This is just an average game, yes the Graphics are good and they have made some of the area's you read in the books come to life, but the model details are poor and I do find it a little easy. My first Toon I got to level 11 without dying and got the title "The Undeafeted". At this point I thought, I need more of a challenge. I would only rate this as a 7.
This is just an average game, yes the Graphics are good and they have made some of the area's you read in the books come to life, but the model details are poor and I do find it a little easy. My first Toon I got to level 11 without dying and got the title "The Undeafeted". At this point I thought, I need more of a challenge. I would only rate this as a 7.
The game is designed so that defeat is rare. You're supposed to try to avoid it and it's supposed to be easy to avoid it. What you're criticising is not a flaw - it's a feature. As for the model details I think you need to tweak your graphics options because they look fine to me.
And like I said , it can be both. Game being too easy is a flaw a flaw a flaw a flaw a flaw because without a challenge people get bored.
I don't disagree that it can be both. All I'm saying is that in my view the game is both challenging and fun, and if you're bored you're looking at the game with the wrong focus.
But heck, if you dislike it, play another game. Plenty more fish in the sea.
LOTRO is well polished, bugless and very well done simply because its too damn simple! Simpler than WoW (and I thought WoW was the bottom, not mentioning, of course, the oriental games named ´grind feast´).
ITs pretty, but empty. Nothing new, and in this industry nothing new (in a sea of same) its the biggest sin. They just cut everything what could give some trouble in the future, it made the game as it could fit in a box. If the simplicity is enought to give a 8.5 grade, then we will find a 10 game easily, we just need to launch Chess Online, its very fun (I love chess) and, believe me, it would have less bugs than LOTR, the client would be at maximum 100 MB, would be no lag, would be a better customization than LOTR... And would be an easy 10, for sure... Of course you would be bored after sometime, but it seens that this doesnt count to grade in here.
LOTRO is empty, turbine cant risk, because they are not good game developers, they cant give too much slack for the players and have arisk a headache later (As it happened with SWG). They invest on pretty graphics and things like ´you can have the same surname than you pal and start a family), but God forbid to put a real PvP or even make the ´family´ bring some bonus or real impact in the game. No, lets make the game SIMPLER (in opposite of what Tolkien proclaims, with all the complexity of his world).
Turbine is a coward compay, and has spoilet the number one IP with its cowardice.
It deserves a 6 for the graphics and polished gameplay, no more than that. And I am being very generous.
Lets not forget that this game is a modern game, and therefore it would be expected something new, or at least a deep vision of something already there, not a step back on gameplay, as it is LOTRO. Better thinking, I let a grade 4.5 for LOTR for this step back (just thinking on UO or SWG and all the possibilities and things let on the hands of the players of those games and the possibility of shaping the game and we easily see that LOTRO is not a MMO but a single game played by a lot of online players).
If the simplicity is enought to give a 8.5 grade, then we will find a 10 game easily, we just need to launch Chess Online, its very fun (I love chess) and, believe me, it would have less bugs than LOTR, the client would be at maximum 100 MB, would be no lag, would be a better customization than LOTR... And would be an easy 10, for sure... Of course you would be bored after sometime, but it seens that this doesnt count to grade in here...
We already have chess online. It's called Chessmaster 10.
Look, you just don't like LotRO, but that doesn't mean it's a bad game. It's the best MMOG I've ever played, and I've played quite a few.
If the simplicity is enought to give a 8.5 grade, then we will find a 10 game easily, we just need to launch Chess Online, its very fun (I love chess) and, believe me, it would have less bugs than LOTR, the client would be at maximum 100 MB, would be no lag, would be a better customization than LOTR... And would be an easy 10, for sure... Of course you would be bored after sometime, but it seens that this doesnt count to grade in here...
We already have chess online. It's called Chessmaster 10.
Look, you just don't like LotRO, but that doesn't mean it's a bad game. It's the best MMOG I've ever played, and I've played quite a few.
