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A niche game or huge mmo-success?
I like alot of the freedom beeing described in Darkfall, but I figure it isn't so easy improving skills with true FFA PvP?
I'd like to see more gameplay like this in mmo's, but how popular is it really?
Personally I find PvE servers in the mmo's I've played just boring, and I allways go for PvP if possible. Haven't really had big difficulty lvling up, but those games have safe zones even as PvP servers.
I'm really not sure how Darkfall will be welcomed by the overall public - will it be a success to kick WoW in the ass, or just a nichegame for the dedicated PvP'ers?
It would be really cool if a game like Darkfall could be the new top mmo 
But it seems to me there are so many people that have a difficulty taking a loss, that I dunno.
I gotta admit I'm tempted to try this game, though I'm busy with another already.
Comments
I think that a LOT of people are looking for to Darkfall, and if done correctly I think it can be a VERY popular MMO. Most if not all old UO players are waiting for it, a lot of AoC fans are waiting for it, a lot of angry WoW fans are waiting for it.
I do however think it will be just a very popular niche game, and I have no problem with that as long as there are 10,000 people on my server.
While this wont be a WOW Killer if they can pull off everything they say they can then it could be a very good game and maybe pull in 500k+ subs.
And I really hope they can because I for one miss the UO pre Trammel days where no matter what I was doing be it harvesting or hunting I was always looking over my shoulder for the PK's and then when they showed up I send a shout out to my guild using ICQ and then it was on
God I miss those days.
Assassin's like to do it in the dark and from behind.
We have yet to see..
I don't think we are looking at anything over 100k subs..
ffa pvp doesn't appeal to everyone
Boxes sell
The market is saturated with medievil MMORPGs.
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I don't see this as something that can compete with wow. It would be the same as if a band like type o negative would beat Madonna on the top list, ain't gonna hapen.
The reason to why Wow is so big is that the mainstream gamer want a game like Wow. There are surely place for smaller games too but this game will never get a million players. If I would guess, I would say around 300K, which is good enough to make a steady profit.
The gamers I see going for it all the really old timers from UO, EQ and DAoC. I don't really think it will make an impact on newer games like AoC and WAR.
But we need niche games, Wow is kinda like listen to the radio, once in a while you hear a song you like but mostly it is the regular mainstream junk. Wow tries to please everyone and I understand why Blizzard makes it like that, money doesn't smell.
A niche game can be more directly to a certain crowd, hopefully we see more of those around.
So good luck to DF and all the other niche games out there, just don't expect any of them to compete with Wow.
Very true. I doubt if it will break 25 to 30 K worlwide, FFA PvP sounds better on paper than it is in reality just look at how the AoC players complained about ganking. On forums before release everyone percieves themselves as the ganker not the gankee
Still there is a group that really does enjoy that game style. I more than likely will give it a try just for old times sake if it releases in US. I second the good luck wishes. Indy games can be very successful and profitable without having a huge number of subs.
I miss DAoC
Very true. I doubt if it will break 25 to 30 K worlwide, FFA PvP sounds better on paper than it is in reality just look at how the AoC players complained about ganking. On forums before release everyone percieves themselves as the ganker not the gankee
Still there is a group that really does enjoy that game style. I more than likely will give it a try just for old times sake if it releases in US. I second the good luck wishes. Indy games can be very successful and profitable without having a huge number of subs.
Itll be niche.... most mmo gamers are carebears not elite
Very true. I doubt if it will break 25 to 30 K worlwide, FFA PvP sounds better on paper than it is in reality just look at how the AoC players complained about ganking. On forums before release everyone percieves themselves as the ganker not the gankee
Still there is a group that really does enjoy that game style. I more than likely will give it a try just for old times sake if it releases in US. I second the good luck wishes. Indy games can be very successful and profitable without having a huge number of subs.
Itll be niche.... most mmo gamers are carebears not pvp'ers
Fixed that for you.
