I don't like your poll. You of given more options on how it might affect AoC. Q.Will it affect AoC current population?
A. No, AoCs current population is stabilized. Only a "handful" of players will come or go Q. Will it have affect on AoC's growth.
A. The hardcore PvP may elect to try Darkfall over AoC; however, the hardcore player also likes a ladder system and neither game currently supports that. AoC is more likely to support a ladder system than Darkfall. People who expected AoC to be the New UO will jump ship (not many of them play AoC anymore) Q. Will Darkfall be a giant
A. NO FING WAY. Darkfall is the epitome of a Sandbox MMO. Most people can't decide what to do in RL, most people can't function without being goal orientated. Darkfall doesn't have a clear cut path laid out for people. No raid progression, No over arching story line, etc that makes a game successful. Now all that aside Darkfall will be a good game, but I don't expect it population to be much more than 250k after the 2nd month of its release. If it is over 250k then the game will have made MMO history. GL darkfall I wish you well.
After reading people's comments on the hardcore PvPers chosing darkfall over AoC in the future I felt that I should say something else. I'm a hardcore PvP in any game that I play for the most part. I played GW for nearly 2 years (WoWs mini game grind didn't intrest me due to gear>skill) and I love the rank system in both GvG and HA. I liked the idea of AoC's siege battles, innovative combat system, and skill based game play. Everything I thought the game would be it is. I was a fanboy but abaonded the hype before game launched. Its combat system is good, the seige battles are fun, and the game is pretty much skill>everything else (yeah CCs are annoying). However, I'm dissaapointed by AoC lack of a GvG ladder system. Now here I am looking at Darkfall. It promises the moon and then some. Full loot PvP is always fun once you get into it at higher levels (crafted gear being good that is) and it appears to be a skill based game. It also appears to offer various PvP venues: Sea battles, open world, and guild sieging; however, it still lacks any goal orrintateed PvP just like AoC. Darkfall and AoC are largely sandbox games when it comes to PvP. The people who left AoC for more meaningful PvP aren't going to play DF, they are playing WAR. WAR give people that sense of PvP accomplishment through renown level, gear, guild siege, and RvR. The people who wanted meaningful PvP aren't going to play darkfall unless they love siege battle and PvP for the sake of PvP. No matte how you cut it, full loot is not anymore reason to PvP than having PvP exp especially when crafted gear is the second best gear in the game and is suppose to be easily attained. So, If you left AoC because it didn't have meaningful PvP don't expect DF to offer anything that different. If you left AoC because you were execpting it to be UO 5.0 then DF will be for you (and AoC will be for that matter in a couple of months)
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup.
Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will.
DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful.
I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
I don't like your poll. You of given more options on how it might affect AoC. Q.Will it affect AoC current population?
A. No, AoCs current population is stabilized. Only a "handful" of players will come or go Q. Will it have affect on AoC's growth.
A. The hardcore PvP may elect to try Darkfall over AoC; however, the hardcore player also likes a ladder system and neither game currently supports that. AoC is more likely to support a ladder system than Darkfall. People who expected AoC to be the New UO will jump ship (not many of them play AoC anymore) Q. Will Darkfall be a giant
A. NO FING WAY. Darkfall is the epitome of a Sandbox MMO. Most people can't decide what to do in RL, most people can't function without being goal orientated. Darkfall doesn't have a clear cut path laid out for people. No raid progression, No over arching story line, etc that makes a game successful. Now all that aside Darkfall will be a good game, but I don't expect it population to be much more than 250k after the 2nd month of its release. If it is over 250k then the game will have made MMO history. GL darkfall I wish you well.
After reading people's comments on the hardcore PvPers chosing darkfall over AoC in the future I felt that I should say something else. I'm a hardcore PvP in any game that I play for the most part. I played GW for nearly 2 years (WoWs mini game grind didn't intrest me due to gear>skill) and I love the rank system in both GvG and HA. I liked the idea of AoC's siege battles, innovative combat system, and skill based game play. Everything I thought the game would be it is. I was a fanboy but abaonded the hype before game launched. Its combat system is good, the seige battles are fun, and the game is pretty much skill>everything else (yeah CCs are annoying). However, I'm dissaapointed by AoC lack of a GvG ladder system. Now here I am looking at Darkfall. It promises the moon and then some. Full loot PvP is always fun once you get into it at higher levels (crafted gear being good that is) and it appears to be a skill based game. It also appears to offer various PvP venues: Sea battles, open world, and guild sieging; however, it still lacks any goal orrintateed PvP just like AoC. Darkfall and AoC are largely sandbox games when it comes to PvP. The people who left AoC for more meaningful PvP aren't going to play DF, they are playing WAR. WAR give people that sense of PvP accomplishment through renown level, gear, guild siege, and RvR. The people who wanted meaningful PvP aren't going to play darkfall unless they love siege battle and PvP for the sake of PvP. No matte how you cut it, full loot is not anymore reason to PvP than having PvP exp especially when crafted gear is the second best gear in the game and is suppose to be easily attained. So, If you left AoC because it didn't have meaningful PvP don't expect DF to offer anything that different. If you left AoC because you were execpting it to be UO 5.0 then DF will be for you (and AoC will be for that matter in a couple of months)
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup.
Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will.
DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful.
I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
Xipher has a good point one of the things people complained about with AoC was the lack of rewards. PvP didn't give them anything, PvE didn't give them anything as gear was never meant to be a mayor factor in AoC. A lot of the people I played with went to war and they liked it because here you actually was rewarded for almost everything you did. PvP gave you rewards, PvE gave you rewards. I 'm one of those players who prefer a sandbox MMO where I myself choose what to do when to do it. WoW was after over a year very boring, as I constantly had to raid or do arenas to be able to compete with other people. AoC I find a lot of fun, sure the PvP doesn't really give me a pat on the back and a reward in my backpack, but it gives me joy which is the most important thing for me. Darkfall might be a good game, it might not be. Time will tell, the full corpse loot will attract the hardcore MMO players that played UO etc. but you never get the masses from WoW playing it. as for majority of players loosing their gear is the worst thinkable scenario. When Funcom talked about the possibility of items drop from murderers there was people on the forums telling funcom they would quit if they lost some of their gear as it meant the world and some more for them.
The carrot for people to play MMO's today are basicly that they get a reward for their time put into the game. Sad but truth, the time where people played mmorpg's for fun is more or less over. Still a bunch of people thinking this way, thinking that improving my skill in the game and becoming better at it is more of a reward then some shiny weapon or armor piece. The fact gear didn't matter in AoC was one of the things people cried a lot about. it meant they didn't bother raid, or bothered to grind to get gold to buy stuff. because gear didn't mean anything. It seems majority of people wants to have a visual proof of their "success" rathher then the feeling that accomplishing things gives you. Blizzard are genious in the way they feed players with rewards for almost everything they do, it attracts the masses and they earn huge amount of money on it. It almost looks like Blizzard one day thought" What the heck! Lets grab all the stuff people liked in other MMO's . Put it into one MMO make it work, base it on our already popular Warcraft setting and show the rest of the MMO makers how they could do things. "
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC) On my radar: TSW, MO MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
If those handful of people are still playing AoC after all its horrible failures, then the success of Darkfall won't make them pull their heads out any time soon.
Ah yes the Darkfall rabid fan trolls!