That´s the point, why do you think LOTRO is the best MMOG? As 100% of people who share this point of view with you ,and I have been asking them, it is for unkown reason, no one could tell me anything deep enough to keep it as ´the best MMOG´, actually their reason to think LOTRO is the best around are the same othat would make Chess Online the number one MMO, its the simplicity and lack of content, the driven game with nothing of creativity left to the gamer. Its boring and uncreative. This game is plain and shallow, thats why some people like it, the same mental laziness who makes some people enjoy mexican soap opera also... No need to think out of the box, no real PvP, no worries about the arrows which you spend, no housing management problem or difficult/deep crafting... You know the deal right on, and the thing will not changer nor improve, it will be this and that, just more of the same...
By the way, I wasnt thinking on Chessmaster, but a chess game with thousands of people playing at same time, with empty options, like changing the appearence of the pieces, nothing that would impact the driven game or make the people make too much choices that would change the environmento giving future troubles to the devs.
Note that I am not telling that this is a terrible game like Dark & Light, for example, but that it is VERY simple, too simple to make it deserve more than a 6. I just disagree with the grade. And, yes, I am a huge fan of Tolkien and dreamed with a game with the complexity that this world demands. Sadly, Turbine took the IP...
every time I log on I see plenty of people at all levels enjoying the game, that is all that matters now isn't it ? Forum opinions don't mean crap compared to actual players.
That´s the point, why do you think LOTRO is the best MMOG? As 100% of people who share this point of view with you ,and I have been asking them, it is for unkown reason, no one could tell me anything deep enough to keep it as ´the best MMOG´,
But their reasons don't matter. They like it, you don't. They keep playing, you don't. I could give you a deep and detailed examination of why I think LotRO is successful and why it is better than other games I've played, but it's a waste of time because my reasons for liking LotRO and my thoughts on why it's the best MMOG out there aren't going to make you change your mind. The real question is: why do you choose to keep torturing yourself by talking about a game you don't like?
The fact is LotRO has had a very successful launch. It reached the number 1 slot in sales and reviews of the game are overwhelmingly positive. It may not be the best MMOG ever - there are lots of MMOGs that I haven't played, so I don't know if any of them are better. All I know is that I'm enjoying LotRO more than I've enjoyed any other MMOG.
every time I log on I see plenty of people at all levels enjoying the game, that is all that matters now isn't it ? Forum opinions don't mean crap compared to actual players.
Since when quantity is quality? Specially on a new MMO with sucha powerfull IP? Mc Donalds is the better food? WoW is the better game?
As I said NO LOTRO player can tell why this game is so good, or they speak that its ´all well polished and nice´ or say that the game has a ´big player base´.
If I was going to give a grade, I would have to pick everything possible on a MMORPG, to embrace all kinds of tastes and then see the grade, for example:
Combat System: 0 - 10 (Lotro: 5) - nothing new, in fact one more drawback, not even spend arrows on combat...
Customization (Number of Classes x Number of Races x Traits): 0 -10 (Lotro: 5)
Lord of Rings Online Final Grade: 5.4
Bottom line: A game with no housing, no player cities, bad crafting (the reviewer said that, I didnt teste), bad customization, CANT BE the best MMOG around. It can, however, satisfy a big number of people who is not specifically fond of complexity. Therefore, you can tell that this game is GREAT for those people, but cant be compared with any other MMOG. WoW, for instance lack housing and player cities as well, but there is other traits (like a good PvP) who can make it competitive in terms of quality (but IMO, not enough) with others games. LOTRO has nothing to offer. A 8.5 grade is a a bit suspicious.
Beery, I have nothing against LOTRO and can totally understand why so much people enjoy it, my problem is with the grade...
Why that ´torture´ me? Because the people can really think that this game deserve an 8.5 and the simplicity and lack of content can became the basis of a good game, and not the complexity. If we start to believe that LOTRO is a great game then this will became the default, the MMO industry will start to make the games simpler and driven, so they can reach the standard of LOTRO. I think WoW is already a cancer (as it was Diablo) to game industry... And to make the things worst, D&L has sink the idea of complex games...
I am pretty sure that LOTRO is like those fast foods, you came, you eat and you leave hastly, the secret of it is not in the loyalty of the people who buy it, but the new ones who arrive... LOTRO bores fastly MOST people, but because of IP new people will always arrive and even those who left will be back just to feel the Middle-Earth alive again, not because the game.
