Howdy, Stranger!
It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!
Quick Links
Restricting players = Game Fail
Fadedbomb
Member Posts: 2,081
Don't let the title misdirect you, I am one of those individuals whom are waiting with insane-googly eyes for MO.
HOWEVER, there's a fatal flaw in what the developer's have planned for MO, and that would be ultimately restricting a player's playstyle by their viewing mode. Yea, if you haven't gotten it by now I'm talking about First Person View restriction planned for Mortal Online. Sure, it's inovative to "bring it back into the genre of MMO's", but it's the wrong move for such an appealing game. People don't like being unable to see their characters, it ruins immersion along with the overall feel of the game.
How would someone like me know anything about MMO's you might ask? Well, I've been around since the launch of EQ playing MMO's almost constantly since then...so yea I've seen pretty much all of it, and I can say for certain forcing your players to play your game in First Person ONLY is a very bad idea for an MMO. I mean seriously, have any of you ever thought of WHY FPV went out of style for MMO's when it first came out? It was only popular with a VERY small audience, and even then most of them admitted that after awhile they got frustrated with being unable to see around them.
In the end, if nothing else works, it's the fact that practically EVERY popular MMORPG before MO has been third person view. Do you honestly think people whom are coming from WoW/Daoc/WAR/AO/EvE/EQ/EQ2/Lotro will be very welcoming of being told how to view their character in an MMORPG and NOT an MMOFPS? Well, I can tell you right now that I do since I've been asking around with popular MMO guilds from these forums and others about this very same question, and I bet you'll never guess the answers I got about it 
....needless to say I don't need to go on much further with this discussion.
-Third Person view is a requirement for a game with such scope as Motral Online, anything else will kill this wonderful game. I'm sorry if you want "new innovation" in MO, but I'm sorry...forcing people into FPV only and delimiting their immersion with their character = FAIL
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
Comments
Ruins the overall feel to what game?
Playing: EVE
and you better care
I'm sure you'll be see your character you equipment bag, or have some sort of feature to view your character. I feel that 1st person though is a lot more immersive than 3rd person even if you can't see your character, at least you feel like you are him.
I personally don't mind the first person view. Its kinda needed for its fps style. It would be nice to bring up a journal that shows your char in 3d but otherwise i'm quite fine with looking through the eyes of my char. Hell seeing his reflection in water would be cool though.
My 2 cents.
"Do not fret! Your captain is about to enter Valhalla!" - General Beatrix of Alexandria
"The acquisition of knowledge is of use to the intellect, for nothing can be loved or hated without first being known." - Leo da Vinci
The screenshots I saw looked pretty impressive, but I have to agree with the original post. I usually try all MMORPGs (Even bought Warhammer knowing full-well I'd hate it, and confirmed it), but this one I'm going to skip. I just prefer a third person view in RPGs. I want to see the maneuvers my character does, not just his hands. Even the Elder Scrolls allowed a third person view (Although it still felt a lot like a first person game, considering the jump animations were terrible and the combat still looked dull). I'd be fine with a restricted camera in combat (Think Star Wars Battlefront in third person, if you moved the camera, the character moved, no free camera), and maybe a free camera in towns or wherever combat doesn't happen; just so one can admire their character. :P
It's VERY different seeing your character IN your enviroment, moving and interacting with it, than just seeing it in a paperdoll window. Also, don't confuse games like Oblivion & Fallout 3's immersion experience by playing in 1st person, those are singleplayer games and are VERY different from an MMO regardless if it seems like it doesn't. =/
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
I personally dislike playing any game in First Person View. It is too bad MO has decided to make this the only view option.
Though I do disagree that FPV ruins immersion. I think FPV makes a game more immersive...I just perfer Third Person View myself.
It's VERY different seeing your character IN your enviroment, moving and interacting with it, than just seeing it in a paperdoll window. Also, don't confuse games like Oblivion & Fallout 3's immersion experience by playing in 1st person, those are singleplayer games and are VERY different from an MMO regardless if it seems like it doesn't. =/
well considering i have played battlefield games and Oblivion and Fallout i can say that i dont give a toss if i am in 1st person. All it does is mean when i get a new piece of clothing i check on my 3d image (usually in the inventory menu) if it looks retarded or not. Once i am happy it looks good then i continue on with my highly immersive game.