So was there really any point to your insults or are you just so despirit to hype DF and insult people that the Darkfall forums weren't enough? Funny that you guys all get hot and bothered when anyone says anything bad about DF but here you are insulting others. So mature
I don't like your poll. You of given more options on how it might affect AoC. Q.Will it affect AoC current population?
A. No, AoCs current population is stabilized. Only a "handful" of players will come or go Q. Will it have affect on AoC's growth.
A. The hardcore PvP may elect to try Darkfall over AoC; however, the hardcore player also likes a ladder system and neither game currently supports that. AoC is more likely to support a ladder system than Darkfall. People who expected AoC to be the New UO will jump ship (not many of them play AoC anymore) Q. Will Darkfall be a giant
A. NO FING WAY. Darkfall is the epitome of a Sandbox MMO. Most people can't decide what to do in RL, most people can't function without being goal orientated. Darkfall doesn't have a clear cut path laid out for people. No raid progression, No over arching story line, etc that makes a game successful. Now all that aside Darkfall will be a good game, but I don't expect it population to be much more than 250k after the 2nd month of its release. If it is over 250k then the game will have made MMO history. GL darkfall I wish you well.
After reading people's comments on the hardcore PvPers chosing darkfall over AoC in the future I felt that I should say something else. I'm a hardcore PvP in any game that I play for the most part. I played GW for nearly 2 years (WoWs mini game grind didn't intrest me due to gear>skill) and I love the rank system in both GvG and HA. I liked the idea of AoC's siege battles, innovative combat system, and skill based game play. Everything I thought the game would be it is. I was a fanboy but abaonded the hype before game launched. Its combat system is good, the seige battles are fun, and the game is pretty much skill>everything else (yeah CCs are annoying). However, I'm dissaapointed by AoC lack of a GvG ladder system. Now here I am looking at Darkfall. It promises the moon and then some. Full loot PvP is always fun once you get into it at higher levels (crafted gear being good that is) and it appears to be a skill based game. It also appears to offer various PvP venues: Sea battles, open world, and guild sieging; however, it still lacks any goal orrintateed PvP just like AoC. Darkfall and AoC are largely sandbox games when it comes to PvP. The people who left AoC for more meaningful PvP aren't going to play DF, they are playing WAR. WAR give people that sense of PvP accomplishment through renown level, gear, guild siege, and RvR. The people who wanted meaningful PvP aren't going to play darkfall unless they love siege battle and PvP for the sake of PvP. No matte how you cut it, full loot is not anymore reason to PvP than having PvP exp especially when crafted gear is the second best gear in the game and is suppose to be easily attained. So, If you left AoC because it didn't have meaningful PvP don't expect DF to offer anything that different. If you left AoC because you were execpting it to be UO 5.0 then DF will be for you (and AoC will be for that matter in a couple of months)
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup.
Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will.
DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful.
I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
Xipher has a good point one of the things people complained about with AoC was the lack of rewards. PvP didn't give them anything, PvE didn't give them anything as gear was never meant to be a mayor factor in AoC. A lot of the people I played with went to war and they liked it because here you actually was rewarded for almost everything you did. PvP gave you rewards, PvE gave you rewards. I 'm one of those players who prefer a sandbox MMO where I myself choose what to do when to do it. WoW was after over a year very boring, as I constantly had to raid or do arenas to be able to compete with other people. AoC I find a lot of fun, sure the PvP doesn't really give me a pat on the back and a reward in my backpack, but it gives me joy which is the most important thing for me. Darkfall might be a good game, it might not be. Time will tell, the full corpse loot will attract the hardcore MMO players that played UO etc. but you never get the masses from WoW playing it. as for majority of players loosing their gear is the worst thinkable scenario. When Funcom talked about the possibility of items drop from murderers there was people on the forums telling funcom they would quit if they lost some of their gear as it meant the world and some more for them.
The carrot for people to play MMO's today are basicly that they get a reward for their time put into the game. Sad but truth, the time where people played mmorpg's for fun is more or less over. Still a bunch of people thinking this way, thinking that improving my skill in the game and becoming better at it is more of a reward then some shiny weapon or armor piece. The fact gear didn't matter in AoC was one of the things people cried a lot about. it meant they didn't bother raid, or bothered to grind to get gold to buy stuff. because gear didn't mean anything. It seems majority of people wants to have a visual proof of their "success" rathher then the feeling that accomplishing things gives you. Blizzard are genious in the way they feed players with rewards for almost everything they do, it attracts the masses and they earn huge amount of money on it. It almost looks like Blizzard one day thought" What the heck! Lets grab all the stuff people liked in other MMO's . Put it into one MMO make it work, base it on our already popular Warcraft setting and show the rest of the MMO makers how they could do things. "
The Problem here is AoC. Yes there was an outcry because gear wasn't important enough and yes people QQ'd about losing an item if they were a murderer ect ect.
What AoC did wrong was try and bring a sandbox ruleset to a linear game.
WoW did it right because there using the rules that go with there system.
UO lost many because it tried using a linear ruleset in a sandbox world.
AoC lost many (not only because of bugs) because it tried using a sandbox ruleset in a linear game.
If those handful of people are still playing AoC after all its horrible failures, then the success of Darkfall won't make them pull their heads out any time soon.
Ah yes the Darkfall rabid fan trolls!
So was there really any point to your insults or are you just so despirit to hype DF and insult people that the Darkfall forums weren't enough? Funny that you guys all get hot and bothered when anyone says anything bad about DF but here you are insulting others. So mature
Funny how you generalize.
I agree with the essence of your post, just not how you said it.
If those handful of people are still playing AoC after all its horrible failures, then the success of Darkfall won't make them pull their heads out any time soon.
Ah yes the Darkfall rabid fan trolls!
So was there really any point to your insults or are you just so despirit to hype DF and insult people that the Darkfall forums weren't enough? Funny that you guys all get hot and bothered when anyone says anything bad about DF but here you are insulting others. So mature
Funny how you generalize.
I agree with the essence of your post, just not how you said it.
Sorry its early here, and i never claimed to be perfect, but atleast we agree in essence.
So in the spirit of rational discussion mind me asking why you posted this poll in the AoC forums rather then in the Darkfall forums were prehaps it belongs? Yes its a free forum and you can post wherever you want but i do find it funny that it seems so many DF fans are all of a sudden invading the AoC and Vanguard forums. I hadn't really noticed this before this weekend, and yes while some of the DF fans can hold a rational discussion there also others that love the do in other MMO forums what they most hate people doing in the DF forums.
If those handful of people are still playing AoC after all its horrible failures, then the success of Darkfall won't make them pull their heads out any time soon.
Ah yes the Darkfall rabid fan trolls!
So was there really any point to your insults or are you just so despirit to hype DF and insult people that the Darkfall forums weren't enough? Funny that you guys all get hot and bothered when anyone says anything bad about DF but here you are insulting others. So mature
Funny how you generalize.
I agree with the essence of your post, just not how you said it.
Sorry its early here, and i never claimed to be perfect, but atleast we agree in essence.
So in the spirit of rational discussion mind me asking why you posted this poll in the AoC forums rather then in the Darkfall forums were prehaps it belongs? Yes its a free forum and you can post wherever you want but i do find it funny that it seems so many DF fans are all of a sudden invading the AoC and Vanguard forums. I hadn't really noticed this before this weekend, and yes while some of the DF fans can hold a rational discussion there also others that love the do in other MMO forums what they most hate people doing in the DF forums.