Bottom line: A game with no housing, no player cities, bad crafting (the reviewer said that, I didnt teste), bad customization, CANT BE the best MMOG around.
SWG has player housing with very detailed customization, player cities and great crafting, yet it is almost universally panned. LotRO is definitely a better game than SWG even though LotRO has no housing, no player cities and a worse crafting system. Part of the reason that's so is that SWG's housing and player cities are horribly implemented. But my point is that these aspects don't automatically prevent a game from being the best.
Anyway, player housing and player cities are coming in the next update. As for crafting, I think it's a subjective issue. LotRO's crafting system is definitely simpler than SWG's, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. I'd much rather have a simple but fun system than an overly complicated one.
Bottom line: A game with no housing, no player cities, bad crafting (the reviewer said that, I didnt teste), bad customization, CANT BE the best MMOG around.
SWG has player housing with very detailed customization, player cities and great crafting, yet it is almost universally panned. LotRO is definitely a better game than SWG even though LotRO has no housing, no player cities and a worse crafting system. Part of the reason that's so is that SWG's housing and player cities are horribly implemented. But my point is that these aspects don't automatically prevent a game from being the best.
Anyway, player housing and player cities are coming in the next update. As for crafting, I think it's a subjective issue. LotRO's crafting system is definitely simpler than SWG's, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. I'd much rather have a simple but fun system than an overly complicated one.
Good to know about housing and player cities on LOTRO, then they are going to the right direction!! I may tottaly change my idea about LOTRO if thats going to happen. Thanks for the info.
As for SWG, it was , by far, the best game, EXACTLY because the complexity. I can tell that player housing and player cities made the game totally special, for EVERY taste (who never had his city invaded, bases destroyed, RP on Cantina, etc..). I dont know where you got the idea that SWG was panned BEFORE NGE (who made the game simpler).
No comparison can be made between SWG (Pre-NGE) and Lotro, I have played both, and SWG pre-NGE was MUCH better than LOTRO and any other MMORPG I have played (and I have played more than 20). Alas, MMORPG, for me is the capacity of the game to change the environemnt, bringing the impact of a population on the universe, making it alive and constantly changing, otherwise its only a single player game played by a lot of people at same time. MMORPG, for me, has the world as a part of the game (therefore, can and NEED to be changed).
I've played SWG for four years. I started playing in August 2003 - one month after launch. A comparison can be made: both games are built on a 20th century fantasy franchise with a similarly large cult following. Both are MMOGs. If SWG can't be compared with LotRO nothing can be compared with anything.
As for your contention that the game was the best game because of its complexity, and that the game was not criticised before NGE hit, well my recollection is very different and Wikipedia agrees with me:
"Reviewers criticized the overwhelming complexity of the game, PVP/PVE combat imbalances of the professions, bugginess and lack of quest content.The reviews for the first expansion, Jump To Lightspeed, praised the new space combat but criticized the ground game for its lack of sufficient improvement. The reviews for the second expansion, Rage Of The Wookiees lauded the new quest content for current subscribers but lamented the CU and the continued bugginess of the game. "
There will always be criticism, but what I means is that the biggest part of the people praised SWG. For example this critic about complexity... How can someone critic a game because its too complex? In my opinion, this is non-sense for complexity means more options , more things to do. Its the same to critic Lord of the rings, (the movie and the book) because it was too complicated to understand...
I like games who gaves you freedom, options to choose. SWG, Ultima Online and others was sand-box games, we, the players, would make our own way. LOTRO, today, you cant do that, too plain simple and controlled . A fast-food game.
Well, on the complexity issue, there's complexity and then there's complication. What you see as complex (a good thing) others may see as complicated (a bad thing). This may be the basis for your dislike of LotRO - what you see as simplistic others see as easy to learn. As long as a game is rewarding its complexity is beside the point. I have lots of fun playing checkers even though it's much less complex than chess. When my mind is clear and I want a battle of wits chess is my preference, but when I'm tense or preoccupied there's nothing like a game of checkers.
That´s my point, Beery... SWG IMO was the best, and I exposed the reasons why, but nevertheless, it got a 7 grade if I am not wrong, because its a game (it was) hard to master, very complex... Althought you could play it simple, that´s what made it the very best game of MMOG IMO.