It will be niche though, because PVE games (and no risk pvp) are preferred by the masses.
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Niche, but enough of a niche to survive. They seem to know from the beginning most players don't want Full PvP and looting. This company seems aware that the majority of WoW or Warhammer fans won't want to come here. It appears they knew that way back before those games were made but they made this anyways. Why?
Because they seem to feel that they don't have to conquer the WHOLE MMO market... they only have to win over the hardcore PvP market because right now, there IS no hardcore pvp game on the market thats fresh and new. Heck, there's barely any that are stale and old left.
So, they will be a niche success but probably not a huge MMO success as the OP is thinking like WoW. This is the faulty thinking of most people ready to doom Darkfall before its released.
Again, they want to corner a small part of the MMO market. Which by last accounts, is starving for a game.
"TO MICHAEL!"
Very true. I doubt if it will break 25 to 30 K worlwide, FFA PvP sounds better on paper than it is in reality just look at how the AoC players complained about ganking. On forums before release everyone percieves themselves as the ganker not the gankee
Still there is a group that really does enjoy that game style. I more than likely will give it a try just for old times sake if it releases in US. I second the good luck wishes. Indy games can be very successful and profitable without having a huge number of subs.
Itll be niche.... most mmo gamers are carebears not pvp'ers
Fixed that for you.
It will be niche though, because PVE games (and no risk pvp) are preferred by the masses.
Most mmo gamers are carebears not elite. There changed back since I ment what I said. no risk pvp is still infact pvp so just because your a carebear doesnt mean your not into pvp.... just means your into carebear pvp which is still pvp.
Yea, my bet is it'll be a niche game, if it evens gets that far. I wish the game success but it reminds me too much of D&L.
Very true. I doubt if it will break 25 to 30 K worlwide, FFA PvP sounds better on paper than it is in reality just look at how the AoC players complained about ganking. On forums before release everyone percieves themselves as the ganker not the gankee
Still there is a group that really does enjoy that game style. I more than likely will give it a try just for old times sake if it releases in US. I second the good luck wishes. Indy games can be very successful and profitable without having a huge number of subs.
Itll be niche.... most mmo gamers are carebears not pvp'ers
Fixed that for you.
It will be niche though, because PVE games (and no risk pvp) are preferred by the masses.
Most mmo gamers are carebears not elite. There changed back since I ment what I said. no risk pvp is still infact pvp so just because your a carebear doesnt mean your not into pvp.... just means your into carebear pvp which is still pvp.
Attitudes like this remind me of.. well...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FO2Abp0FbA0
Fixed that for you.
It will be niche though, because PVE games (and no risk pvp) are preferred by the masses.
That puzzles me though, I really don't get why people play PvE. I just can't stand it compared to PvP. It's like zombie mode. But maybe that's for another forum.
But I allways try to go for the servers with most realism, yet I don't really own in PvP. Maybe most of the players on a server could beat me, at least until I get lvl'ed/skilled up, and I still think it's better. The way I see it, even if I get pwned I can usually learn a bit or two on how to improve or try a different approach in defence/attack.
And the motivation that when I get on the same lvl/skill point we'll be on equal terms in the fight, makes me continue even with more deaths than kills.
Very true. I doubt if it will break 25 to 30 K worlwide, FFA PvP sounds better on paper than it is in reality just look at how the AoC players complained about ganking. On forums before release everyone percieves themselves as the ganker not the gankee
Still there is a group that really does enjoy that game style. I more than likely will give it a try just for old times sake if it releases in US. I second the good luck wishes. Indy games can be very successful and profitable without having a huge number of subs.
Itll be niche.... most mmo gamers are carebears not pvp'ers
Fixed that for you.
It will be niche though, because PVE games (and no risk pvp) are preferred by the masses.
Most mmo gamers are carebears not elite. There changed back since I ment what I said. no risk pvp is still infact pvp so just because your a carebear doesnt mean your not into pvp.... just means your into carebear pvp which is still pvp.