In all honesty? Sure why not. Amazing Avery has been a present of late on the DF forums and if the Age of Conan correspondent seems to have such an interest in DFO then maybe it would be a decent idea to see what the rest of the Age of Conan community thinks of DFO. Would a post asking wether or not the AoC community thinks Darkfalls launch would have an impact on AoC be better served asking the DF community? or the AoC community?
I mean Amazing Avery not only has been making a presence on the DF boards he is even talking about it on the MO boards
So in a way I was promted to by a representative of the AoC community, indirectly of course. I was also honestly curious what the AoC community thought about the subject at hand. I think it better to ask a community about what they think versus asking another community what they think another community would think (this sentence made my head hurt lol)
Will DF make an impact on AoC sub numbers (or the numbers for any other MMO)? Slim to none, probably.
Regardless of what we think, DF hasn't marketed nearly on the level of most of the current top dogs of the MMO arena. I hadn’t even heard of DF until I came to these boards, and I doubt I'm the only one.
Now if DF can deliver on its promises, then maybe in a few months to a year, yeah, it can get find it's niche in the market. It won't be a WoW killer, or even a WAR killer, or a AoC killer, or an anything else killer, but it will hold it's own.
And OP, it's hard to take your post seriously when your signature is basically an ad for DF. You bring up a valid discussion, but it makes you look like you're trolling.
I think we all have leared this year that there is absolutely no reason in rushing on to the next hype.
This.
I'm at the point of wondering at what point doubt begins to creep in with some people and they begin to take the hype with a grain of salt and a lot of skepticism.
I've seen some familiar faces in different games' forums (here and elsewhere) going through the same routine over and over...
It looks something like this...
Game A is in Development.
Player: "OMG.. Game A is going to be the best MMO out there.. It's going to totally steal players away from -perceived competing games here-. They're doing "this", "that" and "the other" and that's why it's going to rule! You'll see!"
Game A goes through Beta
Player: "Okay.. so what, the game has flaws.. all games do in beta. It'll be fine when it comes out. You'll see the game is going to rule and then all the trolls can go elsewhere..."
Game A is released
Player: "Well the game just came out, of course it's going to have bugs.. and so what if they didn't add in everything they said they would.. Do you realize how difficult it is to make a MMO? Just give them a few months and they'll have this game turned around!"
Months later, Game A is no better off and losing players
Player: "Yeah, I give up on this game.. It's not what they promised it to be and I'm sick of being hyped up and let down. I'm looking forward to Game B"
...
Game B is in development...
Player: "OMG, this is going to be the most amazing MMO ever!!"...
and basically wash, rinse and repeat that scenario.
Seriously.. I think there would be fewer people feeling "epically disappointed", if people stopped being so eager to throw themselves with blind loyalty at every new game whose developer promises it to be "all you ever wanted and more".
I'll check out Darkfall when it comes out. It promises a lot of things that *sound* good. But it's easy to make something sound good. It's something else altogether to make it actually as good as it sounds. And do not take the word of devs or company people... they're the *last* people you should be putting 100% faith in.
I have argued this point before, but perhaps less eliquently. In the end I've given up, and Decided to let it go people will believe what they want some people can and will change others are impervious to change, and will always go off saying "This time it will happen! They promised! I want it, Its gotta happen this time for sure!" for those maybe some day it will. I wish them well. its their opinion and as long as they don't try and force it on me then no harm done. Still sometimwe alittle debate is fun
Will DF make an impact on AoC sub numbers (or the numbers for any other MMO)? Slim to none, probably. Regardless of what we think, DF hasn't marketed nearly on the level of most of the current top dogs of the MMO arena. I hadn’t even heard of DF until I came to these boards, and I doubt I'm the only one. Now if DF can deliver on its promises, then maybe in a few months to a year, yeah, it can get find it's niche in the market. It won't be a WoW killer, or even a WAR killer, or a AoC killer, or an anything else killer, but it will hold it's own. And OP, it's hard to take your post seriously when your signature is basically an ad for DF. You bring up a valid discussion, but it makes you look like you're trolling.
If my sig makes me look im trolling then it would seem many do not know what trolling is. I am not going into threads made for other discussions, I am not constantly making overly negative comments, I am not disrupting any threads, simple having a discussion. If having a personal prefference for a game other than AoC makes me a troll in the eye's of others then so be it, I guess I will just have to live with that.
Sorry its early here, and i never claimed to be perfect, but atleast we agree in essence. So in the spirit of rational discussion mind me asking why you posted this poll in the AoC forums rather then in the Darkfall forums were prehaps it belongs? Yes its a free forum and you can post wherever you want but i do find it funny that it seems so many DF fans are all of a sudden invading the AoC and Vanguard forums. I hadn't really noticed this before this weekend, and yes while some of the DF fans can hold a rational discussion there also others that love the do in other MMO forums what they most hate people doing in the DF forums.
In all honesty? Sure why not. Amazing Avery has been a present of late on the DF forums and if the Age of Conan correspondent seems to have such an interest in DFO then maybe it would be a decent idea to see what the rest of the Age of Conan community thinks of DFO. Would a post asking wether or not the AoC community thinks Darkfalls launch would have an impact on AoC be better served asking the DF community? or the AoC community?
I mean Amazing Avery not only has been making a presence on the DF boards he is even talking about it on the MO boards
So in a way I was promted to by a representative of the AoC community, indirectly of course. I was also honestly curious what the AoC community thought about the subject at hand. I think it better to ask a community about what they think versus asking another community what they think another community would think (this sentence made my head hurt lol)
Thank you for your honest answer. Sounds fair enough to me. And yes that last sentence was a killer
I don't like your poll. You of given more options on how it might affect AoC.
Q.Will it affect AoC current population?
A. No, AoCs current population is stabilized. Only a "handful" of players will come or go
Q. Will it have affect on AoC's growth.
A. The hardcore PvP may elect to try Darkfall over AoC; however, the hardcore player also likes a ladder system and neither game currently supports that. AoC is more likely to support a ladder system than Darkfall. People who expected AoC to be the New UO will jump ship (not many of them play AoC anymore)
Q. Will Darkfall be a giant
A. NO FING WAY. Darkfall is the epitome of a Sandbox MMO. Most people can't decide what to do in RL, most people can't function without being goal orientated. Darkfall doesn't have a clear cut path laid out for people. No raid progression, No over arching story line, etc that makes a game successful.
Now all that aside Darkfall will be a good game, but I don't expect it population to be much more than 250k after the 2nd month of its release. If it is over 250k then the game will have made MMO history. GL darkfall I wish you well.
After reading people's comments on the hardcore PvPers chosing darkfall over AoC in the future I felt that I should say something else.
I'm a hardcore PvP in any game that I play for the most part. I played GW for nearly 2 years (WoWs mini game grind didn't intrest me due to gear>skill) and I love the rank system in both GvG and HA. I liked the idea of AoC's siege battles, innovative combat system, and skill based game play. Everything I thought the game would be it is. I was a fanboy but abaonded the hype before game launched. Its combat system is good, the seige battles are fun, and the game is pretty much skill>everything else (yeah CCs are annoying). However, I'm dissaapointed by AoC lack of a GvG ladder system.
