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Darkfall- All or nothing
I have been a closet fanboi for years now. However as the supposed release date closes in, Im filling with heavy doubt. No distribution information with two weeks to go is starting to make me cringe when i think about. So i have come to the conclusion that Darkfall online will have one of two possible fates.
1. It will become an unprecedented success following the unfurling of some master plan. (one of the only explainations for distribution silence up until this point is that the devs are just that confident in the quality of the game that it will be a smash hit.)
or 2. It will become the biggest dissapointment in MMO history. ( the only other explaination for the silence)
I believe there can be no middle ground at this point. All or nothing in my opinion. Does anyone think that there can be a fate for Darkfall that is somewhere inbetween this? discuss if you will.
Comments
I think they need two more months to do the beta right (the beta testers say so).....then launch. And thats no problem for me.
Im pretty sure they release it the 22. since they say a exact date annoncement, otherwise it would be a joke...
It is hard to tell if a man is telling the truth when you know you would lie if you were in his place
How could you think there will be no middle ground? It will neither be the biggest flop in MMO history, nor will it be an unprecedented success.
Even if it is great, a game with no marketing nor casual interest physically does not possess the ability to be a "smash hit" in any terms relevant to the MMO releases of the past decade.
Your options lack realism
I hope it's option 1, I haven't had an mmorpg subscription for almost a whole year now as it appears that nobody is capable of making good new game. Sooner or later someone has got to break the trend of releasing crap titles.
who is the publisher for this game. they are the one's that will be doing all the marketing. I would like to know what they are saying about the lack of effort on there part.
Velika: City of Wheels: Among the mortal races, the humans were the only one that never built cities or great empires; a curse laid upon them by their creator, Gidd, forced them to wander as nomads for twenty centuries...
I'm seriously enjoying the drama of the release. I picture myself on their team and see the release date closing in with the dozen or so of us making non stop calls, being in meetings all day, furiously making the final tweaks to our dream that has taken almost a decade to realize, and having no time at all to get online to say anything because everything is up in the air so close to D Day.
It must be an exciting time for them... but also will go down as one of the most stressful in their lives... if my imagination is anywhere near reality.
Can you imagine taking on publishers and distributers that have hundreds of people on the payroll and billion dollar companies as a small team trying to put out a revolutionary game? It just sounds very david vs goliath.
If they pull this off... if it is available for download on the 22nd... if it delivers on some of what they've promised... this will be amazing. Not only for what we see in game... but for what MUST have went on behind the scenes in these last days before launch.
I'm actually really looking forward to the next official update... AFTER launch. AFTER they've sat there and watched the servers light up with new players for the first time and everything is working as intended.
It's going to be a fun time.
Or like most people think it will be a monumental failure. Unlike the OP, I believe there is a middle ground where the game isn't right off the bat and it takes a few months of ironing out the kinks. So far they've promised me a game that I will enjoy making them very favorable in my eyes. If they can back that up with community support... they will be my hero.
It's simply not possible for this game to be a 'hit'.
1. No real beta test
2. No real reviews of the game by anyone but friends of the developers
3. No stress test on the servers
4. Endgame features have not been turned on for even the friends and family beta
If this game launches on Jan 22nd, it is going to be in shambles from a server/lag perspective, and also from a gameplay perspective. Even huge companies with tons of money have massive launch problems AFTER they have fully tested their game. You think an indie company with no testing is going to be able to launch a game that is playable?
And then what happens afterwards... again, games with hundreds of server techs, developers and customer service people take months to get their game together. You think an indie company with 30 odd people working on it and no money are going to be able to patch/fix the game any time soon.
It's simply not possible for this game to be a 'hit'.
1. No real beta test
2. No real reviews of the game by anyone but friends of the developers
3. No stress test on the servers
4. Endgame features have not been turned on for even the friends and family beta
If this game launches on Jan 22nd, it is going to be in shambles from a server/lag perspective, and also from a gameplay perspective. Even huge companies with tons of money have massive launch problems AFTER they have fully tested their game. You think an indie company with no testing is going to be able to launch a game that is playable?
And then what happens afterwards... again, games with hundreds of server techs, developers and customer service people take months to get their game together. You think an indie company with 30 odd people working on it and no money are going to be able to patch/fix the game any time soon.
There is a difference between unlikely and impossible.
