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1Q 09 update from Olev Sandnes, Funcom CFO. And yes, the results are not good.
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@ atmorat : You seem to keep dismissing the actions of the company and basically want the game judged on your personal contributions. What's up with that? The game is beautiful, the graphics are fantastic. Does that make you feel better? The rest of it is kind of poop though. Stop hinting at "greater knowledge" of all things when you can't divulge any of it. Makes you sound like a condescending ass.
@ Crashloop : If you want to twist the meaning of false advertising so you can sleep at night, go right ahead. Apologists like yourself enable these companies to keep fleecing well intentioned customers. What irks me is that you act like this company deserves a break when they've done this twice. Twice! Like the official Funcom mouthpieces you haven't given an explanation why Funcom basically fell into the same pattern that they did 7 years ago with AO. That pisses me off more than the release of an unfinished game. A company that is allowed to do this more than once will keep doing it. They should be held accountable and stopped. Making comparisons to the Holocaust doesn't make your argument any stronger.
And for the record, because you guys love to re-write history so much, there was no mounted combat nor sieging at launch. Bugs prevented the use of both.
This is hillarious!
Someone breaking ranks inside the Funcom-aparatus!
Mr.Graphic designer, do you have any idea what your pen-to-paper adventure can do to harm the company that has hired you?
Keep up the good work, I potentially see a freedom fighter in you somewhere down the line!
Freedom from lies and coorperate-Funcom-deceit!
I have been reading and posting here for years now and I would only consider myself a fanboy of the MMO genre but not a particular game. I have tried most of them, even the FTP grindfests. I remember jumping to defend LOTRO in its early days and there were plenty that said the game would go under. I remember how pissed off WOW players were with the original PVP experience and how terrible it was until it got polished up over a few years (granted- PVP was not touted as a major feature).
We all know that Funcom screwed the pooch, dropped the ball, mislead with viral marketing, blah, blah, blah. I am so over it. It is a shame that the populations are as low as they are.
All that being said, I do not want any of the larger MMO efforts to die. It will have a negative impact on the market and will tighten the purse strings of investors. I do not want the Conan IP to die for MMOs. AOC has improved tremendously since launch (as did most other MMO's I have played). I quit my sub last year and resubbed in January after getting a little tired of WAR. I have always liked the game conceptually and now the improvements are starting to live up to my expectations.
If Funcom goes under, it does. While I do not feel too terribly bad for the exuctive there who made poor decisions I do feel badly for the graphic artists and other talented folks that will lose their job in the process and continually feel the flames of the decentors. I also hope the game sparks back to life after all the work done to improve it. Not everyone will like any game out there. EVE is a great example. This is a great game for some but for me it was a time sink and I could not afford to keep up wit the regular EVE players. I enjoy AOC and a few others though. I do not want any of them to fail. My worst case scenario I would hope for would be that if FC goes down that someone else picks up the properties they have and continues on to make them a success. Possibly even recruiting some of the ground floor talent to do so.
I completely get atmorat's post. This person is frustrated about the high level (Mob mentality) of attacks on the game and company. These folks pour thier hearts into this. With AOC though it does seem like the angry mob has come to kill the monster even if they are not sure what the monster is or what it did to deserve such hatred. The leaders of the mob just want to see the monster dead, irrational or not. It does make one question the motives of people who continually post negativitiy about any MMO here. What is the endgame you desire? I find it hard to dicern from the posts of the truly active game bashers.
In the end, I really hope that the game survives, improves, and the pop grows. I mounred the loss of Auto Assault even htough it was not my cup of tea. AOC deserves better than that as a game.
In my definition stealing is still when you are forced to pay or not willingly giving money away. That was what I reacted too. If Funcom did false advertising could be discussed forever I guess, but both mounted combat and sieging was ingame at launch, the issue is that the mounted combat was just some attacks with your horse or siege mounts. Siege mounts was bugged as they did siege damage to players, and the normal mounts usefullness in PvP was limited to kick people off bridges. But by defintion that can be seen as mounted combat so in a court of law you wouldn't be able to bust the that. Sieges was unplayable and bugged beyond recognition in the beginning. We were all told at launch that sieges had been internally tested and there was no worries regarding these. This was a lie as the sieges was a disaster.