Now here I am looking at Darkfall. It promises the moon and then some. Full loot PvP is always fun once you get into it at higher levels (crafted gear being good that is) and it appears to be a skill based game. It also appears to offer various PvP venues: Sea battles, open world, and guild sieging; however, it still lacks any goal orrintateed PvP just like AoC. Darkfall and AoC are largely sandbox games when it comes to PvP. The people who left AoC for more meaningful PvP aren't going to play DF, they are playing WAR. WAR give people that sense of PvP accomplishment through renown level, gear, guild siege, and RvR. The people who wanted meaningful PvP aren't going to play darkfall unless they love siege battle and PvP for the sake of PvP. No matte how you cut it, full loot is not anymore reason to PvP than having PvP exp especially when crafted gear is the second best gear in the game and is suppose to be easily attained.
So, If you left AoC because it didn't have meaningful PvP don't expect DF to offer anything that different. If you left AoC because you were execpting it to be UO 5.0 then DF will be for you (and AoC will be for that matter in a couple of months)
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup.
Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will.
DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful.
I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
Hmm I guess I wasn't clear about a ladder system. When I say ladder system I mean tournaments ala GW style. Getting kllled any where in the world wouldn't lower you ranking and a world ranking system would inevitably mean nothing in any FFA PvP game because of ganking, kill stealing, and kill trading. Team ranking system, such as GvG battles do matter to a lot of hardcore PvPers. Where there is a ladder system with tangible rewards you'll sure to find the professional gamer. GW had this sytem in place for the first year and a half and it was very successful which is seen by the two world tournaments they hosted and were aired live on a couple of gaming networks around the world and could be viewed in game by regular players. The type of players that left AoC in mass weren't people who were looking for AoC to be UO 5.0, they were people that were expecting AoC to have a PvP system in place that rewarded PvP in some meaninful way. Exp and gear don't cut it for most people (people returned and then left after 2.0). These players are more suited for a game like GW, WAR, or even WoW BGs.
I know there are people like yourself who left AoC because it wasn't like UO, but I believe that your group is in the minority. Case in point, most people left for WAR which, according to many of the UO fans I've talked to, wasn't even worth trying. Don't get ,e wrong I plan on trying out DF while still actively playing AoC, but I'm not expecting miracles.
Edit: Just read the loot system that FC is implementing in the next patch. It sounds great. Not exactly UO style, but I'm sure this will be expanded by pvp level 5-??
I don't like your poll. You of given more options on how it might affect AoC.
Q.Will it affect AoC current population?
A. No, AoCs current population is stabilized. Only a "handful" of players will come or go
Q. Will it have affect on AoC's growth.
A. The hardcore PvP may elect to try Darkfall over AoC; however, the hardcore player also likes a ladder system and neither game currently supports that. AoC is more likely to support a ladder system than Darkfall. People who expected AoC to be the New UO will jump ship (not many of them play AoC anymore)
Q. Will Darkfall be a giant
A. NO FING WAY. Darkfall is the epitome of a Sandbox MMO. Most people can't decide what to do in RL, most people can't function without being goal orientated. Darkfall doesn't have a clear cut path laid out for people. No raid progression, No over arching story line, etc that makes a game successful.
Now all that aside Darkfall will be a good game, but I don't expect it population to be much more than 250k after the 2nd month of its release. If it is over 250k then the game will have made MMO history. GL darkfall I wish you well.
After reading people's comments on the hardcore PvPers chosing darkfall over AoC in the future I felt that I should say something else.
I'm a hardcore PvP in any game that I play for the most part. I played GW for nearly 2 years (WoWs mini game grind didn't intrest me due to gear>skill) and I love the rank system in both GvG and HA. I liked the idea of AoC's siege battles, innovative combat system, and skill based game play. Everything I thought the game would be it is. I was a fanboy but abaonded the hype before game launched. Its combat system is good, the seige battles are fun, and the game is pretty much skill>everything else (yeah CCs are annoying). However, I'm dissaapointed by AoC lack of a GvG ladder system.
Now here I am looking at Darkfall. It promises the moon and then some. Full loot PvP is always fun once you get into it at higher levels (crafted gear being good that is) and it appears to be a skill based game. It also appears to offer various PvP venues: Sea battles, open world, and guild sieging; however, it still lacks any goal orrintateed PvP just like AoC. Darkfall and AoC are largely sandbox games when it comes to PvP. The people who left AoC for more meaningful PvP aren't going to play DF, they are playing WAR. WAR give people that sense of PvP accomplishment through renown level, gear, guild siege, and RvR. The people who wanted meaningful PvP aren't going to play darkfall unless they love siege battle and PvP for the sake of PvP. No matte how you cut it, full loot is not anymore reason to PvP than having PvP exp especially when crafted gear is the second best gear in the game and is suppose to be easily attained.
So, If you left AoC because it didn't have meaningful PvP don't expect DF to offer anything that different. If you left AoC because you were execpting it to be UO 5.0 then DF will be for you (and AoC will be for that matter in a couple of months)
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup.
Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will.
DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful.
I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
Hmm I guess I wasn't clear about a ladder system. When I say ladder system I mean tournaments ala GW style. Getting kllled any where in the world wouldn't lower you ranking and a world ranking system would inevitably mean nothing in any FFA PvP game because of ganking, kill stealing, and kill trading. Team ranking system, such as GvG battles do matter to a lot of hardcore PvPers. Where there is a ladder system with tangible rewards you'll sure to find the professional gamer. GW had this sytem in place for the first year and a half and it was very successful which is seen by the two world tournaments they hosted and were aired live on a couple of gaming networks around the world and could be viewed in game by regular players. The type of players that left AoC in mass weren't people who were looking for AoC to be UO 5.0, they were people that were expecting AoC to have a PvP system in place that rewarded PvP in some meaninful way. Exp and gear don't cut it for most people (people returned and then left after 2.0). These players are more suited for a game like GW, WAR, or even WoW BGs.
I know there are people like yourself who left AoC because it wasn't like UO, but I believe that your group is in the minority. Case in point, most people left for WAR which, according to many of the UO fans I've talked to, wasn't even worth trying. Don't get ,e wrong I plan on trying out DF while still actively playing AoC, but I'm not expecting miracles.
Edit: Just read the loot system that FC is implementing in the next patch. It sounds great. Not exactly UO style, but I'm sure this will be expanded by pvp level 5-??
Ok I got ya now, the Devs have claimed to be Stat happy and there are going to be statistics. I believe arena's for tournaments/duels to have been said to be in as well. Can't seem to find the quote's on those at the moment.
As far as your edit, yeah they seem to be trying still not what players mean but closer lol.It might even be an atempt to keep DF from taking any PvP'rs. That is unfounded speculation on my part though.
I don't like your poll. You of given more options on how it might affect AoC. Q.Will it affect AoC current population? A. No, AoCs current population is stabilized. Only a "handful" of players will come or go Q. Will it have affect on AoC's growth. A. The hardcore PvP may elect to try Darkfall over AoC; however, the hardcore player also likes a ladder system and neither game currently supports that. AoC is more likely to support a ladder system than Darkfall. People who expected AoC to be the New UO will jump ship (not many of them play AoC anymore) Q. Will Darkfall be a giant A. NO FING WAY. Darkfall is the epitome of a Sandbox MMO. Most people can't decide what to do in RL, most people can't function without being goal orientated. Darkfall doesn't have a clear cut path laid out for people. No raid progression, No over arching story line, etc that makes a game successful. Now all that aside Darkfall will be a good game, but I don't expect it population to be much more than 250k after the 2nd month of its release. If it is over 250k then the game will have made MMO history. GL darkfall I wish you well.