I'm going to hope for the best, expect the worst, and give them a chance to do right because this is the closest thing I've got to the game I'd like to play.
I don't think it's right to go nuts on them for being different. Just because they aren't doing things the same way doesn't mean it won't work. In fact, if it does work by some miracle... then it could change the way new MMOs are released.
To be perfectly honest, yes I think that it is possible for them to have a good release. These companies with tons of money knew all too well that they were going to have post release problems, in fact they probably even knew what the problems were going to be. Fact is they didn't care and just threw it out door anyway.
These games were not finished when they released, they were not finished when they went into beta and the management of the these companies were fully aware and did not care that they were selling a unfinished product. If Aventurine has finished their game then hopefully it won't have many problems.
Most of this testing you are talking about is gauging what they can and cannot get away with at release, it's like launching a half finished boat and hammering in wedges (patches) to stop the leaks.
Is Aventurine going to the same, we will have to wait and see.
It's simply not possible for this game to be a 'hit'.
1. No real beta test
2. No real reviews of the game by anyone but friends of the developers
3. No stress test on the servers
4. Endgame features have not been turned on for even the friends and family beta
If this game launches on Jan 22nd, it is going to be in shambles from a server/lag perspective, and also from a gameplay perspective. Even huge companies with tons of money have massive launch problems AFTER they have fully tested their game. You think an indie company with no testing is going to be able to launch a game that is playable?
And then what happens afterwards... again, games with hundreds of server techs, developers and customer service people take months to get their game together. You think an indie company with 30 odd people working on it and no money are going to be able to patch/fix the game any time soon.
There is a difference between unlikely and impossible.
I'm going to hope for the best, expect the worst, and give them a chance to do right because this is the closest thing I've got to the game I'd like to play.
I don't think it's right to go nuts on them for being different. Just because they aren't doing things the same way doesn't mean it won't work. In fact, if it does work by some miracle... then it could change the way new MMOs are released.
@baromen ... hi, there's just a little bit of info in this thread.. it's not much but i hope it helps
specifically check out post 9
http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/218217/page/1
Well.. not really. Aventurine has build Darkfall up to be A HUGE AWESOME GREAST THING SINCE SLICED BREAD GAME. If it is ANYTHING other than what it has promised to be.. or stated it would be.. it's a failure is everyone eyes.
Currently playing Real Life..
http://i36.tinypic.com/2uyod3k.gif
For all your stalking needs..
http://www.plurk.com/Random_
Final product is all that really counts in the end. Doesn't matter in the least what kind of way they go about developing it, provided the final product comes out good (which is still up in the air). Clearly their development process is a vastly different animal from what everyone is used to, what has been commonplace in the industry for several years. But just because a certain way of doing things is common doesn't mean it is the 'right' way to do things.
People want something new that isn't a clone. But at the same time they want it to come from having a development process that is identical to everything that came before it. In a way that mentality is contradictory. To produce something truly unique and different, you really have to think differently at all levels. Not just in design but in process. Its risky to devote so much money to try a new unproven process- but just like the philosophies behind the game, no risk no reward. Every great invention, idea, work of art came from people that were willing to deviate from the norm.
Painters once established that the correct way to do a figure drawing was to have one eye on each side of the face. Picasso says 'eff that' and gets in the history books. Now Darkfall is not Picasso but still the same old BS humanity has been listening to for thousands of years - if you don't do it my way, you will fail.
The game will be judged on what it is at release. Sink or swim. It could easily go either way. But I really must applaud any company that does something differently from the norm, and I would think any true gamer would want the same. The genre will continue to be stagnant forever if everyone keeps thinking about things in the same way.
Waiting for: A skill-based MMO with Freedom and Consequence.
Woe to thee, the pierce-ed.
It's simply not possible for this game to be a 'hit'.
1. No real beta test
2. No real reviews of the game by anyone but friends of the developers
3. No stress test on the servers
4. Endgame features have not been turned on for even the friends and family beta
If this game launches on Jan 22nd, it is going to be in shambles from a server/lag perspective, and also from a gameplay perspective. Even huge companies with tons of money have massive launch problems AFTER they have fully tested their game. You think an indie company with no testing is going to be able to launch a game that is playable?
And then what happens afterwards... again, games with hundreds of server techs, developers and customer service people take months to get their game together. You think an indie company with 30 odd people working on it and no money are going to be able to patch/fix the game any time soon.
