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Anybody else think today's MMO's are too "vanilla"?
Zindaihas
Member UncommonPosts: 3,662
I'm currently playing WAR and I have to say, there are some things about it that I really like. It has managed to keep me interested longer than most other MMO's I have played recently. But, even so, I have noticed a trend that seems to be all too common in just about every one regardless of which company makes them.
There is vary little variation outside of combat in today's games. I don't know if this is a result of the success of WoW or not. I never played WoW so I can't pinpoint it to that. But it seems like, the sole purpose now is to travel to a location on the map that is your character's appropriate level, fight like crazy to level up and acquire new gear, then move on the the next location and do the very same thing.
All of my character's skill and abilites are focused on combat skills and nothing else. The dungeons are very basic because there is nothing to do other than enter, kill mobs and move on again. The rogue class has virtually been eliminated or stripped of any thieving skills because they are no longer necessary. I remember in EQ, there were tons of spells that were tailor made for non-combat situations. SoW, levitate, teleport, etc. It appears those days are gone.
/sigh
Comments
I have to agree with you on some of these points. Combat systems when you put it out like that will always be that way. Games do very in how combat works though. If you look at Tabula Rasa (which i havent played) it has a combat system similiar to FPS games in a way. But I bet even in that game you travel from one area to another killing mobs.
I have to disagree about the abilities only being for combat. Even in WoW i think Warlocks have an ability similiar to teleporting. Some games like GW don't really need spells like that because you can pretty much move around the world freely. I think it comes down to the fact that everyone wants traveling abilties no matter what class you are. I do however like the fact that some games have classes that get special abilties or spells that can be used outside of combat like the ones you mentioned.
..And this is why i am not playing fantasy mainstream..
I don't know they have pretty much always been that way more or less. Even EQ you found an area with mobs your level and started grinding to get XP. Skill games are the same except you grind a specific skill. Even with the addition of crafting you are doing pretty much the same thing. It comes with the territory of having a hierarchical system I am afraid.
Don't you worry little buddy. You're dealing with a man of honor. However, honor requires a higher percentage of profit
I whole heartly agree with you. MMOs have focused so much on combat everything outside of the combat bubble has gone to complete crap. UO spoiled me on what a online world should be.
/signed
"Vanilla" is an accurate description, IMO. The extremely linear design and the single minded focus on combat are two points that I agree with 100%. They may be good games, they may be polished, but they are very bland...
I'll sign off on this too then. Pretty much what Tatum said. I wouldn't mind if the games became borader in the sense that there's more to do then just fight.
No required quests! And if I decide I want to be an assassin-cartographer-dancer-pastry chef who lives only to stalk and kill interior decorators, then that's who I want to be, even if it takes me four years to max all the skills and everyone else thinks I'm freaking nuts. -Madimorga-
A MMORPG could be so much more than just Combat....
UO and SWG showed this, by having lots of non combat stuff to do that actually had a meaning and role in the game...
But, if you tried suggesting adding something non combat related into a game today, you would get lynched by the "new" crowd that overtook the market when WoW appeared, and their slogan for lynching me would be "We don't want to play the Sims Online doh, dumbar$e!"
Vanilla. Yes, very apropos. It's good word to describe the bleh of today's MMOs
ya i agree that alot or most new mmo's are following the eq and wow style and are therefore "vanilla". but at the same time i am having alot of fun of war and i am glad i picked it up. it would be nice if companies would look outside the fantasy realm for information and make a different kind of mmo (coh/cov, eve, huxely if it comes out and delivers, etc.). maybe even make a modern day mmo somehow. who knows. also maybe trying to spice up the combat system somehow
Lets say I agree 80-90%. I dont want to go to EQ1 with all its complications, like the endless "sit and wait for mana/health regen" or the origial corpse runs, but I too feel todays MMOs are way too streamlined and one-dimensional.
I think your post really told the others about War. Sounds to me it is just an advanced F2P combat game.
Nothing much unique these days... Its all pretty much the same. Why? Because its tried and tested.
You wouldn't goto a resteraunt and order "ze Ps Vo ke la bee" when you have no idea what it is... you might just go with "Pizza" in their menu. Some people like being different, but dont always succeed.
___________________
Give me a good skill based sandbox game, and i'll give you a cookie!
The bland, vanilla quality of newer MMOs is the main reason why they get old so quickly. Theres not much there to learn and discover. Once you've made it to the mid levels, you've pretty much seen what the game has to offer. Combat, level, gear, move to next zone, combat, level, gear...
I say it all the time, but if you trim all the "fluff" and secondary features you end up with an extremely bland game.
I agree..
It's not the 'vanilla' aspect of the games.. it's the lack or RP is the MMORPG. With the "Reward system" of leveling and most games being able to be played Solo.. then Role playing isn't really involved. I mean, who stands out in the middle of no where.. roleplaying solo?
