The following quote from Badger should just about sum up SOE's priorities for this game:
"SoE are making more money from the TCG from players than they would from a lifetime of subscriptions."
And how are they making this money? By getting players to gamble for new loot items. I'm sure they are making more money on this than subscriptions, here's why. One guy told me, "I didn't spend that much on loot cards, only $150 and I got a sith speeder!"
This guy didn't even think he spent much money, and he got completely hosed. That would cover the cost of 10 months of subscription fees roughly, and what did this guy get? At sith speeder, one virtual loot item via RMT gambling.
We're also led to believe that SOE is responsive to its players. LOL! Man, that's just sick. All they care about is finding a new way to run your visa card debt through the roof.
I was very glad to read how this senator (from the OP) blew the lid off yet another one of SOE's smoke and mirror shows. The more you listen to people who have finally found a way to be SWG clean (players and former SOE staff), the more clear it becomes that SOE seemingly has one priority: to draw people into an online money pit and bleed them dry.
P.S. My last big ticket electronic item was not a Sony. I refused to even look at the Sony products for one reason only, the way John Smedley and SOE treat their customers. SOE's ongoing method of treating consumers just cost their parent company a bundle, and it will again, every time I purchase electronics for me and my family.
It seems the Pilot senator had very wrong expectations from his Senate seat. A place in the Senate allows SWG players additional influence over game development, how you use that additional influence is what makes a sucessful Community Leader. Posting threads on the Senate forum should be 10% of your work, with the other 90% going into building communication links with SoE and working with Quality Assurance, the Community Team and Development to get your communities issues addressed. To many Senators post a thread, wait... wait some more... get nothing, then get frustrated.
To be fair though Space hasn't gotten anything and what is the point of him being there if SOE developer's don't talk to him? He might aswel be like everyone else on the forums. Also SOE isn't putting the resources into SWG because it doesn't have the playerbase to make it worthwhile so they wont get developer contact very often. simply because there isn't enough of them there.
Also though SOE has always ignored the player base and the proof was with the CU and the NGE amoung many other things. So really what does this guy expect? All of them are bitching about the game being on life support and how it hasn't been greta for years......... why are they still playing then? When I did the trial thing, most people said to me they'd rather have the old pre NGE game back but still play because they put soo much into their character and friends in SWG.
Space had a pretty big update this time last year - the whole of Chapter 8 was dedicated to it. To say they've recieved nothing is not correct.
Over time, have they recieved as much as those who enjoy the content on the ground? No. Are there as many people in space as there are on the ground? Unfortunately, no. This could be a catch 22, but I'm pretty sure this is how they plan their chapters.
I for one enjoy space and wouldn't mind more content for it and in a perfect world, I'd like to see a couple of devs whos only job is to make new content for space for each Chapter. With current financial situation going on at the moment across all companies, I'm pretty sure that's unlikely to happen for what is considered a minority portion of the playerbase...
The main part of Chapter 8 was the Star Destroyer foozle instance. It also added several ground collection grinds. Space only got a handful of pilot missions from a cut and pasted newbie space station in a cut and pasted newbie space zone, a couple of gunships that were sitting around half finished from when the post NGE expansion was canceled, a few small bugfixes, and a couple space collection grinds.
Even the producer at the time said the space additions weren't that much and promised that space would see more regular attention since the dev team now had experience working with the space game. That obviously didn't happen, and the folks who stuck around for the space game are quite understandably upset. I of course lack any sort of sympathy for them, because of SOE's history, they should have known.
Too much of what SWG needs done to it seems to fall under the "It's too hard" umbrella, as far as the developers are concerned. I don't understand why anyone would be willing to pay for a broken product that even the developers of it admit won't be fixed.
To be fair though Space hasn't gotten anything and what is the point of him being there if SOE developer's don't talk to him? He might aswel be like everyone else on the forums. Also SOE isn't putting the resources into SWG because it doesn't have the playerbase to make it worthwhile so they wont get developer contact very often. simply because there isn't enough of them there.