After reading people's comments on the hardcore PvPers chosing darkfall over AoC in the future I felt that I should say something else. I'm a hardcore PvP in any game that I play for the most part. I played GW for nearly 2 years (WoWs mini game grind didn't intrest me due to gear>skill) and I love the rank system in both GvG and HA. I liked the idea of AoC's siege battles, innovative combat system, and skill based game play. Everything I thought the game would be it is. I was a fanboy but abaonded the hype before game launched. Its combat system is good, the seige battles are fun, and the game is pretty much skill>everything else (yeah CCs are annoying). However, I'm dissaapointed by AoC lack of a GvG ladder system. Now here I am looking at Darkfall. It promises the moon and then some. Full loot PvP is always fun once you get into it at higher levels (crafted gear being good that is) and it appears to be a skill based game. It also appears to offer various PvP venues: Sea battles, open world, and guild sieging; however, it still lacks any goal orrintateed PvP just like AoC. Darkfall and AoC are largely sandbox games when it comes to PvP. The people who left AoC for more meaningful PvP aren't going to play DF, they are playing WAR. WAR give people that sense of PvP accomplishment through renown level, gear, guild siege, and RvR. The people who wanted meaningful PvP aren't going to play darkfall unless they love siege battle and PvP for the sake of PvP. No matte how you cut it, full loot is not anymore reason to PvP than having PvP exp especially when crafted gear is the second best gear in the game and is suppose to be easily attained. So, If you left AoC because it didn't have meaningful PvP don't expect DF to offer anything that different. If you left AoC because you were execpting it to be UO 5.0 then DF will be for you (and AoC will be for that matter in a couple of months)
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup. Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will. DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful. I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
Hmm I guess I wasn't clear about a ladder system. When I say ladder system I mean tournaments ala GW style. Getting kllled any where in the world wouldn't lower you ranking and a world ranking system would inevitably mean nothing in any FFA PvP game because of ganking, kill stealing, and kill trading. Team ranking system, such as GvG battles do matter to a lot of hardcore PvPers. Where there is a ladder system with tangible rewards you'll sure to find the professional gamer. GW had this sytem in place for the first year and a half and it was very successful which is seen by the two world tournaments they hosted and were aired live on a couple of gaming networks around the world and could be viewed in game by regular players. The type of players that left AoC in mass weren't people who were looking for AoC to be UO 5.0, they were people that were expecting AoC to have a PvP system in place that rewarded PvP in some meaninful way. Exp and gear don't cut it for most people (people returned and then left after 2.0). These players are more suited for a game like GW, WAR, or even WoW BGs.
I know there are people like yourself who left AoC because it wasn't like UO, but I believe that your group is in the minority. Case in point, most people left for WAR which, according to many of the UO fans I've talked to, wasn't even worth trying. Don't get ,e wrong I plan on trying out DF while still actively playing AoC, but I'm not expecting miracles. Edit: Just read the loot system that FC is implementing in the next patch. It sounds great. Not exactly UO style, but I'm sure this will be expanded by pvp level 5-??
Ok I got ya now, the Devs have claimed to be Stat happy and there are going to be statistics. I believe arena's for tournaments/duels to have been said to be in as well. Can't seem to find the quote's on those at the moment. As far as your edit, yeah they seem to be trying still not what players mean but closer lol.It might even be an atempt to keep DF from taking any PvP'rs. That is unfounded speculation on my part though.
Good to hear that DF is at least looking at adding this. That all the more reason for me to play it. I lead a guild to the top 200 in GW before all the greats left as a tactic caller and target caller and nothing I've played since has had the level of competition where 1 person sits down and come up with just builds for 5 days stright. If DF adds something like this you bet I'll be there.
As far as your speculation, I don't know. I mean Craig wants to put nearly everything in the game that was talked about before launch and this was one of those ideas. Hopefully they'll add battle towers and lootable PvP gear
I don't like your poll. You of given more options on how it might affect AoC.
Q.Will it affect AoC current population?
A. No, AoCs current population is stabilized. Only a "handful" of players will come or go
Q. Will it have affect on AoC's growth.
A. The hardcore PvP may elect to try Darkfall over AoC; however, the hardcore player also likes a ladder system and neither game currently supports that. AoC is more likely to support a ladder system than Darkfall. People who expected AoC to be the New UO will jump ship (not many of them play AoC anymore)
Q. Will Darkfall be a giant
A. NO FING WAY. Darkfall is the epitome of a Sandbox MMO. Most people can't decide what to do in RL, most people can't function without being goal orientated. Darkfall doesn't have a clear cut path laid out for people. No raid progression, No over arching story line, etc that makes a game successful.
Now all that aside Darkfall will be a good game, but I don't expect it population to be much more than 250k after the 2nd month of its release. If it is over 250k then the game will have made MMO history. GL darkfall I wish you well.
After reading people's comments on the hardcore PvPers chosing darkfall over AoC in the future I felt that I should say something else.
I'm a hardcore PvP in any game that I play for the most part. I played GW for nearly 2 years (WoWs mini game grind didn't intrest me due to gear>skill) and I love the rank system in both GvG and HA. I liked the idea of AoC's siege battles, innovative combat system, and skill based game play. Everything I thought the game would be it is. I was a fanboy but abaonded the hype before game launched. Its combat system is good, the seige battles are fun, and the game is pretty much skill>everything else (yeah CCs are annoying). However, I'm dissaapointed by AoC lack of a GvG ladder system.
Now here I am looking at Darkfall. It promises the moon and then some. Full loot PvP is always fun once you get into it at higher levels (crafted gear being good that is) and it appears to be a skill based game. It also appears to offer various PvP venues: Sea battles, open world, and guild sieging; however, it still lacks any goal orrintateed PvP just like AoC. Darkfall and AoC are largely sandbox games when it comes to PvP. The people who left AoC for more meaningful PvP aren't going to play DF, they are playing WAR. WAR give people that sense of PvP accomplishment through renown level, gear, guild siege, and RvR. The people who wanted meaningful PvP aren't going to play darkfall unless they love siege battle and PvP for the sake of PvP. No matte how you cut it, full loot is not anymore reason to PvP than having PvP exp especially when crafted gear is the second best gear in the game and is suppose to be easily attained.
So, If you left AoC because it didn't have meaningful PvP don't expect DF to offer anything that different. If you left AoC because you were execpting it to be UO 5.0 then DF will be for you (and AoC will be for that matter in a couple of months)
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup.
Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will.
DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful.
I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
Hmm I guess I wasn't clear about a ladder system. When I say ladder system I mean tournaments ala GW style. Getting kllled any where in the world wouldn't lower you ranking and a world ranking system would inevitably mean nothing in any FFA PvP game because of ganking, kill stealing, and kill trading. Team ranking system, such as GvG battles do matter to a lot of hardcore PvPers. Where there is a ladder system with tangible rewards you'll sure to find the professional gamer. GW had this sytem in place for the first year and a half and it was very successful which is seen by the two world tournaments they hosted and were aired live on a couple of gaming networks around the world and could be viewed in game by regular players. The type of players that left AoC in mass weren't people who were looking for AoC to be UO 5.0, they were people that were expecting AoC to have a PvP system in place that rewarded PvP in some meaninful way. Exp and gear don't cut it for most people (people returned and then left after 2.0). These players are more suited for a game like GW, WAR, or even WoW BGs.