LOTRO is very simple, some peole (who enjoy simplicity over complexity) would enjoy it very much, and others who think otherwise (like myself) wouldnt, because we crave for something more. Therefore, AT LEAST, LOTRO should have a grade inferior to SWG, for example, because a ´complexer gamer´ of MOG wouldnt enjoy LOTRO for the lack of complexity and boredom, althought someone who want the ´easy game´ (in termos of complexity) would enjoy also SWG, playing, for example, a Damage Dealer (a rifleman, for instance) and forgetting all about crafting, housing, etc... But I agree with you, SWG, for easy gamers, would be hard and without ´content´, for content in this game is created, mostly, by the own players who play a sand-box game with thousands of possibilities.
So, all resumes at the bad grade given to LOTRO, for a 8.5 grade its for a game who capture not only the complex gamers as the more simple an ingenuous player.
However, I am willing to give a chance to LOTRO (a chance to my taste, I mean) because of what you said about housing. The sense of changing the world around you is the most important, to me, on MMORPG.
That´s my point, Beery... SWG IMO was the best, and I exposed the reasons why, but nevertheless, it got a 7 grade if I am not wrong, because its a game (it was) hard to master, very complex... Althought you could play it simple, that´s what made it the very best game of MMOG IMO. LOTRO is very simple, some peole (who enjoy simplicity over complexity) would enjoy it very much, and others who think otherwise (like myself) wouldnt, because we crave for something more. Therefore, AT LEAST, LOTRO should have a grade inferior to SWG, for example, because a ´complexer gamer´ of MOG wouldnt enjoy LOTRO for the lack of complexity and boredom, althought someone who want the ´easy game´ (in termos of complexity) would enjoy also SWG, playing, for example, a Damage Dealer (a rifleman, for instance) and forgetting all about crafting, housing, etc... But I agree with you, SWG, for easy gamers, would be hard and without ´content´, for content in this game is created, mostly, by the own players who play a sand-box game with thousands of possibilities. So, all resumes at the bad grade given to LOTRO, for a 8.5 grade its for a game who capture not only the complex gamers as the more simple an ingenuous player. However, I am willing to give a chance to LOTRO (a chance to my taste, I mean) because of what you said about housing. The sense of changing the world around you is the most important, to me, on MMORPG.
Just some questions because stopped lotro 3 days ago: there"s always angmarim near Annuminas ? And
nothing has changed ?
There's always a ghost on Bree and an orc camp near Trestlebridge ?
Curious because killed all the orcs near trestle 1 week ago, with my 45 and because I saved the soul of this ghost.
I think that the ´persistency´ of the world is the possibility of the game remains ´in there´, even if slightly modified, after you log off...
IMO, a good MMORPG have levels of ´persitency´ , and a good game should receive impact, even slightly, from their players, to fulfill the feeling of ´being part of this virtual world´.
Of course you cant wait that you complete certain quest and then all world changes, or the quest vanishes or the quest impact profoundly others around you... But you can (and should) wait that your mark still on the virtual world. No matter how tiny it should be, because if not, then its just a single game played by a lot of gamers. The ´persistance´ must be relative.
That´s why I think housing, player cities are important, it gives shape to the world, gives freedom and insert creativity. WoW doesnt have it, but try to compensate it with a rather ´lousy´ war between 2 factions, with somewhat good PvP. It doesnt really change the world, but ´smells´ like it changes (´The Horde always win the Warsong Gulch...´ or ´In Lightningroof server, the Alliance is stronger´), the conflict, inexistent on LOTRO, brings a little of taste of change on the game. Let me say that I dont like WoW, but certainly gives more taste of freedom and changes than LOTRO.
A year later we see this game really coming into it's own. Alot of the people's comments don't have much merit now as they have added a bunch of content since those days. You won't run out of quests or content trying to level today. With Mines of Moria coming out soon this game is going to be even more amazing.
I consider it to be the best game out there right now, and I have tried anything worth playing. (WoW EQ EQ2 SWG Vanguard AoC Lineage2 CoV) out of all of those games, WoW is the only one that I would consider as high of quality, and WoW is heading down the crapper with their incredibly stupid idea of making all previous group/raid content obsolete every expansion (MC raid anyone?)