Also though SOE has always ignored the player base and the proof was with the CU and the NGE amoung many other things. So really what does this guy expect? All of them are bitching about the game being on life support and how it hasn't been greta for years......... why are they still playing then? When I did the trial thing, most people said to me they'd rather have the old pre NGE game back but still play because they put soo much into their character and friends in SWG.
I was an SWG Community Leader for three and a half years, if you play your cards right you can certainly be very effective in terms of getting the communities wishes put into the live game.
SWG is a busy game and growing daily, SoE are making more money from the TCG from players than they would from a lifetime of subscriptions, so there is no barrier for development of the game in that regard.
SoE certain have a long history of ignoring players and making extremely poor decisions, but in the last three years they've learnt from it and can be quite accomodating when it comes to constructive player requests.
Oh yeah, SOE sure learned their lesson... Go check out EQ and EQ2 and come back and tell us how much SOE learned their lesson...
There is a link in the Oboard thread you posted Obee. As I dont have any sub I cant read it. Its written by Tralik33(Pilot senator) and its called "JTLS, SOE, and False Promises", could you copy paste that one too? What is it about?
Now Playing: LotRO:MoM Waiting for: Earthrise, The Warhammer 40k mmo Collecting dust on my shelf: Ultima Online, EverQuest, Dark Age of Camelot, Shadowbane, Lineage II, SWG, EQ2, D&D Online, Vanguard:SoH, Tabula Rasa, PoTBS, AoC, WAR
There is a link in the Oboard thread you posted Obee. As I dont have any sub I cant read it. Its written by Tralik33(Pilot senator) and its called "JTLS, SOE, and False Promises", could you copy paste that one too? What is it about? Here is the link. http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/posts/list.m?topic_id=803398
You don't need an acive subscription, just have to log in.. here ya go:
On Tuesday, January 15th, 2007, the SWG servers were taken down to take Chapter 8 live. As most everyone knows, Chapter 8 was the “Pilot Chapter”. This was to be the beginning of a new ERA in space for SWG and was to be the return to ongoing development of the space game. The following quotes were issued by Deadmeat during the days leading up to Chapter 8:
Deadmeat wrote:
Folks,
I wanted to drop in and try and give you some assurances in regards to the future of space in SWG. I know that folks have a lot of expectations built over Chapter 8, and I believe that you will enjoy a lot of the content we are adding. As you know, Space has not had much attention for the last couple of years and it is my intention that moving forward space will be far more integral to our plans.
One of the ramifications of the length of time that has passed since any appreciable work was done on space is that there are a number of tools and systems that no one on this team have worked with before. Just getting these tool running has taken time, as well as fully understanding all of the space systems and their interdependencies. I don't have to tell you that it is a totally different game then the ground action. We have come a long way to getting that important institutional knowledge back and I do not intend for us to loose it again. Moving forward we will be updating space content, addressing bugs, and generally trying to get more interest in the space game while leaving its core functionality alone. Hell, this is Star Wars. Space has got to be an important part of that. Hot pilots need to be important to everyone in the game.
Will we be able to give you everything you want for C8? Nope. Will the content we add to C8 be only of interest to pilots? No, I wouldn't want that and neither should you. Will you have to wait two more years for more attention. Unequivocally No. By gaining the knowledge we need to make C8, we will be able to continue to address space moving forward. Chapter 8 is a big step forward for the pilot community and I would hate for folks not to see it that way. I know (this is SWG after all) that I will be taking heat for not having this chapter be the be-all-and-end-all of pilot desires, but I hope people can begin to see this for what it is: a return to space development for the SWG dev team.
We are now over 11 months since the release of Chapter 8. We have been told now that there are no plans on the schedule to do anything further with space. In short, we have been lied to. We have been given a promise that has been broken. That debt is due. SOE, make good on your promises. You have a responsibility to honor the commitments you make, just like any other business. There has been no ongoing development, no return to space development for the SWG dev team. It has been one excuse and delay after another. That ends today.