I'm not one of the official "mouthpieces" of Funcom so how can I know why they went in the same traps as with AO? I have a thought about why and that is that GG knew exactly the state of the game, he also knews there would be problems, but thanks to a marketing campaign that beats most others he had dug himself a grave. If he had to postpone the game another 3-6 months that would probably have made the funcom stocks take a HUGE dive as investors would flee seeing all the hype actually was nothing but hype. So he gambled, he probably thought the investors would be easier to please then the players and the players they could keep happy by fixing the game fast. If you look at the gameletters he wrote as GD for AoC all of them where written in a way that was meant to please the investors rather then actual players. I guess GG gambled and lost badly, as the investors saw what was happenign same did FC employees that started to sell stocks and suddenly the stock took a dive that we all know about. GG as a developer and GD did have some good ideas for the concept he wanted, the problem was that he seems to lack the ability to judge how the result would be. AO was a disaster at launch, it was relaunched 6 months later, still not good, but better. It took a couple of years before AO finally did become a good game, and you would think GG had learned from that. AoC proved once and for all he hadn't.
The question remains have Funcom as a company learned anything? the GD is the one guy who should say if a product is ready or not, just like the product manager for any prodyuct if he says it is ready then the CEO will have to trust that. If he told the Board and CEO of Funcom that AoC is not quite ready, but we can make it ready in no time and they approved this all is to blame, if he said AoC isn't ready and the board said it has to be released well they are to blame. Problem is no one knows for sure what really happened, unless the people involved in the process directly. so for anyone not directly involved all we can do is guess. I do guess that Funcom did learn the second time since GG did leave funcom. If they truly have learned we will see when they release "The Secret world". With Gaute of the picture and 2 releases that truly showed how NOT to do it they should be able to get it right. The comparison to Holocaust is a perfect example how the world saw Germany as the big bad wolf, when in reality the cruelties was done by a minority of the population. They did this because they didn't know all the facts, just as both you and me don't know all the fact off why both AO and AoC was released the way they was.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
Nice description of yourself and your noble motives for your post.
However it means nothing when it comes to discussing this PR-beast that Funcom is.
My personal motives are simple: I am a former Funcom costumer.
I will not stop posting to protect costumers from this company until
A: the company is either openly admitting that they lied to us, and are willing to compensate to their costumers...or
B: I am absolutely 100% sure the company is bankrupt and gone.
As for all the heartbreaking stories from fanbois, "mmo"-lovers, an now the poor graphic designer: why on earth are you supporting the worst marketing lie in MMO history.
It's not only a contradiction - it's also very pathetic.
You will never give in to the truth about Funcom, so there will never be nothing but rational and critical posts from (usually ex-players) dissatisfied costumers that were NEVER listened to by Funcom when they sold this abhorrent product to the waiting masses.
Don't be scared of the truth, the truth that this company must go.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
I am confused...how long did you work for Funcom as a costumer? I gotta know, what exactly do those Devs wear when they are programming. Personally, there are a couple of gorgeous ladies there, and if you could possibly post some screenies of their costumes, I would be delighted.
Thank you
"The only thing that can accomplish that is actually improving the game experience "
"Hint to Funcom- you want to save the game? improve the experience "
Means to you that "they are improving the game but the game needs to be improved" I guess?
Its either they are improving the game or not, what you are suggesting is that JD implied from the above statements that they are improving the game but not enough!?!
The use of the adverb "actual" implies that none is on going "actually= used to suggest something unexpected"
I guess you were not around during the English comprehension classes?
Your second statement is nothing but speculation so you have succeeded in contributing nothing to this thread.
I cant find the comment that JD said they werent improving the game. From what I see it says it needs to be improved. Big difference.
As far as AoC goes I think its time to stick a fork in it. With the debt Funcom has, it wont be long before they go bankrupt.
And exactly what debts are these? I ain't looking up in the q4 report, that you can do to show me these horrible debts that will force thekm to go bankrupt soon.
Ofc if you can't do this and put some facts on your statements which would be a first I'll dismiss this yet another failed troll attempt
I do believe they have a debt of around 20 million u.s. I will see if I can find the link that shows the exact ammount.
Still waiting for that link
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
"The only thing that can accomplish that is actually improving the game experience "
"Hint to Funcom- you want to save the game? improve the experience "
Means to you that "they are improving the game but the game needs to be improved" I guess?
Its either they are improving the game or not, what you are suggesting is that JD implied from the above statements that they are improving the game but not enough!?!
The use of the adverb "actual" implies that none is on going "actually= used to suggest something unexpected"
I guess you were not around during the English comprehension classes?
Your second statement is nothing but speculation so you have succeeded in contributing nothing to this thread.
Jackdog's words:
"One would think that after 7 or 8 months of declining population someone at the head office would realize that all the internet "spin" and hype will not help the game or increase population and the only thing that can accomplish that is actually improving the game experience"
One would think that after 7 or 8 months of declining population someone at the head office would realize that all the internet "spin" and hype will not help the game or increase population. The only thing that can accompish that (ie helping the game/increasing population), actually/surprisingly/in fact/really is improving the game experience, instead of utilizing all the internet "spin" and hype.