A year later we see this game really coming into it's own. Alot of the people's comments don't have much merit now as they have added a bunch of content since those days. You won't run out of quests or content trying to level today. With Mines of Moria coming out soon this game is going to be even more amazing. I consider it to be the best game out there right now, and I have tried anything worth playing. (WoW EQ EQ2 SWG Vanguard AoC Lineage2 CoV) out of all of those games, WoW is the only one that I would consider as high of quality, and WoW is heading down the crapper with their incredibly stupid idea of making all previous group/raid content obsolete every expansion (MC raid anyone?)
I agree completely. I too enjoy WoW, but am a casual player of it to say the least. A few weeks ago, I finally got up to lvl 70, did some dailies (got revered with shattered sun offensive), then left. My guild mates where all curious why I was leaving....
"Don't you want to do Kara, BT, Heroics, ect.?"
"Not really, it's not worth it now"
"But you can get great gear man!"
"In November or so it's all gonna be junk"
"Huh, why?"
"Remember when TBC came out?"
"Yeah"
"Did you do MC before that?"
"Uhhh....yeah"
"Don't you wish you had only ran it once to see it instead of every week, and have all that time wasted"
Comments
This is just an average game, yes the Graphics are good and they have made some of the area's you read in the books come to life, but the model details are poor and I do find it a little easy. My first Toon I got to level 11 without dying and got the title "The Undeafeted". At this point I thought, I need more of a challenge. I would only rate this as a 7.
The game is designed so that defeat is rare. You're supposed to try to avoid it and it's supposed to be easy to avoid it. What you're criticising is not a flaw - it's a feature. As for the model details I think you need to tweak your graphics options because they look fine to me.
A feature can be a games greatest flaw my young padawon err wizard apprientice.
Erm... like I said, it's NOT a flaw.
And like I said , it can be both. Game being too easy is a flaw a flaw a flaw a flaw a flaw because without a challenge people get bored.
I don't disagree that it can be both. All I'm saying is that in my view the game is both challenging and fun, and if you're bored you're looking at the game with the wrong focus.
But heck, if you dislike it, play another game. Plenty more fish in the sea.
I couldnt agree less with the grade....
LOTRO is well polished, bugless and very well done simply because its too damn simple! Simpler than WoW (and I thought WoW was the bottom, not mentioning, of course, the oriental games named ´grind feast´).
ITs pretty, but empty. Nothing new, and in this industry nothing new (in a sea of same) its the biggest sin. They just cut everything what could give some trouble in the future, it made the game as it could fit in a box. If the simplicity is enought to give a 8.5 grade, then we will find a 10 game easily, we just need to launch Chess Online, its very fun (I love chess) and, believe me, it would have less bugs than LOTR, the client would be at maximum 100 MB, would be no lag, would be a better customization than LOTR... And would be an easy 10, for sure... Of course you would be bored after sometime, but it seens that this doesnt count to grade in here.
LOTRO is empty, turbine cant risk, because they are not good game developers, they cant give too much slack for the players and have arisk a headache later (As it happened with SWG). They invest on pretty graphics and things like ´you can have the same surname than you pal and start a family), but God forbid to put a real PvP or even make the ´family´ bring some bonus or real impact in the game. No, lets make the game SIMPLER (in opposite of what Tolkien proclaims, with all the complexity of his world).
Turbine is a coward compay, and has spoilet the number one IP with its cowardice.
It deserves a 6 for the graphics and polished gameplay, no more than that. And I am being very generous.
Lets not forget that this game is a modern game, and therefore it would be expected something new, or at least a deep vision of something already there, not a step back on gameplay, as it is LOTRO. Better thinking, I let a grade 4.5 for LOTR for this step back (just thinking on UO or SWG and all the possibilities and things let on the hands of the players of those games and the possibility of shaping the game and we easily see that LOTRO is not a MMO but a single game played by a lot of online players).
Look, you just don't like LotRO, but that doesn't mean it's a bad game. It's the best MMOG I've ever played, and I've played quite a few.