It doesnt really matter all that much to see your armour on your character at all times. Only gear centric games should consider showing armour (crazy looking armour too) at all times.
MMO wish list:
-Changeable worlds
-Solid non level based game
-Sharks with lasers attached to their heads
It's VERY different seeing your character IN your enviroment, moving and interacting with it, than just seeing it in a paperdoll window. Also, don't confuse games like Oblivion & Fallout 3's immersion experience by playing in 1st person, those are singleplayer games and are VERY different from an MMO regardless if it seems like it doesn't. =/
As I sit here in my living room, I look around and notice that I cant seem my back, or my head, in fact, pretty much I can only see my hands unless I look down.
Seems like 1st person view is actually more immersive than watching a doll figure run around on a screen.
In EVE I can't see any character at all, just the view screens from my ship.
Developers disagree with you OP, and you can either enjoy the game they build or decide to plays another.
"True friends stab you in the front." | Oscar Wilde
"I need to finish" - Christian Wolff: The Accountant
Just trying to live long enough to play a new, released MMORPG, playing New Worlds atm
Fools find no pleasure in understanding but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV
Don't just play games, inhabit virtual worlds™
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon
Exactly. Quite possibly the best post on this thread. Just keep the game immersive and not like those other games and we are golden.
Kyleran: Exactly. I don't see what peoples obession with seeing there backside is. Well I do... but i would much rather see the world through my chars eyes. And see my paperdoll when i go to inventory or something. Or if I see myself via a mirror or reflection. Heck, I know games that if you look down(its a first person game) you see your lower half.. i thought it was cool.
"Do not fret! Your captain is about to enter Valhalla!" - General Beatrix of Alexandria
"The acquisition of knowledge is of use to the intellect, for nothing can be loved or hated without first being known." - Leo da Vinci
why do you think guys roll girl characters they dont want to stare at a guys ass in 3rd person view...
Ok I got 2 things to point out about the parts ive quoted first, first person does actually the exact opposite of what you say. First person immereses yourself into the character. 2 when I look at the games listed in the 2nd part EQ was a First Person only game and considering it ran strong for atleast 5 years and is still going on today, and I played it for 4. The way I look at it is First Person definately can work if they do it right regardless, and more than likely they will have a way to allow yourself to see what you look like.
people complain about mmo's not being original and yet as soon as they try to be they you get people complaining.
if you don't like FPV go play any of the millions of TPV mmo's out there.
please let us FPV only fans at least have one game!
tbh I think starvault will probably put in TPV anyway to raise appeal to current mmorpg players which is a shame.
My blog:
Edited After Reading the Thread:
As you can see, OP, people have different opinions on what they like and dislike. Whether you "believe" people approach games like Oblivion and MMO's differently is irrellevant, because people will disagree on that too.
I'd have to say, in the heat of battle, 1st person is far more immersive. In Age of Chiv mod, theres nothing quite like cracking skulls with a crushing overhead hammer strike. From a "role playing" perspective, 3rd is probably better. From a character progression standpoint, 3rd is probablty better too because you can see the phat loots, new moves and shinies your toon gets. My next point is so important, I'm gunna use a new paragraph and colours!
The absolute most important thing for MortalOnline: They have to make compelling melee combat. If its just a Counterstrike circle strafing knifefight with healing pots, then this game will fail. 1st or 3rd person, IMO it really doesnt matter. Just get the melee combat right dammit!
(quick edit. I mentioned Age of Chiv mod. But I expect MO combat to be better than this, more depth ramble rant etc.....)
I have to say that I hope they do go with FPV too as like the poster above has written there are loads of game with the normal view so this would be a nice change imo. I know DFO has gone with that view too so it could start to appear in new games and soon will will all get used to it at some stage too.
I think using this view will make you look around more and be aware of what terrain you have to use as cover and protection too, rather than running around like in Wow where you can see a rogue sneeking up to you seems pointless. I would like to see games make classes where each class has an advantage over the other with a certain skill and they can not negate it but have to manage it too.