As a pilot and as a paying customer, here is what I expect:
1. Honor your commitments. You made a promise, follow through.
2. Quit making excuses why you can’t do things and tell us what you can do.
3. Recognize that Space is INTEGRAL to the Star Wars franchise and should be ½ of the total development for the game.
4. The GCW does not end on the ground. In fact, more battles are waged in space than on the ground in the franchise. It is STAR Wars, afterall.
5. Listen to your players. Items like the LUC proposal, loot revamps, and crafted component updates need to be done, now.
6. Create a dedicated Space Development team that’s sole job is to work on the Space HALF of the game.
7. Make plans now to update the code, flight engine, and whatever else is necessary to make ongoing development easier and capable of competing with the upcoming next-gen space MMO’s due to release soon.
8. Communicate with your players. There is NO reason that there should not be an official update weekly to every Senator from a Red Name updating what occurred that week in regards to their profession.
9. Ask first. Do not assume the team knows what the players want. Ask first, in private if necessary and gather feedback before you commit to an idea, mch less push it Live.
10. Last, but certainly not least, commit to making the SWG space experience THE BEST IN THE INDUSTRY. Star Wars is the best and most popular intellectual property in the world. Make the product you put forth worthy of the Star Wars name.
As the Pilot Senator I have tried to encourage you (SOE) to re-evaluate your position on Space and JTLS. I have been largely ignored and no communication or progress has been made in my tenure. I have reached out. I have been polite. More than anything, I have been patient and my constituents have as well. I am done being patient. I am done being ignored. You owe the players an explanation on why SOE has failed to keep their word and deliver on promises that were made. We have paid monthly fees in good faith that the promises made above would be followed through on. Continued lies and failure to follow through on your responsibilities is no longer acceptable. We want a commitment, we want action, and we want it now. I expect an official response to this from the producer. His predecessors made promises that he is now responsible for keeping. We deserve some explanation and a firm plan of action. We are awaiting the response in eager anticipation that JTLS can finally move forward and become the game it deserves to be under the Star Wars name. If such a commitment and response can not be made, the failure to answer in itself will serve as an indication that we can finally put the last nails in the coffin of JTLS and move on with our lives and take our business elsewhere.
Signed,
Tralik Windwielder
Pilot Senator
...The spread of secondary and latterly of tertiary education has created a large population of people, often with well developed literary and scholarly tastes, who have been educated far beyond their capacity to undertake analytical thought.
There is a link in the Oboard thread you posted Obee. As I dont have any sub I cant read it. Its written by Tralik33(Pilot senator) and its called "JTLS, SOE, and False Promises", could you copy paste that one too? What is it about? Here is the link. http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/posts/list.m?topic_id=803398
You don't need an acive subscription, just have to log in.. here ya go:
On Tuesday, January 15th, 2007, the SWG servers were taken down to take Chapter 8 live. As most everyone knows, Chapter 8 was the “Pilot Chapter”. This was to be the beginning of a new ERA in space for SWG and was to be the return to ongoing development of the space game. The following quotes were issued by Deadmeat during the days leading up to Chapter 8:
<CUT>
Ah ok
Thanks mate for the copy/paste!
Now Playing: LotRO:MoM Waiting for: Earthrise, The Warhammer 40k mmo Collecting dust on my shelf: Ultima Online, EverQuest, Dark Age of Camelot, Shadowbane, Lineage II, SWG, EQ2, D&D Online, Vanguard:SoH, Tabula Rasa, PoTBS, AoC, WAR
I've copied and pasted the points that stand out to me. Another promise made to players, more subscription money taken under false pretenses, and another promise broken. This is the litany of SOE's StarWars MMO:
SOE rep, Deadmeat: "Moving forward we will be updating space content, addressing bugs, and generally trying to get more interest in the space game while leaving its core functionality alone. Hell, this is Star Wars. Space has got to be an important part of that. Hot pilots need to be important to everyone in the game."
Pilot Senator's response nearly a year later: "We are now over 11 months since the release of Chapter 8. We have been told now that there are no plans on the schedule to do anything further with space. In short, we have been lied to. We have been given a promise that has been broken."