Look, you just don't like LotRO, but that doesn't mean it's a bad game. It's the best MMOG I've ever played, and I've played quite a few.
That´s the point, why do you think LOTRO is the best MMOG? As 100% of people who share this point of view with you ,and I have been asking them, it is for unkown reason, no one could tell me anything deep enough to keep it as ´the best MMOG´, actually their reason to think LOTRO is the best around are the same othat would make Chess Online the number one MMO, its the simplicity and lack of content, the driven game with nothing of creativity left to the gamer. Its boring and uncreative. This game is plain and shallow, thats why some people like it, the same mental laziness who makes some people enjoy mexican soap opera also... No need to think out of the box, no real PvP, no worries about the arrows which you spend, no housing management problem or difficult/deep crafting... You know the deal right on, and the thing will not changer nor improve, it will be this and that, just more of the same...
By the way, I wasnt thinking on Chessmaster, but a chess game with thousands of people playing at same time, with empty options, like changing the appearence of the pieces, nothing that would impact the driven game or make the people make too much choices that would change the environmento giving future troubles to the devs.
Note that I am not telling that this is a terrible game like Dark & Light, for example, but that it is VERY simple, too simple to make it deserve more than a 6. I just disagree with the grade. And, yes, I am a huge fan of Tolkien and dreamed with a game with the complexity that this world demands. Sadly, Turbine took the IP...
every time I log on I see plenty of people at all levels enjoying the game, that is all that matters now isn't it ? Forum opinions don't mean crap compared to actual players.
I miss DAoC
The fact is LotRO has had a very successful launch. It reached the number 1 slot in sales and reviews of the game are overwhelmingly positive. It may not be the best MMOG ever - there are lots of MMOGs that I haven't played, so I don't know if any of them are better. All I know is that I'm enjoying LotRO more than I've enjoyed any other MMOG.
Since when quantity is quality? Specially on a new MMO with sucha powerfull IP? Mc Donalds is the better food? WoW is the better game?
As I said NO LOTRO player can tell why this game is so good, or they speak that its ´all well polished and nice´ or say that the game has a ´big player base´.
If I was going to give a grade, I would have to pick everything possible on a MMORPG, to embrace all kinds of tastes and then see the grade, for example:
Graphics: 0-10 (Lotr: 8)
Gameplay: 0-10 (Lotro: 7)
Bugs: 0-10 (Lotro: 9) Almost bugfree
Lag: 0-10 (Lotro: 7)
Sound: 0-10 (Lotro: 6)
Customization (Char Creation): 0-10 (Lotro: 4)
Quality of Quests (by level): 0 - 10 (Lotro: 6)
Number of Quests: 0 - 10 (Lotro: 5)
Housing: 0 - 10 (Lotro: 0)
Crafting: 0 - 10 (Lotro: 5)
Size of the world: 0 - 10 (Lotro: 5)
PvP (including arena, Sieges, Realm vs Realm) : 0 - 10 (Lotro: 3)
RP: 0 - 10 (Lotro: 7)
Community: 0 - 10 (Lotro: 7)
Support: 0 - 10 (Lotro: 7)
Player City Management: 0 - 10 (Lotro: 0)
Combat System: 0 - 10 (Lotro: 5) - nothing new, in fact one more drawback, not even spend arrows on combat...
Customization (Number of Classes x Number of Races x Traits): 0 -10 (Lotro: 5)
Lord of Rings Online Final Grade: 5.4
Bottom line: A game with no housing, no player cities, bad crafting (the reviewer said that, I didnt teste), bad customization, CANT BE the best MMOG around. It can, however, satisfy a big number of people who is not specifically fond of complexity. Therefore, you can tell that this game is GREAT for those people, but cant be compared with any other MMOG. WoW, for instance lack housing and player cities as well, but there is other traits (like a good PvP) who can make it competitive in terms of quality (but IMO, not enough) with others games. LOTRO has nothing to offer. A 8.5 grade is a a bit suspicious.
Beery, I have nothing against LOTRO and can totally understand why so much people enjoy it, my problem is with the grade...
