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EVE Online: Quantum Rise Speed Changes
Stradden
Managing EditorMember CommonPosts: 6,696
MMORPG.com EVE Online Correspondent Andrew Wallace writes this report on the results of the Speed changes that were introduced into EVE Online with last November's Quantum Rise expansion.
As you may have guessed from the title, this look at the Quantum Rise expansion is all about the speed changes that were introduced. Not wanting to be melodramatic, it was heralded as the end of times by some sections of the EVE community (even to the point of referencing the New Game Enhancements update for Star Wars: Galaxies). Affectionately dubbed the "Nano-Nerf" by the community, there was much bile and mud slinging on the official forums as they were released onto Singularity (EVE's test server) and revised before the final release last November; and, strangely enough, the apocalypse has not come to New Eden. First, let's have a look at the speed related modules affected by Quantum Rise:
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Cheers,
Jon Wood
Managing Editor
MMORPG.com
Comments
Well, as expected, the nano whiners were again completely wrong. The game is better balanced now and you can still fit a ship for speed if you so desire. Grats to CCP for fixing a major loophole in the game.
Quantum Rise was a big disappointment for me.
Having played the game for years before speed tanking became king, I knew that the game would not die if nanos were nerfed as so many of the newer players predicted. As such, I spent the better part of two years campaigning on the forums for a nerf to overpowered nano setups. When they first announced they were nerfing speed tanks, I was ecstatic. I was expecting them to change speed from a tank that allowed one to avoid damage entirely to something that simply reduced incoming damage (i.e. no longer God-mode vs. normal ships and setups).
You can imagine my surprise when, instead of just nerfing nanos, they announced they were nerfing webs, microwarpdrive speed, the base speed of larger ships, and even making it possible to completely shut down a MWD with a 9km scrambler.
As a large ship specialist (Caldari BS 5, Amarr BS 5, Minmatar BS 5, command ships 5) who preferred solo and small gang action, I knew these changes would spell certain doom for the ships I had spent four years training for. If the changes went through as planned, any given smaller ship could get under my own ship's guns and orbit at a range where I simply could not hit them. Moreover, with the ability to shut off my battleship's MWD, I couldn't even attempt to maneuver to increase my effective tracking - a tactic that I'd used for years even when webbed if my opponent got too close to hit.
Another expected result of these proposed changes was that solo and small gang play in anything but frigates, vagas, and recons would pretty much die. With webs nerfed so thoroughly and most combat happening at gates, it would now be possible for most opponents to get back to the gate and jump out with little problem; if they had a MWD, a 60% web would be insufficient to stop them. If you had a 9km scrambler, it would take you too long to get in range to use it to shut off their MWD, and your opponent would have enough velocity and inertia by that point to coast into jump range. In addition, even when the person who jumped through the gate intends to fight instead of run, it would now be largely impossible to fight outnumbered with the ability of scramblers to cripple a ship's manueverability. This would result in an increased need to bring more ships to counter that effect and provide support to those ships disabled by the new mechanic (read: blob). And, as is generally the case, the need for individual player skill goes out the window when gang size reaches a certain level; at that point the only person in the gang who needs any real skill is the FC.
I immediately got on the forums and started campaigning for a reduction to the proposed changes. I proposed that, instead of nerfing webs to 60%, the best webs be nerfed to 75% instead (I acknowledged that webs had been somewhat overpowered at 90%). I also suggested removing a 9km scrambler's ability to shut off MWD; this was too crippling to larger ships and prevented the use of player piloting skill to adjust a ship's effective tracking.
For the better part of two months I did my best to see that these changes did not result in a game that was unplayable for those who preferred larger ships and/or small gangs/solo, but to no avail. As has been usual for CCP, the changes that hit the test server were not altered in any meaninful way before they went live.
Having tested the changes on SiSi and also after they went live somewhat, I cancelled my account after four years as the style of play I had worked towards for all that time was no longer possible. It was one of the hardest decisions I've made in a long time (I really, really loved EVE), but there was nothing more for me in the game. I still constantly get the urge to play and would resub in an instant if they changed the mechanics to something I could enjoy, but I don't see that happening. -sigh-
-Wrayeth
"Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
You cant use the same old tactics and setups so you quit? *sigh*
Hate to break it to you but new patches and expansions usually end up with players having to respec, figure out new tactics etc, regardless of the game.
Typical small-minded thinking on your part (being someone who apparently thinks that anyone who is discontent must be an idiot), my friend. Has it occurred to you that I may have tried other playstyles and found them lacking? Would it surprise you to know that my character could fly interceptors, assault frigates, HACs, and recons as well? Would it also suprise you, for some strange reason, to know that I've tried the whole blobbing thing and found that it doesn't suit? I mean, it's not like I was quite visibly a member of several large alliances all the way back to 2004 or anything... -cough- Morsus Mihi, old school Veritas Immortalis, Forsaken Empire, Fountain Alliance, Northern Star Alliance -cough-
-Wrayeth
"Look, pa! I just contributed absolutely nothing to this thread!"
I have a few friends that play eve all fo them hate the new patch. Alot of the skills they spent tons of time training are now useless. All of them are losing intrest in the game mostly because a good part of the skills they trained are now useless. They feel riped off they payed alot to train those skills that now dont suite fighting in ships of there choice. Its alot more then just speed that was changed and was hit with the nerf bat.