"As the Pilot Senator I have tried to encourage you (SOE) to re-evaluate your position on Space and JTLS. I have been largely ignored and no communication or progress has been made in my tenure. I have reached out. I have been polite. More than anything, I have been patient and my constituents have as well. I am done being patient. I am done being ignored. You owe the players an explanation on why SOE has failed to keep their word and deliver on promises that were made. We have paid monthly fees in good faith that the promises made above would be followed through on. Continued lies and failure to follow through on your responsibilities is [are] no longer acceptable."
You could take out pilots and put in creature handlers, crafters, smugglers, commandos, and everyone who enjoyed the game prior to the CU, the NGE, the Chapter 6 combat revamp, and the loot card gamble. The script would read the same. The result? Empty servers, a dying game, and a hated company, all despite an internationally renowned IP.
Comments
Our in house viral marketers/fanbois have resorted to attacking the person and not what he is saying , why doesnt this suprise me .
cheers
The following quote from Badger should just about sum up SOE's priorities for this game:
"SoE are making more money from the TCG from players than they would from a lifetime of subscriptions."
And how are they making this money? By getting players to gamble for new loot items. I'm sure they are making more money on this than subscriptions, here's why. One guy told me, "I didn't spend that much on loot cards, only $150 and I got a sith speeder!"
This guy didn't even think he spent much money, and he got completely hosed. That would cover the cost of 10 months of subscription fees roughly, and what did this guy get? At sith speeder, one virtual loot item via RMT gambling.
We're also led to believe that SOE is responsive to its players. LOL! Man, that's just sick. All they care about is finding a new way to run your visa card debt through the roof.
I was very glad to read how this senator (from the OP) blew the lid off yet another one of SOE's smoke and mirror shows. The more you listen to people who have finally found a way to be SWG clean (players and former SOE staff), the more clear it becomes that SOE seemingly has one priority: to draw people into an online money pit and bleed them dry.
P.S. My last big ticket electronic item was not a Sony. I refused to even look at the Sony products for one reason only, the way John Smedley and SOE treat their customers. SOE's ongoing method of treating consumers just cost their parent company a bundle, and it will again, every time I purchase electronics for me and my family.
To be fair though Space hasn't gotten anything and what is the point of him being there if SOE developer's don't talk to him? He might aswel be like everyone else on the forums. Also SOE isn't putting the resources into SWG because it doesn't have the playerbase to make it worthwhile so they wont get developer contact very often. simply because there isn't enough of them there.
Also though SOE has always ignored the player base and the proof was with the CU and the NGE amoung many other things. So really what does this guy expect? All of them are bitching about the game being on life support and how it hasn't been greta for years......... why are they still playing then? When I did the trial thing, most people said to me they'd rather have the old pre NGE game back but still play because they put soo much into their character and friends in SWG.
Space had a pretty big update this time last year - the whole of Chapter 8 was dedicated to it. To say they've recieved nothing is not correct.
Over time, have they recieved as much as those who enjoy the content on the ground? No. Are there as many people in space as there are on the ground? Unfortunately, no. This could be a catch 22, but I'm pretty sure this is how they plan their chapters.
I for one enjoy space and wouldn't mind more content for it and in a perfect world, I'd like to see a couple of devs whos only job is to make new content for space for each Chapter. With current financial situation going on at the moment across all companies, I'm pretty sure that's unlikely to happen for what is considered a minority portion of the playerbase...
The main part of Chapter 8 was the Star Destroyer foozle instance. It also added several ground collection grinds. Space only got a handful of pilot missions from a cut and pasted newbie space station in a cut and pasted newbie space zone, a couple of gunships that were sitting around half finished from when the post NGE expansion was canceled, a few small bugfixes, and a couple space collection grinds.
Even the producer at the time said the space additions weren't that much and promised that space would see more regular attention since the dev team now had experience working with the space game. That obviously didn't happen, and the folks who stuck around for the space game are quite understandably upset. I of course lack any sort of sympathy for them, because of SOE's history, they should have known.
Too much of what SWG needs done to it seems to fall under the "It's too hard" umbrella, as far as the developers are concerned. I don't understand why anyone would be willing to pay for a broken product that even the developers of it admit won't be fixed.