Is it so difficult to grasp?
Not difficult for me to grasp, these are words of a troll, and as such any BS can be presented.
What proof is there of internet hype and spin coming out of head-office ? = BS
Are they not improving the game? so why the comparison, to a novice it would seem that they are concentrating on spin and hype and nothing being done to the game, which i am afraid is simply not the case, so again BS.
Crashloop,
Your personal narrow definition of stealing goes against a general understanding that stealing can consist of misrepresentation and false claims. Both of which were practiced by Funcom. If you want to argue minutiae in a court of law, feel free. I personally just want to excercise my consumer rights, namely the right to be heard and the right to redress.
As a Director, Gaute's decisions reflect on the company. If you want to believe that Gaute personally drove the game into the ground then you must accept that no one else at the company stopped him. For that reason alone the company as a whole should be held accountable. There are many examples of this in our history, including Enron and more recently Satyam Computer. Because it's video games people seem to think it shouldn't matter. It baffles me.
We're getting sidetracked though. Just consider this, if the game box had a sticker that said "everything we've told you will be implemented fully within 10 months. Except drunken brawling, that's gone forever." would you have bought it? I sure wouldn't have. The game was not ready for launch, they did not inform us of that and so therfore stole our money. That is the simple truth. No amount of crocodile tears from the company's graphic design department is going to change that.
Not difficult for me to understand, these are words of a troll, and as such any BS can be presented.
What proof is there of internet hype and spin coming out of head-office ? = BS
Are they not improving the game? so why the comparison, to a novice it would seem that they are concentrating on spin and hype which i am afraid is simply not the case, so again BS.
Do you understand, or are your eyes so tinited with hate you beleive any BS that a troll puts forth?
first you quote a part of a sentence and roll on that, then you tell people to learn the language(which was in fact ironic) and after that you attack again with nothing to base your argument.
Funcom is saying "our numbers are growing we are doing better", numbers/actions showing otherwise. ones word against anothers, anyone can take their pick
Do they add more content, regular patches? yes.
Are they admitting that these things should have been there to begin with? nooo, everything that was promised was there, you see it was enhanced. you should always read the fine prints, like when you make one with the devil.
oh one more question to answer. if this game was yours, would you go gold by the state it is in now?
I need more vespene gas.
Not difficult for me to understand, these are words of a troll, and as such any BS can be presented.
What proof is there of internet hype and spin coming out of head-office ? = BS
Are they not improving the game? so why the comparison, to a novice it would seem that they are concentrating on spin and hype which i am afraid is simply not the case, so again BS.
Do you understand, or are your eyes so tinited with hate you beleive any BS that a troll puts forth?
first you quote a part of a sentence and roll on that, then you tell people to learn the language(which was in fact ironic) and after that you attack again with nothing to base your argument.
Funcom is saying "our numbers are growing we are doing better", numbers/actions showing otherwise. ones word against anothers, anyone can take their pick
Do they add more content, regular patches? yes.
Are they admitting that these things should have been there to begin with? nooo, everything that was promised was there, you see it was enhanced. you should always read the fine prints, like when you make one with the devil.
oh one more question to answer. if this game was yours, would you go gold by the state it is in now?
Yeah i roll on part of the sentence that was erroneous and then some dude quotes the entire paragrah and then i attack or defend on that. I am basing my argument on that paragrapgh.
Btw if you question my understanding of the langauge then please don't leave it hanging and come out with it.
If you take what comes out of a company as gospel then more fool you. I dont even care about the finanicial figures of FUNCOM, in this time of economic uncertainity there can be many reasons why the company as a whole is doing badly and it may not be down to the number of people playing the game at this point in time. But as i said i dont have any facts so cannot make any solid statements.
By going Gold i take it you mean being released? If so i believe there are many reasons that a game is released beside the current state of the game, this may not be right but it is seen time and time again, more so in the MMO genre where games are released early. I gues each company has there own reasons to do so. With full knowledge that they are doing so.
As i have said before in other threads, AoC is more or less as good as any other MMO out at the moment, given some allowance for its age, (ie Wow will have much more content and polish as it is 5 years+ old).
So yeah if the game was mine, given the current state of other MMOs i would have released it along time ago.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom
@ Atmogat
First off, you are a little thin-skinned when hearing complaints. But the good news, probably for the next year. AOC will be remembered for it's terrible gameplay, but awesome graphics. I have no doubt being a graphic designer for AOC will be a huge positive mark on your resume'.
But now to the meat of my post. You come here with a sob story, about how we should be respectful of Funcom and the progress of AOC. Did you ever ask yourself " why is it there is so much venom about this game compared to other failed games like TR, Vanguard etc".