I know there are people like yourself who left AoC because it wasn't like UO, but I believe that your group is in the minority. Case in point, most people left for WAR which, according to many of the UO fans I've talked to, wasn't even worth trying. Don't get ,e wrong I plan on trying out DF while still actively playing AoC, but I'm not expecting miracles.
Edit: Just read the loot system that FC is implementing in the next patch. It sounds great. Not exactly UO style, but I'm sure this will be expanded by pvp level 5-??
Ok I got ya now, the Devs have claimed to be Stat happy and there are going to be statistics. I believe arena's for tournaments/duels to have been said to be in as well. Can't seem to find the quote's on those at the moment.
As far as your edit, yeah they seem to be trying still not what players mean but closer lol.It might even be an atempt to keep DF from taking any PvP'rs. That is unfounded speculation on my part though.
Good to hear that DF is at least looking at adding this. That all the more reason for me to play it. I lead a guild to the top 200 in GW before all the greats left as a tactic caller and target caller and nothing I've played since has had the level of competition where 1 person sits down and come up with just builds for 5 days stright. If DF adds something like this you bet I'll be there.
As far as your speculation, I don't know. I mean Craig wants to put nearly everything in the game that was talked about before launch and this was one of those ideas. Hopefully they'll add battle towers and lootable PvP gear
I know lol I admitted my speculation was unfounded.
AmazingAveryAge of Conan AdvocateMemberUncommonPosts: 7,188
With todays recent news - I'd have to say no not really.
Since posting in the thread we can see more people play AoC in EU than NA from the looks of things.
With Staggered launch and windows being the reverse of what AoC did at launch - we can see the problems caused or potential for them more so.
Hopefully DF will get out the door in one piece. But I really don't think it is going to have a big impact.
It now looks like DX10 implementation will happen in AoC in Feb anyway. And with a ticket system based on pre-orders for DF it is hard to say how well it will do based off no so good infrastructure.
With todays recent news - I'd have to say no not really. Since posting in the thread we can see more people play AoC in EU than NA from the looks of things. With Staggered launch and windows being the reverse of what AoC did at launch - we can see the problems caused or potential for them more so. Hopefully DF will get out the door in one piece. But I really don't think it is going to have a big impact. It now looks like DX10 implementation will happen in AoC in Feb anyway. And with a ticket system based on pre-orders for DF it is hard to say how well it will do based off no so good infrastructure.
I bet DX10 and the 2 new dungeons will come out the day before Darkfall launches.
and that's coming from someone who loves AoC lol.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Guys! I'm hopelessly lost in a mountain of mole hills! Them damn moles!
Comments
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup.
Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will.
DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful.
I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup.
Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will.
DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful.
I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
Xipher has a good point one of the things people complained about with AoC was the lack of rewards. PvP didn't give them anything, PvE didn't give them anything as gear was never meant to be a mayor factor in AoC. A lot of the people I played with went to war and they liked it because here you actually was rewarded for almost everything you did. PvP gave you rewards, PvE gave you rewards. I 'm one of those players who prefer a sandbox MMO where I myself choose what to do when to do it. WoW was after over a year very boring, as I constantly had to raid or do arenas to be able to compete with other people. AoC I find a lot of fun, sure the PvP doesn't really give me a pat on the back and a reward in my backpack, but it gives me joy which is the most important thing for me. Darkfall might be a good game, it might not be. Time will tell, the full corpse loot will attract the hardcore MMO players that played UO etc. but you never get the masses from WoW playing it. as for majority of players loosing their gear is the worst thinkable scenario. When Funcom talked about the possibility of items drop from murderers there was people on the forums telling funcom they would quit if they lost some of their gear as it meant the world and some more for them.
The carrot for people to play MMO's today are basicly that they get a reward for their time put into the game. Sad but truth, the time where people played mmorpg's for fun is more or less over. Still a bunch of people thinking this way, thinking that improving my skill in the game and becoming better at it is more of a reward then some shiny weapon or armor piece. The fact gear didn't matter in AoC was one of the things people cried a lot about. it meant they didn't bother raid, or bothered to grind to get gold to buy stuff. because gear didn't mean anything. It seems majority of people wants to have a visual proof of their "success" rathher then the feeling that accomplishing things gives you. Blizzard are genious in the way they feed players with rewards for almost everything they do, it attracts the masses and they earn huge amount of money on it. It almost looks like Blizzard one day thought" What the heck! Lets grab all the stuff people liked in other MMO's . Put it into one MMO make it work, base it on our already popular Warcraft setting and show the rest of the MMO makers how they could do things. "
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Ah yes the Darkfall rabid fan trolls!
So was there really any point to your insults or are you just so despirit to hype DF and insult people that the Darkfall forums weren't enough? Funny that you guys all get hot and bothered when anyone says anything bad about DF but here you are insulting others. So mature
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup.
Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will.
DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful.
I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
Xipher has a good point one of the things people complained about with AoC was the lack of rewards. PvP didn't give them anything, PvE didn't give them anything as gear was never meant to be a mayor factor in AoC. A lot of the people I played with went to war and they liked it because here you actually was rewarded for almost everything you did. PvP gave you rewards, PvE gave you rewards. I 'm one of those players who prefer a sandbox MMO where I myself choose what to do when to do it. WoW was after over a year very boring, as I constantly had to raid or do arenas to be able to compete with other people. AoC I find a lot of fun, sure the PvP doesn't really give me a pat on the back and a reward in my backpack, but it gives me joy which is the most important thing for me. Darkfall might be a good game, it might not be. Time will tell, the full corpse loot will attract the hardcore MMO players that played UO etc. but you never get the masses from WoW playing it. as for majority of players loosing their gear is the worst thinkable scenario. When Funcom talked about the possibility of items drop from murderers there was people on the forums telling funcom they would quit if they lost some of their gear as it meant the world and some more for them.
The carrot for people to play MMO's today are basicly that they get a reward for their time put into the game. Sad but truth, the time where people played mmorpg's for fun is more or less over. Still a bunch of people thinking this way, thinking that improving my skill in the game and becoming better at it is more of a reward then some shiny weapon or armor piece. The fact gear didn't matter in AoC was one of the things people cried a lot about. it meant they didn't bother raid, or bothered to grind to get gold to buy stuff. because gear didn't mean anything. It seems majority of people wants to have a visual proof of their "success" rathher then the feeling that accomplishing things gives you. Blizzard are genious in the way they feed players with rewards for almost everything they do, it attracts the masses and they earn huge amount of money on it. It almost looks like Blizzard one day thought" What the heck! Lets grab all the stuff people liked in other MMO's . Put it into one MMO make it work, base it on our already popular Warcraft setting and show the rest of the MMO makers how they could do things. "
The Problem here is AoC. Yes there was an outcry because gear wasn't important enough and yes people QQ'd about losing an item if they were a murderer ect ect.
What AoC did wrong was try and bring a sandbox ruleset to a linear game.
WoW did it right because there using the rules that go with there system.
UO lost many because it tried using a linear ruleset in a sandbox world.
AoC lost many (not only because of bugs) because it tried using a sandbox ruleset in a linear game.
This is of course just my opinion.
Ah yes the Darkfall rabid fan trolls!
So was there really any point to your insults or are you just so despirit to hype DF and insult people that the Darkfall forums weren't enough? Funny that you guys all get hot and bothered when anyone says anything bad about DF but here you are insulting others. So mature
Funny how you generalize.