Attitudes like this remind me of.. well...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FO2Abp0FbA0
If you cant take the heat return to WOW
Very true. I doubt if it will break 25 to 30 K worlwide, FFA PvP sounds better on paper than it is in reality just look at how the AoC players complained about ganking. On forums before release everyone percieves themselves as the ganker not the gankee
Still there is a group that really does enjoy that game style. I more than likely will give it a try just for old times sake if it releases in US. I second the good luck wishes. Indy games can be very successful and profitable without having a huge number of subs.
aoc wasnt set up right for ffa pvp
this is nothing like d & L
hey you dont have to believe me but you will see you will see
this is nothing like d & L
hey you dont have to believe me but you will see you will see
I know the feeling... I played the failure that was DnL..... DF is NOT another DnL... you will see soon enough
Very true. I doubt if it will break 25 to 30 K worlwide, FFA PvP sounds better on paper than it is in reality just look at how the AoC players complained about ganking. On forums before release everyone percieves themselves as the ganker not the gankee
Still there is a group that really does enjoy that game style. I more than likely will give it a try just for old times sake if it releases in US. I second the good luck wishes. Indy games can be very successful and profitable without having a huge number of subs.
Itll be niche.... most mmo gamers are carebears not pvp'ers
Fixed that for you.
It will be niche though, because PVE games (and no risk pvp) are preferred by the masses.
Most mmo gamers are carebears not elite. There changed back since I ment what I said. no risk pvp is still infact pvp so just because your a carebear doesnt mean your not into pvp.... just means your into carebear pvp which is still pvp.
Attitudes like this remind me of.. well...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FO2Abp0FbA0
If you cant take the heat return to WOW
Well played. All I was really trying to point out from that previous post was the fact that you are probably the only one who considers yourself elite. What this has to do with playing WoW, I'm not certain. Me calling you out because you are hyping up some unknown group of "elite" gamers probably doesn't have much to do with me taking the heat.
I humbly submit that I am not as "extreme" as you (or as you so eloquently put it, elite), but I'll be playing right along with you. I just wont divide all MMO gamers into the elite and carebear category.
This game is designed with niche in mind; they plan on appealing to a very specific crowd, and anyone with at least some vague knowledge of what this game is about could guess the same; FFA PvP, completely lootable corpses, skill system over level system... these are the things that honestly would appeal to a very small, but specific, crowd. I have very little belief that this game would even break the 500k box sale and probably average at 100k players tops once it's settled to an average a couple months after release, but if done right it can get the players it is able to attract to stick, as there are very little games that are out currently that are like this. Then again, they will also get people buying the game getting what they don't expect (a WoW clone) and become thoroughly disappointed with it. The only thing I see this game having in common with WoW when judging by what they say about it is the fantasy genre.
This game def wont come close to WOW numbers or a fraction of it... which si fine and understood. But it will be the game for me and thats all I care about.
Very true. I doubt if it will break 25 to 30 K worlwide, FFA PvP sounds better on paper than it is in reality just look at how the AoC players complained about ganking. On forums before release everyone percieves themselves as the ganker not the gankee
Still there is a group that really does enjoy that game style. I more than likely will give it a try just for old times sake if it releases in US. I second the good luck wishes. Indy games can be very successful and profitable without having a huge number of subs.
Itll be niche.... most mmo gamers are carebears not pvp'ers
Fixed that for you.
It will be niche though, because PVE games (and no risk pvp) are preferred by the masses.
Most mmo gamers are carebears not elite. There changed back since I ment what I said. no risk pvp is still infact pvp so just because your a carebear doesnt mean your not into pvp.... just means your into carebear pvp which is still pvp.
Attitudes like this remind me of.. well...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FO2Abp0FbA0
If you cant take the heat return to WOW
Well played. All I was really trying to point out from that previous post was the fact that you are probably the only one who considers yourself elite. What this has to do with playing WoW, I'm not certain. Me calling you out because you are hyping up some unknown group of "elite" gamers probably doesn't have much to do with me taking the heat.