I can understand what you mean when you say you've trained hard to pilot the larger ships yet not find them ineffective against the smaller ships. The only thing I really wish to point out is that a battleship is not mean to be god like over everything smaller than it. EVE has always been about tactics rather than size.
I don't see the issue with a small ship getting in under you being a problem. If you're flying alone and planning to kill a target the best a battleship can do is probably anything cruiser sized and above.
I personally really enjoy these changed as it's made smaller ships stand their ground. 2 DPS and 3 Tacklers in a group can now take on most small gangs that roam around in low sec.
Before the tactic was to, as Yahtzee said so incredibly well, kick each other in the shins until one of you falls down. If you've trained for piloting larger ships, much like I have you should know your role is not to go it alone (Unless you have almost perfect drone skills and a hanger full of light drones). A Battleship or Command ships role is just that, to provide the muscle needed to take down larger targets. Once a tackler has pinned the target down they are but a sitting duck and suddenly your guns WILL do damage.
EVE solo play is.. doable but hardly enjoyable unless you like sitting on pots of ISK bored out of your mind. The idea of a Warp Scram shutting down a ships MWD is to combat the improved speed of the interceptors. As it is EVE is more balanced now.
I am not saying you're wrong as I know I have left games before when the game mechanics changed to a style I didn't enjoy. You seem intelligent and understand so for that I am sorry that EVE was not enjoyable for you any more. However on the whole (From small roaming gangs to 300 people fleet battles) small ships have been given a new lease of life. I say bravo CCP! Bravo!
2008 was a year of nerfs for this game which already made you kinda sleepy.
Like all of the changes, it really depends on your ship of choice. Frigates got mad love this year-no more getting outrun by MWDing battleships- and even destroyers got brought back to life for a bit with Factional Warfare.
“The contents of this post do not necessarily reflect the views of MMORPG.com and its management.”
The contents of this post do not necessarily reflect the views of MMORPG.com and its management.
Typical small-minded thinking on your part (being someone who apparently thinks that anyone who is discontent must be an idiot), my friend. Has it occurred to you that I may have tried other playstyles and found them lacking? Would it surprise you to know that my character could fly interceptors, assault frigates, HACs, and recons as well? Would it also suprise you, for some strange reason, to know that I've tried the whole blobbing thing and found that it doesn't suit? I mean, it's not like I was quite visibly a member of several large alliances all the way back to 2004 or anything... -cough- Morsus Mihi, old school Veritas Immortalis, Forsaken Empire, Fountain Alliance, Northern Star Alliance -cough-
Who has the small mind? Come on now, your entire spiel comes out " oh gee they changed things and I can't be bothered to adapt so I am quiting". If you even had an inkling how silly and immature that sounds you would never have written it.
Despite your rantings the game is fine and so are large ships and small gangs. The game is far better now that it was before the changes. You can still nano if you want, just that you are not untouchable anymore. Battleships were never intended to be solo pownmobiles, you should have support with you. They work fine with a support network along.
If you notice the game is thriving, too bad you are missing out on it, nothing even close to it on the market today.
Thank God, with QR we can rename the game from Nano Online. It was overdue a long ago.
I don't have much of a problem with the nerfing of nanos, but I am not too thrilled with the web nerf. Regardless, this was a well-written article and worth the time to read. Well done!
Sorry to hear that you are quitting after such a long time. Personally, I am really quite enjoying the changes. I understand that some people don't like things, but is that not, always the way of it?
One man's nerf is another man's boost, or something along those lines. I was at Fanfest and I was glad to hear from a lot of pilots of small ships that they were once again going to be able to use them thanks to these changes.
I appreciate that it must be hard to leave such a large investment of both your time and money behind you like that, I have been on the verge of doing that more than once myself, but due to my own choices rather than what CCP were doing to the game.
Although, if I am honest, the speed thing hadn't affected me directly, I am an industrial pilot in High sec, mining and running missions and all that other carebeary goodness, but it seems to me that the people on the losing end of this expansion are really the minority.
I feel sorry for you. This happens to all MMO's. The vets get screwed. All that time you put into the game for nothing. Devs keep claiming it's for balancing the game but what they don't realise is how much time and money people pay per month to master the MMO. This is why I strive to find a free MMO because paying is such a waste in the long run
I can see it now...people flaming me for being cheap. Well, I would still be playing Ultima Online (in 2D) til this day if it wasn't changed. Same thing with Planetside, Star Wars Galaxies, City of Heroes/Villains and now, Eve Online...
Here's a big ,,!,, to all the developers and CEO's of P2P MMO companies...
This is just my opinion and I'm stickin to my guns!
The thing with veteran players getting screwed over in EVE is that they really should know better. The Nano-BS, the Nano-Nos-Dominix, the Gisti-Crow; all of these things have been seen to be overpowered and re-balanced over the years and the Nano-Hacs are just the latest addition. I'm not going to bet money on it, but I reckon there's a good chance we'll see ECM/Falcons get looked at in a similar way before the year is out.
Battleships are slightly different story, as they weren't overpowered per se, but things like webs needed to be changed as they stopped any of the lighter ship classes being effective in web range while making sub-10k warfare a boring slugfest , and it's not like the changes made BSs redundant, either.
“The contents of this post do not necessarily reflect the views of MMORPG.com and its management.”
The contents of this post do not necessarily reflect the views of MMORPG.com and its management.