You can find the answer partially in this thread. It's all about the PR of Funcom. Did you play the game the first month when the client crashed non-stop, when talents didn't work, when itemization was just insanely bad ( I remember using a lvl 20 item for about 30 levels because the quest items were so bad). The game was totally borked the first month or two.
Yet every interview, and at every opportunity, EE and GG bragged about the 'amazing launch' and how sales were setting records. Imagine buying a new car, driving it off the lot and having it break down, and then looking over your shoulder and hear the dealership shouting about how great they were for selling another car. That is exactly the 'gut feeling' many players had the first month. There have been games released worse than AOC.. but there has never been a game released that was hyped so much before release, and then bragged about so much after release that was as bad as AOC. Seriously, watch the interviews from EE and GG this summer.
Then you have the posters on this forum that are just insanly 'loyal'. We have to deal with an " OMG, best game ever" post every day. We have to deal with a " I just started playign today, best game ever" post every day from a person with 1 count. Is it any stretch to imagine that the same PR department that unleashed EE and GG would not stoop to hiring people to make positive posts on forums?
If you want these boards to become more polite, then you should walk down the hall to your PR department and tell them to get the shills out of here, because every time they post, they just remind us of that used car salesman who sold us a lemon back in May and bragged about it for months afterwards.
Edit: Was one-time game server payout...nm.
Lit
Crashloop,
OK, they defrauded me. Hrrm, doesn't feel any different.
I'm not speculating as to the "why" they ripped me off, as you said we'll never know the full truth. I am interested in seeing the consequences of their actions and voicing my opinion of their unethical business practices to anyone who will listen. They made an unethical decision, no matter how you look at it, I want to see consumer opinion win on this one.
I also knew that there was a chance the game would be a total stinker. That doesn't absolve them of responsibility.
I'll end my portion there. We're arguing the same points. The only difference seems to be you think dissenters shouldn't voice their opinion of it any longer where as I feel there isn't a statute of limitations on it
I think I need to put this as simple as I possibly can since some on this forums seem to miss a point that is as large as a barn.
Albert Einstein once said “The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results”.
Since the game has been released this forum has been over run by the classic fanbois mentality. Ie - visciously attack anyone who is critical of the game and make all sorts of ohmygawd the game is so awesome and patch xxx will be the best thing since sex.
So far that strategy has not seemed to help the games population. Possibly it has even hurt it since only the most stupid would believe most of the drivel and sham posts I see here on a daily basis. Last quarters report should paint a vibrant picture of how successful the hype has worked so far. What makes the fanbois think it will succeed any better in 2009?
The so called fans over here should look to Famines posts as examples of how to post w/o making enemies and getting some good feed back on what the customers and ex customers really think so they can work on improving the real issues. I myself rather enjoy reading and replying to his threads.
I miss DAoC
FIXED
It goes both ways sir
Ha - ha
Sorry, nothing more to add at this time as i'm preparing my 'Told You So' and 'Lies do not equal profit!' banners.
Be paid for Beta Testing, don't pay to Beta Test.
Its now time to put the champagne on ice. It wont be long now.
FIXED
It goes both ways sir
Best post in a long time here.
That is an accurate post good sir.....I have never seen anyone ignore so much evidence and make so much ado about nothing as the rabid fans you describe. The validity of the marketing efforts is spot on going by Q4 08 reports.
However, most of the damage being done to AoC was done in other games when word of mouth really hit the fan about AoC. After playing AoC last week I can attest that much of the forum hype is bull and that AoC better pray the X pac is the most amazing sequal to be created for any game in the last 20 years, otherwise chars will likely get deleted when the servers go down.
Funcom has reviewed all of its assets relevant for
impairment testing. This process has led to
recognition of an impairment loss of around
3,1 MUSD for Age of Conan due to a decrease in
numbers of subscribers for the game. Funcom Q4 10 report.
http://forums.ageofconan.com/showpost.php?p=2926123&postcount=7 500 mains/alts on Tyranny in past 30 days - instead of merge servers let's open a new PvP server, again! http://forums-eu.ageofconan.com/showthread.php?t=106427
Everyone has a right of opinion, but the reason I discuss it is that I like to discuss. The consequences of what Funcom did we have seen, customers and investors fled the company. If everything had been as good as they claimed Funcom would today be making loads of money, think it's safe to say they ain't. Funcom could make an apology like EA did some years back, and it would probably be a decent thing to do. However I doubt we ever will see them start to give the customers the money back.
Playing: Battlefield - Bad company (Xbox360) Arma2, DFO (PC)
On my radar: TSW, MO
MMO's played: SWG (pre cu/cu), WoW, AoC, WAR, DFO, Planetside
MMO's that I have tested: Lotro, L2, Aion, Ryzom