I was an SWG Community Leader for three and a half years, if you play your cards right you can certainly be very effective in terms of getting the communities wishes put into the live game.
SWG is a busy game and growing daily, SoE are making more money from the TCG from players than they would from a lifetime of subscriptions, so there is no barrier for development of the game in that regard.
SoE certain have a long history of ignoring players and making extremely poor decisions, but in the last three years they've learnt from it and can be quite accomodating when it comes to constructive player requests.
Oh yeah, SOE sure learned their lesson... Go check out EQ and EQ2 and come back and tell us how much SOE learned their lesson...
Tecmo Bowl.
There is a link in the Oboard thread you posted Obee. As I dont have any sub I cant read it. Its written by Tralik33(Pilot senator) and its called "JTLS, SOE, and False Promises", could you copy paste that one too? What is it about?
Here is the link.
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/posts/list.m?topic_id=803398
Now Playing: LotRO:MoM Waiting for: Earthrise, The Warhammer 40k mmo
Collecting dust on my shelf: Ultima Online, EverQuest, Dark Age of Camelot, Shadowbane, Lineage II, SWG, EQ2, D&D Online, Vanguard:SoH, Tabula Rasa, PoTBS, AoC, WAR
You don't need an acive subscription, just have to log in.. here ya go:
On Tuesday, January 15th, 2007, the SWG servers were taken down to take Chapter 8 live. As most everyone knows, Chapter 8 was the “Pilot Chapter”. This was to be the beginning of a new ERA in space for SWG and was to be the return to ongoing development of the space game. The following quotes were issued by Deadmeat during the days leading up to Chapter 8:
Deadmeat wrote:
Folks,
I wanted to drop in and try and give you some assurances in regards to the future of space in SWG. I know that folks have a lot of expectations built over Chapter 8, and I believe that you will enjoy a lot of the content we are adding. As you know, Space has not had much attention for the last couple of years and it is my intention that moving forward space will be far more integral to our plans.
One of the ramifications of the length of time that has passed since any appreciable work was done on space is that there are a number of tools and systems that no one on this team have worked with before. Just getting these tool running has taken time, as well as fully understanding all of the space systems and their interdependencies. I don't have to tell you that it is a totally different game then the ground action. We have come a long way to getting that important institutional knowledge back and I do not intend for us to loose it again. Moving forward we will be updating space content, addressing bugs, and generally trying to get more interest in the space game while leaving its core functionality alone. Hell, this is Star Wars. Space has got to be an important part of that. Hot pilots need to be important to everyone in the game.
Will we be able to give you everything you want for C8? Nope. Will the content we add to C8 be only of interest to pilots? No, I wouldn't want that and neither should you. Will you have to wait two more years for more attention. Unequivocally No. By gaining the knowledge we need to make C8, we will be able to continue to address space moving forward. Chapter 8 is a big step forward for the pilot community and I would hate for folks not to see it that way. I know (this is SWG after all) that I will be taking heat for not having this chapter be the be-all-and-end-all of pilot desires, but I hope people can begin to see this for what it is: a return to space development for the SWG dev team.
We are now over 11 months since the release of Chapter 8. We have been told now that there are no plans on the schedule to do anything further with space. In short, we have been lied to. We have been given a promise that has been broken. That debt is due. SOE, make good on your promises. You have a responsibility to honor the commitments you make, just like any other business. There has been no ongoing development, no return to space development for the SWG dev team. It has been one excuse and delay after another. That ends today.
As a pilot and as a paying customer, here is what I expect:
1. Honor your commitments. You made a promise, follow through.
2. Quit making excuses why you can’t do things and tell us what you can do.
3. Recognize that Space is INTEGRAL to the Star Wars franchise and should be ½ of the total development for the game.
4. The GCW does not end on the ground. In fact, more battles are waged in space than on the ground in the franchise. It is STAR Wars, afterall.
5. Listen to your players. Items like the LUC proposal, loot revamps, and crafted component updates need to be done, now.
