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So is everybody ready for gas prices to go back up?
Jimmy_Scythe
Member CommonPosts: 3,586
Now that the election is almost over, how does everyone feel about $5 a gallon... again...
What? You thought the prices were gonna level out under $5 per gallon?
Comments
I dont know why people are saying this. The republicans dont control the price of gas. Prices are down because the entire trading market is down and so is demand.
Now that prices are down to around 2 dollars in Michigan, Im seeing an assload of SUVs back on the road all of a sudden. That is what's going to drive the price back up. That and OPEC cutting production.
I'm ready, I got my transit pass all ready to go.
of course they are going to go up , the cost of Obama's "green" plans will force all the refineries to have to do Billions of $ of upgrades or shut down ( well they WILL have to shut down to upgrade meaning we WILL have shortages and that will drive up costs again), the issue with the coal plants will force the energy dept to use ALOT more oil driving the market back up , OPEC is going to cut production because they already know you will pay it .
Not to mention these companies wil have higher taxes to pay , no offsetting "exemptions" + they have to pay to research better ways to do things. But , but but ... they had record profits last 13 quarters ... yeah they made enough to build 3 ,thats it, 3 refineries,( using todays stds not the new ones our netx pres promises to enact, if they happen then they can build 1 "normal" and 1 small one , IF they could find a place in the US willing to let them ) and to biuld these thats means no money for raises, for improvments to existing facilities , no expansion, no research for cleaner ways or efficient ways , no new employees , etc ...
So lets recap ...
propsed "green" plans means its going to cost ALOT more to produce gas ( + expeceted deflation of ANY amount will shut down all of our refineries in 1 day were it to set in btw) , no tax breaks for anyone willing to invest to offset really high production costs( including the oil companies themselves), cant build anything else in the US due to the "not in my backyard" mentality , the whole coal thing (if its true) will drive up prices again for oil , and OPEC already knows you WILL pay 5$ a gallon even if there is no reason to.
You guys are about to elect a man who is going to make everything cost more and now you are already planning to cast the blame on the party going out?
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
What are the spectulators confident again? and willing to start toying with the market again?
I find it amazing that by 2020 first world countries will be competing to get immigrants.
The election year gas price reduction, is it real, or is it a myth?
Excerpt from an argument for, rather a possible example of, such a case from 2006 involving Goldman Sachs:
Goldman Sachs, which runs the largest commodity index, the G.S.C.I., said in early August that it was reducing the index’s weighting in gasoline futures significantly. The announcement did not make big headlines, but it has reverberated through the markets in the weeks since and some other investors who had been betting that gasoline would rise followed suit on their weightings.
...
Unleaded gasoline made up 8.72 percent of Goldman’s commodity index as of June 30, but it is just 2.3 percent now, representing a sell-off of more than $6 billion in futures contract weighting.
-- A sell-off of more than $6 billion in gasoline futures contracts? Let’s put it this way, a $6 billion trade is not decided on at the lower levels of the firm.
...
President George W. Bush nominated Henry M. Paulson, Jr. to be the 74th Secretary of the Treasury on June 19, 2006. The United States Senate unanimously confirmed Paulson to the position on June 28, 2006 and he was sworn into office on July 10, 2006. Before coming to Treasury, Paulson was Chairman and Chief Executive Officer of Goldman Sachs. So what does Goldman do just weeks after Paulson is sworn in as Treasury Secretary? It announces a subtle move that drives down gasoline prices, short-term. Nice move, coming just months before the election.
I am not sure where I stand on all this, but I am fairly sure I don't have all the facts, and a lot of the technicalities might very well be over my head. It makes you wonder though...
EDIT: Added paragraph from article about nomination of *cough* Paulson *cough* in time to see this done.
Obama says energy prices would "necessarily skyrocket".
www.eyeblast.tv/public/video.aspx
Obama :"The problem is not technical, uh, and the problem is not mastery of the legislative intricacies of Washington. The problem is, uh, can you get the American people to say, ?This is really important,? and force their representatives to do the right thing? That requires mobilizing a citizenry. That requires them understanding what is at stake. Uh, and climate change is a great example.
You know, when I was asked earlier about the issue of coal, uh, you know ? Under my plan of a cap and trade system, electricity rates would necessarily skyrocket. Even regardless of what I say about whether coal is good or bad. Because I?m capping greenhouse gases, coal power plants, you know, natural gas, you name it ? whatever the plants were, whatever the industry was, uh, they would have to retrofit their operations. That will cost money. They will pass that money on to consumers.
