and play".
Now whether or not you personally feel that this is a good game dynamic or not I won't get into. That's all opinion. But it would seem that CCP has a choice to make here - by introducing new features into the game with a goal of making it more new-player-friendly, will that result in a net of more players (more people join because its easier, versus the folks who leave because they think it's getting too easy) or less?
Obviously CCP is betting on the former... anything to make the introductory experience for new users easier means more subscriptions, and I highly doubt that people who love the sandbox nature of EVE will flee simply because the game has gotten a bit easier for some.
After all... more players = more victims corp mates...
batolemaeus that fact that my english is CRAP dont change the fact that this is wow friendly action, and that CCP care more about the money that about game sandbox
BestSigEver :P
How is it a failure?
As already said, it might help new players to get to know what to train(even though I find it rather confusing), however it will not tell them what they are actualy training and why. Such tools are not educational, they are manuals how to 'play' the game leaving you clueless with your SP.
As an example could be presented +6 month old player I was giving basic lesson of EVE mechanic. He had no clue about tracking, speed and missile mechanics at all because all what he was doing is missions.
CCP is turning EVE into mainstream games removing all that harsh and challenging aspect of the game...
Yes, of course they do. CCP did not develop EVE as a philanthropy project. CCP has investors who couldn't care less about the "sandbox"... they care about bottom line profits.
So once again - as long as this feature change results in more new subscriptions than canceled subscriptions, CCP wins.
No cosy it is not a WOW friendly action. I used to play EVE. I think it will help people and as was said before give the new people some goals. What is the difference betwen this and EVEMON ??? There is none really.
EVE is still a harsh brutal world and this new feature changes nothing.
Oh and by the way EVE is a business. They made the game to make money. Why do I see so many posts being critical about game companies wanting to make more money. Come on people get real.
If making money bothers you so much the next time you are offered a raise why don't you refuse it.
jposavatz i dont know who got introversions in ccp but ccp have buyed all rights from Simon & Schuster
also this will bring less quality player = less quality recruits
kb4blu each time the game by itself tell/show u a road to follow is a "wow friendly"
difference between this and evemon easy
in evemon u have to put the skill on the list and find by yourself what skills u need
whit this u get the list whit skill and u put that list on evemon, and this encourage more the solo play, if players dont have things to ask other player the level of player interaction is lower (hope u understand me)
we know that this is business BUT ppl(like me) dont like the kind of business where ccp is going
ccp started whit 30k sub on early days and most of game lose subs after 1 year (wow is a exception on that because of viral marketing used ccp dont have the a similar marketing system that wow have) and eve get more and more player because have given a challenge to players
we started whit 40k sp now u start whit 800k sp day by day eve lower the standards by number this is ok because there are move n00bs that vets quitting
BestSigEver :P
cosy
I still think you are over-reacting.
I played EVE when we hit 10000 players on at one time. Games and companies have to grow or they stagnate. Do you want EVE to stagnate ?? Its a hard fact but without growth how is EVE going to finance the new hardware that they bought and NEED.
Every time EVE makes ANY kind of change their forums explode with doom and gloom about how EVE is going to hell in a hand basket and getting more carebear. If you look at their forums I know you have seen this. But EVE is still a brutal place. (Try mining in lo sec without a lot of ships to protect you). Heck just try to go to lo sec and fly around. You will be either attacked by at least 3 or 4 ships that you have no chance against or be fried at a gatecamp. I sure you know this. That has not changed.
Even if someone uses these new features and gets a battleship fully loaded a newer person will still lose it. Quickley.
EVE stll requires skill and experience to survive. No new tools are going to change that.
As long as skill is needed EVE will be fine. It that ever changes I will join you in calling EVE carebear WOW land.
That didn't make any sense. Please elaborate.
I'll give you a 2/10 for effort. Try again..
You mean the concept that made people leave the game on a daily basis? You mean THAT concept? You must like a singleplayer EvE?
So too summarize, you use EvEmon alot, but you don't want it implented in the game, because it killed all the hardcoreness?
I started with EvE a few months ago, and the first thing I did was downloading EvEmon. At that time I didn't even knew the difference between a fig and a dreadnought, but I was able to find "easy" layouts in eve mon, and train that.
Is it me or is EvEmon more casual then the certification system.
On a other note, I like CCP alot, since I play EvE. Looks like they care for their game. Sure not everything works out as smooth as planned, but when there is a will, there is a way.