Lately, I've been craving sandbox myself. A game where I can do something NON combat and fun with it. in WAR .. all there is is combat. PQ, RvR, Scenarios... The crafting system is designed to support the combat.. I mean in AC.. you could make cakes, pies, hot chocolate, roast.. Sure... all of it gave you stamina used it fighting.. but.. there were much better ways to go about that..
And there was player housing... arguably one of the most sandbox like features (which is why Games like WAR, WoW, .. ANY theme park game should not have housing)
Currently playing Real Life..
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For all your stalking needs..
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Very true. I think the general idea in MMOs now is that "RPG" just means: combat--leveling--gear. Theres very little character customization any more and you really have no choice as far as how you want to play the game.
Too many MMOs strive to be the 'new' WoW. Fact is, you're not going to beat it at its own game, and you should try to find your own niche.
I agree. Not much else to add really.
Yep, World of Warcraft wins "best in class" for me so I have no desire to try any more fantasy MMORPG's or other 'battle & quest until you're the top level' kind of games. I wouldn't call WoW vanilla...more like sherbet. In bloodelf lands it's orange sherbet:
And nightelf lands is berry sherbet:
http://www.allaboutgod.com/
Market saturation my friends.
The truth is, an Epic Pony is an Epic Pony no matter which MMO you play...
I try to stay away from Fantasy games... well except the ones I have with my GF.
Yeah, developers/publishers seem to be sticking with WoW as a business model. I'm just gonna wait for a pre-nge SWG game to come along, if it ever does.
http://www.youtube.com/user/Metallica8589/videos?view=0
The reason why all the MMO's seem vanilla is because there aren't any fresh ideas out there that will create a game, that will turn a profit... Lets face it, what works, is what will make money... And right now its hack/slash/get chance at uber item... If all the folks in this thread were the development team for "our" game... We would love it, but not alot of others would play it...
I like a game that you are afraid to die... like EQ1 was when it first came out... I remeber hesitating, ALOT, before I went frolicking anywhere... a bad decision meant you could loose all your equiptment... I remember falling into a high level zone with my mid level character (the Hole, for you EQ players) and I had to go find, and pay, a high level character to help me get my stuff... it required work... Thats HARDCORE... All/most the games now are pretty carebear...
The game of our dreams seldom is the ones that are produced, so we end up playing the one that gets the closest to it...
But yes...vanilla is very accurate...
Couldn't agree more...
If there is anything I long for it is a modern version of UO. I think that game was absolutely the best concept of an MMO ever. It still baffles me that no one ever came up with doing UO in a modern setting with modern graphics and a view like you have in MMOs these days.
No, it is not like I'm imagining SWG, I played that one for some time also, but in my mind UO had the best MMO concept ever. It is the only game I know in which you 'created' your own class based upon the skills you decided you wanted to pick up. And it was all useful one way or another.
I don't see this happening anytime soon though, since the majority wants cooky cutter stuff without having to think. Look at why WoW got so popular: simplicity.
Oh well, one can only keep hoping...
The developers have the same mentality as music and movie executives.
They see a format that works, and follow that line, never veering, never actually being creative.
Large corporations will never risk trying something new and "edgy", they like the old "tried and true" method, that is why your best bet is from an independant developer, a small company that has to "break the mold" to get their game in the spotlight, just like indy film makers and indy bands.
Boy bands and pop stars can be compared to wow clones
True, but EQ was much more of a sandbox game than todays MMOs. I remember high level and low level areas all over the map. In the games I am playing today, I almost feel like a mouse moving through a maze. I start at the begining, follow a path and move my way to the finish line. Too linear for my tastes. Even WAR, which, as I mentioned, I tend to enjoy on balance, is much more linear than I would like.
Welcome to the world of 'Theme Park' MMORPG's. Thats WOW, WAR, AoC and any other you can add to the endless list. Everyone seems to be trying to follow the WOW success and the sad truth is WOW will be on the throne until something different comes along. WAR, AoC etc... simply are trying to make a profit and nothing more, they know that they cannot beat WOW but they are going with a tried and tested gaming model of kill X to get Y reward. Like any other business its invest as little as possible to get the maximum return. WAR & AoC have proven that you can churn out a theme park MMO and it will make you a profit, look at their subscriptions and see what I mean. To be honest why should developers change? I dont blame them for churning out crap, because players will pay the money to play them.
My point is you cant blame developers, there told what to developer. Its the MMO public who is at fault, there prepared to pay money for this 'Theme Park' style of gaming and are happy with that. Until the majority put down their credit cards and say "No, time for something new" why should developers change? I wouldnt if I were them, the Theme Park MMO style works.
Maybe one day something different will happen but personally for the forseeable future at least, get used to WOW clones, WAR certainly wont be the last.