They ? you ? you can already see what the arguments will be during the general election. People will say, ?Ah, Obama and Al Gore, these folks, they?re going to destroy the economy, this is going to cost us eight trillion dollars,? or whatever their number is. Um, if you can?t persuade the American people that yes, there is going to be some increase in electricity rates on the front end, but that over the long term, because of combinations of more efficient energy usage, changing lightbulbs and more efficient appliance, but also technology improving how we can produce clean energy, the economy would benefit.
If we can?t make that argument persuasively enough, you ? you, uh, can be Lyndon Johnson, you can be the master of Washington. You?re not going to get that done."
Energy prices skyrocketing will leave the economy in tatters, as we saw earlier this year. While no one doubts the need to start transitioning to better sources of energy, the manner in which that gets done means the difference of whether it gets done at all. A stagnant or receding economy does not produce scientific breakthroughs, especially when government both increases taxes and imposes steep cost burdens on energy. That cuts into both manufacturing and R&D, because as profits fall, fewer dollars go into research ? which means that all of these wonderful developments would get delayed, or go unrealized altogether.
We need to plan for the transition better than what Obama proposes. We need to use our own reserves of oil, natural gas, coal, and shale to cushion the economy while we develop the alternatives and build the infrastructure to deliver it. That?s what John McCain proposed in his Lexington Project.
Price shocks on energy is the last thing this economy needs. It would be worse than the taxes Obama promises to impose on investment, and would have the same depressive effect. It?s an utter disaster.
I think it was a foregone conclusion that eventually gas prices will go back up regardless of who winds the elections. But high gas prices may be a blessing in disguise in that it will promote the market to make more fuel efficent cars and the developement of alternative fuels and make them more palatble to the consumers. If it were up to me I would actually raise gas taxes to keep them artificially high just to motivate the developement of more efficient cars. Sure it would hurt now the the rewards down the road will be worth it IMO
I disagree. I think that we should pahese in new technology just as we have other things through regulation of the auto industry. We should not force people into it by price gouging them, instead we should force car makers to make better cars through regulation, not through the consumers. Instead of attcking people who are just trying to feed their families, we instead make the new cars better and pahse out the old ones over time. Like the government already has a voucher program that youc an exchange in your old car for $3000 on a car that is less than 3 years old. well do it that way instead of starving families to make them pay artificial prices.
We all want the same thing here, it is a matter of how we do it. I do not think making people suffered needlessly is the answer, there are other ways to do things, they should be considered befor you go to extrremes of making people do without in order to accomplish another goal.
Obama's plans will be much worse for our economy partially do to his position on energy. he plans on bankrupting the coal industry that provides 50% of US energy. he plans on taxing our resources to death, and in doing so the people will pay the price for it, these companies do not dip into profits, they just raise prices when that happens. He has already stated energy costs for americans will " necessarily skyrocket" under his plans. That is the wrong way to do this.
Why hurt the consumer? If you REALLY want to use government to encourage it, offer a tax break for developement? I mean for god's sake, there is plenty of pork in the budget... why not do something actually useful instead of a little of it?
No problem for me. I'll just drive less. I do see the H3s and Excavators coming out of hiding in my area. They always seem to be doing the speed limit. I guess they gotta show off the phat chrome rims.
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
Sadly, not everyone has that option. Hell I have to drive about 50 miles each way to get to and from work right now.... I DO have a good MPG rating on my car (07 Elantra).. but even that hurts at $5 a gallon.
Dont get me wrong, people getting SUVs again are being dumbasses, but still...
Goldman Sachs is responsible for 90% of the oil speculation in the market.
Other bankers are responsible, primiarily, for the remaining 10%.
And, yes, it is the same people who YOU bought "toxic" assets from; gave free money to; and will continue to guarantee their financial business decisions.
This thread is dumb. Gas was traded for what gas would be worth in the future and not for what it was worth at the time being. Gas wasn't in a shortage and won't be for at least 40 more years. Now that the damn stock market is down the price of gas is down. Demand IMHO hasn't changed one bit. I still drive my car same way i did when it was lower as i do when it was higher. Still see every SuV on the road and Truck no matter what the gas is.
Why because they choose to drive a big car. If they want to buy the gas let them, SuVs arn't hurting the market it's the new demand that the world is what is hurting people at the pump. With China and India markets starting to grow so does the demand for Oil and that demand cuts into our supplies that at one point we had on lock. So the problem is no one wants to innovate anymore and learn how to make a new source of energy. We as americans have gotten lazy when it comes to creating new things if it doesn't involve blowing shit up.