I agree with the essence of your post, just not how you said it.
Ah yes the Darkfall rabid fan trolls!
So was there really any point to your insults or are you just so despirit to hype DF and insult people that the Darkfall forums weren't enough? Funny that you guys all get hot and bothered when anyone says anything bad about DF but here you are insulting others. So mature
Funny how you generalize.
I agree with the essence of your post, just not how you said it.
Sorry its early here, and i never claimed to be perfect, but atleast we agree in essence.
So in the spirit of rational discussion mind me asking why you posted this poll in the AoC forums rather then in the Darkfall forums were prehaps it belongs? Yes its a free forum and you can post wherever you want but i do find it funny that it seems so many DF fans are all of a sudden invading the AoC and Vanguard forums. I hadn't really noticed this before this weekend, and yes while some of the DF fans can hold a rational discussion there also others that love the do in other MMO forums what they most hate people doing in the DF forums.
Ah yes the Darkfall rabid fan trolls!
So was there really any point to your insults or are you just so despirit to hype DF and insult people that the Darkfall forums weren't enough? Funny that you guys all get hot and bothered when anyone says anything bad about DF but here you are insulting others. So mature
Funny how you generalize.
I agree with the essence of your post, just not how you said it.
Sorry its early here, and i never claimed to be perfect, but atleast we agree in essence.
So in the spirit of rational discussion mind me asking why you posted this poll in the AoC forums rather then in the Darkfall forums were prehaps it belongs? Yes its a free forum and you can post wherever you want but i do find it funny that it seems so many DF fans are all of a sudden invading the AoC and Vanguard forums. I hadn't really noticed this before this weekend, and yes while some of the DF fans can hold a rational discussion there also others that love the do in other MMO forums what they most hate people doing in the DF forums.
In all honesty? Sure why not. Amazing Avery has been a present of late on the DF forums and if the Age of Conan correspondent seems to have such an interest in DFO then maybe it would be a decent idea to see what the rest of the Age of Conan community thinks of DFO. Would a post asking wether or not the AoC community thinks Darkfalls launch would have an impact on AoC be better served asking the DF community? or the AoC community?
I mean Amazing Avery not only has been making a presence on the DF boards he is even talking about it on the MO boards
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/213163
So in a way I was promted to by a representative of the AoC community, indirectly of course. I was also honestly curious what the AoC community thought about the subject at hand. I think it better to ask a community about what they think versus asking another community what they think another community would think (this sentence made my head hurt lol)
Will DF make an impact on AoC sub numbers (or the numbers for any other MMO)? Slim to none, probably.
Regardless of what we think, DF hasn't marketed nearly on the level of most of the current top dogs of the MMO arena. I hadn’t even heard of DF until I came to these boards, and I doubt I'm the only one.
Now if DF can deliver on its promises, then maybe in a few months to a year, yeah, it can get find it's niche in the market. It won't be a WoW killer, or even a WAR killer, or a AoC killer, or an anything else killer, but it will hold it's own.
And OP, it's hard to take your post seriously when your signature is basically an ad for DF. You bring up a valid discussion, but it makes you look like you're trolling.
This.
I'm at the point of wondering at what point doubt begins to creep in with some people and they begin to take the hype with a grain of salt and a lot of skepticism.
I've seen some familiar faces in different games' forums (here and elsewhere) going through the same routine over and over...
It looks something like this...
Game A is in Development.
Player: "OMG.. Game A is going to be the best MMO out there.. It's going to totally steal players away from -perceived competing games here-. They're doing "this", "that" and "the other" and that's why it's going to rule! You'll see!"
Game A goes through Beta
Player: "Okay.. so what, the game has flaws.. all games do in beta. It'll be fine when it comes out. You'll see the game is going to rule and then all the trolls can go elsewhere..."
Game A is released
Player: "Well the game just came out, of course it's going to have bugs.. and so what if they didn't add in everything they said they would.. Do you realize how difficult it is to make a MMO? Just give them a few months and they'll have this game turned around!"
Months later, Game A is no better off and losing players
Player: "Yeah, I give up on this game.. It's not what they promised it to be and I'm sick of being hyped up and let down. I'm looking forward to Game B"
...
Game B is in development...
Player: "OMG, this is going to be the most amazing MMO ever!!"...
and basically wash, rinse and repeat that scenario.
Seriously.. I think there would be fewer people feeling "epically disappointed", if people stopped being so eager to throw themselves with blind loyalty at every new game whose developer promises it to be "all you ever wanted and more".
I'll check out Darkfall when it comes out. It promises a lot of things that *sound* good. But it's easy to make something sound good. It's something else altogether to make it actually as good as it sounds. And do not take the word of devs or company people... they're the *last* people you should be putting 100% faith in.
I have argued this point before, but perhaps less eliquently. In the end I've given up, and Decided to let it go people will believe what they want some people can and will change others are impervious to change, and will always go off saying "This time it will happen! They promised! I want it, Its gotta happen this time for sure!" for those maybe some day it will. I wish them well. its their opinion and as long as they don't try and force it on me then no harm done. Still sometimwe alittle debate is fun
If my sig makes me look im trolling then it would seem many do not know what trolling is. I am not going into threads made for other discussions, I am not constantly making overly negative comments, I am not disrupting any threads, simple having a discussion. If having a personal prefference for a game other than AoC makes me a troll in the eye's of others then so be it, I guess I will just have to live with that.
In all honesty? Sure why not. Amazing Avery has been a present of late on the DF forums and if the Age of Conan correspondent seems to have such an interest in DFO then maybe it would be a decent idea to see what the rest of the Age of Conan community thinks of DFO. Would a post asking wether or not the AoC community thinks Darkfalls launch would have an impact on AoC be better served asking the DF community? or the AoC community?
I mean Amazing Avery not only has been making a presence on the DF boards he is even talking about it on the MO boards
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/213163
So in a way I was promted to by a representative of the AoC community, indirectly of course. I was also honestly curious what the AoC community thought about the subject at hand. I think it better to ask a community about what they think versus asking another community what they think another community would think (this sentence made my head hurt lol)
Thank you for your honest answer. Sounds fair enough to me. And yes that last sentence was a killer
Hmm I guess I wasn't clear about a ladder system. When I say ladder system I mean tournaments ala GW style. Getting kllled any where in the world wouldn't lower you ranking and a world ranking system would inevitably mean nothing in any FFA PvP game because of ganking, kill stealing, and kill trading. Team ranking system, such as GvG battles do matter to a lot of hardcore PvPers. Where there is a ladder system with tangible rewards you'll sure to find the professional gamer. GW had this sytem in place for the first year and a half and it was very successful which is seen by the two world tournaments they hosted and were aired live on a couple of gaming networks around the world and could be viewed in game by regular players. The type of players that left AoC in mass weren't people who were looking for AoC to be UO 5.0, they were people that were expecting AoC to have a PvP system in place that rewarded PvP in some meaninful way. Exp and gear don't cut it for most people (people returned and then left after 2.0). These players are more suited for a game like GW, WAR, or even WoW BGs.
I know there are people like yourself who left AoC because it wasn't like UO, but I believe that your group is in the minority. Case in point, most people left for WAR which, according to many of the UO fans I've talked to, wasn't even worth trying. Don't get ,e wrong I plan on trying out DF while still actively playing AoC, but I'm not expecting miracles.