Asbo
agreed.. if i wanna play and pay a mmo it better be 3rd person... if i want a fps ill log on my xbox for 10 timez the pvp any mmo can offer...
Ok I got 2 things to point out about the parts ive quoted first, first person does actually the exact opposite of what you say. First person immereses yourself into the character. 2 when I look at the games listed in the 2nd part EQ was a First Person only game and considering it ran strong for atleast 5 years and is still going on today, and I played it for 4. The way I look at it is First Person definately can work if they do it right regardless, and more than likely they will have a way to allow yourself to see what you look like.
For YOU it might immerse you in the game, where as for others it does the opposite. The point I'm making is that they are removing our choice between the two and forcing us to "like" first person view (ie: a very bad move). I'm sorry you missed that
.
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
Once again, for YOU it immerses you in the game or combat, where as for OTHERS it does the opposite. There are players whom can't stomach 3rd person, and there are those whom can't stomach first person. The PROBLEM that MO's devs are forcing on their players is to ONLY play in first person. Many of my friends whom I've played pvp oriented MMO's for years will not play MO unless they can enjoy their experience in third person and NOT be forced into FPV only.
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
Ok I got 2 things to point out about the parts ive quoted first, first person does actually the exact opposite of what you say. First person immereses yourself into the character. 2 when I look at the games listed in the 2nd part EQ was a First Person only game and considering it ran strong for atleast 5 years and is still going on today, and I played it for 4. The way I look at it is First Person definately can work if they do it right regardless, and more than likely they will have a way to allow yourself to see what you look like.
For YOU it might immerse you in the game, where as for others it does the opposite. The point I'm making is that they are removing our choice between the two and forcing us to "like" first person view (ie: a very bad move). I'm sorry you missed that
.
Lol you never once stated that the reason you didn't like the first person view was because they were removing 3rd personal all together you just said 3rd person was the only way to go. Also you have to think about the fact that ok your part of a group that likes being able to see your females characters ass, while there are other people that actually like to play as the character not just watch it shine in brand new "epix"
Ok I got 2 things to point out about the parts ive quoted first, first person does actually the exact opposite of what you say. First person immereses yourself into the character. 2 when I look at the games listed in the 2nd part EQ was a First Person only game and considering it ran strong for atleast 5 years and is still going on today, and I played it for 4. The way I look at it is First Person definately can work if they do it right regardless, and more than likely they will have a way to allow yourself to see what you look like.
For YOU it might immerse you in the game, where as for others it does the opposite. The point I'm making is that they are removing our choice between the two and forcing us to "like" first person view (ie: a very bad move). I'm sorry you missed that
.
Lol you never once stated that the reason you didn't like the first person view was because they were removing 3rd personal all together you just said 3rd person was the only way to go. Also you have to think about the fact that ok your part of a group that likes being able to see your females characters ass, while there are other people that actually like to play as the character not just watch it shine in brand new "epix"
I've never played female toons in an MMO and I won't be starting anytime soon. Nice try troll =|, go back to WoW please...
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
Ok I got 2 things to point out about the parts ive quoted first, first person does actually the exact opposite of what you say. First person immereses yourself into the character. 2 when I look at the games listed in the 2nd part EQ was a First Person only game and considering it ran strong for atleast 5 years and is still going on today, and I played it for 4. The way I look at it is First Person definately can work if they do it right regardless, and more than likely they will have a way to allow yourself to see what you look like.
For YOU it might immerse you in the game, where as for others it does the opposite. The point I'm making is that they are removing our choice between the two and forcing us to "like" first person view (ie: a very bad move). I'm sorry you missed that
.
Lol you never once stated that the reason you didn't like the first person view was because they were removing 3rd personal all together you just said 3rd person was the only way to go. Also you have to think about the fact that ok your part of a group that likes being able to see your females characters ass, while there are other people that actually like to play as the character not just watch it shine in brand new "epix"
I've never played female toons in an MMO and I won't be starting anytime soon. Nice try troll =|, go back to WoW please...