It's not the 'hardcore' part perse, it's more subtle than that. Older players have seen that over time CCP's ideas have been changing, at first it was this "hardcore PK PVP game, if you can't deal with it just leave". CCP's whole focus was on that, ofcourse they worked on taking out (near) exploits or overpowered stuff but in essence it was a school of hard knocks game. That's what makes the game so different from most other MMO's, the fact that players are in control and everything you do can have consequences. It's the basis of the game.
Lately we see that CCP is softening up on their ideas (tinfoil wearers would say that it's because they care less about the EVE concept and just want to make tons of money to use it on their new MMO), and while every step is a small one and by itself not neccesarily wrong there's a trend where the game slowly starts to shift towards being more player friendly. While that sounds like a good thing, to most people who understand what the core of EVE actually is it's the devil incarnate.
The more player friendly the game gets, the more simple goals they introduce the more this becomes WOW in space, where people can just PVE it up and get to lvl 70 and get their uber sword of ultimate doom. Said tinfoil wearers are afraid that this whole thing will remove the initial attraction and uniqueness of the game meaning it will disturb the delicate gameplay which made EVE so successful in the first place. So no, it's not the one fact that we get 'medals', it's the bigger picture where we see CCP changing their 'ideals' for the game.
That's what worries us.
Did you seriously just say that an in-game help with skill planning is a step towards wow in space?
Srsly?
I see this as a great chance, especially since they also introduce corp-internal badges/certificate thingies. Using the titles already ingame was a tad tedious and you wouldn't keep them with corp changes.
If they suddenly made all aggression in highsec space a bannable offense i would agree with you, but a tool to give you some help with skilling? No, sorry, i can't see how this is a step in making eve a wow-ish place in any way.
It's not skillplanning, it's introducing artificial goals and 'medals', an idea they nicked from WARhammer no doubt. The more game provided goals they make the worse it gets. EVE is about player made/driven goals, not medals, uberswords or any other crap copied from other MMO's. I don't WANT stuff from other MMO's, if I wanted that I'd be playing those, not EVE. Anyone who DOES want stuff from other MMO's please, go back to that one and leave this niche game be instead of trying to turn it into yet another mainstream short attentionspan ADHD thingy.
As I stated, it's not one thing (or this one) in particlular, it's the whole shift in ideals (or lack thereof), it's the main DEVS switching to the new MMO leaving EVE to people who obviously fail to understand what the core of EVE was. Already we have a DEV who stated that wardeccing can be griefing, do you have ANY idea of the possible implications of that single statement right there? We went from DEVS who said "kill em all, take no prisoners" and they molded the game on that concept and that's why it's different form other MMO's and that's why it's been succesful, we're possibly going to "we can't have people being punished for their (in)actions". ie, BOREFEST!
Next thing they'll make gatecamps a lot more difficult because it's "unfair", or they make it so you can only attack a POS when the majority of the defending alliance is online and in that system because otherwise it's "unfair". Sound silly? yes possibly, but they are more examples of the game introducing rules to soften the experience where we didn't need/want those before, and that really is where the problem lies to me; They have started going soft and catering for the non-effort/PVP players trying to become a mainstream MMO, how far are they willing to go with that?
Certificates have been in the F&I section for close to 3 years now. I HIGHLY doubt they nicked anything from any game with this feature, especially considering the development cycles are damn long in eve.
Ans yes, the dev was right. The wardec system is broken, has been for a long time. It's broken in the same sense that player bounties are not working. That has been a topic of discussion for a long time, the P nerf was just Ccp admitting that there was a problem with that game mechanic.
Nothing is silly enough to prevent people from suggesting just that.The response from a few devs was quite funny. Sadly i didn't have logging enabled on my notebook..
But i can provide you with another one. Wrangler about the possibility of a PvE server:
<!Wrangler> about the same time pigs turn blue and flies through the skies throwing dynamite on giant pink dragons
I don't think its the feature itself that is the problem , its more the direction that it indicates the game is going towards.
I see this as a means for CEO's to actually check the trained skills of a player. The rest is just bla-di-bla.
Sidenote, EvE is stil a looooooong way from being a Space WoW.
A sandbox is a sandbox, Since when is a sandbox considered catering to carebears when the developers add more tools to the box?
Imo the more tools they give us the better the sandbox (even if the tools are just fluff).
Playing: Nothing
Looking forward to: Nothing