6. Create a dedicated Space Development team that’s sole job is to work on the Space HALF of the game.
7. Make plans now to update the code, flight engine, and whatever else is necessary to make ongoing development easier and capable of competing with the upcoming next-gen space MMO’s due to release soon.
8. Communicate with your players. There is NO reason that there should not be an official update weekly to every Senator from a Red Name updating what occurred that week in regards to their profession.
9. Ask first. Do not assume the team knows what the players want. Ask first, in private if necessary and gather feedback before you commit to an idea, mch less push it Live.
10. Last, but certainly not least, commit to making the SWG space experience THE BEST IN THE INDUSTRY. Star Wars is the best and most popular intellectual property in the world. Make the product you put forth worthy of the Star Wars name.
As the Pilot Senator I have tried to encourage you (SOE) to re-evaluate your position on Space and JTLS. I have been largely ignored and no communication or progress has been made in my tenure. I have reached out. I have been polite. More than anything, I have been patient and my constituents have as well. I am done being patient. I am done being ignored. You owe the players an explanation on why SOE has failed to keep their word and deliver on promises that were made. We have paid monthly fees in good faith that the promises made above would be followed through on. Continued lies and failure to follow through on your responsibilities is no longer acceptable. We want a commitment, we want action, and we want it now. I expect an official response to this from the producer. His predecessors made promises that he is now responsible for keeping. We deserve some explanation and a firm plan of action. We are awaiting the response in eager anticipation that JTLS can finally move forward and become the game it deserves to be under the Star Wars name. If such a commitment and response can not be made, the failure to answer in itself will serve as an indication that we can finally put the last nails in the coffin of JTLS and move on with our lives and take our business elsewhere.
Signed,
Tralik Windwielder
Pilot Senator
...The spread of secondary and latterly of tertiary education has created a large population of people, often with well developed literary and scholarly tastes, who have been educated far beyond their capacity to undertake analytical thought.
You don't need an acive subscription, just have to log in.. here ya go:
On Tuesday, January 15th, 2007, the SWG servers were taken down to take Chapter 8 live. As most everyone knows, Chapter 8 was the “Pilot Chapter”. This was to be the beginning of a new ERA in space for SWG and was to be the return to ongoing development of the space game. The following quotes were issued by Deadmeat during the days leading up to Chapter 8:
<CUT>Ah ok
Thanks mate for the copy/paste!
Now Playing: LotRO:MoM Waiting for: Earthrise, The Warhammer 40k mmo
Collecting dust on my shelf: Ultima Online, EverQuest, Dark Age of Camelot, Shadowbane, Lineage II, SWG, EQ2, D&D Online, Vanguard:SoH, Tabula Rasa, PoTBS, AoC, WAR
I've copied and pasted the points that stand out to me. Another promise made to players, more subscription money taken under false pretenses, and another promise broken. This is the litany of SOE's StarWars MMO:
SOE rep, Deadmeat: "Moving forward we will be updating space content, addressing bugs, and generally trying to get more interest in the space game while leaving its core functionality alone. Hell, this is Star Wars. Space has got to be an important part of that. Hot pilots need to be important to everyone in the game."
Pilot Senator's response nearly a year later: "We are now over 11 months since the release of Chapter 8. We have been told now that there are no plans on the schedule to do anything further with space. In short, we have been lied to. We have been given a promise that has been broken."
"As the Pilot Senator I have tried to encourage you (SOE) to re-evaluate your position on Space and JTLS. I have been largely ignored and no communication or progress has been made in my tenure. I have reached out. I have been polite. More than anything, I have been patient and my constituents have as well. I am done being patient. I am done being ignored. You owe the players an explanation on why SOE has failed to keep their word and deliver on promises that were made. We have paid monthly fees in good faith that the promises made above would be followed through on. Continued lies and failure to follow through on your responsibilities is [are] no longer acceptable."
You could take out pilots and put in creature handlers, crafters, smugglers, commandos, and everyone who enjoyed the game prior to the CU, the NGE, the Chapter 6 combat revamp, and the loot card gamble. The script would read the same. The result? Empty servers, a dying game, and a hated company, all despite an internationally renowned IP.