Why that ´torture´ me? Because the people can really think that this game deserve an 8.5 and the simplicity and lack of content can became the basis of a good game, and not the complexity. If we start to believe that LOTRO is a great game then this will became the default, the MMO industry will start to make the games simpler and driven, so they can reach the standard of LOTRO. I think WoW is already a cancer (as it was Diablo) to game industry... And to make the things worst, D&L has sink the idea of complex games...
I am pretty sure that LOTRO is like those fast foods, you came, you eat and you leave hastly, the secret of it is not in the loyalty of the people who buy it, but the new ones who arrive... LOTRO bores fastly MOST people, but because of IP new people will always arrive and even those who left will be back just to feel the Middle-Earth alive again, not because the game.
Anyway, player housing and player cities are coming in the next update. As for crafting, I think it's a subjective issue. LotRO's crafting system is definitely simpler than SWG's, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. I'd much rather have a simple but fun system than an overly complicated one.
Anyway, player housing and player cities are coming in the next update. As for crafting, I think it's a subjective issue. LotRO's crafting system is definitely simpler than SWG's, but that's not necessarily a bad thing. I'd much rather have a simple but fun system than an overly complicated one.
Good to know about housing and player cities on LOTRO, then they are going to the right direction!! I may tottaly change my idea about LOTRO if thats going to happen. Thanks for the info.As for SWG, it was , by far, the best game, EXACTLY because the complexity. I can tell that player housing and player cities made the game totally special, for EVERY taste (who never had his city invaded, bases destroyed, RP on Cantina, etc..). I dont know where you got the idea that SWG was panned BEFORE NGE (who made the game simpler).
No comparison can be made between SWG (Pre-NGE) and Lotro, I have played both, and SWG pre-NGE was MUCH better than LOTRO and any other MMORPG I have played (and I have played more than 20). Alas, MMORPG, for me is the capacity of the game to change the environemnt, bringing the impact of a population on the universe, making it alive and constantly changing, otherwise its only a single player game played by a lot of people at same time. MMORPG, for me, has the world as a part of the game (therefore, can and NEED to be changed).
I've played SWG for four years. I started playing in August 2003 - one month after launch. A comparison can be made: both games are built on a 20th century fantasy franchise with a similarly large cult following. Both are MMOGs. If SWG can't be compared with LotRO nothing can be compared with anything.
As for your contention that the game was the best game because of its complexity, and that the game was not criticised before NGE hit, well my recollection is very different and Wikipedia agrees with me:
"Reviewers criticized the overwhelming complexity of the game, PVP/PVE combat imbalances of the professions, bugginess and lack of quest content. The reviews for the first expansion, Jump To Lightspeed, praised the new space combat but criticized the ground game for its lack of sufficient improvement. The reviews for the second expansion, Rage Of The Wookiees lauded the new quest content for current subscribers but lamented the CU and the continued bugginess of the game. "
This was all BEFORE NGE.
There will always be criticism, but what I means is that the biggest part of the people praised SWG. For example this critic about complexity... How can someone critic a game because its too complex? In my opinion, this is non-sense for complexity means more options , more things to do. Its the same to critic Lord of the rings, (the movie and the book) because it was too complicated to understand...
I like games who gaves you freedom, options to choose. SWG, Ultima Online and others was sand-box games, we, the players, would make our own way. LOTRO, today, you cant do that, too plain simple and controlled . A fast-food game.
Well, on the complexity issue, there's complexity and then there's complication. What you see as complex (a good thing) others may see as complicated (a bad thing). This may be the basis for your dislike of LotRO - what you see as simplistic others see as easy to learn. As long as a game is rewarding its complexity is beside the point. I have lots of fun playing checkers even though it's much less complex than chess. When my mind is clear and I want a battle of wits chess is my preference, but when I'm tense or preoccupied there's nothing like a game of checkers.
That´s my point, Beery... SWG IMO was the best, and I exposed the reasons why, but nevertheless, it got a 7 grade if I am not wrong, because its a game (it was) hard to master, very complex... Althought you could play it simple, that´s what made it the very best game of MMOG IMO.