Edit: Just read the loot system that FC is implementing in the next patch. It sounds great. Not exactly UO style, but I'm sure this will be expanded by pvp level 5-??
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup.
Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will.
DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful.
I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
Hmm I guess I wasn't clear about a ladder system. When I say ladder system I mean tournaments ala GW style. Getting kllled any where in the world wouldn't lower you ranking and a world ranking system would inevitably mean nothing in any FFA PvP game because of ganking, kill stealing, and kill trading. Team ranking system, such as GvG battles do matter to a lot of hardcore PvPers. Where there is a ladder system with tangible rewards you'll sure to find the professional gamer. GW had this sytem in place for the first year and a half and it was very successful which is seen by the two world tournaments they hosted and were aired live on a couple of gaming networks around the world and could be viewed in game by regular players. The type of players that left AoC in mass weren't people who were looking for AoC to be UO 5.0, they were people that were expecting AoC to have a PvP system in place that rewarded PvP in some meaninful way. Exp and gear don't cut it for most people (people returned and then left after 2.0). These players are more suited for a game like GW, WAR, or even WoW BGs.
I know there are people like yourself who left AoC because it wasn't like UO, but I believe that your group is in the minority. Case in point, most people left for WAR which, according to many of the UO fans I've talked to, wasn't even worth trying. Don't get ,e wrong I plan on trying out DF while still actively playing AoC, but I'm not expecting miracles.
Edit: Just read the loot system that FC is implementing in the next patch. It sounds great. Not exactly UO style, but I'm sure this will be expanded by pvp level 5-??
Ok I got ya now, the Devs have claimed to be Stat happy and there are going to be statistics. I believe arena's for tournaments/duels to have been said to be in as well. Can't seem to find the quote's on those at the moment.
As far as your edit, yeah they seem to be trying still not what players mean but closer lol.It might even be an atempt to keep DF from taking any PvP'rs. That is unfounded speculation on my part though.
Good to hear that DF is at least looking at adding this. That all the more reason for me to play it. I lead a guild to the top 200 in GW before all the greats left as a tactic caller and target caller and nothing I've played since has had the level of competition where 1 person sits down and come up with just builds for 5 days stright. If DF adds something like this you bet I'll be there.
As far as your speculation, I don't know. I mean Craig wants to put nearly everything in the game that was talked about before launch and this was one of those ideas. Hopefully they'll add battle towers and lootable PvP gear
Games:
Currently playing:Nothing
Will play: Darkfall: Unholy Wars
Past games:
Guild Wars 2 - Xpiher Duminous
Xpiher's GW2
GW 1 - Xpiher Duminous
Darkfall - Xpiher Duminous (NA) retired
AoC - Xpiher (Tyranny) retired
Warhammer - Xpiher
Meaningful PvP, now this is a phrase that means something different to everyone. By meaningful PvP for me, I want it to mean something. PvP xp doesn't give any meaning to PvP for me, ladders either. Oh no I got killed poor me, lets tally up what I lost............ oh wait nothing lol. I mean if you to be high up the ladder system then you wouldn't do siege's. Why? Simple, you will die a lot durring a siege and mess your statistics all up. I am all for a Ladder system with an arena setup.
Doing it as a global thing though has always seemed pointless to me. You might not do dungeon runs with your friends or clan for the simple fact you may get ganked and your ranking will be decreased because of your new KD ratio. You might not take part in sieging because your KD ratio may drop. Ganking because a standard, fight those weaker than you because you need to climb that ladder, don't do the challenging fights.
In DarkFall PvP will have meaning, in my view. I can loot those I kill, I can be looted as well. PvP now create's a fear of loss. 1 Char per server per account. This will make people accountable for there actions. Yes , yes people can run multiple accounts, not everyone will.
DarkFall does not lack meaning in there PvP. There is a price to pay if you die and a reward if you win. AoC's penalty for death is a slap on the wrist, which is why most don't consider it meaningful.
I left AoC because I wanted meaningful PvP and AoC truely did not have it and I can say with a fair ammount of certainty that it never will. I am waiting on DarkFall for meaningful PvP. You can say I will be dissapointed because there is no ladder system, well you would be wrong. Only other PvP I found meaningful was UO PvP (when Trammel came about I played on Siege perilous). DarkFall seems to share UO's PvP concepts, AoC did not. So while I agree I was dissapointed by AoC PvP, I am doubtful I will be dissapointed by DF's for the simple fact it is meaningful PvP. Ladder systems don't work in MMORPG's only FPS's where you don't have to worry about PvE content or helping out your clan messing with your ranking.
Hmm I guess I wasn't clear about a ladder system. When I say ladder system I mean tournaments ala GW style. Getting kllled any where in the world wouldn't lower you ranking and a world ranking system would inevitably mean nothing in any FFA PvP game because of ganking, kill stealing, and kill trading. Team ranking system, such as GvG battles do matter to a lot of hardcore PvPers. Where there is a ladder system with tangible rewards you'll sure to find the professional gamer. GW had this sytem in place for the first year and a half and it was very successful which is seen by the two world tournaments they hosted and were aired live on a couple of gaming networks around the world and could be viewed in game by regular players. The type of players that left AoC in mass weren't people who were looking for AoC to be UO 5.0, they were people that were expecting AoC to have a PvP system in place that rewarded PvP in some meaninful way. Exp and gear don't cut it for most people (people returned and then left after 2.0). These players are more suited for a game like GW, WAR, or even WoW BGs.
I know there are people like yourself who left AoC because it wasn't like UO, but I believe that your group is in the minority. Case in point, most people left for WAR which, according to many of the UO fans I've talked to, wasn't even worth trying. Don't get ,e wrong I plan on trying out DF while still actively playing AoC, but I'm not expecting miracles.
Edit: Just read the loot system that FC is implementing in the next patch. It sounds great. Not exactly UO style, but I'm sure this will be expanded by pvp level 5-??
Ok I got ya now, the Devs have claimed to be Stat happy and there are going to be statistics. I believe arena's for tournaments/duels to have been said to be in as well. Can't seem to find the quote's on those at the moment.
As far as your edit, yeah they seem to be trying still not what players mean but closer lol.It might even be an atempt to keep DF from taking any PvP'rs. That is unfounded speculation on my part though.
Good to hear that DF is at least looking at adding this. That all the more reason for me to play it. I lead a guild to the top 200 in GW before all the greats left as a tactic caller and target caller and nothing I've played since has had the level of competition where 1 person sits down and come up with just builds for 5 days stright. If DF adds something like this you bet I'll be there.
As far as your speculation, I don't know. I mean Craig wants to put nearly everything in the game that was talked about before launch and this was one of those ideas. Hopefully they'll add battle towers and lootable PvP gear
I know lol I admitted my speculation was unfounded.
With todays recent news - I'd have to say no not really.
Since posting in the thread we can see more people play AoC in EU than NA from the looks of things.
With Staggered launch and windows being the reverse of what AoC did at launch - we can see the problems caused or potential for them more so.
Hopefully DF will get out the door in one piece. But I really don't think it is going to have a big impact.
It now looks like DX10 implementation will happen in AoC in Feb anyway. And with a ticket system based on pre-orders for DF it is hard to say how well it will do based off no so good infrastructure.
I bet DX10 and the 2 new dungeons will come out the day before Darkfall launches.
and that's coming from someone who loves AoC lol.
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Guys! I'm hopelessly lost in a mountain of mole hills! Them damn moles!