Now if you where only to explain WHY those things you stated make it imposible for DFO to be a hit, THEN we might have a discussion.
{ Mod Edit }
*****************************
I have nothing clever to say.
It's simply not possible for this game to be a 'hit'.
1. No real beta test
2. No real reviews of the game by anyone but friends of the developers
3. No stress test on the servers
4. Endgame features have not been turned on for even the friends and family beta
If this game launches on Jan 22nd, it is going to be in shambles from a server/lag perspective, and also from a gameplay perspective. Even huge companies with tons of money have massive launch problems AFTER they have fully tested their game. You think an indie company with no testing is going to be able to launch a game that is playable?
And then what happens afterwards... again, games with hundreds of server techs, developers and customer service people take months to get their game together. You think an indie company with 30 odd people working on it and no money are going to be able to patch/fix the game any time soon.
Now if you where only to explain WHY those things you stated make it imposible for DFO to be a hit, THEN we might have a discussion.
{ Mod Edit }
Now if you only understood WHY those things he stated make it impossible for DFO to be a hit, THEN we might have a discussion, now you are only a blind fanboi bye bye
Hah okay, that was a cheap hit. I'll try to explain though. Just think about it for a second; just because Aventurine is doing something, doesn't mean they're necessarily right (I know, I'm a blasphemer).
1. No real beta test. Alright, if you can't see why this is a problem, there's honestly no hope for you. Sure, Aventurine is doing "private" testing. That's all well and good, but how many testers do you honestly think they could afford if they're some Greek indie company? Well then you might say they have alot of bots. Fair enough, bots add numbers. But humans will always find bugs, exploits, etc. that a bot will easily miss. It's just human nature to find a way around the rules.
2. No real reviews. I'll let this one slide because the game hasn't released yet. This is not necessarily a big deal; the bigger issue is the lack of overall information from Aventurine.
3. No stress test of the servers. Alright, if you don't understand that stress tests are very important, I hope you enjoy having the server crash repeatedly on launch night while you curse Tasos for not letting you play the most awesomest perfect game evah, because of his server incompetance.
4. Endgame features have not been turned on...I actually thought the majority of the features, overall, were not "turned on" yet. This is another point that I'm willing to give them some slack, IF and ONLY if they're doing focus testing. For example, they turn one feature on for a while, then shut it off to directly test another feature.
Aventurine is truly over their heads with this one. Even if they release with half the features advertised, the game will be so rough and broken that it'll take them a very long time to get it up to an acceptable status. However, this ties in with the years of development, the secrecy with the information, and the promises. People will be so happy to be playing a game called "Darkfall" that they'll play it, no matter what shape its in. Azrile is a hardcore WoW fanboy so he used "impossible" when he should've used "unlikely", that's the one thing wrong with his post.
--------------------------------------
A human and an Elf get captured by Skaven. The rat-men are getting ready to shoot the first hostage with Dwarf-made guns when he yells, "Earthquake!" The naturally nervous Skaven run and hide from the imaginary threat. He escapes. The Skaven regroup and bring out the Elf. Being very smart, the Elf has figured out what to do. When the Skaven get ready to shoot, the Elf, in order to scare them, yells, "Fire!"
Order of the White Border.
It's simply not possible for this game to be a 'hit'.
1. No real beta test
2. No real reviews of the game by anyone but friends of the developers
3. No stress test on the servers
4. Endgame features have not been turned on for even the friends and family beta
If this game launches on Jan 22nd, it is going to be in shambles from a server/lag perspective, and also from a gameplay perspective. Even huge companies with tons of money have massive launch problems AFTER they have fully tested their game. You think an indie company with no testing is going to be able to launch a game that is playable?
And then what happens afterwards... again, games with hundreds of server techs, developers and customer service people take months to get their game together. You think an indie company with 30 odd people working on it and no money are going to be able to patch/fix the game any time soon.
Now if you where only to explain WHY those things you stated make it imposible for DFO to be a hit, THEN we might have a discussion.
{ Mod Edit }
See all those words in BLUE after the part in RED?
Those would be his opinions on WHY he thinks it will be impossible. That's how opinions work. Granted, you might not agree with them... but that doesn't just make them mysteriously disappear.
{ Mod Edit }
So the game is being made to be, as you say, "A HUGE AWESOME GREAST THING SINCE SLICED BREAD GAME", for a very specific group of people, and not much of anything to everyone else.