LOTRO is very simple, some peole (who enjoy simplicity over complexity) would enjoy it very much, and others who think otherwise (like myself) wouldnt, because we crave for something more. Therefore, AT LEAST, LOTRO should have a grade inferior to SWG, for example, because a ´complexer gamer´ of MOG wouldnt enjoy LOTRO for the lack of complexity and boredom, althought someone who want the ´easy game´ (in termos of complexity) would enjoy also SWG, playing, for example, a Damage Dealer (a rifleman, for instance) and forgetting all about crafting, housing, etc... But I agree with you, SWG, for easy gamers, would be hard and without ´content´, for content in this game is created, mostly, by the own players who play a sand-box game with thousands of possibilities.
So, all resumes at the bad grade given to LOTRO, for a 8.5 grade its for a game who capture not only the complex gamers as the more simple an ingenuous player.
However, I am willing to give a chance to LOTRO (a chance to my taste, I mean) because of what you said about housing. The sense of changing the world around you is the most important, to me, on MMORPG.
Just some questions because stopped lotro 3 days ago: there"s always angmarim near Annuminas ? And
nothing has changed ?
There's always a ghost on Bree and an orc camp near Trestlebridge ?
Curious because killed all the orcs near trestle 1 week ago, with my 45 and because I saved the soul of this ghost.
No new camps, no new city, nothing has changed.
OK this is not a persistent world.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persistent_world
I think that the ´persistency´ of the world is the possibility of the game remains ´in there´, even if slightly modified, after you log off...
IMO, a good MMORPG have levels of ´persitency´ , and a good game should receive impact, even slightly, from their players, to fulfill the feeling of ´being part of this virtual world´.
Of course you cant wait that you complete certain quest and then all world changes, or the quest vanishes or the quest impact profoundly others around you... But you can (and should) wait that your mark still on the virtual world. No matter how tiny it should be, because if not, then its just a single game played by a lot of gamers. The ´persistance´ must be relative.
That´s why I think housing, player cities are important, it gives shape to the world, gives freedom and insert creativity. WoW doesnt have it, but try to compensate it with a rather ´lousy´ war between 2 factions, with somewhat good PvP. It doesnt really change the world, but ´smells´ like it changes (´The Horde always win the Warsong Gulch...´ or ´In Lightningroof server, the Alliance is stronger´), the conflict, inexistent on LOTRO, brings a little of taste of change on the game. Let me say that I dont like WoW, but certainly gives more taste of freedom and changes than LOTRO.
A year later we see this game really coming into it's own. Alot of the people's comments don't have much merit now as they have added a bunch of content since those days. You won't run out of quests or content trying to level today. With Mines of Moria coming out soon this game is going to be even more amazing.
I consider it to be the best game out there right now, and I have tried anything worth playing. (WoW EQ EQ2 SWG Vanguard AoC Lineage2 CoV) out of all of those games, WoW is the only one that I would consider as high of quality, and WoW is heading down the crapper with their incredibly stupid idea of making all previous group/raid content obsolete every expansion (MC raid anyone?)
I agree completely. I too enjoy WoW, but am a casual player of it to say the least. A few weeks ago, I finally got up to lvl 70, did some dailies (got revered with shattered sun offensive), then left. My guild mates where all curious why I was leaving....
"Don't you want to do Kara, BT, Heroics, ect.?"
"Not really, it's not worth it now"
"But you can get great gear man!"
"In November or so it's all gonna be junk"
"Huh, why?"
"Remember when TBC came out?"
"Yeah"
"Did you do MC before that?"
"Uhhh....yeah"
"Don't you wish you had only ran it once to see it instead of every week, and have all that time wasted"
"............"
It keeps getting Better and Better!!!
I thought the review for this game was very well done. Is this the perfect/best game for everyone -- of course not! There is no such thing.
Is it a game that aspires to do well by tolkien and by gamers who love Tolkien -- Absolutely!
If you enjoy MMOs and you are fond of LOTR -- enough said! You'll love it!
Only players that have only played wow compared lotr to wow and only players that havent played lotr at all compared it to wow .
i been playing mmo since everquest era and i can tell you this game does not feel like wow or play like it all .
you have to try it to see it .
wow clone is the a very lame way of comparing this very nicely done game bug free and my number one praise is the excellent community .
well done turbine.
we do need more positive feel on these forums.