Not many people will admit to getting their rocks off to a Video Game so that doesn't count for much, you do realize you are imposing your opinion to the people that read this forum that 3rd person is the only way to go or it will fail and a lot of your arguments are void, like I have said immersion is supossed make you feel like your the character thats what true immersion is, allowing people to look at their character from a 3rd person view takes away from that immersion it is no longer a character its another 3d model on a screen.
Once again, for YOU it immerses you in the game or combat, where as for OTHERS it does the opposite. There are players whom can't stomach 3rd person, and there are those whom can't stomach first person. The PROBLEM that MO's devs are forcing on their players is to ONLY play in first person. Many of my friends whom I've played pvp oriented MMO's for years will not play MO unless they can enjoy their experience in third person and NOT be forced into FPV only.
I guess I am completely missing the term immersion? Doesn't immersion put you IN the virtual world, in your character's shoes? At what point do I get to swing a magical floating camera around myself in person or am I just doing something wrong?
Playing: EVE
and you better care
Ok I got 2 things to point out about the parts ive quoted first, first person does actually the exact opposite of what you say. First person immereses yourself into the character. 2 when I look at the games listed in the 2nd part EQ was a First Person only game and considering it ran strong for atleast 5 years and is still going on today, and I played it for 4. The way I look at it is First Person definately can work if they do it right regardless, and more than likely they will have a way to allow yourself to see what you look like.
For YOU it might immerse you in the game, where as for others it does the opposite. The point I'm making is that they are removing our choice between the two and forcing us to "like" first person view (ie: a very bad move). I'm sorry you missed that
.
Lol you never once stated that the reason you didn't like the first person view was because they were removing 3rd personal all together you just said 3rd person was the only way to go. Also you have to think about the fact that ok your part of a group that likes being able to see your females characters ass, while there are other people that actually like to play as the character not just watch it shine in brand new "epix"
I've never played female toons in an MMO and I won't be starting anytime soon. Nice try troll =|, go back to WoW please...
Not many people will admit to getting their rocks off to a Video Game so that doesn't count for much, you do realize you are imposing your opinion to the people that read this forum that 3rd person is the only way to go or it will fail and a lot of your arguments are void, like I have said immersion is supossed make you feel like your the character thats what true immersion is, allowing people to look at their character from a 3rd person view takes away from that immersion it is no longer a character its another 3d model on a screen.
You bash me "inflating" my opinion over others on this forum when, in fact, you are doing EXACTLY the same thing you're accusing me of Mr.Hypocrit. If my opinion is not worthful to anyone then neither is yours, so why do you keep posting in this thread? Also, I know the definition of "immersion", which is why I continue to say YOUR version of immersion is much different than many other people's. How you enjoy it is not like everyone elses. What I was "trying" to point out in my OP was that the fact remains, MMO'RPG's SHOULD have no delimitations upon the player as to how they wish to play within reason. Restricting your point of view to a SINGLE view is not "within reason". I'm sorry you don't feel the same way, but don't start tacking values like "allowing people to look at their character from a 3rd person view takes away from that immersion it is no longer a character its another 3d model on a screen" when they are COMPLETELY untrue and wholey YOUR opinion.
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
Once again, for YOU it immerses you in the game or combat, where as for OTHERS it does the opposite. There are players whom can't stomach 3rd person, and there are those whom can't stomach first person. The PROBLEM that MO's devs are forcing on their players is to ONLY play in first person. Many of my friends whom I've played pvp oriented MMO's for years will not play MO unless they can enjoy their experience in third person and NOT be forced into FPV only.
I guess I am completely missing the term immersion? Doesn't immersion put you IN the virtual world, in your character's shoes? At what point do I get to swing a magical floating camera around myself in person or am I just doing something wrong?
Immersion changes from person to person, for some it's the feeling of impact within an imaginary world, for others it's the feeling of "belonging" within said imaginary world. How that "impact" or "belonging" is obtained is purely by preference and NOT a set value that people can copy & paste like "some people" in this thread seem to think.
The Theory of Conservative Conservation of Ignorant Stupidity:
Having a different opinion must mean you're a troll.
1) Game will fail because First Person kills Immersion
2) Immersion changes dependant on the person