I humbly submit that I am not as "extreme" as you (or as you so eloquently put it, elite), but I'll be playing right along with you. I just wont divide all MMO gamers into the elite and carebear category.
Trust me.... plenty hear consider themselves elite... so your wrong there.
If you cant see the connection between carebears and Wow then that's your own inability to see the obvious not mine..... so you fail there.
Not hyping any group.. just explaining the mind set..... so your wrong there.
I humbly approve your submission of not being elite. Bye now
Niche game all the way that will in no way even slightly dent WoW, but thats ok because that is all they are looking for.
Darkfall should care most of the UO, AC and Shadowbane old schoolers, probably a bit of the DAOC old schools and even some old school EQers like me who havent done much PVP but are tired of the linear, quest driven games that have all come out.
300K would be a HUGE success for Darkfall, im guess 150-200K will be the steady player base if it releases in good shape.
lol great logic there, there's already 230k FORUM members and you're saying they will have less than 100k SUBS...
The market IS saturated with medievel mmos but its also, more importantly, saturated with "single player online" "mmos" and thus I soundly conclude, unless Aventurine pulled the equivalent of WoW 2, they would have made less money making another singleplayer-online game than to break the mold.
FFA pvp doesn't appeal to everyone sure, but does anything? Its really controvertial and wanted in this community, where no game with ffa pvp is even listed in the list of games to the left. This will net the angry Wowers, the AoCers, the angry WARers, all the UOers, and basically all who love mmo pvp and are looking for a new game. But most importantly, it will net people who normally don't play mmos. I'm talking about the fps players and the rts players.
this is an untapped market, and could be a goldmine if a solid game ever releases based on sandbox ffa skill based pvp.
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This is where people fail to understand that basics of how markets work. For example is MMA (Mixed Martial Arts) such as UFC not a niche sport? Yes it is without a question as it requires you to have a certain personality traits to like it, its not for everyone. And here comes to be shocking realization, did everyone that loved watching fights just love boxing prior to that and if UFC had been around would they have all still watched only boxing? No of course not people can only be into what is actually available to them. And so far there has never been a game like Darkfall that has been done well. You can't compare the success of WoW to the failure of Shadowbane and say that it has to do with game mechanics since that has never even been tested.
This is the exact same situation that Darkfall stand in front of in comparison to WoW. It seems to be the general belief of people the masses love games like WoW, that is not true there just isn't an accessible option for the players. Same as it used to be that all fight lovers had to watch boxing as it was the only thing available. Sure you could watch karate or judo (same as Aoc or WAR is an option to WoW) but if your already into boxing you are not going to change sports to a very similar and not even a better organized sport.
So what I am saying is that Darkfall can do to WoW what UFC/Pride did to boxing and over the next 10 years if Darkfall is as well organized and as different to WoW as we hope it can and will eat away at the giant.
Niche only means not mainstream but a mainstream only means the currently most popular and while I am not saying that boxing will die out UFC is already overtaking it in popularity.
If the game works as advertised I think it will be a small niche. I doubt it will stabilize at more then 50k. Open PvP games like this just don't succeed, they pull in a certain hard core pvp crowd but anyone new coming in gets ganked and quickly leaves. So it will get a wave or people then just decline into obscurity or to the point where there are not enough people to gank newbies giving the game some level of churn to keep it alive.
However, I am gonna guess based on the specs of this game and the size of the company that it will release with missing features and/or many broken features. This combined with open pvp and no doubt exploitable bugs will flame this game out before it gets off the ground.
Anyway I'm thinking horizons meets shadowbane :P haha that was pretty harsh. Anyway it won't be long now just a few more weeks till it is released. Maybe I'll be horribly wrong.
---
Ethion
On a good release and with all features in it will most definetly be a huge MMO-success.
I can see +500K subs 3-4 month after release and a million in a year.