The funny part is I can see so many tripping stones coming up for the economy its not funny. Even if gas did go up to say 8 dollars a gallon thats only one of our worries. Ironically the dollar has gained considerable value in the last few weeks. Value which isn't all that warranted. Once this lovely little affair with the goverment fubage wears off the dollar will crash. The economy will deal with the 1.2.3.4.5.6 hell even 7 punch of a goverment administration change, dollar crash, fuel increase, continued war, consumer confidence crash, reassumption of previous loan schemes and so on so forth yada yada. Eventually things will stablizes of course but thats going to take a decade or so. I for one am REALLY happy Im getting married to a nurse. There standard wage is obscenely high and I'll be able to cooperatively work out a very nice lifestyle. I feel bad for the singles in this economy. Let alone the guys married to the wives which don't share, yessh, marriage+greed = suicide!
Why because they choose to drive a big car. If they want to buy the gas let them, SuVs arn't hurting the market it's the new demand that the world is what is hurting people at the pump. With China and India markets starting to grow so does the demand for Oil and that demand cuts into our supplies that at one point we had on lock. So the problem is no one wants to innovate anymore and learn how to make a new source of energy. We as americans have gotten lazy when it comes to creating new things if it doesn't involve blowing shit up.
Im not saying to stop them... but if they can do without it, it's a waste of their money, which means stupid.
Incidently, stupid could also be for fun... and there is nothing wrong with that, but I still will call it dumb.
Why because they choose to drive a big car. If they want to buy the gas let them, SuVs arn't hurting the market it's the new demand that the world is what is hurting people at the pump. With China and India markets starting to grow so does the demand for Oil and that demand cuts into our supplies that at one point we had on lock. So the problem is no one wants to innovate anymore and learn how to make a new source of energy. We as americans have gotten lazy when it comes to creating new things if it doesn't involve blowing shit up.
Im not saying to stop them... but if they can do without it, it's a waste of their money, which means stupid.
Incidently, stupid could also be for fun... and there is nothing wrong with that, but I still will call it dumb.
You have a 100 mile daily commute and then call other people dumb/stupid?
Yes. Because the job moved. When I got the job, it was in one building, and now it is in another. That first was about 10-15 minutes from the apartment I got WHEN I ACCEPTED THE JOB.
Since then, things have happened that lock me right here where I am, including my littlest brother going to college and needing a place to stay so the family can afford to send him. (It's also nice that the company is willing to let me alternate buildings if/when gas goes up again.)
My choice is to keep working or not as things stand... Yes, if I need accomodation, the company is willing to lend a hand, but pretty much this is where I am.
Now if someone gave up an SUV because it was too expensive, and now goes back to one WHERE THEY HAVE A CHOICE ON THE MATTER even though we all know prices will likely go back up... yes, I will call them stupid.
There is the key. It isn't always a matter of choice but convenience. Have you ever had to pack 4 kids, 2 parents, and a weeks worth of groceries for 6 people in a sedan? (We'll skip the conversation about the level of 'dumb' it takes to want to have 4 kids to begin with...) It could possibly be done but it wouldn't be very convenient. And if I have an option between being a sardine or being comfortable for $2.25/gallon, I know which one I would choose 100% of the time. You have your reasons (which are perfectly valid) for driving so far to work, and lots of people have reasons (which are just as valid to them) for driving the suburban to Walmart.
I'm not saying you are doing it, but many people just look at everyone that drives a larger SUV as just a gas guzzleing idiot. Some people don't have a choice, some people already made their choice and can't afford another car, and some people couldn't care less about dropping 100 bucks on gas every few days.
Trust me ignore that mans comments. Your a working American which should be enough. I doubt the said poster who tried to bring you down even has a job or for that matter knows how hard it can be to pay the bills especially when the only job you can get is 50 miles away. Alot of people pick a field and have to stick with it, until they can be better trained or equiped. Theres nothing wrong with driving 100 miles to work. There is something wrong with driving a vehicle for a family of six when its just you and your golden retriever. To the people that are most likely going to say "But Rosie! They should be allowed to drive whatever they want, this is America We have freedom here!" Freedom does not dictate ignorance or apathy. That is a personal choice that should be frowned upon, I do not care what anyone says. Just because you have the right to be lazy or shoot off your mouth does not mean you should. Freedom is an idea people, there is no real "Freedom" its all in peoples heads.