Edit: That's why it doesn't need a traditional marketing campaign or retail space at Gamestop or Walmart. It's entire market has already heard of it, and they are a demographic connected enough so as to make any additional marketing dollars spent, a waste.
Well Said Ashrik, I think you're exactly right.
I have great hope that the devs hold their ground in this.
Asdar
Eh, it won't be so interesting Templarga. People will just claim that DF had some good ideas but "didn't do it right", and go right on claiming that the next open PVP game will be the savior of the genre.
Of course, after having been spurned by the Tasos, it is my hope that (should all this negative stuff arise, and the game fail) they treat the next game with a bit more healthy skepticism than they did the last. I'm looking at you, Earthrise!
Only thing they need is just couple of thousend players IRON OUT the bugs and stress the servers, its 2 weeks away.
I realy hope they wont make mistake releasing the game with a laggy and crashy server it wont survive that:(
Games played:AC1-Darktide'99-2000-AC2-Darktide/dawnsong2003-2005,Lineage2-2005-2006 and now Darkfall-2009.....
In between WoW few months AoC few months and some f2p also all very short few weeks.
It's simply not possible for this game to be a 'hit'.
1. No real beta test
2. No real reviews of the game by anyone but friends of the developers
3. No stress test on the servers
4. Endgame features have not been turned on for even the friends and family beta
If this game launches on Jan 22nd, it is going to be in shambles from a server/lag perspective, and also from a gameplay perspective. Even huge companies with tons of money have massive launch problems AFTER they have fully tested their game. You think an indie company with no testing is going to be able to launch a game that is playable?
And then what happens afterwards... again, games with hundreds of server techs, developers and customer service people take months to get their game together. You think an indie company with 30 odd people working on it and no money are going to be able to patch/fix the game any time soon.
See this is my point though....either we are all totally missing something and Aventurine is going to pull something huge out of thier hat and amaze us all....or the game will bomb. Reality says the game will probably bomb. Thats what i mean by all or nothing.
this forum is chock full of negativity. I was really hoping for darkfall discussion. What a shame.
Glad I never came here when I was on EQ. I would have been told how it was a failure and nobody plays it 7 years before I stopped.
It's simply not possible for this game to be a 'hit'.
1. No real beta test
2. No real reviews of the game by anyone but friends of the developers
3. No stress test on the servers
4. Endgame features have not been turned on for even the friends and family beta
If this game launches on Jan 22nd, it is going to be in shambles from a server/lag perspective, and also from a gameplay perspective. Even huge companies with tons of money have massive launch problems AFTER they have fully tested their game. You think an indie company with no testing is going to be able to launch a game that is playable?
And then what happens afterwards... again, games with hundreds of server techs, developers and customer service people take months to get their game together. You think an indie company with 30 odd people working on it and no money are going to be able to patch/fix the game any time soon.
See this is my point though....either we are all totally missing something and Aventurine is going to pull something huge out of thier hat and amaze us all....or the game will bomb. Reality says the game will probably bomb. Thats what i mean by all or nothing.
We'll see. My mind just can't comprehend how games like AOC, Warhammer, Anarchy, Vanguard etc can have huge beta tests, stress their serversfor weeks to find memory leaks and have a full team of developers and tech people and still have major issues at launch, and then expect 30 guys in a basement to launch a better product with very little experience, little testing and no budget.
Everybody loves a cinderalla story, but this is computer programming, not little league baseball.
Of those games that you mention the three that had major problems were not finished and the devs even admitted it! Bearing this in mind makes whether they had large beta or not is totally irrelavent, they would have had problems anyway. TCoS has just released after only having a small beta and is having none of the problems of the kind that you are predicting, so clearly it can be done.
I think what you need to do is go away and find evidence of a game that has suffered directly as a result of not having a large enough beta (pushing it out before it's ready does not count) and come back with this evidence to support your ideas. Otherwise it just sounds like you think any beta that you aren't personally in is not good enough.
Darkfall will have its fans but it will become a niche game with a small, loyal customer base. Server merges will come soon after release.
I believe most people don't care to play a ffa full body looting pvp game and most people don't like pvp anyway. Yes wow is popular but you aren't forced to pvp.
Darkfall will be the next shadwbane / daoc regulated to a small corner of the mmorpg community.