_____________________________
At the turn of the century...
In 2008...
Cracked.com voted Roosevelt as the most badass President of all time.
This is his story....
There is the key. It isn't always a matter of choice but convenience. Have you ever had to pack 4 kids, 2 parents, and a weeks worth of groceries for 6 people in a sedan? (We'll skip the conversation about the level of 'dumb' it takes to want to have 4 kids to begin with...) It could possibly be done but it wouldn't be very convenient. And if I have an option between being a sardine or being comfortable for $2.25/gallon, I know which one I would choose 100% of the time. You have your reasons (which are perfectly valid) for driving so far to work, and lots of people have reasons (which are just as valid to them) for driving the suburban to Walmart.
I'm not saying you are doing it, but many people just look at everyone that drives a larger SUV as just a gas guzzleing idiot. Some people don't have a choice, some people already made their choice and can't afford another car, and some people couldn't care less about dropping 100 bucks on gas every few days.
Ok, now that Ive gotten that out of the way, let me get back to you... I honestly agree with almost evverything you've said... but I have one key point to add.
If the person with the SUV got rid of it when gas was closing on $5 a gallon, and now that it drops again go back even as they KNOW the price is going up again, that really is dumb. Now, even in this case, there is NOTHING wrong with that. As I said, this is America, and so long as you are not hurting anyone or breaking laws, do it if you like.
Just know the price you pay, and stay in your means, and I have nothing but good wishes for you... (maybe a snicker, but that's my own bias).
There is the key. It isn't always a matter of choice but convenience. Have you ever had to pack 4 kids, 2 parents, and a weeks worth of groceries for 6 people in a sedan? (We'll skip the conversation about the level of 'dumb' it takes to want to have 4 kids to begin with...) It could possibly be done but it wouldn't be very convenient. And if I have an option between being a sardine or being comfortable for $2.25/gallon, I know which one I would choose 100% of the time. You have your reasons (which are perfectly valid) for driving so far to work, and lots of people have reasons (which are just as valid to them) for driving the suburban to Walmart.
I'm not saying you are doing it, but many people just look at everyone that drives a larger SUV as just a gas guzzleing idiot. Some people don't have a choice, some people already made their choice and can't afford another car, and some people couldn't care less about dropping 100 bucks on gas every few days.
Ok, now that Ive gotten that out of the way, let me get back to you... I honestly agree with almost evverything you've said... but I have one key point to add.
If the person with the SUV got rid of it when gas was closing on $5 a gallon, and now that it drops again go back even as they KNOW the price is going up again, that really is dumb. Now, even in this case, there is NOTHING wrong with that. As I said, this is America, and so long as you are not hurting anyone or breaking laws, do it if you like.
Just know the price you pay, and stay in your means, and I have nothing but good wishes for you... (maybe a snicker, but that's my own bias).
One could argue that using so much gas is harmful to the environment and to one's health, thereby hurting people.
There is the key. It isn't always a matter of choice but convenience. Have you ever had to pack 4 kids, 2 parents, and a weeks worth of groceries for 6 people in a sedan? (We'll skip the conversation about the level of 'dumb' it takes to want to have 4 kids to begin with...) It could possibly be done but it wouldn't be very convenient. And if I have an option between being a sardine or being comfortable for $2.25/gallon, I know which one I would choose 100% of the time. You have your reasons (which are perfectly valid) for driving so far to work, and lots of people have reasons (which are just as valid to them) for driving the suburban to Walmart.
I'm not saying you are doing it, but many people just look at everyone that drives a larger SUV as just a gas guzzleing idiot. Some people don't have a choice, some people already made their choice and can't afford another car, and some people couldn't care less about dropping 100 bucks on gas every few days.
Groceries!
SUVs should be called Ultimate Grocery Interception Against Other Soccer-moms Vehicle. UGIAOS!!
Don't be terrorized! You're more likely to die of a car accident, drowning, fire, or murder! More people die every year from prescription drugs than terrorism LOL!
And one could make an argument that eating too much takes food off the plates of someone else that needs it, also hurting someone else.
However, neither are direct harm by any means... so do you want to pass a law to make either illegal?
Btw, Im in a state that wants to... probably to both. You DONT want to go there... trust me.
our next president does tho ...
didnt Obama say somethnig similar recently about famers and the food they produce is unhealthy because we get fat from eating driving up medical costs, so food is the health hazard instead of unhealthy living practices of an individual.
Of course you cant tax living practices ...
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.